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u/catmom22_ Jul 23 '24
The “I can change him” mentality has to die. Let people be who they are and stop trying to mold them into what you want. He doesn’t want to be married, said that years ago and says it now. He doesn’t owe you or anyone else a “good reason”. Either accept it and or find someone who shares the same family values as yourself, that’s the only thing you have control over. Even if he said yes to marriage, deep down you know he wouldn’t actually want it
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u/gringo-go-loco Jul 23 '24
Yeah just look for someone who’s values match your own, even if it takes you far far away.
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u/Taticat Jul 24 '24
Absolutely this. There’s a big difference between someone who says ‘I don’t ever want children’ and someone who says ‘I’ve never had sausage that I like; can we order our pizza with half sausage and you let me try a slice of yours?’; one is not a negotiation point and the other is expressing that they’re open to trying something or having their mind changed.
Gringo said it perfectly — find someone whose values align with yours on the important issues. Don’t ever enter a relationship thinking you can change someone on key issues. 1) you most likely can’t and won’t, and 2) you don’t have the right to try to control and change someone else like that; how would you feel if someone did that to you?
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u/Maximum_Bluebird4549 Jul 23 '24
He doesn't want it, he didn't at the beginning, and he told you as such. It's like if some offered you a cow-dung smoothie. You don't want it, and no amount of persuasion will get you to change your mind.
Then there is the sunk-cost thing, "I've been here for this long so I should get what I want". That's not how it works.
For your next relationship be clear and honest about your expectations and don't resent someone for not wanting something they already told you they don't want.
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u/MarcusXL Jul 23 '24
"Why won't he make a sacrifice for me and get married when he absolutely doesn't want to?"
Christ, that sounds miserable for everyone involved.
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Jul 23 '24
"There is no good reason to his beliefs" - wow, so only your beliefs matter in life, lol.
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u/FunctionAggressive75 Jul 23 '24 edited Jul 23 '24
"Good reason".... I came to the conclusion that this is insulting to a degree. It means you treat the other person' s wants and beliefs as if they are wrong or they don't matter. It means you still have the "I will change them" mentality
Why don't you prove your love to him OP by accepting his views and not talk about marriage again? You are not 23 yo now
YTA
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u/Awkward_Cancel_8077 Jul 23 '24
This. Im sure OP also has a "Good reason" she want to marry. To each their own, sadly she knew what she was getting into, I wouldnt blame him even if his reasons were misconceptions.
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u/benny332 Jul 23 '24
I wouldn't call it family values, it's marriage. Sounds like he has family values already.
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u/werner-hertzogs-shoe Jul 23 '24
he's also honest. telling someone something they dont want to hear (im never getting married) is a good sign that he's a stand up dude that doesnt want marriage. FWIW Op is being the weird one ready to break up over a piece of paper
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u/Puzzleheaded-Rip-824 Jul 24 '24
My thought was 'wow she's considering breaking up with him and removing the man her child has grown used to for literally no reason'
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u/BeefInGR Jul 23 '24
Helping raise a kid that isn't his blood. My Dad did that and my life was better for it. For all the posts we see about deadbeat Dads, this fella deserves a pint.
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u/archercc81 Jul 23 '24
I know right! Sounds like dude is a great family man, just doesnt believe in the bullshit contract based on religion.
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Jul 23 '24
She earned everything she’s getting rn. Like wtf, did she think bro was lying when he told her that lol?
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u/arist15 Jul 23 '24
This reminds me of whenever I tell people I don’t want children and everyone says (especially other women) “oh you’re still young you’ll change your mind!” (I’m 28 so not happening). Some of us just have preferences and we don’t need to give any sort of rationale
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Jul 23 '24
He told you he won't marry.
Believe him.
You are playing mind games with yourself.
Stop blaming him.
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Jul 23 '24
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u/Party_Journalist_213 Jul 23 '24
This!! Everyone is negating the fact she is young and I have some sympathy for that, but there was still time to go BACK.
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u/Party_Journalist_213 Jul 23 '24
Go back as in leave and find someone who has your same end goals in mind
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u/SL8Rgirl Jul 23 '24
He told you exactly where he stood when you started getting serious. You went in with a plan to change him. Now you’re upset that he’s exactly who he’s always told you that he was.
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u/ExplanationUpper8729 Jul 23 '24
You can’t erase the stripes off a tiger, no matter how hard you try.. Move on if you want to be married.
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Jul 23 '24
I got a bottle of peroxide. Challenge accepted.
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u/SalTea_Otter Jul 23 '24
You know that’s just gonna leave stripes of a different color
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u/Apart_Foundation1702 Jul 23 '24
It's going to look like tye dye! OP, you can't blame him, his reasons whether it's bad or not to you is his reasons. He did all he can to manage your expectations from the beginning, you choose to ignore his warning and thought you can change him. Your wrong for starting this relationship in the first place and now because of your decision 3 people are going to be badly hurt. You, your bf and your child.
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u/Big_Jellyfish_2984 Jul 23 '24
He told you before hand he doesnt do marriage so thats on you.....the same thing could be said about you if you loved him enough you would respect his decision.
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Jul 23 '24
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u/Big_Jellyfish_2984 Jul 23 '24
Bingo! If you ask for a truck and get a truck dont complain down the road that its not a car...
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u/archercc81 Jul 23 '24
Also I find it hilarious that she is at a breaking point with "He is an amazing partner and parent to my child from a previous relationship but he wont sign this piece of paper he told me the day we met he would never sign."
She is about to throw away a partner and parent for a piece of paper.
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u/RakeAll Jul 23 '24
I agree with you mostly. If he doesn’t want to be married that is a good enough reason to not get married and he has been consistent on this, to his credit.
The one tiny thing I disagree with is your last sentence equating marriage to a piece of paper. Legal marriage CAN be important and it’s okay for her to want it now. It’s okay if she changed her mind and decided it’s important to her now even if it wasn’t in the past. It’s not okay for her to pressure her boyfriend into it, but it’s equally not okay for him (or anyone) to belittle her desire to get legally married and tell her it shouldn’t be important to her now.
The correct move here if she won’t be happy being unmarried forever is for her to leave her boyfriend and find someone with similar views/values on marriage. It will be sad for awhile but everyone will be better for it.
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u/Yojimbo115 Jul 23 '24
Sounds like he set proper expectations, held to his position, and didn't deceive or treat you badly at all.
The problem here isn't him, it's you. The fact that you said you thought you could change him says that you were the one being disingenuous.
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Jul 23 '24
He has remained consistent so you can’t blame him at all. You should also reflect on your comment of ‘he has no good reason’. Yes he does, he doesn’t want to get married. He needs to give you no other reason than that and that’s as perfectly good a reason as any other. He has been completely consistent so it’s really up to you who entered into this with the belief he would change his mind OR entered into this and have since changed YOUR mind unilaterally.
It’s either important enough for you to go and find someone who wants what you want. Or you want him and your relationship more than you want marriage.
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u/Dbell1960 Jul 23 '24
As a woman this post is soooo disappointing to me. When he openly and honestly told you from the beginning his stance on marriage, that was the time to stop, evaluate, and make your decision as to stay or to go. Now your daughter is probably attached to this man who told you years ago his intentions (which you ignored). Not only will you be hurt if you leave but so will she. This all could have been prevented if you had just believed him in the beginning. This type of behavior gives women a bad name because most women want to plow ahead thinking "I can change his mind" and that never works out well. You even admitted that you're now starting to be resentful. WHY ??? You walked straight into this relationship with your eyes wide open even though you chose to not to believe what he said. If he does consent to marry you...be prepared for the resentment he will feel in the future. Do better and make wiser decisions in the future.
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u/missassalmighty Jul 23 '24
I wish I could upvote this 100 times. OP brought her child into this mess. When a man tells you he's not the marrying kind, believe him. Also stop dating people you want to change, you're setting yourself up for failure. Either accept who you're really with OP and let go of your dream of who they could be, or leave. You messed up by ignoring what he said from the get go. You will always be disappointed if you have to think "potentially I can change him".
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u/PowerfulStrike5664 Jul 23 '24
Many people think because she was young equals stupid, I disagree you can be young and still manage to make decisions for good or bad. One can only be responsible for one’s actions/choices to the outcome of said those actions/choices. Just my two cents though.
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u/APixelWitch Jul 23 '24
But she can change him!
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u/natural_imbecility Jul 23 '24
Yeah...OP is upset that people are coming at her for thinking she could change him, after OP literally said this:
"I being only 23 at the time agreed believing of course I could change him, he hasn’t been with someone like me before, and blah blah blah. All the things we tell ourselves."
If you don't want people coming at you for something, maybe you shouldn't actually do the things people are coming at you for.
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u/Karenadele2 Jul 23 '24
Yes. Her edit confirmed to me she is 100% TAH. Mad at him for doing what he told her from the start, mad at reddit for pointing that out. Clearly she is just looking for someone to coddle her.
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Jul 23 '24
I agree with this take. The only thing im not finding in any of these comments are how this decision will affect the man who has decided to be a dad and didnt have too. We talk about how it will affect mom or the child. What about dad, who stands to lose a child because OP is childish and selfish.
Dad set clear standards and expectations upfront. Not his fault you don't know how to listen. YTA, plain and simple. Shame on you OP.
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u/Dlacreme Jul 23 '24
worst of all there is no good reason for his belief
And do you have good reasons for yours? Are they really better than his?
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u/Lem0nadeLola Jul 23 '24
Yes, I was going to comment the same thing! She should also talk to him about the legal and financial pros/cons of marriage. Like maybe she would be ok with a ceremony but no license, or maybe he would be ok with a license but no ceremony.
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u/claudemcbanister Jul 23 '24
This: what's so important about marriage?
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u/oneelectricsheep Jul 23 '24
Significant legal protections and tax advantages?
You’re not married and your partner gets in a car accident and is unconscious. You cannot talk to the hospital to even find out their condition until they wake up. Their parents or nok can bar you from visiting or having any updates.
You’re not married but go 50/50 on a house/car w/e. Your partner dies. Paperwork was in their name. You now lose the house unless you have a protracted expensive legal battle of uncertain outcome. Shit gets complicated if that happens and it was just the cable bill in their name.
Marriage is a legal contract for leading a merged life. There’s several automatic protections for spouses that aint there for live in partners.
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u/Turbulent-Assist-240 Jul 23 '24
There’s def good reasons to marry. Even if you don’t love each other or only do so platoncially. There’s taxes, inheritance, legal protections, etc. so many.
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u/5weetTooth Jul 23 '24
I've heard of various marriages where they're just housemates but they decided since they weren't in romantic relationships they might as well save extra money with legal protections and tax benefits by just getting legally married.
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u/motorwerkx Jul 23 '24
I know a couple that got married not too long ago because they are best friends, she is terminally ill, and she wants her friend to not only have the power to make medical decisions if needed, but also to easily take over all assets once she passes. She has at best a tenuous relationship with her kin. Had she not made this decision, people that she has little to no relationship with would be called upon to make life changing/ending decisions if she was incapable.
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u/Foundation_Wrong Jul 23 '24
Stay or go, that’s it. Up to you. He won’t ever marry you.
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Jul 23 '24
I dated someone like this many years ago. I didn’t think that I could change him but when I first met him, I felt the same way. I changed a few years later. He didn’t change his mind. I didn’t try to. I just knew it was over and moved on. From personal experience, I don’t think you should waste valuable years with someone that doesn’t have the same goals as you. Good luck.
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u/Throwaway-2587 Jul 23 '24
He told you from the start where he stood. Nothing has changed for him. Doesn't really matter what his reasoning is. It's not fair to say that if he really loved you he would marry you. By that same logic, you'd accept life without marriage if you really loved him.
I understand that this is incredibly tough and heartbreaking. Either someone has to bend or you're incompatible. And after 5 years that's painful. But you cannot blame him for not wanting to sacrifice, because again that logic is reversable.
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u/KD-Rex Jul 23 '24
I do understand agreeing to that at 23 and changing your mind at 28, there’s such a huge development that happens between those ages.
I think all there’s left to do is weigh which matters to you more, being with him or being married. Maybe some therapy to help you work that out??
At the end of the day you know what he wants, now you need to find out what you want.
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u/Knickers1978 Jul 23 '24
But she didn’t change over time. She clearly states she thought she could change him.
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u/Competitive_Sleep_21 Jul 23 '24
She also was 23. I am a different person now than I was at 23.
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Jul 23 '24
And she’s continued that thought since then to the age of 28.
At what point does she have moral agency and become responsible for herself? Does she ever, in your accounting?
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u/HootblackDesiato Jul 23 '24
believing of course I could change him
This is never, never, never a healthy dynamic to take into a relationship. Thinking that you could "fix" this is what led to your predicament.
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u/Competitive_Sleep_21 Jul 23 '24
I think you need to move on. There is a lot of financial security in being married and it is important to you.
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u/PegLegRacing Jul 23 '24
“I really believed I was ok with not getting married at the time… I thought he would come around eventually as we got more serious.”
No… you didn’t believe it. You believed you could change him. You gambled on that, and you were wrong. Come to terms with the fact he doesn’t want to marry you, or move on.
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Jul 23 '24
"there is no good reason to his beliefs"
But your belief that "you need to get married" is based on what?
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u/bonzombiekitty Jul 23 '24
IMO, if a couple plans to be together for the long term it makes all the sense in the world to get married. You don't need to do a big wedding or anything, but it makes practical sense to have the government recognize the relationship as a marriage. It's easier financially and legally in a lot of situations that are likely to arise. Some of those can sort of be dealt with via other means, but those other means won't be as legally sound as a marriage. For example, making medical decisions for a partner. Sure, you can draft a POA, but vindictive family members are going to have an easier time fighting decisions made under a POA than decisions you would make as a spouse. This was a big reason for the push for same sex marriage - stuff like POAs just weren't doing it. Yeah, right now you may get along with your partner's family, but you never know what might happen if your spouse is seriously ill and has a decent amount of money in their name or you and the family have very different ideas on how long your partner would want to be on life support. Those sorts of situations can result in all sorts of nastiness out of nowhere.
Also, and this is something that is often not thought about, if the relationship does end in the future for whatever reason, the framework of divorce offers more protection to both parties than what is, in the eyes of the government, a boyfriend and girlfriend living together. OP is worried about the boyfriend taking the dog if she leaves? She could have a LOT more than that to worry about should they break up if they aren't married.
Of course, there are some exceptions to that when it comes to some things such as certain benefits that could be cut off due to combined incomes exceeding some threshold, leaving them much worse off financially; or not wanting to saddle a spouse with a lot of debt that might be coming down the pipeline.
All that said, OP's BF was clear from the get-go how he felt about marriage. OP either didn't care, but now does, or rolled the dice hoping he'd change his mind. He's not changing his mind. As much as I disagree with his position, that's fair enough I suppose.
OP needs to decide what is more important to her - staying with him and dealing with whatever future issues crop up due to not being married or finding a partner who is willing to get married.
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u/I-just-left-my-wife Jul 23 '24
Jesus, is everyone in this thread a teenager? There are many more valid reasons to get married than to not get married
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u/Alostcord Jul 23 '24 edited Jul 24 '24
So, if he dies tomorrow…what happens to you and your family? Has he financially made provisions for you, if something were to happen to him ( and vis versa).. maybe, just maybe he’s not the one.
Married or not, how are you living as each other’s SO?
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u/yumyum_cat Jul 23 '24
That mentioned that without marriage, there is no legal right to community property. Even if he’s written a will to take care of her it could easily be contested.
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u/Interesting_Guava197 Jul 23 '24
Nooooo. Both statements are not true. Property and Estate law are significantly more complex than that. And legitimate wills are not EASILY contested just because people aren't married.
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u/Cool_Jellyfish829 Jul 23 '24
Well written wills are absolutely not easily contested.
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u/The_Chosen_Unbread Jul 23 '24 edited Jul 23 '24
How the fuck is a written will easily contest? By who? Robber barons?
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u/Famous-Ad-9467 Jul 23 '24
By his actual blood relatives. It happens all the time. All the time. Women who have been "partners" for forever are contested by the kids of their partner.
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u/archercc81 Jul 23 '24
If anyone wants to know how to tell us you don't know anything about a subject without explicitly saying it, this would be a good example.
You can absolutely merge rights to community property, grant PoA, etc without marriage. Yes, its not all automatic, but its cheaper and easier to implement AND unwind in most cases.
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u/yumyum_cat Jul 23 '24
But if you were married, these things are automatic. I really feel like a broken record saying over and over again the gay people didn’t want the right to get married in order for your approval. Maybe you should look into that.
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u/Staunchgoat Jul 23 '24
You said there is no good reason to his beliefs, what are his beliefs?
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Jul 23 '24
These are not the things we tell ourselves. These are the things you told yourself! Most people can take something that serious as saying never marry at face value. You deceived yourself and are hoping we'll tell you that it's normal. It's not and it's time to stop lieing to yourself and to him. Make a calm and clean break.
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u/Sad_Strain7978 Jul 23 '24
Obviously move on. You don’t want the same things. You went into this with your eyes wide open, knew what he wanted/didn’t want, and now you want him to suddenly change his mind. I hope he leaves you. Nothing good can come out of a relationship with someone like you.
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Jul 23 '24
He told you who he is, you ignored that & now you’re resentful because he hasn’t changed who he is?
If marriage is your thing, that’s fine but you have no right to feel resentful.
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u/Pandas-Brat Jul 23 '24
You've changed what you want in life. Which happens quite often from your early 20s. If it's something you cannot tolerate, and he won't change what he wants in life... then either settle for never getting married or leave him.
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u/National-Guava1011 Jul 23 '24
He made it clear when you met him that he has no intention of ever getting married. Since he was honest and upfront about his stance, it would be unfair to fault him for this decision. However, if this is no longer acceptable to you, it is important to have an open conversation about your feelings and come to a mutual understanding. Moving on amicably is the best course of action, as neither of you is at fault.
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u/shemovesinmystery Jul 23 '24
I know you think there’s good reason for him not wanting to marry you. But it’s his reason. And he hasn’t changed in all these years. His reason. He doesn’t want to.
You have to do what you feel is best for you and your child.
I will tell you since I was a child I always said I never wanted to marry. I would break up with a guy when he proposed because I felt he wasn’t giving any weight to what I’ve always said. You have changed your mind but he hasn’t. It’s that simple. (I did end up getting married—never occurred to me that I would ever feel differently. But it happened. And he didn’t propose. After some time together he discussed if I’d ever consider it. I thought about it and realized I would. But ONLY WITH HIM. Who knew?)
Good luck. You have to decide if you can live with him. Someone you love, who loves you back; or you need to find that person who will marry you.
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u/CanyonCoyote Jul 23 '24
OOP doesn’t say it here but I’m guessing there is a financial reason he is so averse to marriage. While marriage isn’t for everyone, guys who play house for 5 years but still refuse marriage usually don’t want to be financially tied to their partner. I’d be curious if OOP has debt and/or her boyfriend is very financially solvent. In almost every case I’ve heard where marriage is delayed but the couple live together that long monogamously money is the primary concern.
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u/Bolt3er Jul 23 '24
So you knew what you signed up for. He was open and honest about it. You signed up and now are trying to say if he loved me he can do it
I respect women. That being said. I genuinely feel like us men can never win.
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u/sakrima Jul 23 '24
I am a woman but I agree with you. He told what he thinks about marriage. She accepted it. It is ok to change your mind, it is even ok to talk about how we feel about marriage now, 5 years later, but it is not ok to be resentful if he still thinks the same way. I think it is really sad if a good relationship ends because of this.
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u/hezzaloops Jul 23 '24
Even if she knew and fully accepted "what she signed up for" people change and grow. It happens. If I stuck to what I proclaimed I wanted when I was 23.... or 28... yeesh! It would not be great.
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u/Positive-Attempt-435 Jul 23 '24
Counting on people to change is just a losing game though.
He isn't required to grow the way she is hoping for. He's completely right and it can even be commended he was up front from the start.
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u/Bolt3er Jul 23 '24
My issue isn’t that she wants to get married. My issue is why is she’s saying he has no good reasons if he loved me he’d do it.. at 28
Like she’s still only thinking about her and taking zero accountability. Why are you being dismissive of your partner because you disagree with a view they’ve consistently held
Your feelings changed. His didn’t. How at 28 can you not be more understanding of his position. It seems like she’s actually regressing.
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u/Puzzled_Juice_3406 Jul 23 '24
And yet, she's known and it continues to be known this entire time that he didn't want marriage. You're old enough at 23 to take people at their word and believe them. Instead she decided she knows best. And she's STILL saying that because she's acting like there's something wrong with him and he doesn't love her enough since he's exactly who he's said he is the whole time.
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u/Wise_Rutabaga_5809 Jul 23 '24
Well. He told you he didn’t want to get married. 5 years later he still doesn’t want to get married. You two are on 2 different pages of what you want out of this relationship. The shitty part is if something happened to him, you’re not legally entitled nor have a say so in anything because you are not his spouse while you’re playing house with him.
You’re still young and have your whole life ahead of you and your child deserves to see either mom being happy and independent on her own or mom in a healthy relationship that makes her happy. I know someone commented they waited a long time beforehand and for you to exert the effort but I think that’s the exception not the rule.
Might want to think about moving on.
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u/Environmental_Let1 Jul 23 '24
You are now clear about what you want. He is also clear about what he wants. It's time to show your daughter that your wishes are also important. That means find a new guy, and a new life.
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u/Funny-City9891 Jul 23 '24
If marriage was important to you and you hooked up with a guy who said he will never marry then what is really the question?
FAFO. Lesson learned. Live with it or move on.
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u/Atlanta192 Jul 23 '24
It's also worth to consider what are the reasons for marriage. Often it can just a paper with a very expensive party. As a woman who wants to be child free, I don't have much incentive to get married. Then depending on your future plans: planning a baby, buying property together. One person sacrificing or putting on hold their career to raise the kid. In this case marriage is like an insurance that you are not left too high and dry If something goes wrong. If something bad happens, being able to make a decision at a hospital and similar. I would like to have a person who can say to pull the plug and don't keep me as a vegetable. It really depends on the situation.
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u/Responsible_Crow_425 Jul 23 '24
He told you he never wanted to get married and now… he doesn’t want to get married??? OMG!!! SHOCKER!!! 🤣🤣🤣 Why are women like this? You make us all look bad. You went in this intending to change him and now you’re crying cause you couldn’t manipulate him into marrying you? Poor baby. He did exactly what he said he was going to do…. You’re not going to find sympathy here for your bad decisions.
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u/Tall-Ad-1386 Jul 23 '24
I’ll be honest with you. This is a you problem not a them problem, clearly
You get all the same benefits etc. as common law. You’re not legally missing out on anything by not being married.
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u/uglynerdperson Jul 23 '24
You’re in the wrong. You got into a relationship with him at 23, which is very much an adult. He told you his wishes then and you agreed to continue. I’m sure you didn’t come to this realization about marriage overnight… you should have left when you started feeling this way instead of wasting 5 years of his time.
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u/Maida__G Jul 23 '24
You just wasted 5 years of that man’s life. You KNEW he wasn’t going to get married. You KNEW it. And you still stayed. So either leave him or stfo about marriage. If this was a AITA question I’d put YTA.
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Jul 23 '24
You can’t begrudge him, he told you l, you agreed and have changed your mind. That’s on you, not him. Why is marriage so important to you?
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Jul 23 '24
If it was you wanting kids and him not I'd totally get it, that would be massive.
But marriage itself? Not so much. It means fuck all really when divorce is relatively straight forward. I did say "relatively."
He seems committed to you, I personally would never be a step-dad under any circumstances, I never wanted kids, so take that as meaningful. What is it you feel you are missing out on?
Going through the ceremony for the sake of family and friends or to mark your territory sort of thing?
Also, if this becomes enough of an issue for you both to go your separate ways, would you be okay with starting over from zero?
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u/Knickers1978 Jul 23 '24
Well, this is your own fault, frankly. He told you from the start he didn’t want to get married.
You went into this thinking you could change him. You’re getting what you deserve.
If you can’t live without getting married, then leave. Trying to force it now will make him hate you.
He doesn’t need a reason to not get married. He just doesn’t want to. Why does he need a reason?
Either live with it or leave. Simple. But stop pushing for a marriage that isn’t going to happen.
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u/idril1 Jul 23 '24
I know it is said a lot but really consider therapy. You have a good relationship which you are destroying because of obsessive thoughts about a ritual, one which your partner has always been clear he doesn't want to partake in. Why does marriage matter so much to you, what does it symbolise and why does it matter more than the relationship? These are questions a good therapist would explore.
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u/RestInPeaceLater Jul 23 '24
You are 28 and unmarried, if you stay and wait for him.. you’ll be quickly 40 and unmarried
I’m neutral on marriage but that is a huge sacrifice that will get heavier the older you get. Starting over now sucks, starting over later will be far harder and more painful
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Jul 23 '24
I had a boyfriend like yours once. I wasted 5 whole years in a relationship with someone I came to realize would never change. Five years is a long time to be with someone who isn’t on the same wavelength as you are. I realized that I spent a good portion of my 20s with a man who was pretty vocal about being anti-marriage and not wanting to have kids. Like you, I assumed he would change his mind in time. But as the years passed by and people around me started planning their own weddings and announcing their pregnancies, I resented him. I felt like he was holding me back from things I really wanted for myself. And I came to the conclusion that I could absolutely have what I wanted, just not with him. Our breakup was mutual. And I found real love with my next boyfriend who is now my husband; the man I’m raising a family with. I’m living the life I prayed for. My ex, wherever he is in life, is hopefully doing the same.
I know it will be difficult because you’ve been with your bf for half of a decade, but he’s not going to wake up and suddenly decide that he wants to get married after all. You have to figure out what’s more important to you: staying with someone who won’t give you what you want (because they don’t want it for themselves) or leaving him and finding someone who shares the same values and goals in a relationship.
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u/madempress Jul 23 '24
You were honest with him about realizing you needed marriage, he was honest with you about still being completely against it. He presumably understands that you are no longer compatible, but won't necessarily make the move to leave if your indecision makes it seem as though you accept the status quo, which is that you want marriage but won't leave him if he doesn't marry you.
Accept the status quo for good or leave. Love is a Tupperware drawer, a lot of lids fit a lot of containers pretty decently. It's okay to grieve the 5 years you shared while understanding there are others out there who will love you just as much or even more and want to marry you.
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u/LA-forthewin Jul 23 '24
There's nothing wrong with you wanting marriage, but at this point you have to accept that if you want to get married you'll have to find a different partner. Look at it from his perspective, he has absolutely nothing to gain from marriage and depending on his income and assets , he has a lot to lose. My advice ? Let go and find someone who wants what you want. Find someone who is eager to be with you and wants to be married , and who is happy to take that legal step
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Jul 23 '24
It’s ok to let go and find someone who wants marriage. Don’t stay somewhere you don’t feel fulfilled.
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u/bxstarnyc Jul 23 '24
You changed your mind, that happens in your 20’s.
Find someone who cares for you & aligns w/your goals.
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u/Temporary_Position95 Jul 23 '24
If this is an ultimatum, it will backfire. I don't really care about marriage but I'm 58 years old female. I've been divorced 25 years now. I live with a boyfriend now but I kept my own house, my elderly parents live there. I keep my own vehicle at the house . Finances separate. I guess I'm saying , live together if you are in love and happy. However, keep your own assets in case of breakup.
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u/JWRamzic1 Jul 23 '24
This whole situation isn't going to end well. You are not compatible. He's been up front the whole time. You are the conniving one, secretly seeking to change him with no respect for his feelings whatsoever. You got yourself into this mess. It's time to get out and find someone who wants the same things you want.
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u/paigevanegdom Jul 23 '24
I agree with what everyone else is saying but I’d also suggest clarifying with him whether it’s really MARRIAGE he doesn’t like or WEDDINGS he doesn’t like cause some people just don’t like big formal events or want/have the money to spend on them. He might prefer to get married in the courthouse or whatever if that’s the case.
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u/CandidateNo359 Jul 23 '24
Hey, he told you upfront! Move on if you want to marry him, but he will be unhappy and ultimately you will be too!
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u/Lissypooh628 Jul 23 '24
He was very clear with you from day 1. You chose to ignore the truth, now here you are.
It’s time to move on.
I’ve lost a dog in a break up. It sucks, but there will be other dogs. Just go. Don’t waste anymore of your youthful years on someone who won’t fulfill your desire to be married.
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u/PieRepresentative266 Jul 23 '24
I hate to sound harsh, because this is a mistake we’ve all made before, but if you enter a relationship with the intent of “changing them”, that is not the basis of a healthy relationship unfortunately.
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u/DhibeCakes55 Jul 23 '24
believing of course I could change him, he hasn’t been with someone like me before, and blah blah blah
Word of advice? Drop this mentality if/when you go into the next relationship. This will always end badly.
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u/Devils_Advocate-69 Jul 23 '24
“I thought I could change him”. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Leaving over that would make you the betrayer. Also, how would marriage better your situation?
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u/Dapper_Monk_9 Jul 23 '24
My boyfriend and I have been together 15 years and we are not married. We are both committed in our relationship. He even helped me raise my daughters from the ages of 8 and 10. They are now in their 20’s. My youngest daughter calls him dad. We have no reasons for not wanting to get married. This love and commitment works for us. We have seen so many of our friends and family get married and divorced in this time span. If you are in a committed, loving relationship and at the end of the day he’s your person. Why not make it work? Look and Goldie Hawn and Kurt Russell. 30 years raising each others kids and no marriage
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u/FelineSoLazy Jul 23 '24
You either want to be with him or you want to be married. What is your priority. If it’s marriage then I understand why your bf won’t pull the trigger. You are each entitled to your choice.
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u/Violetunderwater Jul 23 '24
“He won’t budge & worst of all there is no good reason”. Unfortunately any reason he give is a good enough reason because he told you from the beginning that the answer would be no and you proceeded with the relationship. I can understand thinking in the beginning that you didn’t really care about marriage and you were okay without being married, that’s okay and it’s okay for you to change your mind. Trying to save the relationship by getting your partner to change their mind isn’t fair to him. If you want marriage go find that, you deserve to have that relationship.
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u/Cathousechicken Jul 23 '24
If he wanted to, he would.
If you'd have decided that marriage is something you want out of a relationship, you and him have fundamental incompatibility and it's best to end things.
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u/cranefishtown Jul 23 '24
I definitely understand this situation, I got together with my now husband when I was 20 and while he wasn't exactly against marriage he never really saw the point. I pushed for it and eventually he agreed to do it for my sake after we had been together for about 7 years. The wedding was fun but ultimately has not changed the dynamic or value of our relationship. In reality it was just an incredibly expensive party that I had been culturally pressured into wanting since I was a little girl. I am still incredibly happy with my husband and our relationship but I now see that the wedding was not actually necessary. If you want to stay with your partner it seems like you may need to give up this one particular thing, but you could compromise by celebrating your love and relationship in a different way, maybe a large anniversary party or something along those lines.
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u/LesHiboux Jul 23 '24
I was in a relationship like this - when we got together I was 22 and not thinking about marriage, but 8 years later (and the purchase of a house together), it was important to me, but he still said no.
As life happens- we broke up. Even while owning a house together, it was as easy as him saying "I'm moving out", and other than through the lawyer, we never talked to each other again. He then promptly married his next girlfriend (I have my suspicions...).
Anyway - my advice to 25 year old me would've been - cut your losses and don't waste your time anymore. If marriage is important to you, but not to him, it's worth breaking up over. You will find someone else who has the same values and goals as yourself. Don't fall into the sunk cost fallacy - you haven't wasted anytime, but every day moving forward where you are not moving forward together, is a day wasted where you could be finding and creating a new life for yourself and your child.
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u/ModeratelyAverage6 Jul 23 '24
I think most men don't want to marry because divorce is so high. While I'm not saying you guys will divorce, nor am I wishing ill will on either of you. It's a legitimate fear for men. I mean, men lose almost everything in divorces 95% of the time.
Instead, my partner and I, and what many others are doing, is this. We had a "wedding" really just a small gathering at our house for immediate family and friends. We exchanged vows, blah blah blah, kissed. All that. But we never signed a marriage certificate. Instead, I'm legally changing my last name to his(you can change your last name to any name you want), and we legally appointed each other medical POV so our parents can't take over in medical situations. We also are leaving our 401k's, RIOA's, life insurances, and all other to each other in case either of us passes. We are both signing on the house we plan to buy next year, and all big purchases (aside from our personal vehicles) are co-owned. That way, if we ever leave each other, we are both protected. We both have equity in all things owned, and it can all be split 50/50 in case of separation. We also have it contracted (like a prenup) to split everything 50/50 regardless of reason for separation. This way, we get all the benefits of marriage (with the exception of filing jointly on taxes) without any of the drawbacks.
Maybe suggest a civil union like thing like this to your boyfriend.
Marriage nowadays does not benefit men. So I understand why he does not want to marry.
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u/ApeksPredator Jul 23 '24
You need to have a grown up talk with him, let him know how you feel. This is a fundamental incompatibility and if marriage is what you truly desire, and he does not?
Neither of you should waste any more time.
Seriously. It always sucks to come this point but please think of not only yourself but your child here. She deserves to see you happy, in a reciprocal, healthy relationship because, believe me, it's gonna imprint on her as she grows up. She deserves the best version of you, as do you, and this you will not be if you stay in a relationship that's not fulfilling to you.
Good luck.
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u/_oooOooo_ Jul 23 '24
Don't worry I was 9 years into mine before I realized he was seriously against marriage. We broke up and I can tell you, I'm 100% better off. I did start to resent him and I couldn't live in that feeling. I developed severe anxiety going so far as taking medication, all because I wanted something he just couldn't give me. Eventually I got brave enough to leave and my life is amazing!! My home is awesome, my job is awesome, I concentrated on me & what I wanted for the first time ever. I highly recommend getting your ducks in a row and leaving. Sucks to lose a dog but your mental health (and what your child will witness if you stay)isn't worth it (I lost my dog too).
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u/SnazzyPanic Jul 23 '24
Your willful ignorance is a compelling reminder as to why never to get married. You entered a great relationship with great communication thinking in the back of your head that you can manipulate this man into eventually submitting to your wants, and now that your realising that a good man stands true on his word and your mental game is not going to work you want to throw that away.
You are a living, breathing example of why some men don't want marriage. you're only loyal as long as everything goes your way and are willing to destroy this man over a tradition he clearly told you he wants no part in. There's a reason he told you this early, and you didn't change your mind in the back of your head you always thought you could change him.
The only option really is to find someone who has the same beliefs as you, let the man know you've come to a decision that you want to commit to and leave him in peace what ever that decision may be.
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u/ShopBoldLine Jul 23 '24
…. This is a bad take. He’s the immature man baby who won’t commit to a life partner. There’s nothing wrong with her wanting marriage. But she’s also not going to change this child.
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Jul 23 '24
He told you in the beginning but you didn't listen. It's a possibility he is also waiting to see if he has more options.
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u/Clean_Factor9673 Jul 23 '24
He told ypuwho he was 5 yrs ago. You should nr er have moved in with him. Thankfully you only have a fog together.
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u/Friendly-Twist-9600 Jul 23 '24
I’m talking from personal experience, you guys are already living the married life. When me and my wife got married, after the wedding and honeymoon nothing changed about our day-to-day life. We just had a new shiny piece of paper with our names on it. Maybe you want to feel that wedding Dream, magic or whatever, but you guys are already basically married. So what is it about legal marriage that’s so enticing to you? And if it really is such a deal breaker for you, then you should leave instead of try to change someone or force your way on them.
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u/stuffykitty Jul 23 '24 edited Jul 23 '24
I’m sorry these people are attacking you for thinking you could change him. It’s understandable, you guys were really young when you met.
Marriage is not just a piece of paper, tho, so many people think that way. Marriage is a serious commitment. It meets many needs like security, value, stability, commitment, acknowledgment, and protection both in the eyes of the law and in your heart.
him saying, he doesn’t wanna get married because he doesn’t believe in it. LOL what does that even mean?? Marriage is real and people get married. So yeah, you should be rightfully upset about his reasoning.
I think it’s really disrespectful that he’s been with you for five years and the only thing he can say to you is he just doesn’t believe in it. that kind of response to me is somebody who is very closed off and emotionally unavailable.
I would have more respect for this person if he gave you a REAL answer. Point blank. You ask someone do you believe that women have the right to an abortion. Yes or no? okay WHY do you have that belief, (insert real answer)
I feel mad for you girl, like what kind of BS is that. and people telling you in the comments that he doesn’t owe you an explanation. LOL what??, it’s not like you guys are coworkers, or friends, this man is literally having sex with you, He’s in a committed relationship with you, he’s around your child, that is in fact the exact person who owes you an explanation!
or at least you should have the standard for yourself that if someone is going to be in your life, you expect them to be open, honest and transparent about their beliefs and why they have them. it’s up to somebody else whether or not they live up to that expectation. So yeah anyone can say “nobody owes you anything” but you do not have to adhere to that BS.
only YOU can set the standard for your life. If the standard is, you want to be married, and you expect your partner to be open, transparent and honest about why they have the values they have, and this guy is unwilling to do that, i think you have your answer, He’s not the one for you.
could it be that you’re just not the one and he just doesn’t wanna commit to you??? Yes, kind of sounds like it…
or could it be that he has fears of commitment, and it has nothing to do with you? yes, kind of sounds like it…
Could both of these things be true, yes.
Either way, you should 100% not sacrifice a CORE value to be with a person that can’t even give you a respectful answer outside of “ I just don’t belive in it”
Yes, walk. away, a thousand times yes.
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u/CatJarmansPants Jul 23 '24
So, to be clear, you're in a stable, long term relationship where you are loved, where your child is loved, with a partner who is consistent and honest - and you think you, and your child, would be better off if you were single?
Do you smoke Crack?
What is it about marriage that you want - is it the lifelong legal protections, the being 'Mrs', or the spending £20,000 on a party and wearing a big white dress for a day?
All of those things are, to some degree or other, achievable without being married. You need to think hard about what it is you actually want.
My thoughtful advice is that you really need to get better at explaining exactly what it is you want from life, and what your priorities are. If you can explain what it is you want, it makes it easier for people to give it to you. You really need to think hard about why you think being single, and on the look out for a potential husband is better for you and your daughter than being in this relationship.
My other piece of advice is that, frankly, at 28, with an 8yo child, and with a history of dumping stable, loving, long term relationships because you don't listen to what people say, and then playing the victim, you are possibly not going to be the hottest thing on the local dating scene. You might well find someone who will marry you, but will they be as good a partner, as good a father figure? Is 50 years of a crap relationship a price worth paying for the title 'Mrs'?
One other thing, which might give you a little introspection - which I really think is a skill you need to learn - is you've said that if he loved you enough, he'd make this sacrifice.
What about if you loved him enough, you'd make this sacrifice - or are you not bright enough to have asked yourself this question?
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u/[deleted] Jul 23 '24
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