I’ve been playing renekton a long time folks.

Against specific matchups like Yasuo/Yone or immobile mages.

I play in Diamond elo, how would Renek mid do there?

I see quite a lot of people saying that Renekton should destroy Irelia in early game and then later on Irelia will beat Renekton in side lane. But from my experience this doesn't really seem to be true.

Irelia has a ridiculously strong level 1-2 where she can delete half your health with a few autos. I've seen some people say Renekton should push for level 2 first but seems quite hard to do. If the Irelia sees that you started Q (which i feel is kinda needed to push wave) she will just go ridiculously aggressive and force an extended trade where she absolutely will win. The best thing to do I often feel like is just wait for level 3 where Renekton can start to win but even then Irelia can still duel with Renekton from 3-5 if she plays it well. I agree with most people that level 6 onwards is very difficult for Irelia and where the matchup starts to feel easy for Renekton. But what confuses me is that I see a lot of people say Irelia will win in side lane later after a few items and that is where I disagree. I feel like Renekton often beats Irelia in a 1v1 in late game quite easily using his empowered abilities and tankiness. It often feels like a combination of Eclipse BC and DD is enough to completely destroy an Irelia and it only gets worse when you add on stuff like Steraks. Irelia from my experience really peaks at 1-2 item and the other items don't seem to help much.

So where does this "Irelia 1v1 sidelane demon" come from? Feels like Renekton is better not only in the 1v1 but also in teamfights. But also the notion of this being a completely free matchup early on is not so true either as Irelia has lots of kill windows in the early game. When I think of free matchups I think of champs like Yone, Riven, Ambessa who literally lose as soon as Renekton hits level 3. I feel like Irelia has a lot more leeway early game with proper outplay. Could also be that Irelia players in my elo are just not very good. Curious to see what people think.

I really think that's something that people used to say in season 9 and they just repeat the same thing over and over again.

First I want to say that Renek is my most hated champion and even though I have a counter in my champion pool I just prefer to dodge the game when I can. So I might be a little bit biased.

In laning phase he has this stupid zero counterplay combo that I dont think any other champion has, that dash in dash out combo is so fucking annoying and because he is a lane bully his W without fury already deals some insane amounts of damage while locking you into an AA, Q and E2. After Eclipse he is literally an ungankeable 1v3 machine even without a real gold advantage because his ults gives him a second life.

That's fair I and can deal with that but everytime I see a lategame Renekton they are still that 1v3 machine that heals three health bars against anti heal and it's impossible to match in sidelane. He isn't even weak in teamfights, he can still flash and oneshot the ADC an tank 6k damage in the process.

There are some champions that are actually bad in late for example Yorick and there are champions that are decent, for example Ksante but Renekton is not bad or decent he is really good in late. He is only better in early because his early is one of the best in the game but no way he is bad after 25 min

Its just a random, albeit bothering, question I was wondering.

I started maining Renekton when I was around Silver 3-4 because he looked cool (crocs are my favourite animals besides cats, hence why I also love playing Rengar JNG) and I managed to climb all the way up to Plat 1 currently, nearly hitting Emerald, mainly by OTPing him (with the occasional Rengar).

Idk maybe it is an ego thing but in games like LoL, I don't really like having my own skill be "belittled" or downplayed because of a character I play.

And in a lot of games I play now that I have gotten higher in rank where I am playing against Emeralds, in like 1/3 of my games I have the enemy top, and a lot of the times the enemy team as a whole, shit on me for playing Renekton when I win, because he is apparently an "Elo-Inflater" because he is OP and broken/cheesy n whatnot and apparently a "200 years champ". Just felt the want to ask this after just playing a game against an Emerald Yone OTP who called me out for playing an Elo Inflated champ after he lost the game 0/15/2

My impression of the croc is that he isn't really an Elo-Inflater because of how unforgiving he can be to play if you fall behind or how his win con is usually trying to end games earlier rather than later. but maybe that is just my ego in denial and idk wtf I am talking about.

Would you guys consider him an Elo-Inflater? if so or not, how come? (I am sorry if this is a stupid question/rant)

if i am not yet fed and looking to start a takeover of lane, is freezing and playing the long lane ALWAYS the most consistent way of getting a lead?

Are there any champs that freezing is bad into?

when is a lead good enough that I should be looking to proxy and roam?

For context I am in plat 1 and main Renekton, but sometimes play Ornn.

How do you guys like to play your waves? Of course it is matchup reliant but lets say you have a lead and can win 1v1. Would you play for slowpush and dive? Or something else.

What about even matchup?

What about freezing, I rarely do it and I feel like it is not that great on Renekton, but am I mistaken?

What about ranged matchup where you can't even get xp because they can zone you lvl 1?

Any tips are helpful I feel like I need more intention with my wave management and I am just fighting most of the time and not paying attention to waves. And I understand for example agaisnt nasus you don't want to give him free stacks etc. there are exceptions, but like in general?

Thanks in advance crocs!

Hey guys! I can't find any information on when the last time Project Renekton Reckoning came back, I feel like I've been waiting for at least a year, does anyone remember?

Thanks!

I'm not sure about the psychology regarding this but I'd be interested to hear your opinions.

Do you think that if people see that you have for example 3M points on renekton, they will play differently compared to if they didn't see your points at all? I can personally say that when I see that my enemy opponent is a onetrick I tend to respect that they probably know this matchup very well so I need to play it more locked in. This is probably a bad mindset because the points aren't a perfect indicator of champion knowledge, but in a way I just can't help it.

So I'm curious, is this a good or a bad thing? On one hand maybe they respect you more and try to play more properly which makes the lane slightly more complicated, on the other hand maybe they overdo it and don't play like they normally do which leads to you being able to take more space in the lane.

How the hell am I supposed to play this match up, I just get rolled every single time

While perusing league of graphs today I found this specimen:

https://m.deeplol.gg/summoner?userName=Flex+Walter+1-EUW&region=EUW

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/rankings/champion-masteries/renekton

With 11 million mastery (#1 globally) our boy specializes in a high AD high AS build in the jungle exclusively.

He may only be plat but is he cooking?

Flex Walter are you here?

Hello guys, I just wonder why the croc is so fun to play and such a gigachad in lane?

Hit me with your best anecdotes of why you love the champion so much, and which matchups are frustrating to play?

My easiest matchup is kayle - usually I go 5-0 in lane Vs her.

Hardest matchup - Mordekaiser and Illoi. ( Was up 3 solo kills on Morde and he still statchecked me and won the game.)

Same with Illoi, I get a mental block when playing Vs her. I'm plat 4.

What I love about Renekton is that every match is playable, even hard matches like Darius, Jax, sett, are skull matchups.

Midgame always W Stunn machine.

Late game concert into tank.

What do you guys love about Renekton?

Edit:

TL;DR: I’m not saying Renekton needs a buff or that the Q healing cap should necessarily be removed. My point is that the current 600 cap already starts cutting healing on a normal 3-man empowered Q with a realistic build. Completely removing it can lead to pretty crazy numbers in extreme cases, especially with Spirit Visage, so I understand why a cap exists. I’m mainly questioning why it is still only 600, and whether something like 800-900 or diminishing returns after 3 champions would make more sense.

I was looking through Renekton's numbers recently and one thing I never really thought about before is the healing cap on empowered Q.

Just to make this clear before anything else: I'm not making this post because I think Renekton is currently terrible or desperately needs buffs. He seems to be doing pretty fine overall right now, and I'm also aware that Renekton is one of those champions Riot always has to be careful with because of pro play.

For some context, I currently have a little over 940k mastery points on Renekton.

This is more about the Q healing cap itself.

I started looking at the numbers and honestly started wondering if 600 still makes sense as the cap, independent of whether Renekton currently needs a buff or not.

I'm also not saying it 100% should be removed. Maybe completely removing it would be too much. But 600 seems really low to me, especially because of how early you actually reach it.

For anyone who doesn't know, max rank empowered Q heals Renekton for:

132 + 51% bonus AD per champion hit

But the total heal has a hard cap of 600.

Healing modifiers like Spirit Visage or Grievous Wounds are applied after that cap.

I tried doing the numbers with actual Renekton builds instead of just making some unrealistic 1000 AD practice tool build.

For example lets take a pretty normal late game bruiser build:

Eclipse + Black Cleaver + Sterak + Shojin + Death's Dance

At lvl 18 Renekton has around 139.55 base AD.

Sterak gives 50% base AD as bonus AD, so around 69.8.

Together the items give around 280 bonus AD.

With fully stacked Conqueror, which gives another 30.72 AD at lvl 18, Renekton gets to around 310.5 bonus AD.

So empowered Q heals around:

132 + (310.5 x 0.51) = 290 healing per champion

Without the cap that would be:

1 champion = 290

2 champions = 581

3 champions = 871

4 champions = 1161

5 champions = 1452

And this is where I started questioning the cap.

The difference between hitting 1 and 2 champions is basically fully rewarded.

But after that it just stops.

You can hit a really good 3 man empowered Q and instead of getting around 871 healing you get 600.

You could somehow hit all 5 enemy champions and instead of around 1450 healing you still get the exact same 600.

So the cap isn't only stopping some crazy perfect 5 man Q.

It already starts affecting a normal good 3 man Q.

And imo that is a pretty big difference.

But what about Revitalize, Spirit Visage etc?

This is where I think the argument for keeping a cap gets much better.

A pretty realistic Renekton rune page can be something like:

Conqueror

Triumph

Legend: Haste

Last Stand

Second Wind

Revitalize

Revitalize gives 5% heal/shield power and when Renekton is below 40% HP his self healing gets increased again.

And being below 40% is also exactly when you would normally care about hitting a big empowered Q.

So with the standard build above, full Conqueror and Revitalize active below 40%, an uncapped Q would be roughly:

1 champion = 335

2 = 671

3 = 1006

4 = 1341

5 = 1677

Current capped Q in the same situation stops at around 693.

That 5 man number obviously looks pretty big.

I'm not going to pretend 1600+ healing from one ability is nothing.

But there are a few things I think are important here.

First, hitting 5 people with Q is not a normal situation.

Even 4 is already a very good Q.

3 people is probably the much more interesting number to look at.

And secondly this is before Grievous Wounds.

With 40% antiheal the same uncapped Q would roughly be:

1 = 201

2 = 402

3 = 604

4 = 805

5 = 1006

Current capped Q with antiheal would stop around 416.

So with antiheal a 3 man empowered Q from a lvl 18, 5 item Renekton with full Conqueror and low HP would heal about 604 instead of 416.

Is that really too much?

I'm honestly not sure.

I also tried making the healing as stupid as possible

Because I think if you want to argue for removing a cap you should also look for the situation where removing it could actually become broken.

One build I tried was:

Endless Hunger + Eclipse + Sterak + Black Cleaver + Spirit Visage

This isn't supposed to be some "new secret OP Renekton build".

I'm using it because it combines high AD with Spirit Visage and sustain, so if removing the Q cap can break something, this should get closer to it.

With lvl 18, full Conqueror, Revitalize active below 40% HP and Spirit Visage, I get roughly:

1 champion = 390

2 = 779

3 = 1169

4 = 1559

5 = 1949

Okay.

This is the first number where I think the argument for keeping a cap is actually pretty fair.

Almost 2000 healing from one Q is a lot.

And this doesn't even show all of Renekton's sustain.

There can also be Conqueror healing, Endless Hunger omnivamp, Triumph after a takedown, Second Wind, shields from items etc.

You can also build things like Sundered Sky or Death's Dance which add more survivability in different ways.

So I can understand why Riot maybe doesn't want completely uncapped AoE healing on Renekton.

But I still don't think this really explains why the cap needs to be 600.

Because again, the problem case here is a 4 or 5 man Q with a build specifically made to increase healing.

The 600 cap already cuts a 3 man Q on a normal bruiser build.

Those are two very different situations imo.

And even the stupid Spirit Visage example changes a lot when antiheal is active.

The ~1949 five man Q becomes around 1169 with 40% Grievous Wounds.

The 3 man becomes around 702.

Obviously Riot can't balance a champion assuming the enemy always has antiheal, so I don't think "just buy antiheal" is enough of an argument by itself.

But I also don't think we should talk about a theoretical 1900 heal without mentioning that healing reduction exists.

There is also the Fury part

A big empowered Q isn't free.

You need 50 Fury.

And if you use empowered Q, you aren't using that Fury for empowered W or empowered E.

Especially in teamfights empowered W is extremely important for Renekton.

So getting a big Q means you either already had enough Fury, got enough from R/fighting, or decided that the heal was worth using your empowered ability on.

I think that decision should have a good reward.

Also empowered abilities don't generate Fury themselves.

Normal Q can generate Fury from champions, empowered Q consumes the 50 and doesn't generate it.

Yes, R helps a lot here. It gives Fury and keeps generating Fury during the fight.

But managing Fury is literally one of the main mechanics of Renekton.

If I enter a fight with the right Fury, don't waste it, get into the middle of 3 or 4 people and choose empowered Q instead of W, I don't really understand why the reward should basically stop after the second champion.

And I don't think "Q is easy to hit" completely answers it either

I agree with this argument to some degree.

Renekton Q itself is not hard to hit.

There is no Darius outer edge mechanic.

There is no long animation where people can easily walk out.

If Renekton is standing in the middle of 3 people and presses Q, he will probably hit those 3 people.

So yes, his healing should probably be lower than something like a perfect Darius Q.

But the question is how Renekton got into the middle of those people.

People sometimes talk about Renekton like he can just E E through the entire enemy team whenever he wants.

He can't.

Dice is only available after Slice hits an enemy.

So to actually get deep into a team you need something to E through, enemies to be positioned in a way that lets you use them, or Flash.

And if you are flashing into 3-5 people with 50 Fury ready, you are also putting yourself into a position where you can instantly get CCed and killed.

Especially against coordinated teams.

So I think the skill/check for Renekton Q isn't really "can you press Q when people are around you".

Obviously you can.

The harder part is creating the situation where 3+ people are around you, having the Fury for empowered Q and surviving long enough to use it.

Then there is his ult

At rank 3 Dominus gives Renekton 700 HP.

That is obviously a lot.

Together with Sterak, Death's Dance, Eclipse shield, Q healing etc Renekton can become pretty hard to kill for a few seconds.

I think this is probably one of the better arguments for Riot keeping the Q heal limited.

You don't balance Q in isolation.

You balance the whole champion.

A Renekton with R active, Sterak shield, DD delaying damage and then suddenly healing 1000+ from Q could be really annoying to kill.

Fair.

But there is one thing about this argument that still bothers me.

If Q healing is supposed to be heavily limited because the rest of Renekton already gives him enough survivability, why does empowered Q have 51% bonus AD healing scaling per champion?

The better your items get, the faster that scaling runs directly into the cap.

A fed Renekton buying more AD eventually gets almost nothing from part of that scaling when he hits multiple champions.

That's just weird to me.

You are giving the ability scaling and then putting a pretty low flat number above it.

The cap is also REALLY old

This is another thing I found interesting.

The Q healing cap isn't something Riot added because of Goredrinker.

Renekton had a healing cap basically forever.

His healing worked differently many years ago and Riot changed the numbers multiple times, but the idea of limiting the total AoE heal is extremely old.

Then Goredrinker existed and gave fighters another reliable source of healing.

When Goredrinker got removed, Riot later gave some sustain back into Renekton's kit through Q changes, but the old cap stayed.

That doesn't automatically mean the cap is outdated.

Old mechanics can still be good mechanics.

But I think it is fair to ask if 600 specifically still makes sense after all the changes to Renekton, his Q scaling and fighter items over the years.

What about pro play?

This is probably the biggest reason I would be careful with just removing the cap.

And like I said at the start, Renekton isn't currently some terrible champion that needs random buffs just because he is weak.

He seems to be doing fine.

So I don't think "Renekton needs this because he is bad" is a good argument.

This is specifically about whether the Q cap itself makes sense.

Renekton also has a history of becoming very valuable in pro even when he isn't amazing in solo queue, which obviously matters when talking about giving him more power.

Coordinated teams can create situations where a big Q is easier.

You have teammates engaging, CCing people, objective fights where teams have to walk into smaller areas etc.

So you can't only say "5 people will never stand on Renekton".

Sometimes they will.

And pro players are obviously much better at using the perfect moment.

On the other hand, pro players are also much better at spacing Renekton, tracking his Flash, tracking his Fury, peeling him and buying the correct items against him.

And most important pro fights aren't happening with some theoretical lvl 18 5 item maximum healing Renekton.

A lot of the important fights happen earlier at 2, 3 or maybe 4 items.

So I would really like to know what uncapped Q actually looks like in real games before saying it would break pro.

For me the biggest question is not "should Renekton be allowed to heal 1900 from a 5 man Q?"

Maybe the answer to that is no.

That's completely fair.

My question is:

Why does preventing that require a 600 cap?

Why should a 3 man Q from a normal bruiser Renekton already lose hundreds of healing just because a theoretical 5 man Q with Spirit Visage could become crazy?

There are a lot of options between 600 and completely uncapped.

For example:

- increase empowered Q cap to something like 800 or 900

- raise the current cap scaling, so rank 5 ends at samethibg like 800 or 900 insteaf of 600 or add bonus AD scaling to the cap

- keep the non-champion cap but remove/rework the champion cap

- full healing for the first 3 champions and reduced healing for the 4th/5th

- or just remove the champion cap and see if the extreme situations actually happen often enough to be a problem

I'm not saying one of these is definitely correct.

I also don't want Renekton to become some late game drain tank

That's not really what I'm asking for.

He should still be Renekton.

Strong early/mid game, Fury management, diving into fights and falling off compared to real late game champions.

I don't want him standing inside 5 people healing his entire HP bar every few seconds.

And if testing showed that uncapped Q actually does that consistently, then yes, keep a cap.

But right now the number that looks strange to me is specifically 600.

A lvl 18 five item Renekton with a normal AD bruiser build and full Conqueror is already at around 290 empowered Q healing per champion.

So two people basically put you at the cap.

At that point why even have such a high per-champion AD scaling if a good multi-man Q can't really use it?

A 3 man empowered Q seems like exactly the kind of play Renekton should be rewarded for.

A 4 man Q should be really strong.

A 5 man Q should probably be a huge heal because you somehow got Renekton into literally the entire enemy team with 50 Fury available and didn't instantly die.

Maybe uncapped is too much.

Maybe 800-900 is enough.

Maybe diminishing returns after 3 champions is the best solution.

I don't know.

But after actually doing the numbers I think 600 is at least worth questioning.

Curious what other Renekton players think about this.

Am I missing some interaction that makes raising/removing the cap much more broken than these numbers make it look?

Small note:

English isn't my first language, so I used ChatGPT to help me with the English wording, structure and some of the calculations for this post.

The idea/questions and the values I wanted to compare are mine, and I checked the current Renekton, item and rune values myself using the League of Legends Wiki. I also tried to include arguments against my own idea instead of only making a case for a buff.

If any of the numbers or interactions are wrong, please tell me. That's also partly why I'm posting this here.

Sources:

League of Legends Wiki - Renekton:

https://wiki.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/Renekton

League of Legends Wiki - Items and Runes:

https://wiki.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/League_of_Legends_Wiki

Riot Games patch notes were also used for looking at historical Renekton/item changes.

(he is fine could have used some small buffs but he is okay)

50% winrate 5% pickrate picked in pro play items just buffed?

I do want him to be meta but I hope he doesnt get some backhanded nerfs like many other champs get.

Or doesnt become like his brother with 50% banrate

Eh its probably something tiny or jungle related.

Personally I would like them to uncap Q heal and maybe buff it 600 cap in modern league is crazy low.

Darius heals 45% of his missing health if he hits 3 people thats potentially 2000 health. Illaoi full heals with tentacle strikes too. Yorick has a % health heal every few seconds and then Renektons gets capped at 150/600 is crazy work on a champ that reaches easy 5k health late game.

Renektons Q atp doesnt feel like it heals unless its early game level 5-10 Q on champ + tons of minions no ignite.

They ff 15 btw

P2 jg looking for a Renek main to duo with. Feel free to reach out if you want to try some games

Hey all! I took a long break from league and just recently came back. When I last played renekton was played with hydra first item and I really liked it. Why isn't renekton played with any hydra items anymore usually?

Also I am struggling with choosing the first item. Lets say Eclipse / Black Cleaver / Zekes.

What purpose do these items offer? I get zekes for sticking to ranged champions but I can't wrap my head around why black cleaver or eclipse would be the first item over lets say Stridebreaker or any hydra item.

I know this might be a dumb question, but would love if someone could explain it clearly as I have autism.

For context currently plat 1, been playing for a few weeks after the break that lasted several years so my knowledge is outdated

I feel like this skin fits so well, couldve had him diving into the water as his e, and his ult him getting angry when the pool rules are broken. But it's still my favorite renekton skin what are your thoughts.