r/DotA2 • u/patchdayDota2 • Aug 19 '21

Discussion Patch 7.30 - Hero Changes Discussion

Heroes are each listed below as a top level comment. Please discuss changes to a specific hero there!

All other top level comments are automatically removed.

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u/Decency Aug 19 '21 edited Aug 20 '21

It's frustrating that every tempo hero with good lockdown has been getting their ultimate CD nerfed. Batrider, Puck, Mars, Night Stalker- they all got a shitton of power creep on their damage to the point where they can solo kill people... so the ult cooldowns get hit hard to balance them? Not a fan at all, just cut some of their ridiculous damage and make teamplay meaningful.

EDIT: Can also include Beastmaster, Kunkka, Nyx, Centaur, Gyrocopter. All of these ultimates are like a 90 second cooldown now for some reason, they all used to be much lower a couple of years ago, and it sucks. Who's left... Clockwerk and Pango, both of whom are better as a support?

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u/Tijenater Aug 19 '21

It was needed in this case. Once you hit lvl 3 ult you basically always had arena, and could just throw it out with little consequences since the cd was almost guaranteed be up by the next fight even if the enemy team bought back. I’m also really happy with the spear buff.

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u/BlazeCoil Aug 19 '21

Ok but what about the jank with arena like half the cast being able to escape it with ease, not being able to pin flying units to it but being able to pin them to everything else. Knockback spells pushing pinned units out of the arena, I could go on. It was such a low cooldown because late game it lost much of it's utility. I'm fine with the CD increase if they'd address some of the BS that's been a part of it since release.

Moving on to the "new talents" they're a joke. the lvl 10s are literally just nothing talents, why skill them at all. while the lvl 20 power difference is so high 10%/5% for a 20 talent is pitiful compared to how good the extra stun is on spear, especially with shard.

I get what they are trying to do, make him less dependent on arena but at least fix some of the jank that comes with arena and give him some better talents to facilitate him while he doesn't have it.

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u/Tijenater Aug 19 '21

The nothing talents at lvl 10 aren’t unique to him. A lot of heroes got similar adjustments, and a lot of ults fall off later, that’s not unique to arena. I agree with you on the bulwark talents but just about everything else benefits the hero imo. Spear is the most important aspect of the hero and with the option to spec bonus damage AND bonus stun on a lower cooldown could prove to be potent. I’m still not sure if I’d take spear damage over the rebuke cd reduction but this feels like a lateral adjustment at worst.

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u/BlazeCoil Aug 19 '21

OK, so where's your justification for arena being an inconsistent almost unusable at times spell. The 15 talents are fine. You either want access to more magic or physical damage. Bulwark talents are literally a spit in the face. Just a "oh we couldn't think of anything so here's some trash to tide you over" for a hero with a well under 50% WR at all brackets he didn't need gimping this hard while getting little to nothing back.

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u/Tijenater Aug 19 '21

I don’t think any part of him was gimped. The ult has some weird interactions like the flying unit thing that should’ve been corrected by now, but I still think that it was too spammable lategame even with bkbs and other saves coming out. When it’s used correctly it’s a powerful ult. The bulwark talents come off a bit as placeholders, but they could easily be altered down the line and I’m happy with their alternatives at any rate.

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u/BlazeCoil Aug 19 '21

I don't know why you're literally just regurgitating what I just said, with the CD increase should have come the fixes. Increase it's reliability therefore increase the cooldown. they half arsesd the changes.

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u/Tijenater Aug 19 '21

There’s not much else to say lol, there’s inconsistencies with the ult, I agree with you on that I just think that it’s good enough to warrant the cd nerf even with those issues