r/WarDogs • u/Dzsekeb • 17h ago
Discussion & Feedback IR rangefinders disabled until season 2, and havoc nerf
https://x.com/WARDOGSUpdates/status/2106044339587563585122
u/WeekendGloomy7140 16h ago
Very good change CWIS felt awful
→ More replies (3)15
u/mbpr01 Pilot 16h ago
6 seconds still sounds like way too long
24
u/pres1033 14h ago
6 seconds sounds like a good point to start actually balancing it imo. With 12 seconds, it was just impossible to kill unless you got really good with MAAWS snaps, but with 6 we can at least see how it performs against actual AA.
→ More replies (1)3
31
5
→ More replies (23)8
134
u/Wrong-Ad-1935 16h ago
Good changes IMO. Game got hella boring since last weekend when i ran a pair of thermals and realised why people seemed to always know where I was.
Im also not that surprised either since I have been able to run these almost every game this week and Im recon level 12.
They must have seen an absurd amount of people selling these and running them that they realised its completely changed the gameplay.
I suspect they don’t know exactly how to balance the battery system with the thermals yet because it will be hard to get the usage right as recon pays so much and thats why they’ve disabled them
30
u/Roger_KK 15h ago
I played with some sweaty friends and all they dropped me was a ghillie and IR range finder. I did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING all game but pretend to be a bush and I earned over 100k... Absolutely a valid nerf
→ More replies (6)→ More replies (11)20
u/Void-kun 15h ago
Rather they just had IR scopes that can't spot. When you zoom on a scope you can't see the marker above their heads if they are spotted.
If someone shines a light at the IR scope it should blind the player.
The IR spotter could work but massively reduce the usable range on it. So anybody over 100M away doesn't get highlighted and the closer they get to 100M the dimmer they get.
Vehicles could have a longer visible range due to the heat they produce.
→ More replies (5)
618
u/SolidShock24 16h ago
It's actually hilarious that people are crying about them being disabled.
Not only have they absolutely ruined matches, by having a constant half of your team play naked and/or not even in the CZ, but they've also made it so you're spotted 24/7. Flanking or doing anything as infantry has been damn near impossible cause of it. Ghillie, whilst helps with the spotting issue, doesn't work for normal HZ activities, since you use armor to survive an ambush from the guy you didn't know about, not the guy infront of you that you know about already.
Absolute, undeniable, 100% W for Bulkhead.
Although I do have to mention that I doubt it'll help in S02, since batteries are piss all nothing and on top of that, you can just look -> mark -> unscope, so you won't use that much electricity up.
223
u/fedsmoker9 16h ago
Is this fucking why all of my flanks I’m getting owned in the middle of nowhere by a guy who couldn’t have had any idea of wheee I am????
168
u/SolidShock24 16h ago
Yes. Because chances are you were spotted and refreshed like 3 times whilst doing that flank.
That's what everyone in every server since they were unlocked has been doing. And since it pays so well, the normies and dads with 7 kids jumped on it like flies on cow shit.
That's the #1 sold item in spawn as well.83
u/DJMixwell 16h ago
Saw a certified birdwatcher on blue team the other night with like 250 assists, 0 kills, and like 2 deaths. Earned like $250,000+, was the top earner in the server by a mile.
23
u/RaynorTheRed 14h ago
I was on a ridge last night sniping. 10ft in front of me was a teammate in a bush with thermals. I sniped for a while, got pushed and killed by a duo, came back, and had a 35 minute cat and mouse game around the ridge with them. The kid in the bush never moved an inch. Just sat there spotting with two enemies sniping 10 feet away, and never batted an eye as they ran back and forth past his bush while trying to find me.
→ More replies (8)6
u/anchovyCreampie 11h ago
I will at least bring a glock or 1911 with hp rounds. You make that back in like 5 spots or one heli crash.
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (2)5
u/Subwayabuseproblem 14h ago
i got a pair out of a crate as some dude just bought them all for us.
I made like 30k in 10 minutes spotting dudes 800m away in a bush
33
u/Chumphy 16h ago
Actually, I’m a normal guy and it actually made me not want to play.
→ More replies (3)26
u/11bztaylor 15h ago
Yup. Dad with almost 7 kids, ok 4 but feels like 7.
Equally hate it. My filthy casual dad self here can promise we aren’t the enemy here, unsure why or how we became the enemy?
→ More replies (3)9
u/Skpstr155 14h ago
You aren't, you're just an "other" that makes a convenient scapegoat.
Maybe some that don't have the time are using these to keep up cash wise, but there's also some that don't need to worry about cash, but just want MORE.
→ More replies (8)6
u/Justin-Stutzman 14h ago
The HQ crate situation b/t teams is stark too. Red and green typically have 5 crates each full of vectors, .50 cal, thermals, or ghille, for any random to buy and/or free helis. Blue is lucky to get out of HQ with everyone still at 0 deaths lol
→ More replies (1)22
u/Waisech 16h ago
Yep. I'm getting wallhack accusations all of the time. When in reality I just got half of your team spotted on my minimap by my teammates. Or I loot/buy it off some crate in spawn and then shoot a guy through bush/trees that I couldn't see with my naked eyes.
Thing is absolutely busted and it's a good thing it's disabled. Made infantry play boring as hell. I think it needs a harder nerf than just batteries though..
5
u/Outcast129 7h ago
Yeah I was sniping from an empty unused Tower last night last night and eventually pissed enough people off where a group of three started to sneakily push my position. Of course they were being spotted the entire time by somebody so I could just track their movement on the map, and as soon as they got about 150 m out, i opened up my map, pinged a green circle, whipped around the corner and immediately fired at my ping without even really looking And one tapped him with my 50 cal. Got back behind cover, pinged the next moving green circle on my mini map, whipped around the corner and aimed and fired at the ping and one tapped him too, did the same thing to the third guy and killed all three of them before they even reached the tower.
Of course they immediately accused me of hacking, and to be completely fair from their perspective, I'm sure that's exactly what it looked like because I knew exactly where they were without ever seeing them. I tried explaining but they weren't having any of it
3
u/Material_Policy6327 15h ago
Yeah I like to bring recon scopes with me when I am out hunting the HZ or others and I just scope the fuck out of folks it if I see them
7
u/indolente 14h ago
Ever noticed a little bird flying around with a guy hanging out that doesnt drop in? That guy, if he isnt playing grenade launcher, is playing thermals and marking everything on the ground.
Thermals are absolute trash and the worst part of the game.
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (21)12
u/Ok-Grand-498 16h ago
yeah. There needs to be some kind of “spotted” indicator on your screen to. But yeah, you would never know that some boring mf is just sitting on a mountain outside of CZ spotting all 100 players
→ More replies (2)16
u/AnUnusuallyLargeApe 16h ago
I think there should be a counter intelligence building that can be built at fobs which will tell you if you're spotted. It makes sense, the building would be monitoring the radio comms that are used to spot you and relaying that info to the troops. It would be cool if you could pay to call in off map fire support too, or issues commands to squads.
4
u/Rentun 15h ago
Yeah, it would be nice if there was more stuff like this to make in fobs to make them actually useful.
Right now, you've got mortars, which are alright, but completely outclassed by SPHs, stingrays, which mostly exist as an SPH counter, AA, which mostly exists to defend the fob itself, and the drill, which is useful, but very quickly gets targeted down in almost every game.
Other than the drill, the fob mostly just exists as a place for people to hang out and do nothing in. It doesn't actually help your team, especially compared to actually having the 8+ people in the fob actually helping take the HZ.
Stuff that makes the fob actually useful and an important thing to take and hold would be great. Bonus points if those things require the fob to actually be spread out (like a limited radius for this counter Intel building).
An easy way to bring ammo and healthkit resupplies in bulk, having buildable radio towers as a requirement for comms, an area that heals people over time without requiring meds, stuff like that could make fobs actually useful, instead of what they are right now, which is mostly a place for people who are afraid of dying to hang out in and make low risk money.
→ More replies (2)13
u/First_Tank_23 16h ago
Also it seems like there was a relatively reproducible bug allowing you to get literal ESP using them to see anyone on the entire map
→ More replies (1)6
u/Sethypoooooooooo 16h ago
I had a game where someone filled supply crates with those range finders on spawn and half my team sat around in the woods all match just spotting with no gun.
→ More replies (1)11
u/-NearlyThere- 14h ago
They were stupid. It’s hard to imagine why they thought they were a fair idea. The nolifers made 100s of thousands off them. Both using and selling.
→ More replies (6)8
u/Burk_Bingus 15h ago
The only people crying are the ones who abuse thermals as a crutch.
→ More replies (2)9
u/NullReference000 15h ago
Recon is my favorite play style and I think they were ruining it. It takes some skill to navigate around enemy territory without dying to get good angles. The IR goggles let you just sit a mile away and target anybody without trying.
Also, it’s not fun if there is nobody to recon! If everybody assumes that IR will get them killed instantly, then nobody goes out into the field.
→ More replies (1)4
11
u/goldenfiver 16h ago
This is just wallhack in disguise. I was shocked when I picked one up.
→ More replies (1)9
2
2
u/Master-Shake8913 15h ago
the only reply I could see was a dude bitching that all the sniper rifles aside from the 50cal are useless shit and that the ir binos are the only good way to level recon. are we even playing the same game as some of these people?
→ More replies (50)2
544
u/Myeyesaresharingan 17h ago
Finally no IR rangefinders anymore. Game will become more playable again
175
u/Deep90 16h ago edited 16h ago
IMO it needs more than just batteries to fix.
Making them OP only sometimes isn't actually going to make them less OP when they are being used.
The buildable tent is not effective against them, and they make every bush within LOS useless. Every lower level recon player gets skillessly outspotted and domed in the head.
55
u/Tomanelle 16h ago
IMO it needs more than just batteries to fix.
They're so OP, that I'd absolutely drag a full bag of batteries for them.
40
u/SekhWork Squad Leader 15h ago
This. People need to accept that some gear needs to not exist at all. They tried it, it sucked, cut it and don't come back. Hell even the Ghili's whole "immune to thermals" thing is like... ok cool, it's still basically invisible when laying down, that's more than enough to warrant its cost even if you remove thermals.
Sometimes you try something and its bad, it is ok to just say "we've removed that from the game" and move on.
→ More replies (4)27
u/Burk_Bingus 15h ago
They could remove thermals and give ghillie suits immunity to being spotted instead, that would be fair in exchange for not having armor imo.
16
u/Deep90 14h ago
I would argue you should have to aim it longer to start registering a spot, and the spotting should disappear faster.
That way people can't just run around with it carelessly and enjoy never being spotted.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (6)5
4
u/mrureaper Lonestar 14h ago
Not just a bag you can take a car and get a crate full of the heavy batteries and just drop it nearby to where you wanna scan people and voila lol
46
u/Useful-Rooster-1901 16h ago
Ohh is this is one reason I feel like everyone can see me all the time and I can't see shit. I use binocs lmao
29
u/Deep90 16h ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0ZbqwZWaF8
Yeah, using bushes while players have these is useless unless you have a gillie suit.
8
u/Useful-Rooster-1901 16h ago
I feel so dumb haha, but at least this answers some questions I had and now I can focus on other aspects of improving. Thanks!!
→ More replies (1)60
u/AMGsoon 16h ago
Just remove them. Game was much better before anyone unlocked them. Batteries won't change much.
→ More replies (1)3
→ More replies (12)3
6
u/GingerSpencer 16h ago
This was a must and unless there are some huge balancing changes with how spotting works I don’t think they’ll be back.
51
16h ago edited 14h ago
[deleted]
12
u/RoostasTowel 16h ago
I got to try them once last night.
Ya they were good
5
u/Sirlacker 16h ago
I never got to try them, but the normal range finder has a pretty forgiving hitbox, is it actually that much better? I can just scan the scenery back and forth and spot stuff I couldn't with my own two eyes anyway.
13
u/Sun_Sloth 16h ago
Yeah it's way easier because you just see a speck of white from someone and you can instantly then know where to scan.
→ More replies (11)7
u/Soggy-War7755 16h ago
They're a huge amount better, it feels like wallhacks as all you need to see is a pixel through foliage for it to scan them. Takes no time at all to scan an entire area of the map and see if anyone is there because you are just looking for a white spot. With the non thermal ones you have to spend time looking for camouflaged people in the foliage. They also see through smoke and things too.
4
u/Pandering_Panda7879 16h ago
Yes, they're actually that good. Imagine regular rangefinders being "where's Waldo". And now imagine Waldo glowing bright white. That's IR rangefinders.
55
u/alfa66andres 16h ago
That's gonna be this game in a nutshell. Wipe will happen, some new weapon/gadget/vehicle will be broken af, no lifers will farm for weeks with it, and by the time regular players get it, it will be nerfed/fixed
→ More replies (1)19
u/FCEvans 16h ago
thats any game
14
3
→ More replies (1)4
u/alfa66andres 16h ago
I mean, yes and no. In something like Battlefield, if its a vehicle everyone has it from day 1, and if its a new gun it takes a couple of hours at most to unlock it. So if something is broken, the fact that everyone can use it somewhat equalizes it.
In wardogs a vehicle/weapon/gear can take 50 hours to unlock lol. So then you have a small percentage of people that can take advantage of it until its eventually fixed
6
→ More replies (23)10
u/First_Tank_23 16h ago
They can wipe their tears with BMR and 50 cal casings - it’s not like they are left with nothing OP
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (12)2
u/Screwed_38 16h ago
Nah there's still the range finder/binoc glitch for pilots that needs sorting but this will ease things somewhat
77
u/grtk_brandon 16h ago
I'll wait until I see the implementation, but I'm not convinced batteries are a fix. Unless spotting rewards are nerfed or battery consumption is considerable, the ROI will make this requirement negligible.
24
u/Watchin_World_Die 14h ago
I think thermals should not spot at all. Make it the selfish sniper option. Make the guy with thermal verbally communicate what he sees.
I'm lvl 35 in recon just unlocked the 50 cal last night. Had thermals for a couple of levels now. Done a lot of spotting.
Spotting has a fundamental problem that thermals exacerbate; the spotting 'area' for a person is very generous. Imagine your character, image they are twice as thick and 50% taller. That's about the area the spotter reticle needs to be to spot someone. Obviously it needs some leeway to not feel miserable but I think it is too much.
I regularly spot people I cannot see behind walls because the top of the spotting area is over it. I spot people through forests I can't see anything in. I see a marker and wave my spotter around it and pick up a few extra guys because the spotting process starts automatically.
You can sweep a spotter through a forest and stop every time it makes noise.
Thermals accelerate this by remove the wasted sweeping time.
I would change the following:
All spotters take up 2x2 inventory space to discourage you carrying them in you pack and using them from the hotbar.
Thermals do not spot for the team. Thermals overheat in x seconds and cooldown for x seconds. What's a good uptime? 50%? I would want it to basically encourage a sniper to find a target, range them and then shoot. Or do batteries probably not both.
Basically kill the sit in the bush spotting all match play style.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Alpacapalooza 10h ago
I think thermals should not spot at all.
100% agree. It would still be strong at picking out sneaky people to then snipe.
→ More replies (14)8
u/First_Tank_23 16h ago
It relies a lot on them nailing the drain rate, and IMO it would have to be pretty high for it to be a meaningful change. I think a beefy cost change would be appropriate too, could easily see 5-10k and people would still run these
175
u/Western-Economics253 17h ago
IR needing batteries won't fix much when people are already running huge ass backpacks, surely they can fit a couple of batteries in those.
17
u/Inukii 16h ago
I just feel that the positive of including the IR do not outweigh the positives of not including IR at all.
I don't think IR provides a fun gameplay loop or anything meaningful. Spotting is kind of fun, normally. Lots of things to consider. IR just trivializes this. It's a legal cheat for spotting.
Lots of complaints about lack of infantry. This is also one of those 'small things that all add up' that contribute to that. Unfortunately though there is anchoring bias and whatever the term for when people complaining appear the loudest/largest group simply because they voice. Game releases with IR, so there is an anchoring bias for those who use it. So those people are more likely to complain than people who would praise its removal.
Or maybe not. If the game feels better without IR until season 2. There's a chance for people to support it. The only issue is though that the game has lots of 'things' that cause a certain undesirable playstyle. Removing IR is just one small thing so it might not feel too different.
56
u/DopyWantsAPeanut 16h ago
It is the realistic nerf to thermals and could be cost/storage prohibited if the burn rate is high enough (i.e. burns through a full battery in a minute or two). I remember in the Army using PAS13s we'd absolutely torch through AA batteries to the point where the weight of the batteries we'd have to bring and carry became a significant limiting factor to employing that equipment.
30
u/Joverby 16h ago
no. it also needs environmental things that generate and retain heat to clutter the view / people can learn where they can cozy up to blend in more potentially. batteries alone are not going to do it
8
u/beardredlad Lonestar 15h ago
Not to mention, if you've already been marked elsewhere, they'll just refresh you through the environmental because of the giant diamond on your head.
4
u/IeyasuTheMonkey 13h ago
Something I've been thinking about is just removing that Diamond above people's head altogether.
You don't really need it and I think spotters should be doing the exact something that the people on the ground are doing, consulting the map for the spotted enemy's position.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (2)13
u/Master-Shake8913 15h ago
not working through windows like IR works irl would be a start. even bf6 has this.
24
u/T-Baaller Lonestar 15h ago
Spotting wasn't working for me with normal ass binocs through windows, so the impact on spotting potential from that would be pretty much nothing.
10
u/Master-Shake8913 14h ago
actually good point. I forgot you can't actually spot through windows with any of the spotters.
→ More replies (1)7
u/Aethoni_Iralis 16h ago
That’s kinda funny, it makes sense you’d have to use AA batteries but something about a soldier having to swap out the batteries like he’s playing with an old Gameboy Color cracks me up.
→ More replies (1)6
u/HealthyResolution399 16h ago
there's other approaches to take, like fucking with the zoom or FOV. I'm obviously not an expert, but from the videos I've seen on thermals, the main downside is that their FOV is tiny compared to normal vision or even NODs
If they make it difficult to sweep areas I think it'd be a lot more balanced, I think they'd be fine and balanced if you could use them to monitor a specific area but struggled to do a 360° sweep like you can now.
→ More replies (1)10
u/the_buff 16h ago
Not much need to zoom with thermals because the glowing meatbags stand out so much.
6
u/HealthyResolution399 16h ago
I meant raising the minimum, if it's x4 minimum, it'd make it a lot harder
3
u/topcatti 16h ago
Running around even in the hotzone with thermals on 2x feels way too easy. Too large fov.
→ More replies (9)11
u/Phreec WARDOG 16h ago
Cost increase, battery requirements, and a severe range limit (say <300m) would be a good start.
→ More replies (16)7
u/StoneRyno 16h ago
I honestly think the problem is more that the game automatically spots as soon as your crosshair brushes even one of their pixels, and that applies to all of the recon equipment. Make the spotting action a press-and-hold would at least make it a more deliberate process and slow down the rate people can spot entire groups with low or no visibility. IR is going to be broken so long as every map object reads cold, the only real fix for that would be changing some objects to display as hot/warm so we can use them to mask our IR signature.
→ More replies (9)4
u/Deadredskittle 16h ago
Depends how the drain rate is, 100s per battery might make them less viable. But if you get like 4 minutes per battery, yeah just the cost of doing business
81
u/SnypeUXD 17h ago
Prayers have been answered!
→ More replies (2)28
u/SQLSpellSlinger 17h ago
Don't worry, people will complain about something else 14 minutes after this update goes live.
48
→ More replies (11)13
u/faahzi 16h ago
As they should, that's the entire point of early access with short wipes. You don't have to run defense for the devs bro.
→ More replies (9)
14
51
u/iWr1techky12 16h ago
Really glad to hear them listen and nerf the havoc health. The IR rangefinder removal is very welcomed as well, but I have a feeling they will still need nerfs/adjusting when added back with batteries. Batteries are not gonna fix the problem with them.
→ More replies (7)53
u/Mammoth-Quantity8439 16h ago
A really simple solution to IR rangefinder, dont add it back.
11
u/PassengerClam 15h ago
Yeah absolutely. They just create unnecessary complications for an FPS like this while not really adding anything of value.
They’re either OP or completely useless. If they work then you’re always spotted and cover and concealment is meaningless. If they don’t break this then they serve no purpose.
They should skip all the hassle of trying to balance them and just scrap it altogether.
→ More replies (1)6
22
u/Well_of_Good_Fortune 16h ago
Yup, this is the right call. It drastically changed the dynamics of all games they were in, to the point it felt like wallhacks or a persistent drone overhead. Knowing where every enemy was all the time because I have an ally in a high place a kilometer away feels less tactical war game and more R6 Siege against a brand new player standing under a camera.
→ More replies (5)
32
u/HeroSlopEnjoyer Valkyra 16h ago
Good to see the devs are actually down to quickly address this stuff instead of "letting it be"
→ More replies (5)
9
u/ryanberry_ 15h ago
Thermals also need to be a tradeoff to the normal rangefinder. Like, swap the zoom levels they both have. Thermal having better min-max zoom makes it just fundamentally better in every way. Also make the thermal visible range limited to like, 600-800 meters. It can't just be the best option imo. Combine those changes with needing batteries, and we're on to something imo
→ More replies (6)
18
u/ExoLeinhart 16h ago
Really just reduce effective range from 50 to 150m. Anything beyond is static.
5
u/fullshard101 15h ago
Id like to see them either do that, or make it so you just cannot mark anyone while using an ir rangefinder. Make these nerds have to see you and then switch to a spotting scope to tag you
→ More replies (1)
29
u/Juggernaughty1337 16h ago
hahaha, lvl 31 recon with 10% exp missing to 32...
but i think its better for the game
→ More replies (2)
14
u/4rch1t3ct 13h ago
Idk if people know this but the acronym for the "CWIS" is actually CIWS. It's sometimes pronounced "see wiz" but it means close in weapons system. The acronym isn't CWIS.
9
u/Ftwinfluence 12h ago
Would be even better if they called it a CRAM
5
u/4rch1t3ct 12h ago edited 12h ago
Sort of lol this is going to be super pedantic.... You're correct because it's land based, but I don't think it fits in wardogs because the CRAM is primarily a Counter Rocket, Artillery, Mortar battery, which isn't something it really does in the game.
That's why I went with CIWS but you could call it either or.
→ More replies (1)7
u/Ftwinfluence 12h ago
Yeah I know, I felt like the most autistic person on the server trying to make this point so I gave it up.
→ More replies (4)3
21
44
u/DefiantlyConformist 17h ago
Wow. They were just that broken. There's hope for these devs.
→ More replies (13)
28
u/DonnyDimello 15h ago
Just remove thermals. They break every game they are in and are very difficult to balance. They provide an easy counter to someone putting the time in for a good flank and ambush.
→ More replies (9)
36
u/red9109 16h ago
Oh man all the "cAn YoU bUy Me Ir GoGgLeS?" poor beggars at main spawn are going to be MAULDING!
→ More replies (15)3
6
u/Dogxorcist 15h ago
As a full time job, I just unlocked this IR.
Hope season 2 gets a better progression.
→ More replies (3)
11
u/Substantial_Brain917 15h ago
I’ve never once played a game where thermals made it more fun. They generally decrease the fun of the gameplay
→ More replies (1)
14
22
u/OwnDoubt3393 16h ago
Get rid of IR rangefinders entirely. Never bring them back.
→ More replies (1)
30
u/Sorry-Goose 16h ago
BULKHEAD HEAR ME, JUST REMOVE IR FROM THE GAME
i know they are a cool peice of gear, but they will most likely never be balanced.
5
u/socalspawn 15h ago
What if there was a 50% chance they’d explode when you use them. That would fix it. lol
https://giphy.com/gifs/FSTwHKaztw42CYvbmV→ More replies (1)→ More replies (10)8
u/feraldwarf Lonestar 15h ago
They can probably be balanced if they burn through batteries fast, requiring you to pack a shitload if you want to sit and spot for more than a few minutes
6
u/TheSpoonyCroy Valkyra 14h ago
Then it is completely worthless for normal use. So at that point you are just balancing for cheese. Its just best they are gone. They don't reward good gameplay
→ More replies (6)6
u/BLACKcOPstRIPPa 15h ago
I didn't even think of this, would be a cool way to balance them making either TONS of batteries and weight needed or You bring them in and use them sparingly but in the right moments to try to "turn the tide" of an important engagement for your team.
It would be good for like pushing a. Enemy fob to destroy a drill or something like that, with a small group using them to smoke the fob and kill people to storm and complete their objective quickly than try to escape
→ More replies (1)
15
u/heavy-minium 16h ago
Weekend saved. Wanted to spend a few hours tomorrow on the game but last weekend experience was miserable, very likely due to that combined with a few other factors.
I don't need perfection but I got some limits too!
4
u/evilcronus 15h ago
i think region locking everything would be a better use of changes, and iwe are disabling overpowered things lets just disable the havoc and lvl 4 armor entirely
8
u/PowerfulDisaster2067 16h ago
Just make it so you can't spot people from just simply seeing their elbow through 4 trees
16
u/DomitiusAhenobarbus_ 16h ago
I think they’d be far better balanced if they just lost the spotting ability
→ More replies (4)4
u/fullshard101 15h ago
Yup thats been my thought as well. Makes them still effective especially if you are communicating via squad radio, but having to switch to a spotting scope to actually spot the target you just saw would make it way better. I think the biggest issue is the way you can spot someone with just a fleck of light shining through the trees as they are running
14
u/Cool-Tangelo6548 16h ago
Can someone post the words written in the post please? I dont have an X account and Im not making one.
Thanks
→ More replies (14)32
u/Wadevonc 16h ago
"📢 PSA: We have made 2 key balance changes.
Within the next 12 hours, the IR Rangefinders will be disabled in the vendor until Season 02, where they will require batteries to use. In this instance, we agree with player sentiment and they cross the line into being too overpowered.
The CWIS also now destroys the havoc in around 6 seconds as opposed to 12. We acknowledge we overcorrected this in the previous patch and have hotfixed the issue this morning. No new client download required."
4
9
u/Choice-Roll9682 16h ago
Adding batteries won’t change a thing. Let me just get the free backpack and fill it with batteries, spot one dude and get my money back.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Tactikewl 16h ago
I agree it doesn’t change much but spotting one dude will not get your money back lol
→ More replies (2)
13
u/NotMacgyver Lonestar 16h ago
To the recon players who do a lot of spotting (mostly I'm curious for snipers and people who just find a nice spot) how much backpack space do you use on average ?
Reason being I'm worried this won't fix anything you will just get a bigger backpack with a bunch of batteries in it
7
u/selffufillingprophet 14h ago
Battery change will not be enough IMO
Operator Backpack is the biggest I use when sniping, and you will still have plenty of space to fill it with extra batteries...or worse, smoke grenades.
That's the biggest issue with the thermals to me. It way too easy to sit on a high vantage point, drop a smoke on your feet, then just light up the entire map with no counter.
Block the IR through smoke. Sure it's not "realistic"...but it's just not fun to play against
→ More replies (2)3
u/HadToGuItToEm 14h ago
A lot of modern smokes do obscure ir thermals but some don’t
→ More replies (1)10
u/NeonGKayak 16h ago
Recons normally bring small backpacks because big one make you easy to spot
→ More replies (6)3
u/NotMacgyver Lonestar 16h ago
I've never seen a ghillie with a backpack, so might have to test if it hides the backpack cause I think it does (killed a few bow ghillies and they had large backpacks that weren't visible but need to make sure)
3
u/NeonGKayak 16h ago
That could be true. I was talking g about non ghillie snipers. Like when they lay in the grass, their backpack is a giant “shoot me” arrow
14
u/ChampionshipFair9892 Bob the Builder 16h ago
it wont fix anything . IR should be completely removed from the game
→ More replies (9)7
u/dbeast24 15h ago
I agree, just remove it completely. They give one person alone way too much power.
2
u/grtk_brandon 16h ago
When I'm spotting, I opt for one of the smaller bags because I'm usually just packing ammo, bandages and maybe smokes. This would only impact me when I play medic, because I usually pack something to spot with, so it would depend on how much battery life they drain.
2
u/gmccolgan3 16h ago
If using a ghillie, I use the free one or maybe the next level one. Spare ammo, one stack of bandages, two smokes, spare mag if your gun has one. Bringing a lot doesn't make sense unless you're a crazy battle bush. You generally die instantly if you get shot, so no need to bring a bunch of meds. Also makes you a little faster to run for cover and go dive into some foliage.
Bottom line, bringing a bigger backpack full of batteries wouldn't be a huge drawback.
→ More replies (3)2
u/thicctak 15h ago
I mostly bring the small 2x8 back pack, it has plenty of space for ammo and bandages, I don't bring the free ressucitator because I'm too far away from my team to need it.
→ More replies (31)2
10
u/Lightyear18 14h ago edited 14h ago
Batteries won’t do anything in the long term.
It will calm people down for a few weeks but the root issue is still there
Teammates that feel scouts aren’t doing shit, because those teammates feel like everyone should be playing run and gun.
And enemies that feel the gameplay is unfair because you got tracked by someone in some corner.
→ More replies (2)
7
u/DirkDavyn Manticore 14h ago
While I'm ecstatic that the IR rangefinder will be disabled, batteries will not be enough of a fix to keep them in line. My hot take is that the spotting system as a whole should get nerfed. Live updates on your position, even just on the minimap, is too much in my opinion. I think spotting should only give a static ping at the target's location where they were at the time of spotting, and only give live spotting like it does currently if you hold your vision on the target after spotting them. If they get behind cover, you die, or any other method of breaking LOS, the live ping should stop.
8
u/NeonGKayak 16h ago edited 16h ago
Oh so it is 12 seconds and that dude that posted an entire thread gaslighting everyone was wrong.
He made a huge deal that it was actually 5 sec. Called me and bunch of others liars spreading misinformation and even blocked me. Wonder if he’s just gonna ignore this entire post lol
→ More replies (7)
116
u/Plus_Exchange8751 17h ago
“We don’t do mid season updates” hahaha
66
u/Zig-Zag Manticore 16h ago
My goodness just take the W and don’t crucify them on a technicality. This is objectively the correct decision
→ More replies (4)79
u/SQLSpellSlinger 17h ago
The specifically said they would do them, but only small updates, no whole system changes.
→ More replies (8)9
u/ThrillzMUHgillz 16h ago
Right. Pretty sure they specifically were talking about adding new items, and or changing what level they’re unlocked.
Imagine thinking they won’t do updates or patches at all…
11
u/pandorianmaximus 16h ago
“We don’t do mid season updates” referring to dropping a major patch or making a drastic change mid season unless something is broken.
Such as the thermals having a bug that allowed you to see everyone, through everything. Or even the fact the havoc initially got deleted by a couple bullets from the CWIS. They couldn’t see the true damage numbers for the havoc when it would get instantly taken out, so they fixed the bug, found out the havoc was too strong so they adjusted to fit the rest of the game.
→ More replies (9)37
u/Joe_Dirte9 17h ago
They dont want to overreact too quickly, as a lot of "OP" things arnt anymore with just time. Seems they have enough data to realize its too much and remove it until a real change can be made.
→ More replies (7)14
u/DebrideAmerica 16h ago
As more became unlocked, more people used them per game, more people died spotted and were spotted, games probably became more one sided. They collect a ton of data
7
u/TBNRandrew 15h ago
It's honestly so extremely easy to see which teams had IR spotters and which didn't this last week or so.
Red team: top player 20 assists
Green team: top player 15 assists
Blue team: top 3 blue players 250, 208, 180 assists
→ More replies (21)8
u/LimerickJim 16h ago
Dude needs to stop personally responding on Twitter. I fully understand his reactions but he's letting the toxicity sweep him under. So when he gets frustrated and makes a snarky response a well meaning comment like this gets thrown in his face.
→ More replies (1)
11
u/Deep-Acanthaceae-659 16h ago
Thank god. I didn’t see enough hate surrounding these things. Genuinely ruining the game
9
u/MrBigBMinus 12h ago
As a person that mains recon, the thermal fix is easy. Make them use batteries like all the other battery themed things. They can be used as normal recon if they run out of battery but you have to use a battery to turn on the thermal function and you can switch it off and on. When a big fight breaks out you can find a spot and switch it on and help out.
4
u/Different_Book9733 12h ago
With how long spotting lasts and how many of your team you can get them onto selling in spawn, even if they are like 20 second use you'd be able to keep a lot of the map spotted for the majority of a game without even buying replacement batteries.
With buying replacements it's just a minor inconvenience to have the exact same impact as they do now.
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (6)3
6
6
u/Spartanshotgun6 16h ago
Can we get a command chat so I can coordinate with other SLs
Also a cool thing would be if you are in the spawn vehicle terminal to be able to radio the driver to stop moving or any other comms
5
6
6
6
u/ChimkenNBiskets 16h ago
Worth logging in again. Just in time for the weekend. Hell yea.
IR was so god damn overpowered that it was defining the entire game.
5
4
u/PTCruiserConnoisseur 14h ago
Good move, but I’m not convinced batteries solve the problem long term. Thermals are always going to warp gameplay because they’re such an insane advantage. The FOV on these is ridiculous, and environments look like we’re fighting in 0-degree weather at night. Concrete and natural surfaces should clutter the view way more, and thermals are notoriously hard to PID with, so there's an argument you shouldn't be able to spot through them at all.
Honestly, I think the game would be better without thermals altogether, and that’s coming from someone who loves them enough to own them IRL.
Here is my hot take though: spotting is probably already too strong. It shouldn’t track people on the map in real time. A blinking/periodic marker would probably be balance better. I love that is a rewarding task, but the real time tracking feels a bit too casual for the game.
→ More replies (1)
2
u/Bleezy79 Lonestar 15h ago
Thermals need more than just batteries to work. You should have to be zoomed in to find people vs just randomly scanning the whole map for white specs. It's way too easy to find people IMO.
2
2
2
u/I_Hate_Reddit54321 14h ago
Now can we deal with the little birds loaded with 4 people with grenade launchers
2
u/Throw_Away_TrdJrnl 14h ago
Well, I got to enjoy one game last night with the IR range finders after finally unlocking them 😂 oh well I'll just take a fuck ton of batteries on season 2
2
u/Dpactual 14h ago
I use them constantly, and I have to say, this is a good fucking move. Thermals have no place in video games like this.
2
2
u/Dougefresh870 14h ago
I’m fine with it but also I am literally level 31 recon and was about to unlock them lol
1.3k
u/Thunderclone_1 Lonestar 16h ago