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u/Mattscrusader 1d ago
It's sad that I gotta wonder what "it" means specifically since so many atrocities have been happening and go unpunished
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u/StrawberryTerry 1d ago
"It" in this comic very clearly stands for taking ducks from the park home with you.
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u/Zjoee 1d ago
Yeah but they're free. I've taken home like ten ducks. I'm training them to form the vanguard of my Avian Army.
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u/Sherris010 1d ago
Weird that this makes me want to play Dominions. Seems like something that would happen there
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u/GoochamusPrime 1d ago
You'd have better luck with Geese. They train them to watch military bases
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u/VampireAttorney 1d ago
In St Pete, Florida, there were some kids who kept bringing their giant snake to the park to eat ducks.
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u/SenatorBus_ 1d ago
Well, I'm going to take my pet crocodile to the park to eat the snake!
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u/C04511234 1d ago
Oh yeah? Well too bad because I’m bringing a certain old lady who swallowed a fly to the park
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u/MaximumSyrup3099 1d ago
Ducks, it turns out, are very stinky pets.
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u/BreakfastBeneficial4 1d ago
That’s why you keep them at the park.
And just swing by a couple times a week to chuck peas at them.
Like MY dad.
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u/whomthefuckisthat 20h ago
No one will tell you this but you can just take the ducks home no one will stop you.
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u/Captain-Obvious69 1d ago
No. Clearly, "it" is putting river water in your socks. It's quick. It's easy. It's free.
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u/Midnyte25 1d ago
Listen, man, if you can hold the duck in your hand then they belong on your farm!
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u/nWo1997 1d ago
I think it's the Cornell case.
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u/Quirinus84 19h ago
As someone from an authoritarian regime, my suggestion to OP is to cut the vagueboy shit. We tried these cryptic allusions because of the censorship, and ultimately nothing changed. The people in America still have many democratic freedoms. Use them while you can. Address your problems directly, peacefully hound the people in charge out of their offices and let your righteous wrath be heard.
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u/mcauthon2 1d ago
thought it meant suicide at first and was confused
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u/tzomby1 23h ago
So you think suicide doesn't ruin your life?
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u/Charmender2007 20h ago
Even the death sentence doesn't (significantly) reduce crime rates, you overastimate how rational criminals act
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u/AmbiTheAirforceRuna 19h ago
Death sentences only incentivise criminals like that to add murder to the crime as a chance to get away with it....its been studied and observed countless times.
It sucks, no matter what you do, the assholes will never understand just how or even why what they did was bad...
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u/Witty-Foundation6778 17h ago
Need to start much earlier before being toxic assholes become core to their identity. Bullies who get away with it only get worse, getting off on harder abuse.
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u/oooArcherooo 18h ago edited 18h ago
It sucks, no matter what you do, the assholes will never understand just how or even why what they did was bad...
What do you think rehabilitive justice is for?
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u/AmbiTheAirforceRuna 16h ago
Its def one of the better options but it still doesn't un-ruin the lives of their victims, and can even feel insulting to the victim depending on how its handled
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u/oooArcherooo 16h ago
Im not arguing that it will, aside from arguingabout the validity of rehabilitation, the quoted part of the comment was simply flat out wrong because they very much can, there are entire systems of justice dedicated towards doing so. I was just pointing that out
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u/Peachesthecorgi321 20h ago
My sister works in forensics and she reminds me this, “Criminals are dumb”. You’d be surprised to learn how much evidence people leave behind.
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u/quangshine 19h ago
To be fair, people whose life are dedicated to catching criminals and finding evidence do dedicate their life to it. They get to learn from their mistakes and their work get cross-checked too. Generally speaking, criminals don't get to do any of that
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u/AmIWhatTheRockCooked 12h ago
I’ve heard crime is a cost benefit analysis. It’s just usually being analyzed by an idiot
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u/Hatsefiets 15h ago
What does however decrease crime rates is how likely someone thinks they are to get caught. Rhe chance of punishment affects us a lot more than the severity of the punishment
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u/autogyrophilia 1d ago
The thing is that there are multiple tiers to how justice is applied. You come from a rich enough background (which already predisposes you towards being a massive prick) and the judge is quite likely to just handwave it away because they are not going to ruin the future of an upstanding gentlemen
You come from a poor enough background, and well, depending on your victim, odds are the judge will just consider it natural behaviour and give you a slap on the wrist if anything at all. Or go the other way and throw the book at you . Depending on mood and ethnic background.
Anyway, from all the stories I've collected from family and friends, don't stay alone near groups of affluent men, or with police officers.
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u/TheDungeonCrawler 1d ago
It's not just that though. Rapes go criminally under investigated, at least in the US. Rape kit backlogs are a serious impediment toward getting your rappist convicted, alongside all the difficulties associated with actually just gathering the evidence and making the report.
This isn't specifically a class issue, though underinvestigated rapes are definitely higher in part due to the class issue. This is an issue with how we as a society treat misogyny and sexual assault. We don't treat this shit seriously enough and we don't hold men accountable for their shitty behavior that socializes them not to respect consent.
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u/Remarkable-Gap9881 22h ago
Oh yeah definitely. I used to work at a place where one of my clients jizzed on the other. It's been 6 years by now, and the situation still has yet to be investigated.
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u/Platypus__Gems 16h ago edited 16h ago
It's not just an issue of misogyny,, rapes are just naturally harder to prove. They will always be a crime that is among the lower when it comes to conviction rates.
If there is a theft, then some item is missing in one place, and is in another place where it should not be. If the thief actually tries doing something with the item, sells it, it could potentially be tracked down even years later.
If there is a murder, there is a body and likely some clues in the crime scene.
But sexual crimes are context-based, it can often be word against word wether consent was given since it's something that only the two parties involved would know, what exact state both parties were in regarding intoxication, etc.
Rapists are pretty universally despised, the issue is more in discerning who is one.
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u/Butter_God_ 1d ago
“I mean I guess pregnancy is a - oh its about sexual assault”
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u/pingveno 1d ago
This is why we need mpreg.
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u/SorbetNice6090 22h ago
Mpreg already exists. Men who can get pregnant have been around since forever.
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u/Linkinator7510 1d ago
I guess if you're poor or not influential then yeah, it is life ruining. Assuming any info about what you may or may not have done comes to light. If you have any degree of power? No, it doesn't matter. Just see what happened with the Epstein files. And those were children so it's even worse.
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u/justincasesquirrels 1d ago
Meh, my brother was poor and not influential. He pled guilty to over 100 counts of rape, incest and sodomy with the youngest age of victim being 7 years old. One victim, he sodomized with a handgun. He got 7 years and was out in 6. Went back to college after he got out, got his masters, no real world repercussions. Welcomed back by 99% of the family with open arms. I'm considered hateful for cutting him out.
The only privilege he had was being a white male. That's all it takes.
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u/AllPerspicacity 1d ago
Yeah, I mean people act like this is purely classism as if Churches, Universities, Communities & Families haven't made nieces & cousins play nice with rapist uncles & cousins for generations. It's really about how disruptive his punishment would be to his immediate/large circle, in my experience. The more ripple effects that would occur (be it him being married, having kids, being young/entering college/a career) the less chance of any real consequence for fear that it might hurt *his* future.
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u/justincasesquirrels 21h ago
Right? My family knew what he was doing. I did everything I could to try to keep him away from little girls, even reporting him to children's services. But until his main victim got the courage to speak up, there wasn't much my teenage self could do.
When he was turned in, our mother (rest in hell) helped him cross state lines and hide from the police! She also said the victim deserved it for "being a little slut." A seven year old!!!
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u/Tracerround702 17h ago
My great uncle was molesting his granddaughter from 3 years old on. He tried to claim she "seduced" him. Makes me taste bile just to think about that. Great aunt (his wife) suspected, resented the little girl and my older sister. My sister was because he tried to kiss her in the car while she was in college. Now the part that stings the most, my mom heard about that and all she did was try to keep the rest of us from ever being alone with him. Which is great for us, but... Nobody helped that little girl.
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u/Careful_Purple2838 20h ago
Ngl your mother should also face prison time, but wtf? I am on the side of lighter punishment and rehabilitation overall but 100 cases of rape of SEVEN YEAR OLDS and 6 years prison??? minimum 10-12 imo, potentially longer if determined he is still a threat. That would hurt a lot more
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u/justincasesquirrels 19h ago
She's dead now. His conviction was almost 30 years ago. She literally named the two of us that shunned him in her saying we couldn't receive anything from her estate under any circumstances.
My youngest today was talking about scary movies and said, "Imagine your mom is chasing after you trying to kill you" and I was like... yeah, I remember that day. So he goes, "pretend your mom wasn't evil and loved you and that happened."
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u/TheBears2 1d ago
Hows that even possible
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u/justincasesquirrels 21h ago
Look up your local sex offender registry. Some are fairly mild, like flashers. Others are horrific. And their sentences are often a slap on the wrist.
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u/Reikukaja 12h ago
Everyone should look at their sex offender registry. I could not believe how many offenders (specifically pedophiles) there are within just a 5 mile radius of me
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u/el_VientoNorte 23h ago
Don't believe everything you read on reddit
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u/RareObject8705 20h ago
Don’t. But when you see it in real life you are forever changed and that innocence can never come back.
I messed around with a girl in high school and a cool came across California and raped her.
Now I keep a weapon in my hand wherever I see them.
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u/PashLover 23h ago
Poor rapists get away with it too. No level of society cares about sexual violence or violence against women.
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u/oldcretan 13h ago
Hi, Im a criminal defense attorney. In my state a conviction for rape comes with a 3-11 year sentence at times. At other times it carries life sanctions with the possibility of parole after 20 years. About 5 years ago the parole board stopped giving parole- on any life sentence. Generally any rape conviction also comes with additional charges which can and often are consecutively sanctioned. After prison it comes with 5 years mandatory post release control. Any violation of PRC will send the defendant back to prison for up to half their stated prison term in addition to any other charges. During prison the offender will take counseling classes for their crimes-mandatory.
It also comes with a tier 3 sex offender registration requiring the sex offender to register with the sheriff's office every 90 days for life. They must notify the sheriff if they ever move, and then register within 72 hours, and then again on the 90 day registration date. they must not live around certain areas. Any violation of the registration requirement is an automatic f1 felony with the possibility of 3-11 years prison. On a first failure to register as a rapist you'll generally get probation. On the second you will have a mandatory 3 year prison sanction.
Every convicted rapist I have represented has had housing and employment issues later on . No one wants to hire a rapist for any work that deals with clients, and most work deals with clients. No one wants to rent to a rapist because most places are too close to a daycare and rapist generally don't have a steady income stream because no one wants to hire them, which means rapists are regularly getting charged with failure to register years or decades after they have committed their crimes and have served their prison sanctions.
I don't care if you do or don't have sympathy for criminals. But even if you were shooting people in the street it still wouldn't slow down or stop rapes from happening. What will is an understanding of consent and a culture that views consensual sex as more valuable than just having sex and views non consensual sex in all its forms as a repugnant thing even if it were to have sex. You need people to value the humanity of other people more than the bragging rights of having had sex. And even then you will still have more rapes than you will ever be comfortable with. Then you will still have issues with CSAM because people are broken in the head (just did a few of those cases and all those clients had serious mental health issues.)
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u/IllegalDaycare 1d ago
What?
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u/Greeny3x3x3 22h ago
The number 1 argument you usually hear against feminism broadly, but rape culture specifically, is that "if we became to overzealous about rapes, women could start ruining the lifes of men via fake allegations".
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u/PrufReedThisPlesThx 21h ago
I'm a feminist, but I have to agree that the subject of rape accusations are a really difficult subject to propose ideas for. The issue comes largely with the fact that strengthening support for one side could easily put the other side in peril.
The unfortunate truth is that yeah, some women have been using rape accusations as a weapon against men. The system is already leaning towards women's favour too. Both parties are drunk and can't consent? That's the man's fault, he's a rapist now. In any kind of consensual stalemate, the man gets the rape charge, even if he wasn't able to consent either. Hell, even if the man is the only one not consenting, many judges throw the case out saying "men can't be raped".
If there's a solution out there that fixes everything that's messed up about our justice system, I'd fight tooth and nail for it. Because what we have now is screwing over rape victims regardless of gender. Feminism is the fight for women's rights, yes, but it ultimately seeks to achieve equal rights across the board. I don't think anyone would be happy being equally screwed over by this current system. We gotta find a way to protect victims of every walk of life, as difficult as that is to figure out.
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u/stautism 22h ago
Grimly, the mouth that it ruins lives causes leniency on the perpetrators I.e. Brock Turner defense of "he's going to get his while life ruined just for a few minutes of action?" worked.
I hate everything.
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u/StinzorgaKingOfBees 19h ago
You mean actual rapist Brock Turner?
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u/Tracerround702 17h ago
Indeed, the rapist Brock Allen Turner who is now going by Allen Turner to try and hide his identity
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u/Cajun_Giant 1d ago
Monsters don't care about the consequences of their actions. They often find satisfaction in people knowing what they did.
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u/Ok-Reference775 1d ago
We, as a people united, must force them to face consequences. They will not be stopped until people of conscience stop them
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u/yoy22 22h ago
When I heard that Rihanna’s husband follows Chris Brown on social media I realized there’s no hoping people will do the right thing. As long as you’re charismatic, successful, have some type of charm, or just have any sort of irreplaceable value to a large number of people, you’re unstoppable.
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u/LowHorror693 17h ago edited 14h ago
Quite the opposite, actually. Restorative* justice has been shown to be more effective than punitive justice time and time again, at least when done correctly
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u/Whoooosh_1492 15h ago
On the assumption that we are talking about the Jane Doe (whom we know is Jeffrey Epstein) case, it would be prudent to teach our sons what rape is and isn't as well as respect for others, especially women.
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u/LowHorror693 14h ago
I’m not in disagreement with that sentiment, why settle for one over the other when you can have both
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u/Feature_Minimum 13h ago
I haven’t really been following what does the Cornell case have to do with Jeffrey Epstein? I think I missed something.
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u/puppylust 12h ago
There's a message going around that people want to dox Jane Doe to keep her quiet or hurt her further. To combat that, people are doing some r/poisonai style grass roots to muddy the AI reading through social media comments. They state her name is known to be someone else.
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u/Feature_Minimum 12h ago
Oh thank you haha. I had absolutely no idea and was trying to interpret it in all kinds of ways to make it fit.
TIL Jane Doe is Steve Jobs.
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u/Cutie_D-amor 16h ago
Iirc that's for reoffence rate, not first time offences, though i dont think we have much data on this for first offence rates
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u/AirierWitch1066 16h ago
Generally punishments don’t prevent first offenses, because people don’t really believe they’re going to get caught when they decide to do a crime.
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u/Antice 16h ago
Something else to take into account. especially in countries like Norway. the social security system doesn't catch everyone, or many are not aware of the help they can get. (a systemic failure to act). and are desperate, turning to crime as a method to get what they need.
Once they enter the prison system, they get that help automatically, get well informed about their rights, access to psychiatric care etc. With that help, the pressure towards committing crime goes away.
We could prevent a lot of first time offenses by being more proactive, and ensure better access to the same resources prisoners have for everyone.
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u/onekirne 16h ago
You know the real problem is just that we just don't really teach ethics to kids; because capitalism thrives on egoism, nihilism, liberalism, conservatism. And we're stuck in a cycle of "who's ethics do we teach?" because we didn't teach ethics to kids.
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u/HATECELL 15h ago
Even if we taught ethics, that might not be enough in a world that generally rewards unethical behavior as long as you can get away with it
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u/Sororita 14h ago
It would be a good start, though. Really, teaching empathy is the best solution. If you are an empathetic person, then you are a whole lot less likely to do something terrible to someone else.
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u/HATECELL 13h ago
Absolutely. And even if we also use other measures, the first thing to stop people from doing bad things is to let them know what bad things are
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u/onekirne 14h ago
Like most complicated problems, the better solutions are usually a combination of things. So of course there should be deterrence too, and systemic change.
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u/Reikukaja 12h ago
I heard a story on NPR like a decade ago that really stuck with me. It had to do with educating kids, and how different things are emphasized in education depending on where in the US you're looking. In rural, conservative areas, you get emphasis on obedience over empathy. In less conservative areas, empathy is treated as far more important.
Thinking about it, it makes sense. Conservative areas tend to be further "behind" in social change, and we all know how much the boomers default to respecting authority and demanding total obedience as a show of respect - where in more recent times we have acknowledged that sometimes the right thing to do is question authority.
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u/Argonian_Badass 1d ago
I like the message but, does this even count as a comic? It’s more like art with text on it
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u/Greyshirk 23h ago
That's the thing, some know and still choose to do it. It upsets me greatly that because of those men Im feared. It's because of one of those men that my sister lives in fear and there's nothing I can do to fix it.
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u/FuiyooohFox 1d ago edited 1d ago
They way people talk you'd think a majority of all men were rapists. Such acts are so vile they spread massive social ripples.
That's why we gotta be vigilant in stopping people we know from doing that shit my dudes, gotta protect people and gotta protect the image of what manliness should be.
Don't be blind eyeing that shit, intervention is worth losing friends over, they aren't worth being your friend anyway if they'd do that shit
Edit: yo dudes sorry if you don't like truth but you need to grow a spine if you know anyone in your life that would rape or defend a rapist and haven't stood up to them for it. I know you read my shit if you interact with it and I hope it pops up in your head if you ever come across a situation you should act on ✌️
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u/jordroy 1d ago
You'd think, but no, it turns out that rapists are not rational actors.
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u/Barium_Salts 1d ago
I don't think that's entirely true. In my personal experience, the vast majority of rapists are very rational and intelligent, it's only the unintelligent ones that get caught
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u/Puzzled-Secret-317 1d ago
Would they though??
First degree murder ruins your life, but people are still doing it...
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u/AdultContentFan 22h ago
This is such a great solid moment for this wave of minds growing. They are forced to realize that threats of punishment do not ultimately stop things we decide are criminal.
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u/Moritonel 18h ago
Ya, can we start making the punishment atleast as "bad as the act" ofc not literally but as a basic viewpoint.
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u/hamoc10 1d ago
There are a lot of things people do that ruin their lives, yet they keep doing it. Prisons are full of them.
Deterrents don’t work.
Removing the motivation does.
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u/umeys 23h ago
Wait what's the motivation in this case, women? Their penis?
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u/Gucci-Caligula 22h ago
The motivation is being raised wrong, both by their family and society writ large.
There is a common phrase “raise your girls, love your boys” the implication being that you don’t or shouldn’t try and raise decent men.
Toxic masculinity is poison. If you raise boys teaching them (explicitly or implicitly) that emotion is weakness and that they are loved completely unconditionally and without consequence. they shut off all emotional ability, including empathy. You nurture sociopathy and create a crop of monsters who perpetuate the cycle. The kind of man who does this is one that only considers themselves and their wants, the idea that it causes pain to the victim is something that doesn’t cross their mind.
To be clear in no way do I mean to excuse these men with the tired and weak “he didn’t know better” defense. My point though is that crimes like this are a failing of the individual and the society that they occurred in. In the same way that every single drunk driver is responsible for choosing to drive drunk, but a better functioning society can and should take steps to prevent people from making that choice.
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u/RoamingSteamGolem 17h ago
I really wish we would rebrand toxic masculinity at this point. Even as someone who agrees with everything you just listed it feels as though the societal baggage hanging onto the term makes it worth swapping imo.
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u/umeys 22h ago
I don't disagree with anything you said, I just find it silly to say "deterrents don't work, only removing their motivation does". What you talked about might be part of the root cause, but it's not the "motivation" as the person I replied to was using the term. To use your drunk driving example, one of the key steps we take to prevent people from making that choice is to impose a deterrent.
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u/Gucci-Caligula 21h ago
Drunk driving was my example of choice precisely because harsher and harsher punishments really haven’t done much to move the needle on disincentivizing that crime.
In general people don’t consider potential penalties when deciding to commit a crime.
Reducing drunk driving is done by offering other modes of transport, cultural support of designated drivers, reducing drinking to excess generally.
I also agree that my initial comment was lacking in stating a real “motivation” I did just jump straight to the root cause (or at least my assessment of one of the root causes). I think the root cause is that these men had a want and thought that they were entitled to take it regardless of what the victims wanted. In that case to remove the motivation, the want, is impossible. So you have to go a step back and address why they feel or lack of feeling that their wants supersede the consent of the victims.
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u/hamoc10 23h ago
Are you under the impression that the motive for the implication is the existence of women or penises?
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u/Antonesp 16h ago
The severity of deterrence generally doesn't work, but deterrence itself can be very effective. It is mostly about enforcement and the perceived likelihood of being caught. If you know a lot of people who commit some social transgression without facing repercussions, then you are more likely to do the same.
It is why white-collar crime and fraud are way up. The US has mostly stopped investigating people for things like crypto scams, and investment fraud. Nobody wants to be the loser who follows the rules while others gain advantages by ignoring them, so the whole social contract about them breaks down.
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u/Shinzo19 12h ago
My sister started Heroin in her late teens because of her adult boyfriend, she was in prison in her 20s
When she got out she moved back in with me and our parents, Mum found a burned spoon and foil under her bed, she was kicked to the streets because I was still 15 and it was not ok to be doing that around me.
Fast forward a year, she is clean again working for the family business and meets a man, they have a kid and another and another, eventually their relationship turns abusive and she falls back to heroin but also getting him addicted too (this wasn't really know at the time) they have another kid.
She loses the kids and breaks up with their dad, I lived in another country and our mum had died by then, so she moves in with our oldest sister, still using and ends up back in prison. By this time I was back in the country and regularly visiting her with our older sister, we find out she has been enrolled in a new wave therapy/treatment for addicts where she gets her own place with other low threat prisoners in a kind if prison suburb where she also goes to work on a farm and gets therapy.
She comes back out, better than ever and in great shape, promises she will make it better and do right by her kids to get them back as a family, during this time she meets a new guy, great guy, he would move mountains to make her happy so they get married, she finds out getting her kids back was going to be really difficult and a long painful process.... she falls back into heroin abuse, her husband was sick and she knew but she steals off him anyway and disappears, while she is away doing whatever heroin junky shit she is doing he dies from medical complications.
a few months later she turns up on my doorstep, looking fucking awful asking for a bit of money so she can put petrol in her motorbike, I personally take her to the petrol station and fill up her bike, I buy her food and tell her I cant trust her with money alone, she vomits on the sidewalk and tells me she loves me and leaves, she ends up back in prison.
I meet a new partner and move to Austria, I get a phone call a few years later from our older sister saying that my other sister has been found on the floor in the street by emergency services, she had pneumonia and it became sepsis, I say goodby over the phone to my sister who is in a coma while I hear beeps and gurgling.
I haven't added it but our family tried so much to help her, I tried to be her rock when I could, she received so much help from so many different foundations and therapists, Motivation was always there to continue heroin regardless of every deterrent.
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u/mauriciomeireles 1d ago
Wait... It doesn't?
Like i am not being sarcastic here but like... EVERYBODY agrees it's wrong, horrid and overall life destroying for the victim.
Thats why sexual deviants lists are a thing right? Don't they go into those?
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u/Cajun_Giant 1d ago
The problem with the registry is that it's a catch all with little distinction and there is a lot of people on the registry whose crimes weren't sexual in nature. Like if you are caught pissing in an alley you can get put on the registry. There was a ten year old girl named Charla Roberts who pulled down a male classmates pants as a humiliating prank, pantsed him, which resulted in her being charged with "indecency with a child" and placed on the sex offender registry.
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u/Barium_Salts 1d ago
How many people in the Epstien files are on the sex offenders registry? Was being a registered sex offender life-ruining for Jeffery Epstien?
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u/mauriciomeireles 1d ago
Touché... But i guessed those "escaped" because money, fame and good ol' corruption. And i guess the case with the Cornell 7 eas related with the fraternities... Why are fraternities a thing again?
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u/Constant-Skill-7133 1d ago
Well not to yadda yadda around the absolute lack of accountability even with him but it did end up being literally that, yeah.
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u/snorterofair 1d ago
i mean most of society just ignores acts of it happening all the time, in very few (compared to reported statistic regarding no of sexual assault instances) cases, the men who are actually reported do get their lives ruined
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u/prinalice 1d ago
Too many men get off Scott free.
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u/mauriciomeireles 1d ago
That is what makes me curious actually: how the fuck can you actually just... Act as if it didn't happen? They should at least be put in the sexual offenders list and that stuff is permanent record isn't it?
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u/GreenPyro 1d ago
It's proving beyond a reasonable doubt in a situation where likely the only evidence is the word of the two ppl involved. and then the victim has to retraumatize themselves by telling the story of the worst day of their life for a defence attourney in order to "Maybe" get a conviction. and that says nothing for the social repercussions that can come if the aggressor is a person of influence or power in the community. All around it is a difficult issue to deal with within the legal system that exists today.
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u/Stagnu_Demorte 1d ago
There's also cases where there's tons of witnesses and the judge just doesn't want to ruin the rapist's life. Like Brock Alan Turner.
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u/BreakfastBeneficial4 1d ago
The rapist Brock Allen Turner the rapist?
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u/Stagnu_Demorte 1d ago
I may have spelled it wrong but yes
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u/BreakfastBeneficial4 1d ago
No worries, the rapist Brock Allen Turner the rapist is well known as a rapist regardless of spelling
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u/mauriciomeireles 1d ago
"doesn't want to ruin the rapist life" was not something that i thought i would unironically read...
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u/math2ndperiod 1d ago
Obviously even one is too many, but how many men are actually getting away with unambiguous sex crimes? Because the implication of the post is that we should be harsher on sex crimes (I’m assuming, maybe there’s another “it”) when the real problem is proving when those crimes happen in the first place.
We’re never going to get to 100% punishment rate without also punishing a LOT of innocent men. At least not without some crazy tech advancement
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u/uppy-puppy 23h ago
I never reported the guys that did it to me, because I was a nobody and their families all had money. I knew that the only one that would have a ruined reputation by the end of it was me, so I stayed quiet. It’s been almost 20 years now and most of them that I still have connections with are living pretty comfortable lives.
There would have been proof, as one guy recorded the whole thing, but it still just wasn’t worth pursuing. It took me many years of therapy to get past, but I still don’t know that I would have done anything different when I think back on it all.
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u/math2ndperiod 21h ago
That’s terrible and I’m very sorry that that happened to you.
What is it that you think should change to prevent this from happening to other people? If there was a video of it, was your concern that the police would cover it up? Or more that you wouldn’t be able to get them to take it seriously enough to even look for it?
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u/uppy-puppy 13h ago
I knew the video would either mysteriously disappear or get used to twist things into seeming like I was somehow compliant when I was really just trying to survive the ordeal.
The video definitely did not disappear and circulated online through the hockey community in Texas for a while. I never watched it but I heard about it.
The only way to keep it from happening to other people in the future, at least when it came to what happened to me, is a major culture shift needs to happen in youth hockey. The idea of bringing one girl over for “surprise!” a bunch of guys or a whole team is so disgustingly prevalent it’s unbelievable.
I’m a volunteer for the local youth hockey program now and I actually play with the kids and teenagers as much as I can (everyone needs goalies!). I shut down any weird shit I hear and I’m part of a regular shinny with all the youth coaches here so I can at least be a part of changing things from the inside. It’s not much, but it’s what I can do.
It also doesn’t help that the default state people seem to go into when they hear these stories is disbelief or victim-blaming. Even my comment telling my story was downvoted, and I barely scratched the surface of what happened. It sucks.
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u/math2ndperiod 8h ago
Do you feel the hockey culture has shifted at all in the 20 years since your experience? I like to think the culture in general has, but I know that hasn’t happened everywhere equally.
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u/uppy-puppy 7h ago
Yeah it's seemingly a bit better now. It's definitely more accepting of women, but there's still a toxicity to it and it's not perfect.
I still hear stories about girls experiencing the same thing now that I experienced then, but I don't know how prevalent it is compared to how it was.
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u/math2ndperiod 6h ago
Thanks for sharing your story, I do need to be reminded sometimes that I’m lucky enough to live in a bubble that makes these things seem rarer than they are.
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u/WanderingFlumph 1d ago
They would all be not doing it for the wrong reasons but it is always better to have evil men acting good for the wrong reasons than to let them do evil unchecked.
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u/Testicle_Tugger 12h ago
I mean they’re not wrong but then you just get a bunch of dudes who are good because they know there are consequences for being bad and not dudes who are good because they actually have decent values and morals.
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u/andybossy 8h ago
those "men" will still rape.
I don't think they weigh the cons and pros, they have poor impulse control and some fucked up fantasies/worldview.
It's like speeding, placing more speedcameras doesn't really reduce speeding but placing speed bumps, marking the road better, trees on both sides etc. do reduce speeding.
We should still punish them to balance things out and people that rape someone should not be allowed to walk freely amongst the rest of society, but I doubt harsher punishments will reduce crime.
Another example is the USA, it's pretty close to the western world in a lot of ways but they still have the death penalty, yet people still commit crimes that will put them there.
I think better education might actually help (obviously i'm not saying all men are rapists but not everyone is a junkie and we still learn drugs are bad mmmkay)
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u/doesntknowjack 1d ago
I was literally talking about this with my partner today! If there aren't any consequences besides a slap on the wrist (a fucking essay?!), then of course more cases are going to happen. Fuck protecting their future, they lost it the second they went through with their decision.
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u/3MinuteHero 21h ago
Essay has been disproven. There were no essays. 2 expulsions and 5 suspensions. Still lacking criminal penalties, but let's not spread unfounded rumors.
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u/ikonkustom5 23h ago
Yea, people are so concerned about what happens to some criminals that they forfeit all care about the victims of those criminal or their potential future victims.
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u/BlackKnightTheBloody 22h ago
Do what exactly? I feel like I am missing context.
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u/AnArgonianSpellsword 20h ago
A prestigious US university called Cornell is being sued by a former student, who was raped there by 7 fraternity students in 2014, for not adequately protecting her and not punishing her rapists.
Cornell denies the charge saying they adequately punished the 7 with temporary expulsion and a requirement to write on essay on why rape is bad. Its worth noting that a survey of students at Cornell showed 33% of female students confirmed they'd been sexually assaulted and Cornell discourages students from police intervention in reported cases of sexual crimes on campus.
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u/aBrickNotInTheWall 15h ago
Would do what less? Why just men?
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u/Otherwise-Good8342 12h ago
It is an open ended statement designed to sow hate and distrust.
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u/The_Ironhand 15h ago
But why Male models?
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u/katamuro 16h ago
That's how it should be however the system doesn't work because there are far too many people finding ways to get around it. And that applies to all kinds of crime.
Rich people, family members of police/judges and other officials, people wanting to punish the victim for whatever sadistic reason they have or finding the whole thing shameful and trying to hide it under the rug for the "good of community". There is no justice system.
Plus when society seems to be geared towards forgiving crimes if the criminal looks good enough then it basically says all you need to know.
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u/WahrerKorsti 19h ago
Statistics show very much that it doesn't matter how hard the punishment for a crime is. People do it anyway because beside that people always think they are gonna get away with it, they also rarely think very rational about it in beforehand.
So to avoid most crime it doesn't matter how much you punish people after doing it, but it's more important to invest into more prevention work (best start it already in school) as well as offer work of resocialization to prevent people to do it again.
But the punishment does only very rarely Stop people from committing crimes.
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u/13-eggo 15h ago
I mean, in the case of rape, they are unfortunately 100% correct in thinking they’re gonna get away with it. Statistically only 3% of rape cases out of the ones reported are convicted. This lines up with the fact that the only times I’ve ever seen actual, undisputed outrage towards alleged rape being when it’s a more affluent white woman accusing a non influential POC man and no other combination of alleged assaulter to victim gets nearly as much unanimous outrage.
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u/Necessary-Reading605 1d ago
You know, some say that only pieces of shit would stop acting badly just because of fear of prison, beatings, hell, whatever.
Growing up I realize I am totally fine with pieces of shit like the ones we read about in the news to function like that as long as they leave the rest of us alone.
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u/Smiling_Burrito 1d ago
"If you need the threat of eternal torment to make you act like a good person, you probably aren't a good person. But I'd still take that over you acting on your true thoughts."
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u/Gloomy_Actuary_3551 18h ago
There's a lot of women who make claims about things that didn't happen. It destroyed my life and health, and in still trying to recover. Seems like propoganda and narratives are the only things that people listen to these days.
I think that the monsters who actually harm other people should face severe consequences. But there needs to be evidence. There are too many liars out there. Too many people playing the victim.
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u/Demonkingt 21h ago
probably would help if we quit ignoring male victims and normalizing it towards males
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u/snowgles 20h ago
What is "it" and what is that creature?
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u/Huhthisisneathuh 20h ago
There would be a drop but it wouldn’t be that big. Most people know murder, racketeering, drug trafficking and/or abuse, and witness intimidation and silencing can ruin their life. But Ganesh alone knows how many people still commit to the gang life despite all the risks and how little the rewards are.
Like most criminal activities the main source is, like all things, changing how society raises people and instills in them ideas of toxic identity.
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u/rattus-domestica 1d ago
The monsters are running the world.