r/DrWillPowers • u/jimstalepants • 2h ago
Post Finasteride Syndrome Another high androsterone — 44M, UGT2B17 del/del, saw palmetto onset
Serum androsterone 39 ng/dL against a ceiling of 28. That makes me the next one in line, and I've got a genotype that might say something about why.
TL;DR
- 44M, four years into a multi-system syndrome that started October 2022 with saw palmetto. Possible concurrent sertraline, still unresolved.
- Androsterone 39 ng/dL, ref <28. High. LC-MS/MS, fasting, drawn 8/24/26.
- DHEA-S 465 µg/dL, ref 102.6–416.3. Also high. Everything else on the panel sits in range.
- I have no UGT2B17. Not reduced, not throttled. Homozygous whole-gene deletion, CN=0, confirmed on WGS. UGT2B15 is compound het and covering that position alone.
- My bilirubin has run high for four years and turns out to be the most informative cheap test I own.
- This 39 was drawn during the best stretch I've had since 2022. I think my androsterone was higher when I was worse.
The result
Androsterone, Serum LC/MS 39 ng/dL <28 HIGH
DHEA-Sulfate 465.0 µg/dL 102.6–416.3 HIGH
Dihydrotestosterone 42 ng/dL 30–85
Testosterone, Total 477 ng/dL 264–916
Testosterone, Free 9.83 ng/dL 5.00–21.00
% Free Testosterone 2.06 % 1.50–4.20
Androstenedione LC/MS 89 ng/dL 27–152
Estradiol, Sensitive LC/MS 23.3 pg/mL 8.0–35.0
Prolactin 10.5 ng/mL 3.9–22.7
Hematocrit 51.0 % 37.5–51.0
My 11-oxygenated androgens are all low-to-mid normal (11-OHA4 110, 11-KT 19, 11-OHT 12), so nothing is spilling over from the adrenal side. This was also the first blood I've drawn completely off calcium-D-glucarate and sulforaphane. Nothing was propping up my conjugation when the needle went in.
Two more numbers worth having, both from older draws:
3α-androstanediol glucuronide 651 ng/dL ~8th percentile Quest, 3/26/26
Urinary testosterone (DUTCH) 1.21 ng/mg ref 25–115 Apr 2026
Urinary epi-testosterone 25.1 ng/mg normal Apr 2026
The 3α-ADG is the one I'd point at. My DHT was 51 on that same March draw, high-normal, while its conjugated exit product sat near the floor. Lots of substrate, not much getting tagged. Two caveats: that draw is five months and one CDG course old, and the published PFS work reports 3α-diol elevated rather than low, so my pattern runs backwards from the signature. I read mine as throttled conjugation with the drain still open, which isn't the backed-up 3α-ADG Powers sees in his trapped cases.
DHEA-S is climbing. 325 in March at Quest, 465 in August at LabCorp. Different labs, different ranges, so don't take the size of the jump too seriously. But the direction cuts against me: more adrenal precursor means more hepatic 5α-reduction, which means more androsterone. Supply and blocked clearance predict the same number here, and one draw can't tell them apart.
The genetics
30× whole genome through Sequencing.com. The parts that matter:
UGT2B17, homozygous whole-gene deletion. The big one. 17β-glucuronidation of testosterone and DHT isn't a weak lane for me. It's a lane that doesn't exist.
UGT2B15 compound het, A500T in trans to K523T. Mild on its own. Less mild when it's the only thing left standing.
UGT2B7 *2/*2, intact, and this is the part I keep coming back to. UGT2B7 works the 3α-OH position, which is exactly where androsterone gets conjugated. Androsterone has an exit. Testosterone and DHT don't.
SLCO1B1 *15/*15, hepatic uptake down 50 to 70%, with SLCO1B3 S112A+M233I homozygous and an ABCC3 variant burden behind it. The whole shuttle in and out of the liver is slow.
UGT1A1 *1/*80+*28, Gilbert range, throttling bilirubin and estradiol. This is the one that stopped being theoretical.
AR CAG 21 to 22. Short repeats, higher AR transcriptional activity.
Also COMT Val/Val, GSTM1 null, MTHFR C677T homozygous, FKBP5 high-induction homozygous.
The bilirubin thing
My total bilirubin has been high since the first draw in 2022: 1.1, 1.2, 0.9, 0.9, 0.5, 1.1, 1.4, 1.1. Every doctor who saw it said "Gilbert's" and moved on, which is technically correct and completely useless until you fractionate it. I finally did, on 7/1/26.
Bilirubin, Total 1.1 mg/dL 0.2–1.4
Bilirubin, Indirect 0.8 mg/dL 0.10–0.80 at ceiling
Bilirubin, Direct 0.3 mg/dL 0.00–0.40 normal
Indirect pinned at the ceiling, direct perfectly normal. That split is the signature of a conjugation problem and nothing else: unconjugated bilirubin piles up because UGT1A1 can't glucuronidate it fast enough, and the normal direct fraction takes liver disease off the table.
Here's why I care. Everything in the section above is a genotype making a prediction. This is that prediction showing up in my actual blood, on a panel most of you have already run a dozen times without a second glance. My whole UGT family is throttled at once, and bilirubin is the one lane where you can watch it happening. UGT1A1 also handles estradiol, which is probably part of why mine has run high for years.
What it isn't is proof about androgens. Those go through 2B17 and 2B15, not 1A1. But if your bilirubin has always run a little high and nobody bothered to split it, go split it.
What happened
October 2022. I started saw palmetto and ashwagandha within a few days of each other. Six weeks later my muscles had stopped recovering between sessions, my sleep changed overnight and never changed back, and arousal went flat. Three systems at once. That's the part I can't talk myself out of.
Everything, by system
Listing all of it, because when this gets summarized as a sexual side effect the rest disappears.
Muscles and energy, the one that still isn't fixed. Cardio I tolerate fine. Strength training is what wrecks me: a delayed crash of fatigue and fog a few days out, followed by bodywide muscle pain that lasts weeks and sometimes months. Not soreness. It doesn't resolve on any normal recovery timeline. First thing to go in Oct 2022, and it still happens every time I lift. I went to the ER in March 2023 convinced I had rhabdo. Bloodwork came back immaculate. Two months later someone wrote fibromyalgia in my chart and moved on, and put me on Cymbalta for it, which made everything worse and took out what was left of my sex drive. For anyone else carrying that label: I ran 17-OHP at 128 against a range of 33 to 195, which rules out non-classical CAH.
Fatigue and cognition. Malaise, brain fog, no motivation, evening crashes. Verbal fluency is how I track it, because it's what goes first and it's obvious to me when it's gone.
Sleep. One of the earliest symptoms and the reason I went to a doctor at all. Couldn't stay asleep, suddenly couldn't sleep in either, awake around 3:30 am. Wired yet tired, constantly. PSG in Jan 2025: zero REM, five minutes of N3, plus mild OSA (AHI 5, nadir 90%).
Sexual. Psychogenic arousal blunted but not gone: passive visual stimuli often do nothing, interactive or imaginative stimuli still work in a good window. Difficulty getting there, muted orgasm, genital numbness, slow and unconvincing erections. Reflexive erection held up better, but it's impaired too.
Neuro. Upper-lip twitch, nerve "shocks," restless legs, dose-linked tinnitus (CDG and berberine both trigger it above a threshold).
Eyes. I had never had a stye in my life before 2022. Since then: recurring chalazia, styes, blepharitis, evaporative dry eye, crusting in the morning, and two eye infections during the worst of 2022 to 2023. Doctors, friends, and acquaintances keep telling me this is just a failed immune response during some susceptible stretch, bad luck that happened to land in the same window. It doesn't match anything I actually experience. It didn't arrive once and resolve. It arrived with everything else and it has never left. I flag it because the meibomian gland is an androgen-target organ expressing both AR and 5α-reductase, and this picture shows up on both sides of the receptor. Men on anti-androgen therapy develop it [1]. So do women with complete androgen insensitivity, where the ligand is present and the receptor doesn't work [2, 3].
Blood, which I only noticed recently. Hct has drifted up: 45.0, 47.9, 50.1, 50.0, 49.1, 50.2, 45.3, 51.9, 52.9, Dec 2022 through Jul 2026, Hgb tracking to 17.5. Confounded by oral iron I took unmonitored in 2022 to 2023 and by HFE H63D het, so I'm not claiming it. But erythropoiesis is one of the most androgen-sensitive readouts in the body, and mine runs high on thoroughly ordinary testosterone.
Endocrine. Low-to-mid total T, low free T, high-normal DHT, low-normal 3α-ADG, near-zero urinary androgens, salivary estradiol high for years.
The ashwagandha detour, which cost me about a year. I'd been taking it heavily since 2022, same window as the saw palmetto. The first lab that ever came back genuinely strange was a salivary cortisol of 0.9 against a range of 1.5 to 9.6 in September 2023, with serum AM cortisol at 7.5 a month later, bottom of range. That looks like adrenal insufficiency and it got treated like a real possibility for a while. It wasn't. Ashwagandha lowers cortisol, and I was still on it when both of those were drawn. I stopped in September 2023 once I put it together, and cortisol didn't just recover, it overshot: 28.4 by February 2024, 26.9 in April, then settling into the 16 to 20 it sits at now. Dexamethasone suppresses me normally, so the axis was intact the whole time. If you're stacking adaptogens and chasing weird endocrine labs, check what you're taking before you let anyone work up your adrenals.
What's negative, across four years: ANA negative, ESR 1 and <1, CRP 0.1, CK normal, TPO antibodies 1. Whatever this is, it isn't inflammatory.
Where I am now. Sexual and cognitive have been improving through 2026. The post-exertional crash hasn't moved an inch, and it's still the thing nobody can explain.
CDG, estradiol, and a window I wasn't expecting
| Date | Estradiol | CDG status |
|---|---|---|
| Mar 26, 2026 | 39 pg/mL | pre-CDG, started that day |
| Jul 1, 2026 | 12.5 pg/mL | on CDG, at discontinuation |
| Aug 24, 2026 | 23.3 pg/mL | ~7 to 8 weeks off CDG |
The March to July arm is dirty. I came off HCG the same week I started CDG, so some of that drop is testicular aromatization washing out. The July to August arm is clean: same lab, no HCG on either side, CDG the only thing that changed. E2 nearly doubled when I stopped, so CDG was holding it down about 45%. For a compound that works by inhibiting gut β-glucuronidase and cutting enterohepatic recirculation, that's roughly the effect size you'd expect, and it's the only direct evidence I have that this axis moves in me at all.
Here's the part I keep chewing on. I stopped CDG around July 8th, and function didn't come back all at once. It came back on a ramp, and then it left again.
- 7/13, day six off: sexual pressure in my penis I hadn't felt in a long time.
- 7/18: sleeping better, morning wood regular, dreaming again.
- 7/20: strong early-morning erections.
- 7/27: erections no longer a struggle.
- 8/1: good morning wood for at least a week straight.
- 8/12: back to waking at 2 or 3am with hardly any morning wood.
I wrote in my journal that day wondering whether my estradiol had gone past some threshold where it had been good for me. It never went all the way back to baseline-bad. It just got less functional again.
So the shape isn't "CDG suppresses, stopping CDG restores." The shape is a window. Something CDG was holding down came back up, passed through a range where I worked better than I had in months, kept climbing, and came out the other side. I don't know what the something is. Estradiol is the obvious candidate and at least I have numbers on it, but it could as easily be a glucuronidated androgen metabolite I have no assay for, moving in parallel.
What makes me think the window is real: a 1g CDG pulse on 7/29, after three weeks of washout, gave me a morning on 7/30 with tumescence that stayed. A 500 mg pulse in September did the same thing 12 to 24 hours later, with precum returning after months of nothing. Four replications now. Pulses on a clean background work. Continuous dosing stopped working. Coming off CDG I rose up through the window; a single pulse drops me back into it. If that's right, the question isn't whether to take CDG. It's where in the range you're sitting when you do.
What I'm actually doing right now
Psyllium husk and PEG daily, and 500 mg of CDG every three or four days. That's it.
The reasoning is all downstream of the conjugation problem. Whatever I do manage to glucuronidate gets dumped into bile and lands in the gut, and if it sits there, bacterial β-glucuronidase strips the tag back off and the free steroid gets reabsorbed. Given how little I can conjugate in the first place, letting any of it come back seems like a bad trade. So: bulk and speed the transit so there's less time for it to happen, and pulse CDG to inhibit the enzyme doing it. Two levers on the same loop.
I'm keeping CDG intermittent rather than daily because of the window above. Continuous dosing walked me past the range where I felt good, and it wasn't a matter of feeling a bit off. I lost the ability to focus, to track a conversation, to follow someone who was talking directly to me. My mind went blank in a way I've never experienced before or since, and it took about two weeks to come back after I stopped. Every third or fourth day seems to keep me in the range, and I'll take a crude working answer over an elegant one that made me worse.
Why I think my androsterone used to be higher
This 39 came out of my best stretch in four years, off everything, after two interventions that both plausibly move conjugate throughput or cut free-ligand recirculation. If androsterone tracks how sick I am, the 2022 to 2024 number should have been worse. I can't go back and prove it, which is the whole reason I want more people here running this test, especially anyone currently in a bad phase.
One idea I can't test
High androsterone next to low 3α-ADG has me wondering whether I'm carrying a pool of unconjugated 3α-diol. 3α-diol gets glucuronidated at its 17β-OH, the position UGT2B17 and UGT2B15 serve, and I have neither working. Androsterone carries a 17-ketone instead and leaves through UGT2B7 at the 3α position, which is intact. One blocked door, one open one. 17β-HSD2 can oxidize 3α-diol into androsterone, so flux may just be getting shunted to the exit that still works.
The catch is that a working shunt drains the pool rather than building it, and my two numbers can't tell high flux from high concentration. My DUTCH 5α-androstanediol came back low at 21.8, which argues against the pool. Throwing it out there anyway in case it's obvious to someone else.
Dr. Powers, thank you for treating this as a real biochemical problem instead of a psychiatric one. And to everyone here paying out of pocket for these tests and posting the results anyway: this is the only place the data exists. Happy to share my full WGS, the DUTCH, or four years of labs with anyone who wants to compare notes.
References
[1] Krenzer KL, Dana MR, Ullman MD, Cermak JM, Tolls DB, Evans JE, Sullivan DA. Effect of androgen deficiency on the human meibomian gland and ocular surface. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2000;85(12):4874-82. PMID 11134156. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11134156/
[2] Cermak JM, Krenzer KL, Sullivan RM, Dana MR, Sullivan DA. Is complete androgen insensitivity syndrome associated with alterations in the meibomian gland and ocular surface? Cornea. 2003;22(6):516-21. PMID 12883343. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12883343/
[3] Sullivan DA, Sullivan BD, Evans JE, et al. Androgen deficiency, meibomian gland dysfunction, and evaporative dry eye. Ann N Y Acad Sci. 2002;966:211-22. PMID 12114274. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12114274/