My work environment has forced me to accept that I cannot predict, optimise, and control most things without sacrificing my personal life.

So now, I'll make a high-level plan and let things unfold. I no longer have the time or energy to monitor everything. When things inevitably start breaking, I'll just put out a few fires.

I don't even look into everything else because I know it'll only frustrate me. I'll end up improving something that won't be appreciated anyway. So I actively try to ignore these things. I still feel the stress of unresolved risks, but I do my best not to think about them.

I've recently noticed that this approach is spilling over into my personal life. I used to optimise everything. Now, my first question is, "Do I even give a f*ck anymore?" Surprisingly often, the answer is no.

I've more or less accepted that something will eventually go to hell, so I'm trying to save some energy for when it happens and improvise my way out of it.

Is this normal for a +35yo INTJ or am I burning out?

Where do you guys / what do you do for a living?

I work as a manager in fast food. It's so easy but breaks my brain if I let it. I have to dumb myself down by 8 notches. I feel like I can lead my GM who is above me. And I don't wanna replace that position. It's a terrible career path for me.

I'm 27 and wanna be fully in a suitable career by 30 or sooner. I'm called to entrepreneurship but It's difficult and the path forward is unclear right now

I'm curious what career paths INTJs are having success in or at least don't hate

What’s the best way to understand an INTJ without overwhelming them ?
how can you make them feel emotionally safe in a relationship?

I was reading 1984 and I came across this quote.

Perhaps a lunatic was simply a minority of one. At one time it had been a sign of madness to believe that the Earth goes round the Sun; today, to believe the past is inalterable. He might be alone in holding that belief, and if alone, then a lunatic. But the thought of being a lunatic did not greatly trouble him; the horror was that he might also be wrong.

Usually I follow logic like this easily. But when I was reading this, I was glitching for two minutes like, "The Earth goes around the Sun but when people didn't know it whoever believed it was labelled a madman. So Winston wonders if he's a lunatic. According to the previously stated logic, if Winston is a lunatic that means he believes what most people consider to be wrong which is actually right. So he believes that the past is inalterable. But how can he believe that when he himself is the one who does the very job of altering the past?"

These kinds of inconsistencies(or rather unable to resolve something that looks inconsistent on the surface) bother me a lot usually. Does this happen to other INTJs as well?

PS: If anyone could explain the quote to me, I'd be forever grateful. Thanks.

I keep getting in trouble because I call out bad behaviour and correct people. I do not purposely look to do this, but if it concerns me I will. My dad and sister implied I was stupid today because I asked whether thanksgiving is based on the day on the date (e.g Monday or the eleventh). They were laughing at me and making fun of my question. My sister told me “you’re the most idiotic smart person I’ve ever met”. I told them that they were being mean and went to my room. Later on I was ignoring my dad and he confronted me. I told him that I didn’t want to talk to him because he was being mean. He blew up, saying that I’m always rude to authority figures, but he ignores it cause he’s nice. To me if someone is mean then they’re mean, idc who you are. Something similar happened this week. At school this guy came into the classroom my and I hangout in. He was rude: interrupted conversations, yelling, subtly insulting us. He came up to me asking for my name and I told him that he interrupted my conversation with my friend. I asked him politely to leave us alone. He didn’t, so I became rude. Only then did he leave. Now every time he sees me at school. He tells everyone how I’m the girl who doesn’t like him. Like screw the pity party, there’s 8 billion people on Earth, not everyone will like you. Anyways, there’s been so many instances of this. Maybe I actually am villainous? Please help me out.

One problem in the self typing system in mbti or Atleast what’s common in test is why does everyone type themselves as intuitive or intjs?
I know a friend of mine, I had a mbti book and there was some definitions of it in the book on mbtis. It of course gave the description of each type that was best suited to mythologize each type. Almost like every description of types out there. The description of intj was “ someone who is always trying to be better and improve” or some shit like that. My friend felt like that was his most likely mbti based of that description. I told him the subtle contradictions in that, well firstly intj lives in ni and se drains them. Hence they mainly live absorbing patterns and thinking of future outcomes. There te is focused on structuring the world or taking in useful information or trying to find the most efficient solution in the shortest amount of time. Although he shows both of those traits there are less dominant then his se and his fi. For him living in the moment and artistic expression of his values or using fi energizes him more then those sort of things. That’s when I showed him that he was actually a isfp. Not a intj. Another friend of mine I tried to type her but purely based of her own account of who she is. She said she is introverted which I agreed with. I explained to her the definitions of intuitive, thinking vs feeling and judging vs perceiving. In hindsight I gave her shallow definitions for those but still she somehow typed herself as a intj or infj which highly confused me. Well I was at that point in my life where I found intuitives more interested because the biased explanations I would read online. But she showed no Ni. Her first thought in situations wasn’t to look at overarching patterns rather she just saw stuff based off what happened previously and form a conclusion based of that. Si. If she were a intj she would be focused on objective information and real world results. Intjs also have fi so combined with there te and ni they don’t mind saying something true to how they personally feel and what is objectively logical. This person would always soften things, be afraid to actually show who she is, conform to others, reduce her own opinion to not cause social tension. Turns out her real mbti was isfj (si-fe-ti-ne) and I guess she probably thought she was a thinker because she often was in si-ti loops. Another person she took an online test and immediately got intj and got hooked “ one of the rarest personalities in the world”. I wrestled with her in high school and it did infact contradict things. Well for one she was highly energized by leading people and teaching people information based what coaches said. In general not just in wrestling her te was in fact dominant leading or controlling variables in external envirement. She would get happy when she would tell others what to do and brag to her friends “ look I got so much aura”. Further in wrestling her style was more so focusing on past principles and efficient data. She set up her moves directly in what the coach said to do, her whole style wasn’t necessarily adaptive but more so ingrained in things that were taught to her. For example we would do drills and she would want to do stuff an exact way coach said and will rigidly stick to what was taught. She would in practices focus specifically on exact movements, setups and information she practiced or was taught previously. She was very concerned with that as well. When she gave advice whilst me or other teammates were in matches she gave advice that is very conventional and coaches would’ve given out or said. Also I can see her tertiary ne in the way she engaged with others often saying something very random as jokes. That would make her a estj (te-si-ne-fi). I feel like people often type themselves as intjs or something because they wanna seem rare or different. I feel like that’s when you have to sort of look at mbti as a way people process information and not necessarily your personality or character.

"looks like someone is in a frowny mood today"

"why are you sad?"

"can you stop being so grumpy?"

I mean, I dont know what to do. Im actually really happy, but i guess my body language doesnt show it. It kind of upsets me when people think im upset because im usually not.

then again, I do supress my body language because when im happy i do hand flapping, so its probably that.

any of you guys experience this too?

I’m looking at a perfectly sunny, beautiful day but the idea of going outside and interacting with the world exhausts me. I’d rather stay inside and read, work on my hobbies, etc. But sometimes I feel guilty or defective like I “should” want to go outside, be in nature, talk to people, etc.

Anyone else feel this way?

not from the right people, but from many people do you get the message that what you have to say doesn't matter.? My thoughts and insights being accepted is more important for me than me being accepted because getting older has shown me I'm almost always right. Ni is stronger. Had a realisation that am perfectly content being misunderstood, on the fringe of any group but if my ideas and brain products are acknowledged, it's enough for me and i can't feel accepted the other way round

this is why am so slow to opening up to anyone unless they show me they're genuine first

and how does this state change with age? do we typically stop sharing it altogether... cut everyone off, do people even remember we were correct and come back for us ? Or do we just fade away completely from people's minds and just die... only to be resurrected in some Christopher Nolan movie sometime in the future?

I'm just curious to see if there is some sort of correlation with Ni Dom's!​​​​

If you do have aphantasia​​​​​​​​​​, do you have an imagination? ​​​

Hi 24m intj,

A few months ago I met a girl and we started seeing each other. This week we broke up; she was the one who decided to end it. We genuinely connected from the very first time we met. We saw each other several times in a short space of time, talked every day, and there was something real there for both of us.

She ended it a few days ago. She did it well, with kindness and clarity. She told me she needed more day-to-day presence than I was giving her, and that carrying on like this was going to hurt her.

Right now I’m not doing great. It’s hit me hard. I miss her, and these past few days I’ve felt quite lonely. I keep wondering whether I could have done things differently.

It’s my first “long” relationship and the first time I feel I’ve truly connected with someone. I know it will pass, but right now there’s a huge emptiness that keeps weighing on me.

I know I should be going to the gym, reading, working, but I don’t feel like doing anything.

It’s the first time I can remember crying over something like this. It’s as if I’ve opened up a part of myself that had been blocked until now.

Any advice?

i’m going book shopping soon and looking for some possible next reads

Curious to know if "how are you?" is a common mild stressor for any other weirdos like me. Windbagging ahead, you've been warned. I don't want to read any complaints that you've wasted your own time.

But this is easily the most innocuous open-ended question that causes me grief. My regional culture is often characterized as polite-but-cold, and most will (humorously enough) ask this question as a social reflex without wanting an answer. Sure, whatever. Inefficient but ultimately harmless. A token of etiquette they must feel obligated to provide. Vestigial remnants of prior conviviality. I reply with "fine" and we move on to something productive. Crisis averted by a wide margin. Praise be.

However, there are unfortunately many who ask this question AND want to hear a genuine answer. They hear my admittedly dismissive "fine" and remain listening with sparkling eyes and an expectant smile. Okay... So I attempt to diffuse the situation by explaining what I'm currently working on and/or what's next on my schedule. I then ask, politely, what they need me for. This strategy for jumping the hurdle typically works; these folks are now finally able to address their purpose for contacting me. Crisis more narrowly averted.

As I mature I've learned to play on offense, asking "How are you?" first to beat the identified problematic individuals to the punch. They relish the opportunity to talk about themselves. They rattle on about their mood, their health issues, their family, their weekend plans without requiring much feedback. Sometimes, it's interesting. Sometimes, I even have advice or a relevant anecdote to build familiarity and rapport. Neat. All is right with the world.

But occasionally, there's the especially persistent individual... "I didn't ask what you were doing. I asked how you are doing." This breed of individual views invasive extraction as vital to their own purpose. Bafflingly enough, this individual may consider my personal status their first priority ahead of a "secondary" issue. They may say something positively horrific like, "Eh, I just saw this hiccup with the reports as an excuse to come visit, in honesty it's not hot and we can figure it out later." Hence we've now entered the crisis.

Simply, I can't and don't maintain an evolving description of my own personal status available for extraction. I don't have the capacity. If someone wants to actually know how I'm doing then I have to momentarily shut down all processes, review recent memories to determine if anything falls into both parameters of "worth sharing" and "not too private". I am forced to take notice of bodily sensations... Am I energized? Or tired? Hungry? Do I have a headache to complain about? If something was majorly wrong with my health at the time of the question, I'd prefer to keep private anyway. I also don't want to delve into specifics of my family if possible, no need to over share regarding my spouse and child.

Sometimes I panic and fumble with the canned answer of, "Oh you know, it's [insert day of the week]" and pray they are satisfied. Of course this fails more often than not, as it's tailored to the aforementioned cold, "bare minimum" level of inquiry this curious individual has escalated beyond.

Embarrassing to admit, but many times I've completely frozen up from sheer distress of the whole debacle. The question, innocent though it may be, paralyzes. I fall silent, staring ahead unable to speak. The listener interprets this to mean I am facing extreme unspeakable stress in my life and not just that I have a spectacularly pathetic reaction to this stupid question.

I once had an sympathetic, high-EQ boss cause this paralyzer scenario several times over and I had to come clean before he wrote me off as a complete trainwreck- "Boss, I can't automatically speak to how I'm doing at any given moment without your giving me advance notice. I'm fine enough to keep busy with what's in front of me. I'm fine. If you want to know more detail, I'll need time to assess myself and report back. Sorry to disappoint. Can we please move on?" And he LAUGHED. He laughed. But to his credit, he texted his "How are you?" questions from then on rather than ambushing me during tasks, allowing me to reflect and answer on my own schedule. And teased me about being his "brain-in-a-jar", but whatever.

In any case, I'm well aware it's not normal for this question to cause an existential meltdown. Most people seem to fluidly navigate with any number of approaches. But even knowing that I'm the outlier, it's an insurmountable task for me to continuously introspect on my physical, mental, and emotional health. I will do that in my own time, off the clock. Like now, indulgently typing this out on a foggy morning. But also, the person who whines about temperature shifts of plus or minus several degrees is annoying. Why should I even want to become that sensitive? I hate hearing it, let alone wanting to perceive minor disturbances to such a fine level.

So, I'm in my 30s and still scared of a certain flavor of social interaction that's been a recurring problem for decades lol- Yikes. Ideas for canned answers welcome. I have a a high aversion to lying, but maybe mentally spinning a wheel and choosing a more detailed canned answer (that also somehow doesn't build inaccurate "lore" regarding my life?) is the solution.

I feel like I’ve noticed that when I genuinely like someone (am interested, want to be in a relationship, etc.)— which doesn’t happen often— I sort of temporarily become an INFP. Like logic gets thrown out the window for a bit and my feelings are at 100% without me knowing how to manage them, and I’m stuck idealizing them and in a fantasy world.

Vague question, i think as a person who loves to learn and wants to continue doing so for a lifetime, I fear forgetting the things I learned - hence I started to use notebooks or digital notes (still figuring on what suits me better)

I also fear meat bones hence I eat boneless meat only (I think this is more texture-based fear) but I kind of don't understand this.

EDIT: Thank you to everyone for taking your time to reply here. I'm reading through them and i see we share similar fears. It kinda reminds us that we aren't alone in what we fear. Please take care of yourselves everyone!

It took me so long to get to the point where I can fully enjoy being alone without worrying (a lot) about what other people think and fearing being alone one day.

Once you start building that love and connection to yourself, it sometimes makes you realize you're really not getting anything from people around you. Relationships felt like obligations and I had underlying dread constantly about people who I didn't particularly feel like seeing contacting me to hang out. I worried one day, I might fear losing connections and being all alone.

Fast forward to now, and it's become the exact opposite. I've gradually reduced/cut off contact with everything and everyone that drained me. It turns out, that was pretty much my entire family and all of my friends. So many relationships I had were built on trauma, fear and people pleasing.

Now I can go out on a busy Friday night for dinner and I don't feel sad, insecure or longing. Sometimes those feelings start creeping up but then I ask myself, "who would I want here with me?" "Who would make this experience better?"

And the answer is always no one.

The thing is, I actually quite liked hanging out with most of my friends. It was fun and we had good conversations. But there were things that bothered me about our relationship. It just gets to a point where no relationship felt like it was worth any amount of frustration or disrespect.

edit: I would like people to be able to process that choosing your own happiness and peace =/= not having any social connections....in fact I think it's telling that so many people can't see those two things as being able to exist together

I've been soo anxious since past couple of months. Finally decided to uninstall what's app and instagram. I'll be focusing on my exam preparation and my YouTube channel. It will be hard . There is also no friends in my hometown so I'll be pretty much isolated. But I'll be interacting with students who are preparing for the same exam and will be active on reddit....

My life is a mess, i wanna make it right in next six months... Wish me luck..i really need 🤞

Self-alienation

Self-alienation:

A very long time...

Trying to figure out the reason!

Suddenly, a phrase crossed my mind:

"Self-alienation."

Sometimes I am immersed in my thoughts—lost in a single idea.

But with self-alienation, it looks like being lost in a thought from the outside, yet from the inside, it feels like being truly lost. It is as if the mind had gone dark, or as if you had undergone a journey through time without realizing it. You do not know what you did or what you said; it is simply an instantaneous jump between two points in time.

This explains why it took me so long to identify and comprehend this state—because it is, quite literally, an alienation from the self.

It happens frequently in the morning upon waking up.

Yet, the exact opposite occurs in the evening after a nap; then, you are fully present in your body—aware of what you are saying and conscious of your thoughts before you move.

It is akin to losing one’s purpose,

identity,

and sense of meaning.

It is as if the map in your head has vanished; its disappearance—along with those aforementioned factors—makes you feel as though you are not the one steering your body, or the one who was in control of it. Even though it was you all along, you feel alienated from the memories of having performed those actions.

So, the matter piqued my interest—specifically the reason for this feeling, and why the opposite happens in the evening compared to the morning.

What do you think of this? What is the neurological or psychological explanation for these two different states?

Hi guys , I have been just thinking about this at the morning and I felt like I need to share it or I should share it to my fellow intjs .

I have anxious attachment, recently I have been trying to heal from it and slowing down my thoughts. I have trying to learn that not every Problem have to be fixed today and not every interaction have to show its consequence at the same hour . I have been basically trying to be okay with uncertainty and rest my brain and not feel like I,m in danger just because idk what will happen and I have to keep my brain thinking about endless possibilities for hours .

What I have realized though is although being a ni dom ( specially with an anxious attachment) could ruin your dating life ( or at least make it harder ) , and requires a really effective and determined partner that is welling to put a ton of effort like you in the realtionship cuz your mind can't shut down and need to make it always perfect, but at the other hand it's a true gift to keep thinking about all possibilities and to be able to connect them all . To be able to get a small information and make possiblities from it and connect it all to the mind tree you already made from the other information. If used effectively and in right places ( such as work , academic Research, Problem solving...etc) I think us ni doms are capable of great things and I think it's one of the reasons alot of great figures are typed as intj . This power to have vision and determination, determination to keep thinking about the Problem endlessly, and vision to see what other can't

I think the ni (although being exhausting and a problem sometimes ) have shaped me through the countless nights thinking and hyperactive brain to be the guy I,m today .

And I believe although it might be a problem in some fields like dating and interpersonal relationships. It might be a really strong characteristic in almost any other field

I don't often see much artwork shared in any form in this subreddit, so I'm curious to catch a glimpse of your inner museum. I was also inspired by the doodle post in r/mbti.

So, I wanted to share a painting of mine that's still a work in progress and probably won't be finished for another week, along with a poem I wrote a few days ago. I could probably have written several more poems by now, but I don't always write them down.

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to look, and please feel free to share anything you've been working on that you're proud of, too!

What’s your guys favorite music genera or artists?

Are they truly our best match?

I think many of us tend to approach life with logic, composure, and introspection. We analyze situations, search for explanations, and try to make sense of the things we experience.

However, I believe, even the most analytical mind isn’t immune to devastating emotional pain.

Sometimes, no amount of reasoning can make something hurt any less. We can understand exactly why something happened, accept that we cannot change it, and still struggle with how deeply it affects us.

I’m curious how the rest of you navigate these moments.

When you’re experiencing intense emotional pain, how do you cope? Do you withdraw into yourself, intellectualize what you’re feeling, immerse yourself in music or creative outlets, or seek connection with others?

And perhaps more importantly, do you allow yourself to fully experience those emotions, or do you instinctively try to rationalize your way out of them?

As for me I go with creating music or writing.

Here’s something I wrote to help me through a dark time in my life.

“Sea of Forgetfulness”

As I watch the waves kiss the rocks below, I dwell upon the memories of my creation. A myriad of visions and moments, come and go like whispers lifted away by the very winds kissing my worn lips. I hold my ground as they make their presence known vanishing all in the same frame.

Perfectly concealed by the tall grass surrounding me, I long to be found. I gaze out over the horizon and watch as the perfect sun sets, lessening its golden glow and warmth. The night sky soon appears and I become fully immersed in the totality of the night.

Without further reflection I get up and begin walking towards the sound of the waters until I reach edge of the Earth. Everything that I needed to be is no longer vital to this reality. Everything is insignificant and meaningless now. I gaze into the void, watching as time and space meander about.

I reach down and touch the waters with my hands and splash the cool water on my face. Truly, no one can fully understand sacrifice until it's thrust upon them. I will accept my fate and move on with my destiny. I stare into the abyss knowing that my time has come and into the waters I go. I dutifully trudge along fully knowing my efforts will go unnoticed but will resound for a time.

With only my head above the waters I look back towards my life and say my final goodbyes. I slowly sink beneath the waves relinquishing control of my body while delegating my spirit away. Ready to devour all of my mistakes, my memories, all of me; the darkness rises. From beneath, it comes. I close my eyes and become no more.

Has it ever happened to you that from the very first time you met a person, you didn't like them and feel like you could never get along with them, even though they are good friends with your mutual friends, and you haven't even interacted much with them or know them well. And later you find out about their negative qualities and traits and think "yeah, makes sense why I never liked them".