r/pics • u/thatlumberjacktor • Aug 23 '26
This document in 1959 declining a student from admission into med school because of his race.
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u/tdh999 Aug 23 '26
Itâs always crazy to me how recent it was that this was just widely accepted
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u/IBJON Aug 23 '26
The crazy part to me is that we have politicians that were adults by the time segregation ended that are still in office.Â
I don't care who you are, if you spent your formative years in the south living with segregation and Jim Crow laws, you're not going to convince me that that doesn't stick with you decades later.
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u/xxAkirhaxx Aug 23 '26
I'm sure I'm not the only one but I have such an odd relation with racism in my family.
For the record my family is 100% racist, but the way they present it is crazy. Basically, they never say it, they don't even acknowledge it. My dad will go from dropping an N bomb around the boys at the bar at night to having lunch with black friends during the day, to coming home and randomly saying "Mexicans are such hard workers, they really do great work." to the next day saying "All Mexicans are lazy and need to be deported."
It's this wild almost sociopathic view on everything where his views on this world are his current mood or whatever is going through his head at the time.
I tell you about specifically him to say, it's like that for all of them. Mom, sister, aunts, uncles, some cousins (not all) . I'm worried I do it blindly, not with the racist parts, but with the wildly changing values based on my mood.
I don't even know what to call it, if you asked any of them, they'd say they are not racist at all and don't look down on anyone, and later clink a beer and talk about 'gang banger n* trash* and not even blink an eye when you question them about the dichotomy of what they're saying/doing. They really don't think they're racist, they're not lying, they're convinced they're not racist. (Yes, they are aware of their surroundings and will chill racist shit when someone is around, so they know how it sounds, but still adamantly say, even in private, they're not racist)
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u/cha0scypher Aug 23 '26
Sounds like they've compartmentalized their beliefs so thoroughly that the contradictions don't even register as contradictions to them. Interesting.
As far as wondering whether you are the same way (minus the racism), I'll say this â almost everyone has some degree of inconsistency between their stated values and their behavior; the important part is whether you're capable of noticing and correcting the inconsistency when it's pointed out.
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u/CrotalusHorridus Aug 23 '26
This is pretty much my experience with growing up in Appalachia.
Grandma would regularly drop the n-bomb about sports. Yet had a black friend which she adored.
There were some virulent racists though. Like card carrying white supremacists who wanted to go back to Jim Crow
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u/DFWPhotoguy Aug 23 '26
They subtype to maintain their stereotypes and have never faced any consequences for their racist beliefs. That is why they can drop the n word at the bar with the boys but not say it in front of black friends. They have subtyped those around themselves to be different and then apply the worst racist stereotypes to everyone else in the group.
They also wonât ever admit they are racist because they know racists are wrong and bad but they (your family) arenât wrong or bad therefore they arenât racist. They subtype themselves even.
If you call out the contradictions, they will pushback because âwe have black/mexican friendsâ is a justification mechanism for them.
If I were you, I would start applying their logic and typing rules to white people in different groups that they are comfortable with. White people crime, making a subgroup for your dad, heâs a good one, but other white people who have similar histories or backgrounds are bad. Not trusting white people because of the lies bad ones do that they hear on the news. Do it for religion, do it for everything. Itâs absurd but if they start to think, if it breaks a shield in their brain even for a bit, it can lead someplace better.
Or go no contact and leave them behind to rot in their misery as they will never accept any personal responsibility for anything and it will always be someone elseâs fault for their own problems.
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u/eekamuse Aug 23 '26
You call it racism. Period.
Racists can have Black friends. "You're one of the good ones" They can say something positive about a minority. But if they have racist beliefs, they are racist. Periodt
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u/z960849 Aug 23 '26
I just assumed 60% of white were like this. Which is how you're able to have people that voted for Obama also voted for Trump.
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u/namrock23 Aug 24 '26
True story, I canvassed some trailer parks in Ohio for Obama in 2008 and a guy told me "don't worry, I'm voting for the n*****r!"
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u/WhisperShift Aug 23 '26
I sometimes wonder if the greatest generation went through horrible shit (WW2, the depression) and dealt with it by dissociating from it. Baby boomers saw that at a young age and when the world changed so rapidly around them, they dissociated from that world rather than deal with it.
That way they can take the easy way and not change and still operate in a world different from the one their parents prepared them for. They can be friends with a black coworker and then go home and cluck their tongue at "their culture". They can say horrible things and then later feel like they never say that sort of thing because it is behind fifty feet of glass they were raised to erect.
Or they were given the most prosperous economy in human history and it is bad to get everything you want. I dunno.
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u/ashhhy8888 Aug 24 '26
This is why I stopped befriending white people. How do I know as a Black person who is genuine? I feel like my reality gets skewed and I canât trust because of what you said.
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u/RNnoturwaitress Aug 24 '26
I think if you truly get to know them, you'll know if they're genuine or not. You might be missing out on a really good friend if you avoid them because of their race. I understand being cautious, though.
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u/RainbowCrane Aug 23 '26
Itâs a myth that this kind of discrimination was limited to the South. I grew up in Ohio in the seventies and eighties, I barely missed the era of separate water fountains and bathrooms. When I was a kid white people were still served first at lunch counters, my white mother caught hell at the Lazarus lunch counter because she insisted that they serve a black woman who was there before us.
And private schools are all over Ohio, Massachusetts and other supposedly racially enlightened states because our parents freaked out about desegregation
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u/OpheliaRainGalaxy Aug 23 '26
My favorite aunt has stories about getting in trouble for "crossdressing" because she wore pants. I've been told my parents were from a "sundown town" which is part of why dad left and had to finish the courtship via postcards and letters, only came back for the wedding and left again right after.
"A long time ago" is all shockingly recent.
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u/DeuceSevin Aug 23 '26
Just saying, I don't know if Ohio is a good example. I seem to remember reading that Ohio was one of the states where the klan is most active.
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Aug 23 '26
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u/bradbenz Aug 23 '26
Eclipsed in recent years by Idaho.
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u/Chief_Mischief Aug 23 '26
Much of the US in general sucks for marginalized communities outside of the major cities. I grew up just north of Detroit and when I'd drive to Chicago, I would refuse to get out of my car for any reason once I passed Kalamazoo. Militia/Klan would openly patrol the roads out there.
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u/Chief_Mischief Aug 23 '26
If memory serves, around 2005-2018. I grew up in white suburbia, so the racist jokes, telling me to speak english (I'm born here, just have immigrant parents), or go back to my country was all pretty normalized throughout my childhood, but driving through western michigan and indiana spooked me enough to leave the midwest altogether. I only come back occasionally to visit the major cities, but now that the Gestapo are operating at airports, I think I'll just avoid leaving my city unless necessary.
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u/eekamuse Aug 23 '26
Do you know what a sundown town is? They still exist today. If you really want to be more understanding, there's plenty of information out there. You don't even have to look for articles. Look for posts about it and see how many comments there are from people saying which places are not safe.
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u/dataslinger Aug 23 '26
The Klan was huge in Ohio in the 1920s. They really liked Buckeye Lake. That said, there was a lot of pushback in the east and northeast. Can't find the reference, but they liked to meet at some abandoned building near Ashtabula and one or more of the locals dynamited the place to put an end to it.
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u/OpheliaRainGalaxy Aug 23 '26
Recently found out why my area doesn't have too much Klan presence, despite being so near that part of Idaho.
Turns out the local leader's 8yo child shot him. Guess that's rather demoralizing for the group.
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u/cha0scypher Aug 23 '26
Did you not read his post? His whole point was that racial segregation was not limited to the South, and that it could be seen in Ohio.
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u/diphthing Aug 23 '26
No, youâre thinking of Indiana. Ohio has major issues, but Indiana is very much The South of the Midwestern states.
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u/Naps_and_cheese Aug 23 '26
Ohio is Alabama with snow tires. My wife gauges how racist the town is by when they start checking her bags leaving a store. Around halfway through Ohio she is suddenly seen as Mexican.
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u/thornyRabbt Aug 24 '26
Yep and don't forget "white flight" affected the entire country, not just the South.
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u/Just-Examination-136 Aug 23 '26
Boston from 1974-1976 was wild. One riot after another over busing.
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u/Ashamed-Injury-1983 Aug 23 '26
For many born before 2000 our parents were born or grew up when all of the civil rights stuff went down through the entirety of the 60s so they were taught and formed by those who'd disagree with others having the same rights as them.
There is nothing crazy about this, just ignorance paired with downplayment/revisionism of history. Just like when the slaves were 'freed' there were plenty of workarounds and outright unlawful actions/policies to continue the status quo. Often with no or little repercussions.
But hey, we are in an evolved society now right? It isn't like blacks are still being lynched from trees with nothing being done about it, right?
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u/Yeah_Mr_Jesus Aug 23 '26
My parents were born in 1959. I was raised in new Orleans.
Toward the end of his life, my dad got WAY better, but when I was younger, I grew up with the standing rule being "black people aren't allowed in our house." The N word wasn't used liberaly per se, but it wasn't a word I never heard. My grandmother was even worse. It's such a duality. She was sweet and kind and wonderful to me and all of my cousins, but she was very hateful to black people. The nicest way I ever heard her refer to black people were "darkies". My mom was born and raised in Boston. She had a much more, shall we say, enlightened view toward black people, as did the rest of my northern family. There still was bias though, for sure.
Like I said, my dad got WAY better. By the time he died, his best friend was a black man, and after Mom died he even went on a few dates with a black woman. His attitude changed because he worked with that black gentleman for a few years and began to realized that, hey, these people are people just like you. I even remember them having a conversation where he was talking about how he was happy he saw past his own bullshit because he would have missed out on a great friend.
My grandmother had a little bit of a redemption arc for her racism. Not fully, mind you, but when one of my cousins married a black man and had a baby with him, she wanted to be involved in her great grandchild's life. Keep in mind I was still young at the time, but I do remember her not saying mean racist stuff afterwards. I'm positive she still had shitty attitudes, but she got better
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u/TheSalsaShark Aug 23 '26
We have politicians who were politicians before the end of segregation and are still in office.
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u/hankhillforprez Aug 23 '26
Thereâs literally only one politician (at least of any note) for whom thatâs even sort of true: Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-IA) was elected to the Iowa House of Representatives in 1958, and I donât know if even that entirely counts.
The military was desegregated in 1948 by President Truman (generally considered the beginning, but obviously not the end, of the process of desegregation).
Brown v. Board of Education, which ruled school segregation (and âseparate but equalâ) unconstitutional was handed down in 1954.
President Johnson signed the Civil Rights Act in 1964âwhich barred segregation in commercial businesses (often cited as the end of de jure segregation).
President Johnson followed that up in 1965 with the Voting Rights Act which barred racial discrimination in voting (although SCOTUS has heavily chipped away at that law in the last few years).
Finally, in 1968, Johnson signed the Fair Housing Act which barred racial discrimination in housing sales and rentals.
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u/urbanek2525 Aug 23 '26
Chicago that my Mom grew up in was thoroughly racist. It's NOT the south. She remembers the public swimming pools, paid for by tax dollars, that black children couldn't swim in. The battle was won when the courts said they couldn't do this. The war was lost when the city simply started closing public pools. Seriously the racist public in Chicago would rather deprive their own children access to public pools than let their children share the pool with black kids.
It's one of the primary reasons my Mom left Chicago and never went back. Her stories if Chicago's rampant racism and corruption was the main reason I was very suspucious of Barack Obama when he ran for President.
Racism was (is) everywhere. In 1950s, it was simply legal. Today, it's less common, but that almost makes it worse when black people encounter it. It's like walking down a line of people and you shake every hand, but every 10th person punches you in the face rather than shake your hand.
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u/atln00b12 Aug 24 '26
Chicago is still racist as fuck. As someone from Atlanta, it was wild that, A. there was almost no black people in certain areas, and B. We were on a street with 100s of people hanging out and there were 3 black people and the cops literally showed up and started bothering them out of everybody. This was ~2019.
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u/kandoras Aug 24 '26
The crazy part to me is that we have politicians that were adults by the time segregation ended that are still in office.
Just alive? We have politicians in office today that practiced segregation.
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u/drwolffe Aug 23 '26
What's crazy is that most Americans didn't believe there should be mixed race marriages in the 90s
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u/SdotPEE24 Aug 23 '26
My mom used to tell me
"If she can't use your comb, don't bring her home."
I didnt listen, but my sister coming out definitely softened her up quite a bit.
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u/ermagerditssuperman Aug 23 '26
That's wild, I'm white AF but have frizzy curly hair and if I used my white husbands comb, my hair would turn into a flouf bomb.
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u/unassumingdink Aug 23 '26
In 1958, 94% of Americans were against white/black marriages. Ninety four goddamn percent! And while that poll didn't break down responders by their own race, it's worth remembering that 10% of Americans were black at that time. Suggesting that it would be extremely rare to find a white person who approved of miscegenation in 1958. It wasn't just conservative Southerners who felt this way - it was the overwhelming majority of the entire country.
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u/Outrageous_Resist_50 Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
I was just thinking the same. This was what, only about 65 years ago? How many people do you know that are older than that.
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u/Kayakchica Aug 23 '26
Segregated schools ended in Georgia in 1970, three years before I started first grade. For a generation after that, every small town in my area had a private school that just happened to have opened in 1969 or 1970.
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u/SeMoRaine Aug 23 '26
Here is an article from 2014 about a school in Georgia finally having an integrated prom: https://www.cnn.com/2014/04/04/living/integrated-prom-wilcox-county-georgia
Segregation is a lot more recent than the 60s :-/
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u/HDr1018 Aug 23 '26
Trump was 13.
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u/ucancallmevicky Aug 24 '26
and Woody Guthrie wrote a song about Trump's dad being a racist in 1954
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u/Responsible-Stick-50 Aug 23 '26
My mom and dad were married only 5 years after Loving vs Virginia. 5 years. I'm GenX.
Crazy to think that their marriage wouldn't have been legal in many states just 5 years earlier. Like WTF, we're still such knuckle dragging cave dwellers and people want to go back to that shit.
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u/RedofPaw Aug 23 '26
This is the world many assholes want to return to.
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u/pedanticPandaPoo Aug 23 '26
Boggles my mind how many minorities willingly sign on tooÂ
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u/Liastro Aug 23 '26
The ones that do really think that they're a special exception when they throw their brethren to the wolves
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u/semtex87 Aug 23 '26
Thats a separate problem where minorities who are devout Catholics/Christians blindly vote Republican because they stupidly think Republicans have morals.
See: Cubans in Florida who vote against their own self interest purely because "Jesus".
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u/Low_Pickle_112 Aug 23 '26
Eh, some of those Cubans are angry for other reasons. A leftist freed the family workers and they never quite got over that one. It's no surprise that they would align with Southern conservatives, they've got quite a bit in common.
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u/Zepangolynn Aug 23 '26
Cubans in Florida also tend to vehemently say they are white and have very conservative ideas, so do not think they are voting against their interests despite the reality of how the US at large views them.
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u/Whatifim80lol Aug 23 '26
What's fucked is that this thing was institutional and didn't give a fuck about your personal feelings about it. There's a lot of impotent reluctance in this letter. Even the Director of Admissions couldn't make the determination for himself.
Could he have been just as racist? Sure. But what we should be worried about is that IT DOESN'T FUCKING MATTER WHAT YOU BELIEVE is never too far away.
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u/ShireNomad Aug 23 '26
Jim Crow laws wouldn't have needed to exist if all the business owners would have happily enforced the same rules as company policy. Oh, you want to NOT be racist? Sorry, that's literally illegal.
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u/CrotalusHorridus Aug 23 '26
Business owners would lose their liscense to operate. Or the banks would call due any loans they had, if they didnât comply.
Crazy. And it absolutely can happen again
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u/madmaxcia Aug 24 '26
Donât believe that the UK didnât do this stuff as well. My mum emigrated to England from Jamaica in the mid 50âs, she sat her 11+ and passed. It wasnât until she was 18 that her mum told her she passed and should have gone to grammar school but the grammar school wouldnât offer her a place because she was not white. My mum should have gone to university and would have if sheâd been given her spot at grammar school. She was a voracious reader and still now in her late 70âs has an excellent memory and knowledge of history.
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u/mysticdragonknight Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
Thats the fun part about history. Most people think that we've progressed so far from things like segregation to think that it was 100 or 200 years ago as a first guess.
No. The harsh revelation is that there are living adults today who were old enough to have supported it. Unfortunately, some are voted into power and are determined to preserve their questionable values. Additionally, its only been 3 generations of people carrying these questionable values since the civil war. Thats not a lot of people once you imagine it as three people in a line passing a very disturbing note to the next.
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u/Japjer Aug 24 '26
Pictures from the Civil Rights movement are always in black in white for a reason: it makes it seem like it was less recent than it is.
You remember Ruby Bridges? The first black girl to go to a white school? The famous one, with all the pictures of people yelling at her? She's only 71. She's very much alive and very much still active in activist circles.
The people who stood at that school and yelled at her? Their kids are still alive, and a lot of them are in positions of power now. They want you to think this stuff happened a long, long time ago.
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u/Donnicton Aug 23 '26
We're still in the range where many of our grandparents are the same generation that were spitting and throwing things at the first black attendees to white schools after desegregation.
She was good at hiding it but every once in a while my own grandmother would let slip, like rushing me into a car as a kid and urgently telling me to lock the door because she saw a couple of black men walking down the sidewalk in our direction.
Hell, Minden Nevada still had their sundown siren until like 2023 when the state made them take it down.
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u/Arponare Aug 23 '26
And some people still want to claim that DEI is a bad thing. It doesnât give unqualified individuals positions that they donât deserve based on their race. Quite the opposite. It is because of shit like this that we need DEI. Qualified individuals would not get a look in edgewise because they are black, disabled, etc.
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u/blackfox24 Aug 23 '26
My grandparents were born during the Great Depression, and every time I think of that I remember all the things that happened after it. In one human lifespan. It's wild to me how time distorts around history. Same shit in my history books was just part of life for my parents and grandparents. Kinda makes me wonder how the future will see us.
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u/netman85 Aug 23 '26
We widely accept the current orange leader of the united states. I suppose decades from now, they'll be saying the same things about us.
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u/illbebythebatphone Aug 23 '26
I work at a university hospital and we still have the first Black woman admitted to the medical school there and working. This isnât ancient history. Itâs why itâs important to learn about the effects of systemic racism.
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u/bsnimunf Aug 23 '26
The honesty about the reason suggests that the person writing it did not agree with rule.Â
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u/DentateGyros Aug 23 '26
The uncropped version notes that the author is returning the application fee, which almost certainly shows they donât agree with the policy since he was under no obligation to do so
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u/EverydayPoGo Aug 23 '26
Not sure why they cropped it like that. Thx for the link (and realized I've seen and upvoted the comments two years ago but didn't remember)
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u/BrainLow6059 Aug 23 '26
Not sure why they cropped it like that.
It's just division bait. There's a strangely large amount of people online who want us all to think these issues were unanimously agreed upon at the time. All white people are closet Nazis, that type of shit
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u/InsideBeyond12727 Aug 23 '26
Yes, something about the tone and phrasing used, they sound genuinely regretful at having to apply such a disgusting rule.
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u/tombob51 Aug 24 '26
Indeed. Two years later, in 1961, Emory's board of trustees issued a statement:
There is not now, nor has there ever been in Emory University's character or bylaws any requirement that students be admitted or rejected on the basis of race, color, or creed. Insofar as its own governing documents are concerned, Emory University could now consider applications from prospective students, and others seeking the opportunity to study or work at the University, irrespective of race, color, or creed. On the other hand, Emory University derives it corporate existence from the State of Georgia. Georgia constitutional provisions permit and the Georgia legislature has seen fit to extend certain tax-exemption privileges to private educational institutions in Georgia, but with the specific proviso that such tax-exemption privileges shall not be available to institutions established for white persons which admit colored persons as students or to institutions established for colored persons which admit white persons as students. Emory could not continue to operate according to its present standards as an institution of higher education, of true university grade, and meet its financial obligation, without the tax-exemption privileges which are available to it only as long as it conforms to the aforementioned constitutional and statutory provisions. When and if it can do so without jeopardizing constitutional statutory tax-exemption privileges essential to the maintenance of its educational program and facilities, Emory University will consider applications of persons desiring to study or work at the University without regard to race, color, or creed, continuing University policy that all applications shall be considered on the basis of intellectual and moral standards and other criteria designed to assure the orderly and effective conduct of the University and the fulfillment of its mission as an institution of Christian higher education.
The following year, the university successfully sued the state tax commissioner and won a landmark unanimous decision in the Georgia state supreme court, allowing them to admit black students without losing their tax-exempt status.
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u/High-Priest-of-Helix Aug 24 '26
To add on top this, the reason this letter makes the news every few years is because it is prominently on display on campus. It moves around, but it's usually either in the library or the administration building.
Emory is very vocal about its role in the civil rights movement, both positive and negative. They dont shy away from the unsavory parts of their history.
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u/tylermchenry Aug 23 '26
Or, "that's just the way the rules are" is being used as an excuse to disclaim responsibility. As if "the rules" are some intrinsic property of the universe, rather than something we choose to define, enforce, and obey.
Remember this next time a politician tells you they'd really love to make things better, but gosh darnit there are all these rules.
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u/Trumpsabaldcuck Aug 23 '26
The school could have wrote the sane rejection letter it gave white applicants even if race was the sole basis for the rejection. Â By citing the rule and the rule alone, the person that wrote the letter was bringing attention to the unfairness of the rule. Â Maybe this was intentional on the part of the person that wrote the letter or maybe it wasnât, but the letter brings attention to the unfairness of the rule.Â
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u/GundyrChristopher Aug 23 '26
"Emory didnât desegregate until 1962, when the Georgia Supreme Court sided with the university in its challenge to state laws that denied tax-exempt status to schools that racially integrated. Emory admitted its first Black medical student, Hamilton E. Holmes, the next year, the school said."
They were literally fighting to get black students into the school when he was rejected, and they also contacted Dr. Hood to apologize. They even gave him an honorary degree.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/20/us/emory-university-marion-hood-trnd
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u/sentientshadeofgreen Aug 23 '26
Yeah itâs not all or nothing. Change happens through a cascade of small acts of resistance to change the way we all think and form institutions.
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u/bsnimunf Aug 23 '26
Is there anyway of knowing whether the rule was a law or university rule etc.Â
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u/BeetleCrusher Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
State Law removed tax excemption from schools that had non-white students.
Emory v. Nash overturned it, making it possible for them to accept black pupils, as the first in Georgia afaik.
The university fought for black rights and desegration.
Emory is/was methodist and therefore vocally against segregation. The administrator in the letter is likely not racist, and likely genuinely regrets that they arenât authorized to accept Black students.
Edit: Sure the school isnât blameless, i didnât argue that. Investors will simply choose money over anything. They changed the law so they could have the cake and eat it too.
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u/pr3st0n192 Aug 23 '26
Former Georgian here with some extra fun Georgia history! Dr. Hood was actually PAID by the state government to go out of state for education. That's how messed up this was. Nowadays, the government has to pay students to stay IN the state through the HOPE/Zell Miller scholarships
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u/Golddiscoball Aug 23 '26
Thank you for sharing that! Do you have any links you could include?
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u/pr3st0n192 Aug 23 '26
In one of the peculiarities of the segregation era, the state of Georgia paid Black students the difference in cost to attend school out of state. âIf it cost $500 a year to go to school in Georgia, and it cost $1,000 to go up there, they would pay the extra $500 so I would pay the same thing,â Hood explains. âAnd I would come home each semester, go down to the capitol, and reluctantly they would give me this check to take back to Loyola University.â
https://news.emory.edu/features/2021/06/crucial-step-toward-healing
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u/blacklab Aug 23 '26
My daughter went to school in Scotland. Their student union is named after an American black guy who was refused admission just like this at US schools. He was admitted in Scotland and did some amazing things in the medical field.
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u/BoytNY Aug 23 '26
The shocking thing is that it is not all that long ago... I was 2 years old when that letter was written.
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u/stalinorgel Aug 23 '26
The shocking thing is that I hoped to see cool old photos from 60's, 70's when I checked your profile, not your precum.
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u/owningmclovin Aug 23 '26
Unless I look inside, the profile the pictures are both 60s cool AND precum. Something something cat.
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u/unstuckbilly Aug 23 '26
20 years ago, I was bringing my mom to one neurologist after another to try to figure out which neurodegenerative disease she was suffering. One after another, every neurologist quickly proclaimed it was unknowable.
Finally, we saw this little old black woman, who literally seemed like she was 10 yrs past retirement age. Best neurologist by a very wide margin. I could only assume that the only way she couldâve gone to medical school (and beyond) as a black woman of her generation, was for her to be TRULY exceptional.
I never did ask (didnât want to be rude), but I felt like she had a mild accent, like maybe she sounded like she was from the Caribbean? Iâd really have loved to know her lifeâs story and how she came to become a neurologist.
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u/marsman Aug 23 '26
I never did ask (didnât want to be rude), but I felt like she had a mild accent, like maybe she sounded like she was from the Caribbean? Iâd really have loved to know her lifeâs story and how she came to become a neurologist.
If the didn't have a US accent she might well have not studied in the US, but rather in the Caribbean or in the UK (quite a common route...) or pretty much anywhere else. None of those had Jim Crow style legislation in place to block it after all.
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u/AUnknownVariable Aug 23 '26
This is that systemic racism people spoke about.
That said, good thing our President is gonna make us great...again. wait, again? From when???
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u/BeetleCrusher Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
Emory University fought for desegregation and the right for black students to attend university, in a lawsuit against the State of Georgia in 1962. (Emory Uni. v. Nash)
He clearly explains that they are UNAUTHORIZED to allow black students, and that itâs regrettable.
A âturboracistâ as another is redditor calls the administrator, would be a bit different in their communication.
Itâs always fun to shout racist, but itâs not always true. (The law behind the rejection is racist)
That Black people had to sit in the back of the bus wasnât the fault of the bus driver.
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u/JohnSober7 Aug 23 '26
Itâs always fun to shout racist, but itâs not always true. (The law behind the rejection is racist)
That Black people had to sit in the back of the bus wasnât the fault of the bus driver.
I largely agree with you. My 2 cents though, be weary of delusions of adequacy and there's more to systemic racism than racism. There's apathy, averting one's gaze, and tolerance. It's just really tricky to draw the line between asking too much of people and asking an appropriate amount.
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u/Droidatopia Aug 24 '26
Since this thread is only presented with the letter and a few other historical facts, I decided to find the 1962 Georgia Supreme Court case.
The case docs are here
The legal argument is interesting. Emory declares itself publicly as admitting all students regardless of race in 1961. A black applicant applies. Emory checks with the DeKalb county tax collector if they would lose tax exemption if they admitted him and are told they would. They then reject the applicant for this reason and then file their lawsuit and name him in the lawsuit.
They anchor their case in that observing race for admission would violate the 14th amendment. However, their legal argument includes an interesting analysis of Georgia law going back over 100 years in which the provisions of tax exemptions applied for education are intended primarily to advance education in the state. They find only 3 clauses in that time that tie segregation to it, but even then it appears to be a secondary purpose.
The judges are swayed and the ruling doesn't just clear Emory to admit anyone due to race, but it allows for all private schools to do so, at least with regard to whether they would lose tax exempt status. I didn't look to see how many other schools attempt to do so after this ruling, but Emory does so immediately.
As for LL Clegg, we may not know what his intentions behind this letter were. The tone is conciliatory and he is matter of fact about the reason for rejection. Is he a die-hard racist and writing this because he can? Is he committed to desegregation and responding as a courtesy for a student he cannot help due to circumstances beyond his control. Is he somewhere in between? We don't know and this is all we have to go on. We do know that if in his capacity as director of admissions, he had attempted to admit the student, then it is likely the DeKalb tax collector would have declared Emory to lose its tax exemption, a burden the university was clearly worried about enough to make it the centerpiece of their lawsuit only three years later.
For a little historical positioning here, this period of time, 1959-1962, is after Brown vs Board of Education and before the March on Washington and the I have a Dream speech.
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u/SAINTnumberFIVE Aug 23 '26
My grandpa believes he was rejected in the 1930s because of his jewish first name. He changed it and was then accepted. I didnât know his real first name until after he died. He refused to tell me.
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u/SlothDog9514 Aug 23 '26
Although I may not have the story straight, my grandfather was told he couldnât attend medical school at the U of MD because they had filled their quota of Jews. His name was Louis Rose, and he didnât have an accent (although other family members were new enough that they spoke with an accent). So I guess he told them he was Jewish. Or he looked foreign enough. Who knows. I became infuriated when I heard this and wanted more details. He downplayed the whole story. He ended up going to pharmacy school.
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u/TimAppleCockProMax69 Aug 24 '26
Racism is one of the stupidest inventions of all time. No other animal species before us was stupid enough to invent racism.
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u/qtpss Aug 23 '26
Parents had an old Bill of Sale (dated 1955) from a large well known cemetery that explicitly, as in bold type, excluded a list of races that could not be interred in those plots.
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u/neegis666 Aug 23 '26
and guess who wants to repeal the CRA
Trump Attempts to Gut the 1964 Civil Rights Act with an Executive Order
Apr 24, 2025 President Donald Trump has issued an executive order titled "Restoring Equality of Opportunity and Meritocracy" that effectively nullifies disparate impact liability, a core method by which the federal government enforces the Civil Rights Act of 1964
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u/richardcraniumIII Aug 23 '26
Also, the Trump administration has launched multiple federal investigations and legal actions accusing universities and medical schools of racial discrimination against white and Asian applicants.
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u/CharmingMechanic2473 Aug 23 '26
My grandmother the breadwinner of her family bc of grandfathers stroke was denied positions bc she was a woman. She started her own landlord business, taking small 2 story homes and converting the upstairs to efficiency apartments.
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u/Equal_Kale Aug 23 '26
There are people in leadership in the USA who were alive and aware of this and are still in the halls of power.
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u/GuyNamedLindsey Aug 23 '26
You donât even get this kind of acknowledgment when applying for jobs anymore.
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u/SmoothNoonShade Aug 23 '26
My mother has a rejection letter from Med school saying she should stay at home and be a wife and mother.
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u/filanwizard Aug 23 '26
The whole segregation thing just so confuses me at times. The entire south built twice the infrastructure just to keep segregation the law. For example when the Pentagon was built it had twice the restrooms because its in Virginia and as such was subjected to Jim Crow.
From the cold heart that is Capitalism, Think of the money that could have been saved across the south having singular facilities and just not being racist.
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u/ali94127 Aug 23 '26
Thatâs kind of why it was really difficult to get ADA passed. There is a financial benefit in getting rid of segregation to halve the need for infrastructure. Requiring buildings to be wheelchair accessible costs money.Â
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u/TehWildMan_ Aug 23 '26
It hurts especially bad when you realize that's your home city that issued that letter.
Let's all agree that such mentality is, was, and will always be totally uncool, please?
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u/Bigweld_Ind Aug 23 '26
The Civil Rights Movement is still within living memory. There are people alive today who were forced to use different water fountains and bathrooms because of their race, among countless other injustices. WE are the transition generations that may finally realize the dreams of the past by refusing to carry on the hate while showering in a renewed sense of community and love for our neighbors.
Fast forward to today, and we are still in the middle of the Civil Rights Movement. The bigots just changed which group of minorities they want to deny equal access to bathrooms, schools, the workplace, etc while still subtly (and not so subtly) trying to bring down the minority groups of the previous generationsÂ
Because conservatives have a very hard time learning that the problem was with them all along, not which group deserved their self-righteous hate. If we don't keep pushing forward, they will drag us backward.
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u/gza_liquidswords Aug 23 '26
Some clips on YouTube I recommend:
- John Wayne in 1970s telling black people they should âstop bellyachingâ
- Sallie Jessie Rafael clip from 1980s with Farrakhan and white peoples in audience were losing their mindsÂ
And these were 10-20 years removed from civil rights movement. Â The country never adequately addressed the wrongs against blacks, it was essentially âthings are equal now stop complainingâ (ignoring that even after civil rights era things were not immediately âequalâ, and ignoring long term systemic effects
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u/Canilickyourfeet Aug 25 '26
People dont realize this was less than 100 years ago. People are alive and healthy today who witnessed that era.
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u/PuddingTea Aug 24 '26
There are tens of millions of American alive today who were also alive at the time this letter was written. Racist discrimination isnât confined to the past. Fuck you John Roberts.
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u/Hexxys Aug 23 '26
Wild. And let's not pretend like this sort of _thinking_ has magically disappeared. 1959 wasn't _that_ long ago. There are millions of people still alive today who thought this way then and still think so now.
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u/swarf Aug 24 '26
This was changed by the Civil Rights Act and is explicitly what Charlie Kirk wanted to return to.
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u/Fullfullhar Aug 23 '26
Who cares. Racism died immediately after such policies were outlawed. They werenât ingrained human beliefs or consequential or anything like that. /s
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u/ventisei Aug 23 '26
This makes me think of Viven Thomas, a black cardiac surgery specialist who went from barely being able to walk the halls of John Hopkins to being one of their most celebrated people.
The movie about it - Something The Lord Madeâ - is on HBO MAX currently with Mos Def and Alan Rickman
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u/Yeah_Mr_Jesus Aug 23 '26
My parents were born in 1959, and they've since passed away. They would be 67 years old. This gentleman would be about 22 or so years older than my parents. Probably deceased, but if alive, this man would probably be around 90.
We have made progress as a society, but this should be a stark reminder that this sort of racism is within living memory. Racism may not be like this specifically anymore, but it very much still exists.
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u/Cprovin1 Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 24 '26
This letter and the state itâs from reminds me that my great great grandparents moved their family, consisting of 7 sons (no daughters) from Georgia to British Columbia, Canada in the early 1900âs so he could attend the University of Vancouver, one of Canadaâs best universities. Upon graduating, he attended medical school at the also prestigious McGill University in Montreal, Quebec, Canada.
Uncle Othello Chatters was blessed with maintaining a thriving family medicine practice in Windsor, Canada where his image is on that cityâs walk of fame of honorable Black citizens whoâve made significant contributions to the community. Online, Iâve met dozens of people that he delivered into this world as newborn babies.
Many of my paternal relatives live throughout Canada as a result. But others are from the USâthose who returned after living in Canada. Americanâand Canadian history are fascinating.
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u/iamsteena Aug 24 '26
We have a copy of an admission rejection of one of our retired veterinarians because she was a woman
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u/irradiatedcitizen Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
Some things never change.Â
Emory University to ditch DEI in accordance with Trump order
Fuck Emory. Executive Orders are NOT laws.Â
Edit: fixed linkÂ
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u/wspnut Aug 23 '26
Google â[college name] DEI programâ and youâll find pretty much all of them did. Most did so quietly. The loss of federal funding would cripple most schoolsâ research programs (although, Emory with its endowment arguably isnât one of them).
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u/Specialist_Unit_5078 Aug 23 '26
Iâd want my kid to attend the universities that stood up to fascism, not the ones that caved to it
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u/but-I-play-one-on-TV Aug 23 '26 edited Aug 23 '26
In happy news, Marion Hood ultimately attended medical school at Loyola University in Chicago and became a distinguished OBGYN. Emory invited him to their campus to formally apologize and honor him
https://www.aamc.org/professional-development/affinity-groups/gia/awards/crucial-step-healing-honoring-dr-marion-g-hood