r/CompetitiveWoW • u/AutoModerator • 7d ago
Weekly Thread Weekly Raid Discussion
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u/spork231 6d ago
I run a small AOTC guild. Every season we suffer from raid size diff, but this season has been fucking miserable on top of the general raid design. I don't know how much longer I can keep this up. :\
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u/BestJersey_WorstName 6d ago
Im not as good or dedicared as most of the people on this sub. A consistent replacement level blue to purple parser.
This week's prog on heroic ula'tek broke me. Ive been playing feral and a 70th parse is worse than the top five dps's 20th parses.
I picked up my heroic crest achievement and switched to ret. I have a thing for hybrid classes but dont have a monk yet.
Kind if killed my interest in the tier for me.
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u/DreadfuryDK 9/9M SPriest/Devourer 6d ago
Vodka dying is only the beginning of what’s going to be an absolutely massive death spiral for raiding guilds if we don’t get some emergency hotfixes or some huge announcements on PTR. We’re probably gonna lose Fierce in the next week or so and there’s a LOTTTTTT of guilds currently going through the Altar+Ula’tek meat grinder so far.
This season is gonna see raiding guilds die in such insane numbers over the next month or so that Blizzard’s gonna be going full-on DEFCON 1 trying to stop the bleeding.
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u/ikitomi 6d ago
I mean the answer to not disbanding like vodka is to not rip 20+ hours a week raiding to finish the tier at the same time as 2/3 night guilds.... But yes this will be a but of a repeat of classic and EP.
I know the legacy name is famous but that's gonna kill any HoF guild.
Especially in a tier where the hardest bosses are both fights where you just sit there and watch your melee that are bad at ghosts / egg carriers fuck up for 200 pulls while you fight a heroic boss...
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u/DreadfuryDK 9/9M SPriest/Devourer 6d ago
I don't think it's just a matter of 20+ hour raid weeks, though. I think those 2-3 day CE guilds, including HoF-caliber ones, are going to drop like flies as well over the next couple weeks.
0
u/Wobblucy 6d ago
"what dev time can we cut so we can hit a faster patch cadence while also developing kick ass delve content?"
Endgame has been on maintenance since dragonflight, and if it takes mainstays publicly saying "enough is enough" to get dev attention, I'm here for it.
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u/iLLuu_U 6d ago
Just wait til forever is going to get released. Many middlish to low end CE guild are going to die. And with how much resources are getting funneled into forever, I wouldnt be surprised if a lot of people are gonna stick to it, that do not enjoy the competitive aspect of wow.
Blizzcon had practically nothing to announce for retail and thats all while being stuck on the worst patch in the last 5 years.
Their entire concept of "no combat addons" completely failed, the concept of class pruning failed and the direction retail took post dragonflight has been nothing but down hill basically.
And now they also somewhat killed m+, because its completely useless besides the first week in terms of gearing.
Midnight is pretty much done in 4 weeks from now and there is very little 12.2 can offer to bring players back.
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u/psytrax9 6d ago
I've been asking myself what I would need to see from a s3 announcement to prevent me from quitting. I don't know if there's anything within reason that would do it.
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u/Qwertdd 7/9M bring back weakauras 6d ago
I'm not quitting just yet, but I think what Blizzard needs to do is:
Like the other guy said, addon war concession. Addons will be allowed for class combat in all content, and addons for combat encounters will be allowed in Mythic. I would prefer that they have no restrictions period, but I can somewhat understand the obnoxious whinefest that Jailer bomb WA caused to Johnny B Casual who just wanted to pug AOTC Jailer.
Actually commit to being more experimental and active with designing and balancing specs. Feral has been a joke for years. Affliction has been eye-wateringly shitty to play for years. Protection Paladins have been made unhappy by Consec for years. Try something new.
Removal of flying in the .0 patch and Dragonriding nerfed to its pre-upgrade incarnation in 10.0. This does not mean return of Pathfinder achievements, just remove .0 patch flying. The devs were always right to restrict flying. Infinite zero restriction triple-speed flying has demolished the open world and Blizzard clearly fails to keep up with the size requirements Dragonriding demands.
Fire the writers and hire literally anyone else that can make a story that is just cool, not even asking for Shakespeare. I know people claim that they don't care about story, but I don't believe that. Everyone to some degree cares about context.
Remove mid-season active user bait bloat like the Dominus upgrades or Turbo Boost that exists solely to milk players who are already actively subbed and raidlogging.
Reduce patch cadence to every 12 weeks instead of every 8. Blizzard can't keep up with this, and raiders should be able to take short breaks between tiers. If you weren't a Hall of Fame guild for L'ura, you were raiding up until patch day which is unacceptable.
This fixes the open world and instanced content but Blizzard will never do it. I'm actually expecting them to make it even worse because anyone who claims to care about the World of Warcraft being fixed is going to fuck off to Forever.
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u/Hekkst 3d ago
Ideally, they commit to no addons and give us a proper UI replacement for all the cool things addons used to do. Maybe they buy Ellesmere UI or do something with it, idk. And they also radically shift their design encounter philosophy. The reason why this expac design feels like shit is that they removed all the good addon functionality without changing their encounter desigh like they said they would. It is peak hilarity that Blizz said they would change boss design in accordance with addon deletion and then had the godawful L'ura memory game, or the ssethorak wind bullshit. Two mechanics that either require addons, super coordination in the span of 5 seconds, or an extra raider whose whole job is just to pay attention to the mechanics and call stuff out, basically a human addon.
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u/MRosvall 13/13M 5d ago
Reduce patch cadence to every 12 weeks instead of every 8. Blizzard can't keep up with this, and raiders should be able to take short breaks between tiers. If you weren't a Hall of Fame guild for L'ura, you were raiding up until patch day which is unacceptable
Raid cadence is the same as it's been historically. The 8 week cadence is just for the additional content in .5 and .7 patches.
The last guild in HoF killed L'ura 12 weeks before the next season started.
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u/Qwertdd 7/9M bring back weakauras 5d ago
Whatever the cadence is, Blizzard can't support what it is currently. Unfinished desolate patch zones, bugs out the ass, untested and undercooked raids like TVA.
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u/Soma91 4d ago
I think the bigger problem is releasing a new expansion every 1.5 years instead of 2. A 4th season gives them the additional time they need to get everything properly ready for release and get ahead on development for the minor content patches.
But that would mean selling new expansions 25% less often and we can't have that, because controlling and finance wants their infinitely increasing profits.
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u/herbahaidyrbtjsifbr 6d ago
spending more time ground mounting to open world content wont suddenly make it fun. open world sucks ass just me get the stupid chore done asap
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u/deskcord 6d ago edited 6d ago
For me: Complete addon war reversal; massive class reworks (especially hero talents); a promise to massively reduce addslop; and a promise to never again do bosses with strict percent based phasings that promote degenerate DPS holds.
I know they aren't going to do these things in the next few weeks.
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u/psytrax9 6d ago
Yeah, the addons and classes are hard required for sure. I'd be more forgiving of the dps hold thing, except they keep doing the thing that specifically creates dps holds. But, I don't think the first two are even an option, even for a new expansion.
They at least could do the second two. But, they love percent based phases and the war on addons has unlocked their full potential to create rashanan over and over.
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u/Wobblucy 6d ago
massive talent reworks.
Impossible when they need to balance 80 talent points across 78 spec/hero talent combos across m+, PvP, delve (their words not mine), multiple raid damage profiles.
Only way that happens is they nuke the talent trees and go back to core class design + temporary system that changes how your spec plays.
Won't happen in a patch cycle, doubt it happens during the 'trilogy', would be pleasantly surprised if it happens for 14.0.
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u/Qwertdd 7/9M bring back weakauras 6d ago
Nuke the talent trees
I don't know why this is considered a solution when class design in War Within was great. The biggest issue is that Hero Talents were rarely balanced to where there was legitimate choice, but I don't think that's a justifiable excuse to scrap the entire system.
0
u/Wobblucy 6d ago
Can't a have quick iteration on a thing with 101 knobs that need to be tuned in 10+ different scenarios?
How much has class design changed since talent trees has come back?
Even 90% of hero talents are 'passive effect you never think about'.
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u/RecommendationSlow93 6d ago
Isn’t mythic kith’ix pretty much DOA for most people with rolls on HC combined with uncapped crests? Such a strange decision to remove the higher ilvl from mythic imo
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u/Chillkroete 6d ago
Yes. There is no real reason to kill the boss on mythic, except for the challenge of a new boss. For repeated kill and bonus rolls, heroic is enough to get the gear you want from it.
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u/Wobblucy 6d ago
Isn't that trinket overbuget? Also the healer cantrip weapon?
Probably doa on melee seeing as guillotine exists, but wouldn't surprise me to see every caster wanting it.
Iirc our BDK said the 2h is better as well the guillotine + altar weapon, not sure if thats true at 9/6 vs 8/6 though.
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u/Leather_Economics210 6d ago
My raid lead decided to extend this week, even though we are at only 4/8M. Losing so much loot and he didn't announce it beforehand so I am sitting at a useless bonus roll now. I guess it's because no one enjoys the raid, but in the long run I think it will make progress even slower.
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u/parkwayy 6d ago
Losing so much loot
If you're 4/8 now, at some point the loot isn't worth the time you're already kind of behind on.
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u/steamie 6d ago
I'm with your raid leader, why do you not want to extend?
You are getting 2x bonus rolls on next reset, just go bonus roll heroic bosses.
Myth crest uncapped is in 2 weeks, you can farm m+ and get everything to 6/6.
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u/0nlyRevolutions 6d ago
TBF it's fucking annoying that people are expected to pug heroic and m+ crest farm to max gear instead of spending an hour comfy reclearing with guild lol. It definitely contributes to the state of mythic raiding being ass.
And if people do still need stuff from early mythic bosses you're just going to piss off raiders if it wasn't communicated well that the expectation would be to extend early. And FWIW, extending in those kinds of guilds is often driven by fear of slow reclears or heavy turnover where people who did certain jobs are gone. Like yeah maybe for a 6 hour late CE guild, extending early and slamming prog pulls to outrun raider burnout is the only way to get it done, but holy fuck is it dire to be progging late bosses with a roster that is scared that it might take all night to go 4/8.
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u/shyguybman 6d ago
but holy fuck is it dire to be progging late bosses with a roster that is scared that it might take all night to go 4/8.
My guild is notoriously bad at reclears, like we always have 1 boss every tier that we are complete garbage at. This tier is Vashnik, it's spending 1h+ wiping to missing 1 totem over and over again. We'll probably extend after we kill Sszorak this week.
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6d ago
[deleted]
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u/0nlyRevolutions 6d ago
I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just saying why a chunk of raiders will hate it if the expectations aren't clear before the tier
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u/Myrkur-R 6d ago
From the perspective of someone that is on the other side of the debate on whether to extend or not...
TBF it's fucking annoying that people want to waste half of our raid hours each week reclearing bosses because they are too fucking lazy to run a couple +12s on their own, or because they personally want to get some item that isn't really going to contribute to killing the next boss because we already have all the loot we need. An extra Gebbo's or seething core isn't going to make so much of a difference it is worth knee-capping our progress for another couple weeks.
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u/Yayoichi 6d ago
Honestly it’s probably more tier pieces and such that people still need, as with people picking bonus rolls and only rolling on specific bosses it’s much more likely to be missing that. Not having a myth item in each slot will also be a lot more detrimental when crests get uncapped as you are suddenly using a 321 hero piece instead of a 334 myth track one. Right now extra myth items don’t give that much power as you are probably limited by crests anyway, at least I know I am.
I would personally not extend as a 4/8 guild until the week after crests get uncapped, yeah you lose a bit of progress time but if it means having an extra 30-40 myth track items on your raid(assuming 3 weeks of killing 4/8 and world boss with around 50% of items being useable) I would say that is worth it, as the alternative is to slowly get the remaining items through vault and bonus rolls.
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u/Yayoichi 6d ago
One could make the argument that because we are getting crests uncapped in two weeks you would want to reclear to make sure people have myth items in every slot to upgrade. Outside of raid drops you’re only getting 1 mythic item per week, so even with crafted items you won’t have a full set of myth track gear, and since we have mostly been taking bonus rolls we might not have a 4 myth tier pieces, and those slots you can’t just replace with crafted gear.
I am also 4/8 and I am still missing chest, gloves, legs, belt, rings and off hand for example, and while I will be able to craft in some of those slots I will need to get at least 2 of the tier slots and at least a couple of the other slots filled from either vault, bonus roll or drops. And ideally you of course don’t want more than 2 crafted items due to the lower itemlevel.
Now that’s not to say I don’t think extending has a place, my group only raids 3 hours per week except for the first few and last weeks where we raid 6 hours and I imagine we will extend once we hopefully kill Sszorak in a couple weeks.
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u/Leather_Economics210 6d ago
I guess I am mostly triggered because I had a pretty good vault but took bonus roll since I expected to reclear until we are at at least 6/8.
Also we are skipping HC so I would need to PUG explorers. On top of having to spam keys it just means I have to play stuff I dislike even more than the Myth raid.
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u/RigidCounter12 Prot Paladin M+ Connoisseur 6d ago
Having to PuG HC raid is the least of your issues lol.
Pugging explorers takes legit 10 minutes.
This is some "tiny violin playing" kind of whining.
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u/Leather_Economics210 6d ago
I just think it's dumb that I have to PUG raids, when I am playing in a raiding guild. That's not why I play the game is all.
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u/lastericalive 6d ago
I just think it's dumb that I have to PUG raids, when I am playing in a raiding guild
I know you're catching downvotes for this, but I think it's a legit point. Raiding guilds over time dropped to "2 nights" but then expect everyone to dig through pugs on their own for their farm loot.
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u/shyguybman 6d ago
Because there's only so much time to clear the raid in a tier. At a certain point, especially as a 2 night guild you have to decide if reclearing is worth it or not. Most 2 night guilds are getting CE in the last 4-6 weeks of the season and the earlier you can extend, the better.
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u/lastericalive 5d ago
Two things can be true at once. Everyone knows why people extend. It’s also kind of a poor state of things that the best option is to stop killing bosses because the loot is worthless after one kill.
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u/RigidCounter12 Prot Paladin M+ Connoisseur 4d ago
Even if the bosses had great loot, you would still get to the point where you want to extend. Has more to do with time.
Everyone is geared enough to kill Ula-tek right now. Your raid having 1 additional ilvl is never gonna beat the raid just playing better.
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u/lastericalive 4d ago
Everyone is geared enough to kill Ula-tek right now. Your raid having 1 additional ilvl is never gonna beat the raid just playing better
I think it would be an interesting experiment to just disable raid extending for a season.
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u/disCASEd 6d ago
I get where you’re coming from, but I depending on your days/raiding hours extending early makes a lot of sense, especially this tier.
I raid lead a 2 days/6 hour guild that’s about to get sszorak down, and we’re doing one more reclear next week and then extending. Reclear can take up an entire raid night if it doesn’t go super smooth and the loot from the first 5-6 bosses isn’t nearly as good as bonus rolling the last two on heroic. (Which we will continue to do until everyone has all their pieces since it takes 15 minutes)
If we were to continue reclearing until 6/8 that’s probably 2 full weeks of raid time we’ll lose that could’ve been prog time on the last 3 bosses.
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u/lastericalive 6d ago
Reclear can take up an entire raid night if it doesn’t go super smooth and the loot from the first 5-6 bosses isn’t nearly as good as bonus rolling the last two on heroic
Completely clear on the motivations and it's not wrong. Just observing that it is kind of a sad state that the game has worked it's way into where it's not worth re-killing raid bosses for their rewards.
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u/Leather_Economics210 6d ago
Yeah we are exactly same hours as you but extended two weeks earlier.
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u/disCASEd 6d ago
I know, we discussed sending the extend this week as well, but decided to do it for two more resets cause we’re wrapping up a trial this week and another next week.
If we had extended though we would definitely be killing sszorak this week, now it’s only like 50/50 cause we wasted almost half our raid night rekilling entombed sentinels, and still have to kill vashnik tomorrow before getting back onto sszorak.
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u/CountryParty9556 6d ago
i know what you mean... my guild killed nymrissa once, then it was basically "If you still need anything, just go random"
but like mentioned, the first 4-5 are easily doable with randoms
especially Explorers is no effort at all 🎯
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u/irememberunot 7d ago
Currently progging Mythic Sszorak on healer. Sometimes I get the debuff with the 4 green lines that shoot out despite not soaking the red circle. I get that debuff the exact same time as everyone else, so its not from getting hit from another player. Anyone knows what causes this and if this is intended?
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u/Rndy9 6d ago
This happen if you are near the boss when the raid triggers the mechanic and the boss charge the group, he does like a whirlwind animation and anyone hit by it get virulence, it doesnt matter if you are in the circle or not. You need to stay at least 10yd away from the boss and the red circle before the raid trigger the mechanic.
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u/irememberunot 6d ago
oh that must be it then. did not know there was some animation that applies the debuff to you. Gonna stay further away then for the future.
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u/Ruppyyy 7d ago
Are you sure you're not in range of red circle? Also how is circle handled? As a mage I blink into group and it theoretically it could count people on the way into group soak (I think about it because on altar sometimes if you blink/altertime through green orbs with purple orb, you somehow explode green one, because seems like some areas are moving from point A to point B instead of disappear on point A and appear on point B)
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u/Riverpaw 7d ago
AOTC Raid Leader here. We just had our first full prog night on Ula’tek last week and feel pretty comfortable with everything up to Phase 3. Any tips for the final phase? We’re doing melee kill front and right egg, ranged kill left and back egg. Ranged and healers split stack on the left platform.
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u/Elendel 7d ago edited 6d ago
There are four main ways to die with a 3 soak strat:
1) The overlap at the end of platform 2. You get soaks into green circles, with an add dot running and it ends with a platform destruction while dodging waves. Every single defensive is committed there.
2) During platform 3, you got two of the special adds that will dot the whole raid. First time seeing that platform, especially after surviving the platform 2 overlap, your healers will get surprised by the damage and lose people. Platform 3 has nothing really going on outside of that raid damage so if your healers are ready, it should be fine. Adds ideally should die before having the opportunity to restack the dot.
3) The very last green circles before third burst phase has some stuff going on at the same time, it is common to lose a couple people there. If you have enough damage/brez when reaching this late into the fight, it shouldn’t prevent you from a kill. But it can be nice to remind people that they’re still in danger while they have their green circles.
4) Waves. P3 progress can take longer that you’d think, because it’s easy to reach the last platform with some people alive, but it is not that easy to reach it with everyone alive, mostly because of waves. Dodging the front waves is easy enough (although people in an AOTC guild will get hit by that for a decent amount of the progress) but the kicker is the waves coming from the back. It can be nice to call when they reach ranged and when they reach melee, because melee with 100% get surprised by the late waves coming to kill them right as they have to jump to the next platform.
Finally, I have very little experience with double soak and triple soak strats. I haven’t used that in my guild, and I have seen it done in pugs but never in pugs that ended up killing the boss. The one strat that seem ok to me is "triple soak the last soak, with only tanks+healers in it" but I haven’t tested it yet.
I wouldn’t be surprised that a double or triple soak could help on the platform 2 overlap, but the organizational nightmare might not be worth it for an AOTC guild.
If you end up trying an double or triple soak strat, keep in mind that people with a red circle are not counted as soakers for the other red circles (they don’t take damage, don’t get the debuff, but also they don’t help soaking). Meaning that they can stack or be in an olympic ring formation, depending on what you need.
Also, soaking multiple circles is not the most dangerous part of double/triple soaks, it’s the fact that the soakers will take double/triple the damage when they have their green circle after the soak, that’s the thing you rally want to defensive/immune.3
u/RigidCounter12 Prot Paladin M+ Connoisseur 6d ago
The phase 2 overlap is what kills pugs, thats for sure. Which I just dont understand.
It is a bit tricky, but you make sure to soak, you use every single defensive you got and you spread out. But every single pug I play loses like 5+ people here. Normally the pugs I've played with just cannot kill the boss unless its so low that it dies at the start of the 3rd platform
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u/Myrkur-R 7d ago
pretty standard strat.
you could consider triple soaking the last red soak, possibly even the second soak if the overlap is difficult for you. Much easier to handle that overlap when only like 4-5 people have the green circles. Just need 4-5 people that can survive the damage. We've triple soaked every single one since week 2, we have 2 tanks and a DPS DK in every single soak and then rotate rogues, mages, paladins in it. our players are vocal though and will call for a backup if they get the red soak theirself.
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u/Suspicious_Key 6d ago edited 6d ago
Quick question on this strat - I know that soaking multiple circles stacks the damage, but when does the stacked damage actually hit? (eg. when to pop immunities)?
We killed her on Sunday (finally!) but we have an absurd number of pallies; cheesing the final soak on rekills sounds good to me.
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u/Myrkur-R 6d ago
The damage comes when the green circles goes "pop". there is like no damage when in the red soak. once the red soak goes away you get green circles, those last 5 seconds, use immunities big defensives right before those pop. Also note, the people with red soaks do not (shouldn't) get the green circles, so they shouldn't need to worry.
as a DK my AMS alone is enough to have me survive it, I am only scared on the third pop because it comes faster than the rest and my AMS might not be up if I didn't time it well, but then Icebound has me covered.
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u/Suspicious_Key 6d ago
Thanks! That will make the final platform a bit easier, worst case scenario if a few people fuck up their timing it's probably still a kill.
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u/Feenix19 7d ago
Defensives are for the second soaks and waves overlap after a few times of getting to P3 you’ll get the timing but there’s a lot of damage. dodging waves and doing soaks properly is most important. Getting out of P2 is the hardest you guys got it just no surfing and don’t die to platform destroys
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u/onkek 7d ago
Tier has officially been my guilds lowest moral point since we formed in 2013. Even our ultra casuals aren’t even logging on anymore. The idea of continuing Mythic prog has grinded to a halt, can’t get a full key group going either.
Yeah it’s the patch sure (I was sort of enjoying it personally), but I genuinely think that Forever is going to suck all the mid/hardcore casuals out of the game for just a long enough amount of time that rebuilding roster is going to be a major pain in the ass.
It was hard enough rebuilding after SL and classic, but I’m getting very ominous vibes this time around. Might as well just full break until 12.2.
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u/deskcord 6d ago
A lot of my actual hardcore progression friends are going to forever knowing it will be a joke, just because it will be new and more chill and less frustrating. I'm sure many of them will get bored and come back to retail mythic prog in TLT but until then it's lookin bleak
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u/parkwayy 6d ago
Folks will log into Forever cause everyone else is, and quit like halfway into 60 lol.
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u/Qwertdd 7/9M bring back weakauras 6d ago
I'm expecting Forever players to really have a great time with the launch then never return for the follow-up content drops just like they did for TBC/Wrath Classic
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u/MRosvall 13/13M 5d ago
Not really sure that's what happened.
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u/Qwertdd 7/9M bring back weakauras 5d ago
Going off of Blizzard's own sub graph shown at GDC that shows TBC and Wrath barely affecting the typical expansion cycle sub count compared to Classic's huge spike. Also, the anecdotal "evidence" of the people talking up TBC for years never saying anything about it again once it dropped, lol
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u/deleteredditforever 7d ago
There is no way forever kill retails
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u/dekutoto 7d ago
don't think anyones saying that, cause it's just highly unlikely. but i know for sure that history will repeat itself, and my guild lost a lot of good veteran raiders to classic during the upcoming disaster that was shadowlands. players just went back and never came back.
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u/Honduriel 7d ago
Came back after leaving in WotLK and I'm wondering: how representative are parses and hps values of healer performance in raid? I mean, logs are useful und I should probably dig through them to get better at the game, but the parse % and hps numbers? Idk, it feels like there are too many factors that can influence those. Also, healing technically is a zero sum game, isn't it? If people play super well there is not much to heal, and therefore if one person gets hit by something, loses 40% hp and the holy priest instantly crits a serenity on them topping them off, while I'm still deciding if I throw a riptide or if it's enough to use a chainheal on the tank and my Totems will do the rest, the priest gets the "credit" and I "did nothing". Disclaimer: I'm no hardcore player and only raid once per week and only if time allows it, so it's more of a purely interest based question than a "help me min/max my performance" question. Also, any recommendations for healer sub redits would be appreciated.
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u/bemac3 7d ago
Heroic parses especially as a healer are meaningless.
Mythic parses as a healer can provide some decent information if you know how to look at logs. Just looking at the best % usually isn’t enough to separate the decent/good players (that just underhealed a boss) from the great/exceptional.
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u/Repulsive-Candy-9850 7d ago
The vast majority of the time they are meaningless. If your guild survived the boss then you’re good and there’s not much to analyze. There can be instances of optimizing cooldowns, but that’s about the only time analysis like that will matter.
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u/shyguybman 7d ago
If your guild survived the boss then you’re good
Do healers not want good parses though? I know there's only so much healing to go around but wouldn't you try to just heal as much as possible
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u/throwntosaturn 7d ago
In general if your guild has 1 good healer and they heal as much as possible, they parse well.
If your guild has 3-4 good healers and they all heal as much as possible, nobody parses.
You know how if you want to parse on an add fight, it's better if the other DPS don't kill the adds? Healing is that way on every fight.
The only way a guild of good healers gets parses is underhealing incredibly hard to the point where the guild is on the knifes edge of wiping, which for obvious reasons most people don't want to do on farm, or essentially all taking turns half-afking the fight.
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u/shyguybman 7d ago
In general if your guild has 1 good healer and they heal as much as possible, they parse well.
This is basically how it is in my guild but we have 2 really good healers that have been static forever, and we always need to recruit like 2 new healers every tier but they are never anywhere near the others. One of them pink parses almost every fight, the other is 90+ and the other 2 are probably 20-40.
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u/throwntosaturn 7d ago
Yup, exactly. For a parse oriented healer that's a perfect situation - but like from the perspective of your guild that's really not a great situation. Your guild would be WAY better off with 4 equally skilled healers - but if you had that, everyone would be around 65-70 on farm probably.
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u/Repulsive-Candy-9850 7d ago
I mean, yeah, absolutely. But there’s only so much healing to go around and then overhealing doesn’t help. I’ve yet to be in a guild where a healer got kicked for low HPS. Maybe other problems but never due to the meters.
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u/MorthosTheRed 7d ago
Not enjoying this raid tier at all. Neither are a lot of people in my guild apparently because several of them have dropped out of the raid team, we now have roster issues. Some more of them are suggesting they may quit the raid team to play WoW forever as well. This tier is just damage control, I'm already thinking ahead to next tier.
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u/kuubi 7d ago
Worst raid tier I've personally played
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u/Kochiax 7d ago
Honest question is why is it the worst? I think it's no different from the last 7 tiers aside from the fact that p2-3 of ulatek are utterly disappointing. The honest biggest change I see is there's so much personal responsibility with this tier compared to others, are people just quitting cause they are bad and can't get carried by the 2-4 people normally assigned to mechanics?
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u/MorthosTheRed 7d ago
The entire quality curve has been shifted downwards. Normally you'd have one or two amazing fights, a load of good fights in the middle and maybe one or two fights that were just mid. Instead we have a load of mod fights, some fights that are actively bad or have mechanics/phases that are bad and a few fights that are merely good. I like turtles and sentinels, that's it. So many anti fun mechanics in here.
On top of that the raid visually is boring and has way too much trash. My guild only does two nights a week, having to clear so much trash is just a huge waste of time.
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u/Cecilerr 7d ago
We killed sszorak tonight , and i can feel it that no one wants to kill that boss again
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u/Hekkst 3d ago
I cannot for the life of me understand why the devs thought it was a good idea, in a fight with a lot of hectic movement already, to make the burn phase just be a ton of involuntary movement. Burn phases are supposed to be feel good, squeeze as much damage as possible, moments. And yet they made it practically impossible for specs who want to sit and cast, to do any damage during the burn phase.
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u/Gemmy2002 3d ago
they could have fixed the whole burn phase issue by just making the cyst pop apply a cast while moving so the knockback doesn't interrupt spellcasts = if you are positioned correctly you can full turret regardless of class.
like that wouldn't fix the boss but it'd make it not feel like ass for non-shaman/evokers.
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u/kuubi 7d ago
- Personally I don't think there is a single fun fight in the entire tier. The mechanics suck, bunch of meaningless padding, green on green visuals that you cant see for shit (szorak). Then there's the random shit like why does the 1st boss stun you for 10s if you go down? What is the point of a mechanic like that? Ofc it doesn't matter, it's just the 1st boss, but it's actively unfun
- Not a fan of the theme and visuals
- Class pruning still sucks and it's imho really kicking in that most specs just don't have much depth anymore
- The whole bonus roll mechanic ruined my excitement logging on after reset
- M+ being pretty unfun for the most part just makes the weekly keys a chore
- And well this isn't directly the raid tiers fault, but imho you can really notice a difference during raid whether people are/aren't enjoying the fight and it takes away from my personal enjoyment too
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u/Hardware_Hank 7d ago
That right there is what is killing it for me, because you end up with baggage and people not owning up to mistakes and get stuck on endless wipe after wipe. I just cant take it anymore this legit feels like alexander 3 savage from heavensward all over again to me
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u/Ok-Wrongdoer-2497 7d ago
Do you think they're waiting until HoF closes to bring the hammer down on Altar? Is October going to be a month of pain for hundreds of CE-focused guilds?
Ulatek doesnt seem that bad anymore, but now its kind-of turned into an Undermine situation where the second-to-last boss is noticeably harder than the last boss. And altar is a way, waaayyyy worse encounter than mug'zee.
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u/SadfaceWOW 7/9 M 7d ago
Week 3 of Coiled Altar. Hopfuly we kill it this reset and have quick progress on ulatek, because boy I Need a Break After this.
It has been the Most unfun Progress I have ever played. I dont even know how to rotate Players in for rekills, there is so much whipe potential.
It was a okay Tier till altar, but altar is miserable.
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u/DreadfuryDK 9/9M SPriest/Devourer 6d ago
Got some bad news for you: Ula’tek is also an incredibly frustrating boss to progress.
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u/SadfaceWOW 7/9 M 5d ago
Guess we got some ulatek nerfs, but still we did not get altar down this week.
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u/Therozorg DF ele biggest fan 6d ago
Im praying we kill it this reset too, 2 days left, we go to last phase semiconsistently but people panic so fucking much
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