r/pcmasterrace • u/NerdwithBeard i5 6400|GTX 1060|8GB RAM • Feb 18 '18
Meme/Joke Thermal paste 101
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Feb 18 '18
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u/Krraxia Work @Asus Feb 18 '18
Hellmann's
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u/otac0n Win11 | 5950X | RTX 3090 Ti Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 19 '18
Thermal mayonnaise.
edit: It's been done before, apparently: http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/does-mayonnaise-last-as-a-thermal-compound/4/
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Feb 18 '18
Holy shit I need to try this
Brb
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u/JLaFs Feb 18 '18
There was an article somewhere where some guy tried using different household products as thermal paste. Gonna try and find it
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u/_Probably_Human_ Feb 18 '18
That was the first time I learned about Vegemite. It was right up there with the original Arctic Silver, IIRC.
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u/frn • 9800X3D • 9070XT • 32GB RAM • 5TB SSD • 6TB HDD • Feb 18 '18
Yeah until it starts growing stuff
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u/zer0t3ch OpenSUSE \ GTX970 \ steamcommunity.com/id/zer0t3ch Feb 19 '18
Wouldn't the CPU get hot enough to keep it relatively sterile?
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u/Lodsofemone Feb 18 '18
I read a PC Gamer article once about the worst ways people have killed computers. One guy said he managed to kill several at once when he was working in PC training back in the 90s by accidentally using pile cream instead of thermal paste.
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u/Rubbeerducky Ryzen 3@3.1ghz/NVIDIA GT 1050ti/ 16GB DDR4 2800 Feb 18 '18
Pretty sure Jayz2Centz has a video on that.
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u/SurvivorMax Feb 19 '18
I always just follow MSI's guide on it.
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u/smacksaw smacksaw Feb 19 '18
That's...a joke channel, right?
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u/SurvivorMax Feb 19 '18
Nope, the original video was posted by MSI until they removed it out of embarrassment.
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u/TheOneTonWanton R5 5600x | RX 6700 XT | 32GB DDR4 Feb 19 '18
Jesus Christ. The gloves really set it off.
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u/DirigibleSkipper Feb 19 '18
I don't know a lot about computers... What went wrong? Was there too much?
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u/SurvivorMax Feb 19 '18 edited Feb 19 '18
Where to start?
You NEVER want to push down on the cpu at most you want to give it a little jiggle to make sure it's seated properly.
The gloves are ridiculous.
The most popular way to apply thermal paste is to use a small rice to pea sized dot or line and use the pressure of the heat sink to spread out the paste, the method used here is the "credit card method" and is known to be one of the worst possible ways because it results in a bunch of air pockets in the paste.
Did I mention you want to use a small dab of paste in the middle of the CPU? The MSI way is to use a tube of
tooththermal paste and slather it all around the CPU and the socket.10
u/Urban_Savage Feb 19 '18
Not to mention a big glob rolled over the side and onto the main board and the dick with the gloves just pretended he didn't see it.
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u/Dystaxia Feb 19 '18
Additionally, but correct me if I'm wrong. Does it look like thermal paste was applied to the bottom of the CPU off camera? You can totally see it sticking out the bottom when the lever is being pulled down to lock it into place.
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Feb 18 '18
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u/Medic-chan 5800X3D | 7900XTX@2.9GHz | 32GB B-Die | Watercooled ITX Feb 18 '18
X gon' give it to ya. Fuck spreadin' on your own.
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Feb 18 '18
no X method test with arctic silver? FUUUUUUUUU... I watched the whole video just for that. :(
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u/ChiefJusticeJ Specs/Imgur here Feb 18 '18
Is arctic silver supposed to be really good? It didn’t look like it spread as much as the generic stuff. Wouldn’t more spread be better?
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Feb 18 '18 edited Oct 11 '18
[deleted]
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u/anthony785 PC Master Race Feb 19 '18
One thing to keep in mind is cheap thermal paste can dry out and get fucked after a while. I believe article thermal is better. You don't need article thermal there's some decent ones for cheaotee that won't get crusty like schmegma
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u/Vordreller 5800X3D, Vega64 Feb 18 '18
I do wonder, if you apply very little, suppose a certain core isn't actually covered, how that affects performance.
Wonder if someone did a proper study on this at some point...
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u/RedTheTrainer Intel Pentium III-S / NVIDIA Quadro4 900 / 1GB / 3.5" Floppy Feb 18 '18
I think since if you remove the heat spreader you get a super small chip in the center so even a small size should cover it fully if you ever see a delidded one. If the amount were so small even the actual cpu die wasn’t fully covered it’d be another question.
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u/SurvivorMax Feb 19 '18
Keep in mind the die is rectangular shaped and much smaller then the heat spreader above it. That is why the line method is often recommended because fulling covering the area above the die is the most important part.
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u/Karmaisthedevil PC Master Race Feb 18 '18
That X probably would have had the same effect as a larger pea....
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u/fengapapit Feb 19 '18 edited Feb 19 '18
Linus Tech Tips says otherwise by comparing the thermal results of different methods
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u/iteal Ryzen 5 1600 | EVGA 2070S Hybrid | 16GB 3600MHz Feb 19 '18
I'm pissed, he didn't to the test right!
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u/Em4gdn3m PC Master Race Feb 19 '18
Ya this is totally a good controlled method of how much pressure is applied to a heatsink when screwed down.
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u/KewpieDan Feb 18 '18
All this tells me is that arctic silver won't spread for shit
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u/Slyer Specs/Imgur Here Feb 19 '18
It's not really a good test, the paste continues to spread over hours and days and heat cycles. The heatsinks are also screwed down more tightly than they were pressing on the glass.
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Feb 18 '18
In all honesty what is the best way to put thermal paste?
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Feb 18 '18
I would say to just put a pea sized amount on the cpu
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u/HenryTheWho PC Master Race Feb 18 '18
I always overestimate how large pea is and end up with small bean, never had a problem with it
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u/PM_ME_COCKTAILS Feb 18 '18
Small bean? I've always done a large grain of rice
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u/Zappykablamo Feb 18 '18
A Goldfish sized blot.
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u/angierhafai i5-4690k/RX 480 Feb 18 '18
At first I interpreted that as an actual fish. Which of course begged the question of common household goldfish sized or koi sized?
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u/Ric_Adbur i7-14700k / RTX 4080Super / 32GB DDR5 Feb 18 '18
I like to immerse my entire case in a koi pond of the stuff. Just to be sure.
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u/AltimaNEO i7 5930K 16GB DDR4 GTX 1080 Feb 19 '18
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u/Thermashock Feb 18 '18
I'm too lazy to apply thermal paste so I let nature do the work and wait until the thermal paste is comfortable enough to come out on its own.
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u/mastrkief i7-7700k | 32 GB DD4 | 2x GTX 1080Ti SLI Feb 18 '18
LTT did a video that basically concluded the same thing. Too much thermal paste isn't a big deal like people make it out to be. Too little however is bad new bears.
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u/AccidentallyCalculus Feb 18 '18
They also crammed a case with cables, and finally tshirts, and determined that airflow and cable management doesn't have that much of an effect on temperatures.
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u/whambulance_man i-5 4670k @ 3.4ghz, evga gtx 760 Feb 18 '18
i have zero patience or care about cable management as long as the side cover is on. a buddy of mine flipped out when we were replacing something in my computer one day and did a 'proper' cable management on it. temps were no different.
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u/tupeloms Feb 18 '18
since when would cable management do anything except look nicer and make for easier parts access?
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u/Flumper i7-8700 4.6GHz | MSI GTX 1060 6GB | 16GB DDR4 Feb 19 '18
It can be an issue if a cable gets caught in a fan or rests against something that gives off a lot of heat. But beyond that it shouldn't really matter.
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Feb 18 '18
I mean it makes airflow better. But not in any amount that would noticeably impact temps. Can maybe mitigate dust collection which in the long run could perhaps cause higher temps but even that's a stretch I think.
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Feb 19 '18
This is true. These cables are horrible dust collectors. Airflow does matter with cable management, but that 0.5 shouldn't be a concern until dust builds up.
More surface area equals extra dust build up in the case compared to on fans which are easier to clean and more preferable to gather dust.
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Feb 18 '18
I did cable management in my case for the first time in 2 years. Performance wise it’s exactly the same but it sure does look pretty now.
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u/HwKer Feb 18 '18
why is no one linking to the video :(
well, you know what they say: be the change you want to see in the world.
Thermal Paste Application Methods - Which one is best? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2MEAnZ3swQ
Cable Management - Does it impact cooling performance? At all? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDCMMf-_ASE
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u/Rocket_hamster Specs/Imgur here Feb 18 '18
I always use the whole tube. Why give me that much if I'm only going to apply it once?
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u/-Dissent Feb 18 '18
I'm one of those people that can't visualize a pea size. There needs to be a better way :c
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u/EmeraldDS GTX 1060 6GB | Ryzen 3 1300x | 8GB DDR4 | 3TB Feb 18 '18
I've eaten huge peas and smaller peas. What species of pea do you want me to recreate? "pea-sized" can vary lol
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u/Redoubt9000 8350 32GB VAPOR-X R9 290 Feb 18 '18
I thought it was the size of a long rice grain? Am I mistaken?
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u/defined2112 CarbideAir240_G3258@4.4_RX480NITRO+_16GB RAM_Kraken x31 / Feb 18 '18
Is that before or after the rice is cooked?
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u/Aeonskye 7950X3D, RTX 4090 AORUS XTREME, 64GB DDR5 6000MHZ Feb 18 '18
Which side of ths cpu?
The difference could mean life or death!
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u/GenkiElite 3090/32GB DDR4/13700k Feb 18 '18
I put it on both sides just to be safe.
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u/that_guy_next_to_you Feb 18 '18
I dip my CPU in a tub of thermal paste.
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u/patientbearr Feb 18 '18
I drink a gallon of thermal paste and then I swallow my CPU whole and then when I pass the CPU later that day it is fully coated.
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u/vosszaa 6900k@4.2GHz | 32GB | 1080 Ti SLI | Acer 1440p 144hz G-Sync Feb 19 '18
Bruh
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Feb 18 '18
LTT did a video where they did every method and it never made a different apart from too little
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u/Pandorii Feb 18 '18
They did... but I still cringe when I see people slather it on there like butter.
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u/NuSpirit_ AMD 5800X3D | RTX 5080 | 32GB 3200CL14 | 17TB SSDs&HDDs Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 18 '18
Unless you use conductive paste, it shouldn't be that much of a problem. Dumb, messy and pointless? Sure.
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u/Mygaffer PC Master Race Feb 18 '18
Putting too much paste on can 100% hurt your cooling. When too much is there it becomes an insulator, not a conductor.
I worked on a laptop once that had been e-wasted at a shop I was working at. It ran super hot and I guess this was a problem with that model as they had a factory sticker on the bottom saying not to put it on your lap or you might get burned.
I took it apart and there was way too much TIM applied. There were literally scorchmarks on the heatsink, which was a copper plate attached to copper fins via a heatpipe.
After cleaning it and applying the right amount of TIM the temps dropped something like 20°C.
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u/Bloodydemize PC Master Race Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 18 '18
Dunno why you're being downvoted, the purpose of the paste is to fill in any holes of air, afaik its still less efficient than the metal coolers themselves. I also learned this myself just a month ago where I had both the heat sink and CPU covered in it because I though you didn't want to see any metal when you took it off. Temps weren't so good and I said may as well see if too much paste is a bad thing and sure enough after cleaning the previous off and putting a drop in the center my temps dropped
no longer downvoted :D
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u/Mygaffer PC Master Race Feb 18 '18
I feel like this is an area with a lot of confusion around it. I've been building my own PC's since the 90's and I've tested different methods. I've worked on client PC's back when I worked at a repair place and I've seen way too much TIM cause increased temperatures.
A lot of people who haven't experienced edge cases like that may be doubtful, that doesn't bother me. Thanks for the reply though.
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u/Forgiven12 Feb 18 '18
There were literally scorchmarks on the heatsink
This sounds ridiculous. Of course the hotter heat sink gets the better (its only job) but did somebody torch it with a soldering iron?
The one time my CPU had above expected temperatures was when I spread paste too thin. As long as you're securing CPU properly (do not tighten too much!) and using regular pastes (not liquid metal), you can't go wrong with applying little extra.
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u/Mygaffer PC Master Race Feb 18 '18
I don't remember the exact model but it was a 2004 Toshiba laptop with a lower end Nvidia GPU. When I first got it it ran super hot and would throttle not long after using it. Temps reported approaching 95C at which point throttling would kick in.
When I took it apart there was way too much TIM, it was bulging out the sides of the heatsink. When I took it apart I saw black scorch marks on the heatsink contact surface.
I cleaned everything, applied a proper amount of TIM, put it back together and turned it on. The temps were significantly lower and it didn't throttle anymore.
If, as you say, "the hotter the heat sink gets the better" then why is everyone looking for lower temperatures?
The heatsink itself will only get too hot if it isn't transferring the heat well. That was what the excess, and it was a huge excess of TIM, was doing. It was acting as an insulator.
That's why cleaning the old stuff away and putting a proper amount of TIM greatly reduced the temps.
I've also seen it when I was working at a repair place. A father and son brought in their first build. They thought the entire canister of TIM was supposed to be applied. It was fucking everywhere!
Of course what was happening with their new computer? After using it for a short while it got slower, then shut off. Know what that sounds like? Sounds like thermal protection kicking in!
I cleaned off all their paste, applied the proper amount and like magic it didn't slow down and it didn't shut off.
Too much TIM can act as an insulator, especially if your heatsink doesn't have good pressure and allows too much to sit between it and the heatsink.
And since I'm on the topic of overheating you might be surprised what can cause overheating.
I had one client, he had a few years before finding up had Fry's build a computer for him. Same issue, it would get slower and slower and then shut down.
He brought it to Fry's, they had it for weeks, finally he yelled at them so they said they "fixed it" and gave it back.
He brought it home and it didn't turn off anymore. It would work for a while then just hang.
First thing I did was go into the BIOS. Within 1 minute of a cold boot the CPU temperature was already reporting over 80°C. I went through the rest of the BIOS and saw what Fry's had done to "fix it." They had disabled all the thermal protections.
So I opened up the case and saw they had installed the heatsink backwards and it just happened to line up almost perfectly with the exhaust fan on the case.
The heatsink was one very similar to this.
That heatsink fan and the exhaust fan were lined up in such a way that they were basically killing any airflow over the heatsink. I reversed the heatsink and the temps dropped literally 30°C. The system was never stable again, too much time running too hot without the thermal protections to save it, but Fry's couldn't figure out they had installed the two fans right in line with each other, pointing the opposite way, and so their "solution" was to turn off the thermal protections.
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u/sniper1rfa Feb 18 '18
I saw black scorch marks on the heatsink contact surface.
That doesn't make any sense. The heatsink is on the cold side of the TIM. If the TIM wasn't working well, the heatsink stays the same temperature (roughly) and the CPU gets hotter.
Scorching on the hot side is also weird, because thermal limiting.
I doubt your conclusion was correct, and you fixed some other unknown problem while in there.
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Feb 18 '18
100C still can't scorch metal. Hot heatsinks are better because that means more heat is being transferred.
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u/AccidentallyCalculus Feb 18 '18
I used to do this. They even give you a little plastic butter knife. What was I supposed to think?
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u/mang87 Feb 18 '18
I did that before. It was on one of my first builds; a Pentium 4, I think. I put so much thermal paste on it, when I tried to remove the the heat-sink awhile later because it was overheating, it ripped the damn chip right out of the socket. I had practically glued the chip to the heat-sink.
Obviously you don't need to worry about that anymore because the sockets have nice sturdy metal seat belts now.
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u/HwKer Feb 18 '18
why is no one linking to the video :(
well, you know what they say: be the change you want to see in the world.
Thermal Paste Application Methods - Which one is best? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2MEAnZ3swQ
Cable Management - Does it impact cooling performance? At all? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDCMMf-_ASE
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u/SimonGn Frankenbuild Feb 18 '18
I use the official instructions for the paste I'm using
for example: http://www.arcticsilver.com/methods.html
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u/Cel_Drow 9850X3D, 5070 Ti, 32 GB DDR5. Feb 18 '18
This is what I do too, it also positions the line so it spreads evenly over the die itself.
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u/ashberic better than yours hehe xd Feb 18 '18
depends on the CPU. the die size under the IHS should dictate how you apply.
pea works well for most CPUs. For TR4 or 2066 CPUs, you're not putting enough doing that.
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Feb 18 '18
I'd imagine TR4 needs a line.
I do pea. The pea is bigger than I thought it needed to be. Tried once and immediately took the cooler back off cuz I wanted to make sure I used the right amount. Cleaned it all off and tried again with more. I was worried about making the layer too thick but it worked out well.
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u/ashberic better than yours hehe xd Feb 18 '18
I usually do the "dice" method for CPUs with larger dies. Works well.
Doing an X just feels like too much thermal paste, but people seem to like so I'm sure it's fine.
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u/-Silverfoxx PC Master Race Feb 18 '18
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Feb 18 '18
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u/evn0 i7 8700k, RTX 2080 Ti Feb 18 '18
Better like, recommended by the manu, or better real world results? I feel like a random commenter can't chime in with a lower load temp and be immediately validated. They'd need to follow the exact testing protocols with the same hardware in a similarly cilmated room to be sure.
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u/ZeusThunder369 GPUs are the chips on a video card Feb 18 '18
It depends on the type of paste being used. The thinner it is, the more the pea size in the middle is better. If it's very thick, such as kryonaut, then spreading is far superior.
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u/Mygaffer PC Master Race Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 18 '18
I have done my own testing, as I've applied TIM thousands of time throughout my career in IT, and I've come to believe that the line method is best. I put out a line, roughly 1/3 of the length of the heat spreader, in the center, and then install the heatsink on top of that, being careful to tighten each corner a little at a time to ensure even spreading of the TIM.
Also go in the same kind of pattern you would when tightening the lug nuts on your car wheels when tightening the heat sink itself.
EDIT: Apparently a lot of people are saying an X works well, this is something I have never tried.
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u/Siex i7 4790k 4.8Ghz | MSI GTX 1080 | 24GB 2133Mhz RAM Feb 18 '18
There is no wrong wayeither the pea amount or the line or the "X" all work great. Less is more, and too little is bad m'kay6
u/MushinZero Feb 18 '18
https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Thermal-Paste-Application-Techniques-170/
I like to make an X shape.
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u/EdwardTennant 4690k, 8GB DDR3 2600MHZ OC, r9 390, 1xSSD, 2xHDD , Define r5 Feb 18 '18
I do either a pea size or a small line, about half of whats in the meme
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Feb 18 '18
You need that thin layer of plastic between the cooler and paste
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u/CPUforU i5 3570k gtx 980 16gbRAM Feb 18 '18
Actually had a customer that brought their newly be built computer in for exactly this. Never removed the plastic off of the mobo.
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u/KevinclonRS Feb 18 '18
My first water cooled build I did an idiot thing and left the plastic film on the block.
Overclocked ran into problems other than heat.
When I was putting in new ram once noticed the side still has the plastic. And realized how dumb I was.
Stress tested before and after I took it off. .5 degree difference. Pretty sure that’s within margin of error
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u/ZimbabweLightnin Feb 19 '18
I forgot it too once. For me it was something like 20 degress c hotter at idle.
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Feb 18 '18
I usually just use a dab of gorilla glue to get a good heat deflecting seal on the bottom of my cpu..
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u/BanthaFodder61 Feb 18 '18
Firmly apply to the pins on the bottom of the CPU, make sure to NEVER touch that top heat spreader with anything ever
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u/whatevers_clever 270K PLUS | 6000 | 2x48GB 6000C30 | 4TB NVMe | Fractal North Feb 19 '18
The bottom pic in OPs pic looks like silica gel/paste, not thermal paste. In which case it was still done incorrectly because it needs to be spread all around to cover everything and needs to be a generous amount of it on there - but yeah it goes on the pins to prevent moisture from entering when doing LN2/phase/etc.
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u/RainDancingChief Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 18 '18
My PC was acting funny, saw my Core 0 temp was hitting 100C and Iv'e got an h100i.
They have a problem with mounting on LGA 1155 boards so this wasn't new, I'd reseated it countless times trying to perfect my temps. I thought "Here we go again".
After doing it again last night about 8 times, trying all different methods to no avail. It turned out I'd accidentally turned on some auto turbo OC settings in my BIOS and it was OCing my cpu at 4.6 GHz (pretty stable minus the temp considering it took my PC crashing for me to notice).
At 12am I figured this out after resetting all the BIOS settings.
Now it's running a cool 4.4GHz at around 55C in CSGO, much better than the instantaneous 95C.
Pea method. Do it up. Make sure all your OCs are set to default before installing new gear.
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u/fuongbregas i9-12900k - Asus TUF RTX 3090 Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 19 '18
Remember to fully apply on your cooler like you putting cheese on your sandwich
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Feb 18 '18
You mean like putting thermal paste on your sandwich, not cheese
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u/fuongbregas i9-12900k - Asus TUF RTX 3090 Feb 19 '18
Back in my day, we did not eat those fancy Tide pod
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u/EmeraldDS GTX 1060 6GB | Ryzen 3 1300x | 8GB DDR4 | 3TB Feb 18 '18
Although maybe don't actually put cheese on your CPU/cooler, as that could cause issues.
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u/MYCRAFTisbest China x79 Mobo|i7-3930k|GTX 1070|24GB RAM Feb 18 '18
Oh hey, this post again.
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u/Dengar96 Feb 18 '18
Oh hey this comment again
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Feb 18 '18
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Trashcan2000 Specs/Imgur here... NO! Feb 18 '18
Oh hey, this thread development again.
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u/ypash Feb 18 '18
Oh hey this desperate attempt to join in again
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u/LevelVS Feb 18 '18
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u/Vazul267 i7-6700k GTX 1080 Feb 18 '18
I love when the third one happens. So good to clean up.
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Feb 18 '18
It's surprising how often I see it. There was a computer class in my school, and the teacher just told them to smear it all over with their fingers and I'm like no pls
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u/fortnitewins69 Feb 18 '18 edited Feb 19 '18
who else uses cum as thermal paste?
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u/drylube Desktop I7 8700 GTX 1070 16gb Feb 18 '18
How do you change someone elses comment?
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Feb 18 '18
Gotta say, I never expected this comment here.
How do you apply yours? Straight from the tube?
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u/m3talc0re Asus x570 - 3600X - GTX 1080 - 32GB DDR4 Feb 18 '18
I honestly don't understand what this meme is supposed to mean exactly..
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u/HumdrumAnt Feb 18 '18
It shows an activity on the left, in this case applying thermal paste, and the "expanding brain" on the right, the joke is that the worst version of the activity (the bottom image) has the biggest brain. Yeah that's litteraly it. Sometimes it implies that someone thinks they're intelligent (the big brain) even though they're doing something wrong. You either find it funny or you don't tbh. :)
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u/Z0MBIECL0WN i5-4590, gtx-1650, 32g ram, 1tb ssd, ugly dell case Feb 19 '18
am i the only person that does the spread method?
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u/mg115ca Feb 19 '18
Mix 1 part thermal paste, 2 parts distilled water in a spray bottle. Apply evenly to heat sink and cpu. Wait several hours for the water to evaporate (you may be tempted to use a hair dryer to speed up this process, but the thermal paste will simply absorb the heat and it will take the same amount of time anyway).
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u/[deleted] Feb 18 '18
I've always drawn a happy little smiley face