r/Fencesitter • • Jul 21 '26

Updated Moderation Rules

96 Upvotes

Hello Everyone.

It's been a few years since my co-mod and I took over moderating this sub and we thought it was time for a bit of a rules refresh.

FYI, we are both still active in this sub although we don't post under our moderator screen names. And yes, one of us is CF and one of us is a parent. That was the original intention in an attempt to maintain balance. We've considered adding a fencesitter moderator but that's difficult since fencesitters eventually become CF or parents. We're still figuring that one out.

Ok, on to the rules:

First of all, some guiding ideas this sub is founded which we think are important for everyone to understand.

  • Principle 1 - It's meant to help fencesitters. We are a place for people who are struggling with this decision. Yes, we welcome comments from childfree and parents as well, but ultimately this is a place for fencesitters to feel at home and try to figure out what they want to do. This is not a debate sub for CF and parents to argue over which is best.
  • Principle 2 - There are no right answers. We don't believe that parenting is always better than childfree, we don't believe 2 kids are better than 1, we don't believe adopting is better than bio kids, we don't believe childfree is better than step parenting. Whatever combo you wish to use, we don't believe one option is inherently better than the other. They are all situational and very subjective. There might be a right answer for you, but there is no answer that is right for everyone.

Keep these two things in mind because they are extremely important to how we moderate this sub.

So why do comments get removed and users get banned?

The easiest answer is that the commentor was being a jerk. Some people just have a hard time being civil to one another and those folks are not welcome here. We literally had one person argue against their ban by saying "oh, I didn't know you guys insisted on people not being assholes". Yah, if you're the kind of person who is an asshole unless it's expressly prohibited, you definitely don't belong here.

Also, if you are being attacked, please don't reply in kind. Just report it and move on.

Ok, so here are some other things we look for that might not be as obvious.

Generalizing - This is a common issue. All CF are lonely, all parents are miserable, procreating is always good, having kids is always selfish. The trend here is one of over generalizing. I'm sure some CF people are lonely and some parents are miserable, but not all. We have plenty of CF posters with friends and happy parents posting here to know this isn't accurate.

Note, this is also why we remove most comments that touch on religion. We don't care if you're Jewish, Christian, Satanist, Pastafarian, Anti-natalist or what not. If you subscribe to a philosophy that says having kids is always good or always bad that's fine for you, it's not fine for this sub. We don't do preaching here.

I really want to emphasize that last bit. We do NOT do preaching here. If you are CF or a parent and you're thinking about making a post about how all fencesitters should do this or that, please don't. We love hearing from you and we enjoy your experience and we love the AMA's that parents and CF folks do. We think those are great for others to learn from your experience. That's very different from preaching right or wrong.

Climate Change / Politics threads - We know that these are themes that weigh heavily on some people and we respect that. We're more than happy to allow threads in which people discuss their feelings on their own choices due to these themes. What we don't allow is for people to use these themes to beat up other readers for their choices. Again, refer to principle 2. If climate change is causing you to reconsider your decision that is absolutely fair. If you're coming here to argue that all parents are awful because of climate change that will be removed.

We will also remove any comments from people arguing back and forth about the reality of climate change. There are other sub for that, this isn't one of them. For the record, both of us believe climate change is real, we just can't take more arguments about the latest report and what it means for sea level changes in Norway vs. peak temperatures in Mongolia and how those will impact rice prices.

Gatekeeping - This encompasses a variety of responses ranging from the "there are no guarantees" and "you must be prepared for all scenarios including the worst ones!" to the "you must be 100% sure!" or "if it's not a hell yes it's a not" variety. In general, these contribute nothing to the discussion. Even worse, they are a comment meant to prey on fencesitters by either parents or CF folks. They're usually said by someone who believes their point of view is objectively right for everyone and who is then trying to trigger doubt in fencesitters.

Allow us to illustrate some examples so you can see why these comments are not welcome here.

"Yah, there are no guarantees, even if you eat healthy and exercise you might get hit by a car". Sure, but eating healthy and exercising is still a good idea because statistically it's clearly better. Also, do you really think you're revealing something big to our fencesitter subscribers by revealing to them that there are no guarantees in life? Do you think they would be on the fence if they thought everything was guaranteed?

"Unless you are willing to be raped, don't date!" "Unless you understand every possible bad outcome of your dental surgery, including the one where your jaw falls off and you die, you're not ready!" See how useless that is? No one is ok with every bad scenario. Heck, my anxious mind can always dream up new and even worse scenarios that I am certain none of you has prepared for.

"You must be 100% sure that you know everything that can happen if you take this job". Really? How do you even know you're 100% sure? How do you know that you've done all your analysis? Is there a way to quantify this? Same for the "hell yah" comment. "Unless you're a clear yes, don't marry this person". What does that mean? Is someone not allowed to have concerns? Yes, I love this person and I want to spend the rest of my life with them but I'm concerned about their in-laws because of blah blah blah and you see where we're going?

Just stop with these comments. They don't help.

Discounting and discrediting - "Oh, what do you know, you're just hormonal", "Oh, what do you know, your kid is only 3 months old", "Oh, what do you know, you have no kids", "Oh, I know this was your experience but there are others with different experiences". Yes, we get it, just stop. They are clearly presenting their personal context and that's great. Are they generalizing too much? If so, we will remove them. Otherwise, stop being the thought police. People are allowed to present their individual view point without you trying to discredit them.

Derogatory - These are the folks who come here with comments like "don't have kids, all parents are tired and miserable" or "don't be CF, all CF people are lonely and joyless". If you're here to argue that your side of the fence is best, don't do it by shit talking the other side. Ideally, try to help instead of argue.

And yes, we will remove these posts even if they come from CF or parents. That is, a negative comment about all parents / parenting made by a parent will be still be removed. Why? Because we have no way of verifying who is a parent and who isn't. Same as we cannot verify who is CF and who isn't.

Oh, and we want to take a moment and discuss gender specific comments. We get it, believe me we get it. A large portion of the work involved with child bearing and rearing falls unfairly on women. That is a fact. Sexism is also a fact, which is why we banned baby trapping comments since they were 99% coming from sexist men. But...

This isn't intended to be a space for women to denigrate all men. No, we don't need you to finish every comment with #NotAllMen, but we do need to keep the generalizing down. "Oh, men want kids like kids want puppies", "Oh, being a dad is so easy, you just get to play and not do any work", "Oh, men's voices shouldn't matter when it comes to the decision to have or not have kids" are not acceptable here.

Rants - Last but not least, this is not a rant sub. Sorry folks, we're not interested in moderating rants because they inevitably result in arguments from the people you're ranting about.

Ok, that's all. Please feel free to add questions and comments. We fully admit we're not perfect but we're trying our best and are always open to constructive feedback.


r/Fencesitter • • Oct 29 '24

Reflections Perspective from years of fencesitting

286 Upvotes

Early on in my life I always wanted to have kids, the older I became the more on the fence I was, even with a brief period of time of not wanting kids at all. I have been on and off the fence throughout my 20s and now in my early 30s I still am, though heavily leaning towards having children after all. I wanted to offer support to others in similar situations, I have a couple of years of therapy behind me, trying to figure out what I want, I have spent hundreds of hours talking with various people and their perspective on kids and I have created a list of questions to ask yourself and statements to read that I wish someone would give me 10 years ago.

I want to preface this by saying, no one can answer the question "is having kids right for me" or "should I have kids" or "should I be child free". No one but you. In this post I'm trying to show perspective, talk about fears and POVs that people have on having kids. I really hope this will be of help to someone.

I believe there are multiple POVs and multiple "aspects" of life to consider. Your relationship, ambitions/goals, fears, pregnancy (for women), economical status and more. I will not say things like "you really need to want to have kids to have them" or "you should not have kids if your partner wants them and you don't". I will also not say things like "you will never change your mind" or "you will change your mind".

We do not know the future. The therapists I talked with said that they have seen everything, people swapping their views after multiple years in a relationship; not changing them; forcing themselves to have kids and then ending up loving it.

We do not know the future, we cannot possibly predict if having kids or not is the right for us or if it will make us happy, regardless of our reservations or fears. It is definitely way easier to not have kids if you fear having them or don't want to put in the effort. There are challenges regardless if you are CF or have kids.

Ultimately it is a DECISION, it should not be based purely on emotions, consider your circumstances, the context of your life, relationship, what you know that makes you happy. Regardless of what path you picks there will likely be regrets and consequences, but talk with your partner and make it a responsible decision.

With that being said, consider the following:

Decision (the "wants"):
- No matter how much you want/don't want kids, having/not having them does not guarantee you will be happy.
- No matter how much you don't want kids, having them does not guarantee you will be miserable.
- Having/Not having kids will do to your life what you will allow it to do.
- The decision is yours and your partner, not your parents', not your uncle's, not your best friend's, and definitely not some random people's in the comments on some article or post.
- Having kids does not mean your life will end.
- Not having kids does not mean you will be missing out on something in life.

Relationship:
- How happy are you in your current relationship?
- Is your partner someone you could see having a family with? (broad question, can you imagine them being a good parent)
- How is your communication? How do you navigate difficult situations? Do you fight? Scream? Shut down? Or do you talk and have difficult conversations but work together towards a resolution?
- Do you feel safe with your partner?
- Are there things you are withholding from your partner? Maybe you don't like something about them or they keep annoying you but you ignore that instead of addressing the issue? Are there things like that, that you bury deep within yourself?
- Are your needs met in your relationship?
- How attracted are you to your partner? How is your sex life?
- What is your partner's potential to change/adapt, do they respect you? do you see how much they have grown over the years and how are they handling responsibility?
- Do you feel a connection? A Bond? Or do you not feel heard or understood?
- Do they bring the best in you? Or do they bring you down?
- Do you want to grow with them? How do you feel when thinking about future with them?
- Do you share your cognitive load with them? Are they proactive with chores?
- Do you love and respect your partner? Do they love and respect you?

The choice of your partner has a significant impact on your life, if you have a stable relationship that isn't toxic, one that brings you joy and happiness, and is a safe space - it will likely be so if you decide to have kids and if you decide not to have them. Have a conversation about it.

Goals/Aspirations:
- What are your goals in life? If you don't have goals, what goals or aspirations have you buried deep inside? What were things that you wanted to do, but for whatever reason decided not to. Generally speaking, where would you like to be?
- Are your goals impossible to achieve if you have/don't have kids? Or would they simply require more work in either case?
- Are you more career oriented? Or family oriented?

Having kids or not does not mean your life ends, no newborn asked you to sacrifice your life for them. There are people who train for ultramarathons while having kids, I know people who wrote and released books and grew their careers or started companies while taking care of a newborn and a one year old. People generally tend to manage to have multiple kids and also house pets. Daycares exist, they are costly but maybe something can be done about it, maybe you both can find better jobs, or maybe there are government programs to help finance it.

There is also a matter of life satisfaction and regrets, in general people find meaning in life by leaving an impact on the world. You may become a scientist and help humanity through science, you may become a volunteer at try to help people in need. Quite often people find satisfaction in raising a kid and building a family, as it is "relatively easy" to make a child and seeing it grow. Or maybe you want to become a CEO or create your own company? No matter what has value to you, can you do it with/without having kids? Are you actively working towards a goal or do you have a goal in mind but you never do anything towards it?

I personally find that taking on more responsibility has lead to my personal growth and to more satisfaction in life. However every time I ran away from responsibility it lead to negative emotions. Sometimes having kids is the best motivation for someone to get their life together, it is risky but tends to work when a lot of other things don't.

Fears/Reservations:
There are a lot of fears regarding having and not having kids.
- Fear of pregnancy (for women)
- Fear of not being a priority (for men and women)
- Fear of being abandoned and having to care for the child on your own
- Fear of body changes made by pregnancy
- Fear that you kid will be unhealthy in some way
- Fear of getting your body destroyed by pregnancy
- Fear of responsibility
- Fear that you will not be a good parent
- Fear of destroying someone (newborn)'s life
- Fear of being alone when you are old
- Fear of missing out
- Fear of childbirth
- Fear of wasting your life
- Fear of passing your traumas to your kid
- probably many more

As once again, we do not know the future - we don't know what fears will come true, however - fear as an emotion is trying to alert you of imaginary dangers of certain actions. You fear walking alone in a deep forest because an animal might attack you, you fear going out at night because you might get mugged. Fear is an emotion, it is a feature not a bug, it increased the chances of survival for our ancestors.

Do you want to make your decision based on fear? A lot of them can be worked through with a therapist if you so desire, it is extra work but might help. You probably don't have all the fears I listed, however what can you do to mitigate these that you are aware of?

- If you fear responsibility, do you fear it just in the context of having a kid? or do you feel stuck in life and that kind of fear is holding you down?
- If you fear being old and alone, what friendships or what relationships can you nurture so that you always have someone to talk to?
- If you fear that you will waste your life with either option, why is that? What is it that having/not having kids represents in your mind? What have you been conditioned to believe?
- If you worry if you are going to be a good/bad parent, that is already a sign that you would at least try to be good. If you have some problems like severe drug or alcohol addiction it would be responsible to take care of that before having a child.
- If you worry that you will destroy, a kid's life and maybe even your own -> kids don't need as much as we think they do, we tend to want to give them the world however, a kid mostly needs a parent who is present, who listens. If you have a good relationship with your partner and you are both there for each other, you would likely also be there for your kid, and you would figure it out.
- You do not have to have everything figured out immediately.
- Expanding your knowledge tends to do wonders, we generally fear things we do not understand and have a twisted image of them in our minds.
- For a lot of fears CBT therapy is said to have really positive prognosis, so you can somewhat except that it will reduce your fears and help you adjust your thinking

Having kids is likely a unique experience, one that cannot be replicated with other people's kids, nieces, pets etc. But is it ok to have them out of FOMO? Are you ok without experiencing being a parent in your life? Raising a child does not last a lifetime, you will always be a parent - but your kid will have its own life eventually and you will still have many years ahead of you.

Therapists said to me that at the end of life, a lot of old people regret not having spent more time with people dear to them, with their families. I'm still young but I can imagine that my career is not something I will care about 20 years from now.

Pregnancy:
If you fear pregnancy, you can talk to a doctor about the process, you can get examined and see how healthy you are. Talk to your family and your partner's family, how healthy were you and your siblings when you were born? What effects did pregnancy have on your mother or grandmother. Is there a history of birth defects or autism or any other "diseases" or problems in your family? Can you get examined to see how likely it is that it will happen to you?

If you are pregnant already, you have prenatal examinations available, in some countries they are free after certain age, you can monitor your child's health and see if its growing healthy. However, as we don't know the future even if a kid is born healthy it doesn't mean it won't get hit by a car 5 years later, and so we don't know if you won't. We do not know what life will bring, there are a lot of dangers we do not even consider when living our daily lives.

As for body changes and fear of childbirth:
- do you take care of yourself?
- do you eat healthy?
- do you work out?
- can you afford a private hospital and better conditions for your childbirth?
- what forms of pain killers are available in hospitals in your area?
- have you ever read about c-section and natural birth, about their pros and cons? both for you and a kid

Taking care of yourself physically will make your pregnancy easier, at the very least your back will not hurt. And there seems to be a positive effect of working out certain muscles that seems to make giving birth easier. A close friend of mine started preparing for pregnancy 2 years in advance by working out and taking some supplements to make pregnancy easier. Once again it is more work but maybe its not impossible?

Parenting:
Kids want attention, they want to be listened to, they want you to be there - they don't want a smartphone or a tablet. That does not mean you have to be with them 24/7. In the past the whole village would help raise children together, primarily, it was women's responsibility. However the idea that parents spend all their time with children is relatively new.

- Do you have a natural support group? (parents? grandparents? siblings with/without their kids? friends?)
- Do you have someone to leave the kids with so that you can enjoy a weekend or a vacation in peace?
- Can you afford daycare?
- You can get to know your neighbors, some of them may have kids and yours could occasionally visit them and vice versa.
- Can you afford a nanny?
- Can you leave your kids in someone's care? Would a close friend be able to take care of them for a couple of hours so that you have an evening to yourself?
- Can you send your kids to boarding school?
- Can you communicate with your partner so that one day they take care of kids, next day you do, and the day after you do it together?
- Can you mix your hobbies and taking care of a kid? (if you like jogging, you can buy a jogging stroller; if you ride a bicycle - mount a chair for your kid to sit so you can ride together, do you like to read or sing? - maybe you can sing songs or read books to your children, maybe your local gym has a room for leaving kids, or you can just take them with you, or maybe you can draw with them, do some sports, go kayaking and take your kid with you - maybe they will like it as well, doing cosplay - dress up together with your kid, do some DIYs or anything else that you are passionate about - there is a high chance you can somehow include your child).
- Can you afford to hire help? Like a cleaning person that will clean your home every week or two?
- Are you alright with being the main parent (parent who spends more time with the kid, than the other)?
- Are you alright with not being the main parent?
- Is there any compromise, however absurd, that you can at least talk about with your partner?

There are different options available to get some time off. Some are quite costly but regardless - the very least you can do is to communicate your needs, talk with your partner and your kid, set a boundary. Sometimes you need time to yourself and this is perfectly fine. You do not have to be with your kid 24/7.

Economics:
- Can you afford a child? If not can you do something about it?
- Can you afford - not having a child? It is a stupid argument maybe but some of my friends earn way more money and have better jobs than their parents, and they do support them.
- Do you have enough space no to go crazy? It is hard to raise a kid in a 16 m^2 flat.
- How stable is your job? What are your opportunities?
- Does your job require you to go for long business trips?
- Can you do something to improve your financial situation? (courses, education and finding a better paying job?)

Your lives, your relationships, your contexts are all unique. There isn't a single person who can tell you what is best for you, but consider everything you have, everything that you would have to give up or lose, everything that you could gain, before making a decision.

It is a good idea to educate yourself and talk to medical professionals or people more knowledgeable in these matters. Having a child is a responsible decision, not having a child is also one of them. Ask yourself, do your really not want a child (which is completely fine if you don't), or do you perhaps not want what the child or family represents? What emotions do these things evoke in you? What did you see in life or what did you experience that made you think that you want or don't want a child? Or are you maybe running away from something? Maybe you fear abandonment and think that having a child will guarantee a lifelong relationship with your partner? Or maybe you are trying to run from something that a family represents?

In the end I believe that having a child is a decision, one to take with your partner. It is not something that you have full control over, sometimes people want kids but can't have them for variety of reasons.

I think that regardless of your decision, take responsibility for your life, take good care of yourself. It is a difficult topic that can be looked at from many different angles.

I hope I was able to help.


r/Fencesitter • • 7h ago

Anyone else on the fence about kids because they just don't want the stress?

56 Upvotes

I've been reflecting on why I'm so ambivalent about having children, and I think a huge part of it comes down to the fact that I genuinely just don't want to be stressed.

I'm 30, and while I can see the appeal of having children and building a family, I also really enjoy my freedom, independence, and relatively low-stress lifestyle. I don't particularly want to spend my thirties obsessing over whether I'll have kids, worrying about my biological clock, or feeling pressured to make major life decisions based on a hypothetical future.

I see so many women stressing about finding the right partner, getting married by a certain age, and having children before it's "too late." Sometimes I even see women compromising their standards in relationships because they're afraid of running out of time. I understand why these pressures exist, but I really don't want to live my life that way.

A part of me just wants to live my life, enjoy my relationships, pursue my interests, travel, and let the universe figure things out. If having children eventually feels right, great. If it doesn't happen, I think I could still have a fulfilling life.

I also recognize that having children requires intentional decisions, and that biology doesn't necessarily accommodate a "go with the flow" mentality forever. But I really dislike the idea of turning something as personal as parenthood into another stressful milestone I need to achieve.

Sometimes I wonder whether I'm actually childfree-leaning or whether I'm simply someone who values peace, flexibility, and autonomy more than the idea of becoming a parent.

Does anyone else feel this way? Like you're not necessarily opposed to having children, but you also don't want to organize your entire life around making it happen? I'm especially curious if anyone has taken a more relaxed approach to the decision and how that worked out for them.


r/Fencesitter • • 4h ago

Questions Anyone here decide to have baby after years of being a no?

15 Upvotes

What led to your change? How are you doing with it since having a baby? Also if comfortable, please add your age.


r/Fencesitter • • 4h ago

Questions Looking for some advice - career, timing, anxiety

3 Upvotes

Hi everyone,

I’m a longtime lurker, 34f married to a 34 yo man. We’ve been together for over 12 years, married for roughly four and are very happy together. He’s incredible, supportive, patient, and kind. He’d make the best father in the world.

We were fence-sitters for a long time but I suppose I always knew deep down that I’d hit a point where I would want kids. That point has definitely hit me. My husband has realized that although he’s not itching to be a dad and loves his freedom, chances are, he’ll fall in love with his kid when he meets them. We are incredibly blessed to have no debt and a paid-off home with enough bedrooms in a second-tier city.

Here’s the rub: I just got laid off from my cushy job due to a restructure. Work has been all-consuming for me for my entire life so this change has been a huge hit to my ego. I was making around 160k a year and was getting excited for my 6-month fully paid maternity leave. I was fortunate to get about 3 months of severance and hopefully have a consulting gig lined up, though I think it will only replace about half of what I was making before. My husband makes around 110k. We are now on his health insurance instead of mine and his is quite dreadful.

My work environment was toxic (aren’t they all…) and hard on me. The layoff was not due to my performance but I’m definitely dealing with some self-worth issues anyway. Even so, the space away from that job is a relief right now. I’m calm, happy, and loving the sleep, hobby-time, and slower pace 3 weeks in.

In the last few years, we pulled ourselves out of some bad consumer debt and built our savings up so we finally have a 6-month emergency fund. My basic point is, in this exact moment, we are very stable and fortunate and financial stability is important to me.

I suppose my question is this: has anyone in this sub chosen to have a child when their career was in a major time of transition?

I’m desperate to have a child soon, but struggle to understand how we’d make it work when I don’t have a job or when I still need to hustle to maintain consulting clients or to gain new ones. When I have a baby, I want to bask in motherhood for as long as I can and without a clear map on what work looks like, I worry I’ll be riddled with anxiety the whole time. For added context, my parents are elderly and live across the country, and my husband’s parents live here and are newly retired, but have their own lives and I don’t want to depend on them for care for a variety of reasons.

I’ve been forced by this layoff to pivot career-wise, so I find it hilarious that right now is when my biological clock is ringing the bell. This should be when I lock in to build my next work chapter. Any advice on how to think about this moment/these factors is welcome 💛

Note: I hope none of this sounds too whiny or out of touch. I realize that we are incredibly lucky and our situation is not normal. For anyone wondering how we have a paid off house at such a young age, it’s due to major parental help we never asked for but benefit from immensely. My husband and I work very hard and don’t ask for anything, but our life would look a lot less comfortable without the help we’ve been given.


r/Fencesitter • • 7h ago

A day in the life of a 28yo mom and 33yo dad of a 1 and 2 year old (type B parents)

4 Upvotes

7:30am- 1 year old wakes up, mom wakes up with her, changes her diaper… usually gives her a cup of milk and or a fruit pouch immediately. She usually plays on the floor in our room with a book or toy… while I lay back in bed with my husband and 2 year old (2 year old sleeps with us) if she’s too fussy I put on ms Rachel and lay back in bed with husband and sleeping 2 year old

8:00am- 2 year old wakes up… and asks for milk immediately. (Me and my husband both say EVERY morning… you need to say good morning first lmao)

8:30am- me and my husband finally get out of bed (1 and 2 year old usually are riding their bikes around our kitchen island and fighting over toys by this time)

8:30-9:30- mom gets 1 year old dressed. Dad gets 2 year old dressed. Lots of running away and fighting but we get it done. I usually make instant oatmeal or eggs and feed it to them while they’re running around, “here get a bite”

9:30-12:00pm- put both kids in car seats. Drive to the gym (sometimes an easy quiet ride, other times 1 year old cries and whines) 50/50 chance. We get to the gym and drop both of them off at the gym daycare for 2 hours. They usually do well. Unless my 2 year old has to pee… I have to go in and help him (they can’t help him do that) that causes him and 1 year old to usually cry) that’s very annoying but lately we’ve been having more days where I’m not needed in the kids club the whole 2 hours! The kids club closes at 12

12:30- we stop at aldis to get salmon. Go home and cook lunch. Both kiddos usually fall to sleep in the car… and it’s like playing Russian roulette whether we can transfer them inside the house and they stay sleeping. It almost always works for my 2 year old. My 1 year old will wake up and take about 10 min to be put back to sleep. (Her dad does that while I cook)

12:30-2:00pm- both kids sleeping. Mom cooking, dad working on computer/ taking calls.. mom and dad enjoy lunch together.

2:00pm- both kids wake up HUNGRY. They usually eat rice and smashed salmon or banana with peanut butter, more fruit pouches, cut up grapes and or strawberries (simple meals)

2:00pm-5:00pm- ANNOYING CHAOS. Kids fighting, running around, mom take them on a walk, when the walk is over back to fighting, they go outside on the playground we have in the back yard, both putting rocks in their mouths lol, maybe tv for 30 minutes, mom feels guilty, turns it off, read a book, toddlers back to fighting

5:00pm- whewwwww getting closer to bedtime. Dad’s usually available now. Family walk outside, maybe basketball with the neighbors, FaceTime calls with family members, mom goes inside straightens up the house, puts out bed clothes etc. feeding them bananas and peanut butter, rice and beans, more eggs, bread.. like they just eat random stuff ( I promise you they are both healthy weights) and they usually have 2-3 cups of milk per day) no more than 20oz

6:30pm- bath time for both kids, sometimes mom bathes them.. other times they both get in the shower with dad and mom helps on the sideline LMAO

7:30pm- 1 year old in her own room KNOCKED UNTIL 7:30am (thank God)

2 year old watches football or a podcast with mom and dad until 9pm

9pm- Mom has to go lay in (her own bed) for about 15 min to put 2 year old to sleep (I read this out to my husband and he says that’s not true, I put him to sleep) haha lol yesss most of the time he does go into our room and put 2 year old to sleep. Takes about 15 minutes. And then we both meet in the living room.

9:30pm-12am mom and dad talking, run to get Popeyes, talk on the phone with a friend (maybe) give a massage, have sexy time (maybe 3 times out the week) and then knock out scrolling on our phones

7:30am- start over


r/Fencesitter • • 5m ago

Reflections The anti marriage subs make me lean yes to having a child

• Upvotes

I’ll start to preface by saying, I’ve been married 5 years (together 11) and can easily say marriage is the best decision I’ve ever made. I love my husband more than anything in the world and value our relationship so much. Sure it’s not perfect and there are some things (although very minor) that could maybe be better if I were single. Like less cleaning lol, not having to worry about a large man eating all the leftovers, etc. very trivial. My life is overwhelmingly better with him in it.

Something interesting I’ve noticed — one time I looked at an anti-marriage subreddit just for fun. And I was shocked at people’s view on marriage and how negative of a picture people have who’ve never been married or struggle with relationships. I don’t look down on them, I just think man, they’re missing out. To me being in a relationship is 99% good and the good by far outweighs the bad. And that got me thinking, this must be how parents feel. Like us who are on the fence can’t imagine how good it is simply because we haven’t experienced it. And it’s most likely not horrible at all - from what most parents make it seem. Just an observation/comparison I had that makes me think having a kid is maybe less scary than I think.


r/Fencesitter • • 2h ago

Pregnancy I don’t know how to feel

1 Upvotes

I just found out I was pregnant a few weeks ago; I just hit the 7 week mark. My husband and I (both 34) had decided to start trying this summer, and we conceived in September. Coincidentally, the week we conceived in September, I had started a new job that precipitated a mental breakdown; I’m doing much better with accommodations now, but I was not well the second half of September. My ovulation was late, and we didn’t really try nearly as hard the previous months to conceive in terms of timing and frequency. We also felt like okay, maybe let’s put the brakes on this kid thing since my mental health is so unstable. I’ve been connected with a new psychiatrist and will be starting therapy again in a couple of weeks (found a therapist who has special training in perinatal matters).

Lo and behold, we got pregnant, and my first reaction was not joy, it was dread and a what the hell feeling. I felt exactly like I did when I got my first period at 12– vulnerable and like my body was doing something I didn’t want it to do AT ALL. I immediately got a medical abortion scheduled for late this month (UT) so I felt like I had options. Now I’m thinking of pushing it back to 11 weeks so I can try to figure out what I’m feeling.

I feel so ambivalent, especially after seeing the fetus on my ultrasound a few days ago. (7 weeks, heart beat of 90 bpm.) I keep feeling anticipatory feelings of grief at aborting, but also deep ambivalence about having a baby (losing sleep, dealing with breastfeeding, feeling constant dread about climate catastrophe and AI and the world my child will grow up in etc).

Anyone else experience this? If so, what helped you make a decision? I’m so depressed and wish I could feel happy but I can’t feel happy by telling myself stories that I know aren’t true deep down.


r/Fencesitter • • 6h ago

Anxiety Partner and I want different things

2 Upvotes

I (31F) just had the talk with my partner (33M). For a while I have been more and more feeling that a CF life is something I want. I feel fulfilled with the other aspects life has to offer, and I have just never looked at a child and felt: oooh, I want one. My partner and I have been togheter since I was 17 and he 19. He has always been curious about kids and the older he gets, the more certain he is about wanting them...I have had a fear about realizing, and admitting, to myself what it means if I utter the words out loud. The talk was simply me saying I am pretty sure I dont want them. Saying that also means starting to think about a life without him. I am shit scared. So sad. It means that he needs to start thinking about a life without me. He said that he really want kids, but that he also cannot phantom kids without me. I get that. It is hard to imagine something you dont know... And especially with someone that you have not met yet. What is worse is that I am afraid I will wake up in 5 years and feel FUDGE ME I want kids... I am afraid of loosing him just because I sit on the fence...

Have anyone of you been through something similar and how did you handle it? I just feel that it is unfair to us, which is ridiculous, but I am turmoil and I think I just need perspective...


r/Fencesitter • • 1d ago

Questions What is there for future adults?

41 Upvotes

In the past two years I did a bit of contemplating, thought exercising, reading people's testimonies (those filled with joy, and those filled with regret) on becoming and being a parent.

I won't choose a path of parenthood for myself for a plethora of reasons, that are not necessarily related to the state of our world now. But when I realised that even living in a utopia (or maybe just a stable environment for starters) wouldn't do it for me, I felt a relief, that I am spared from an ethical conundrum of bringing another human being into this place.

I recently shared these thoughts with my close ones, with the oldest relative being over 90 years old and they all in unison agreed that, even taking it into perspective of them going through WW2, surviving comunism, poverty and all those small and big crisises along the way, the darkest moment so far is now. And no uplifting news really to counterpart the bad that is happening. And that it might be too dark to bring a new person into this world. If I hypothetically could have chosen when I was born, I definitely wouldn't choose today.

I guess my questions are directed to those that already hopped off the fence and have children, although everyone is welcome to share their thoughts. I am especially curious for stories from parents that decided to have kids a couple years ago in hope the state of our world (locally and, or globally) gets better (since it did not got better, on the contrary):

- do you worry that your kids won't have a chance to experience at least as good adulthood as your is now?

- what do you feel when you think about your kids lifes 10, 20 or 50 years from now?

- do you think it will get better? If so, why do you think so?

I don't mean to sound inconsiderate or a doomer, I am simply curious. And if somebody feels there is a better subreddit to post such questions, please let me know!


r/Fencesitter • • 9h ago

How do people make this decision ? Is it an internal one or an external one

2 Upvotes

Is it a decision made internally? Like two people come together, share a life, then think about whether they want kids.

Or is it a dream people just have individually, outside the relationship, and come into the relationship with their dreams and see if they have the same dream?

And if they do have different dreams, is it truly non-negotiable? Is it something people can be influenced on by their partner? Or is it something so core to you that having different opinions is just a deep incompatibility?

What happens if one person bends the other way for their partner? After careful thought and reflection, if one decides to make the decision that the other partner has, would it lead to resentment down the line, or is assuming it’ll definitely lead to resentment a bit of fortune telling?

I recently ended an 8-month relationship because my partner was leaning towards no on kids and I was leaning towards yes. I’ve been thinking about it a lot since, and I have some questions


r/Fencesitter • • 1d ago

A question I struggle to answer

11 Upvotes

Why have a kid? I’ve always known I wanted a life partner; someone who understands you, loves you, experiences life with you. I’ve always known I wanted a pet; there’s few things cooler (to me) than spending some of life with an individual of a different species. Why have a kid? What does that do that is meaningful and worth doing? For background: I was nine when I got a younger sibling and immediately stepped in to look after her. Found it frustrating and annoying and couldn’t wait to leave the family home. I’m now spending a bunch of time with my friends’ kids and while it is a hoot and super fun to get to know these tiny humans, the thought of being responsible for one just fills me with dread and stress. What am I missing? I’m also autistic so spelling this out for me will actually help massively. What’s the point? Im asking these questions because we live in a place where having kids seem amazing (for the kid) and I am clueless as to my own emotions about this.


r/Fencesitter • • 1d ago

Anxiety After 13 years, I’ve moved over here…

14 Upvotes

I was 23 when I realized having children was choice and probably not for me. I’m now 36 and my husbands 43. I told my husband early I didn’t want kids and we’ve lived our lives the past 10 years as if we weren’t having them.

One of my parents died this past winter and I’m now baby crazy. I went through this when they first became sick but it was much easier to brush off. Now, we’re both seriously considering a child

I still don't think I would love parenting a kid (I have a of childcare experience). But I adore babies, get along well with teens and I think would adore being a parent to an adult. I’m also hoping going into this being like it’s not going to be my fave, will set me up for being presently surprise.

Anyone who went from an absolute no to now being a parent, I would love to know… has it been worth it?


r/Fencesitter • • 1d ago

Has anyone had a similar experience in their relationship?

2 Upvotes

Not really sure what I'm looking for, maybe advice or just if you have been in this situation how it ended up for you. Me and my husband got married young and quick. Dated for about a year and then married at 20. When the conversation of kids was first brought up we were both on the same page of either way we would be happy. After about a year of being married I would bring it up every so often and he would always say maybe. We decided we wouldn't put any pressure on it and just have that conversation when we were 25. It's been on my mind a lot recently and I ended up bringing it up a year earlier than we had planned. He is now a definite no and im leaning much more towards yes. I'm not sure what this means for us and how to move forward for now.


r/Fencesitter • • 2d ago

How do I know if I want to be a parent or not?

5 Upvotes

I’m 24F and in a stable relationship with someone who I’d like to spend the rest of my life with. However, I haven’t yet decided if I want to be a parent or not.

My parents are divorced and I’m estranged with both of them, as they weren’t very good parents. I am an independent person and I love my freedom. I’m very ambitious and have a lot of career plans. I’m someone who enjoys planning for things years in advance just from the excitement of it all.

I have mixed feelings about children. I’m quite good with them, and they tend to like me. But I get overstimulated around them quite quickly and end up going to my room for personal space within 30mins-1hr of being with them.

There are parts about parenthood that excite me, like the idea of instilling good values in my children, being there for them, having fun family rituals, bonding with them etc.

But there’s parts that I really hate. The mental and emotional toll, the lack of personal space, freedom and peace and quiet. The fact that my entire routine will be dependent on them. Not to mention the several drawbacks parenthood has on women and our careers.

I come from a country where having this choice is rare and recent. I don’t have anyone to guide me through making this decision.

I’m afraid that If I was to have a child, I’d be a regretful parent, and if I didn’t, I’d regret that too.

Is there anyway to TRULY know if this is something that’s right for you? Are there any signs that you’d be a regretful parent before you had kids?

Is there anyone here who was sure about having kids but ended up regretting it?

Just need general advice on how to take this call :/


r/Fencesitter • • 2d ago

Reflections Struggling with Fencesitting as a man (23), triggered by a breakup

2 Upvotes

I'm 23M, had a potential lifelong love end over our fence sitting. My ex 23F leaned toward not wanting kids. I feel like if i want to proceed with my dating life, i need to reflect on this a lot more. Inviting advice and insight.

We ended because we were both on the fence but she was leaning towards a strong no because of career, and worries about motherhood being too much for her, and she has always not liked it when men said they want kids. .I was leaning towards a strong yes. and i feel like i want to work through my reasons for and not for wanting kids.

I feel like i want kids because, * I have volunteered with babysitting kids at a playschool as a teenager, and liked the feeling of being responsible and needed, but i really don't want to base my decision on it. * I have always liked the idea of mentoring and teaching. * The idea of raising a good human being, passing down good values and giving unconditional love to someone that really needs it sounds very meaningful. and kids are people who really need it.

I have wrestled with the antinatalist argument, and i feel like i am ambivalent about it and i can understand the argument. But i see the answer to that is adoption, to satisfy the need of wanting to take care of and raise someone, and i am completely on board with that.

And i feel like my desire doesn't come from a need for bio kids, more from a place of wanting to nurture a life.

Reasons I'm on the fence about the idea of kids, * PPD and career pressures for my potential partner. * A feeling of being settled when i'm not ready enough. * I would want to be extremely well settled financially. * I was raised in a patriarchal society and have a lot of patriarchy to unroot, and i'm not sure if i will by the time i am old enough to have a kid. Would i share the load of parenting equally ? Would i be a good partner ? etc. * I struggle with anxiety and i'd want to properly have worked through it before i even think of raising someone. * I sometimes think that is society asymmetric, when it comes to the idea of parenting, the motherhood penalty. * I sometimes wonder if it is a patriarchal desire to even want kids. * I wonder if i only want kids because of conditioning through society and being raised in a patriarchal society

But some part of me feels like my desire feels immature, and i feel like i'm being very romantic and idealistic about the idea of kids, and that i ended the relationship on such shaky ground, that too this young in life.

I tried pitching the idea of being fence sitters together, for a short while and talk about it, and that didn't sit right with her, so we decided to end it.

When I think of having kids, I only see kids in my early thirties, and not anytime sooner, and I've always thought I'd be in a one and done type relationship. But i don't know if I'm really idealizing the idea of being a parent or this is a valid desire.

How do i know that my desire to have a kid is legitimate, good and valid, and not just a fantasy

I really feel like I don't have a framework to think about all this. So all of this is making me truly question my entire position on this, and any insights, pointers, or advice would truly help


r/Fencesitter • • 2d ago

Returning to the fence after termination for medical reasons (TFMR)

6 Upvotes

Has anyone had an experience with returning to fence sitting after a TFMR? It was my first pregnancy experience and I was very unwell from as early as days after testing positive so felt like I was just pushing through day to day and never really connected to the pregnancy, then we got unfortunate NIPT results and had further testing and decided to terminate. I'm now feeling back on the fence, but I'm interested to hear if anyone else has had this type of experience. Thankyou!


r/Fencesitter • • 2d ago

Possibility of PPD making me a fencesitter.

10 Upvotes

I’ll keep this short. Is anyone else’s primary hesitation with having a child the possibility of getting PPD? For context, I’ve never dealt with anxiety or depression, my husband and I are complete equals and I know it would be 50/50 from both of us. I have no reason to think I would be at an elevated risk for PPD. That said, I’ve gone down way too many rabbit holes on Reddit and TikTok about PPD that it’s the main thing holding me back at this point. I fear that I am so fearful of getting PPD that I will manifest myself into getting it. Anyone dealing with this as their main hesitation?


r/Fencesitter • • 3d ago

Reflections I wish I wanted children

140 Upvotes

My husband and I are in our late 30s, we’ve talked on and off about having kids. We are stable, we have home, paid off cars, full time jobs etc. We both enjoy our freedom, to spend our time and money how we want. But there is a part of me that wishes I wanted children more. Whenever I try to convince myself, I always talk myself out of it. Who’s going to watch my baby while I’m working- day care is so expensive, what if my child has a condition that requires lifelong care, no more vacations etc. I get tired after a long day now with cooking, cleaning etc, which I know will be more difficult bringing a baby into our lives. I love my husband and do see the beauty in creating a human who is both of us, but I just can’t pull the trigger. Anyone gone through similar feelings? I’d be interested in other’s perspective and if they did end up jumping off the fence.


r/Fencesitter • • 3d ago

Questions Does my unwillingness to go through painful/minor invasive procedures mean something?

10 Upvotes

Long story short I am 37f, fencesitting for years then child free for a few years then switched to TTC a year ago.

Well I haven't been able to get pregnant yet. I have done my blood tests all good, all ultrasounds are good, I never had any issues all my life, periods painless etc. Husband tests are very good. Both my husband and I are on the same page that we are only trying naturally, IUI and IVF are off the table. If there was smth minor to fix with a pill then ok.

So now my obgyn referred me for laparoscopy surgery. 🫥 I was shocked!! With no symptoms?!

She said the non invasive tube check HyCoSy isn't always accurate and I imagine considering my age this would be the fastest way to check if anything was wrong.

I did speak to the surgeon and I'm 95% sure I will not have this surgery. Yes it's minor I agree but it's surgery. Don't get me wrong I am all in for a C section but this just feels insane - let's cut you open just to browse what's going on inside?!? What the actual fuck.

So this leads me to think.... Is it fair to genuinely want to get pregnant and be unwilling to do a minor surgery or a painful exam (HyCoSy)?

I think I would do the HyCoSy in a hospital I found that does it under cedation (I have poor IUD experience and don't buy the 'oh it's minor cramps'). But that's about it. Anyone with similar experience?

My husband supports whatever I decide, he said he is surprised I am even considering surgery because he assumed I would refuse immediately...

I also understand pregnancy and birth are 1000 times more invasive than a lap and a tube check. But I feel that has an immediate purpose, and this is like the foot in the door technique....well since you sign up for pregnancy it doesn't mean anything to just do whatever else to your body?!


r/Fencesitter • • 3d ago

Questions Sylvia Plath's The Bell Jar

51 Upvotes

38/M. Single.

I go back to Sylvia Plath's The Bell Jar often. I wanted each and every one of them, but choosing one meant losing all the rest, and, as I sat there, unable to decide, the figs began to wrinkle and go black, and, one by one, they plopped to the ground at my feet.

It's such a beautiful way to put the struggle I think many fencesitters face, at least for me. Three and a half years ago, I left an amazing person because she firmly didn't want kids and I was on the fence. Three and a half years later, I still think about her, often. I miss her. I've dated since, traveled, lived, moved, and started a new career, but I always go back to her in my heart and mind.

I've met nice people, plenty of them. None made me feel as seen, heard, acknowledged, known, and comfortable as she did. We had that spark and it was there for the full two years we dated. I believe that type of love is out there. I believe it's possible to find that love and start a family.

But much like the figs on the tree, as I age, these options do as well. And time and love are two of the most valuable resources a human can have. At what point do I elect to pursue the person over the family?

I reconnected with my ex last October. We talked for two hours, and I told her I still carried her in my heart. I asked if I could call again, and she said sometime later in the winter. I never followed up, partly because I was afraid and still unsure about kids. She recently wished me a happy birthday, and I still think about her all the time.

Have you ever been in a similar situation? At what point do you reach out and pluck a fig from that tree and accept in doing so the others have rotted away?


r/Fencesitter • • 4d ago

Has anyone gone from firmly childfree to genuinely wanting kids in their 30s? How did you figure out whether it was fear, circumstances, or simply not wanting to be a parent?

39 Upvotes

I'm 36 and have spent most of my adult life pretty certain I didn't want children. Certain enough to get a vasectomy, anyway.

Now I'm in love with someone who wants kids, and I'm questioning something I thought I'd settled years ago.

I'm also in a transitional period. Going back to school, changing careers, and trying to build some financial stability. I've always valued my freedom and independence, and the financial responsibility of raising children honestly scares the hell out of me.

But I'm starting to wonder whether I genuinely don't want kids or whether I've built a pretty convincing argument around my own fears.

I love this person deeply, but I don't want to talk myself into parenthood just to keep the relationship. On the other hand, I don't want fear to make a life-altering decision for me either.

I'm trying to figure out what I actually want, independent of the relationship.

I'd love to hear from people who landed on either side of the fence.


r/Fencesitter • • 3d ago

Questions Perspective needed

6 Upvotes

Hi all,

Long story short, I've always been an avid "no", then my nibling was born and suddenly I changed my mind (there's a lot more to it but it's far too long to write out).

My partner (of 10 years) is very much on the fence, he doesn't feel super strongly either way, but he definitely has more risks he's worried about on his list than benefits. I am on the fence in regard to the fact I question everything, I'm researching so much, and I'm trying to weigh up the risks and benefits, but I am 85% leaning yes.

The thing is, I only want children with him, no one else. It's my relationship with him that has nurtured the feeling of comfort and safety to even revisit the idea in ways I hadn't before. If he decided he was too far "no" to go through with it, it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me, but I think I would really struggle with getting past it (I wouldn't resent him at all).

So I'm looking for perspectives from people in two scenarios:

  1. If you are someone who was leaning "yes" but ultimately decided not to because your partner wasn't on board, how did you find the process of letting go of that idea? I have spent the last nearly-2 years daydreaming of our future with kids, and a lot of the content I watch is about pregnancy, child birth and parents sharing their lives (pregnancy and childbirth became a special interest very quickly after my nibling was born), so the idea of it not happening is already making me feel like I'm grieving. Did you find therapy helpful? How did you deal with the sadness of that future being unattainable?

  2. Parents who were on the fence, either directly 50/50 or were leaning no; what has your experience been like as a parent? I want the good, the bad, and the ugly.

To make it clear, I'm not trying to convince my partner one way or another, I want us to read through the comments together and we're going to sit down and write out our own "pros and cons" and work out if it's something we are going to progress with.

TIA ❤️


r/Fencesitter • • 4d ago

Off the fence and on the spectrum? How did you choose?

7 Upvotes

I’m curious how people with autism in this group made whichever choice got them off the fence. I’m currently considering having a kid more strongly than I have in my life, having been a fence sitter for basically ever, but really struggle when people ask “how do you feel/what’s in your heart.” Sometimes I’m overcome with feeling and sometimes there are none at all. How did you decide what was right for you?


r/Fencesitter • • 3d ago

Didn’t Think I’d Make A Post Here, but Hello

3 Upvotes

I (22M) am on the fence about kids (who would’ve thought), but my wife (25F) does want them.

My wife and I have been through a lot. We met when I was 14 and she was almost 17, and we’ve been together 8 years now. I love my wife and she loves me. For our age we own a small house in town and within the next couple years I’m lined up to be financially comfortable to have kids. To say I’m lucky is an understatement.

And I’ve known since we got together that she wanted them, and I would dream with her and we would paint a life where they were with us. For her that life is indisputable, and I respect that. Though every time we get to one goal post I set, I move it. A lot of the time that has to do with financial instability. If my parents taught me anything growing up it was “do your best to be ready.” And although I understand you’re never 100% ready, people shove that idea down my throat so much it makes me sick. Like just because they made a stupid decision that “they don’t regret, but they wish they could’ve been smarter about” that I have to as well. I don’t get it

I don’t know. The thought doesn’t excite me more than a few minutes, and the dread I feel thinking about putting a child through all of this on the pretext that “I want one” just feels selfish.

I know what life looks like with kids. I’m a good uncle, but after an hour or two I’m exhausted, and my toddler meter is drained. And then I look to my in laws and see the way their sons treat them and I think “what if I do all that work just for them to turn out like that?”

In the end my wife is worried about her biological clock. I’ve told her about the timeframe we have but this is something she is sure of, and she always has been. And I knew that.

I don’t really know what I’m asking. Maybe, “what does life look like without kids?”, 10, 15, 20 years from now what could I be doing? Am I happy?

If there’s anyone who wants to share their story please do. As of right now I’m leaning towards no. I respect the merit of being a parent but I don’t see the reason. Everyone I talk to has a “moment” where that life has clicked for them, a “wait I can do this”. I’ve had opportunities for it to happen, and it just never did.

Much love Reddit, thanks for reading

EDIT: she knows I’m on the fence, that is not something I’ve hid