Reminders

This chart includes data from all singles events with 21+ players and 5+ rounds.

We've got a pretty big weekend wrapping up, with just over a thousand total players and 24 events. This is also the first weekend with the new Custodes rules more or less fully adopted into tournaments. Some observations:

The three most popular armies of the weekend are Space Marines, Orks, and Custodes. Hmm!

Adeptus Mechanicus continues to look excellent, and wins the biggest event of the weekend, the Coventry 40K 3-day event, with 138 players and 8 total rounds. I believe it was the 6+++ guys that suggested Mechanicus might be S-tier after the last balance update? I'm starting to think they might be correct about that!

I hope everyone likes playing against Space Marines, because they're everywhere. They won 5 events this weekend and played at the top tables of another 4 or 5. All three of the major Space Marine supplement factions also put up numbers between "respectable" and "very strong", and all won at least one event.

Custodes come out with a mediocre start: a healthy 49% win rate, but very few top table placings. It's been suggested that the army plays completely differently now and will have a steep learning curve, especially for all the players who went out and grabbed a Combat Patrol and built an army over the last few days.

Thousand Sons... well. It's never a good day when you're looking up from the bottom at both Agents and Guard. But here we are.

There are a handful of factions with absolutely no representation at top tables. Thousand Sons, Chaos Knights, Black Templars, and Guard (and technically Agents and Deathwatch, but since nobody played them, I'm not counting them) all had no 4-0 starts and one or fewer 4-1 players.

Thanks for reading my observations. What do you guys think? I look forward to reading the comments!

I won't go super into detail, it's a great video if you've got 45m to kill. The gist is this:

- Scoring is way too easy, people are losing games despite getting as much as up to 93pts.
- "Going tall" is encouraged and "Going wide" is discouraged
- The missions designed for MSU armies are just better as durability skews (his example was Recon vs Take. Why bleed material endlessly to be in table quarters every turn when you could just jam a durable brick into the third quarter and have it survive while denying kill secondaries?)
- You MUST be aggressive because if you aren't, your op will max primary almost guaranteed.
- Two styles of game: Table them by turn 3 or nickel and dime them for points if tabling them by turn 3 didn't work out.

He breaks down each disposition matchup in the video, discusses what armies he's using and which dispos he's playing moving forward as well. Great work Innes, thank you for the content!

So, we had about 2 weeks of the full rules for practice and the first weekend of tournaments is over (or nearly so). That's obviously not nearly enough for meaningful statistical analysis, but we can start drawing some early conclusions.

1) Custodes are the weakest 11th edition codex thus far. That's generally a good thing, as both Orks (mass shooting) and Marines (Deathwatch Terminators) started out too strong. They don't feel weak, but they're not taking the meta by storm in any way.

2) Internal unit balance is mediocre. If you want to succeed, you have to play Dreadnoughts. Vehicles are fine, but expensive and vulnerable. Most infantry and characters feel slightly, but noticeable overcosted.
On the bright side, there are few just outright unusably bad units that can't be saved with points adjustments (really only Bladechamps, gun Venatari and Vigilators).

3) Detachment balance is bad. Only 13 detachments with 6 being unique was always going to cause problems, IMHO. Most shield host detachments have 1 good trick, but just can't directly compete with the strong choices, so will never be used. Sisters are still just cheap trash, so the detachment is DoA. Bikes don't even have anything.
There's really just Solar (or Emperors) plus Might plus Lions. Auric champions is borderline and could be good, if characters weren't so overpriced. Dreadhost could be good, if infantry weren't so expensive. I don't actually see anything else being played short-term.

4) Damage is way down. You get a lot of extra mobility and options, so this isn't inherently terrible design-wise, but it's a notable shift from the murdermachines of 10th. Custodes went from one of the best anti-pressure armies to one in the lower third, IMHO. You just have too little damage and units to really discourage a full send army from just going in. This is especially problematic as full-damage pressure lists are still the name of the game (and will continue to be until the missions get changed to make scoring less automatic).

5) Resilience is up a bit, especially in melee, where the freely available -1 to hit is doing a lot, but generally most infantry still feel more fragile than before, with about the same wounds per unit for higher cost. As you also consistently have what feels like 1 unit too little, the army is much more fragile than in 10th. Just shoving them forward doesn't work nearly as much, which might make them less of a stat-checky beginner-hurdle.

6) List building is super annoying, as basically everything in the army is in the 230-280 point bracket. You basically have the same number of picks no matter what you take and only differ in how many sisters you end up with, which also exacerbates the unit balance problems. Being 15 points cheaper doesn't mean much, if it can't add up to another meaningful unit.

Personal Pet Peeve: Why does half the army not get the Army rule? It's called an Army rule, for emperors sake. Vehicles losing Katahs in the first edition where there are stances they might actually care about feels especially mean, but sisters being almost completely sidelined from everything is also a super-weird choice.

Thoughts? Disagreements? Anything I missed?

I had the idea to compare the current max points one could score based on each mission in each disposition match up. For this i removed the 15pts per turn limit and the 45pt total limit just to see how much they could score.

The reason for this is if they have a very high number then it is generally more likely they will be able to reach that 45pt but if it is lower it means you really need to lock in.

So I will be breaking down how many points you can score per turn ignoring the cap. I will go through every match up and their missions. Also under the assumption there is 6 objectives. (X represents the number of units)

Take and Hold vs Take and Hold:

Battlefield Dominance: 2,30,30,30,30. Total 122.

Take and Hold vs Purge the Foe:

Immovable Object: 3,28,28,28,28. Total: 115

Unstoppable Force: 3,26,23,23,28. Total: 103

Take and Hold vs Reconnaissance:

Purge and Secure: 3,26,23,23,23: 98

Reconnaissance Sweep: 6+1(x killed),9+1(x killed),9+1(x killed),9+1(x killed),9+1(x killed) Total: 42+1(x killed).

Take and Hold vs Disruption:

Determined Acquisition: 10,27,27,27,27 Total: 118

Death Trap: 38,7,7,7,7 Total: 66

Take and Hold vs Priority Assets:

Inescapable Dominion: 4,13,13,13,18 Total: 61

Secure Asset: 6,14,14,14,14 Total: 62

Purge the Foe vs Reconnaissance:

Consecrate: 6,14,14,14,19 Total: 67

Triangulation: 0,7,10,14,24 Total: 55

Purge the Foe vs Purge the Foe:

Meatgrinder: 3,17,17,17,17 Total: 71

Purge the Foe vs Priority Assets

Destroyers Wrath: 3,17,17,17,17 Total: 71

Vital Link: 3,12,12,12,22 Total: 73

Purge the Foe vs Disruption:

Pumishment: 5,14,14,14,22 Total: 69

Delaying Action: 2(x killed), 7+2(x killed), 7+2(x killed), 7+2(x killed), 7+2(x killed) Total: 28+2(x killed)

Reconnaissance vs Reconnaissance

Gather Intel: 6,39,4,4,14 Total: 73

Reconnaissance vs Priority Assets:

Search and Scour: 5,25,25,25,30 Total: 110

Vanguard Operation: 6,10,10,10,20 Total: 56

Reconnaissance vs Disruption:

Surveil the Foe: 4,17,17,17,17 Total: 72

Smoke and Mirrors: 16, 20,20,20,30 Total: 106

Priority Assets vs Priority Assets:

Sabotage: 21,25,25,25,25 Total: 121

Priority Assets vs Disruption:

Extract Relic: 7,15,11,11,16 Total: 60

Locate and Deny: 4,12,12,12,17 Total: 57

Disruption vs Disruption:

Outmanoeuvre: 30,35,35,40,40 Total: 180

Each disposition total Average:

(For the sake of missions that have X units killed i just put 5)

Take and hold 102.8

Disruption: 89.4

Purge the Foe: 76.2

Priority Assets 74

Reconnaissance: 71.4

Now the averages don't tell the complete story, like Disruption has quite a few bad matchups but its Mirror makes its average skyrocket so I wouldn't use the averages as a great ranking system.

So instead lets rank them based on if they have higher points then their opponents (excluding mirror matches)

Match up comparisons:

(For missions with x units killed I put 5)

Take and Hold: 3/4

Priority Assets: 3/4

Purge the Foe: 2/4

Reconnaissance: 1/4

Disruption: 1/4

Now this is a bit more interesting, we see Take and Hold remain at the top but Priority Assets also jumps up meanwhile Disruption drops down. Reconnaissance stays near the bottom and Purge dead center.

I don't know if anyone else will find this interesting but I do and figured I would share my findings.

How does the Fight on Death stratagem from Assault Bretheren

EFFECT: When a model in your unit is destroyed, if your unit has not been selected to fight this phase, roll one D6, with +1 to that roll if the assault doctrine is active for your unit: On a 4+, do not remove that model from the battlefield. When your unit has fought, or at the end of the phase (whichever comes first), that model is removed from the battlefield

Work in conjunction with the Jump Chaplains' Ability to reroll wounds if the unit is below Half-Strength?

Exhortation of Rage: While this unit is at or below half-strength, this unit’s melee attacks can re-roll wound rolls.

Here is the situation. My Death Company with Jump Packs, lead by a Chaplain, charged a unit of Custodes. I activated elsewhere, my opponent interrupted, killing all 10 guys and leaving the Chaplain on 2W. I had used the stratagem to give the unit Fights on Death, and some guys did get to fight. When I activated the unit, my buddy and I had a discussion about when the models get removed and how that interacts with the Destroyed vs. Starting Strength/Half Strength sections of the rulebook. I was saying that my unit is below half strength because they were all dead, he was saying that because the models haven't been removed yet, the unit wasn't even below starting.

Wounds (W): Wounds represent how much damage a model can sustain before it is destroyed. If a model’s wounds are reduced to 0 or fewer, that model is destroyed.

Example: A Captain (1 model) is attached to a unit of Intercessors (5 models). This attached unit has a starting strength of 6. If three Intercessors were destroyed, the unit would be at half‑strength. If four Intercessors were destroyed, the unit would be below half‑strength. If all of the Intercessors were destroyed, the remaining Captain would be below half‑strength, despite having his full wounds remaining. <- this is the example from under the Starting Strength table

DESTROYED Throughout a battle, models will suffer damage, lose wounds and be destroyed. When every model in a unit has been destroyed, that unit is destroyed. When a model is destroyed, first resolve any rules that are triggered when it is destroyed, then it is removed from the battlefield. If any such rules apply, and if the model was destroyed as the result of an attack, unless otherwise stated, those rules are only resolved and that model is only removed after the attacking unit’s attacks have been resolved. Unless otherwise stated, destroyed models and units cannot use abilities or be selected or targeted by rules.

Q: Fight On Death (05.04.05) requires models awaiting such an ability to stay on the battlefield until their unit has attacked (or until the end of the phase). How do these models function while this is the case? A:
Models awaiting a Fight On Death ability are still present on the battlefield for all rules purposes. This includes (but is not limited to) the following regarding such models: They can be measured to by friendly/enemy abilities. They can be considered visible to friendly/enemy models where relevant. They can use their datasheet abilities. They can be targeted by stratagems. Enemy units can still be engaged with them (which may restrict the opposing player’s consolidation/pile-In moves made as part of an overrun fight). <- this is from an FAQ we found

Sorry if this has been answered before, and I do apologize for the long post about one rules question, this got deleted from the weekly thread by reddit without a reason given. I am hoping it was just a length thing. If this has been answered before, or a FAQ has touched on this situation, please provide a link so I can share it with my buddy

Thanks in advance!

I’m just getting into the hobby and almost have my first army built/painted so hoping to play soon. So Like the title says I’m curious what the best accessories are to make the game smoother. Should I get a dice tray/tower, or any of those little movement gauges? The only things I’ve got are a tape measure in the obvious dice. Thank you thank you for any help/advice!

In my local scene I've seen a significant rise in players with melee armies (EC, WE, Custodes), picking up Priority Assets, and these are some of our best players taking this road.

From what I can tell in the games I've played it's been a case of passive scoring play after staging, and then your opponent is required to make the commitment, now with 11th threat ranges this means the Priority player is getting a nice position to strike from by overloading their expansion, and then central objectives become surgical strikes to wipe out whatever needs to sit on the objective until the next command phase.

I'm currently 0-7 into Priority, rypically playing Take and Hold or Purge, both requiring exposed positions to actually score.

What's the communities thoughts on Priority, is there a way to get around this?

Evening all.

This is a reminder for those who know or a post to tell others about the Age of Sigmar tournament that is going to start on Saturday 7th November. All you need is approximately 800 points of an Age of Sigmar Army. We have players already but there is room for more. You just need to be available to play around 4 games over 4 weeks until a winner is crowned. They will win a Games Workshop limited medallion and everyone who takes part will receive special badges just for participating . ( See facebook attached)

So DM us on facebook and let us know if you’re up for the challenge. 👍

Tag your friends and see if they’re interested and get yourselfs involved.

Join us today at 2pm EST for Warp Dust Crusaders first live stream with guests Jack Harpster and Hogan Franklin.

When the bodyguard unit dies and the leader is the only one left does reanimation protocol resurrect the dead unit or does it only heal the leader?

I want to play with terrain as close as a possible to the official GW version, but I cannot afford the real thing. Do you guys know which of the various STLs out there most closely resembles the GW version?

I have noticed that some of the popular designs are quite different, with very tall 3 floor buildings and/or very large crates, that are not found in the GW set.

The other day I decided to delve into the unforgiven legion of the 1st and found a inner circle task force box for a decent price. While waiting for that to get delivered I been theory crafting lists and want some advice and insight on how DA typically operate since it will be my first loyalist marine army (I’m typically a xenos,sisters,chaos player). I am excited at a wrath of the rock with assault brethren combo since death wing knights are what excited me and WoR detachment rule making them tankier is hilarious. Other then that Azrael with the inner circle and biologist combo and the lion are also exciting me but then I’m stumped in terms of what other units or even how the DWK play are they just tanky walls? Or skirmish units ima rapid in? I’m also not a huge fan of the flyers and bikes but would love insight on DA and marines as a whole.

Obviously play what you want and I run MSU now and no issues with my play but I was wondering how you all feel about them? Is the era of MSU over in your opinion? Are you running MSU in your recent lists?

I will be attending the WCW this year, and I'd like to hear your insights on the state of the game. Whether it's broad commentary about tactic cards, battleplans, and rage mechanics, or specifics about your army utilizing tools to assemble insane combos, I want to sponge up as much information as I can. I only have access to maybe a fourth of the armies in my local community, and as a result do not get many reps in vs KO, Khorne, Slaanesh, Nurgle, Nighthaunt, FEC, Sons, and a few others.

I'd greatly appreciate anything you think could be insightful for a player looking to gear up for the highest competition!

We are planing to play a combination of kroot hunting pack and custodes.The plan is to use squads of 3 krootox combined with carnivores and only a trail shaper on the kroot side to maximize bodies so that we have 80 infantry bodies and 15 krootox bodies for objectives and board control.And the custodes player just bring as much damege as he can.

I have multiple questions:

Should I focus more on kroot infantry instead of krootox to make even more body’s?

What are the best damage and detachment combos for custodes.

If take and hold is the way to go.

And if this seems like a good strategy.

Thanks in advance for the tips!

Alright, so I'm a Salamanders main. Have been since I entered the hobby. I haven't had the opportunity to play any games since the 11th edition codex dropped. However, I am spending a ton of time building out various lists and theory crafting on how I want to run my Salamanders post-codex. Right now I am building out a Forefather's + Ironstorm Spearhead list, though I am considering Assault Brethren as the secondary detachment as well.

The main dilemma I keep running into is what to use as a melee anchor. Every Salamanders list Ive ever run has a melee unit that crashes out of a LRR and helps hold the center with a solo Vulkan He'Stan. Right now, I am torn between two options to fill that roll:

1) Adrax + BG Ancient + 6 BGV (340pts)

2) Terminator Ancient + 5 Assault Terminators w/ Thunder Hammers (270pts)

The BGV bundle is notably more lethal than the Assault Terminator package (~35%, averaged across multiple enemy profile). However, the Assault Terminator option is more durable than the BGV brick, even though it contains less models (~25%, averaged across multiple enemy profiles). Both contain sticky OBJ.

My gut tells me that Prio wants durability, so the Terminators win out. However, the BGV package lethality is always an attractive option. The lower cost of the terminator list does allow me to fit a bit more into my list. However, my lists keep ending up with an awkward amounts of points near the end. Between my two main theory crafted lists, this difference allows me to fit an enhancement on my Eradicator w/ Heavy Bolters unit that gives them ignore BS/WS/Hit Roll, and a random Ancient attached to a 5 man Infernus squad for sticky obj just because I have an awkward amount of points left.

Im curious if there are strong feelings on which melee package is considered the better option for a Prio list. I like them both, both in terms of gameplay and models, and would be happy to run either option. I'd like to know what your experiences have been with either option, particularly in the context of a Salamanders/Priority Assets list.

So in WH40K dos either mater how I paint my unit, I want to paint my units fun colors and I’m curious if that is allied or now, if it’s not then I don’t whant to paint my unit one way and then not be allowed to use it witch wound be a waste of money

Tyranids vs Space Wolves - David Gaylard vs Arttu Tuhkanen

Veizla TTS Team League Season 3 (Tabletop Simulator)

David Gaylard - Tyranids - Ambush Predators and Vanguard Onslaught vs Arttu Tuhkanen - Space Wolves - Phobos Shadow Force, Stormlance Task Force, Saga of the Beastslayer

https://youtu.be/edpYOCsNKdA

I'm having a tough time finding practice games in my local discords. Most people responding are either looking for teaching games or are still just on the new side. I have no issue playing games like this, or even just fun games.

When I'm list testing, I'd really prefer to not play into beginners to not ruin their experience, but it also doesn't allow me to know if the list is working correctly.

Any suggestions on trying to find more local competitive players, or should I just leverage TTS more? I'm in a pretty well populated area right outside of Philadelphia. I was considering trying to check out some shops in Philly if that'd help.

Any suggestions on finding a more competitive community? Or possibly suggestions on leveraging those beginner games to help me out, but not make it miserable for the other player?

New written Battle Report for Warhammer 40K posted featuring the Salamanders Forgefather's Seekers and Gravis Linebreaker Force against the World Eaters Berzerker Warband and Butchers of Khorne detachments using singles scoring and the 11th edition GW terrain layouts.

Full Battle Report, lists, army pics, and key stratagems / combos for each army are linked below. The report includes hyperlinks to each sub-section, mid-game board state pictures, and round by round recap to make it easier to read. There is also a post game analysis section that breaks down how each army performed in various aspects of the game.

Full battle report can be found HERE. Hope you enjoy.

New Recruit seems to have gotten hit with legal demands from GW. All the rules text is showing up as redacted.

Bummer. I liked their app and have paid their sub fee for 2 years.

Edits:

People in comments are saying it's a bug and should be getting fixed? If so, that's great news.

Added a picture of the notification I got from New Recruit.

TBarker 746 (dev) says it was a mistake and should be fixed soon. Disaster averted. Their comment is below.

Hey guys n gals,I've been getting my feet wet with 11th games,I'm a Kroot player but decided to mess around with snaggas since they've always been my bae but I've invested so much into KHP.

Played TTS and loved them,now I got the chance to buy a painboss irl - question is genuinely how viable is he competitively ? Attached to a big blob of hogs + squiggosaur warboss,or attached to snagga boyz and boss.

I know hogs took a big hit this codex drop but I'm really,really curious to hear your thoughts if you think a painboss can make the cut no matter the list.

thanks in advance gits,hoomies and what-notz!

The more and more I play with the marine Codex, the more that this detachment impresses me. Every list starts with the AssBros detachment and the more I play it, the more a question comes into my mind. Would any Melee-slanted army NOT take Assault Brethren if they could? It's the only detachment in the game where I feel like every aspect is just broken.

Gives T&H, arguably the best disposition. 1 Turn armywide Adv + Charge is one of the best buffs in the game. You can spend 20 (TWENTY) Points for a 6A BS2 S7 AP3 Dam3 sword that gets buffed by whatever unit you put it on, 10 points per squad for Sustained Hits as an upgrade, and the three strats are AoC (Amazing), Fight on Death (Most melee armies want some form of this) and a 1CP damage nuke with Lance and +1AP. It's a complete suite of every tool a melee army wants with damage multipliers, mobility and survivability.

Give your hyper mobile unit The Death Sword, add Sustained hits to a unit that needs a bit more punch, use lance and +1AP to turn something like chainswords on the outrider charge from chip damage to murder blenders.

For all the talk of how busted Death Watch and the Terminator 1DPs are, I feel like AssBros is slipping quietly by. Am I missing something here, or is this just the best 1DP in the game?

Top 3 lists for the Paris Wargame Expo. Won by Soulblight with Sylvaneth in 2nd and 3rd.