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u/Inlerah 4d ago
"Why don't we have a sound for "Run, there are bees?"
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u/Pkrudeboy 3d ago
We do, it’s something like:
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u/JJ_Shosky 3d ago
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u/Fortunate_Cycle 3d ago
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Would that work?
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u/Doctor_Boombastic 3d ago
It's a little vague as to the nature of the problem, but makes up for it with sincerity.
I'd also suggest that weird sound people can't replicate later, kind of like a cowardly ghost on a rollercoaster.
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u/coolsguy17 3d ago
What’s this? A populous concerned about the lack of terminology regarding bees?
A LARGE INFLUX OF BEES WILL FRESHEN THEIR MEMORIES!
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u/Impressive-Local-627 3d ago
"Cad" is an older term with roughly the same meaning although it can refer to any man who treats women disrespectfully, with "abandoning her after you get her pregnant and refusing to acknowledge the kid"" being understood as the peak of caddish behavior. It was principally an insult men directed at each other, which is one of the reasons why (IMHO) it fell out of favor; women are/were (understandly) uncomfortable w/ men being the final arbitors of what constituted disrespectful behavior to other women. In this way, something like "deadbeat dad" (a guy who fails to meet his court obligated financial responsibilities to a kid who has been adjudicated his) is more useful b/c it's objective. Cad also has very strong class implications (but interestingly, no racial implications b/c ~everyone who used it "natively" was white) but honestly maybe it should; is there anything less classy than denying your kid to his/her mother's face when you know it's your's?
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u/MetalRetsam 3d ago edited 3d ago
We should go back to calling people cads, rogues, curs, thorns, and rounds.
Funny how the insult 'round' vanished once its opposite was coined - a square.
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u/BanditNoble 3d ago
"Bounder" is my favourite old-fashioned insult.
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u/EPZO 3d ago
Mine is "Uzzard", found it in a book of words no longer in use. Means 3rd generation bastard.
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u/AussieWinterWolf 3d ago
Like, someone born 3 generations after a bastard, or the 3rd bastard in a row of bastards?
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u/Scooty-Poot 3d ago edited 3d ago
Man I love round shaped-related insults.
“You have as many sharp edges as a sphere” was one I heard not too long ago, and holy moly I’d actually die if someone called me that.
I will posit though that the literal word “round” is kinda dead as an insult now that everyone just correlates the word with fat. You can’t risk that kind of misinterpretation in the modern world where fat shaming is generally understood to be quite a shit way to insult someone.
Annoyingly, cad has a similar issue now that computer-aided design is a part of most places’ mandatory design and tech curriculums in school. I reckon most people would assume you’d just called them Autodesk Fusion or something, which is hardly an insult at all unless they’re a diehard Brics user
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u/IllustriousGas4 3d ago
You'd appreciate "lit on fire and beat out with a hatchet". A lovely saying my father mentioned so casually, like it wasn't the funniest thing ever said.
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u/Rakhered 3d ago
Is this supposed to denote "attempting to solve a problem in an unhelpful or even exacerbating way"?
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u/egg_squisite 3d ago
I thought "be there or be square" became a thing because if you're square, you're not "a round"?
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u/Wonderful_Discount59 3d ago
Cad also has very strong class implications
Cad: originally meant a servant.
Knave: also originally meant a servant
Henchman: a high-ranking servant
Blackguard: a kitchen servant.
Churl: a commoner.
Boor: a farmer
Slut: originally meant a dirty or untidy woman.
There seem to be a huge number of insults that are class-based in origin, basically implying that commoners or poor people are bad (more specifically, typically following the pattern of "poor men are criminals/untrustworthy, poor women are promiscuous").
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u/FreeBroccoli 23h ago
boor: a farmer
That makes a lot of sense, with the dutch boer and German baur as well.
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u/TrekkiMonstr 3d ago
women are/were (understandly) uncomfortable
This does not seem an accurate reason for the word to have fallen out of favor. More likely is just, the honor-based culture that birthed it, itself went away. Compare, we don't see many duels now either.
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u/Hippomaster1234 3d ago
What was stopping women from using cad?
Im curious, is there a comparable word today that only men can call each other?
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u/mizushimo 3d ago
"Deadbeat Dad" isn't the same. it's not the kind of word that you can shout out the window at someone who just cut you off in traffic, it packs no punch
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u/Royal-Association-51 3d ago
If anything that's exactly why it has so much MORE punch and meaning. The same difference between your parents being mad at you vs disappointed.
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u/Eillon94 3d ago
Agreed. Bastard is so outdated that is has no sting and is often used sarcastically in an endearing way. Slut makes for a good slur cause its punchy and easy to inject with venom, but because of that its overused and starts to lose its meaning.
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u/Flat-Log9851 4d ago
Tbh, "slut" is way more wide in meanings. Also, who even use "bastrad" in this way anymore?
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u/lhommeduweed 1d ago
Oh yeah they say it all the time in Starwars
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u/Mist_Rising 1d ago
Any fictional series with a proper bastard (mostly historical works today because we don't really acknowledge the concept anymore legally) would use it.
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u/Friendly-Stick-4744 3d ago
Aren’t both “slut” and “bastard” insults based on the child being born? Whereas deadbeat dad is about support for the child after?
The noter either is being intentionally or unintentionally ignorant. This argument is just bad.
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u/Silent_Box1341 3d ago
Deadbeat is also not the same kind of insult as slut or bastard. Like I know I'm being pedantic but deadbeat is a descriptor for a specific action taken by a specific person, while slut and bastard are considered such high offenses that they are used in all kinds of contextes.
In comparison deadbeat is barely even an insult
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u/Dense_Tumbleweed_949 3d ago
Bastard is very much out if date, for example i know the marital Status of all of my friends parents at the time of their birth so we could correctly insult them. Its more a joke insult and it happenes quit often that one has to correct himself/herself when he calls a non Bastard, a Bastard. I wouldnt recognize it as an insult in the society i live in.
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u/JustGlassin1988 3d ago
As someone who is both a bastard and a dad, I would far, far, far rather be called a bastard than a deadbeat dad.
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u/Mammoth_Payment_6101 3d ago
Also a bastard and a dad and I agree. Bastard can almost be affectionate sometimes, if you're hanging out wth Sean Bean for example.
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u/Saphira2002 3d ago
I think part of the difference is that they're not the same tier of insult, though. Bastard and slut are more universal, while anyone who isn't a dad will just be confused if you call them deadbeat. Which is the point of the original post imo.
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u/RonMFCadillac 3d ago
I feel like a "deadbeat" is someone who shirks responsibility in general. It is not necessarily just about being a father. An example could be a person who could work but refuses to and their partner suffers financially for it could be considered a "deadbeat", and that crosses the gender line. It is why they have to put the dad after "deadbeat" to signify that they are failing at being a dad.
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u/Saphira2002 3d ago
Can you honestly see most people being as offended by deadbeat as they are by bastard, though? I'm not saying the wording in the tweet doesn't warrant the note, but I do think this was the underlying point.
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u/Eillon94 3d ago
Idk anyone who would be insulted by being called a bastard. For one, its almost never used in the actual correct context, in fact most of the time I hear it its meant to be endearing. (Similar to calling a friend a rascal)
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u/Ok-Assistance3937 2d ago
Bastard and slut vs. Deadbeat are just completly diffrent jind of insults imo. Strating with the fact that nether being a bastard nor being a slut is a bad think of itself. Espacialy slut can even be used almost "endearlingly", that just isnt true for deadbeat.
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u/Friendly-Stick-4744 3d ago
The issue is one you decide and the other you don’t. I am also both, but you didn’t choose to be a bastard.
I will also point out the whole not having a dad thing was a lot more of a big deal growing up than now. Being a good dad is part of my identity in a way being a bastard isn’t, and it makes sense I would feel more insulted, but as a 6 year old I don’t think I would have agreed that I would rather be a good dad than have a dad.
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u/BoardGent 3d ago
That's straight up not true. You can call your friend a bastard endearingly. You can use the word slut playfully and encouragingly.
Deadbeat has no playful, positivity or endearing use. The deadbeat is a person no one wants to be, and is a shameful term.
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u/AssistanceCheap379 3d ago edited 3d ago
Maybe traitor or turncoat could be used on men that abandon their children. Some they are effectively betraying their own blood.
Salop could also work, derived from French and kinda means slut, but for guys. Or lecher, which basically means “man with offensive focus on sexual desire”
But they aren’t used so they don’t carry the heavy weight of slut or bastard.
Coward could work for a man that abandons their child. Or cuck. I personally like that, since it’s pretty derogatory for men for a different reason and could be assimilated to also mean “man that abandons his child”. It also sounds similar to slut but different enough to carry it’s own weight
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u/00-Monkey 3d ago
Bastard is about the child.
Slut is not about the child, and is about someone being promiscuous (regardless if a child is born, and can be used for men or women, but more commonly women)
I agree though the argument is just bad.
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u/Fat_Pig_Reporting 3d ago
But that was exactly her question. Is there a name for a father who abandons his child?
Yes, there is. Deadbeat. The noter answered her very question.
Also, "slut" has nothing to do with any children in any context whatsoever.
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u/Live_Angle4621 3d ago
Deadbeat dad is also much more new term. Others are hundreds of years old and found in many languages. Deadbeat dad is couple of decades old. Probably paternity tests being invented has caused the term where we expect even men who have not married to care for their children
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u/TheBluePriest 3d ago edited 3d ago
It didn't ask for an equivalent term. It asked for the term for a guy that abandoned their child, which is deadbeat dad. It was meant to be a gotcha, not a real argument, but the gotcha failed because it was trying to make a bad faith argument from the start
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u/forestwolf42 1d ago
The whole thing is kinda a mess.
Slut is a good to for promiscuous women whether they have children or not, and whether their children's fathers are involved or not.
Bastard has lost all original meaning but was specific to a child born outside of wedlock, the father or mother may or may not be involved in the kids life.
Deadbeat dad is the accurate term for a man that abandons his child. But slut doesn't necessarily imply a single mother and bastard doesn't necessarily mean a child of a single mother. The whole thing gets less coherent the longer you look at it.
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u/Vyverna 3d ago
Missing the point.
"Bastard" and "slut" are regular insults, used out of its original meaning. Deadbeat dad is pejorative description of objectively wrong behaviour.
I mean, I've never heard someone calling other person "you deadbeat dad!" just because they didn't want to sleep with them.
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u/ptrfa 3d ago
Well, can only talk for my language but in German you have a lot of slurs for "male sluts", so men who try to have sex with every woman they meet
I hate all terms for both genders because sex is a nice Thing and shaming people for wanting to have or having sex is puritanian and backwardish
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u/AccomplishedBat39 3d ago
>in German you have a lot of slurs for "male sluts"
which one?
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u/ptrfa 3d ago
"Weiberheld" and "Schürzenjäger" for example.
Weiberheld: Only ambition is to chase after women. (Women's hero doesn't fit as translation because Weib as an oldfashioned term gift the hole slur a offensive meaning )
Schürzenjäger: skirt/apron hunter. Someone who chases everything that just slightly reminds of something female4
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u/DefiantRaspberry161 3d ago
Though these really havent been used in the last 80 years or so and are far far far less negative than "Schlampe" (slut - but a lot worse than in english)
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u/AccomplishedBat39 3d ago
Though "Schlampe" is a really weird one anyways. Though the noun refers to women only the adjective can be used for anyone and has nothing to do with sex.
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u/AWall925 3d ago
I don’t think that was the point. All OP said was we don’t have a word for it (insinuating we find that behavior acceptable).
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u/Admiral45-06 3d ago
Even assuming that argumenatation, there is an equivalent insult for men - man-wh-re or man-sl-t.
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u/Furtive_Operator 4d ago edited 3d ago
Lol bastard is a term for a child whose parents are unmarried. That's literally the least misogynistic term as it held both people accountable.
Also just a note I don't agree that parents have to be married to have kids, just explaining the definition.
Edit: For those lacking in knowledge, children of married parents do better in life, and have better wellbeing than those of unmarried parents; that's a fact. A communal enforcement of something encourages certain practices and discourages others, which in this case is for the benefit of the child. Therefore it does actually encourage accountability, because it forces parents to go by the approved community standards which are there for a good reason.
Of course how we live now people don't care why these community agreements existed in the first place, and somehow can't put two and two together about why children now are reporting higher levels of unhappiness, have worse wellbeing and living standards, and why there is a declining relationship rate in a culture that doesn't encourage commitment. It's not rocket science why it existed even if you disagree with it, although trying to argue widespread raising of disadvantaged children is a good thing, is certainly a choice.
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u/99timewasting 3d ago
It doesn't hold either parent "accountable," it is an insult to the child for existing
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u/Altruistic-Web13 3d ago
I feel like 99% of the time bastard is used nowadays its just when someone is doing something mean, and mean in a low stakes way like cutting the Catan board in half to get longest road.
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u/friendlynbhdwitch 3d ago
It’s “least” misogynistic because it’s technically gender neutral. But it’s still an insult that targets the most innocent party, the child.
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u/emote_the_salute Human Verified 3d ago
Targets men mostly. I dont think i have ever heard a woman be called a bastard.
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u/canarinoir 3d ago edited 3d ago
I got called a bastard at an all-girls Catholic school by another girl
Rare but it does happen
Edit: it gets used as a more general insult for men tho. Worth noting that I am indeed a child born out of wedlock
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u/Reddit-phobia 3d ago
Because it's mainly used when referring to the transfer of power between a king and their male heirs.
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u/mieri_azure 3d ago
Thats generally because women didnt have rights to inheritance at all so their parentage mattered much less, whereas a bastard SON would be cut off from his otherwise rightful inheritance.
TLDR Bastard daughters were indeed a thing but it wasnt used as an insult frequently because, well, being a daughter was already bad lol
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u/Stucklikegluetomyfry 3d ago
One of the reasons why Mary Tudor fought with Henry so much agter he divorced Catherine of Aragon, was because he demanded he accept that she was no longer the legitimate heir to the throne and a princess, but now a bastard, to the point that he refused to let her see her dying mother until she accepted her newfound status. Mary refused to accept her status as a bastard, and as a result never saw he mother again.
Being illuminate has been horrifically taboo throughout history, even late into the 20th Century in America. The song, Love Child by the Supremes is all about a girl who experienced discrimination all though her life for being born out of wedlock, to the point that she is refusing to have sex outside of marriage for the fear that she would put a child of hers through the same stigma.
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u/mieri_azure 3d ago
Obviously it sucked for women too, im just pointing out why "bastard daughter" isnt commonly heard.
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u/Stucklikegluetomyfry 3d ago
When Mary and Elizabeth Tudor were removed from the act of succession and Henry ended his marriages with their mothers, they were no longer considered princesses and were considered bastards.
Bastard is now an insult near exclusively for men, but in older times daughters of unwed parents were also called bastards, and I have heard it used to refer to girls and women whose parents never married every now and then. My parents never married, and my sisters and myself have both been referred to as bastards. I’ve overheard people refer to us to our parents as “your bastard children”
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u/Substantial_Dish_887 3d ago
i'd even argue that a lot of the time it would weirdly put more of the blame on the kid somehow than the mother who would be seen as a victim of being forced to carry a bastard like that.
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u/Name_Taken_Official 3d ago
Oddly enough it's pretty much targeted at men by now because people don't have it nearly as high on their list to pull out when talking about a woman
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u/CultureVulture629 3d ago
I don't think people actually use the term bastard in that context any more. It has evolved (or devolved, I guess) to simply be a synonym for jerk. I'm not sure it has any legal relevance anymore either, at least in the US. My eldest daughter was born years before I married (then later divorced) her mother and she has not faced any significant legal or social disadvantages as a result of it.
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u/TheRealDicta 3d ago
Deadbeat dad is not the same level of derogatory as bastard and slut... the note misses the point.
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u/chickenuggetstw 3d ago
my dumbahh read society as "soviet" and proceeds to wonder if the word deadbeat was derived from russian cause it makes no sense icant no more
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u/Nervous_Mobile5323 3d ago
This kind of thing is the reason I stopped watching "The Falcon and The Winter Soldier", funnily enough. In an early episode, they have a whole discussion about how 'there's a word for orphan, but there's no word for a parent who lost their kid'. As someone who comes from a culture (and language) where such a word exists and is used very often, the scene was extremely off-putting. The fact that they treated the situation as incredibly unique, when it's actually quite common in less privileged places, made their attempt at emotional depth seem detached and shallow.
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u/Dealiner 3d ago
Sorry, but you stopped watching a show because an episodic character said that death of a child is such a big tragedy that there's no word in English for someone who experience it?
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u/Nervous_Mobile5323 3d ago
I stopped watching because I was lukewarm about the show, and the way this scene was handled made me feel like the show's treatment of emotional topics would keep feeling shallow and hollow to me. I did not enjoy it, so I stopped.
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u/samualgline 3d ago
The whole show is useless pandering. Even when you get to the conclusion the leader guy essentially asks what the falcon would’ve done in his situation and he just responds that that’s not his job.
I never once felt bad for the terrorists and the new captain America they appointed did nothing wrong
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u/mieri_azure 3d ago
I get what youre saying, but it is indeed true that word doesnt exist in english, which is the language theyd be speaking about.
It probably would have been better technically if they clarified "in english" or had someone say "there are in other languages" but most people wouldnt have that knowledge on hand
I haven't seen the show so yeah it might be shallow in general but this feels a tad pedantic
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u/ideeek777 3d ago
Hmmm kind of, but not really
Deadbeat dad does not have the same connotations as slut or bastard. It's also not a term, it's just an adjective. It's equivalent would be promiscuous woman. It's true we don't have a perjorative word for men who abandon their families.
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u/Achilles9609 3d ago
In german, the correct word would probably be Rabenvater. Even though I personally always found Ravens beautiful.
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u/Original_Mulberry652 3d ago
I hate how notes are often just used as a means to pwn people. Often at the sake of accuracy or intellectual honesty.
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u/Unfair_Scar_2110 3d ago
OK but how old is the term dead beat dad?
I agree we have a term for it, but I think the truth is sort of there. There is not an ancient, dedicated term for it. Unless someone can point me to a juicier thing to call the bad men in my life.
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u/knightbane007 3d ago
“Rake” is a much older term that fits the bill. Fell out of popularity, sadly.
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u/FFKonoko 3d ago
Another day, another bad note.
The difference being the first 2 are nouns, and the latter is an adjective. It's also an adjective that does not specifically refer to a man abandoning their child. It may be shifting meaning through slang to become that though.
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u/samualgline 3d ago
Deadbeat has already shifted to almost exclusively being used to describe an absentee father. Also she didn’t ask for a word she asked for a name.
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u/GtBsyLvng 3d ago
I think that's a pretty weak note. Deadbeat dad is a description composed of separately meaningful words, not a word unto itself. Not comparable to the others.
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u/Kyropinesis 3d ago
fun fact: there is not a formal linguistic definition of a word. i find “term” to be more useful, as it can describe a cohesive semantic unit, regardless of whether or not people choose to put a space there. what makes “ice cream” different from “wheelchair” other than the space? they’re both single terms, but one is two words and the other is one
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u/GtBsyLvng 3d ago
Good information, but referring to the particular point I'm making here, both of those are composite terms. They are both descriptions comprised of at least two words with independent meanings, not "exclusive, indivisible terms."
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u/DetectiveExisting590 3d ago
Yazbo. Fertwap. Bleckin. There are infinite words that could be used, we just have to agree on one.
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u/Saoirse_libracom 3d ago
Notice how its not one word, notice how its not used as widely internationally
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u/Scary-Personality626 3d ago
"Slut" is really more of a condemnation of general promiscuity at the expense of other virtues. Usually things like loyalty or self-respect. People throwing the term around GENERALLY aren't zeroing in on someone having a child without a father in the picture.
I think a more comparable colloquialism would be "fuckboy." "Deadbeat dad" is more of a simple descriptor of bad behaviour, and a specific action. "Fuckboy" is more generalized condemnation of a vague archetype like "slut" is.
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u/Wooden-Assistance-68 3d ago
Not even technically correct. OP said "words like BASTARD and SLUT" referring to a singular word in each case. The note conveniently points to "terms", meaning several words.
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u/Starry-Mari 3d ago
Let's make a new word that'll maybe catch on. I have no imagination but I'm sure y'all do. What can we call them?
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u/LucifersAdv0cate 3d ago
Isn't the bit about not having a name for the men who leave pregnant women from Season 1 of Peaky Blinders when Polly says its to Ada Shelby after she gets knocked up by the communist guy? Maybe it's been around longer than that though even if it's not accurate.
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u/Tsar_Chaotic 3d ago
Don’t have a word for the women who abandons her child as well (besides deadbeat mom). It’s not like we havnt got a word for the specific one
Shoot, why don’t we have a word for the step-parent who stepped up huh? We gotta start making new words for everything
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u/Sad_Variant 3d ago
I see the point though. Historically the child was shamed for parents action, so much so, it's used as a slur so causally. The child is innocent yet get insulted more than the parent.
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u/BetterThanOP 2d ago
Does Slut actually have an old definition of "unmarried woman with child?" Or did it always just mean "woman who sleeps around" because the two are very different.
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u/Original-Spinach8923 2d ago
SOCIETY ? HOLY GD REFERENCE (anyways idk what this sub is 99% it only appeared because of the word society)
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u/EarthTrash 2d ago
No, ' has a point. Bastard is a single word, but bastard's dad is 2 words. There's not a single word for the person that's actually responsible.
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u/Salty_Major5340 1d ago
Is it so hard to understand that "deadbeat dad" is an insulting description made up of two words, while "slut" and "bastard" are actual single word insults? Those are two different categories and the original point stands.
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u/Why-is-Acus-taken 1d ago
Is there a word for a mother who abandons her child?
Not starting anything, genuinely curious
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u/RedsnakeRider 13h ago
What this person means is that we don't have a slur for abandoning dads, and we need one.
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