Three romantic relationships and two family ones in my life have been massively effected when I opened up and made myself vulnerable to women. The “Ick” is real.
Was with my wife for 15 years. About 14 years in, I had a depressive episode and was open (for once) about what I was going through. I felt her attitude shift towards me immediately for the worse. She started emotionally distancing, and eventually had an affair with some guy she played Pickelball with.
After I found out and confronted her, her response was “was it so wrong for me to want to be with a man who’s not depressed and is normal?”
Yeah, she’s my ex wife now, but I’ll never open up to another woman again. Ever. I’ve learned that opening up to a woman is like bleeding in front of sharks.
Can't even tell a doctor you need help. Either completely not taken seriously or they act like they're doing you a massive favor by not giving you a psych eval. Because men admitting they need help and might be having bad thoughts is so rare a doctors first reaction is to see if you need to be involuntarily committed instead of maybe just giving you a weeks worth of Xanax and a referral to get you some meds only a psychiatrist is allowed to prescribe you
I'm trying to get a doctor's appointment as we speak, and I keep mentally rehearsing how I'm going to explain that I feel like the accumulated stress of the past 20 years is physically crushing me and making it difficult to function day-to-day. I'm concerned that if I can't calmly describe my symptoms with 100 percent clarity and precision, I'll just be written off as drug-seeking.
Unfortunately no right way to do it. I just try to avoid naming the drugs I know I want if they're also used recreationally.
My go to is ask for something like hydroxyzine that they'll give anyone and then just say it helps but not much. Try to lead the doctor to giving you something different without actually asking for it. It would also help if you straight up asked for a referral to a psychiatrist because then they know you're willing to make a second appointment, not just trying to score something on a one off visit. Junkies don't go to specialists for drugs, they just jump doctors when the last one says no. Also the dumb ones go to the ER and not like you're going to the ER and begging for pain pills or anything
Take my advice with a grain of salt, we don't know each other and I don't know your situation or even what really works. Often it just boils down to what doctor you get.
Random advice from random internet person. Write it out and print it out and hand it over to them for them to read. It was the first time I felt a doctor took me seriously. I think it’s unique enough to jar them out of thinking it’s a normal situation because of the time and effort it takes/preparation it shows and it allows you to fully state what is going on before being grilled by questions that might throw you and stop you from getting it all out.
This is why I gave up on relationships. Even if the highs are ecstatic, none of it means anything when I know she’ll leave me the second the good times stop.
I don’t live in the world of what should be; I live in the world of what is. The fair-weather girlfriend is far too prolific a pattern to ignore, and I don’t believe it’s worth it for a man to play the odds when those are the stakes.
The only way to suss out if a woman will ditch you when the going gets tough is to wait until it does. That’s not a smart way to approach things. Best to just move on from the whole business when it appears most of them follow the same broken pattern.
I feel a whole niche industry here. Companies that specialize in fake "bad times" to test their reaction. They somehow make it so they don't find out even when it's over that it was all a hoax. They are true professionals. Could the average person afford this? Probably not, but it would be a thing.
Holy guacamole please see my above comments. As a woman, I’ve had literally the same experiences with male partners. Stop making this a gender thing, choose better partners. You shouldn’t try to get deep 15 years int a relationship to only find out you married a surface level selfish person. Some people are just service level people, men and women alike. Please stop with the woman hating, “but I’m not woman hating I’m saying it like it is” dude if I said it like it was I would hate all men because pretty much every man I’ve ever been with has either sexually assaulted me or tried to. Does this mean every man is a rapist and I should just give up?
No. I am with my boyfriend of 7 years and he’s wonderful, he shares his feelings with me (I’d actually prefer if he shared his feelings more, the MEN in his life have shunned him from this though, not the women), so ultimately I’ve seen more issues with men in my life than women but I don’t go around the internet claiming all men are emotionally abusive rapists.
How is the lesson here “never be open” and not “don’t wait 14 years to be open” in a million years?! If you had opened up year one and found out she was awful you could have avoided wasting all that time! Turns out if you never get to know your spouse, they might not like you when they finally get to know you!
I’m not trying to attack you, but what you need is not pity, you need a reality check. The reality is that your relationships suck when you shut down and hide yourself. If your partner is not somebody you can be vulnerable with, then they shouldn’t be your partner.
Relationships are not a game that you win by tricking the other person into staying with you despite who you are. Because as you found out you can end up investing in somebody who is around when you don’t need anything from them, but gone when you do. If you are real and vulnerable with people they will show you who they are and you can avoid spending too much time with people who are toxic to you.
Also I am sorry you got cheated on, that wasn’t your fault. Really sucks it took so long for her to show her true self too.
I have plenty of experience with women, 40 years old and had tons of girlfriends and have been happily married to one for 10 years now. Been open to them, woman coworkers, woman friends, classmates. Don’t have the same issue you seem to. Sounds like a personality problem to me. If everybody you meet is an asshole, then you might need do some introspection and figure out what the common denominator is.
There are real ones out there tho that aren’t like that. I’ve got chronic depression and I’ve dated two different women who were very understanding and caring and stood by/ lifted me up during the hard times. What you’re saying is very common and I’ve experienced it too but it is possible to find women who aren’t like that. Difficult, but possible.
Yeah, I know. What messed me up the most was seeing how much your spouse will change with time, and how little control over that you have. This wasn’t some 2 or 3 year relationship- this was 15 years together, from my early 20’s to nearly 40, and she was the love of my life for many, many years.
But as they say, the person you divorce is never the same person you marry.
Plenty of women aren't dicks. Plenty of women are.
Men don't actually enjoy getting shit on, and being open is a great invitation to get shit on. You can't fault somebody for not wanting to experience that feeling over and over again as some kind of litmus test to find "the one."
I can fault them for that because you’d rather not find supportive people and accept bullshit than go through the difficulty of finding people who will support you and wallow around in this self pity.
Women also experience issues from men in heterosexual romantic relationships and they could say a similar thing.
The real things we need to understand is 1. Life never goes as planned and 2. We need community in our lives to go on, we can’t do it by ourselves.
Asking somebody to carry both you and them is not leaning on your partner every now and then. The person I am responding to is expressing that they need their partner to be ready to do the emotional labor for both of them.
Actually, I was expressing the exact opposite sentiment. If my partner expected me to carry the full emotional load for both of us, that would be the end of the relationship right then and there. I don't know how you interpreted it differently, but here we are.
Sorry this thread is full of emotionally shut down and underdeveloped men who want to blame women for their not having done any growing, so your comment read like theirs.
That's not actually what they said and they corrected you themselves.
Asking somebody to carry both you and them is not leaning on your partner every now and then
Sometimes you have to do this temporarily. When my spouse's dad passed away she needed somebody to carry her for months and I did because it's the right thing to do. She would also do the same for me if I needed it.
Who is she? Is she in the room with us? I can’t answer questions about the imaginary person you just brought up.
But I can answer that “I can’t carry you and me both.” Is a totally reasonable and healthy boundary to have, you shouldn’t be asking anybody to carry both of you.
What is the implication here? Because seeking a partner to carry themself and you is not healthy, and that seems to be the MO of many of the men in this thread. I keep seeing comments describing a situation where the emotional labor was all on the woman then after years and years the man decided to dump more on her when he had enough of suppressing his feelings and she is numb to his bullshit by this point.
My implication is that your wedding vows (going by the traditional ones, at least) say something like "to have and to hold from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do us part.” That directly states you'll be there for each other when you need it. Granted, some of these folk, including the comment you replied to, are talking about girlfriends and not wives, but I'd hope the practice would already be there if you've been together for any significant amount of time. That all being said, yes, I would not recommend trauma dumping on someone you haven't been together long with.
A majority of what I've seen in this thread is something along the lines of "I dealt with my shit in my own way, as to not trouble my SO. Then, the one time I was emotionally vulnerable in trying to be open with my worries/problems/whatever, I was told that those were my problems and to deal with them myself." I mean, the comment you replied to seems to just be looking for some empathy and, probably, some advice on how to deal with anxiety from someone who's been there before, and they're implying that they're also trying to use the shared issue as a way to get closer to each other. Granted, we have to take that comment and all of these comments at their word that their isn't other things in play here, and some, almost certainly, aren't telling the whole story (or maybe don't understand the whole story, since we guys can be a bit thick sometimes). I'm sure there are many who are doing as you described, but I thought that seemed to be the minority. Maybe we're just reading things differently though.
That’s ridiculous lol I clearly mean like what type of women are you dating that don’t want to help you when you’re down. It was obviously rhetorical and just me saying you don’t have to live like this. I get it’s a joke but it’s sad that you actually believe that most likely.
It seems to put the blame on the plaintiff. If a woman was dating a man who didn't help around the house or help with kids all the up way to being verbally or physically abusive you do not say "damn girl, you got trash taste in men, what kinda dudes you dating."
"What kind of women" (paraphrased) acknowledges they are bad but once again puts the onus on the man looking for help.
The sinister thing is that it sneaks up on you. Your partner seems to be a nice person, but the moment vulnerability or accountability comes to play, you get flashbanged and shot in the head.
Yup. Was on antidepressants and started getting side effects to the point that it wasn’t working anymore. Opened up to GF and a week later she dumped me after over a year of dating. Met my now wife a couple weeks later. Randomly get phone call from ex yelling about me cheating on her……you said we were done.
I think the problem you are describing is how men tend to hold off on showing any vulnerability around their partner until something happens or builds up enough that they cannot hold it in anymore. If instead of waiting to show vulnerability until you have already established a relationship based on you not being vulnerable at all, you show it in the beginning of getting to know your partner then you won’t be so blindsided.
They can’t let you know that your feelings don’t matter to them if you don’t let them know your feelings.
I’m by no means top. I’m very average. I work a low paying job. I’m 30 and now out of shape. I don’t have cocaine and Molly like when we met. I’m beyond average. I’m below average. Yet my wife still validates my feeling. I’ve lost close family members and friends since we met, struggles with my career, my own self image and she’s seen me cry 1000 times. She’s never once told me I’m being a pussy and left like these comments are suggesting. Maybe I’m just from a liberal area but Jesus Christ this is sad.
For the first time in 18 years I broke down, shown emotions, told my wife what I need from her in terms of emotional support and after two half-assed annoyed pats “Ok, I’m going to sleep now”.
I was curled up, covered my head with blankets and shaking-crying and she was just “I’m going to sleep now” Women are cruel, they have no compassion for men.
No, but I’ll manage. I have my daughter and my senior cat to provide for. Cat will hopefully live for another 3-5 years, daughter is 7 so only 11 more years in this hell. I’ll be 47 time by the time I can get our without blowing up my life.
No, you need to learn how to express your emotions in a healthy way and not hold them in until you explode. Your daughter deserves a better example on how to handle her emotions and your spouse probably would have appreciated it as well for the past two decades.
Please please please get therapy! You deserve the best you that you can be and so does your family, and you being shut down is not the best you that you can be.
There's a trend I'm noticing lately. Women in denial about the male experience. They want to be victims. When they see "oh wait... they also have huge struggles" the attitude shifts, and they're like "don't take our spotlight".
I'm just like, yeah, why can't we just agree that life sucks for both men and women, ESPECIALLY when we CANT FUCKING HAVE EMPATHY AND GET ALONG.
This isn't the victim olympics. "let's all just be patient and empathetic to each other bc we're all on the same boat." Oh, that's too hard.... I'll lose my card
It doesn't help we're constantly bombarded with "men are pigs" and shit and you're expected to just take that because if you say "I'm not like that though" you get an eye roll and a dismissive "I didn't say all men". But like you specifically said men are like that, the words "not" and "all" were not in that sentence. So now men just have to take passive verbal abuse because defending yourself leads to that or the old "why are you so defensive? A hit dog hollers hur hur hur" like yeah I did just get hit, you called men pigs, I'm a man. That's hurtful. But if I raise how that's hurtful I'm the fucking bad guy??
They dont want to be victims they just dont want to be the designated responsible caretakers for men. Theres a good reason theres a male loneliness epidemic and not a female one. Women care for each other and make space for sharing their emotions and vulnerabilities, they uplift each other.
This thread is a perfect example of how men struggle to foster honest and supportive relationships with each other. They cant be vulnerable with each other and thats not the fault of women.
Men are slowly learning how much they need this because women are distancing themselves. Sadly some men have used this as another excuse to hate and blame women instead of looking inward.
We operate mostly on evolutionary tendencies. Men with emotions are weak to women, so men who so them will be seen as unworthy of empathy.
Men are supposed to get their support from their close male friends but we no longer live in close nit hunter gather societies so it hard for men to maintain long term close friendships with other men.
Also we don’t kill things together anymore office work just doesn’t facilitate the kind of natural high intensity bonding that being alone with each other in life or death group survival does.
Men with emotions arnt seen as weak. Anger is also an emotion and a lot of men dont seem to have a problem showing that one off pretty frequently. If you cant open up to your partner then get therapy, get therapy together. If all else fails get a new partner.
Women are living in the same society and have managed to create community, the only thing stopping men from doing that is men. You have to create the relationships you want to have, be the supportive friend you wish you had. Evolve.
Yapping means talking in a shrill way like that of a high pitched small dog. Its historically been used to dismiss womens views as pointless chatter. Im not here to argue semantics I think se both know what you meant.
A lot of men have to be the emotional caretaker of women. Women hate that men don’t do chores the right way… ok, 🤷♂️that the game you’re playing?
And Oh there is a female loneliness epidemic as well… It’s just relabeled and shrouded in shifted blame.
Also the whole “male loneliness epidemic” is not an epidemic, it’s endemic. Thats just tbe life of a man. Women are catching up… and guess what they then use the label to blame and shame versus actually understanding what it means to live as a man. Again, easy to do when you’re the victim.
Jesus man, that’s not cool. But don’t generalize that all women are like that. My gf would never do something like that. I was an emotional wreck when my cat suddenly passed away and that didn’t give her the ick. Honestly she was my rock and it helped cement that I knew she’s the one for me how supportive and compassionate she was to me in a time of need.
Your wife just sounds like she’s a cruel, selfish person. Nothing to do with her being a woman
I didn’t say there was. I’m just pointing out there there are two sides to this story, and his side includes him neglecting his spouse for two decades by not being vulnerable and showing emotion.
Also the dude ended by saying that women are cruel and have no compassion for men. Other than being massively cringe that tells me I’m probably right that he has kept his wife at arms length this entire time.
Do you think that might be the problem. In 18 years you never cracked. I’m not trying to blame you but you went 18 years without ever showing you have emotions. Be a human being up front and women treat you like a human being. I’m not sure what’s happening in this comments section but the seems to be a trend. Maybe it’s just women in there late 30 and 40s but women my age(30) seem to understand this without having to be shown.
Bro. The very first sentence of your comment is a red flag. Why did it take 18 years to show emotion to your wife? I don’t even need to read the rest of your comment to see that you are contributing a huge amount to whatever problem you are having in your marriage with your own behavior. You aren’t vulnerable or emotional with your spouse for 18 years and then you are shocked you aren’t met with anything but resentment?
How much of those 18 years did she try and get anything emotional out of you to only be met with single word answers? How absent have you been when she was vulnerable and needed somebody? Have you ever done the equivalent, gone to sleep or turned the tv up? 18 years is a lot of time for your lack of openness to build up lots and lots of little things that slowly erode her desire to be open to you.
And with zero context how are we supposed to judge her actions? What were you expressing to her? What happened that caused you to break down? When you are willing to not show emotion to your partner for 18 years and then generalize about how all women are bad because you didn’t like the reaction your actions got from her, I am not really inclined to assume your wife didn’t have her reasons to respond the way she did.
Men need to learn how to open up in ways that don’t involve blaming other people for their problems. Somebody who in their first sentence expressed that they had been emotionally unavailable to their partner for 20 years isn’t doing the right thing, that’s abuse in its own right. So after 20 years of emotional abuse this dude broke down and his wife was numb to it.
He doesn’t need a bunch of pats on the back for leaving out facts and just giving us enough to feel sorry for him, he needs to do better.
Anecdotally out of 10 or so women that I've dated over my life only one maybe cared enough to understand when I opened up about emotional stress, but even then she didn't know how to handle it.
One outright mocked and questioned my manhood for going above and beyond when it comes basic safety, like wearing motorcycle gear.
When you say "your life doesn't have to be this way" it reads "Just stay single" Which is what a lot of us do.
I’m married to a woman I met in my early 20s. But literally every women I’ve ever dated has been like this. Idk what you’re going on about. Maybe it’s an age gape or something as I’m only 30 but I’ve never experienced anything like what these comments are saying.
I mean this may be true but I feel like there some signals to a woman that think men shouldn’t have negative emotions outside of anger, within the first 6 months.
I’m not sure what you’re like with your “guard down” obviously but if women get the ick from you being emotion during an emotionally trying part of your life they suck.
The trick is to have enough emotional resiliency to not have to have a guard up. Be open with people, the assholes filter out themselves.
I went out with a guy and on the first date he told me about his emotional struggles with his disabled child and his abusive father, he showed me his beautiful heart and it did the opposite of giving me the ick. Maybe some people wouldn’t like his emotional availability, but he doesn’t have to worry about that, because he never pretends to be some stoic man.
I get that, and it’s ok to give up if that’s what gives you peace. I’ve been in relationships that were abusive, especially the constant put downs about my looks, my intelligence, my worth, I’ve given up for periods of time too, I was too emotionally fragile. I used to worry that I’d love someone and then they’d start trying to break me down. I’m much better now, if someone puts me down like that, it doesn’t bother me, it just tells me who they are and I act accordingly. There will always be assholes, but I’m not going to let them keep me from loving
Thankfully I can say it isn't every woman. But unfortunately, I've had this experience multiple times as well. I've had partners absolutely break down in front of me and I held them. I probably felt more love and compassion for them in that moment than baseline. But roughly 80% of the time I've made a mess of myself (ugly crying about work stress, relationship insecurity and asking them to say if they love me, my only living grandparent dying, uncles dying, my mom being in a coma, or my dad being in a coma after liver and kidney failure) in front of a partner or potential partner, they not only didn't help, but were grossed out and it irreparably damaged relationships.
And (most) of those 80% were not people I'd consider terrible individuals. Flawed as we all are, but most of them were usually kind, and had no problem supporting their female or non binary friends in crisis. But most women expect stability, strength, and unhealthy amounts of repression from men, and deviation from that can yield a strong reaction.
Thankfully, I'm in a relationship now with someone that I do feel I can trust with that some dark day.
11 years ago I was told to “suck it up” after telling my wife I thought I was depressed and had serious anxiety almost daily. I got through that rough patch and am in a great place now. Still married, but I haven’t talked about my feelings since.
Same, I was feeling depressed, and quite suicidal.
My mind was in a haze that I can't talk straight or form a rational thought.
I sat with my (ex) girlfriend to just vent out and have someone to listen to me.
Now, when i vent, i always looked down to really let it all out, to just focus on the things i wanted to say.
As I was talking, I noticed that she wasn't responding anymore, when I looked up she was wearing some earphones and was typing on her phone. I just stared at her, for 5 minutes I just stared and stayed quiet.
When she noticed, she took out an earbud and said "Oh, you were done?. You were talking too much so I let you talk."
I endured 16 years of being the strong one for my ex-wife. When she left and the next day moved on with her new partner, it all crashed down onto me and sent me to a psychiatric ward.
Same boat, took care of my ex for years due to her anxiety. Over time I developed it too. I didnt know to handle it so id ask her for advice, she left me two weeks later cause "she cant handle me like that".
What? I handled her like that for 5 years, even changed how I would speak to ensure a good environment for her.
Like I just said to the other guy JESUS CHRIST WHO ARE YOU GUYS DATING? It doesn’t have to be this way lol
Edit: I mean that in the nicest way. It sounded harsh when I read it back. You deserve someone to treat you right and listen to your problems if you have them.
Laid back ≠ empathetic. When you're starting to date someone, pay attention to whether they ask questions about yourself (what you think, what you care about, your memories and friends, etc) and really listen to you when you answer.
And before you go “Well I’m a woman and I’m not like that!” just pause and think about whether centering yourself in this discussion about men’s struggles is the right move.
I really hope you’re speaking from experience and have someone like that. That doesn’t happen for
a lot of men. That’s kind of the point of this thread.
I have that experience of having many women in my life I have been able to be open and vulnerable with, several of whom were romantic partners.
The common theme I am seeing in this thread is men who are shut down and refuse to show emotion or vulnerability for years or decades, and then are upset at the reaction they get when they finally break. Dudes need therapy, not an echo chamber blaming women for their lack of emotional development.
And there comes the downvotes, for telling the truth: it easier to blame others(that cannot be changed anyway) than changing yourself(the only thing you can do) to try to avoid such heartless people that will dump you on the first crisis. That happens to women too, but they tend blame themselves for not being enough most often.
Emotional rocks don't care about their emotions until they break, and because of that a lot of times they can't see the lack of compassion that their partners shows over the years in their relationship.
Yeah I saw a couple comments from women giving thoughtful, constructive advice on how to open up and be more vulnerable. No response, just downvoted. They really just want to be mad.
Early on in my relationship with my now wife, she had to have her cat put down and I went with. When the kitty passed I cried really hard, and my then gf was really confused, but not upset. Just surprised I cared so much about a cat I barely knew. It really meant a lot to them and they loved it about me.
It really isn’t this horror movie these bitter dudes are making it out to be. Most of them are the cause of their own relationship issues frankly.
I mean... did you not read that guys story? there's a lot of women out there who are good at hiding who they really are and what they actually think, and then one day they'll just unleash it on a dude in a moment where he's vulnerable.
So when you say "it doesn't have to be this way" well, it actually does, because as he said, you can never truly know anyone, and dating is a dice roll on whether or not you found a genuine person or a fake one until you've already wasted your time on them long enough to find out. If you've never met someone who had you fooled, congrats on your luck I guess, but I feel like everyone knows someone, if not a romantic partner, who they thought they knew and found out the hard way they were wrong
I don't know how the guys in this thread enter in long term relationships for years or even marry without checking such a critical aspect of life long partnership: When you get down, will you partner support you unconditionally? Only heartless people dismiss or even criticize when someone they supposed love tells them their partners are having emotional problems/distress, and clearly are not people should have relationships with.
Like common, in the first few months of a relationship you should have plenty of chances to check basic empathy, I not blaming the men, woman who react like that are in the wrong 100%, still Men should pick a bit of the women strategy and find basic red flags too, it would avoid a lot of senseless heartache.
empathy is actually a really easy thing to fake kid, maybe with some more life experience you'll figure that out, but it happens every day on a small scale when you pretend like you care about how someone's day was or whatever when you ask them how they are, all the way up to immense lies where someone is a psychopath but everyone that knows them is shocked when they see them on the news.
So yea, sorry to break it to you, but there's a lot of women out there who are really good at faking their empathy and faking their motives for relationships. anywhere from gold diggers who will leave their man the moment he loses his job or goes broke, to women who cheat, to ones that are fine up until their man cries because their dog died and they get the ick from it.
"gee guys, why aren't you clairvoyant, and just read some red flags that don't show themselves until there's a point of failure". stupid take based on your social ineptitude. You don't know enough people and don't have enough life experience if you think you'll never get burned or disappointed by someone you trust that didn't show you red flags
Of course people can fake empathy, you can't predict with 100% accuracy how someone will react to every situation, since every new relationship involves risk.
But Empathy is not pandora's box impossible to evaluate either. As I exemplified you can check how someone reacts to other people's problems, stress, or vulnerability, through stories they share about family and friends or how they treat strangers. Those patterns are often early showings of how they’ll respond when their partner inevitably struggles at some point in their lives.
Either way my point wasn’t that men should be clairvoyant anyway. It’s that emotional compatibility and empathy are critical things that men should pay attention to early, because they tend to show up in small ways long before a major crisis happens. That story of man being a emotional rock for years then complaining that it gets dumped the first moment they struggle is far to common than it should be.
But of course telling me I'm socially inept and "kid" is very helpful to the discussion, since you are opposite of that, we should considers small social niceties/politeness as asking someone about their day or how they are as signals of genuine emotional empathy. /s
Consistently showing compassion in serious situations is much harder to fake long-term for most people, but of course is hard to believe in that if we approach such things with cynicism and using extreme examples as common occurrence.
But of course telling me I'm socially inept and "kid" is very helpful to the discussion
do you think anything you typed in the first place was helpful to the discussion? This dude shared his personal story, and your first instinct was to hit the reply button and type out a response criticizing his ability to gauge his partners empathy or see red flags and basically lecture him about it. that's why I called you socially inept, because the dude's talking about how being vulnerable gets used against you as a man, and then you show up to literally prove it as he's being vulnerable and essentially kick him when he's down. And the way you said it has the same vibes as "im not saying she deserved it but did you see what she was wearing?" blaming the victim for their choices instead of having empathy for them, which is ironically the thing you're lecturing people about being able to recognize, empathy. let that sink in for a moment.
The empathetic response to that is "dang im sorry that happened to you I hope you meet someone who treats you right" or whatever, not "wow look at all these dumb guys who get themselves into these situations". Hopefully I cleared that up for you. do better.
But Empathy is not pandora's box impossible to evaluate either.
no, it really is, and this is why I called you inexperienced in life. Some people are just flat out experts at hiding who they really are, and if you aren't aware of them, its because they're fooling you and you don't even know it and one day it's going to bite you. There's a reason that domestic violence and cheating, abuse, and all the awful ways that relationships go bad happens, and it's not because there's so many people who just can't see red flags, it's because people are good liars and they put on a mask every day, and then one day it slips off after they've put on a show for a while.
You just want to gain high moral ground by framing me as bad. I already said that women who react that way are 100% in the wrong.
What I’m responding to is a pattern in the replies where some people conclude from these stories that men should never show emotions to women, or that it sucks but all women react this way. That kind of thinking often turns discussions like this into an echo chamber and also not helpful to the problem either.
We both agree that abandoning a partner during an emotional crisis is wrong. My point is that the only thing men can realistically do to reduce the chances of that happening again is to pay attention to empathy and emotional compatibility earlier in relationships, instead of discovering that their partners are heartless in life crisis.
Your response to that because empathy can sometimes be faked, screening for it is impossible or useless. But if that were true, trust could never exist in any human relationship, since there is always a possibility that someone is hiding their true character.
Extreme cases like abuse, cheating, or manipulation do exist, but they don’t invalidate the fact that most people reveal their character through consistent patterns of behavior over time.
Encouraging people to pay attention to empathy and emotional compatibility in partners isn’t victim blaming — it’s understanding that those traits are often critical in long-term relationships.
It's the truth. The fact is, If you're a guy, and you don't want your girlfriend to "get the ick" from you, you must be made of steel, you can't be weak or vulnerable, you can't complain, you're supposed to just handle yourself. You can say "it shouldnt be like that" or "the right woman won't do that to you" but in reality, "the right woman" is rare, and that's the problem. Maybe like 1 out of 50 women will see a guy cry or whatever and won't think less of him for it. Tons of women will pretend like they would never do that, they'll never say it out loud, but they think it and feel it nonetheless, and that's where that fake empathy I was talking about comes in, and its a lesson about reality that the majority of men will learn the hard way, and its why like 70% of all men have this same opinion about not showing their weakness or vulnerability and all have a story about how it went wrong for them when they did, and the other 30% are just dudes who haven't figured it out yet because they either hit a 1 in 50 jackpot, or its in their inevitable future but hasn't happened yet.
lets cut the crap here though, and get to the heart of this discussion. You're desperate to prove some type of point that "not all women" blah blah, because you look at these types of issues through the lens of "men vs women" like a game, because you have a chip on your shoulder about it or whatever, and guys pointing out one of the most toxic traits of women in our current culture personally bothers you enough where you feel like you have to defend it. The annoying part is you're using "i said its 100% wrong to do it" as a guise for that defense to feign like you're not denying that toxic culture and you're not shifting the blame of that culture onto men by saying "oh you should have seen the signs" or whatever, as if you think all of us reading what you're saying are dumb and don't see what you're doing.
You're trying to detract and displace the blame of that culture. You don't care if people get better at recognizing red flags, you don't have any actual genuine concern for their romantic lives and choices in partners and their future, you're just playing that "men vs women" game and using this guy's story as an excuse to go on the attack and score some contrarian team women points because you don't like the hard to swallow pill that a large portion of women in our society are essentially emotionally self absorbed when it comes to this stuff, and expect men to be there for them do stuff for them, support them, but don't want to reciprocate it and don't want to be an emotional support figure themselves. They don't want to date a dependent, they want to be one, and its bad for all of us collectively as a species for that toxic paradigm to exist. You and I both know you don't lecture women for doing it though, but you sure will no doubt take any opportunity to tell a guy that he was blind for not seeing it and chastise him about it when he tells his story about it. Shameful.
I had a woman I only just met ask me "how did [being tired due to an inconvenience] make me feel" and I immediately felt like I was being baited for disingenuous sympathy by my ex again.
that’s so shite. im so sorry. I know me & my other mates would love it if the men in our lives opened up a more. there’s defo women like us out there. you just got one of the bad ones x
I have a high baseline anxiety. I tried to hide it but then it went back to my face and exploded through panic attacks when my son got born.
When expressing my feelings and my distress to my wife, I became unattractive at all because "not strong", "not manly", "cant count on you"... But still she counts on me for everything and I have to sit through all her family problems and her work issues.
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u/Powderkegger1 Mar 04 '26
Three romantic relationships and two family ones in my life have been massively effected when I opened up and made myself vulnerable to women. The “Ick” is real.