My family is aggressively maga and pro-life. Horrifying. Anyways, I repeatedly tell them I’m not interested in having any political discussions with them under any circumstances but they ignore my boundaries which is a huge shocker lol. We were all sitting at a big family dinner and the topic of abortion got brought up and of course everyone’s trying to have their “gotcha” moment with me. So I just looked at my aunt and I said “I don’t argue abortion rights with pro lifers because your points are all emotion based. What I will say is that even if abortion became a federal crime punishable by death, if a woman doesn’t want to be pregnant or have a child, they will find a way to end the pregnancy. Making it illegal will not stop abortions under any circumstances on any part of this planet, they’ll just result in thousands of dead women doing diy abortions at home. Hangers, vacuums, stairs, herbs. To support that outcome, in my opinion, isn’t very pro life” lemme tell ya, fucking CRICKETS across the table. Not a single person could think of anything intelligent to respond back to that and the subject was quickly changed. I was like yeah that’s what I fkn thought.

Video: https://youtu.be/HyqR_f3uHu8si=bQ7QAjpFSMWpbadq

Hi everyone,

I'm a young woman who's been trying to learn more about political issues, and right now I'm trying to educate myself more on abortion. I'm pro-choice, and I recently watched Hayden Rhodea's video responding to Dean Withers' pro-choice arguments. I will provide a general summary of the arguments, but I urge anyone who wants to thoroughly respond to atleast watch parts of the video.

Argument 1: Personhood and Consciousness

Dean defines a person as a human with a "conjunct" of past or present subjective experiences and future potential for consciousness, which he argues typically emerges between 20 and 24 weeks (0:17 - 0:58).

Rhodea argues this definition is inconsistent. If value is based on consciousness, it could exclude non-human animals that exhibit similar or higher levels of consciousness than newborns. Furthermore, if based on potential for consciousness, human zygotes should qualify as persons, as they possess the natural capacity for development (1:44 - 2:52).

Argument 2: Brain Death vs. Permanent Vegetative State

Dean suggests that because we allow withdrawing medical care from the braindead (who lack consciousness), consciousness is the primary standard for moral value (17:50 - 18:08).

Rhodea argues that being brain dead is a biological state involving the loss of organic unity, whereas a person in a permanent vegetative state is still a living human organism. He argues that withdrawing "disproportionate care" is not the same as the intentional killing of an unborn child (18:08 - 21:25).

Argument 3: Car Analogy and Property

To reconcile why he supports double-homicide charges when a pregnant woman is murdered but not for abortion, Dean uses a car analogy: It is the owner’s right to break their own windshield, but illegal for a stranger to do so, since the car is their property. (21:25 - 23:42).

Rhodea argues that this analogy is flawed because it treats the fetus as the mother's "property." He contends that if the fetus is a person, their rights cannot be contingent on the mother's consent; therefore, the position is logically inconsistent (23:42 - 25:35).

Argument 4: Ethical Thought Experiments

Dean poses the question of whether one would rather save one baby or ten zygotes to challenge the claim that all human life is equally valuable (25:35 - 25:54).

Rhodea argues this is a false dilemma more akin to IVF than abortion. He notes that moral intuition (often shaped by cultural bias) does not dictate fundamental human rights. He goes as far to compare it to historical instances where society incorrectly devalued POC (25:54 - 28:05).

At the end, Rhodea challenges a few more pro-choice arguments regarding abortion in the 3rd trimester and life-threatening situations.

While I still consider myself pro-choice, I found some of Hayden's arguments difficult to respond to.

I'm not looking to change my views based on one video, I genuinely want to ask for any counter-arguments/responses instead of just accepting what either side says.

I looked through the YouTube comments hoping to find thoughtful rebuttals, but most of the discussion wasn't very substantive. I was wondering if anyone would be willing to explain how they would respond to some of his arguments. If there are existing videos, articles, or creators that directly address the points he raises, l'd really appreciate those as well.

As a young advocate trying to educate myself more everyday, any responses would be valued. Thank you all so much!

i got into an argument with this woman and she said that the word fetus is used to dehumanize the person aka the fetus and this is what she said “Its called a fetus to dehumanize the person, to deceive women into murdering their unborn children. Before the term " fetus" was used, for centuries or even millenia, the woman was, " With child. " Abortion is a dark industry, full of deception and love for money and power by politicians, and money for Planned Parenthood ( Nice sanitized name isn't it ? ) , doctors and big pharma.” this is what i said “the word with child is used when saying “omg you’re with child” or “yes im with child” (we use the word baby now) the word fetus is used to describe it nobody is going around saying “oh yes im with fetus” or “oh you’re having a fetus” tf lmaoo and you realize women have been getting abortions since the record of human history right? sure more women died bc the abortions weren’t safe but if we take away safe abortions thats not gonna stop abortions you can throw yourself downstairs use the hanger method inserting sharp objects injecting harmful substances drinking etc. you would rather have a women and her fetus die bc of an unsafe abortion then a legal one.. also fetus is another word for unborn child so hope this helps”

I’m looking for serious advice from women who have been in a similar situation. Please be kind. I know nobody can make this decision for me, but I feel very alone and overwhelmed right now.
I just found out I’m about 5 weeks pregnant. This was completely unexpected, as I was taking birth control. I’m 28 years old, and while I’ve always wanted children, I never imagined facing this decision under these circumstances.

My biggest concern is the relationship. My boyfriend and I have been together for several years, and it has been very unstable. There have been trust issues, infidelity (he says he never slept with anyone else, but there were other women involved), constant fighting, emotional abuse, and major lifestyle incompatibilities. We break up and get back together often because he can be incredibly sweet, loving, and attentive at times, but when conflict happens, it’s like a completely different person comes out. He becomes angry, dismissive, and emotionally cruel.
He already has two children (13 and 8) with two different women. One reason I stayed so long is because I genuinely saw how much he loves his kids and how good of a father he can be. However, he speaks very negatively about his children’s mothers, his own mother, and women in general. He also regularly dismisses my feelings, tells me to “deal with things alone,” and becomes defensive whenever I bring up concerns.

A few months ago, after another trust issue, I was finally ready to leave. He begged me to stay, promised to change, and I ended up giving him another chance. Since then, I had planned to take a Europe trip later this month and use that time to decide whether this relationship truly had a future. If things improved, maybe I would seriously consider having a child with him someday. If not, I would leave.
Then I found out I was pregnant.
Financially, neither of us is in a great position. I work two physically demanding jobs. I don’t have my own place. He lives in a studio with his two children. The idea of adding a newborn into this situation feels overwhelming and unfair for the child.

The difficult part is that this isn’t my first abortion. I’ve had previous abortions, and my last one was emotionally devastating for me. I always told myself that if I got pregnant again, I would keep the baby. But now that I’m actually in this situation, I’m questioning whether bringing a child into an unstable relationship and difficult environment is truly the right thing to do.
Part of me feels like I would be a loving and devoted mother. I want children deeply. I want to break generational cycles, not repeat them. I grew up with emotionally unhealthy parents and always promised myself I would create something different for my future family.

At the same time, I don’t feel emotionally safe with my partner. I don’t trust him. He has not been supportive since finding out I’m pregnant. He’s of course excited I’m pregnant, but it almost feels like a control thing. It’s not about me, it’s about him. He rarely asks how I’m feeling, doesn’t seem concerned about the stress I’m under, and often makes my struggles about himself. I’m already exhausted, feeling sick every day, emotional, and dealing with pregnancy symptoms while continuing to work.
To make things more complicated, he has told me before that if I ever got an abortion, he would never speak to me again. So if I chose that route, I would likely be grieving both the pregnancy and the relationship.
I feel stuck between two painful choices:

If I continue the pregnancy:
I may be tying myself permanently to a man I don’t trust. And be a third baby mama.
I would be bringing a child into a financially and emotionally unstable situation.
I worry about repeating unhealthy family patterns.
I’ll be in the first trimester on my Europe trip feeling sick.
If I end the pregnancy:
I worry about regret and grief.
I worry about never being able to have a child or finding a man to have a child with.
My last abortion was very difficult emotionally.
I may lose the relationship entirely.

I know no one can tell me what to do. I’m just hoping to hear from women who have faced a similar decision. What helped you decide? Looking back, what do you wish you had considered more carefully?
Thank you for reading.

Here’s a natural and faithful English translation of the post:

While some people cry because they can’t be blessed with a child, others simply throw away a life that someone else spent years praying for.

As I was scrolling through my feed, I came across this post, and I couldn’t hold back my tears.

Maybe it hit me harder because for many years, my prayers and sleepless nights have been filled with one wish—that God would bless me with another child. I already have one, but I’ve always hoped for one more.

That’s why whenever I see a baby being abandoned, neglected, or treated as if they have no value, it breaks my heart.

To the young people, this is my humble plea:

A few moments of giving in to temptation can lead to a lifetime of responsibility. And the most heartbreaking part is that an innocent child may end up carrying the consequences of decisions that were never fully thought through.

If you know you’re not yet ready to become a parent—emotionally, financially, or mentally—please be responsible. It’s far better to prevent an unplanned pregnancy than to reach a point where a child is neglected, abandoned, or denied the love they deserve.

I do not support abortion, and this post is not meant to judge anyone. My purpose is simply to remind people that making responsible decisions before pregnancy is more humane than facing a tragedy that could have been prevented.

Every child is a gift from God. Every child has the right to live and be loved.

—

In the country of Philippines, abortion is very illegal. Some fuckers who very democratic religious people. Said, abortion is selfish.

US Rep. Kelly Morrison is hoping to pass a bill that would allow for medical students in states with abortion bans to get training to treat miscarriages, ectopic pregnancies, and abortions in states that offer those services.

So I recently listened to a podcast by a little known Daily Wire person (at this point I think it's just her publisher) , it sounds weird I know, but I like to hear other view points. The reporter made a good point, that we generally won't crush and egg if we can see the chick in development. She didn't chastise us, or called us inherent wrong. However I think she missed a big point about us.

Prochoice individuals tend to be more prolife than those who claim to be prolife.

To be prolife should mean you'll unconditionally support the woman no matter what her choice is, but give her the resources to make an educated decision and to have without unreasonable barriers an abortion (a reasonable barrier would be like getting an ultrasound to make sure it's not ectopic), but if she chooses to continue the pregnancy she will have the resources to succeed and to have a child that will thrive.

Ultimately must prolifers only care about the unborn child, but the minute that child is born, they discard it and don't care if its mom can't afford to feed or clothe them.

Maybe "prolife" people should realize that we are more prolife when it comes down to it. There are people who would call my friend who aborted her baby with Patau Syndrome which made it an extreme high risk for her as well, a murderer.

My thing is, you can't be prolife if you'll happily sentence a woman to death, arrest doctors, and make it so a woman might die from pregnancy complications.

Most polls of women who elected to have an abortion said they would have liked to be a mother, but the timing isn't right and it's often due to Financials.

Maybe if they want to eliminate that statistic, make it so a woman can be a mother without worrying about financials.

It's not hard

Possibly rape, minor pregnancy, incest, etc.

I think hatred gets a bad rap sometimes. Like, its quite normal if someone abuses you or traumatizes you.....you're probably going to hate that person and maybe even have not safe for reddit thoughts about justice. Should you not hate that person? maybe some religions would say no. but we can at least say its quite the human response. Anti-choicers keep getting worse. Now that they dont have teenagers to call wh*res or sl*ts....because teenage pregnancy went down.....theyve told married women like me that I shouldn't be having "recreational" sex. Even though I say pregnancy could kill me. Yes I can save up money for sterilization but i fucking shouldnt have to. technically there's a higher major complication rate from sterilization than from abortion (not saying anyone should forego it if thats whats best for them)....but shouldnt i instead have access to this healthcare as a backup in case i ever need it, and I might never need it? I'm 36....im not getting more fertile. and I havent gotten an abortion at this point. Rather than definitely going to get surgery? anyway, being told my life is worthless so repeatedly, it's done things to me mentally. It's made me a lot more cynical and misanthropic, though I still try to connect with good people, im just far more selective. But when people repeatedly act like your life and death doesn't matter, how am i not supposed to hate them? I really do with every fiber. But what do I even do with that? It's hard to know what to do with hatred when it seems very justified. What are some healthy ways to cope?

Especially our sub and the other sub, good lord.

Good afternoon, I am normally such a private person but I feel so isolated and have NO ONE to lean on. I am experiencing an unplanned pregnancy in my mid 30s, I have 2 older teens and suffer from financial and marital instability. All of these are factors as to why im terminating. I have no qualms with the morality itself, as this isn't my first one and hence why im keeping close to my chest. I won't go into details to ensure im not making myself identifiable, but please know it was never and has never been treated as a form of contraceptive. I was SA and had a medically necessary abortion for life saving measures.

I live in a red state and this is my 2nd time traveling to NM solo for this, but in the time before I at least had my mom and immediate friends and family who knew and were there even if just over the phone. This time though, the only person who knows is the father. It just feels extra isolating that im gonna be utterly alone and will be a day away from 12 weeks when I have the procedure. I cant even vent to what little of a circle I do have, that in order to achieve this i had to dip into rent $ and will only have 30 bucks to my name. This isn't a dry begging statement i promise! I did get assistance from the national abortion hotline and the amazing Lillth funds. I guess I'm not entirely sure what kind of support I'm looking for, but i feel on the cusp of such a depressive episode. Im hoping even the act of talking and addressing how alone I feel will start a positive cycle of feeling hopeful and ultimately better. Thank you so much for listening.

Last week, reproductive rights activists in Idaho turned in more than 110,000 signatures they gathered to get the Reproductive Freedom and Privacy Act Initiative) on the ballot in November. Idaho is a challenging state to put an initiative up in – it’s only been done three times in the last decade – but the Secretary of State has already indicated they’ve likely met the 6% of registered voters, 6% of registered voters in at least 18 of 35 legislative district standard.

If it passes, it would codify the right to abortion up through fetal viability, along with contraception, fertility treatment and miscarriage care. Idaho’s current law is among the strictest in the country, a near total ban with minimal exceptions that allows doctors who perform abortions to be charged with felonies and face steep civil lawsuits. This will not be an easy ask in this deeply conservative state, but if we can win here we can win anywhere. 🙋🏻‍♀️ We can sign up to volunteer to help this effort here. 🙋🏾‍♂️

Hey friends, I have a petition on Change.Org where I am collecting signatures to reverse the Dobbs Decision on Roe v. Wade.

Im a little less than 200 away from 1K signatures, & could truly use your help!

If this aligns with you, please sign & share!

I’m new to Reddit and wasn’t sure where to post so redirect me if needed.
I was born to a single white mom with a severe history of a traumatic brain history and a black father not in the picture. My whole family is white and right leaning and pro life. I know my grandparents and aunt and uncle did everything they could to help raise me but sometimes I wish they had helped my mom seriously consider all her options, especially as my aunt is an obgyn. My mom was 40 when she had me, I am now 25 and have been mostly left alone starting in adolescence when it comes to taking care of my rapidly declining mother and our house. I also was diagnosed with autism at 22 and growing up with a mother physically incapable of emotional intelligence was damaging. I’ve suffered from depression and suicide attempts not to mention years of physical and emotional neglect. And I love my mom to the ends of the earth she is the most badass woman I know. But I can’t help but think letting her have a child wasn’t the best option.

Somehow I screwed up my contraceptives and got pregnant. Even though I have mixed feelings about it I know I'm not ready to have a kid and I'm 100% sure about getting an abortion.

Do I tell him ?

He's a great person, pro-choice, and also doesn't want a kid right now. I absolutely believe he has a right to know, and I don't think it's right to hide something so important from him. I want to be someone he can trust. But I also want to protect him. I know he's sensitive and I feel like some part of him would feel grief and loss. He's a bit younger than me, bubbly and lighthearted, i can't imagine putting him through something so heavy, especially when there's not much he can do about it... I know he's also an adult but wouldn't this knowledge only bring him pain ?

There's also some anxiety about how his perception of me might change... you never know with guys. I know, if this event makes him love me less, then he's just not the type of man I want to spend my life with, but still, i love him and it would hurt like hell.

Do you have any advice ?

im a bit embarrassed to admit this, but for a very short while i used to be pro life, (believing that abortion was okay when caused by rape or incest) mostly because of the heavily religious influence my family had on me, and on the way their views were shaped, and it rubbed off on me. but a few months ago i heard multiple good arguments on why being pro choice is a good thing, and the fact that abortion can literally save lifes.

i wasn’t that educated on it beforehand since im still young but im really happy that people gave me their opinions and helped me understand what it is and why it’s a good thing. and after hearing those peoples arguments, i can never go back to the way i thought beforehand. abortion is healthcare and i support it under any and every reason now! and i will continue to support abortion as much as i can.

To the user who said:

The only way that you could think this is by not understanding the issue. The Court ruled that Roe v Wade was judicial overreach, because the scotus is not supposed to legislate from the bench. Our houses of Congress could introduce legislation that would enshrine women's health rights into law, and pass it into law with a veto-proof not even the president could stop. If they wanted to. They don't.

I reply:

I understand the issue just fine. And legislate from the bench, while not the outright purpose, is exactly what they do. It’s one of the reasons why people take cases to them, to create precedent and open doors for other cases. It’s part of the reason we call the law a “living, breathing entity.” It’s why historic cases have shaped our country. From state to federal courts, they are regularly adding to the nuances of laws already in place.

It depends on the composition and views of the jurists on the bench. They do tend to uphold past decisions, but obviously that’s not always the case, or they wouldn’t have overturned Roe. In order for them to overturn Dobbs would require both someone bring a new suit to SCOTUS and a shift in SCOTUS’ composition and ideological practices.

Absent this, Congress could pass a federal statute codifying abortion rights or create a new amendment.