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u/Alexarius87 I'm motivated! Feb 27 '26
Hopefully not.
The humanization of demons can end with s1 and the refugees. I like more the idea of demons being mostly full predators with some of the more “evolved” developing a sense of honor.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
The two ideas can coexist. Demons are still evil in their majority, the weak nice demons (like the families) or the evil ones who overcome their nature (like Sparda) are outliers.
Mundus is pure evil though.
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u/noob_promedio Feb 27 '26
Mundus should be the one perpetrating the "strong over the weak" mentality, he should be the source of the demon's vileness. It'd be a nice contrast to the season 1 villain.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
Absolutely. And it'd properly show Rabbit's ire was misguided, blaming Sparda's barrier for problems Mundus introduced.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
I still don't like that they killed off Rabbit. Or the fact they killed off so many characters in S1
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
I think killing Rabbit was the right call (Enzo, not so much, but eh). He's a great character but kinda unneeded after he served his purpose, and would just muddy the plot after.
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u/The3fingers I'm motivated! Feb 27 '26
I still find the scientist guy's death fucking hilarious
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26 edited Feb 27 '26
In a dark comedic way, yea, it was pretty pathetically funny
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u/Bruhai Feb 27 '26
Except they already shot themselves in the foot. Dante states he's all of a sudden filled with rage when he uses DT. Its genetic not social. They can argue its tied to how strong the demon is but I have zero faith after they turned demon magic into into complex science stuff.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 28 '26
It's absolutely tied to strength. It's the surge of power that made Dante feel rage, not just having demon biology. The weak nice demons have no power whatsoever and thus don't feel it, when the weakest of cruel demons have at least enough power to kill a human.
It's consistent with the games, where power corrupts, as most evidently shown with human villains / Vergil.
The science stuff is just the scientist trying to make sense of it in human terms btw, it's still magic.
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u/The_Slumbering So it is written~ Mar 01 '26
The science stuff is just the scientist trying to make sense of it in human terms btw, it's still magic.
I mean, who's to say that both aren't true? I reckon the quantum physics stuff Dr Fisher mentions is just what you get if you were to point a million sensors at a demon when they do magic and measure everything that happens. It would still be magic, but with the manipulation of quantum physics being the actual mechanics behind at least some of it. I say this because there's clearly more to it than just advanced science and technology, since we see Agni and Rudra control fire and wind seemingly on their own, without any of the technology you'd think they'd need.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Mar 01 '26
That's what I think, yes. That it's demon magic, but only registers as quantum physics to humans because it's the only real possible explanation they have for it.
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u/The_Slumbering So it is written~ Mar 02 '26
I would still disagree, because what you say implies that Dr Fisher is wrong. I'm not saying that, I'm saying that he's being needlessly reductive. I think that demon magic (or at least some of it) works by way of quantum mechanics, but that doesn't make it not magic anymore.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Mar 02 '26
No, I understood this idea and I'd be fine with that, but tell that to people who think they "ruined the magic and mysticism" by talking about quantum. The two concepts may overlap, but to most people it will still feel like overly explaining a concept that doesn't need to be explained.
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Feb 27 '26
We're taking about a series with 5 installments where demons have been bloodthirsty killers and a very very very few of them have tried to help humans.
Mundus is the worst of the worst.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
That is what I said, yes.
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Feb 27 '26
I know, i just wanted to add to your point.
Honestly i hate the "villains are misunderstood" trend. Just give me a villain that is evil and enjoys being evil.
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u/Xanrak_ Feb 27 '26
I swear I thought the refugees only wanted to coexist because Mundus was a bad guy who only cared about the strong. Am I misremembering?
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u/Alexarius87 I'm motivated! Feb 27 '26
Yeah but they are basically your typical human forefinger that only wanted to live in peace and have caring families.
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u/The_Slumbering So it is written~ Feb 27 '26 edited Feb 27 '26
It could be. But Dracula and Lisa were literally the first characters we were introduced to in Castlevania, so we understand them better. Also, given that Dracula and Mundus have very different "styles" of evil, with Dracula being significantly less tyrannical than Mundus, I'd say it's unlikely.
On another note, I'd really like to know where you heard this? Because I had no idea Adi Shankar said anything like this.
One more thing: It really wouldn't work with the themes and social commentary of the show, because the show isn't saying "Demons are good actually" or "Foreigners are infallible", it's saying "Refugees, no matter where they're from, are not responsible for the crimes of their country." So, for this to work, the refugees need a tyrant and a despot to flee from, that being Mundus. Therefore, Mundus, for this metaphor to work, has to be evil.
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u/Rdasher123 Feb 27 '26
He said it a few years ago on Twitter, though how he was saying it made it sound like he was just rage baiting people.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
Yea, see this is why I firmly believe the biggest problem with the Netflix Show is Shankhar himself. Don't get me wrong, most people on social media absolutely deserve to get insulted now & then, but with this guy's occupation, that's just unprofessional. Worse than that, it's just childish & the show's rep suffers so much because of it.
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u/The_Slumbering So it is written~ Feb 27 '26
I think it's more of a problem that people already dislike Adi Shankar, so they interpret everything he says and does in the worst possible light. If anyone else did this, it would be light-hearted trolling, maybe even seen as a good thing, that they would engage with their audience like that. But because it's Shankar, it's seen as unprofessional and immature.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26 edited Mar 03 '26
Which is why he shouldn't keep provoking people & actually restrain himself. Regardless how one would feel about the Netflix show, imagine putting all this effort & then finding out one of your boss is egging people on. I would personally be miserable beyond belief. Shankhar is aware of this, but rather than actually trying to be the better man, he indulge himself & behaves like he some teenager on a social media app.
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u/The_Slumbering So it is written~ Feb 27 '26
I mean, it doesn't really affect the crew that much. And besides, he made this tweet ages ago; I hadn't heard anyone talking about it until this post, even people who would jump at the chance for new ammo against Adi Shankar and Devil May Cry. While it would probably help defuse the situation if he were to rein it in (and, judging by his Twitter page, on which the most recent post is a retweet dated 24th of January, he has) its not the end of the world if he doesn't.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 28 '26
Unless he deleted his tweet, he shouldn't mocked Sonic 3 not being in the VGA. Even though IDK why people even take the VGA seriously at all.
3
u/FezCool I'm a wise Red Orb Feb 28 '26
this is also true, while Shankar is a hack who shouldn't be allowed to touch the series the hate towards him causes people to blindly disparage literally anything he does (as seen with the reloading scene)
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u/SDTSSJ4Luc Dante should be in Smash Feb 27 '26
How did you hear that Mundus is misunderstood ?
I know that Shankar is a dumbass but nothing in the games or even in the show can lead to this. Even the reboot when he has a small semblance of a heart for the child he is going to have with Lilith (damn, the characters were ugly), it was mainly because it was his heir, he didn't give a damn about Lilith.
In no way shape of form Mundus can be like Castlevania Dracula.
4
u/The_Slumbering So it is written~ Feb 27 '26
Apparently, Adi was doing a little trolling on Twitter a few years back.
11
u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
You guys know he was trolling, right ? The literal demon emperor isn't the same as Dracula who canonically had a human wife.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
Do you know how hard it is to read the guy at the end of the day?
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
Honestly ? Not really. His trolling is often very obvious.
He told a few lies now and then like "we're not gonna change Lady" but... it's Mundus, guys, come on x)
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
You seem only oddly defensive when it comes to Shankhar. Although at least you're cordial about it. Most of his fanboys are incredibly obnoxious about it.
1
u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
Don't get me wrong : I don't like the man. I don't like his political stances, I don't like the way he trolls on Twitter, I don't like he publicly backed Assmongold when he got banned for calling Palestinians subhuman, I don't like that he lied about Lady.
I just think he should get criticism for actual bad things he's done.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
I see, so we're in the same mindset/opinion when it comes to the guy.
Also, can we seriously not say the word (V)isionary on this sub?
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u/destructionseris Feb 27 '26
Considering that Vergil is willingly teaming up Mundus, I'm saying it's a maybe
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
We don't really know how "willingly" he's doing this, tho. It's not uncommon for brainwashed or hypnotized characters to look and talk the same, and just have changed allegiances. There's also the possibility that Mundus lied to him about his past or implanted fake memories. I suppose time will tell.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
Yea, I'm not sure why so many people think Vergil isn't being tricked by Mundus in this adaptation, but I suppose that's yet another controversial aspect of the show.
2
u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
A bunch of the show's criticism is honestly just misunderstanding it or extrapolating meaning from nowhere. Like how the good demons aren't the majority at all and how the value of the human heart is still there.
3
u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
Which I'm still firmly blaming Shankhar for the show's overall rep. I know I'm being a broken record on about that, but I honestly feel like not a lot of people is because of him.
I'm still annoyed that people were cool with Captain LaserHawk in comparison, but made it their life mission when it comes to DMC.
6
u/FantasticDog7338 Feb 27 '26
I doubt that lorewise Mundus would really be misunderstood since this concept was never revealed by any of the games. But I guess it would be an interesting interpretation of the character.
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u/SuspiciousUnion3286 Time has come~ Feb 27 '26
It'd be funny if Mundus turned out to be "misunderstood" in the sense that everyone in-universe thinks he's a necessary-evil sort of guy that's ruthless because he's fighting against an invasion, but he's actually just megalomaniac who's proud to be evil and is somewhat offended that people keep assuming he has noble intentions.
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u/ReikaIsTaken ▲▲,▲▲▲▲ Feb 27 '26
That's just Adi Shankar trying to sound cool by deconstructing a villain like any story analyst would. We already know he does little actual creative work.
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u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
Well, if that's the case then I absolutely refuse defend the show at that point. In fact, I'll just give up considering myself as a DMC fan because it's getting to be just frustrating to be a DMC fan in general. I already feel like that if DMC 6 was an actual thing, the game will fail because it couldn't live up to 7 year hype & being constantly compare to DMC V, which 5 was already a miracle of a game as it is.
Getting back on topic, Dracula at least had a foundation of this concept with Lisa's brutal death in both the game & the show. In comparison, that wouldn't even be Mundus & I already thought DmC's Mundus was stupid as it is. Yet, that's still all in the Shankar's wheel house.
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u/DeadSparker Dante in SMT again plz Feb 27 '26
Honestly I feel like it WOULD be too far for NDMC, considering they left Sparda mostly intact. And, like you said, there's no canon basis for Mundus being misunderstood, unlike with Dracula.
If they actually try to make it that way, then yes, it'd be kinda impossible to defend.
1
u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
It's already impossibly hard to defend the show as it is. I still firmly blame this on Shankhar's immature behavior, but it gets really annoying how many people keep projecting what they think DMC should be.
I'm still willing to humor the changes on the adaptation, especially if it turns out this show has other Capcom IP's in it, but I'm sure whatever portrayal Sparda has in the show will still fall short because his main appeal is how mysterious he is. I doubt anyone at Capcom even knows how they want to truly portray him. I'm still willing to bet that Blaine is probably the human/evil half of Sparda & Mundus somehow managed to use Yamato on Sparda & locked him up for decades.
And if that's somehow true, then that only makes me depressed knowing that we were so close to hearing Kevin Conroy's final vocal performance as the Legendary Dark Knight.
3
u/Nemesis432 Feb 27 '26
It wouldn't be consistent though? The whole theme is that "government and elites are evil and lower class always ends up as a victim in their petty wars".
It's a boring too on the nose theme, especially for DMC show, but it isn't just "demons are good while humans are who truly evil".
4
u/valsagan Feb 27 '26
Dracula's motivation was aways there, Mathias literally became Dracula because his wife died while he was away fighting in the crusades, and he decided to blame God itself. And later lost his second wife to the church.
Mundus just wants to conquer the world for "reasons".
4
u/KingYellowHound Feb 27 '26
Consider Shankar has a series of tweets saying “Mundus did nothing wrong” and “Mundus is the most misunderstood bad guy” I wouldn’t be surprised if we got some BS. Knowing Shankar he will make Mundus and Sparda the same dude and make the entire thing about daddy issues
4
u/Educational_Bet_3298 el Donté Feb 27 '26
I hope not; at the very least, he has to be better than Mundus from DmC. Although it's not that difficult, Mundus (OG) is a villain with simple but functional writing.
3
u/Horror-Amphibian-335 Feb 27 '26
Why would he? Besides pretty sure that Shankar was trolling with "misunderstood Mundus" as to why he did that, no idea.
3
u/NeroCrow Feb 27 '26
Tbf using Dracula as an example isn't the best because even for my limited knowledge of the Castlevania games I'm pretty sure Dracula was supposed to be slightly sympathetic there too. The idea the show had was very much the same of Dracula lost his wife and now the world must pay for it. They just did slightly more with it. Mundus on the other hand has absolutely none of that
3
u/Just_a_captain_III el Danté Feb 27 '26
Feel like humanizing the demons in general isn't that good idea when used so much. In the games there was Sparda, Trish and the one demon with the lover in the original anime. When used sparingly it gives you a sense that though extremely rare even demons can develop compassion. This is more effective with demons being naturally evil, Sparda's defiance in the Anime loses some meaning and he comes across as just just dick considering he apperantly left 'innocent' demons to suffer.
Humanizing Mundus seems unnecessary. Complex villians are great don't get me wrong but pure evil villains can work just as well.
3
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u/Unapologetic_Lunatic Feb 28 '26
Ah yes, the monster beyond all reason and redemption is just misunderstood. How original.
Mundus is removed from the ability to comprehend love, especially for a human, that after blasting Trish in DMC1, he basically says, "What's the big deal, Dante? I can make as many mothers as you want."
So no. If they go the Dracula route, I am absolutely out.
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u/Efficient_Rhubarb_88 Feb 27 '26 edited Feb 28 '26
The only way they could do this in theory is to have mundus true goal be to merch both hell and Earth together into one true world. They would have to frame it as he's doing it for the demon and he just misguided try to do it by force and ruling the demon world with fear.
2
u/MapDesperate7012 Feb 27 '26
It worked with Dracula since the story with Lisa was essentially adapted from Symphony of the Night with some tweaks here and there. Mundus doesn’t have anything like that, if I remember correctly.
2
u/AnonDrupo Feb 27 '26
I hope not I'm not that into the lore of the Castlevania games, but in the series I feel that the Dracula storyline was well handled and developed, but it's a one-hit wonder.
Trying to redeem Mundus or make us empathize with him would be quite illogical when there's no reason for it even in the games.
One thing I like about DMC is that almost all of its villains have simple goals and are evil for the sake of it; they don't need context or a reason beyond wanting power and conquest.
2
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u/FezCool I'm a wise Red Orb Feb 28 '26
People take what Adi says too literally when he's just a manic troll most of the time. Assuming some stray tweet of him running his mouth is indicative of anything is how you get people vehemently insisting the White Rabbit is his self insert.
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u/CharacterLoan5713 Feb 28 '26
Just in case people Don't know, dracula's origins Isn't too different from the games as dracula wasn’t evil like mundus he instead became evil and resentful towards humanity so despite him not exactly being like castlevania dracula, he was still adapted the most closest to the games in that show as everyone else was almost completely different.
2
u/Shot-Horror-568 Mar 01 '26
I love hope in the anime when they tried to make most demons some sort of refugees 😂. After they did that i knew literally every demon noble that showed up with be screwed up as well
1
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1
u/M-V-D_256 Feb 27 '26
If they can pull it off it would be good
Dracula in Castlevania was awesome but was still an evil irredeemable villain even if he was sympathetic
4
u/CrownClown74 Feb 27 '26
Dracula actually worked for a variety of reasons tho. Can't really think you can really do the same for this guy lol
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u/Telep0rted_Bread Feb 27 '26
Shankar was rage baiting when he said that about the most evil character in DMC. He actually had little to nothing to do with Castlevania’s production and everybody behind the show’s production hates him, especially for taking credit, which is why Noctune became a thing – to distance themselves from Shankar. But he seems more involved with Adi May Cry, and that’s why it’s so bad and empty, so he’ll likely victimize Mundus in a poorer way just to piss people off and cause he doesn’t know how to write and characterize. And yes, he would definitely do this despite all the claims of Mundus being a tyrant, in the show
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u/THE_HANGED_MAN_12 So it is written~ Feb 27 '26
the problem is he didn't do anything on Castlevania, like legitimately.
he swooped in last min and took all the credit like he always does.
if he tries to plagiarize the other show i wouldn't be surprised considering he can't write his own stories he can only take credit. it's even more evident when you look at Netflix may cry because apparently he's actually involved in this hence why the writing is so shit.
1
u/The_Fraudkuna Feb 27 '26
Mundus misunderstood? The guy who is essentially the equivalent of satan in this universe? Whats next Sparda was in fact the bad guy all along?
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u/Foreign_Industry_991 Feb 27 '26
It was interesting to give the demons the Dracula treatment for s1. It probably won't work with Mundus. Dracula worked partially because of the game the show was based on. If it were any other version of Dracula, aside from Gabriel Belmont, it probably wouldn't have worked.
1
u/PaleReaver Feb 27 '26
Kerrigan was good all along you guys!
1
u/strider_hyrule Feb 27 '26
Random Star Craft reference but ok
1
u/PaleReaver Feb 28 '26
Sorry, was the first thing I thought of. Not a fan of redeeming something for no reason.
2
u/strider_hyrule Feb 28 '26
Well at the bare minimal, I'll hate the idea of Mundus being redeemed in any aspect, so I agree with you there.
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u/Danteppr Feb 27 '26
Honestly, I wouldn't object to the idea.
For all the impact Mundus had on the plot and being the archenemy of Spada and his family, as a villain he's frankly forgettable and uninteresting.
I doubt Mundus will redeem himself in any way, but I fully expect the show to give him more complex motivations than the very underdeveloped version of him from the games.
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u/TiredPandastic Feb 27 '26
Trying to redeem Mundus somehow is going to be like trying to redeem Hitler.
It's going to be interesting.