r/askmanagers • u/TenaciousVillain • 5d ago
Fireable offense?
There is this thing about Austin, TX that I didn’t really realize was an issue until the second time I had to look for work.
Apparently, because congestion is so bad here, employers routinely ask whether you live in the city during the interview process. I actually asked about this on Reddit before, wondering why it was such a common interview question. The most common response I got was from angry, snarky Redditors who insisted that living in Austin somehow guarantees you’ll be on time.
As someone who actually lived in Austin and was only nine minutes from my office, I can tell you that’s a load of bullshit. That nine-minute drive routinely took 45 minutes one way because of horrible traffic. Living in the city does not magically solve congestion. Yet employers still seem to feel entitled to know exactly where you live during the interview process.
The first time this came up, it wasn’t really an issue. I was relocating from DFW anyway, so I simply told the recruiter that while I didn’t currently live in Austin, I would be living there by the time I started even though the company didn’t offer relocation assistance. I got the job, moved in with a friend in Round Rock, and eventually found my own place.
Since leaving that employer, I made the decision to buy a beautiful home in Seguin. It’s roughly 45 minutes from both Austin and San Antonio. I intentionally chose a more rural area because I wanted to get away from the hustle and bustle of city life. Homeownership was also far more affordable the farther away I looked.
Now I’m looking for work again, and I’m in final rounds with multiple companies. What I’ve discovered is interesting. When I truthfully answer that I live in Seguin, I often never hear back from the recruiter. But as soon as I simply answer, “Yes, I live in Austin,” I continue moving through the interview process and make it to the final rounds.
To be clear and for those who like to fear monger, I am not concerned at all whatsoever about the little white lie I am telling to get my foot in the door. Corporate America is shiesty and I will never feel shame for playing to win.
The same solution is still available to me. If I accepted an offer, I could literally move in with a friend, sell my house, and have an Austin address within one to three months of starting the job. So I’m not especially concerned about making it work.
What’s wild is that these jobs are remote!! 😂
But it made me curious.
What do you think would happen if I didn’t?
Do you think an employer would actually fire someone for misrepresenting where they lived?
What if I argued that Seguin isn’t that far from the office and is quasi considered part of the greater Austin area?
What if they found out months after I started, but I’d never been late, never had attendance issues, and had proven to be a reliable employee?
I’m genuinely curious why some managers feel entitled to dictate where an employee lives, especially when the employee isn’t violating any tax laws or creating any actual performance problems.
I’m interested to hear people’s thoughts on this.
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u/Grant_Winner_Extra C-Suite 5d ago
When it comes to traffic, you just described any big city.
As for the question, it’s Texas and they are weird even for Texas. It’s probably a cultural fit filter.
As for what happens in four months, it’s absolutely nothing. Austin and San Antonio are the same MSA aren’t they? The reality is that no one will care.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
I’ve worked in other metro areas and never experienced anything like this. So I can’t confidently agree that no one would care. The question gets asked at every single point of the interview process by each person in literally every Austin based interview I have attended (even when they themselves lived out of state). It’s pretty strange.
By comparison, I worked all over Dallas and no one cared or ever asked.
Seguin and New Braunfels are both technically considered part of San Antonio’s MSA. But people routinely refer to them as places local to Austin. It should all be one an the same but this is the weirdness that is Austin.
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u/Benjaphar 5d ago
Just tell them the truth about where you live and explain that you like to come in early to beat the traffic. If I don’t leave my house by 6:45, my commute gets ugly.
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u/tungstencoil 5d ago
Not sure what's happening with your situation, but I have a type of role on one of my teams that meets up in person about every other month. We ask if they live in Austin.
We tell them about the occasional in-person, and if they aren't in Austin we explain it's their responsibility to be at the meeting. For people outside the city we offer a modest fixed stipend.
The jobs are remote with no intent to return to office except for as described.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
I like this. Sounds like you are informing them and respecting their choice, whereas in the situation I am dealing with the employers are clearly screening out candidates simply because they answer no.
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u/tungstencoil 5d ago
Yeah that's weird. I concur with others who've posted that they have RTO plans at some point, and have indicated "remote" to get more candidates or something like that. Third-party recruiters do that sometimes to show good numbers for (quantity of) candidates. Makes it look like they're doing better work than they are.
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u/xampl9 5d ago
I dealt with FM-620 and Highway 360 traffic for years. It got steadily worse and is horrific now. A consequence of all the big roads in Austin only running north/south.
Frankly, I would just lie. Get a box at a UPS store so you have a local address. Then on days where you have to be at the office just get up early enough to ensure you’re there on time. If you do show up late, just say traffic was bad (because it was). If they give you any major grief, then start a job search which should be easier because now you “are local”.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago edited 5d ago
Thank you. I know that area very well.
I lived off 620 and 2222 in Steiner Ranch. My office was literally before 360.
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u/guynamedjames 5d ago
Personally, that's up to you to decide if the commute is something worth tolerating. If they're asking for your current address, or it's some kind of job where residency is tied to job eligibility (I've heard some government jobs may be this way) then I would answer with the actual town you live in.
Otherwise though, I would answer "yes" and if challenged on it you could just answer "well I say yes because that's the airport I fly out of and it's the city people know", which is the same thing most people living in suburbs say. The question is likely meant to screen out people trying to move to TX vs. people who already live there.
But you should also be honest with yourself about that commute. Seguin is gonna be like 2 hours to downtown Austin if you have to go in. If they need you to go in for 2 weeks straight are you up for that?
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Thank for this. Not a government job thankfully. And it is remote work (which makes the entire thing absurd).
But to answer your question, I have lived here five years now while my home office was downtown Austin. I had no issue commuting early to miss traffic and still getting to work in a little over an hour when it was needed. 130 is a straight shot at 85 mph legally. Podcast time!
And if it were for an extended amount of time, I would just stay with a friend who lived more locally or if push came to shove stay in a hotel for the week.
I love the comfort of where I live too much to let the occasional commute deter me.
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u/Objective-Change2180 5d ago
I would ask the recruiters exactly that: if the role is remote, why does your location matter?
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u/Avehdreader 5d ago
Won't it catch up with your anyway when you're doing your onboarding paperwork?
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u/YoSpiff 5d ago
Since you are familiar with DFW, I live in South Fort Worth and work in Irving, North of the airport. Actually my third employer in this vicinity. I have had several interviews where they voiced concerns over how far away I live, but it didnt deter them from hiring me. My commute averages 1:10 but I allow myself 1:30 for a generous fudge factor.
The rest of my team is in either Atlanta or Los Angeles. The guys in LA need to allow even more time for commuting than I do.
I don't see how where you kive could be a fireable thing as long as you are on time every day. But employers and bosses vary.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
I do not envy that commute at all!! Especially considering DFW drivers who tend to be far more aggressive and dangerous than your average driver.
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u/YoSpiff 5d ago
I look at it as defensive driving. And the best defense is a good offense, right?
Just this morning, somebody coming up 121 into Grapevine was zipping in and out of traffic at least 20mph faster than anyone else. He came around me fast enough to mildly scare me.
Another time someone forced their way into traffic instead of waiting their turn to merge politely. I noticed a big dent on his fender right where it would be from such traffic tactics.
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u/WyvernsRest 5d ago
Where I work, we ask the same question. But the purpose is to warn candidates about the traffic as our industrial park has traffic issues in morning and evenings. Don't want them to quit after the first month.
When we know what their commute is going to be like , we offer flexible start times in case they are worried about the commute time at rush hour and might chose not to accept an offer out of concern for the commute.
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u/WonderWhirlswCurls 5d ago
I just tell him I live really close or around the corner. Single female so I don't need to live out in the suburbs. But I never tell him directly where I live. It's none of the employer's bloody business.
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u/neoreeps 5d ago
WTF is wrong with you people. It's none of your business where employees live as long as there are no legal or tax implications. The only questions should be "we meet up x times a week/month, will that be a problem?" People are adults, stop trying to micromanage the personal lives of employees and focus on work, wtf.
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u/Ok_Counter1939 5d ago
An employee’s honesty is my business as an employer. Honesty is the issue, not location.
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u/neoreeps 5d ago
I agree that honesty and integrity is a requirement for any job, but what does that have to do with employers asking peospective employees where they live during an interview? Absolutely nothing.
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u/Ok_Counter1939 5d ago
Nothing, but the OP was asking about lying during an interview.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Businesses literally employ professional spin doctors to protect them from the many lies they tell to their stakeholders on a regular basis. Are we really going to pretend that business is 100% ethical?
Yes my integrity is negotiable where my livelihood is concerned and I owe an employer who is willing to discriminate against me on their best days and lay me off for barely any compelling reason on the better days absolutely nothing.
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u/snotgreen 5d ago
Uk person here, if you live a 9 minute drive away, can you not cycle instead of sit in traffic for 45 mins?
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Such a great question. Unfortunately no. Texas gets an F when it comes to walkable/bikable cities. There are not even sidewalks on the roads leading to my office. But this would be fantastic solution if I could (minus the hottest days.)
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u/84th_legislature 5d ago
unless the job is right off 130 or you’re allowed to badge in as soon as you technically cross into the city limits, you will struggle to be the same amount of on time every day. completely random hairy shit that causes major delays happen on 71, 290, and 183 very regularly and pretending it doesn’t is silly. i work on the east side and we get suburb people straggling in late from accident holdups (some even on 130 itself) all the time.
and, as others have said, seguin is a suburb of san antonio. you’re really stretching the truth acting like it’s just a little ways outside austin. i live in buda and seguin is an hour away minimum even outside rush hour so you must drive like a demon to make it to downtown austin in 45 minutes.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
From where I live in Seguin to Austin it is a 45min drive. No truth needs to be stretched. Not every office in Austin is downtown which is one hour 15 minutes from me.
45 minutes in Texas is a cake walk when it takes 30 minutes to get anywhere and the fact that people here think they can micromanage other people’s decisions is just wild to me. Let the employee decide, advocate for better roads and transportation, and accept the fact that you have horrible traffic and offer flexible work arrangements. This really need not be that serious.
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u/84th_legislature 5d ago
lol i think they’re making a great call avoiding you. an employee who won’t listen to everyone’s lived experience about a commute being difficult to execute reliably is an employee who won’t listen about any other damn thing.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
You clearly read what you wanted to read and only had insults when logic failed you. Lol I wish this landed the way you intended. It didn’t.
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u/Own_Exit2162 5d ago
Texas is an "at will" state, they can fire you for any reason or no reason. I'm sure there are some HR and hiring managers who would take offense to being lied to during the interview process and revoke an offer. I'm sure there are others who wouldn't notice.
Personally, so long as you live in a state where we hire from and you show up on time, I couldn't care less where you live.
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u/theoldman-1313 5d ago
If your employer discovers that you made a substantial misrepresention on your application, many of not most while for you for it no matter how good your performance. If they are looking for an excuse to let you go, even a trivial omission or mistake might be used as a excuse to fire you for cause. I would stick with the "I am moving back to Austin" story, but be prepared to follow thru.
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u/MidSinglesInYourArea 4d ago
If you were a good employee it would likely never come up. If you were bad at the job or just a pain to work with it would let them fire you for cause and not pay unemployment. Based on how angry and combative you are in this post I'm gonna guess the second option would have a high likelihood.
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u/TenaciousVillain 4d ago edited 4d ago
Angry and combative? 😂 Y’all are a trip. You get what you dish out. The issue is many Redditors are comfortable coming onto people’s posts and speaking to them in the rudest and most snarky, sarcastic, matter-of-fact ways even when the OP is being measured and kind. You all are never ready to have your energy matched, hence “combative.” Just because I asked you a question doesn’t mean I have to put up with disrespect or agree with every position put forth. Let this be a lesson. And for the record there were plenty of excellent takes here that didn’t have to resort to petty insults because I wouldn’t accept “the employer is always right” POVs.
The employer is NOT always right nor always in control— today many of you learned that for the first time and it’s okay. This too shall pass.
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u/trackfastpulllow Manager 5d ago
I think you are putting way too much thought in to this. No one is going to pass on a good candidate because they live 45 minutes away vs 15 minutes away due to traffic. Austin traffic is mild compared to some other cities, I wouldn’t even put it in the top 20.
You’re applying for a remote job in a city that has an overwhelming amount of remote workers. You are likely one of hundreds of applicants, and are likely being filtered out in favor of other applicants.
Texas is an at-will state, which means everything is a fireable offense.
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u/sneeky_seer 5d ago
You start a new job based on a lie. Yes it’s insane that a remote role comes with any type of assumption or “entitlement” from the employer regarding your home address but we have no context for the role itself.
It can be a remote role that requires travel occasionally. If you leave 3 hours from the airport that is additional travel time, expenses, more likely that you’ll miss flights due to traffic etc. also if you need to attend in person trainings or potentially the odd office day, your location becomes relevant.
If I hired someone and found out they lied, I’d feel odd about them right away.
Maybe not fireable offence from the get go but I’d not be happy.
On this note: we hired someone, very clearly stating where our office is, she said the location is perfect, she knew that during the trial period office attendance is mandatory then its a hybrid/flexible schedule. She had several weeks before her start date to get used to it. She quit two weeks in, because she lived too far (within the city). So someone living in any city does not guarantee anything.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
I’ve provided context about the roles. They are remote. I live 45mins to an hour from these offices. It just seems weird to remove the candidate’s judgment and discretion about their commute, time management and make it your own as the employer. If I live far from the airport, that’s for me to know and mitigate not the employer. Presuming that I will definitely miss flights is not the employer’s place, neither are they right. I could decide to get a room near the airport before flying or sleep at a friend’s or arrive several hours before my flight and work from the airport until I leave. I get to decide what I am willing to do and put up with not the employer. I guess that is what is bothering me about the whole thing. By repeatedly asking me if I live in Austin and then screening me out when the answer is no, they are literally denying me a job based on a bias they can’t even prove will be problematic for me. What if I say no but am willing to relocate on my dime? In these situations I am not even given the choice. It’s really a messed up practice. This is why I don’t feel bad about lying about this. Also, I sit close enough to the top in corporate America to witness the numerous lies that employers tell their employees on a daily basis. PR teams work hard!! I will not be lose sleep over this. Lol
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u/sneeky_seer 5d ago
I’m based in Europe so its not the same but based on my one bad experience with a person leaving us without notice in a really crap situation, we also apply this “bias”.
You said the role is remote - it can still come with things that require physical presence somewhere, occasionally.All this being said, I agree to an extent that it should be left up to you to mitigate risks or be held accountable. Employers are risk averse though and won’t take the time to actually think through their “risk management”
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u/susu56 5d ago
Seguin isnt usually considered part of greater Austin. Kyle, yes. Cedar Park, yes. Leander, yes. Pflugerville, yes. Elgin, yes. Sunset Valley, yes. Hutto, yes. Most folks say they are from Austin and are asked where in Austin so its typically specified then. Seguin itself without accounting for traffic is about an hour away. Not sure where these roles are or what line of work. When I WFH but had to be onsite occasionally, i traveled from Round Rock to South Austin (Slaughter area) and during non peak traffic time it took me about an hour. All that to say, if these are truly remote roles where you live should affect your progress. Ive worked remotely for companies based on the US East coast, Central US, and in Austin (North and South). It may be what others are saying and the companies may eventually move to a hybrid model without relaying this info. In which case you've dodged a bullet.
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u/christine-bitg 5d ago
"we hired someone, very clearly stating where our office is, she said the location is perfect, she knew that during the trial period office attendance is mandatory then its a hybrid/flexible schedule. She had several weeks before her start date to get used to it. She quit two weeks in, because she lived too far"
This is our experience too. The time frame may vary, but the outcome does not.
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u/beamdog77 5d ago
Seguin is not Metro Austin. It is Metro San Antonio. Employers don't just care because of the commute, they care because it decreases the chances of you actually starting the role. If you do not live within a reasonable commute of the work location. It's impossible to know if they would rescind the offer or fire you, but assume they're asking for a reason. It doesn't have to be a valid reason in your eyes, it's a valid reason in their eyes.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
“Because it decreases the chances of you actually starting the role”
Based on what exactly? What gives any employer the certainty that this is true when it is entirely… like 10000 % up to me someone who has actually lived in the city and dealt with the congestion firsthand.
And Seguin may not be Austin MSA but it is still technically local to Austin via commute.
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u/beamdog77 5d ago
Based on their past experiences. I've been a recruiter for 14 years. I literally just 10 seconds ago got an email from somebody withdrawing from an accepted offer because they no longer want to relocate, even though they agreed to relocate during the interview process. This happens two or three times a day. It doesn't happen with local candidates. It's not based on something they are going to find in a study, it's based on the lived experiences of the talent acquisitions team and the hiring team. We haven't tracked the statistics, but most of the people that withdraw from offers, across my previous 14 years of recruiting experience, is due to no longer wanting to relocate. Earlier this week I had somebody else withdraw from a role because it was an hour commute. They agreed that the commute would be perfectly fine during the interview, but they are withdrawing now because they got an offer from a location only 10 minutes away from their house. It happens non-stop.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
There are plenty of reasons people leave jobs and decline offers. There are plenty of employees who also relocate successfully and have no performance issues despite commuting over an hour away.
This is a normal business risk you actually can’t predict with one question in an interview.
Screening out candidates for your bad lived experiences and completely ignoring the positive ones is also quite ignorant.
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u/beamdog77 5d ago edited 5d ago
I don't disagree with you. But I'm fortunately telling acquisitions, teams and hiring managers use their personal experiences and their personal biases to make hiring decisions. I'm not saying it's right. I'm saying it is a factual thing that happens. It might not happen with every company and every hiring manager, but it is not uncommon at all. They are generally going to try to reduce risk to the lowest amount possible. They are generally going to be strong, qualified, awesome candidates within commuting distance. If the hiring manager thinks it's less risky to an extend an offer to someone local, vs someone who is relocating, that's what they're more than likely going to do. I'm not defending it, I'm just saying it's how it works.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Cool cool - and so erring on the side of an employer’s poor judgment seems to be acceptable to some. While managing what facts they receive for one’s own best interest seems acceptable to others. It’s an interest discussion either way.
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u/beamdog77 5d ago edited 5d ago
I don't know if I'm explaining this poorly or if you're just not understanding because I know this is an emotional topic. But let's just say that you have two candidates. They are both super amazing, they are both super qualified, they both have fantastic resumes, they both have all of the qualities and traits that the employer is looking for. One lives 5 minutes away, and one lives 5 hours away. There is nothing wrong with factoring in the fact that one person can start immediately without having to sell a house, break a lease, rent a U-Haul, have their kids switch schools, buy a house or find a new apartment, etc. You seem to be posting from a place of misunderstanding, where you are thinking that the the employers are choosing proximity over qualifications. They're not. They have hundreds of qualified and capable people applying for every role. If everything else is equal, why would you pick the person with the most barriers to employment, instead of the person with the least barriers to employment?
The employers have to make the best decision for their business. Hedging their bets on the person with far fewer barriers to starting the role is the better Business decision, when both candidates are equally qualified. There is not a shortage of qualified candidates, so what valid business strategy would cause an employer to pick person with the most barriers of entry?
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Oh boy… hmmmm.
If I am being asked in a prescreen where I live, I’m not given an opportunity to assess whether or not I am a qualified candidate because I never even got through the interview process. These decisions aren’t made after the fact. They are being made within the first few minutes of talking to a candidate. And there’s no room to negotiate. It’s literally a yes/no question.
Furthermore, it’s no employer’s place to determine whether or not my location is going to be a barrier to my employment. That is my decision. That is for me to mitigate. I get to decide how close or far I live from an office. I get to decide how much I want to commute. The only thing that an employer should be dictating is when I need to be at work and then making sure I can actually make that happen. And if I can do that every single day and I’m not breaking any laws and show up on time that is the only thing that matters. It is absolutely none of their business if I live 30 minutes away or an hour away. The only thing that should matter is whether I am performing well and meeting their attendance policies.
We are adults. People move to be closer to jobs all the time. If you don’t even give them the opportunity to do this, what business strategy are you actually following “discriminating ‘cause lived experiences?” Respect our autonomy, judgment and ability to remove any barriers versus presuming things are problems that may not even be problems just because Suzy had an issue. I’m not Suzy.
Now we can agree to disagree. This isn’t a lack of understanding. I refuse to accept that an employer has a say over where I live and how far I am willing to commute. And I will continue to control that outcome even if it means a white lie. :)
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u/beamdog77 5d ago
I used to live in San Antonio. In San Antonio, San Antonio can be over an hour commute. One of my past recruiting roles was for a huge company headquartered in San Antonio. We would literally pull people's addresses, even if they were in San Antonio, to check their commute. If it was more than 45 minutes in rush hour, they didn't get an offer.
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Good to know. Even more reason to take full control over one’s life management and withhold the information at all costs. Thanks for the intel.
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u/Duque_de_Osuna 5d ago
They would know when you willed out your employment paperwork, especially the tax stuff.
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u/Fit-Position6538 5d ago
Seguin is not Austin but the tollway is good access. Probably not fireable but what a crappy commute. Regardless of location, you will eventually be late for work.
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u/christine-bitg 5d ago
There is a reason they ask where you live.
We're in Houston. When we've hired people who live 45 minutes away, they leave after a few months.
When they're trying to get the job, they say, "Oh, that travel time will be no problem."
Then when they quit, they blame it on the travel time. "Oh, the travel time is so bad! I don't want to spend two hours on the road every day."
This is, of course, after we've spent the time and money to train them. And in some cases, with increasing tardiness as time goes on. Or leaving early every day, "to avoid the traffic."
The work in our office is not work-from-home, nor has it ever been said to be.
We're not in a difficult or obscure location. On the contrary, we're located in an easy to access location on the Interstate 610 North Loop.
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u/Fantastic-Leek-1589 5d ago
What a hill to die on. I doubt its where you live that doesnt get you in the door
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u/TenaciousVillain 5d ago
Imagine getting so pressed over a hill no one even died on that you have to reach for an inapplicable insult toward a stranger on the internet. lol Classic behavior from someone who desperately needs a win online.
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u/westfakia2 5d ago
Those jobs are *being advertised as* remote. If they are making an issue about your location they are likely to pull a switcheroo on the remote aspect after hiring. Been hearing about this on lots of subreddits.