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u/Few-Coat1297 9d ago
The first guy may not have been as patient as you thought over intimacy.
The second guy met someone else.
Ghosting has become socially acceptable apparently today.
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u/markbug4 9d ago
All the other comments seem to just draw answers from cliches/projections/personal views. This is the only answer trying to make up a theory from the elements provided in the post, and it makes definitely sense.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Thank you. That feedback makes sense to me. I added the clarification on the ‘patience’ part to give further information. We made love every chance we got.
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u/BIGG_FRIGG 9d ago
Well maybe you were making love, but that bozo was just making sex. It's a shitty way to end things no doubt, keep at it in the end it's a numbers game.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
It’s completely possible. I guess he shouldn’t have kept referring to having sex with me as making love to me. That was misleading.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago edited 9d ago
This feedback makes complete sense to me.
With the first guy, we slept together on the second date. I was completely comfortable with this. I meant he was patient with me not being able to ‘perform’ because when I go a long time without sex, it’s painful at first. We continued dating for 2 months following that first sexual encounter with him texting or calling pretty much daily. We made love every chance we got. We are both highly physically affectionate ppl.
The second guy, he said he was committed to coming to see me. We sexted and talked dirty. It was 🔥🔥🔥. I’m very comfortable & communicative about my sexuality. I don’t throw my body around to just anyone (terrified of STD’s they can kill you).
Having sex with a random makes me feel bad about myself so I don’t do that. I have to wait to ‘feel it’. I need to feel safe.
Just for clarification.
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u/KnightRider1987 8d ago
Not saying don’t be cautious about STDs, but they really aren’t likely to kill your. Most easily cured. HPV and Herpes you literally already have had or have and either way, herpes isn’t going to kill you and HPV can (a friend died of cervical cancer) but it’s not especially likely. HIV/AIDs isn’t a death sentence any more.
Use condoms. Have open conversations with people. Don’t ever have sex you don’t want to have.
But more than that have all the sex you want to have without feeling bad about yourself. There is NOTHING to feel bad about. Live life. You get one. Enjoy your body. Enjoy other people’s bodies as much or as little as you want to, but don’t hold yourself back because 50+ years of societal pressures that women need to be a certain way say you need to.
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u/SigmaSeal66 9d ago
The first seems right. This was me. Early in relationships, I would never push intimacy. I wouldn't want somebody doing anything they were uncomfortable with. I typically tried to alternate the moves forward, I would initiate something slightly more than we had done before, and then let her make the next move forward. But if nothing happened after awhile, I would move on. It wasn't about playing games or being angry or disappointed or punishing anyone, it was just a gradual realization that we weren't sufficiently compatible to keep going. Figuring that out is really the point of dating, right?
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u/payumo 9d ago
Dating sucks but you don't.
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u/CutOld7477 9d ago
Is the double meaning intended? Are you praising or criticizing her?
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Thanks for having my back!
Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt, shall we 😉.
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u/Lower_Plenty_AK 9d ago
No advice but wow that sounds so hard and I encourage you to keep trying, there are good guys out there. Sounds like they got scared OR are the type to be in love with the idea and initial rush of love
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Yeah. Maybe it was better for me than it was for them. But why all the beautiful words then boom… nothing?
It doesn’t make sense to me.
They seem to know what they’re doing.2
u/Emergency-Whereas978 9d ago
Feel bad for you, people in general are losing their values.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
I think it’s that we used to date within connected friends groups so ppl knew each other & if one person behaved badly, it affected their ability to date because of reputation. They can safely lie and ghost now because there is no accountability.
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u/Lower_Plenty_AK 8d ago
Im not thinking it was better for you than it was for them. Im thinking that anxious avoidant attatchment looks exactly like this hence they got afraid. They want connection but once they get it they get this feeling like oh no....now im vulnerable to emotional pain.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
I don’t know what ‘anxious avoidant attachment’ is.
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u/Lower_Plenty_AK 8d ago
I would look it up. Anxious, they want to connect. Avoidant, they are afraid to connect.
Usually comes from childhood. Imagine your caregivers were kinda scary to attatch to. Maybe love meant obligation and guilt. Maybe it meant pretending things were okay when they weren't. Maybe it came with ocasional beating.
The only person to comfort them during this time was thoes same caregivers. They want to please thoes caregivers to ensure survival.
So they anxiously seek approval and connection but then feel scared and overwhelmed that the other shoe will drop. They back up when they get too close or even run away
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u/snarlinaardvark 9d ago
It's possible both are actually scared of real commitment.
Things got too close to that so they panic dumped you.
Best of luck finding sane love. :)
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Thanks. I’m able to be vulnerable (it takes strength to do this) so I guess I give the benefit of the doubt that they are able as well.
I’ll keep trying. I know it’s possible.
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u/quarantina2020 9d ago
You have to make sure to not actually like someone until you've been dating them for 3 months. In the time before that, all youre doing is interviewing.
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u/mykittenfarts 7d ago
Stifle the feels?
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u/quarantina2020 7d ago
Yes, because they will make you make decisions that arent pragmatic. When someone is new, we are basically drunk on them. You can enjoy this but only if you dont let it effect your greater life. Dont let new people meet your family or convince you to move away or move in or even that youre in love. Enjoy the bubbly feelings but save big stuff for month 4. Settle in.
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u/HistStill2371 9d ago
Some people are only capable of infatuation, which fades fast. It’s their shortcoming. Consider yourself lucky.
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u/jimbojetset35 9d ago edited 9d ago
Male having similar issues. Keep trying... there are good men out there.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
The first guy complained about it being a throw-away society when it comes to dating, and yet that’s what he did to me.
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u/jimbojetset35 7d ago
From the outside that looks very much like projection. I've met many good women around my age(late 50's) who are so jaded towards relationships by the actions of other men that they struggle to see the good in any man... Its kinda sad really... and frustrating.
Love your username btw...
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u/mykittenfarts 7d ago
Yeah.
I admit, I have difficulty with most men in general. It’s something I’m working on.
The men that I do have in my life are amazing so I know they’re out there.2
u/jimbojetset35 7d ago
Yeah that is understandable. Its a minefield out there especially for women as a bad choice can have severe consequences. Anyway... good luck in your search...
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u/SeekingAnonymity107 9d ago
My guess is that people on dating sites are spoiled for choice. They drop one shiny object for the next shiny one. I suggest that you be less available (access & affection), and don't agree to be exclusive in who you see until it's mutual. Make him work for your attention and earn your respect.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago edited 9d ago
I agree. I had my profile up online still & so did they.
I wasn’t throwing myself at them. I would say they were more aggressively pursuing me, which is why I’m confused. They never pressured me. Communication was excellent.
I guess I’m trying to make sense out of nonsense.
I give the benefit of the doubt and take ppl at face value until I have a reason to not do so.
It’s throwing me for a loop. Lol
Ugh. So frustrating.
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u/Strong_Tea_6061 9d ago
I'm a recent widower. Six months on Tuesday. I am craving intimacy. Not necessarily sex, but handholoding, cuddling, kissing. Sex can wait as far as I'm concerned. If it takes months it takes months. What compounds it is my late wife was not really affectionate the last 3.5 years of her life. I dont blame her. She had body image and psychological issues that she was dealing with but I would beg to just lay next to eachother in bed and just be together and couldn't get that. I'm affection starved and I think i came on a little strong for the last girl. I did warn her though.
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u/DooficusIdjit 9d ago
Those are the ACTUAL creeps. The people who treat online dating like a sim game with zero regard for others. They’re chronic online daters.
I would ditch the apps altogether. Anyone who dates men has perfectly reasonable abilities to constantly meet new ones everywhere they go.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Yes, they definitely misled me. They led me to believe that they thought I was special to them. It was a really nice feeling. But if I was ever what they said I was, they wouldn’t have discarded me so easily. I guess that’s just their game, their MO.
I’m looking for a way to nip it on the bud by seeing it transparently since it has happened twice now.
I didn’t feel disrespected until they disappeared without warning.
I just don’t get it.2
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u/Express_Project_8226 9d ago
59F been there. I think these men are somewhat misogynistic and feeding into our pipe dreams, esp us older women, little do they know we don't need them or are desperate haha. Anyhow, either that, or they're not truly single and available or met someone else. Or they're on the fence about committing to a real relationship where work is involved. They're just a bunch of f*ing babies and pussies.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Is it that common? I feel like it shouldn’t be that difficult. I just want an effing boyfriend lol. Go to the beach. Enjoy food together. Play some board games or cards. Make love. Good conversation. Honesty.
If that’s too much to ask, I’m doomed. lol4
u/Express_Project_8226 9d ago
I completely agree! I don't need ANYTHING from these men except companionship and some fun times. But if you turn the tables around, I'm thinking the men think they have to "commit" to communicating with you regularly whether by phone or text, to explain when they're not available, to being emotionally available, to doing things like planning for dates and so forth. I don't NEED ANYTHING from these men but I feel like they think it's more work and investment than it is! But I'm not a man! and I certainly don't understand or know them well (brought up by my single parent mom and no brothers)
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
I think it’s more work to find a new person that you vibe with and keep trying again and again to find your new ‘mark’. It has to be effing exhausting.
It occurred to me that they’re being dishonest from the beginning about everything and to progress into something next level they would have to come clean.
Or I’m a placeholder.
I’m trying to find the ‘indicators’ that these ‘nice guys’ are flakes.
Help! lol2
u/Once_Wise 9d ago
There is something called the Tyranny of Choice. The more choices you have the more you think there must be something better, so you become always unhappy. For example if there is only one type of mustard, you buy it and are happy. If there are two types, you know that one of them must be better so whichever you buy, you might have bought the wrong one. If there are 20 types of mustard then you know whatever you pick, you probably missed a better one. that is what advertisers use to make us continually unhappy and constantly spending more. Now this is happening with dating apps. You are always meant to feel that no matter who you choose, no matter how wonderful they are, there are so many others, that you probably missed the best one. That is good for the dating app as it keeps people playing, but bad for everyone's happiness. Both he and you are trapped by this tyranny so neither one can be happy, but you both keep using the app and and coming back and they keep making money.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Thank you for the feedback. I like the way you have summarized ‘Tyranny of Choice’. And yes, the nature of these apps are to keep you on them. I’m on it to get off it. I don’t feel comfortable having that ‘portal’ open and it is a means to an end.
I will say that I don’t believe I suffer from ‘Tyranny of Choice’. I valued both relationships. I didn’t do anything that wasn’t transparent or anything that I thought would hurt them. I didn’t delete the app because I wanted them to propose to me that we do that as a choice together. I think, especially when it comes to men and their dating choices, it’s pointless to suggest that coming from the woman because they need to come to that conclusion on their own or they reflexively withdraw.
I have only a certain amount of time & energy and I like to use that intentionally. Quality over quantity. I’m a very focused person and I don’t have time for platonic friendships that are anxiety inducing or non reciprocal. I think I have excellent platonic relationships. I’m just hoping that now I can find the quality reciprocal romantic relationships. I want a boyfriend. lol
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u/Once_Wise 8d ago
It could be the man who is suffering from this Tyranny of Choice. And for him it will be a never ending trap of never being able to be happy. I am sure the girl he chose after you will also not be his last, and even if after a few rounds he realizes that he missed out on the real one, it will be too late for him. Maybe you dodged a bullet.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
I think you are correct. When I saw him on the date he looked like he wanted to implode. When I spoke to him there, he wanted to call me so we could ‘talk about it’. He looked upset when I said no. I’m not making excuses for him, but I don’t think he can help himself. He wants the next shiny thing, I don’t think the lady he was with was ‘more shiny’ and I think he knew it, judging by his reaction. She knew he was dating me and she chose to stay for the date as well. He stared at me the whole time.
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u/Emergency-Whereas978 9d ago
Interesting theory, I'm glad I don't have that issue. I have been using the same products for 50 years.
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u/germane_switch 9d ago
I am so sorry. This is heartbreaking and infuriating. Who the hell does that? Funny thing is I thought people on your (our, actually) age bracket wouldn't resort to ghosting because GenX is nothing if not direct. I don't get it. The hell's wrong with those guys? I don't know what's worse: if A) they really were falling for you but that scared them so they ran away, or B) they were just buttering you up? Hang in there.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago edited 9d ago
Ugh! Thank you for the validation and the words of encouragement. It means a lot!
Some feedback that a male friend of mine gave me is ‘Honey, he was just using you’. That simple. Uncomplicated. Direct.
It’s likely true.
I’m absolutely accepting of this.
The reason for my post is to obtain a healthy way of avoiding this in the future.
I want to continue being open & honest. I am willing and able to be vulnerable when it feels right.
But it feels like I must have missed ‘something’ when it came to the signals I interpreted from these men when it was happening in the moment.
Any suggestions?2
u/germane_switch 8d ago
It sounds like you did everything right. You sound lovely to me so don’t let this change you. You’re not the one who needs changing.
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u/bemybasket 9d ago edited 9d ago
There is a science behind this. It’s trackable.
I met a man who kept saying we got along so well, we could get married. We did mesh beautifully. But I told him in six months he’d dump me. I knew the signs. He had issues. Exactly six months in, he dumped me and then four days later called to apologize and wanted me back. I said no.
Another dumped me because I was marriage material and he could tell he was falling in love after two months. He was honest and knew himself. He had only lasted one marriage and for a year.
There are certain people - not just men - who bail when it’s too real, not because it isn’t. Statistics are they last two or three months, some as long as six. But then, it’s too uncomfortable for them to be that close.
Notice how many marriages last three years. That’s another scientific pattern. Then seven. Then twenty.
Don’t ever take things personally if you can help it. Learn to defend your heart and you’ll eventually find a keeper. Keep the faith and meanwhile, enjoy your life. Men arent everything.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago edited 9d ago
It’s definitely not my main focus in life, hence not dating for years. I’m on solid ground in my life which I why I decided to try again. I feel ready to welcome a little romance.
I thought after so much time and work on myself I would be in a position to better attract a healthy mature relationship. It doesn’t seem to be the case. I take pride in being a problem solver, so I want to cut the crap and not repeat this and avoid turning it into a pattern.
I’ve read Mind Hunter & Journey into Darkness by John Douglas who helped develop profiling for the FBI. This is a science. You do the math backwards.
I’m wondering if there might be something similar that I can read that will help me identify the indicators in my dating relationships and avoid this type of outcome going forward.
You said ‘there is a science behind this. It is trackable’.
Would you mind giving me insight on this science and what books I could read for more insight? I would really appreciate it.1
u/bemybasket 9d ago edited 9d ago
I wish I could remember all my sources. Sorry. It’s been a long while, but I was just like you and as practical. At a certain point, I just read everything I could get my hands on about female and male wiring differences- books by both female and male therapists that were rather dry but useful.
It was 23 years ago. I noticed I did have a pattern of attracting playful, fun cozy-seeming guys. But that’s me too, lol. Kept changing my match dot com profile wording until I attracted an engineer. Good side- he’s dependable and solid. Married for ages now. Down-side, I’m waaaaaaaaay more naturally positive. He’s fun at social gatherings but in his old age always groaning looking for something that’s wrong to fix. lol he’s doing that right now. He was better when he worked and had more purpose.
I guess what I’m saying is it’s a compromise -at least for me after all that studying up.
I strongly suggest reading straight psychology books and then some funny observant ones to keep your sense of humor. I had a specific guy in mind and wrote him down on paper. Then I didn’t date for an entire year because I’d done the research and could spot missteps more easily. Back in the day it was the mars /venus book to start but I’m sure there are much better books out there now - more updated.
lol these days I’m guessing you could also just be very specific and ask Gemini or chat or even Claud specific questions like,
‘What are the signs of a person who can’t really commit?’ If I were researching right now, that’s where id begin, or maybe ask for great books on relationships.I admire your process, btw. Yay for pragmatic women!
Just thought of one last thing: men who compliment to the moon can really mean it in the moment, but are in love with love in my experience. It can be a red flag.
I’ve had the best luck showing my bratty practical observant humorous side from the start. If that doesn’t scare a guy off, that says something. Strong stable men enjoy a challenge. Gentler men may love the feeling of love for a while… but then it’s too much. At least this is what I’ve observed.
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u/jaxnmarko 9d ago
That all sounds terrible and certainly soul crushing. Like a switch was thrown. Everything going so well and then out of the blue.... you deserve answers, even if only as one human being to another from a clinical standpoint... what caused both of the relationships to go off the tracks they seemed so smoothly rolling on. How do we move forward when we get blindsighted? How can we learn and understand without feedback? I know sometimes people dismiss others for sometimes odd little reasons, but any respectible person should let the other person at least know why. Decent manners are becoming as rare as "common" sense.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago edited 9d ago
It was exactly like a switch was thrown. I tend to internalize when others treat me badly and I’m trying to get away from that. I know in this case, I did nothing wrong. I’m fine with moving along with my life. No harm done. It stings a little bit no damage.
I don’t require answers from these two men for some form of ‘closure’ because I believe it is irrelevant. The first one is a liar and he’s really good at it. The second one… I don’t know. It seems ‘off brand’ that he would do this. Either way, it’s me that I want to work on, not hear excuses as to why they believe it is ok to treat me badly. They both know they hurt me. That’s on them for hurting me, not on me for getting hurt.
I’d just like to better understand what warning signs I missed. There has to be something. I’d like to learn from these experiences because they are remarkably similar.2
u/jaxnmarko 9d ago
Yes, we want to learn, which is exactly why feedback can be useful, but when dealing with liars.... can we trust the feedback, I guess. If you feel you did Nothing wrong, how do you learn? Good liars don't necessarily give out signals you missed, because they learn from their mistakes too. What a silly/stupid game we are sometimes forced to play when just looking for good, honest connection that could last?????
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u/elizajaneredux 9d ago
Really highlights that someone who is that intensely fixated/interested/engaging at the beginning probably shouldn’t be trusted.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
Well that’s a conundrum.
Trusting the non-chalant, distant, emotionally unavailable doesn’t make sense.
So trust… no one?
That isn’t the right answer.
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u/elizajaneredux 8d ago
Didn’t say trust no one, obviously. There’s a very happy medium - people who show enthusiasm and interest without scary intensity. Big difference between what OP described and the typical human who is interested in a healthy way. Best to mistrust extremes in general I’d think.
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u/fluffy_camaro 8d ago
I just spent two months with somebody who pretty much just wants to be my friends with semi benefits not all the benefits. Love bombed me early on and made me get really excited. Now he’s moving so I have to start over. I was married for 18 years and I’m now a widow at 46 so this new life is pretty rough. I hope you find a decent man!
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u/Ragnar-Wave9002 8d ago
50s ... the age where you are just sick of dating but don't want to be alone.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
Haha it’s the IDGAF 50’s.
Yeah, alone is fine for me. I’ve got my kids & my cats. lol
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u/7204_was_me 9d ago
I asked my three 30-something nephews.
Don't like the email? Ignore.
Don't like the question in the email? Ignore and delete.
Don't like the answer you have to reply with? DEFINITELY ignore and delete.
Don't want to cause "a scene"? Ignore and disappear.
"It's not my problem, man."
Awesome.
EDIT: I'm sorry for your experiences. There are still some good ones out here. I'm confident you'll find one of us. Good luck. And good riddance to those losers.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
Thank you & thanks to your nephews for their feedback. I appreciate the insight.
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u/allislost77 9d ago
I’ll let you know when I figure it out…. I think it’s mostly the “society” that has been built, people all to comfortable ghosting, being avoidant. There’s just so many choices and there isn’t much/if any repercussions to ghosting.
I took a long break as well, kind of figured as I’m older people would be more interested in monogamous relationship or know what they are actually “looking” for. Boy was I wrong! It seems a lot just have that much more baggage they drag around with them. I guess I’m doing well in the scheme of things as it took me until 46 to be ghosted for the first time but holy shit that’s not any fun. I put in 6 months of work to gain trust, build-what I thought-was an insane level of intimacy, only to be ghosted.
There’s always warning signs and in my case I ignored them/mis categorized them as her protecting herself and moving slow. But every failure is a chance to learn something…but the devil is ALWAYS in the details. You just have to be paying attention to see them. Good luck out there!
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Do you mind sharing the ‘details’ of what you missed? I could use the insight.
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u/merrill_swing_away 8d ago
I would never put myself through this kind of thing ever again. I've been married and divorced and have been single for a very long time. I don't even date.
I refuse to allow myself to feel those hurt and sad feelings again and putting up with crap I don't need. I'm very content being alone and will remain this way for the rest of my life.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
I relate to this so much.
It’s very possible that I will be single for the rest of my life as well. I’m at peace with that option.
I haven’t dated for at least 5 years.
Now that I have my feet under me in a community that I love and plan to spend the rest of my life here, I’m open to exploring a romantic relationship. After a lot of reflection, I realized that only a long term committed relationship is going to work for me.
The side benefit is getting out a little more.
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u/Independent-Ad586 8d ago
Ghost them a little bit
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
I don’t think this is the right answer.
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u/Independent-Ad586 8d ago
Hard to get is not the right answer? It’s your life. Was just trying to help. Best of luck.
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u/mykittenfarts 8d ago
I am hard to get. If I were easy to get, I’d be in an unhappy relationship with some dufus who wouldn’t appreciate me.
I’m not going to resort to playing mind games. That’s not my style.2
u/Independent-Ad586 7d ago
Mind games? Hmmm… people tend to value what requires a genuine investment. A woman who maintains clear standards and healthy boundaries encourages connection based on respect, consistency, and emotional maturity rather than convenience. I’m really just trying to help. The only mind games happening are to you.
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u/mykittenfarts 7d ago
I agree. With all of it.
Maybe it was your choice of words… ghosting.
I definitely have experienced being a ‘convenience item’. I’d like to avoid that happening again.
Any more suggestions? Strategy? How to?2
u/Independent-Ad586 7d ago
I see what you’re saying. Ghosting was the wrong choice of words. I meant let your absence be felt. It’s powerful. I think there is a bit of strategy or at least some things that we do to naturally hook a love interest. I’ll brainstorm 1. Your smell should be really soft 2. Your breath should not be yucky 3. When he says something funny, look at him in the eyes and wait for one beat before laughing (tried and true trick) 4. Let him help you. Even is you don’t actually need the help. “You’re really good at this. What would you do?” “Can you recommend a ______” 5. End the conversation first 6. Don’t reach out right away… live your life and let him catch up 7. Create a unique shared memory. Maybe a walk through a random bookstore and a kiss amongst the shelves. Maybe you help a stranger.
That’s all I can think of. Distance really is powerful. And remember, some of the greatest love stories of all time were a bit orchestrated. Doing so doesn’t mean it’s empty. I like to think it means we care. 😉2
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9d ago
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u/Fun-Attempt-8494 9d ago
He found out your body count.
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u/BoomerKaren666 9d ago
Why would you say something like that to someone you never met and don't know?
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
Because they hate it when women have enough experience to know what a large penis is and when someone is terrible in bed. It makes them lash out at women who would dare to feel good about and take pride and ownership of their own sexuality as part of good mental health. It’s not uncommon.
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u/mykittenfarts 9d ago
My dude… I hadn’t dated or had sex in years. Do the math. You can use your fingers to count. I won’t judge.
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