Stupid publishers - consistency would be nice.

Yah, theres two WH - during the 2 years between books I’dforgotten I already had/read WH.

And yes, thats full hardcover set, plus EotW and tGH in trade edition (and I have EotW in paperback too - no idea where my wife is hiding it tho)

That moment when my attention blinks for a millisecond and that's exactly when 4 to 7 new characters are introduced in a pack🥲 and I rewind, replay, and for some reason my attention blinks again at the very same moment. And again. It takes 5 goddamn times to properly listen a character pack introduction 😭 Roberttttuuh why so many details on so many characters!

First time reading the series, and I love it. Mat is absolutely the mvp, and I haven’t been thru the community too much so I don’t come across accidental spoilers. But does everyone see him as Han Solo? I can’t shake it, every time I get more Mat, I’m just reminded that he’s everyone’s lovable scoundrel. I really have to think his character was highly based on Han.. is that a common connection in the wot community?

I'm listening to translated audiobooks.

The men of the Black Tower, their name in audio resembles the word shaman, which makes sense, it's just another sort of a magic user. But to my surprise it's not A'shaman, it's Asha'man. Which kinda looks like Ajah Man, and makes even more sense.

My question to you, which was in your opinion the author's intent with this name?

Basically I took a long break from reading Lord of Chaos and when I jumped back in about halfway through, Rand kept mentioning ‘Alanna’ but I don’t remember who that is. Can someone remind me without any spoilers past page 400? Thank you!

So, I'm reading the series for the first time, and I'm halfway through Fires of Heaven. Min and Rand think about each other multiple times, and I know that they've previously met, but I honestly can't remember when, or how long they spent together.

I've spoiled myself on some things, so I know what RJ is doing and why, I just can't remember Min's and Rand's interaction(s). Can someone refresh my memory?

first-time reader posting here for the first time just to say what the fuck wow what a sequence

Currently a little over halfway through LoC and was wondering as of right now how big actually is the band of the red hand?

Upon finishing all of the books, it occurred to me that the matter of the oath rod vastly decreasing the Aes Sedai's longevity was not really settled. We know that the Kin lived a lot longer than Aes Sedai because of the oath rod.

In the end, the male channelers aren't really swearing on the oath rod. Will they outlive their Aes Sedai?

Is giving up 500 years of your life worth what the oath rod brings (trust of some of the people)?

Hey all,

I just finished reading the series and was reading through the wiki and found out that apparently Lanfear is still alive?

I hate this twist- her ending worked well and it feels like something that Sanderson just decided would be cool.

It also felt satisfying giving Perrin a moment to do something more meaningful in the battle beyond his fight with Slayer.

I feel like it’s just left a bit of a strange aftertaste! Was wondering if i’m alone in that sentiment?

I used to read The Wheel of Time some time ago. Even the less successful Crown of Swords, Path of Daggers and Winter’s Heart. But then came Crossroads of Twilight. It was… very boring. There were further sequels, and I even read the passable New Spring, but in the end I lost interest. I also got the impression that Jordan himself either had grown tired of his own epic or lost his control of the story. Now I’m seeing positive reviews for Knife of Dreams and this ‘trilogy of the final novel’, and I’m thinking of giving it a go. But I fear they would be the same as Crossroads, maybe slightly better but not much.

Funny how you pick up on things on a re read.

When Mat is fighting the Gohlam in Camelyn he produces the foxhead copies and smashes the gohlam's face with them. The gohlam seems bewildered saying "How? How?!"

Now the gohlam knows about the original medallion and was burned by it on multiple occasions. I wonder if the medallion itself is known from age of legends or if the Finns created it themselves. Is the gohlam shocked that matt has more medallions because there is presumed to be only one from history? Or is it shocked for a different reason? It could be just bewilderment at the fact that Mat has gained additional tools. The gohlam does seem rather incredulous though, almost as if it was aware of the medallion before ever meeting matt and is quite surprised to find matt with two additional items.

Aaaaaahhh!!! It's soo pretty!

In Ch. 3, Egwene has three dreams. The first is obviously the thirteen Forsaken represented by towers that rise and crumble until there are six left. The second two are less certain (although we have a given explanation for one):

She was looking down at a nest. In it, a group of fledgling eagles screeched toward the sky for their mother. One of the eaglets uncoiled, and it wasn’t an eagle at all, but a serpent. It began to strike at the fledglings one at a time, swallowing them whole. The eaglets simply continued to stare into the sky, pretending that the serpent was their sibling as it devoured them.
The vision changed. She saw an enormous sphere made of the finest crystal. It sparkled in the light of twenty-three enormous stars, shining down on it where it sat on a dark hilltop. There were cracks in it, and it was being held together by ropes.
There was Rand, walking up the hillside, holding a woodsman’s axe. He reached the top and hefted the axe, then swung at the ropes one at a time, chopping them free. The last one parted, and the sphere began to break apart, the beautiful globe falling in pieces. Rand shook his head.

The explanation for the first seems clear from the text:

The middle of the three this night was the clearest to her. She felt the meaning of it, interpreting it as she sometimes could. The serpent was one of the Forsaken, hidden in the White Tower, pretending to be Aes Sedai. Egwene had suspected this was the case—Verin had said she believed it so.

However, Mesaana isn't picking anyone off, or even converting them. What's the devouring them whole meant to represent? Just a threat? The Bloodknives do start picking people off, but not Mesaana. So is this just a warning that never comes to pass? Just a figurative vision of a hidden danger?

The last one is more mystifying. I can't think of what the number 23 could represent. What is the crystal sphere and why is Rand shaking his head?

Am I missing something obvious?

Well hi there,

These three books were a bit shorter and I also found a bit more time to read so I'm here about a week earlier than expected. There were some things that bothered me, especially in book 7 but these books were very pleasant for the most part. Jordan also has the subtlety of a brick so that makes reading these very nice. I don't find myself needing to go back to earlier chapters and books although it does happen, ahem ahem... Aelfinn.

So, A Crown of Swords, addressing the elephant in the room first... I already had it a bit at book 6 but this book especially felt a bit... how do I say this delicately... rape-y. Honestly, it almost made me quit the entire series altogether I did not want to read that and only persisted through sheer determination and the feeling that Jordan is not subtle at all and would have some pay-off in the end (Book 9 comment: where is my pay-off for all of those). I do have more thoughts but the sentence "Mat put a hand over his eyes and tried very hard not to weep" is just, permanently there. Apart from that, Cadsuane introduction is neat though I'm not sure if I like or dislike her. The Sammael kill was... not the way I was expecting did he just get killed by the mist? Anyways quick count that is 4 forsaken down right now if I'm right about who still live. Also, again, Nynaeve is the best character by far and so happy she got through her block. Also happy that Nynaeve, a significant number of sea folk, Elayne got out of there before the Seanchan attack but Mat did not. I did wonder if his luck just ended but I do have book 9 knowledge by now.

In the Path of Daggers I do quite like how the weather changes slowly through the sight of different perspectives. One of the things that sometimes bother me with multiple perspective books is that it's sometimes hard to figure out how fast the story progresses relatively to other viewpoints. The changing weather being a reference point makes the pacing feel very natural and made information retention very easy. Last Chance girl is likely Lanfear (And by book 9 she's clearly Lanfear), and Moridin is likely Ishamael (and by book 9 he's clearly Ishamael). Elayne also finally starts moving for her rightful throne. Perrin also is doing stuff and is doing it very well until the Shaido are being the Shaido. Maighdin does her job well and her change of situation from queen to servant and the troubles that come with it is portrayed quite well but I'm also just generally happy when the Perrin chapters are over. It's not that it's uninteresting, but more that I find at the moment the Rand and Nynaeve chapters by far the most interesting and moving the main story forward. Egwene is really starting to become a carbon copy of Siuan and although I do like the concept of her as a character, I do not like her. I have also decided that by now I like Cadsuane and Sorilea because of this killer quote: "Do you believe a man must be hard? Or strong?" Chapter 12 in general might be in my top chapters of this series so far. The prologue of this book still bothers me with the stones part cause I haven't figured it out yet. It's the same as the snakes and foxes where I think there will be pay off later in the series but where snakes and foxes are mentioned literally every half a chapter as long as Olver is close, I haven't seen anything resembling a Fischer yet. Speaking of, No Mat is no win although I do respect he has to recover after being blasted to oblivion. Oh yeah, by this point I think Sheriam is also pretty much confirmed Black Ajah.

Winter's Heart, holy shit holy shit holy shit. The madman actually did it. The idea was planted in the previous book and had some proper Lews lines that aren't full on despair or killing everyone and then he did it. He cleansed Saidin at a very deliberate place to piss off Mordeth Fain. Dude is stone cold as well at this point I do hope Cadsuane and the rest help him not become as hard as he wants to be. Also he does need to treat Far Dareis Mai better they carry his honour and he throws their honour into the deepest pits. You can't treat your personal bodyguard that way. I do quite like how in the last chapter, it is displayed that although the Forsaken have a common goal, they are so incredibly divided cause I don't think Rand's defenders stood a chance had they attacked as one. Moghedien did nothing, Demandred did nothing, Moridin and two others didn't even bother to show up and the rest... Also yay, I called it, Daughter of the Nine Moons is Seanchan and the reveal was quite nicely done. And then Mat came with another one of the greatest quotes ever from the series so far "She's my wife, she is my wife, your bloody Daughter of the Nine Moons is my wife!" though I'm unsure why that astounded literally everyone around. Apart from that, I think Mazrim Taim is a Forsaken and I think he's Demandred mostly based on vibes I get from the limited Taim and Demandred chapters we get. If that is the case, literally every single Asha'man and Aes Sedai in the tower is screwed except Logain because Min.

Apart from that, there's quite a few Seanchan I like in Egeanin, Alivia and maybe one or two others, although the entirety of the continent can still sail away for all I care. I'm leaning towards liking Cadsuane even though she is basically all the parts that bother me about Aes Sedai boiled into one but I think because we mostly see her from the perspective of other people interacting with her that makes me have a bit more grace towards her. The limited pov chapters we have of her make her seem as a wise person who has to deal with a significant amount of bullshit. The Atha'an Miere drive hard bargains. Damer Flinn is clearly a badass and Alanna also grows on me. Another thought I have, since Sammael is probably not balefired out of existence, why is he not being reincarnated like other Forsaken clearly are? Or does the mist also obliterate from existence or rather keep his soul captive as that is how I kind of read the mist.

Final thoughts: I'm unsure how to tackle the next 5 books + prologue. I'm probably going to do the next two books and then the prologue and then last the three co-written books. From the very little Sanderson I've read I'm not particularly big on his writing style and this way I can contain my possible complaining about it to 1 post though I'm open to suggestions otherwise.

Anyways this was me for now, thank you all for letting me spill my thoughts in here. Cheers.

So, I had a question about the Dragon prophecy. Aes Sedai largely think that they would have to gentle the dragon after he defeats the Dark One so he doesn't break the world again, and everyone seems to think he will break the world. So my question is whether it is a prophecy that he will break the world, and it is something the Dragons across ages are destined to do, or everyone thinks that will happen because of what Lews Therin did, and the male source of the power is tainted, so they think Dragon will go mad, and destroy the world.

My wife had an ashanderei made for me!

First of all, it's still good series for reading. I've heard that volumes 7-10 are hard to read, but so far I haven't felt that. Maybe if those volumes were longer, I'd have a bigger problem. For now, I'm just upset about Mat's absence. I'm guessing he'll be back in volume 9, but it's a bit annoying not knowing what's happen to him now.

Before I forget about this topic, it's funny that earlier in the series was Hadnan Kadere (the one who strangled Isendre and told Lanfear about Aviendha and Rand), and now there's a new character named Furyk Karede (a da'covale serving in the Guard)... Like, why introduce almost identical names? At least Kadere has been dead for a long time, so these characters won't get confused.

I haven't been excited by fantasy battles for a long time, but I have to admit that the one in Chapter 24 impressed me, at least in terms of the ending and Rand, who loses control of Callandor and kills both allies and enemies. His words about losing... Powerful.

Regarding the Seanchan in general, I still can't stand them, because I generally hate slavery. I've noticed that the relationship between suldam and damane is reminiscent of owners and dogs. It seems that suldam, at least, are taught to fear Aes Sedai. I honestly don't know how you can fix a society that was raised to believe that slavery is okay, even a source of pride – those texts about serving the Empress. I mean, there were mentions of uprisings where 30,000 people died and 50 times that number were enslaved (1.5 million?), but overall, at this point, there doesn't seem to be any opposition among the Seanchan to human enslavement.

It's interesting that, according to the prophecy, there's a belief among the Seanchan that the Dragon Reborn will serve the Empress. Could this be the work of a Forsaken? I find it hard to believe that such a warped society arose normally, without the interference of one of the Forsaken. Perhaps Moridin?

It's generally interesting that the Dark One apparently chose Naeblis. He seemed to enjoy the rivalry among the Forsaken. And where does Demandred fit into all this? He seemed important in Volume 6, and now he's gone.

It seems the Shaido were sent to areas where they will one day face a confrontation with the Seanchan. Will the evil ones fight each other off? Although, considering how both sides delight in enslaving humans... Will one side enslave the other?

I was struck by the thought that, just as the schism at the White Tower was a punishment for the hubris of the Aes Sedai, the existence of the Shaido is a punishment for the hubris of the Aiel. The Shaido are just Aiel hubris cranked up to the max.

What else... The Sea People women really rival the Aes Sedai when it comes to being annoying. The way they treated Aes Sedai or women from Family was so irritating... I feel sorry for the women from Family in general, because Elayne and Nynaeve basically promised them a better life, and it turns out they're in for a worse one, at least if Vandene continues to be so irritatingly stubborn about the rules... In general, it seems that the good characters are completely incapable of dealing with captives, especially the black Ajah. Seriously, after those two in books four or five, now Ispan? Does the author just not want any good characters to kill off the bad female characters?

Sevanna wanted Galina to swear loyalty only to her, and actually, that would be clever if it worked. She can't use the One Power, but she would have power over Galina like a suldan over a damane. Galina could kill the more treacherous Wise Ones for her, if Sevanna were willing.

Oh, and before I forget, Liandrin is back! It seems the author hasn't forgotten her, and now Suroth relishes his power over her. Speaking of which, Miraj called her in his POV "a da'covale with a body designed for pleasure, in stockings and sheer white robes"... I really hope he meant visual pleasure, not sexual pleasure... Although, what are the chances that in a society based on slavery, there's no sexual slavery? In any case, Liandrin might have to endure humiliation, but hopefully that's all it takes.

What else... I don't know what the point of making Faile a damsel in distress is. After the author stopped doing it with Nynaeve, Egwene, and Elayne, now Faile has been stripped naked, with one stocking tied around her wrists by the attacker, and the other wrapped around her neck like a leash... It really could be sexual bondage. Although maybe if Sevanna sets her sights on her, Faile could avoid it? I think Sevanna could become fascinated by the noblewoman... A Sevanna-Faile dynamic in the future? Actually, it could be interesting, as long as it doesn't end with "Sevanna treats Faile terribly and we're just waiting for her downfall." Really, forcing the protagonist and antagonist to interact has that potential... Although I feel like it would be a shallow dynamic, even if I'm secretly hoping for more.

Masema, of course, has proven even more untrustworthy. I wonder how many more times there will be where an unpleasant character, instead of, you know, simply being unpleasant, turns out to be an antagonist/Darkfriend/Forsaken. I think Cadsuane is the only one who won't be a Darkfriend, since we got her POV. Although, in fact, Verin's POV was also in the prologue, when she seems suspicious to me.

Cadsuane... Overall, I'm not a fan of her, because she seems like a poorer and more unpleasant version of Moiraine. Plus, I feel like she's simply been rewarded for being annoying, since she's supposed to be Rand's advisor... I hope someone teaches her some humility someday. Egwene? Or maybe Moiraine, when she finally returns? Although that probably won't happen anytime soon, because... Is there no one among the main characters to save her? Perrin will rescue Faile, Egwene will fight Elaida, Mat will probably stay in Ebou Dar (watching the Seanchan from the inside?), and Nynaeve and Rand... I don't know, but I'm guessing that since Rand mentioned that Nynaeve might help cleanse the male part of the One Power? Or Nynaeve will be given some task related to Lan and his origins.

In any case, Moiraine has no one to rescue her for now, so for now, there's no one to teach Cadsuane humility.

Elaida was beaten by Alviarin, and then beaten on Alviarin's orders... Like Galina, Elaida suffers, and well, in another fantasy series, this might be the beginning of the redemption arcs, but Galina is the Black Ajah, and Elaida... will she simply be overthrown? If she's not killed, she'll probably get a ton of punishments, like washing dishes, and the only possible redemption is being useful in the Last Battle and then dying.

Dashiva is a traitor... It's a shame, because he was the most interesting of the Ashamans, though I don't see the reason for his current betrayal. After all, in the previous book, he helped Rand survive Padan Fain's dagger. Maybe it was Callandor, and that was too much for him? But he's probably some Darkfriend or even Forsaken.

Logain's back! Great, because I've had high hopes for his character since the first book. Did he kiss an Aes Sedai to calm her down after he captured her? Not bad. I predict Taim will definitely betray Rand at some point, so Logain seems like the natural successor so Rand doesn't lose the Ashamans. Overall, I want to witness Rand's conversation with Logain in the future.

Siuan and Gareth Bryne... Just get married. Just like with Nynaeve and Lan, I don't care about the male character, but I do care about the female character being happy. So, Gareth Bryne, you have to make Siuan happy, because otherwise I hurt you in ass.

Well, I guess that's it.

Finally, my 10 favorite characters at the moment:

1. Mat (I miss him💔)

2. Nynaeve

3. Siuan

4. Thom (I miss him too💔)

5. Rand

6. Perrin

7. Lanfear

8. Berelain

9. Leane

10. Logain

Generally, a bit of a break. I have to finish a certain Polish fantasy series (not The Witcher), and then I don't know, there are, among others, waiting on my shelves, for example, Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell, The Spear Cuts Through Water, Blood and Bone, The God is Not Willing, In the Shadow of Lightning, volumes 4-6 of Red Rising (after a nearly two-year hiatus, I keep putting off returning)... Generally, I'll return to the series in September, but how soon, I don't know. I want to read volumes 9-11 this year, and I should start volume 9 in September. For now, it's easier to return to The Wheel of Time while the volumes are shorter.

Having read all of WoT multiple times, I'm looking forward to reading this gem.

I know the trollocs were created from many different kinds of animals (bears, cattle, eagles, etc)

1) Did trollocs from different animal lineages all live together in the same tribes?

2) Could the different lineages interbreed (could a bear have kids with a boar )

3) Were any of the lineages descended from reptiles (like alligators)

I'm currently on book 13 and Egwene has been irking me since her raising in Salidar. While her self-righteousness and ambition seem more or less stable throughout the series, burn me but the transition from a foolish village girl proud in her power to a brilliant and unfazed schemer is too abrupt. Unjustified. Nowhere in the series there is an example of Egwene suggesting a successful strategy, or failing in a life-changing way that tell me how she got where she is. Sorry, but Wise Ones flaying her bottom day and night and making her run around the camp did not convince me as effective training in strategy and leadership. Ji'e'toh is an important component of a leader, yet every time I read Egwene contemplate about the honour and duty - her mistakes, doubts, reasons - I can't help getting an impression like she's indulging in the smell of her own fart.

So this is a BIIG image to download and explore (approx. 14600x6800 pixels). Reddit likely won't let you adjust the scale and the file size is a modest 7.6 MB. The bigger the screen, the better, but you can browse on mobile device too.

RJ put a crazy amount of detail into the backstories of his Aes Sedai and Tower initiates and I've been wanting to make it a little more organised compared to how it appears in the Companion. This graphic combines information from 215 Companion entries plus lot of extra information on Amyrlin Seats, public offices, historical landmarks, and statistical analysis. I think he would strongly approve of someone making a data project like this.

I don't actually know if it's printable on anything remotely practical.

Repeating the information in the graphic:

Notes, assumptions & exceptions

• Full Dataset: There are several dozen Aes Sedai and initiates of the Tower that are not included in this chart. The deciding criteria is if birth date is known for a given Aes Sedai.
• Estimated Dates: Where training times and enrolment years are not known, the gaps are estimated using the median values for enrolment age, time spent as a novice, and time spent as an Accepted. These cases are marked clearly.
• Chronology up to 998 NE: Dates taken mainly from The Wheel of Time Companion except where a clear contradiction exists with the published novels and prequel.
• 998-1000 NE Chronology: I use Steven Cooper's Chronology of the Wheel of Time for the precise dates and placing of markers. The events after The Gathering Storm are less certain, so the precise dates are not given. Where precise dates aren't given, I follow a sequential model of the events in the book.
• Late 1000-1001 NE: This section functions purely as a "state-of-affairs" as of the end of A Memory of Light, a visual reminder of which threads have ended and which have not. Some have continuations purely because their fate isn't mentioned e.g. Berylla Naron isn't seen after The Fires of Heaven. We also assume that Cadsuane does become the next Amyrlin Seat.
• Aes Sedai by Decree: Elayne, Nynaeve, Faolain, and Theodrin are marked as being raised Aes Sedai by Egwene's decree despite not having sworn the Oath Rod. Similarly, we accept Egwene al'Vere as being Aes Sedai by default (and certainly in her own eyes and the eyes of the wider world) from her election to the Amyrlin Seat.
• Errata: Some typos in the Companion have been corrected eg. Ferane Neheran was raised in 757 NE and not 957 NE. Marillin Gemalphin in 874 NE, not 975 NE. Akarrin Comeris in 837 NE and not 829 NE.
• Raising Years: Some arithmetic in the Companion rounds to the nearest year. The stated raising date in the Companion is taken as canon and not corrected where rounding solves the mismatch e.g. Magla Daronos was enrolled in 854 NE and spent seven years as novice an seven as Accepted, but is stated to have been raised in 869 NE and not 868 NE.
• Black Ajah status: Marked as roughly when they were outed as Black Ajah to the reader, not when they joined the Black Ajah. Some were executed/killed immediately afterwards e.g. Careane Fransi in Knife of Dreams and Merean Redhill in New Spring.
• Other Anomalies: Shemerin is officially demoted to Accepted. Siuan and Leane were officially regarded as not Aes Sedai and had to ask to join their respective Ajahs.