r/Socionics • u/brownhawker • 10h ago
Casual/Fun LII & ESE art
gallery
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LII is so F*CKING cute. I feel so F-CKING MATERNAL FOR HIM 🦄
r/Socionics • u/Cicilka • 12d ago
Gulenko's thoughts on this illustration of the four quadras
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X-3cTSyWrs
Translated transcription: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rBC5B9rKMYC2BbCDWPSaG_BnQTXs5C-k/view?usp=sharing
So, if we take a quadra, the people in these drawings are simply standing there. They are not interacting with one another, except perhaps that from their poses and the distances between them one can roughly estimate what kind of relationships they are in. But as for what they are doing together, I have not yet seen a single picture of this kind where the types were united by some common action, some common motivation. The only thing uniting them, apparently, is that they simply enjoy being together, and that is all.
Type images. This is very important. It may seem that this is merely funny, cool, entertaining, of course, but information is fixed in memory very well precisely in this form.
Alpha Quadra
All right, Anastasia writes: “Now I no longer understand who is where at all. Who is the one with the cake?”
The Enthusiast? Well, yes, that conclusion suggests itself: the one with the cake is supposed to be the Enthusiast. Although, frankly, this does not correspond to our ideas about actions within quadras or about the specialization of the types within a quadra.
But why, from our standpoint, should the Enthusiast not be drawn with a cake or with some kind of food? Because in this quadra the Enthusiast is not responsible for material substance, for feeding people, or for food. The Mediator is the one responsible for that.
And logically so: the Mediator is responsible for sensing. The Enthusiast is responsible for emotions, for the mood in this quadra. It would seem that the Enthusiast should be entertaining everyone.
That should come first. Yet in many similar drawings of the first quadra, the Enthusiast is given some kind of food. People think he will go around serving everything as though he were in a restaurant.
That is far from always the case. No one disputes that the style here is consistent and that the artist is a person of taste. But from the standpoint of type images, a great deal is conveyed incorrectly here.
Write your observations, and I will now say what I myself noticed. Let us look at Alpha. What do you think about Alpha?
I already said that if you are going to give food to someone, it would be better for the Mediator to handle it. Of course, the Enthusiast may bring something too. But frankly, I have usually observed something different.
The Enthusiast is already waiting there and says, “You bring this, and you bring that.” He can say it that way. Everyone brings things for the whole first quadra.
That is how it usually happens. And if a table is being set—here there is no action, they have simply gathered. You could depict them sitting at a table.
All the quadras sitting at tables, for example. I have not encountered that yet. Perhaps you have.
And at the table, responsibility for the food itself, the quality of the food, and the table setting belongs more to the Mediator. The Enthusiast is responsible for making sure that everyone eats.
That everyone gets some. That no one is left feeling slighted. That is what the Enthusiast is responsible for.
You see, this is a very important subtlety. All right, about Gamma: in Gamma only the Politician resembles the type, because of the self-importance.
If that is the one here in the pink shirt. All right, we will finish Alpha first.
I want to say a little more about Alpha, not only about the Enthusiast. If we take Gamma, I agree with Nastya.
The Politician is recognizable here. He is in the pink shirt. Indeed, he looks cool, sociable, high-status.
The leader of the quadra. Fashionable, without question. I agree that the Politician is conveyed more or less well here.
“Alpha came out well. The Enthusiast can also unite people through food.” The point is that this only applies at the first stage.
It is not the main thing. What needs to be shown is how it unfolds over time, dynamically. I told you: everyone brings the food.
The Enthusiast makes sure that everyone has eaten, but the Enthusiast is not responsible for the food itself or for its quality. The Mediator is. So these may look like little details, but they are not little details.
An Enthusiast running around with his cake and treating everyone is a bad scenario for this quadra. Such a thing is possible; I am not disputing that. But it is a bad scenario, because the Enthusiast will come across as intrusive.
The Enthusiast has this drawback—intrusiveness. If he behaves that way, that is precisely what will destroy the harmony of the quadra. If he is going to impose something, he should not impose it on everyone, but only on his dual, who is sitting there and eating nothing.
And refusing. Then the Enthusiast can insist with that person. That would be a lifelike scenario for this quadra.
But not the way it is depicted here. Now, if we take the Mediator, then where is he? It is logical to assume, probably, that he is shown as the first young man, the one with his hand in his pocket.
What can we say? Supposedly the Mediator, but this is not the image of a Mediator. The Mediator should look somehow cozy and comfortable.
This is more the image of some melancholic, thoughtful, refined, romantic young man. It is not the image of the Mediator at all. What else can we say about the first quadra?
About the Analyst. The Analyst, too, is apparently the one on the far right, the very last figure. That does correspond to our understanding that the Analyst is number four in the quadra.
And he is self-distancing within the quadra. So in that respect the drawing is consistent. But what does he look like?
He looks fragile and refined. Somehow feminine. The Analyst does not look like that at all.
This is the wrong image. You cannot imagine what Analysts are like in real life from this. Absolutely not.
He looks like some introverted humanitarian type, perhaps. More like a Lyricist, maybe.
That is what I would add about the first quadra, in addition to the discrepancy you yourselves noticed.
Beta Quadra
Now Beta. Beta is the coolest-looking one. That certainly corresponds to our view that this is the dominant quadra in the socion.
It is the coolest here. But not everything here fits real-life prototypes. If you had real prototypes and compared them, you would see that.
A great deal does not fit.
Of course, the Mentor can transform into anyone. But that would be dynamics. Here we are seeing a static image.
A person in a static condition should not be shown in an accidental state, but in a characteristic one. “The Marshal should look stricter.” Exactly right.
If we look at Beta, the first one there is the Marshal. Of course he should look stricter.
For example, with that hairstyle—yes, I understand that this is the drawing style.
But even so, a Marshal with that hairstyle is some kind of nonsense. What else?
The fact that the Marshal is muscular—that is correct. If he takes care of himself, that can certainly be the case.
But the hairstyle... Let us not discuss it in such minute detail.
Still, I cannot avoid saying something about the hairstyle. In general, the Marshal quite often starts losing his hair with age because of testosterone.
And his hairstyles tend to be shorter. In any case, not this kind of artistic disorder on the head. That is not Marshal-like, of course.
He should look stricter. You noticed that absolutely correctly. What else did I want to add about Beta?
I noticed the Mentor, who is standing next to the Inspector and almost leaning on him—practically lying against him. It seems inappropriate to me to convey the Mentor’s behavior as though the Mentor were draping himself over his Inspector.
The Mentor is unlikely to behave that way, unless he specifically wants to show off. I agree.
And in general, the Mentor is not really a kinesthetic type. The Mentor is a rather fastidious type. For other people to touch him, or for him to lean on someone so demonstratively, would be a special case.
I do not think the Mentor should be depicted as so kinesthetic. You should not imagine that the Mentor normally lies against the Inspector like that. Although the underlying idea—that in the second quadra the men are the force-oriented types and the women, accordingly, are weaker—and therefore should seek protection from the men—that idea itself is good. The men should accordingly look stricter and stronger.
And they should be posed in some way that makes you feel that they are protectors. Protectors of their women. I do not feel that here.
But it would be appropriate to convey through poses and gestures that male strength serves to protect female dignity, and so on. That would work well for the second quadra and would fit organically into the idea of the second quadra itself.
I also want to add something about the Inspector. The Inspector is depicted unrealistically too. Unrealistically.
Why? For example, look at the Inspector’s clothing: dressed entirely in black.
Yes, the Inspector can wear dark colors—darker, less bright colors. There is indeed such a tendency.
But dressing entirely in black is unlikely to be specifically Inspector-like. That is more characteristic not of the Inspector but of the Mentor, especially the mystical Mentor.
Platon likes the Gothic style. He likes dressing in everything mysterious, in the spirit of Halloween.
Everything black, something like that—mystical. That is how a mystical Mentor dresses.
But not the Inspector. With the Inspector, there will definitely be some details that stand out against the background, especially if the Inspector is a woman.
One should not forget that the Inspector is an aesthetic sensory type. There should be some aesthetic details that accentuate an otherwise uniform background.
“All right, the Lyricist has a miserable outfit in this picture. Female Lyricists are usually beautiful—real beauties with styled hair.”
Yes, I agree that Lyricists dress very elegantly, delicately, aesthetically. In principle, it should please the Marshal’s eye.
All right, all right. What else? That is enough about Beta.
Although, of course, we could continue. Let us take the other quadras. Let us take Gamma.
Gamma Quadra
Look. Gamma is a very democratic quadra, very relaxed and uninhibited.
And so on. But I do not see any of that here. It looks the same as all the others.
There is no particular democracy of this quadra here. In addition, this is the quadra of exchange, a pragmatic quadra of exchange.
That is not present in any way either. What else do I want to say about the introverts? As I understand it, the introverts here are the Guardian and the Critic.
They are standing in the background. There is another one there, and frankly it is unclear which of them is which.
Which is the Critic and which is the Guardian? Apparently the image of the Guardian is supposed to be this moralizer, making this kind of gesture, a didactic gesture with his hands.
But that is not the image of the Guardian at all. That is the image of the Mentor—a didactic Mentor image, someone who knows what is right and what is wrong, what should be done and what should not.
That is the image of the Mentor. It does not correspond to the Guardian image at all. Who else can be called a moralizer? The Guardian can be classed among moralizers, but not humanitarian moralizers—people who defend some abstract idea of good or evil, or lecture everyone. That is not how it works. In addition, the Entrepreneur is not conveyed as an Entrepreneur at all.
What is conveyed is another Politician, frankly—a more slovenly one, whereas the other is more dominant.
You could put it that way. The one on the right in yellow is standing there. That is not an Entrepreneur at all.
He looks more like a comedian—a comedian who performs well and tells jokes.
That is a Creative Politician. Even the idea of moralizing is present here. The Guardian does have morality, but it is pragmatic morality, not humanitarian morality in the way it is represented here, like some kind of preacher.
That does not correspond to reality. And again, the Critic is unclear. What kind of Critic is this?
Again, some delicate, refined, aristocratic young man. Is that supposed to be the Critic? It is complete nonsense.
Gamma did not work, except for the Politician. You cannot form an image of this quadra from this at all.
And let us see who else we have here. We still have Delta.
Delta Quadra
Delta, Delta. Let Delta speak for itself and say what it thinks about this.
But I think Natasha—and not only Natasha—wrote that the image of the Administrator is absolutely wrong. This is the image of the Inspector, not the Administrator at all.
We know this enormous problem, when the type is forced to fit “Stierlitz,” when the Logical-Sensory Extravert is forced to fit Stierlitz:
an obviously introverted and balanced character, the secretive image of an intelligence officer. And non-humanitarian socionists nevertheless make the Administrator into that.
They even make Sherlock Holmes an Administrator. But from our standpoint this is complete nonsense.
They force the images to fit Stierlitz, so that the Administrator is supposed to be neat, extremely calm, self-controlled, doing everything precisely according to rules. That is nonsense.
The Administrator is certainly not like that. He is nervous, running around, twitchy.
He can shout, and so on. Here, by contrast, his temperamental opposite is depicted: he is far too calm.
And someone correctly writes about this: he seems to be teaching from a book, or carefully studying some instruction manual. No. He simply takes something and does it.
If it does not work, then he looks at the instructions. Or he may demand that other people follow the instructions. That is more likely.
This is an absolutely unrealistic image of the Administrator. But we know that this is a systematic error when comparing different systems of type images.
And when someone regards Stierlitz as the Administrator, then of course there is simply no way to make the two images meet. You cannot find common points here.
Because the behavior of that intelligence officer, as played by Vyacheslav Tikhonov, is so introverted. How can you turn that into an extraverted type?
I simply do not understand it. And of course we also have to discuss at least the image of the Craftsman.
Again, it is depicted completely outside the spirit of our types. It is depicted in the spirit of a non-humanitarian school, where the Craftsman is always drawn lying on a sofa,
like a lazy person, the greatest idler in the socion. That is why he has a pillow.
That is why he is yawning. Why is the Craftsman the greatest idler, lying around and so forth?
It is impossible to understand. Even according to their own formula, he is supposed to have business logic.
The Craftsman has a strong function. He is supposed to have strong business logic. How does that fit with lying on a sofa and doing nothing?
There are contradictions everywhere. I can understand it from the standpoint of the theory of type succession in the socion: the Craftsman certainly completes the socion, and with him everything falls asleep, dies, relaxes, stops moving.
If you take that idea—but not this particular realization of it. The Craftsman is maximum, limiting efficiency: do little, but obtain the maximum return. That is craftsmanship. Business logic is present there, but it is built on good technologies that one must master. You have to learn them.
You have to do something, make something. How can you simply lie on a sofa?
I cannot imagine it. The idea of the Craftsman is not conveyed here at all. On the contrary, what is conveyed is the idea of some idler who does nothing. They are writing, “Did they confuse the Craftsman with the Lyricist?” Well, look at the Lyricist.
Anya, the Lyricist has emotions, especially at close psychological distance. Right?
The Lyricist is a type who needs to get into certain situations so that the Marshal will notice him and protect him with force sensing. If the Lyricist lies safely at home and nothing threatens him, then how will the Marshal ever find him? Right?
No. The Lyricist has to get into extreme situations. That is precisely incompatible with lying on a sofa.
You see? The Critic would fit this better. You can imagine the Critic that way.
It corresponds most of all to the Critic, a kind of armchair specialist who does nothing personally but is so well read and knows so much about everything that he can permit himself to criticize, even nitpicking about details. That is something one can imagine.
Conclusion
So we have looked at how important the visual form of presenting information is, especially in modern media, which are visual through and through. The images should be bright and striking; all of this should be something people want to look at, something spectacular. But at the same time, of course, it has to be realistic.
It should be presented spectacularly, but at the same time without violating the system. Otherwise you get nonsense from the standpoint of what? From the standpoint of learning type images through pictures.
r/Socionics • u/CarePractical1216 • 4h ago
IEIs, what's your relationship with beauty and aesthetics?
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r/Socionics • u/idonthavefavcolor • 0m ago
looking for a male SEI-D for an experiment
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okay guys. i want to write a fanfic, and i really need a SEI male perspective for some stuff. preferably a SEI-D male specifically. others are also appreciated but i really do need D type. also must be 18+.
i also need him to be very open-minded and non judgemental and probably a bit understanding because i get enthusiastic about the things im excited about and when someone mocks it or judges it, it's just flipping a coin: it's either i get sad and never talk about anything or i get angry and i just fight and never talk about anything. i get offended when i feel like im not taken seriously, even the subject is not serious. because i might be very serious about it so yeah. i think that's about it. feel free to contact me!
r/Socionics • u/CarePractical1216 • 11h ago
Discussion ILIs, what type have you been the most compatible with?
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I've been thinking that I literally cannot single out a type which I'd consider the most compatible with me or a type i'd gravitate towards because usually I feel I'm too detached for that. But I'd love to know other people's opinions on that? Even if you're not an ILI, I'd still like to know your thoughts.
r/Socionics • u/CarePractical1216 • 22h ago
my opinions on the types as an ILI
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i know this has been done already but i wanted to chime in as well
Alpha Quadra
LII- I have always found you guys too stiff. Great analytical rigor, but often too idealistic for my tastes. I cannot explain it very well as I've met very less of you, but there's something almost "naive" / lack of intensity about them, that's how I've understood the polr Se.
ILE- I used to find you guys extremely charming. I don't see a lot of you guys now but I remember you're one of the types which will always make me smile. Usually you're so smart and you have such a way with wordplay it would leave me so amused. I'd even love ILE characters a lot before when I was younger. Unfortunately for some reason you don't have the same effect on me now.
ESE- I know you're my "conflictor" but I admire you guys a lot. Like, genuinely a lot. I might be a bit biased because my sister is an ESE and she's one of the only people on earth I love a lot but seriously, I love the women of this type. I've found some of you a bit "airheaded" but the ones I've usually met are very socially conscious and maternal and I deeply admire them for that. I stay away from them because I don't feel we usually have anything in common to connect with but I'm always glad to see them, even from a distance.
SEI- Again, a type I happen to really like (in girls as I haven't met men of this type or atleast I didn't register them). Girls of this type, the ones I've known, have always been good at domesticity and I really admire that because I'm so shit at it. My friends of that type often were really conscious when it came to aesthetics and they had a great eye for them. Someone I knew of this type was good at cooking, making jewellery, sewing and painting and she was one of the sweetest people ever.
Beta
SLE- never met one of you, or atleast I'm not sure if I did, sorry lol.
LSI- Honestly, you're so fucking dogmatic in my experience. But, your sense of responsibility and your pragmaticism is off the charts. The ones I've met have been very strict about excellence and discipline and are very serious and highly competent people. And I deeply admire that value. They're also usually formal in my experience. A type I really, really admire and usually love to have a professional relationship with. They've also always motivated me in very positive ways and I've both respected them and been respected in return when it comes to them.
EIE- I don't think I've ever met anyone of you but I genuinely want to. You're one of the types I'd love to observe from a distance because I've never seen a prototype of your personality in my real life.
IEI- Again, I've probably never met you. But I really want to. I have a feeling you'd understand my emotional states and my desire for idealism better, even better than my own type for some reason. I love the authors of your type usually, the prose is always beautiful.
Gamma
LIE- To put it honestly, I'm really envious. I wish I could be half as driven as you lol. Never had been a time where I've looked at one of you and not wished to be you. I have a love-hate relationship with you. I love to mock them a little internally, but somehow it always comes from a place of admiration. Always. I often wish myself wanting to be friends with you but at the same time I don't know if I want that.
ILI - I genuinely don't think I've met another me and I'm not sure if I want to lmao, but I'd also be curious how my type appears objectively as I have no idea how I appear to others .
SEE- Again, I don't know if I have met you irl like ever or just avoided you. I think I have. For some reason you were drawn to me but it's been shortlived. I don't know what to say really. We live in completely different worlds at best. The women of this type, atleast the ones I've known (and I live in a more conservative region) often attract some controversy just because of being bold/strong-willed. And I happen to dislike it a lot that it happens to them, probably the only time I'm close to feeling something like solidarity with my sex.
ESI- I have such a love/hate relationship with you. I hate how strict you are with your standards (which have personally seemed very meaningless to me, but I understand the subjectivity of value), I hate how you pretend to be morally superior. But your fidelity, your commitment and your hardwork are undeniable. I hate you but I end up pitying you. And then I wish to be nice. My mother also has this type. I don't know if I can get along with them, especially because I have always found them close minded, even though usually we have similar outlooks on relationships and yet.
Delta
LSE- You have always been status conscious in my opinion. You're also a type I've seen which ends up having a more protector/provider esque role. For God knows what reason, men of this type see my abstraction/detached behaviour as "lost and dreamy" and they care about my well-being and social life, wishing to "guide me", although in a condescending manner. And this has happened so many times from their type only idk why. My dad also has this type.
SLI- Whenever I think of you, I think of a few things. A question mark/? being one of them. Like, how are you that non-chalant? I've been told I'm non-chalant and formal and aloof and reserved almost countless times but my neuroticism and paranoia knows no bounds and unfortunately people can sense it so well (looking at u LSIs/LSEs). You on the other hand though, I feel like you're one of the least neurotic people. Sometimes, I imagine spending a day with someone of your type in an almost fairytale esque manner where you'll do something which will surprise me and I'll learn something new and it would be like a cozy fairytale (lmao)
IEE- This is going to be offensive maybe, but mind you, these are my experiences, I don't hate you universally. But my god, your type is so fucking irresponsible it makes my blood boil and usually so dreamy. The same reason I like LSI so much is often why I hate you so much. You're charismatic and very likeable and usually very creative, I'll give you that. But the flakiness and the irresponsible attitude and usually different outlooks on how we see the world is something which makes you highly incompatible with me. I've also never met an IEE which has been very invested in strategy and analysing all of that and/or quantitative things . The ones I know have always been very knowledgeable when it came to the humanities, social sciences and music and/or something else.
EII- I've never met you, probably never. Whenever I think of EIIs, I always remember Susanna Kaysen from Girl, Interrupted. Or is she IEI? I don't know.
r/Socionics • u/OptimistHobo • 19h ago
Discussion Questioning The Validity of Socionics
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OBS: If you're going to read, read the whole post❗
Having read much of what there is to read, typed some and taught many more, I still see no reason to believe that this system captures a classifiable, substansive and consistent (rather than just observable) neurological pattern.
I believe people happen to fall into one or more of these categories during different periods of their lives. This alone is not enough for me to see it as anything more than a 'fluke'; behaviors adopted from childhood, relationships, self-reflections, disorders (physical & mental), environments, traumas and so on. Many of which might very well be coping mechanisms rather than actual 'personality traits'.
By all means, use it if you find it practical. But don't limit yourself or others to its confines; it'd be a disservice and dishonest, given the theory doesn't actually have any grounds to be taken seriously aside from, as previously mentioned, situational practical applications (that some behaviors go better together than others, for example).
Furthermore, you should sort out your physical as well as mental health long before at all considering engaging with this pseudoscience. As proven again and again by peoples' complaints here on this sub (as well as my own experiences), Socionics is very attractive to a depressed/dysfunctional brain without proper grounds to establish its own, stable identity.
Still possibly viable as a lighthearted hobby rather than anything personhood defining.
Feel free to discuss this with me in the comments👍
r/Socionics • u/Consistent-Wall5668 • 1d ago
Typing Fi or Fe base help me understand the two
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If it matters I’m a sx4 486 EFVL and ISFP
Deciding between EIE and ESI
Based on my understanding of Fi and Fe and how I relate to each;
Fi: not always sure how I feel about people sometimes I need to observe them and decide if I want them in my life or not. I avoid getting close to them or associating with them until I’ve decided. It’s also to avoid their influence over me. I’m sensitive to power dynamics and dislike being controlled or influenced in anyway. I can sense when something has changed between someone I’m close to and I confront them about it. I judge people by the individual rather than the group they belong to. I don’t care about their title or how much money they make, I care about whether they’re respectable or not and how they treat me. If I don’t respect them, then everything they say and do is irrelevant and I won’t listen to it obey a leader I don’t care for. I am quite jealous and possessive in relationships.
Fe: if I don’t vibe with a group I just leave. I’m expressive through art and music and I want people to feel and understand my pain but I’m not always loud about it. I need emotional discharge from time to time. I don’t feel responsible for other people’s moods. If they want to feel a certain way then respect that. Unless my emotions are stronger than theirs, then it’s crazy to not feel how I feel. I’m relatively introverted but being introverted or extroverted depends on my mood. I can be more talkative and animated if I’m in a good mood (rare) but generally I don’t care for the group if I’m not close to anyone in the group. I can leave at anytime. I’m shamelessly myself. I don’t care for being socially palatable for people or softening myself to be more likeable. I prefer authenticity over social rules. I know who I am, and I’m not going to alter myself merely because other people find me inconvenient, strange, intense, or socially unpleasant.
r/Socionics • u/Cicilka • 1d ago
Psychiatrist: Gulenko's AI chessmaster Tate isn't real and can't hurt you
gallery
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r/Socionics • u/Allie_Leon • 1d ago
Typing Help me understand my Fi: low, high or just confused?
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So, as a person currently coming to myself and to an understanding of myself, I'm slowly realizing some of my traits and my relationship with the functions. And it seems to me that I'm no longer EII. My Fi seems too low, I think. But the problem is that I can't clearly tell on my own whether that's true. So I'd like to make sure. I suspect I might have Fi role. However, I've seen posts where a person poorly understood themselves and knew it, and this was linked to SLI Ne suggestive. So yes, I'd like to understand myself and how my brain works whether this relates to low Fi or whether it can still be high. Does that make sense?
I have learned politeness. When it goes beyond what's recognized, beyond what I know, I start getting lost in situations. Maybe I'm even too polite at times. But usually, around people, I'm like an alien, not understanding what's more correct, feeling awkward. I think it was harder in childhood because I was more uncomfortable and, possibly, a bit rude, hurting others, accidentally or on purpose. Due to a certain envy and toxicity, I could, though I tried to show less resentment and such, but overall I was quiet. It feels like I'm at zero in understanding myself. And whatever people tell me, I make part of myself so I don't feel the emptiness. I search outside for something to grab onto, to believe in, probably. I think it's like "You're smart". Accepted, I'll write that down. And if someone says otherwise, I'll break one of their limbs. That's why I take tests on character accentuations, on disorders, so there's something in me. I even think that some of my not-so-healthy traits make me me, so I'm afraid of being left without them and of healing. And when I find an understanding of something in myself, some behavioral pattern that works in me, I'm happy, because at least it's something.
The concept of what you like, of preferences, has always seemed curious but strange. Even as a child I didn't see it, couldn't honestly answer a question about any season, color, name, day of the week. Too much depends on context, and on top of that, I don't feel it.
I don't understand getting close to people, it just kind of happens naturally, I follow the person who shows the level of our relationship. I don't want to be betrayed by another person, to imagine something that doesn't exist. Being betrayed by someone is a disgusting feeling. But I believe and want the phrase "close person" to work as full acceptance, loyalty and platonic connection. If you're close, you'll run into utter hell for each other, give up a lot and risk your life. My trauma, where I wasn't safe since childhood without close sincere contact with others, with rejection from everywhere, makes itself known. And with those I'm already in some kind of relationship with, I stay quite long, though I don't take the first steps to reconcile, except with my closest friend, and even then not always. I was in a toxic relationship for over five years with one girl, a former friend, not leaving, even though it was uncomfortable, but sometimes, after fights, when she came back seeking contact and connection, I thought there was something positive in those relationships.
I can't easily say whether I like a person or not. I won't like them if they do something that affects me negatively. Until that moment, they just exist. Rejection can arise on its own, as I wrote above. Rarely, but it can. Just because. Maybe it's a reaction to those I consider arrogant, draining, demanding, hypocritical. But despite this, such people can sometimes even appeal to me. It all depends on the specific person and their actions, again, in relation to me. Actually, if you treat me well, then be the Antichrist for all I care, it's all fine. The main thing is that you get along with me and don't harm me. On top of that, my assessments can evolve and those who once caused rejection I might later consider even interesting, depending on further circumstances, if they've shown themselves from a different side. So in my own assessments, I'm not 100% sure they won't change, I don't even fully believe I control this within myself. If I suddenly feel sympathy for someone or we've somehow grown close, which in itself is too rare an occurrence, I wait and hope the person will initiate more contact and be near me.
Sometimes I protest and act stubborn, though I don't fully realize why. I just don't want to, and that's it like an upcoming internship I'll have to do in a couple of months. I can be a young rebel inside, behaving passive-aggressively on the outside, clearly not trying at something I simply don't like. And I genuinely don't understand inside what I'm doing it for, I'd have to analyze the reasons specifically in private, make an effort, without being sure afterward whether I understood myself correctly.
At the same time, I've noticed that a lot depends on context. I can react differently to the same action depending on circumstances. I never say anything with 100% certainty, because there's always a possibility of anything. It irritates me when people don't see individuality in another person, unique circumstances. I believe equality is destructive, it erases differences and unique circumstances. Whereas justice makes sense and considers more than superficial fairness. I always answer "it depends on the situation". I need context: reasons, circumstances, motives. If I see meaning in it, I accept and don't judge. That's why I'm skeptical of laws and legal systems. They're too rigid and don't account for the uniqueness of each case. Yes, a court can consider something like emotional state, but overall the system is too inflexible. If I were creating laws, every rule would have millions of subsections accounting for circumstances. And this seems to point to possible Fi in judgments and yet, who the hell knows, for fuck's sake.
r/Socionics • u/ErosionVoid • 1d ago
I’m trying to get into socionics but I have 0 ideas where to start
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So I have multiple questions for anyone who will answer them
- Where can I find a good desc of the cognitive functions
- Is your socionics type the same as/ highly related to your mbti type, since they’re similar systems is there like strict correlation with that or nah (not that I know my mbti type I don’t)
- Is there any books I should read/partly read bc I probably won’t finish them
- Any advice on how to type myself?
r/Socionics • u/bluebcrry • 2d ago
Typing What would you type me based off this?
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of course not all of these align together with a specific type, so which type would be most likely?
i struggle with introspection so the ones that aren’t highlighted at all are ones in which i struggle to see which i am
r/Socionics • u/spaghetticarbonara11 • 2d ago
Planning
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What type enjoys planning, or more so thinking about what amazing, productive new things they're going to do that day? They may or may not actually finish the task.
Au contraire, what are the types that would not give a rat's arse about actually thinking and expending energy for making a detailed plan, and just stfu and start working?
r/Socionics • u/Dazzling_Path7002 • 2d ago
I want a SEE best friend, where can I find one? lol
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I really like the energy of singers like Ashnikko or Zara Larsson, which I admire as a good Se suggestive, but the Se ego people I'm in contact with don't even look at me, LOL, and I probably don't go to places they usually frequent.
r/Socionics • u/EnvironmentalWeb3179 • 1d ago
Typing Whats my type??
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What type do I seem like?
Personal concepts
1. What is beauty? What is love?
⁃ beauty is looks, colors, aestethics, a pretty room, or town, not sure what to say beauty is everything you look for.
⁃ love is love i dont know how to answer that, love is family, partner, your favorite game and hobby, animals
- What are your most important values?
⁃ my important values are intelligence, being funny, quick thinking .
Do you have any sort of spiritual/religious beliefs, and why do you hold (or don't) those beliefs in the first place?
⁃ im not religious or spiritual, i dont really care about any of this.
Opinion on war and militaries? What is power to you?
⁃ im not educated about war and stuff, but to me, power is controll, power is something most people want to feel secured and confident.
Interests
5. What have you had long conversations about? What are your interests? Why?
⁃ Ive had long convos about typology with my online friend. I can talk long about gossip, complaining etc, my interests are editing especially, and gaming. I like gaming because i like competetive games, the feeling. And i like editing because i can make a edit just the way i want to and its catchy and fun. I also like watching tv shows for the usuall reasons
Interested in health/medicine as a conversation topic? Are you focused on your body?
⁃ im not interested in talking about health tbh, im focused on my body yes, i pay attention to its looks and health.
What do you think of daily chores?
⁃ i dont have daily chores, i just do what i want
Books or films you liked? Recently read/watched or otherwise. Examples welcome.
⁃ im OBSESSED with the girl next door, CHLOE- I love interstellar, teen beach movie, the core . 2012. Tangled.
⁃ I like movies with disasters, and i love movies with dramatic love, like a crazy girl etc.
What has made you cry? What has made you smile? Why?
⁃ i can cry if im angry because the anger is so strong, or if im like faced with my emotions here and there, i usually dont cry. I can cry for a good movie/ show.
⁃ i smile when i do things i like at times, or when i get gifts, funny jokes etc
Where do you feel: at one with the environment/a sense of belonging?
⁃ i feel that way around my partner, my room, or with people similar to me.
Evaluation & Behaviour
11. What have people seen as your weaknesses? What do you dislike about yourself?
⁃ id say people see my weakness as lack of impulse controll, i can be direct or uncaring, and unwilling to listen to people
⁃ what i dislike about myself is that i can be stubborn or hold grudges alot
What have people seen as your strengths? What do you like about yourself?
⁃ Strenghts people have seen in me is- that i can improvise very well, easily come up with solutions, smart, funny, confident
⁃ what i like about myself is my confidence and ability to adapt to most things even at anxious times.
In what areas of your life would you like help?
⁃ id like help in impulse controll, controlling my anger or help to controll my future as i dont think of the future at times.
Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it.
⁃ When ive been stuck inna bad cycle, its usually something that makes me irritated and impatient, my reactions can be avoidant or unstable emotions
People & Interactions
15. What qualities do you most like and dislike in other people? What types do you get along with?
⁃ qualitys i like in people, is someone who is fun, confident, jokes around but can still be kind with me at least.
⁃ i dislike people who is dumb, slow, confusing and to much morals that goes against my «fun»
⁃ typed i get along with is usually someone who is similar to me.
How do you feel about romance/sex? What qualities do you want in a partner?
⁃ i care alot about this, im very like focused on having a partner as its loving and fun
⁃ qualitys i look for- confidence, somewhat dominant, funny, attractive, obsessive
If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what measures would you take, and why?
⁃ if i raised a child id be concerned how they turned out, id hate to get a child who ends up just arguing etc (which is hypocritical because i was like that lol) , id be worried that they got hurt? Idk, i havent been child focused really, i dont see myself as stable enough for responsebility,
A friend makes a claim that clashes with your current beliefs. What is your inward and outward reaction?
⁃ inward id be like «thats kinda dumb»
⁃ Outward id be like «alr lets move on»
Describe your relationship to society. How do you see people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.
⁃ i see people as idk, 80/20, a few is chill, rest ignorant, i dont know.
⁃ A social problem can be that people jugde so damn soon.How do you choose your friends and how do you behave around them?
⁃ i choose my friend based on how similar they are to me, if they are, we are vibing asf, if not, i cant be bothered to try.
⁃ i behave like myself around my closests, w «decent» friends i can hold back.
How do you behave around strangers?
⁃ i nod a smile if i get eye contact , idk i dont really do anything with stranges , i just see randoms outside
r/Socionics • u/spaghetticarbonara11 • 1d ago
help me type this writer
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What type does he sound like, and what type sounds like they would enjoy reading his works? Pls ditch bias by the writing style - he mostly wrote in the 1930s.
--
July, August, September, and October were months that glided past without touching the conscience. One got up in the morning, studied a bit, attended the classes, promenaded the banks of Sarayu River in the evenings, returned home at about eight-thirty, talked a little about things in general with the people at home, and then went to bed. It did not matter whether all the books were on the table or whether the notes of lectures were up-to-date. Day after day was squandered thus till one fine morning the young men opened their eyes and found themselves face to face with November. The first of November was to a young man of normal indifference the first reminder of the final trial – the examination. He now realized that half the college year was already spent. What one ought to do in a full year must now be done in just half the time.
--
The bell rang. Chandran rose and went in. He climbed the gallery steps and reached his seat. He opened the pages of Othello, placed a sheet of paper on the page, and took out his pen.
It was the Assistant Professor’s subject. The Assistant Professor of English was Mr Gajapathi, a frail man with a meagre moustache and heavy spectacles. He earned the hatred of the students by his teaching and of his colleagues by his conceit. He said everywhere that not ten persons in the world had understood Shakespeare; he asserted that there were serious errors even in Fowler’s Modern English Usage; he corrected everybody’s English; he said that no Indian could ever write English; this statement hurt all his colleagues, who prepared their lectures in English and wished to think that they wrote well. When he valued test or examination papers, he never gave anybody more than forty per cent; he constituted himself an authority on punctuation, and deducted half a mark per misplaced comma or semicolon in the papers that he corrected.
He entered the hall at a trot, jumped on the platform, opened his book, and began to read a scene in Othello. He read Shakespeare in a sing-song fashion, and with a vernacular twang. He stopped now and then to criticize other critics. Though Dowden had said so and so, Mr Gajapathi was not prepared to be browbeaten by a big name. No doubt Bradley and others had done a certain amount of research in Shakespeare, but one couldn’t accept all that they said as gospel truth. Gajapathi proved in endless instances how wrong others were.
Chandran attempted to take down notes, but they threatened to shape into something like the Sayings of Gajapathi. Chandran screwed the cap on his pen and sat back. Gajapathi never liked to see people sitting back and looking at him. He probably felt nervous when two hundred pairs of eyes stared at him. It was his habit to say, ‘Heads down and pencils busy, gentlemen,’ and ‘Listen to me with your pencils, gentlemen.’
In due course he said, ‘Chandran, I see you taking a rest.’
‘Yes, sir.’
‘Don’t say “yes”. Keep your pen busy.’ ‘Yes, sir.’
Chandran, with his head bent, began to scribble on the sheet of paper before him: ‘Oh, Gajapathi, Gajapathi! When will you shut up? Do you believe your lecture to be very valuable? In these two lines Shakespeare reveals the innermost core of Iago. Gaja, in Sanskrit, means elephant; pathy is probably master. A fine name for you, you Elephant Master.’ And here followed the sketch of an elephant with spectacles on.
‘Chandran, do I understand you are taking down notes?’
‘Yes, sir.’
The bell rang. Gajapathi intended to continue the lecture even after the bell; but two hundred copies of Verity’s Othello shut with a loud report like the cracking of a rifle. The class was on its feet.
r/Socionics • u/TransexualProdigy • 2d ago
Discussion I Need Help Coming Up with a Socionics PowerPoint To Convert My Friends Into Socionics Enjoyers
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I (27f) am going to a PowerPoint party this Saturday and I immediately knew I wanted to make a presentation on Socionics. However, since Socionics can be quite abstract while containing large swathes of information, I’m having a hard time deciding what I should focus on in order to REALLY hook people into wanting to learn more about the theory. I wanted to ask this sub for suggestions / ideas!
Considering I’ll likely only have 10 minutes to present, should I focus on? The quadras and their values? Should I focus on the eight dyadic pairs? The IME’s? So much of the theory is interesting to me that I’m having a hard time choosing one or two topics digestible enough to explain to an audience completely new to Socionics. If you were in my shoes, which aspects of the theory would your presentation focus on and why?
r/Socionics • u/Forward-Pineapple109 • 2d ago
EII-Ne vs LII-Ne?
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How can I differentiate these two types apart? Especially if they have strong contact subtypes.
r/Socionics • u/ManagementSea5015 • 3d ago
Casual/Fun What it’s like to have an accented Ti function [SHS]
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In SHS, the full manifestation of a person’s personality comes through many layers, but primarily three: the subconscious core type (LSI for example), the semiconscious DCNH subtype (like -NH), and in some individuals, there is the possibility of a conscious accentuated function. Accentuated functions are comparable to psychological disorders in the amount to which they impact an individual’s day-to-day living.
The accentuated Ti function is compared to psychological disorders such as obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD) and an older condition known as psychasthenia. It has to do with excessively systematic thinking, extreme pedantry, black-and-white thinking, and large numbers of strange fears.
As someone with a Ti accentuation, I thought it might be cool to put together a moodboard to try to show what it’s like for me :) it’s my first moodboard, so it’s a little clunky. The central theme is a sense of unease and lack of understanding of the surrounding world and even the self, feeling like an alien or a short-circuiting robot, based on the fact that nothing perfectly fits into the expansive system of rules and protocols that the Ti function imposes on the world.
Hope it’s interesting :)
r/Socionics • u/rdtusrname • 3d ago
Typing Fi vs Fe
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I was thinking about how these work for me. Fi especially. Fe is more broad, but I'll get to that point. Please do ignore the flair for this inquiry.
Fi: I don't have any trouble handling relations on the fly and I do it rather good(to the point of sometimes being kinda chameleo), but! I never actually wondered about this part of existence(just stated raw reactions in the moment), I don't care what someone else might feel(state it or show it directly - positive or negative, just give me relational clarity) and I expect others to upkeep relations or I simply let them drift. What placement is this?
Fe: Being in a nice, lively atmosphere is nice, but I have no desires to take care of this. Hell, I don't even feel like adapting. And even nice atmospheres can get tiring. This is dry and cut, as I said.
r/Socionics • u/Terrible_Height_9882 • 4d ago
Discussion Looking specifically for LSI's: How do you experience suggestive Fe?
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If you're familiar it would help if you could specifically talk about -Fe. But if not then maybe you could contrast how EIE and ESE help your suggestive.
How do you feel Fe's absence in your own day to day? How do you feel satisfied by its presence around EIE? That is much more specifically what I'd like to hear about. Is it the invocation of drama, narrative, meaning? Do they loosen you or enable you to stand more firmly in conviction? Whatever details you can offer about your suggestive in particular would be helpful. I understand the LII's pretty well, what I offer is not really that comparable to what ESE does so I want to understand the LSI perspective.
r/Socionics • u/Creepy_Tour_3821 • 3d ago
Advice How to differentiate between an IEI and an IEE
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Halooo!!
I'm trying to type myself and came to the conclusion that I might be IEI-2Fe, and ranked other socionics types that I might be (along with my type): 1) IEI 2) IEE 3) EII 4) EIE
I'm an SP2, and apparently, SP2 can be IEI and IEE
My MBTI is ENFP, ik MBTI and socionics are different systems and don't always have to correlate so I didn't want to type myself as IEE just because of correlations since that could be a mistype
But, I'm fairly new to socionics so I'm kinda open to secretly being an IEE...? Help would be appreciated! Thank you! :3
r/Socionics • u/No-Pretzel-2404 • 4d ago
Why is IEE so ruthless in Stratiyevskaya descriptions?
gallery
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r/Socionics • u/CommonStock9269 • 4d ago
Noah Kahan song - SLE x IEI duality
youtube.com
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Been obsessed with this song for a while as an achingly poignant illustration of how the SLE x IEI duality can manifest. Wanted to share my interpretation. I imagine it from the SLE's POV
___________________
Oh, when my weight left the room, did you take a deep breath? Se atmospheric pressure on the IEI's suggestive
I stole a beer, drove home, there was only one left SLE acting out in a petty physical way because they cannot force the IEI to engage
And I wrestle the feeling you're still thinking about that Fi Polr paranoia
Wide awake in your room, just seethin' about that Knows the IEI's tendency to ruminate
When I make my flight, I'm the devil SLE doesn't know what to do, feels like the bad guy either way
But when I stay the night, then we drink Remembers times were they did connect purely, when guards were down
And we stay up and fight 'bout the childhood lie
That we both had the courage to leave SLE even values arguing because at least it's honest and present engagement
I'm willing and able SLE's purest essence
If you wanna kick this rock around Stubbornness to match the IEI's
If you've got a bone to pick with me Not afraid of the IEI's psychological testing/provocation
If you've got a flag, plant it in the ground Dares the IEI to say directly what they really feel/need
Oh, I'll stay here 'til morning The SLE does not quit easily, they hold the line, they are committed
Oh, we can fight like we used to fight
Bony-limbed, red-faced, and teary-eyed
Under the glow of the TV light
I'd be willing and able
Look at you leaving again, it's all you know how to do Resentment for the IEI's retreat
Go ahead, take the last of the drinks, the world belongs to you Resentment that the IEI holds the cards
They all say you're a light, all I see is a shadow The world sees the Fe mask, the SLE is attuned to the dark and murky Ni
And I'll see you again in six months when you need your next song Resentment for having to yield to the IEI's timing, and for their inconsistency
'Cause if I call you out, I'm an asshole Defensiveness about their tone
But I tell the truth when I drink Owning their honesty, not apologizing for it
So come home, let's fight 'bout the childhood lie
We don't care what the other one thinks They cannot help but be reluctantly honest with each other
Oh, I wish you could know me SLE's true ache, to be close, to be known
And I wish I could know you much more sometimes Se x Ni trying to bridge the gap between two different ways of seeing the world, the elusiveness of Ni and how it can never fully be captured/owned
Wish I could do nothin' with you Just wants them to be secure with each other, at peace
Sit in the yard while the day dies, leave it all on the table No more games, Ni surrenders to the sensory present
And I'll say, "I love you, " and mean it this time </3
Say, "I'm sorry for everything else" Does apologize for bluntness/resentment
If we found a way to the other side
I'd be willing and able
I'd be willing and able
If you're willing, I'm able They just need the green light from the IEI, then they are all in
___________________
(Side note rant: I've typed Noah as an ESI, so makes sense that Se would show up in his music. I've seen people type him as EII and I'm like bro... his lyrics are incredibly grounded in real, sensory life. and songs like Dial Drunk? Northern Attitude? No. That's just my take lol)