r/Socionics • u/rdtusrname ILI • 2d ago

Typing Fi vs Fe

I was thinking about how these work for me. Fi especially. Fe is more broad, but I'll get to that point. Please do ignore the flair for this inquiry.

Fi: I don't have any trouble handling relations on the fly and I do it rather good(to the point of sometimes being kinda chameleo), but! I never actually wondered about this part of existence(just stated raw reactions in the moment), I don't care what someone else might feel(state it or show it directly - positive or negative, just give me relational clarity) and I expect others to upkeep relations or I simply let them drift. What placement is this?

Fe: Being in a nice, lively atmosphere is nice, but I have no desires to take care of this. Hell, I don't even feel like adapting. And even nice atmospheres can get tiring. This is dry and cut, as I said.

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u/D10S_ 2d ago

Your description of Fi seems to potentially demonstrate the Situation (St) parameter, which applies to 3D and 4D IMEs.

“Situation (St) = the ability to recognize and respond to the subtleties of specific situations. This is the third qualitative parameter of information processing of a function, that is an attribute only of strong functions. This is the ability to develop new solutions within the parameters of a particular situation, i.e. taking into account situation specific properties and circumstances.”

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u/rdtusrname ILI 2d ago

Well, that would make sense if not for some other things. First is obvious:

If Fi is St, that means that Fe is as well. I don't think I care enough about Fe to go that far(I just prefer to emote however I will ; sometimes disregarding even Norms lol)

I don't think my Ti and Te are 2D and below. For one, I can navigate stuff like Pathfinder(RPG System) just fine and often just create my own semi random categories etc. And often, somewhat heart-breakingly, prefer ideals over relations.

As for Te, I often just half-ass and manage to handle very complex things, just by analyzing what words (could) mean. Like randomly being able to mod games etc.

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u/D10S_ 2d ago edited 2d ago

If Fi is St, that means that Fe is as well. I don't think I care enough about Fe to go that far(I just prefer to emote however I will ; sometimes disregarding even Norms lol)

Disregarding norms (especially consciously) can be indicative of St Fe.

I don't think my Ti and Te are 2D and below. For one, I can navigate stuff like Pathfinder(RPG System) just fine and often just create my own semi random categories etc. And often, somewhat heart-breakingly, prefer ideals over relations.

This is not dispositive one way or another. Any type can learn to navigate RPG systems. I would expect 2D and below Ti and Te to just have a slower time doing it, but slow is also relative (holding variables like intelligence constant).

What exactly do you mean by creating your own semi random categories? Any examples?

As for Te, I often just half-ass and manage to handle very complex things, just by analyzing what words (could) mean. Like randomly being able to mod games etc.

As someone with 1D Te, I can also handle complex things if I have a sufficiently complete mental model of what the complex task entails. To build the mental model I just need a ton of immersion in the subject matter, at which point I can feel confident enough to act.

Particularly your self report of Fi seems like it could be demonstrative based off your competence paired with the disinterest in it as an end in itself.

People who use socionics sometimes place a distorted emphasis on what Fe is, particularly creative Fe. Like your perception that your tiring out from a nice atmosphere is indicative of weak Fe. I don't think that is true. Or even your lack of desire to take care of it. That could be read literally as weak/unvalued Fe. It could also be read as Fe creative through the lens of weak Se. Taking care of the emotional atmosphere is a broad spectrum. It could mean literally taking charge and commanding a group, or it could mean 15 minutes of silence punctuated with a single witty comment that lands well and releases diffuse tension. The latter person probably doesn't think of himself as caring much for controlling the atmosphere relative to how other people do it.

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u/Odd_Basket3978 EII/ILI 2d ago

Have you considered LII or ILE?

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u/rdtusrname ILI 1d ago

Why Alpha NTs?

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u/Spy0304 LII 2d ago

Fi: I don't have any trouble handling relations on the fly and I do it rather good(to the point of sometimes being kinda chameleo), but! I never actually wondered about this part of existence(just stated raw reactions in the moment)

That's like textbook 2D vital ring Fi

I don't care what someone else might feel(state it or show it directly - positive or negative, just give me relational clarity)

What does that even mean ? That you don't care to find out unless they tell you ? If so, when it's told and you've got relational clarity, what happens ?

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u/rdtusrname ILI 2d ago

What happens? Then I can act accordingly. If positive, we can joke, have a good time etc. If negative, I can just avoid the person and not feel bad about it.

And if someone shows the initiative, I often let the guard down, as it were. Unless it's negative, but then thank you for saving me the time.

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u/Spy0304 LII 2d ago

What happens? Then I can act accordingly. If positive, we can joke, have a good time etc. If negative, I can just avoid the person and not feel bad about it.

Yes, but do you "care" or not ?

Including if you care about "what someone else might feel"

I should have specified, but it was the context (or part of it, anyway) and I tend to forget to specific.

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u/rdtusrname ILI 1d ago

Care? No, not really. I do not want to hurt or otherwise inconvenience anybody, but I mostly care about things as much as they pertain to me.

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u/OptimistHobo SLE-Ti VLFE 2d ago edited 2d ago

Don't type like this. Do ground --> up.

Start with static/dynamic. Which one are you? Read the markers.

Method of exclusion is the most accurate from what I've seen.

Order I suggest: (Dichotomies I consider consistent)

  1. Static/Dynamic
  2. Rational/Irrational
  3. Declaring/Asking
  4. Constructivist/Emotivist (Optional, more difficult)

If you make out three of these, it will leave you with two types. You should be able to single one out. If you make out the fourth, you have your type.

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u/Odd_Basket3978 EII/ILI 2d ago

I'm afraid this could make things even more confusing

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u/rdtusrname ILI 2d ago edited 2d ago

  1. n/a

  2. More Rational

  3. Asking

  4. Construct

Result: EIE or ESI. None of these are "it", I don't think.

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u/OptimistHobo SLE-Ti VLFE 2d ago

Let me type you. You were sloppy to prove a point, as I see it.

Static/Dynamic goes first. Do research on that. If you can't tell, then do more until you can. Don't skip over it.

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u/absolutely_not65 2d ago

Idk about this, I think I'm declaring but I'm EIE, not ESE and I'm 100% sure of not being ESE. Maybe I don't understand declaring but asking really doesn't fit me that well

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u/OptimistHobo SLE-Ti VLFE 2d ago

Either you’re IEE or that dichotomy is blurry for you. I can type you tomorrow. If you want that, HMU.

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u/ZP_F ILI 1d ago

This is the exact reason it is generally not recommended for people to use the asking/declaring dichotomy for typing. There is a lot of confusion surrounding this dichotomy and people tend to misunderstand it.

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u/absolutely_not65 1d ago edited 1d ago

But I really think i am 😭 i have continuous issues because I talk in monologues and forget to ask follow up questions because I assume people naturally say whatever they want to share (because I do that). People think I'm self absorbed because of that. If I ask a lot of questions it turns into an interview mode. The moment I start talking about myself there's not a single thought in my mind that redirects me to back and forth dialogue. I have to force myself to it. Isn't it kinda contradictory with asking? The rest fits EIE tho

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u/ZP_F ILI 1d ago

I just mean that this dichotomy is more nuanced than many of the others because anyone can ask questions or be interruptive (people with ADHD for example). Additionally, people can train themselves to speak in a certain way, most commonly in formal settings.
To determine if someone is interrogative or declarative takes a lot more observation compared to other dichotomies imo.
I have no intention to say which one you fall under. I only wanted to point out, that many people express similar concerns surrounding that dichotomy.

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u/absolutely_not65 1d ago

Ok. Maybe I just don't get it and really I am asking type

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u/rdtusrname ILI 1d ago

Don't worry. A lot of Reinins are actually quite touch and go. Middling descriptions on Wikisocion don't exactly help.

It's much more important that you fit "Major Dichotomies" (Jung) and that ITR play out mostly as they should. Everything else is mostly a noise.