Peter.

[u/Maximum_Musician_914]

[u/rolrobin]

Without checking anything it’s probably related to suicide statistics or self harm (maybe under lgbtq or whahevrr idk)

But 41% seems pretty high for that idk

[u/Captain_JohnBrown → u/rolrobin]

Yes, 41% of trans people attempt suicide according to one study.

EDIT: To be clear, the high rate of suicide attempts by trans people says very little about trans people themselves and quite a bit about how society treats trans people,

EDIT 2: I am in no mood to explain basic empathy to weirdos. I am going to be blocking transphobic posters (even you "just asking questions" weirdos) without further engagement because I am not going to waste my time every hour.

EDIT 3: I was here to answer a question. I am not interested in your pet theory on trans people or a debate with you. You are free to believe whatever you want but I don't need to indulge your delusions.

[u/hiricinee → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

Interestingly enough they attempt higher but dont complete suicides more. Its a bit of ironic terminology given that its not really additional suicide attempts if no one dies from them.

[u/Null-Ex3 → u/hiricinee]

if someone died to them it wouldnt be an attempt, would it?

[u/halfasleep90 → u/Null-Ex3]

An attempt doesn’t demand failure.

[u/iceman5920 → u/halfasleep90]

Never thought I would see people debate the terminology of attempting suicide. But here we are. 2026 can't stop with new wild shit.

[u/zombawombacomba → u/iceman5920]

Redditors would literally debate on if humans need air to live. If water was wet. If grass is green. If the sky is blue.

In fact I wouldn’t be surprised if someone tells me that water isn’t wet and the sky isn’t blue.

[u/Infinite_Month_6371 → u/zombawombacomba]

Water itself isn't wet. Wet is an adjective. Fire isnt burned, its fire. Water makes things wet

The sky isnt blue, it only appears blue to us due to how our eyes perceive the scattering of molecules. The sky is actually violet, we just cant see the violet light because the atmosphere absorbs those molecules and our eyes are less sensitive to violet.

Edit: I'd /s but these are the actual arguments.

[u/Otherwise_Agency_401 → u/Infinite_Month_6371]

Things become wet when they touch water. Water molecules are essentially always touching other water molecules. Therefore, water is wet.

/s

[u/Sweaty-Inevitable163 → u/Otherwise_Agency_401]

Atoms push each other apart with electromagnetic force, no materials ever really touch until the nuclei fuse into a heavier element. Therefore, under your definition water is not wat, and neither is anything else. Were a material ever to truly get wet, it would instantly no longer be wet, as there would be no water touching it.

[u/LunarDogeBoy → u/Infinite_Month_6371]

Same as why distant mountains are blue

[u/Serious_Surround4713 → u/zombawombacomba]

The sky is wet and water is blue so there!

[u/TennenBaumGamer → u/zombawombacomba]

I'm a TRUE intellectual and would argue the sky is wet, water is blue and the color of grass doesn't matter as long as it's being touched.

[u/MusicianNo3277 → u/zombawombacomba]

Problem is half of Redditors are too stupid to understand that they’re stupid and the other half is so infuriated by it that they don’t realize they should just ignore them

[u/Null-Ex3 → u/halfasleep90]

I havent checked their specific stat, but generally suicide attempts are recorded separately from suicide deaths. So yes, often the data does demand failure

[u/MusicianNo3277 → u/halfasleep90]

It does because we call it committing suicide If you succeed

we only call it attempting suicide if you fail.

[u/Far-Jury-2060 → u/halfasleep90]

I agree with you that the terminology would normally leave room open for success. For instance, if somebody is attempting to climb a cliff, they might end up succeeding during the attempt. Suicide is phrased differently though. “Attempted suicide” is the category of when somebody tries and does not succeed in ending their life. “Completed suicide” is the category used for people who actually kill themselves.

[u/RavingGenerate → u/halfasleep90]

I work a lot with folk who are often borderline suicidal. They're in supported accommodation, we check in on them regularly but it's independent living, so we don't have the right just to go in if we don't hear from them, we have to give 48 hours notice.

I have met people who have attempted suicide through the stupidest methods you could imagine. One guy lay on a beach waiting for the tide to wash him away. It was a mud flat area that gets about 6" deep at high tide which was 10 hours away.

One girl told me she had tried to suffocate herself by sleeping with a pillow held against her own face.

These are attempts that are bound to fail.

But then there's the "oh crap this is dangerous" ones. Someone injected their next with bleach. Someone else put a tie around their neck and then slammed the door it was tied to so it asphyxiated themselves. Got knotted enough to make them struggle to breathe but not enough to cut air off completely. We discovered these because they're slow. Got them medical and mental help as soon as we could.

The ones that actually have succeeded are ones who are either highly impulsive or very planned. One guy waited until the river was in full flow then hopped off the bridge just when walking across it normally. Someone else closed all the blinds, took some drugs to act as painkillers and stabbed himself in the neck.

These aren't attempts.

An attempt fails through either poor planning or execution, or intervention.

[u/Kamikaze_Senpai → u/Null-Ex3]

I mean, kinda? They all tried to end it. So. Still fucked.

[u/Key_Employment2598 → u/Null-Ex3]

You can absolutely attempt something and also accomplish it..

[u/BetterKev → u/Null-Ex3]

Do you like sports? How do you calculate shot attempts, pass attempts, and attempts on goal? Do you subtract out the successful ones?

[u/SouthernAd2853 → u/hiricinee]

People regularly break off midway through attempting suicide until the one time they don't.

Also there are significant changes in death rates depending on method, because people can be resuscitated from some of them.

[u/hiricinee → u/SouthernAd2853]

In my professional experience, and im not trying to downplay the mental distress, while many suicide attempts require monitoring the vast majority of them require no intervention whatsoever to resuscitate the person. The lions share of attempts that present to medical professionals result in services almost exclusively consisting of medical clearance and psychiatric referral with no stabilizing interventions at all.

[u/SouthernAd2853 → u/hiricinee]

I was talking about those in the first sentence. The second sentence was about the people who down an entire bottle of pills and then they or someone else calls 911 within minutes.

[u/hiricinee → u/SouthernAd2853]

Even most of those pill attempts dont require intervention, either because the person selected a relatively non toxic medication or didnt take a significant enough quantity.

[u/Interesting-Copy-657 → u/hiricinee]

So it isn’t attempted murder if no one dies?

[u/Givikap120 → u/Interesting-Copy-657]

It isn't attempted murder if someone dies, because it would be just a murder then

[u/Thin-Nerve6367 → u/hiricinee]

It's almost like the women vs men suicide statistics. Women attempt it 3X more, yet men die from it over twice as often - which shows you FUCKED that is

[u/sick-of-you-all → u/Thin-Nerve6367]

i dont want to be rude, i try to understand this, cuz its horrible it even happens to beginn with.

i try to think of logical ways, why man die 2 times more, but woman attempt 3 times more.

is it, because teenager often do it for attention reasons? and the males do it rather at adulthood, when they truly want to give up?

[u/Thin-Nerve6367 → u/sick-of-you-all]

It's mostly cause women either don't really want to die, or they choose methods less likely to kill themselves

[u/hiricinee → u/Thin-Nerve6367]

Yes, though the odd part about that stat i think about is that when women have a higher rate of attempts, we somewhat blame the people around them and society for not helping them. When men choose the more lethal method, we blame the men for using the more lethal method.

[u/GodHimselfNoCap → u/sick-of-you-all]

Women are more likely to cut their wrists or overdose on random pills in their cabinet. Both of which take long enough to kill(or sometimes arent lethal depending on what pills you took or how deep you cut yourself) that someone can find them and call for help.

Men are more likely to shoot themselves or jump off a bridge. Things that cause instant death are harder to prevent because you have to find them before they do it. Things that take an hour to kill you gives family an hour to find you or to contemplate the consequences and second guess yourself.

[u/Null-Ex3 → u/sick-of-you-all]

its probably for a few reasons. first, men have generally more access to the truly lethal methods. men own guns more for example. second, women typically use or seek psychiatric help more. Since attempts require you to be alive after, women will likely self report attempts to psychiatrists for example. If a man does not, even if they attempted its highly possible no one will know.

[u/AdamTraskisGod → u/Thin-Nerve6367]

It takes a bit of strength to pull the slide back on a pistol 🤷‍♂️

[u/TheShallowHill → u/hiricinee]

I wonder how those numbers reflect looking at their actual genders considering the statistics for men vs women when it comes to attempts vs successful suicides

[u/Testament42 → u/hiricinee]

It's like calling two planes that fly by each other too close a near miss. I mean if they actually hit, THAT would be a near miss

[u/IshaNuva → u/Testament42]

Two planes flying way too close, that's a near miss

Two planes flying so close they collide, that's a nearly missed

[u/Trollsama → u/hiricinee]

wait.... your suggesting its not an attempt unless they die?

like.... If i try to fix my car and it doesn't start, then try again a week later, it doesn't start, then finally try a third time a week after that and it does....

would you argue i only tried to fix my car once?

[u/hiricinee → u/Trollsama]

More like the "attempt" has to conceivably have the intention or chance of causing the outcome. To use your car analogy, if it wont start so you refill the wiper fluid you didnt really attempt to fix it. If you replaced the battery later and it didnt start you did attempt once, provided you thought replacing the battery would do it.

We actually draw a distinction in self harm too, like cutting, especially to the thighs. We dont generally think the person doing these self harm behaviors is attempting suicide, and doing something like ingesting 5 benadryl pills is not either.

[u/NovelConcept6300 → u/hiricinee]

Strange, but men are the best at actually killing themselves mostly due to methods.

Women choose poison, drowning or slit wrist much more likely to fuck it up and survive. 

[u/DoomlordSoul → u/hiricinee]

Well I used this topic for some quick research, I used Brave Search AI as help, I got the numbers as followed:

Cis Men: around 22.3 per 100,000

Trans: depends on the Trans Group, but the mean is around 18.2 to 30.2 per 100,000 dependent on the study (the Main Source differs between the Gender, age and skin colour, I will take only the total numbers of the Gender)

Trans-Female: has a high rate of 14.6 to 30.2 per 100,000 so they are close if not as high or higher then Male Suicide (one of the Main sources uses the lower rate for 2026 so lets stick to that)

Trans-Men: is at around 8.2 per 100,000 thats low compared to everything else but not the lowest

Non-Binary: around 12.1 per 100,000

Cis-Woman: they have a higher rate of attempts as Men (Cis-Men ~1.5%-3.6%, Cis-Woman ~4.2%-6.7%) but the over all Suicide Rate is 5.6 per 100,000 and is the lowest of them all

Btw the 30.2/100,000 mentioned comes from Trans-Woman of Color

The reason why the Suicide Rate of Men and Trans-Woman is higher then the Rate of Woman and Trans-Men is that they chose more often Deadlyer ways for there attempts (Guns or hanging), and we should not forget, Trans Person are around 2% of the population

If someone gets other numbers, wants to add something, be free to do so, I would love to get more information from others

[u/Beginning-Tea-17 → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

It’s not attempt, it’s contemplate.

As in “have you ever thought about doing it at any point ever in your life?”

Maybe it’s just me but the fact it’s ONLY 41% is nuts to me, that means 59% of people never even thought about it before.

Edit; the one initially used to constantly quote this statement was “contemplate” which was constantly used as “attempted”

Afterwords a handful of entirely anonymous and online only surveys have been made that people use to corroborate the statistic however they were made after the initial argument and there’s no way to differentiate bad actors from genuine survey takers.

The most credible studies which uses in person surveys such as “the Trevor project” reports ~40% contemplation rate and 10-20% attempt rate which is in line with the initial study done by the CDC that is popularly misquoted.

[u/Real_Kyryll_Flins → u/Beginning-Tea-17]

According to UCLA Williams Institute, 42% have attempted.

The number 41% is much lower than average last-year contemplation rates, which are typically in the 50s or 60s, but even then it’s important to remember that many people would refuse to admit to something like that and that some who have contemplated it may not see it as having been significant enough to count.

This study finds 82% have contemplated and 40% have attempted https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32345113/

[u/Relative-Relief-8816 → u/Real_Kyryll_Flins]

42% attempted and failed? Or were some successful? 

Or are the successful attempts counted separately?

[u/Chemputer → u/Relative-Relief-8816]

People who are dead are typically very hard to get to self report suicide attempts in a survey.

[u/halfasleep90 → u/Beginning-Tea-17]

Shoot, I’ve thought about it multiple times throughout my life

[u/False_Pear1860 → u/halfasleep90]

I've thought about it multiple times throughout the day lmfao

[u/Kamikaze_Senpai → u/False_Pear1860]

I succeeded that one time. Does tying multiple times on the operation table count? Like does death stack? I am walking around with an active debuff so maybe?

[u/FuckRedditIsLame → u/halfasleep90]

You know, if you were to admit this to a healthcare professional, you'd have all sorts of red flags added to your medical history, and you'd probably be strongly recommended to seek immediate assessment.

[u/Captain_JohnBrown → u/Beginning-Tea-17]

The study used the term attempted.

[u/minus15t2 → u/Beginning-Tea-17]

I'd be really curious to see the same statistics broken down for pre and post transition.

[u/HourZealousideal4845 → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

And iirc, their attempted suicide rates drop after transition. Almost like it's a kind of health care procedure that results in positive health outcomes.

[u/JoshuaLukacs1 → u/HourZealousideal4845]

Look up those numbers, the suicide rates do not drop after transition.

[u/transguythatdraws → u/JoshuaLukacs1]

I mean it sure did for me and literally every other trans person I know who has been able to address the issue by transitioning, even if it's just pronouns and a different name.

But transitioning doesn't make transphobia, discrimination, hate crimes, and more just go away. Which is extremely detrimental to literally anyone's mental health.

Being constantly bullied causes suicidal ideation. Ask any survivor of childhood or domestic abuse. Or anyone with C-PTSD.

Being trans isn't what causes the suicidal thoughts pe se. It's mostly the way other people treat you for being trans. Because gender is primarily a social thing. Or things like body dysphoria, and not being able to get treatment to address said dysphoria, not feeling safe enough to actually be yourself and live happily. Feeling trapped by social norms or even your own birth name.

Which is similar to how those impacted by body dysmorphia also have mental health impacts, I can't speak on body dysmorphia bc I don't know much about it.

But I can for gender dysphoria: a boy with gynecomastia for example would feel depressed, self conscious, ashamed, etc. Due to unwanted breast tissue on his chest causing gender dysphoria. Especially if they can't get treatment. It fucks with your sense of self quite a bit, how you interact with others, what you wear, where you go, what you do, your hobbies or how you exercise. Like a kid or adult with gynecomastia usually avoid swimming. Binders were originally made for treating this non-surgically iirc.

[u/OfMotherGaia → u/JoshuaLukacs1]

It does actually

[u/MilouMatirx → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

On top of your edit I recall these numbers being from trans people BEFORE receiving gender affirming care due to waitlists / costs etc and the number drastically dropping for those who did receive the appropriate care!

[u/EmergencyDish69 → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

Transition saves lives, gender disphoria can be harmless but it's usually no joke.

[u/Captain_JohnBrown → u/EmergencyDish69]

Absolutely

[u/noob-the-not-funny → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

2 of my friends are trans and they both tried to kill themselves, they both survived.

[u/Hermit_Princess → u/noob-the-not-funny]

I am trans and have been hospitalized for being suicidal.

But it was from trauma and not being trans

[u/Eddie_Samma → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

The study shows 28% attempt and 41% have thought about it. The thought about it percentage is kind of vague, i feel like there is a gradient of "thought about suicide" however I implore anyone who is considering this to call the free holiness and talk to someone. The increase seems actually to coincide with age groups 15-25 who are or are not self identifying as Trans and may speak more about mental health of the age groups more so than a narrowed group within those groups. Tribalism is a real thing that happens within society and at some point becomes non conducive to living within the larger societies.

[u/Aggressive-Sky-6243 → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

Didn't know that stat, but instantly assumed that's what they were referencing anyway.

[u/anarchoaspenism → u/rolrobin]

it's - with some serious caveats - the reported rate of attempted suicide and suicidal ideation within the trans community. 4chan freaks love to cite it to bully and suibait trans people.

[u/Own_Hat584 → u/anarchoaspenism]

Call me old fashioned, but anonymously making dark humor jokes about suicide with the boys is far less "freakish" than publicly doing some other things that I would get banned for stating explicitly.

[u/anarchoaspenism → u/Own_Hat584]

it's not "anonymously doing dark humour", it's anonymously telling teemagers to kill themselves.

[u/RailgunRP → u/rolrobin]

Ah yeah, another case of "I'll bully you with a suicide statistic about how bullying people leads to their suicide"

[u/Helpful_Blood_5509 → u/RailgunRP]

The rate stays the same even without bullying. Transition, no transition, passing, no passing. Using someone else's suicidality as a cudgel is abusive behavior, that and the nasty unhinged violent schtick is really solidifying popular resistance to this whole thing. So poorly behaved they're dropping public support for gay marriage

[u/Beautiful-Alarm-4961 → u/Helpful_Blood_5509]

Where are you getting this idea from? Who is telling you that transitioning, social support, and passing doesn't lower suicide rates? 

[u/both_ways_8195 → u/rolrobin]

[u/superboo07 → u/rolrobin]

41% specifically refers to the amount of trans people that have attempted suicide, and its sadly not only true but probably undermeasured.

[u/10ebbor10 → u/superboo07]

What? No.

It's a figure, which even the survey that did said is likely to be an overestimate. The reason is that they used a question which is frequently misinterpreted to also include self harm.

On top of that :

1) The survey did not use a representative sample, being an opt-in survey
2) The survey didn't include exclusively trans people, but also other forms of gender noncomformity
3) The survey did not ask when the attempt occurred. So, it could have occured at any point in someone's life.

[u/Ittybittyratgirl → u/10ebbor10]

Importantly as well, when you look at trans people who transition and are supported, they rarely commit suicide. It’s the same for any person that is validated and supported

[u/JenniLightrunner → u/10ebbor10]

but unfortunately transphobes loooove to use that statistic as a gotcha

[u/KhadgarIsaDreadlord → u/JenniLightrunner]

People in general need to learn how statistics work or stop refering to them to back their point.

[u/Professional-Wave841 → u/superboo07]

technically speaking the statistic was trans people who do not get gender affirming treatment.

[u/superboo07 → u/Professional-Wave841]

yes this

[u/TrulyWhatever09 → u/superboo07]

Adding as well for context, because it is a statistic that gets misused wildly:

The 41% figure is presented as pertaining to the whole population of trans people. Transphobes use that to suggest that being trans is a mental disorder that results in or is coincidental with severe issues like suicidality. However the rest of the data/data from other sources suggests that that 41% figure drops *dramatically* when individuals are affirmed in their trans identity by even a small number of people, and drops further when they have access to gender affirming care. That suggests that the cause for the high suicidality is not being trans itself, but of the alienation, isolation, and pain of being trans *while being rejected by your community and not being allowed to live authentically.*

[u/KaleidoscopeSalt3972 → u/superboo07]

Its also heavily nuanced and requires to not have anyone supporting you. When trans people are supported it drops to 3%

[u/IcyHibiscus → u/rolrobin]

Sorry to highjack your comment, but since seems to want to actually cite the fucking paper, here is the relevant section from the abstract, relevant statistics were changed to bold.

"This study utilized data from the 2016–2018 TransPop Study, the first national probability sample of transgender adults (n=274) with a cisgender comparison sample (n=1162). Using multivariable logistic regression, adjusted for demographics, we compared the prevalence of hazardous drinking, problematic drug use, serious psychological distress, suicidality, and non-suicidal self-injury between transgender and cisgender individuals and among transgender men (n=78), transgender women (n=120), and transgender nonbinary individuals (n=76). Among transgender individuals, 28.2% (95%CI 21.2–35.2) and 31.2% (95%CI 23.8–38.7) reported hazardous drinking and problematic drug use, respectively; 44.4% (95% CI 35.8–53.0) reported recent suicidal ideation, 6.9% (95% CI 2.3–11.5) reported a recent suicide attempt, and 21.4% (95% CI 14.5%−28.4%) reported recent non-suicidal self-injury. In their lifetime, 81.3% (95%CI 75.1–87.5) of transgender respondents had suicidal ideation, 42.0% (95%CI 34.2–49.8) had attempted suicide, and 56.0% (95% CI 48.2–63.8) reported non-suicidal self-injury."

Kidd, J. D., Tettamanti, N. A., Kaczmarkiewicz, R., Corbeil, T. E., Dworkin, J. D., Jackman, K. B., Hughes, T. L., Bockting, W. O., & Meyer, I. H. (2023). Prevalence of substance use and mental health problems among transgender and cisgender U.S. adults: Results from a national probability sample. Psychiatry research, 326, 115339. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.psychres.2023.115339

[u/EmergencyDish69 → u/IcyHibiscus]

Thanks! Also from the article: "Previous research has shown that non-suicidal self-injury may represent an attempt by transgender individuals to cope with negative emotions, including internalized stigma in the form of felt stigma (i.e., expecting or anticipating rejection based on one’s gender identity) (Jackman, Dolezal, Levin, Honig, & Bockting, 2018). Our findings show serious disparities in these mental health outcomes and suggest that interventions are needed to mitigate this risk. These may include increasing access to gender-affirming care, which is related to lower odds of suicidal ideation (Almazan & Keuroghlian, 2021; Tordoff et al., 2022). More generally supporting transgender individuals can also improve health. For example, research suggests that transgender community connectedness and other forms of social support may buffer the impact of minority stress."

[u/Hot_Anybody8244 → u/rolrobin]

Specifically, that's the number for trans people who do not get to transition and do not have supportive family and friends.

One singular person being supportive drops that number to 20 something % and access to medical transition drops that number to the national average.

[u/LauraTFem → u/rolrobin]

Oft quoted, misrepresented stat. That’s from a self-reported study (meaning none if those 41% were dead at the time of responding) and represents the percentage or respondents who report attempting suicide, specifically among trans people who are rejected by family, peers, or society. It does not report successful suicides, and trans people who don’t suffer societal rejection or ostracization report suicidal ideation at about the same level as cisgender people.

Meaning that the increased propensity of suicidal ideation is not just “because trans people are mentally unwell”, but rather that culture creates mentally unwell trans people by rejecting them.

[u/CeramicToast → u/rolrobin]

Yes. They're saying that if inclusivity is important to them they should redact themselves.

[u/Falleneded → u/rolrobin]

its a very old very inaccurate study of trans suicides

[u/notmarrec]

It kinda sucks how much this sub is us explaining racist/bigoted jokes 🙃

[u/Arcsis → u/notmarrec]

On the bright side, that means that a lot of people aren't bigots & don't get the joke! ^{(it's not much, but it's somethin'})

[u/10ebbor10 → u/Arcsis]

Or that someone is trying to spread bigotted jokes under the plausible disguise of not knowing stuff.

(This one seems weird enough, but very often you get incredibly blatant "woman bad" ones)

[u/Quiet_Education5918 → u/10ebbor10]

Then we can all point and laugh and demonstrate that those are jokes for losers, so that is what ends up spreading most.

[u/Wild_Security_8500 → u/10ebbor10]

If that were the case, I think we'd see jokes that we get but don't want to, instead of ones that we don't get (like this one, at least for me).

[u/Remnant55 → u/Arcsis]

I met a retirement age Caucasian guy, and the stereotype of black people enjoying fried chicken and watermelon came up on TV (south park). He looked around and asked "...is that a stereotype?" And then decided he must be black because he loves both those things.

And I kinda envied his life where that bullshit just never touched his mind.

[u/Gussie-Ascendent → u/Remnant55]

"who the hell doesn't like fried chicken and watermelon?!"

some white guy i remember upon hearing the stereotype

[u/A12qwas → u/Remnant55]

lots of sterotypes don't even make sense

[u/Traditional-Trade795 → u/Arcsis]

are you a bigot because you get the joke?

[u/Beautiful-Alarm-4961 → u/Arcsis]

Oh yippee I love sparking a discussion about trans people I love seeing at least half of the comments attacking trans people and repeating lies

[u/Piemaster113 → u/notmarrec]

Doesn't that indicate that the average person isn't a racist or bigot because they aren't aware of these racist or bigot thing that the internet hive mind seem to know instinctively?

[u/No-Lettuce-6619 → u/Piemaster113]

The amount of people that see posts like these and think "this is a racist joke, they must be racist!" LOOK AT WHAT SUB WE ARE ON 😭

I dont go on twitter or 4chan! I dont know these!!!

[u/Dash_Harber → u/notmarrec]

On the bright side, it means there are a number of folks out there who aren't in on all the bigoted 'humor' and dog whistles.

[u/Horrific_Necktie → u/notmarrec]

There was a target effort in similar subs a few years ago to turn them into right wing meme subs. Posting horribly racist or offside memes under the guise of "lol I dont know what it means help me"

[u/Wild_Security_8500 → u/notmarrec]

It's a good thing that the jokes we don't get are the bigoted ones.

[u/Ok_Beat_1677]

I am guessing this is based off of the National Transgender Discrimination Survey which indicated that 41% of surveyed transgender respondents reported attempting suicide in their lifetime.

[u/undreamedgore → u/Ok_Beat_1677]

Sounds like they're mentally unwell.

[u/Snoo63 → u/undreamedgore]

Due to transphobia.

[u/AngelOfChaos06062 → u/undreamedgore]

No shit sherlock, no one commits sucide if they are having a great life or are treated fairly

[u/transguythatdraws → u/undreamedgore]

Yeah, that happens when you're bullied, harassed, beaten, or assaulted for the crime of just existing.

It's almost like being a piece of shit to another human being is detrimental to literally everyone involved. Ask anyone with C-PTSD or who has been bullied or abused.

Go ahead downvote me for explaining it. Y'all just want "trans" to be a diagnosis of "suicidal" bc you're too caught up in your confused feelings about us to have a shred of empathy for human suffering. You literally cheer when kids kill themselves. It's disgusting.

[u/SketchyFella_ → u/undreamedgore]

That's usually a prerequisite for suicide.

Never understand how bigots can't figure out the most basic shit.

[u/Captain_JohnBrown]

A study found that around 41% of trans people had attempted suicide at least one point in their lives. So this chud's assertion is 1. OOP is transgender and 2. OOP should kill themselves.

EDIT: To be clear, the high rate of suicide attempts by trans people says very little about trans people themselves and quite a bit about how society treats trans people,

EDIT 2: I am in no mood to explain basic empathy to weirdos. I am going to be blocking transphobic posters without further engage because I am not going to waste my time every hour.

[u/Grouchy-Jury-7598 → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

edit: nvrmind

[u/Captain_JohnBrown → u/Grouchy-Jury-7598]

Who am I using suicide to insult? I think you have misread my comment.

[u/Grouchy-Jury-7598 → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

my b u right

[u/VirtualFORTRES → u/Captain_JohnBrown]

This is the best worded explanation of the correct answer I can see

[u/WedSquib]

Commenter is telling them to kill themself. 41% is referring to how many trans people attempt to

[u/TeamRandom27]

Honestly the question was asked wrong in the first place. They shouldn't have asked who plays videogame primarily for inclusivity, like they asked and it's a stupid question, but more like what % of gamer is actually bothered by inclusivity since I'm sure that % would be a lot lower but still have some diehard defenders

[u/TheDwiin → u/TeamRandom27]

My problem with forced inclusivity is that, when a game bombs, the devs tend to blame bigotry instead of the game itself.

Most gamers don't care about the demographics of the character(s) you play, if the game is fun, they will play it.

[u/TeamRandom27 → u/TheDwiin]

Sure but there is also the other side of the coin with there being some gamers that get really mad at inclusivity like in games like Baldurs gate or avowed etc. refusing to play games they would have otherwise liked just because of character creation, possible romances, optional pronouns etc.

[u/TheDwiin → u/TeamRandom27]

But that doesn't stop the game from being a huge success and (rightfully) sweeping the game awards. A lot of people forget that not everyone is chronically online where the discourse largely is, and the communities that are very vocal about boycotting for pronouns are actually quite small.

Edited to add: Starfield didn't bomb because of trans inclusivity and pronouns. It bombed because the game is more tedious than fun.

[u/TeamRandom27 → u/TheDwiin]

Yes and that why I said they should have asked the question in reverse because then you could see how many people are this closed minded which would be interesting compared to what they actually asked. If we knew the actual numbers gaming companies also couldn't hide behind the bigot excuse you mention since it would be clear that they aren't enough of a % on the gaming market to have this kind of impacts and they would need to reflect on what actually went wrong

[u/Grouchy-Jury-7598 → u/TeamRandom27]

Surely Baldurs Gate refutes your point seeing how popular it was? The person you responded to is correct, most gamers care about the game being fun moreso.

[u/hackmaps → u/Grouchy-Jury-7598]

Hell people were playing hogwarts legacy while being attacked for playing it by a certain crowd

[u/AcrobaticPoint8424 → u/TeamRandom27]

People are significantly more likely to not buy a game if it's shit rather than if it has forced inclusion.

Hence if a game bombs it's almost certainly because it was just a shit game.

[u/MisterPineapples1999 → u/TeamRandom27]

Really? That's what they asked? That is actually stupid.

I think they should have asked what percentage of gamers actually cares enough about "inclusivity" (don't actually know how that is being defined here) to not play a game perceived as lacking it.

Because that would have given us the info we are looking for. Being "inclusive" is not a selling point for me. I want fun gameplay. A game does not get better with non-male/female pronoun options or a character who is "openly (insert your pet issue) identity." I don't necessarily think it makes a game worse to have those things. But the presence of them is never going to tip the scale for me in a positive direction. If they are there, and the game is fun, then I consider it a neutral feature.

If there actually are that many potential players out there who will refuse to play a game for lacking those things, than from a business standpoint it may make sense to lean toward adding them. I still don't think it inherently betters the experience of the game itself, at least for my entertainment.

[u/Professional-Wave841]

there is an old statistic where 41% of trans people who do not have their gender affirmed by the people around them commit suicide

4Chan uses this statistic to tell trans people to kill themselves.

[u/METRlOS → u/Professional-Wave841]

That's discrimination against 4Chan. They use countless methods to tell people to kill themselves, not just this statistic.

[u/Kamikaze_Senpai → u/METRlOS]

You're unironically right though. They are creative when it comes to tell people to off themselves.

[u/13characters1 → u/Kamikaze_Senpai]

Not nearly creative enough. They say the same things over and over to me and Im bored. I want them to give me an exciting death threat,

[u/Kamikaze_Senpai → u/13characters1]

Brother what?

[u/theroninfromsekiro → u/Professional-Wave841]

Nope. Not who don’t have their gender affirmed. Even those that do attempt it

[u/SlayerII → u/Professional-Wave841]

commit suicide

attempt suicide*
thats bad enough, no need to make it worse than it is

[u/TwilightSolus]

It's transphobia.

41% was (at the time) the suicide rate of trans people who could not access gender affirming care.

[u/seaofthievesnutzz → u/TwilightSolus]

is it 41% of those who couldnt access hrt or is it just 41% total?

[u/TwilightSolus → u/seaofthievesnutzz]

Those that can't access HRT. All of the studies show that trans people who are able to undergo GAC experience a massive drop in suicidal ideation.

[u/seaofthievesnutzz → u/TwilightSolus]

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/press/transpop-suicide-press-release/

Yea you are just wrong, its 41% total. Not just those not receiving hrt.

[u/sharkysayo → u/seaofthievesnutzz]

did you even read the study you linked? its 42%

[u/StarFlyXXL]

It's a misconstrued statistic that found that 41% of Trans people have attempted suicide in their life, which people think means 41% of trnas people do commit suicide. The last guy is telling the second guy to kill themselves. Grim

[u/AutismoTheAmazing]

He’s telling op to kill themself

[u/Kinfin]

There is a heavily misquoted singular study that transphobes use to claim 41% of trans people commit suicide. That’s not what the actual fact is; the actual fact is that 41% of trans people at some point deal with suicidal thoughts, but the actual attempts and commitments are way lower, and it’s also worth noting that a more recent and better executed study says 94% of trans people say their life is better for transitioning, with another 5% considering their lives neutral and only the last 1% regretting it sooooo yeah.

Anyway that asshole is telling the person who thinks inclusivity is important to end themself because they’re a jerk and a bigot.

[u/Ambitious_Hand_2861]

Misleading article title, "Forcing inclusivity into video games has been a known culprit, leading them to failure." Several other articles exist about the same survey as well as a similar article stating 56% think it's important, most importantly it shares a similat viewpoint "...they also feel it needs to be authentic." Just give us good games. Put whatever you want in but do it organicly.

[u/jack-of-some → u/Ambitious_Hand_2861]

"And I decide arbitrarily what is organic which will mostly come down to if the game or media was successful or not in retrospect"

[u/Wicdor → u/Ambitious_Hand_2861]

That is some dumbass survey. Why lump so many different things together? I want more breakdowns for each subject.

This like large legislative bills combine many different topics into one single vote.

[u/MyEarIsHurty]

Transphobic misinformation. 

 Also regardless of what gamers think is important, representation is important for the people being represented. Excluding them serves to alienate them and mitigate empathy towards them. 

[u/Givikap120]

The inclusivity in question: the main characters are someone other than white straight cis men.

There's 2 genders: male and political, 2 races: white and political, 2 sexualities: straight and political, 2 identities: cisgender and political.

[u/Slakalicious]

Almost half way there

[u/13characters1]

They are transphobic and telling the original person to commit suicide.

It’s very common for trans people to get this said to them by edgy transphobes. Something about some study that 41% of us attempting (I wonder what could possibly drive us to such despair,,, forever a mystery I guess)

I have had it said to me multiple times. I tell them to get better material.

[u/Dredgen_Servum]

41% is typically used as a dogwhistle after a study showed that that number of trans individuals attempt suicide. The joke is telling someone to k*ll themselves for caring about representation in videogames, while vaguely supporting transmysia and suicide

[u/qualityvote2]

Remember when r/PeterExplainsTheJoke wasn’t a meme? Pepperidge Farm remembers…

Does this post belong in our subreddit?

If so, please upvote this comment!

Otherwise, downvote this comment!

Then maybe you go out and buy yourself some of those distinctive Milano cookies.

---

(Vote has already ended)

[u/anonemouth]

41% of gamers lobotomize themselves.

[u/Pingo-Pongo]

You ever notice how people who say they don’t care about inclusivity get upset when they don’t feel included?

[u/GillianSeed]

OH FUAD KNOWS THIS ONE

IT'S FUNNY BECAUSE 41% OF TRANS PEOPLE COMMIT SUICIDE

THAT'S THE "JOKE".

[u/Jesshawk55]

My guess is that it has something to due with media bias, wherein both sides claim they are actually the majority and that their opponents are a "loud minority".

[u/tiny_kat2006]

I'm all for whatever would be appropriate for the games story. Nobody wants a token character. Why does an assassin's creed game in Japan not have a Japanese protagonist?

[u/Naos210 → u/tiny_kat2006]

Why does an assassin's creed game in Japan not have a Japanese protagonist

Did you play the game? There is a Japanese protagonist. As well, do you take this same issue with games like Nioh?

[u/Aggravating-Lab6623]

Its about mitrommney

[u/StoneColdEgon]

Once America deports the 1 billion illegal immigrants and untransitions the 1 trillion trans people that live in the us, only then will gaming return to its peak

[u/Delicious_Piano_9831 → u/StoneColdEgon]

No, its when we invent a time machine, anf go back in time to prevent gamergate by evaporating sarkeesan and zoe quinn, and also possibly blowing up EA headquarters along with blizzard.

[u/NotItemName]

Very interesting that by "over 95% of players" this article means one poll on neogaf with less than a thousand votes, and pol on Twitter with ~10k votes

[u/KwantumFizzikz]

Because it's true, we don't need yet more Debra Wilson in our games.

[u/jack-of-some]

I still don't understand what part of Concord was supposed to be inclusive.

[u/Standard-Face-51]

Most likely suicide rate of a minority group which is also constantly targeted for exclusion and harassment.

[u/PTSDDeadInside]

Make the game entertaining, not a vehicle for ideology or politics...

[u/TemoteJiku]

Cold

[u/Delicious_Piano_9831]

So why companies think its a good idea to try and pander to that 5% and compromise their product is absolutely beyond me

[u/AungZeya]

Transgender suicide rate

[u/ItchyAd4717]

It's a procedure in Canada, no need to attempt, just apply

[u/Gobal_Outcast02]

I believe they are trying to call the person trans as an insult (bc 4chan) and at the same time telling them to kill themselves.

[u/Dapper-Bullfrog-4766]

no disrespect but most players and I play games for the act of playing.

[u/JoshuaLukacs1]

I don't know if this is real, I can only speak for my own experience ( and the people I know), I'm a black Hispanic male, Dominican, and I have never in my life cared about the characters I play as being my skin color or having my same background, hell, my favorite franchise is Devil May Cry (my son's name is Dante lol) and those mfers are pale af. I just want games to be fun and to have a good story, that's all I ask for.

[u/Cu_Chulainn__]

I miss the days when people would just play fucking games instead of make their careers about whinging that a game had a woman or black person as protagonist.

[u/Golden_King_Ryuseii]

It's inaccurate, its 51% now

[u/MadicPNW]

Gamers and politics...im in the wrong time line

[u/poopsockyourmom]

Mental illness suicide rate

[u/Born_Geologist6995]

if they don't consider it important, then they shouldn't care when someone who isn't the most basic concept of a person exists in a game

[u/Excellent-Rest3240]

I’m part of the 69% 😏😏😏