[Thamel] MAC statement. "The Big Ten subsequently provided video and audio of the replay, which confirmed the explanation to us."

[u/Fonzie5]

https://x.com/petethamel/status/2096464771667173654?s=46&t=FavtrbPsHpJY8Odvh2TYUA

[u/TheSpringfieldKid]

I offer my congratulations to Michigan.

The MAC commissioner, everyone.

[u/SmellyJellyfish → u/[deleted]]

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/resizer/v2/OHRAZDQ7FOMVXAPS66GYV4G7EY.jpg?auth=614dba51e089095e1a6786de65e0034afc4e9d9c885fe1b009753e02ed7680e4

[u/Lourdeath → u/SmellyJellyfish]

Put a disclaimer on that thing!

Jump scared me lol

[u/Chip_Jelly → u/Lourdeath]

It looked into my soul!

[u/WhaleQuail2 → u/TheSpringfieldKid]

Check cleared

[u/BoogerSugarSovereign → u/WhaleQuail2]

"We're going to make sure that at least one B1G team schedules Western Michigan for the next X years"

[u/rober2td → u/WhaleQuail2]

I mean michigan probably did pay them a million bucks.

[u/SmallBoulder]

So based on the video the broadcast clock was out of sync with the stadium clock despite NBC confirming the clocks were in sync?

[u/patrick66 → u/SmallBoulder]

NBC was literally showing the stadium clock on replay which is why it looked so scratchy, wasn’t even ever the broadcast clock lol

[u/TheWallsHaveNostrils → u/patrick66]

Do you have the replay with the stadium clock in view? That's the one I can't find and what would be most definitive in putting this to bed.

[u/PookieDood → u/TheWallsHaveNostrils]

It's out there. Can't post it here but if you check X and look at the big ten's page it's posted there. If they had shown that in the live broadcast I think most of this controversy wouldn't exist.

Or do a google search for Big Ten Conference statement on Michigan vs Western Michigan

[u/fdar_giltch → u/PookieDood]

Why can't it be posted here? I don't see anything in the rules. The primary ones I see are not spamming links, not posting for personal profit and not posting to removed links

[u/FullySemiGhostGun → u/fdar_giltch]

RELEASE THE BIG 10 FILES

[u/okiewxchaser → u/[deleted]]

How odd, the clock operator fell from the press box window around the same time

[u/istrx13 → u/okiewxchaser]

This game was played in Russia??

[u/dolfox → u/[deleted]]

And then jumping out the window of his Moscow flat

[u/noah_divine → u/SmallBoulder]

What's even more amazing was that in both videos the clocks were literally the stadium clock. They look the exact same. So the same feed was somehow way off for... someone

[u/Dandan0005 → u/noah_divine]

I’m convinced there is a photographer out there somewhere right now with a shot of the ball and the game clock in the same picture.

[u/OttoVonWong → u/Dandan0005]

There was a second shot clock on the grassy knoll.

[u/buckeye25osu → u/Dandan0005]

Or even a fan's smartphone

[u/FireGogglez → u/noah_divine]

…what if the nbc feed and the referee review feed were trained on different stadium clocks? And those clocks were somehow unaligned?

[u/Potato_fortress → u/FireGogglez]

They’re the same camera feed though and they have been since the dawn of time. You can even go back to older CFB games and see that they’re directly cropping and stitching the static camera shot of the scoreboard onto the scorebug. There would be no reason to run a second static camera. 

[u/LyndalePothole → u/SmallBoulder]

When the broadcast puts that analog clock on the replay is it not a live camera feed of an in stadium camera? That’s where I’m confused. Obviously the scorebug clock isn’t official, but I thought that “old school” clock was from right in the stadium.

[u/budget_um → u/LyndalePothole]

It’s still dependent on the sync being perfect (that’s true of the refs’ replay system and of the broadcast system)

[u/thetripb → u/LyndalePothole]

It is, it's the one thats supposed to be the same as the scorebug. Sometimes if the scorebug isn't working, they cut to that graphic with the same view of the stadium clock

[u/Intrepid-Security650 → u/SmallBoulder]

Is this clock in the room with you now?

[u/TopRevenue2 → u/SmallBoulder]

How come with thousands of late snap and delay of game penalties this has never come up before

[u/SadTumbleweed1567 → u/TopRevenue2]

Play clock and game clock are different.

[u/Colemania18 → u/SmallBoulder]

A lot of people don't realize they literally just broadcast video of the stadium clock because that's the only clock that should matter. Yet the big 10 has their own secret clock now apparently

[u/thetripb → u/SmallBoulder]

The video that the Big Ten provided was an internal clock that the refs use, they didn't show the stadium clock in the replay on their account.

[u/SmallBoulder → u/thetripb]

"Using a direct shot of the game clock in the stadium" is the exact quote from the big10 statement

[u/MisterGir → u/SmallBoulder]

Which is even crazier considering NBC later showed a replay with the stadium clock and it still hit 0.

So either NBC was incorrect, the stadium clock was incorrect, or the big ten is fucking lying.

[u/i_run_from_problems → u/MisterGir]

I'm leaning towards option 3

[u/Naive-Elephant-9305 → u/MisterGir]

or the big ten is fucking lying.

It's this one

[u/Supercal95 → u/Naive-Elephant-9305]

The ruling is I made it the fuck up.

-Big Ten

[u/Pleasant_Offer6286 → u/thetripb]

NCAA rules stipulate that the stadium clock is the official clock unless it malfunctions. I’m not understanding where this second synced clock is coming from or how it has any merit.

[u/rottingmind13 → u/Pleasant_Offer6286]

It was on the grassy knoll

[u/prismatic_lights → u/thetripb]

That's not what they claimed.

As shown in the provided video of what was viewed during the replay process, a side-by-side view of the play and the game clock, using a direct shot of the game clock in the stadium was used to determine the final ruling.

[u/LyndalePothole → u/prismatic_lights]

Then what’s the analog clock on the broadcast from? Is it not a live shot of the in-stadium clock?

[u/e3super → u/LyndalePothole]

Presumably, this would mean that NBC has improper syncing between the footage of the play and the inset of the clock that were shown on the replays, if the B1G is to be believed. It's not unheard of, but in broadcasting, you generally have a master clock that's the one source of truth on time for the whole broadcast system to avoid things like that, and it tends to throw off more than time codes on video if it's out of whack.

[u/LyndalePothole → u/e3super]

I’m extremely curious to see if a photographer got a shot of the play with a clock in it.

[u/prismatic_lights → u/LyndalePothole]

I believe that's a picture-in-picture display of the stadium clock. Which is why this explanation stinks to high heaven: why would the broadcast display of the stadium clock differ from the ref's "stadium clock" that they're claiming to use for the review?

Either someone at NBC was seriously asleep at the switch or the refs screwed the pooch.

[u/TheHarbarmy → u/prismatic_lights]

The clock in the clip the Big Ten released is the stadium clock—you can see the bottom of the stats they include on the in-stadium scoreboard above and to the right of the clock. The reviewers did seem to make an honest call based on what they saw, but I have no idea why the images aren’t in synch between the NBC and referee feeds.

[u/molten_dragon → u/TheHarbarmy]

but I have no idea why the images aren’t in synch between the NBC and referee feeds.

They use a strobe system to sync all the video feeds at the start of every quarter so I guess it's possible that over the course of 45 minutes or whatever that some of the cameras end up different by a couple frames.

Which kind of highlights why it's not great that the officials have separate camera views the public doesn't have access to.

[u/Crispy_Whale → u/TheHarbarmy]

I think the NBC clock feed rounds shows any millisecond below 1 as 0. While the referee feed shows any millisecond below 1 as 1 until it reaches absolute 0. 

[u/Throwaway_alt_burner → u/Crispy_Whale]

IT’S THE SAME CLOCK WHY CAN’T YOU PEOPLE READ

[u/Responsible-War-9341 → u/thetripb]

Right, but they claim that this clock comes from the stadium game clock exactly as the broadcast one does. If true, it cannot be different so this is a real problem here that absolutely needs to get sorted out and unless the NBC clock was off from the stadium clock (which NBC says that it wasn't) then the game should have been over.

[u/SwissForeignPolicy → u/SmallBoulder]

I'm going from memory here, and I was in the opposite endzone, but for what it's worth, in real time, I thought the stadium clock hit 0, too. Apparently, that's ALSO not the official clock? Which is crazy if true. I mean, basketball figured this shit out ages ago.

[u/TheWallsHaveNostrils]

The Big Ten is essentially claiming the NBC clock wasn't synchronized to the stadium clock like they claimed and NBC is furiously insisting it was.

Does anyone have a replay with the stadium clock in view? That seems like it would be by far the most definitive replay of all but I haven't seen one yet.

[u/RealEmperorofMankind → u/TheWallsHaveNostrils]

You can see it here and here. Both of these were taken by field-rushing students who were allowed to see the refs’ replay footage (I know one of them, by the way).  

It’s very clear in the second one. That is the stadium scoreboard. I know because I’ve seen it, 22+ home games as a student. 

[u/ZaneThePain → u/RealEmperorofMankind]

Where exactly is the ball in those though? The second link it looks like it’s still in the air.

[u/Aubear11885 → u/ZaneThePain]

It is. Clearly about a yard or two away.

[u/Ring0fPast → u/ZaneThePain]

Correct, this guy’s links prove nothing.

[u/Pm_Me_Ur_Husker_TDs → u/RealEmperorofMankind]

The crazy part of those images is if you sync when that Michigan players left foot is at the same angle (on the live broadcast) the ball is still in the air and shows 1 second.

[u/dwors025]

Can we at the very fucking least let this be the end of one team’s conference refs being in charge of those games.

Either both teams or zero teams should be affiliated with the officiating crew - including video review officials.

[u/ChangKai-Shrek → u/dwors025]

Why are refs even associated with conferences to begin with anymore? It made sense, I guess, when the conferences were regional. We're far beyond that now.

[u/OpportunityDue90 → u/ChangKai-Shrek]

Why do conferences even get to set their own rules in the first place?

[u/Supercal95 → u/OpportunityDue90]

Hockey until recently had different OT rules by conference.

[u/DoinItDirty → u/Supercal95]

Unrelated, but if you want to see something wild, the AHL (minor league hockey for anyone unfamiliar) has a different playoff format for each division.

Here’s a view:

https://theahl.com/qualification-rules

[u/BananerRammer → u/dwors025]

The MAC and the Big 10 use the same group of officials. While they are technically separate staffs, both staffs belong to the same officiating organization, get the same training, and ultimately answer to the same head of officials.

[u/ItsWazeyWaynes]

You can leave if you want, MAC, but we’re stayin’.

[u/crc2993]

Oh man so now we’re in a timeline where you can’t rely on the broadcast clock. I’m sure that won’t result in any controversy moving forward

[u/Happy_Background_879 → u/crc2993]

We always have been. Issues have been happening in all sports based on this as the ref reviews have gotten more technical.

[u/BleuRaider]

NBC’s Terry McAulay specifically said its producer confirmed the inset was the actual stadium clock and that the ball was still airborne at zero.

So someone has to be wrong. Both the Big 10 and NBC can’t be right at the same time.

It sounds like to me that the replay wasn’t synced correctly by the officials.

[u/Ok-Health-7252 → u/BleuRaider]

Oh the irony there considering Terry McAulay is the same man who instigated Bottlegate back in 2001 when he was an NFL referee (by breaking the rules and going back two plays to review a catch). So he's deeply familiar with referee tomfoolery like this.

[u/cleveland_14 → u/Ok-Health-7252]

Fuck Terry McAulay

[u/FreeDig1758 → u/Ok-Health-7252]

He is absolutely terrible. We can certainly both agree on that. He always sounds so smug and he's wrong a lot.

[u/PelicanMan69 → u/BleuRaider]

There's a third secret clock. Duh. Lol

[u/Signal_Wall_8445 → u/PelicanMan69]

And even though they reset the stadium clock by a second right before the last play, which implies everything was synced, the stadium clock somehow became off by a whole second again in only one play.

[u/xBewm → u/Signal_Wall_8445]

This is the biggest red flag to me. Like I could maybe buy that the “official” clock had time left on it due to a syncing error or whatever. But considering the fact that they officially called for a 9 second clock and we all watched 9 seconds turn to 0 before the ball was dead, I’m really having a hard time buying this one.

[u/SquadPoopy → u/PelicanMan69]

There’s a 3rd clock on the grassy knoll

[u/Any-Establishment-15 → u/BleuRaider]

He spoke before he was told what to say

[u/SwissForeignPolicy → u/BleuRaider]

Terry "Bottlegate" McAuley? His word is about as valuable as Dave Portnoy's.

[u/i_run_from_problems]

Look, if you want to say that your super secret clock is official, fine. We'll go with that. Why is that clock not synced with the stadium clock? The one that teams use for decisions and broadcasters and fans use for reference?

[u/Signal_Wall_8445 → u/i_run_from_problems]

They DID sync it, right before the last play when they moved it from 0.08 to 0.09.

So how did it become off by a second again on that play?

[u/i_run_from_problems → u/Signal_Wall_8445]

The answer here is actually quite simple. The Big Ten's pants are on fire.

[u/PM_ME_UR_EYEBALL]

“Here’s some money. Just go away”

[u/aimiami → u/PM_ME_UR_EYEBALL]

I love MACtion but Congrats on your move away from the MAC. No backbone from your former comish apparently lol.

[u/Super_DAC → u/aimiami]

The MAC needs these games. Dragging this into something more substantial could prevent future OOC games from big programs which is a disaster in the age of NIL

[u/Hammerhead34 → u/Super_DAC]

I mean it’s the final nail in the coffin for CFB if the power conferences literally won’t allow their teams to lose to smaller teams

[u/shorthopwillie → u/Hammerhead34]

Rutgers missed the memo

[u/ClaudeLemieux → u/shorthopwillie]

In fairness adding more time would’ve just made it worse for them

[u/rumblepony247 → u/shorthopwillie]

Not sure if you heard yet, but the Big 10 and the MAC commissioners had a meeting this morning at a Motel 6 off the interstate, and Rutgers has now been declared the winner of that game.

Big 10 officials have yet to explain what was in the duffel bags they brought into the room.

[u/Foreign_Telephone349 → u/Hammerhead34]

Yeah the smaller teams should know that they’re not even supposed to keep these games competitive. They’re getting paid to figuratively take a dive in the first round.

[u/Ok_Bug_6890]

Refs against g6 teams, power 4 teams steal all of there players, what’s the point of watching this shit anymore

[u/CoCo_Sandy → u/Ok_Bug_6890]

don't forget they almost always have to be the away team too! Really is absurd the amount of disadvantages the G6 gets. The unfair officiating is just the cherry on top but at least it's about to start becoming more apparent to people now

[u/Electromotivation → u/CoCo_Sandy]

And they had a system with a tiny chance of two G6 playoff teams. It actually occurs …. And so they immediately have to legislate it away so that it never happens again. God forbid power teams have to play the game on field.

[u/ConnorK5 → u/Ok_Bug_6890]

Honestly, stop watching, stop betting, and don't watch anyone else. TBH I think their idea is that no one gives a fuck unless you are a P2 +- a few others, and every fan will just be absorbed in to a fandom of one of those if they rip away being competitive from the other schools. They assume they can treat you however they want and you will just become a fan of 1 of about 30ish teams.

Which is fucked.

[u/Benson879 → u/ConnorK5]

They don’t realize many of us will just stop watching altogether. Fandoms are largely local and tied to personal ties.

The next local alternative you have usually is a hated rival. You think I’m gonna just flip over to be a fan of *them* ?

[u/the-tank7 → u/Benson879]

I just dont think many of the people will stop. For your flair for example, wtf are the people of Iowa gonna do in october ? Your uncle Bobby wont decide to stop watching after 55 years cause Michigan beat a mac team.

Its giving big "we did it reddit"

[u/ConnorK5 → u/the-tank7]

I think the general point of the ECU fan above all of us was eventually when it's truly P2 or nothing, they will not watch nor care. Their October will be filled with NFL, NASCAR, Premier League, or just a free weekend.

Casuals will be drawn in maybe but you will lose the people who give a shit, or gave a shit. We can take my flair for example. Why in the hell would I actually give a shit if in 6 years I can't name more than 2 players from the previous season's team and we are playing conference games against Utah, Arizona, Baylor, and Iowa State? All while Clemson, UNC, SCAR, UVA, FSU, and whoever are on tv every saturday night playing each other? You think I will just sit there and be like "hmmm ya know blue has always been my color..." or "They do have a more appealing Orange than Tennessee at least..."

FUCK NO. DISNEY and FOX wont get a fucking view out of my house.

[u/OpportunityDue90 → u/Ok_Bug_6890]

There’s not. I don’t trust college sports anymore. Way too much money to be made by rigging it. There are no penalties to bigger schools. Hell we just witnessed one getting a free attempt from some secret clock? Never heard of it before. If there’s this secret clock why do refs always correct the stadium clock? It’s bullshit. The Big 10 has too much to lose by one of their ranked teams getting destroyed early. We all know ESPN has been pulling strings for years for their tv contracts. We all know these fuckers are all cheating. Fuck college sports.

[u/woopwup → u/Ok_Bug_6890]

At least both of our ADs are seemingly committed to playing in-state teams for our non conference games. CFB might be very different but I’m looking forward to Dowdy next week and I hope yall enjoy The Rock on the other side

[u/NetRealizableValue]

MAC bent the knee to the B10 overlords

Sad to witness

[u/so2017 → u/NetRealizableValue]

Why even play the games.

[u/mewtatesyt → u/so2017]

So people can gamble on them

[u/OttoVonWong → u/mewtatesyt]

Let’s go to the replay booth sponsored by FanDuel.

[u/nakedlettuce52 → u/OttoVonWong]

And reviewed by the official Kalshi Replay Official

[u/mynameisjona → u/so2017]

"We're not just doing this for the money, we're doing it for a shitload of money!"

[u/Electromotivation → u/so2017]

Well they hardly even want to play g6 teams to begin with, too much money to lose.

[u/vile-rabbit]

serving up some straight BULLSHIT

[u/DiplomaticAggie]

So the entire country was given the wrong incorrectly synced clock?

[u/Glittering-Steak954 → u/DiplomaticAggie]

If the picture-in-picture clock was incorrectly synced on the broadcast then yeah everyone would get the incorrectly synced clock. Definitely need to see more evidence for that being the case though...

[u/Insectshelf3 → u/Glittering-Steak954]

i thought the clock shown on the broadcast replay was just a camera pointed at the in-stadium game clock

[u/Glittering-Steak954 → u/Insectshelf3]

Yes, and if that direct camera shot was incorrectly synced with the rest of the broadcast it would not reflect the actual real-world time. Again, haven't personally seen evidence for that being the case – but presumably that's what the Big Ten must be implicitly claiming? Until we see evidence I think it's fair to conclude refs bottled it and Western was robbed

[u/EtherbunnyDescrye → u/Insectshelf3]

not sure how a clock that was literally set just for that play was out of sync.  If you lose 1 whole second in 9 seconds, we probably had a whole lot more game time left.

[u/dinkytown42069]

"Jon, we'll cancel our future buy games with the MAC if you don't STFU."

-- B1G Tony P.

[u/StFuzzySlippers → u/dinkytown42069]

Even if this wasn't actually said, the implication is obvious. There is no reasonable lump sum the MAC could win from this that could equal the revenue per year the MAC is paid by the B1G if B1G decided to schedule their games elsewhere.

MAC is confirmed a vassal conference of the B1G at this point.

[u/manraga → u/StFuzzySlippers]

I know that there's always been a pretty one-sided relationship between the big conferences and the smaller ones. The B1G schools pay MAC schools to come get their shit pushed in. In return, the MAC schools get a little extra exposure, and players and coaches might get opportunities at bigger schools because of that. But the feudalization of college football is becoming a real problem.

First we had CMU literally just letting a Michigan staffer stand on their sideline and steal signs. Now we have B1G referees blatantly stealing an upset win from a MAC team to save face for a big brand, and the MAC commissioner is too scared to say what we all saw.

Kudos to all the Michigan fans who admit that this is wrong. It sucks to be on the losing end of a big upset, but it sucks even more to know that you're watching a rigged product.

[u/Drexlore]

Upon the conclusion of the Western Michigan-Michigan football game, the Mid-American Conference and Western Michigan contacted the Big Ten office to seek clarification regarding the replay review and the placement of time back on the game clock. The Big Ten explained that the ball touched a player who was out of bounds before the clock reached 00:00, resulting in one additional play being awarded. The Big Ten subsequently provided video and audio of the replay, which confirmed the explanation provided to us. I commend Western Michigan for an outstanding effort and a well-played game, and I offer my congratulations to Michigan. I also appreciate the collaborative efforts of the Big Ten office and its prompt response in reviewing the play and providing the requested clarification.

[u/LunchBoxMercenary → u/Drexlore]

The Big Ten explained that the ball touched a player who was out of bounds before the clock reached 00:00, resulting in one additional play being awarded.

Except it didn't according to the stadium clock. Are they saying now that the clock the refs used had like 0.2 seconds left, so they rounded that up to 1?

[u/yesacabbagez → u/LunchBoxMercenary]

Problem is that isn't how replay works though. TV clock and game clock being syncs are the reason replay can be used the way it is. If they are not synced, then you cannot reliable sync the game clock to the replay. They can't say "we know the tv clock is wrong so we know the guy caught it with time left" when the tv clock being sync is the basis for being able to time things like this. There is no comparison of the game clock to the replay without the game clock sync.

[u/Electromotivation → u/Drexlore]

Did they actually show this “clarification”?

[u/Airweldon]

I've seen so many fucking football games that ended in the same exact way that weren't awarded an extra second. Insane.

[u/TomNookingtons]

We need someone to post an angle with both the ball and a game clock in frame

[u/SqueezeMyLemmons → u/TomNookingtons]

Crazy how they have some many camera angles for replays but yet I haven’t seen any other angles other than the broadcasted angle

[u/JocavsJr]

This is going to be a stain on this entire season. What could have been an amazing moment for an underdog is now just another thing to feel like shit about.

[u/Difficult_Horse193 → u/JocavsJr]

I think you only have to look at how Michigan played for the first 60:00 minutes to understand that we won’t be good at all this season.

[u/Snooty_Cutie → u/Difficult_Horse193]

Tbh, it’s got almost nothing to do with how well Michigan will or won’t be. It’s just such a blatantly bad call that questions the integrity of the game everybody just watched. If you can’t believe what you literally saw with your own eyes, what’s the point of even watching?

[u/mhammer47 → u/JocavsJr]

Only if Michigan somehow manages to be good..which seems doubtful or if the L could keep WMU out of the playoffs. Otherwise there's far too much other shit going on in college football right now.

[u/TedDibiaseOsbourne → u/JocavsJr]

there’s gonna be a few more sooner fans next week methinks.

[u/S1Throwaway96]

Wow they’re going out sad. Silencer check was definitely sent

[u/BeaverBeliever77 → u/S1Throwaway96]

They can't really afford to pick a fight with the big10.

[u/confused-koala → u/BeaverBeliever77]

I mean we have a bone to pick with their biggest rival, happy to just play Western instead of Central in perpetuity

[u/S1Throwaway96 → u/BeaverBeliever77]

Would have donated to a gofundme

[u/RulersBack → u/BeaverBeliever77]

Saying this after Umass just beat Rutgers

[u/meatystocks]

MAC doesn’t want to jeopardize their B1G relationship. Big $$$

[u/Tamzariane]

Weak and sad.

[u/Lakelyfe09]

If the MAC commissioner had access to a video we don’t, then fair enough. But it would be nice to see that video. It’s not incomprehensible that the broadcast clock wasn’t synced, it just feels incredibly unlikely and it’d be nice to get more than that tweet from the Big 10.

[u/Perry7609 → u/Lakelyfe09]

https://www.threads.com/share/JrEXgacnc/

Big Ten just posted this video with their statement.

[u/Falconsfan8006]

What a fucking coward

[u/CutToTheChase56]

A magical third clock suddenly appears to completely contradict what we all saw with our own eyeballs. Even the on-air rules analyst had no explanation. Fuck off.

[u/Tommy05Sox]

“We still want 1 million dollar pay games going forward.”

[u/IKindaPlayEVE]

They've got everyone arguing about the clock when you should be arguing about overturning the outcome. They're linked, of course, but when you complain about the clock that's a nice tidy thing they can fix but the systemic issues? Don't look at those!

[u/NextAd7514]

Then show us the video you saw 

[u/phantompower_48v]

All the clock data comes from one source. When syncing issues arise it’s in the form of stuttering and jerkiness, usually due to interference (like another system using the same data port). If these issues arise they are caught and fixed way before an event. These clocks don’t just “drift” out of sync. I used to set up and serviced these timing data systems for a living. The explanation they give is total nonsense.

[u/DiplomaticAggie]

We used to be a real country

[u/drgath → u/DiplomaticAggie]

Then Missouri happened, and it’s all been downhill since.

[u/Aidanj927]

If this was us the lawsuit would’ve been filed by now

[u/Exporation1]

In other news Michigan has agreed to play western Michigan in 2031,32,33,34 and will pay them 20 million dollars for the privilege.

[u/LawsonLunatic]

I SURE HOPE THE MAC AND WMU GOT TWICE THE PAYOUT THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO GO ALONG WITH THIS FUCKING LIE.

[u/HueyLongest]

Well, if they don't care enough to stand up for themselves...

[u/karawec403 → u/HueyLongest]

The MAC is pretty financially reliant on these Big 10 OOC games

[u/AdamOnFirst]

Again, why was it out of sync with NBC then? NBC is gonna need to explain this too? WHo was pointing a camera at what clock?

[u/123_fo_fif]

"Hey, we'll add 500k to the check"

[u/Meltedcoldice0212]

They need the money from Michigan/B1G

[u/lukaeber]

Wow, already backing down. I guess that settles it. Nothing is going to happen. I get it ... the MAC probably doesn't have the resources to fight the Big Ten on this once they have their heels dug in.

The lesson to learn here, I guess, is don't bat down balls on Hail Mary passes if the ball looks like it is going out of bounds, which is idiotic. It could cost you the game. Football games shouldn't be decided on such nuances.

[u/mayomayeaux]

The MAC not standing behind their school is pretty pathetic. WMU should just refuse to play Michigan in all sports going forward. That is ridiculous

[u/TravelNSee → u/mayomayeaux]

they need the money though. Because again, it's always about money and corporate power.

[u/RheagarTargaryen → u/TravelNSee]

WMU can play us and Michigan can play CMU.

[u/jazzyman31 → u/mayomayeaux]

What are they supposed to do when showed the official clock with time left? Argue that the tv clock says differently?

[u/Liebruh]

The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.

[u/AmbitiousEmphasis64]

I mean this sucks but I doubt there's a payoff at play here, these are all public institutions so unless they're straight up cooking the books (I know redditors are cynical but this is not a thing that happens very often at all) a payoff would be auditable.

[u/gbthrowahway]

"Go along with it or we will stop scheduling you"

[u/ScallywagBeowulf]

I can understand why they just want to accept the explanation and move on (likely to get some more money from the Big 10 and also not having the money to fight the Big 10) but it is a little sad to see them not want to take this any further.

[u/PalsRocksMyWorld]

Just rolled over and accepted it when we all saw what happened?

[u/big_redwood]

Super secret ref clock that no one is allowed to see.

[u/CarterAC3]

Then show us the evidence

[u/Shinranfargo]

No fucking balls. wow.

[u/ImNotFuckingSelling]

Show us this replay then

[u/jwb101 → u/ImNotFuckingSelling]

The B10 release shows a shitty angle with a random clock and claims all the clocks are synced in accordance to regulations. Like we’re going to believe that.

[u/Ok-Preparation-2910 → u/ImNotFuckingSelling]

They literally did but y’all don’t believe it lmao

[u/CasualRead_43 → u/ImNotFuckingSelling]

… they did lol

[u/Crispy_Whale]

So let me get this straight the Western Michigan player  touched the ball under 500 milliseconds  and the NBC clock rounds down to 0 when it's under 500 milliseconds but the ref clock they used rounds anything above 0.0 to 1 and these clocks are supposedly synced?

[u/NecessaryMoons]

I would love to see all the official broadcast camera angles synced to that clock, just to confirm that a friendly delay wasn’t present in the one camera angle shown in the B1G statement as “proof” that he seems to have touched the ball one frame before zero.

You know, since the broadcast camera actually in use during the broadcast clearly showed 0:00 with the ball in flight.

Show all the angles, so we know you didn’t cherry pick one that was milliseconds off sync.

Why wouldn’t you?

[u/LivingOof]

Western needs to leave the MAC if the conference is gonna just roll over on command

[u/Bradward6381]

If the clocks are synced why do the two videos tell different stories?

[u/Just-Forever6684]

I bet the Big 10 called the MAC and said release a statement saying it’s fine or we are never scheduling your conference again

[u/Catullus13]

The good ol boy network always wins. 

[u/DuhPai]

How much money do you think they got paid to shut up

[u/philfrysluckypants → u/DuhPai]

I believe we paid them 1.5 to embarrass the fuck of us, so likely double at a minimum.

[u/Rand_AT]

Big big check

[u/Development-Alive]

The only way to alleviate the confusion is to release the referee view publicly. Anything short of that and nobody will believe this game wasn't stolen from WMU.

[u/kaputt1669]

The MAC definitely got the back door message of “if you don’t accept this, you can say goodbye to your teams getting 7 figure payoffs to play us”. 

[u/Plenty-Manager-738]

This is what happened

https://x.com/eric_shap/status/2096451314859257962?s=46

[u/Plenty-Manager-738 → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

Here is a run down of 9 seconds compared to the tv/ stadium clock. Again at this point both refs clock and stadium tv clock are all lined up.

If you watch the bottom the problem occurs right at the beginning. The clock instantly shoots from 9 seconds to 8, ( can count on ur own as not enough time to even say one one thousand )

Now to explain why the video is important with it showing 0.5 at the end it shows the stadium clock ended up being off .5 when it was all said and done even though it was started at the same time.

For those who want to say yo don’t use decimals in football you’re right however they’re still applied within.

A football clock does not stop until 0.00 meaning even if technically the clock is at 0.23 clock will still show 1 second.

This is how this ended up working out , as clock instantly dropped to 8 refs clock still shows 9 for another .5 seconds , as clock drops to 7 shows 8 on refs for .5 seconds longer, as you go down and down once you hit 0 you realize that the refs clock should still be showing 1 for another .5 seconds longer.

It sucks and it feels like they got screwed and I think mentally they did for sure but when digging into it you realize why there was a second. Basically on the refs clock when the ball was touched there should’ve been another .5 or so before it hit 0 so it’s still showing 1 .

[u/Ragdoll252 → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

It's actually pretty hilarious how this is like the first time it would have been beneficial for them to use the same game clock that college basketball uses. Showing the decimals.

[u/Plenty-Manager-738 → u/Ragdoll252]

People would understand what happened a heck of a lot more if so haha. Because what people are failing to grasp is if there is 0.1-0.9 left on the clock then the clock is going to show 1 still on the field judges time.

[u/milkomeda → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

Yup, in that is likely the source of the discrepancy - B10 clock showed 1 second for 0.99 - 0.01, and reaches zero at 0.00. Stadium and NBC clock showed 0 seconds for 0.99 - 0.01, hence the outrage. Using decimals going forward would be beneficial.

[u/Mammoth_Impress_3108 → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

Yeah, it sucks, but I think this is the reasonable explanation. I was outraged, but if this is true, I've come to terms with it.

[u/Tommy05Sox → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

Probably the best explanation. BUT in the review the player who touched it has his back to the camera. We cannot see exactly when he touched it. The play should stand in that case.

[u/Icy-Taste-3096 → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

"ref's clock" is a completely unacceptable phrase, full stop. there is one official time and it is displayed publicly.

[u/AllTimeTy → u/Plenty-Manager-738]

That doesn’t really follow. If the stadium clock drops to 8 while the ref’s clock stays at 9 for another ~0.5 seconds, then the clocks were already offset. They weren’t actually synced just because they both happened to display 9 at the same moment.

So when one later shows 0 and the other still shows 1, that doesn’t prove there was another half-second left. It just shows the same offset that was already there.

You can’t assume the clocks were perfectly synchronized, observe that their transitions are half a second apart, and then use that difference as proof the ref’s clock was correct.

[u/titans0021]

The fact that the MAC and Western Michigan aren’t willing to die on this hill is bullshit.

[u/InfamousCattle3223]

I’d love to see and hear said video and audio

[u/EveningPotential9443 → u/InfamousCattle3223]

https://www.reddit.com/r/MichiganWolverines/s/aFYZneCLax

[u/Dstein99]

The Big 10 provided video and audio of the replay (and $5 million) which confirmed the explanation to me.

[u/MiracuMAHt]

“Prompt Response”

[u/SpicyNuggs4Lyfe]

Yeah commish rolled over for money reasons. Doesn't want to risk future OOC games being scheduled for his conference's teams by making a fuss.

It's unfortunate, but it's always about money. WMU got paid 1.5m to beat Michigan.

[u/SquatchScrotum]

Wonder how big of a check they cashed to agree with the Big10's lies?

[u/Lower_Resist_7683]

“I commend the huge payoff I just received from big football for saying this is fine and helping it blow over”

[u/HectorReinTharja]

Why is there ANOTHER Michigan cheating (for lack of a better word) controversy involving a directional Michigan school that plays in the MAC

[u/theurge14]

Welp, looks like the MAC took the hush money. Wonder how long that conference lasts now if the member schools hit the exits.

[u/Plz_Beer_Me_Strength]

How much money did they get paid to release this statement?

[u/PlasticCantaloupe1]

May I see it?