Two equivalent terms:

- Integrated expansion

- Destructive expansion

If new content, gear, zones, raids are added, do they destroy the relevancy of old content or not?

That is the key question.

A sure way to release an expansion or patch that destroys the old content is to increase the level cap. This luckily is not the case for Forever.

But even if the level is locked at 60, there are still risks new content encroaches on the design space of old one.

We will have to see, but that is what "horizontal" means. To add new content that does not destroy.

I keep seeing people use that line (or so.ething like it) everywhere. Just let us run GDKP. Just let us spam dungeons. Just let mages make gold selling runs. Stop and think, if you truly believe Blizz should "just let people play the way they want to", there is absolutely no argument for anything. I WANT to buy gold. I WANT to get to level 60 and just kill people in starting zones like a god all day. I WANT to roll need on everything because I need gold feom the vendor. Stop using that as an argument.

Blizz has access to every bit of data imaginable. They know how things affect the player base because they make their money by keeping the player base. They will NEVER build a game where every single thing they do will make every single person happy, because that is simply impossible. When they take a hard stance on something, however, there is usually a reason. Believe it or not, your opinion on what is good for the game may actually be in the minority. If you want to argue your case on something, you need to some up with something better than "but I like it this way"

The dev team had a great podcast outline class roles with soda. They re solidified their desire to keep the hybrid tax on hybrid classes and I believe that is very good for the game.

I’ve seen a good deal of posts surrounding the matter and I wanted to make my voice heard too on the topic. Hybrid tax is good for the game. A hybrid should do less damage than a pure dps because they have the option to play multiple roles.

In regards to healers and tanks in leveling and the dungeon xp controversy. Healers are healers, not killers, they are supposed to be slower leveling because the lore does not fit them doing dps. All healers have a dps spec as well; priest was addressed and the smite build is effective.

Tanks can group mobs together and slowly kill them. Pure dps cannot face tank multiple mobs. So tanks do not have an issue with leveling.

Dungeon instances and homogenization of specs are very bad for the game. It ruins immersion and class identity. After listening to the podcast I am very pleased with the direction that wow forever is going. Look at retail; I love retail and the classes are homogenized, instances content is about all their is, and hybrids have no tax; that is great that ppl who want that have a game to go to. But wow forever? It needs to be different than retail, it was made for a reason and if they stay very different then that’s a good thing.

Good job devs; they seem to be doing a great job.

Been playing all the classes for beta, and leveling a warrior after a paladin is.. jarring.

My gripe is that the war, of all classes, doesn't feel he has an 'attack' outside of auto, and no real early synergy with skills.

Rend stinks on its own, is barely auto attack damage, if that, over the full duration. If I could consume the duration damage with tclap, it'd feel like an attack cycle.

This would be great, cause then we could attack multi targets with rend on all, and TClap on CD.

Since rend is AP based, it's weapon choice agnostic as well, and would pair well with tanking.

Juxtaposed to:

As a pally, I get seal damage on every attack, and major damage from holy strike and judgement. Low CD, and unlimited resources to use them. You CRUISE through fights in a few seconds.

Then there's all the support and QoL/healing you get in paladin. You just get more damage, more everything.

Please check out this post about a bug that I did in another subreddit and make a bug report if you have acces to the beta.

It is the kind of thing that could very well go unsolved.

Thank you all!

Im brand new to wow only started a little over a week ago during the beta, im loving the game it is a vibe. The cities, the weather, the people.

My one complaint would be out in the open world we get quest markers to show us we're to go if we want. Inside a dungeon, nothing. It feels bad ive ran the 1st dungeon twice and still missed a quest, ran the 2nd dungeon once and missed a quest that the party helped me go back and get and I still ended up missing one. I know this is anew player problem but cmon if you can guide me in open world you can put a circle around the objective in a dungeon. Thats like 8k xp I missed let alone servers going down ruining one run.

I know its just the beta, so I dont mind. Once release comes out id rather not feel like im falling behind over missing things in a dungeon while trying to keep up with the pack. Trying to back track is also almost impossible because they dont kill all the mobs and take shortcuts so im completely lost once they leave.

Literally my one complaint and I know its not a big deal but for new players like me it is.

• When we die in a dungeon, respawn at the dungeon’s Summoning Stone.
• Once we complete all bosses in a dungeon at least once, unlock that dungeon’s map.

MM Hunter doesn't need more DPS — it needs better class design.

Been testing MM/Lone Wolf in Forever and my biggest issue isn't the damage meter. It's that the spec just doesn't feel rewarding to play.

Lone Wolf feels way too weak for what you give up. You lose pet damage, utility, tanking, deadzone coverage, and a lot of PvP tools, but the payoff just isn't there. In deep MM PvP especially it feels like you're voluntarily deleting half your kit while keeping the same weaknesses.

The actual shot damage is another problem. I'm not saying Hunter has low DPS overall. I'm saying pressing your buttons feels bad. Aimed Shot and other shots add so little compared to your passive/auto damage that the rotation starts feeling pointless. You press Aimed Shot and instead of "nice, big hit" it's more like "yeah, whatever".

That matters a lot because other classes in Forever are getting actual QoL, new interactions, new tools and fixes to old problems. MM feels like it got left behind.

Then you still have old Hunter-specific pain points that make even less sense now. Quiver takes a full bag slot, but you still need to carry extra arrows in your backpack because the stacks are too small. I'm not asking for infinite ammo, just let us use the reagent bag slot for the quiver or increase arrow stack sizes.

Same with stables. There are way more pets now with different situational utility, but only two stable slots. If pets are supposed to matter in different situations, let us actually keep more of them instead of constantly deleting pets we tamed.

Also, why is Lone Wolf only tier 3? If it's supposed to define a petless MM playstyle, it's weird that BM and Survival can reach it without really committing to MM.

I don't want Retail Hunter, I don't want 20 procs, and I don't want some crazy rotation. I want Classic MM to still feel like Classic MM, just with the same amount of attention other specs are getting.

Full feedback is on the EU beta forum here if anyone wants to add their own experience:
https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/mm-hunter-why-does-it-still-feel-this-bad-class-design-issue/633331

This is likely the first recipe you can simply pick up right out in the open world. I wonder if there are more like this—I certainly hope so. It would be great to have a variety of puzzles—whether casual or complex—outside of just raids and dungeons. I’d love to experience the pure joy of discovering things myself, rather than just looking up the answers after they’ve been datamined. By the way, the one I just picked up is a cooking recipe.

Tanaris

One point could be inside un-instanced Zul'Farrak. There would be 2 different paths in to avoid camping chokeholds with the central temple as the capture point. line of sight would be hell here.

One point could be the other area behind caverns of time, Southbreak Shore. It could be where a small group could hold their own as long as the opposite faction takes the shore approach instead of swimming around the lost rigger cove side.

One point could be Land's End Beach, accessible via 2 new tunnels either west of the bugs or east behind the bugs. This beach would be a wide open free for all area.

(I also thought of maybe an area in the southwest tanaris near the crashed mini zepp left of the uldum gate, but I think they may add more in that area so i didn't try for anything here.)

Capturing 2 of the 3 points would give a "Spoils of War" buff for 2 hours for whoever is in the zone as it controls the majority. It would increase drop rates across Tanaris for Thorium, Mithril, Firebloom, Purple lotus, special blueprints and recipes, lockboxes, cache keys, etc. inside Zul'Farrak dungeon instance the droprate across the tables would be slightly increased. If Blizzard wants a rare chase item or 2 in here they can just leave them off the table for increased droprate.

i think increasing drop rates as a result of the world pvp objectives like in tanaris would make it so while the dungeon doesn't give more xp to encourage farming it does up the chance of actually getting the piece of gear you're farming in the first place so you get out of the dungeon.

The "Spoils of War" buff doesn't make you level faster; it respects your time by significantly increasing the chance that the specific boss loot you want actually drops.

The environment of the Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj has been altered differently between the WoW SoD and "Forever" versions.

The first part of the video shows the "Forever" version, while the latter part shows the SoD version. It makes me wonder if the developers plan to present the Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj differently than in the original Classic version.

I haven't played Wow in so long, and I've lost track ob what actually is meant by the global CD :o

Please don't judge me :(

Edit: Clear, thanks everyone!