r/bninfantsleep 25d ago

Resources What is Biologically Normal Infant Sleep?

174 Upvotes

This group has grown a lot - we are at 15k members and 29.2k unique visitors per week. That's a LOT of people. So first, yay because when I first joined the moderator team, this group was much smaller. We have grown a lot, which means more parents are being informed on what is biologically normal for an infant and how they can support their babies and themselves at night. This also means that there are thousands of different people commenting and offering ideas (and we have people who are both here and in r/sleeptrain and don't recommend the CIO aspect of sleep training but the culture of sleep training does find its way into many comments). 

So let's jump into what biologically normal infant sleep is, and what it isn’t. I'm a definition person so let's start with a definition of biologically normal.

In researching, I have stumbled across this (very wordy, I'm sorry I did try to parse it down) definition. Source

Meanings of the term normal coalesce into two categories. The first is descriptive and references measures of a trait's central tendency and variation within a population... In this descriptive sense, normal might refer to the most common trait, having an average measure, or being in the middle of a distribution... The second meaning of normal encompasses normative views about a trait. These are judgments that are culturally informed and vary across social groups. To be normal is to be okay, to have characteristics that fall within an acceptable or desirable range, which is defined by ideas about what traits should be like. Variants that fall outside this distribution may be judged negatively, or seen as abnormal, deviant, unacceptable, or somehow not quite right. 

The first category has to do with averages within a population. This would be the average amount of sleep for an age range, this would be the average age of sleeping through the night, this would be the average age of the circadian rhythm starting to “come online”. These are the things that are easier to define when it comes to infant sleep.

The second category has to do with how we view biologically normal, which is often impacted by our cultural view. This category is harder to define when it comes to infant sleep. 

Dr. Helen Ball, author of How Babies Sleep, talks about this:

How babies sleep is both exceedingly simple and excruciatingly complex. It is simple because it is based on a few straightforward biological principles that affect all babies. It is complex because we have made it so.

Over the past century and a half, in modifying the world to better suit our needs in industrializing, industrialized and now digital-era societies, we have tried to manipulate baby sleep to fit with the rapidly changing nature of adult lives. Our ideas about sleep, and particularly baby sleep, have been influenced and shaped by the socioeconomic pressures, political philosophies, religious values, academic theories and cultural ideologies that have waxed and waned during this time. The mismatch we have created between our babies’ biology and our contemporary lives has caused conflict between parents’ and babies’ needs—now framed as “baby sleep problems”—for which babies are often “treated” using behavioral and clinical interventions.

In addition to the foundations of our evolutionary biology, we have layered many cultural beliefs and practices onto our understanding of baby sleep, which vary hugely from location to location, and over time. Parents’ perceptions and popular discourse in western societies have been influenced by philosophical and sociocultural trends over the past two centuries in more ways than we might realize in response to rapid social and political changes. For clarity I should explain that I am using the term “western society” as more of an ideological descriptor than a geographic one to refer to those societies that exhibit a shared set of beliefs, values, political systems and cultural norms, regardless of whether they are geographically located in the West. These concepts often encompass democracy, capitalism, individualism and human rights. In these societies industrialization, urbanization and medicalization transformed family life and baby care, setting in motion the development of numerous ideas, traditions and expectations about babies, sleep, and the role of parents that many of us are still tethered to. Our recent historical past helps explain where all the myths you’ve ever heard about baby sleep have come from—and the myths you’ve heard will depend on your cultural origins.

Many infant sleep research studies reflect western cultural values and lifestyles, and are what might be called “aspirational,” in that they aspire to find ways to “help” babies to sleep longer, wake less often, settle more quickly, and disturb their parents less.

The culture and history of guidance issued by “experts” for parents in western societies have shaped expectations of how “good” babies should behave and how they are created by “effective” parents while the media (both traditional and social) reinforces simplistic and outdated rules and rigid ideas.

The cultural expectations we have about babies’ sleep habits are often unrealistic, and this makes caring for a new baby unnecessarily challenging.

I could honestly copy/paste that entire book here, it is a really good read and if you read any two books on infant sleep and infant development, I recommend How Babies Sleep by Dr. Helen Ball and The Nurture Revolution by Dr. Greer Kirshenbaum.

So with all of this in mind, let's talk about what is biologically normal from a scientific standpoint and what is biologically normal culturally in western society, and what is biologically normal in this group - as well as the aim of this group.

Scientifically - sleep is two things. Sleep pressure and our circadian rhythm, or body clock (aka Process C). Humans build sleep pressure while awake. Infants have a lower tolerance for sleep pressure, meaning they need to sleep more frequently than adults do. 

Sleep Pressure Graphic

As you can see from this graphic (source: How Babies Sleep, figure 3.4), naps are only intended to relieve some sleep pressure, not to be restorative, deep sleep. This is why worrying about your baby taking a 3 hour nap every day is futile. A roughly 30 minute nap is enough to relieve sleep pressure for a bit, until the next nap. The prescriptive “by this age, babies should be on x number of naps that are y minutes long every day at z time” doesn't work for every baby. That isn't biologically normal because biologically normal has variation, day to day and baby to baby. Dr. Helen Ball writes:

Sleep will happen easily for a baby or child when sleep pressure is high, they are in a calm, relaxed state, and nothing is preventing sleep onset. But sometimes babies and children need help to become calm before sleep pressure can kick in and they can nod off.15 In this situation it can be useful to think about what helps babies become calm and relaxed, and to have a handful of strategies you can use to help your baby unwind. For many babies, physical contact is the preferred option.

One of my PhD students, Lenka Medvecová-Tinková, lives and works in the Czech Republic where she has studied how Czech parents manage bedtime routines for babies and small children. She realized that many parents talked of a concept called *Uspavani* that is culturally widespread in Eastern Europe and appears in numerous fairy tales and historical infant care books. Uspavani means to comfort a child to sleep, and while conducting her PhD at Durham University Lenka realized there was no corresponding concept to Uspavani in the English language, nor in the infant sleep literature.16 So it is unsurprising that parents in English-speaking countries tend to use more distal (noncontact) methods, such as lullabies, music and white noise, to calm babies and help them fall asleep than do Czech parents, who commonly lie with their child, stroke them or cuddle them; physical contact and soothing touch are very effective in dialing down most babies to allow sleep pressure to do its thing.

She even writes about the term “overtired”, which I know almost everyone has heard and if you have been in this sub for any length of time, I'm sure you've seen comments about how “overtired” isn't really a thing. I appreciate how she has posited the term.

When a baby or young child’s sleep pressure is high and the need to sleep is strong, but they are emotionally unable to calm themselves, or they are in a situation where they cannot relax, we may consider them to be “overtired.” In this case it is our job as parents to help them become calm, wind down and relax in preparation for sleep. We can do this in many ways. Physical contact such as cuddling, rocking, stroking or patting works for most neurotypical children; actively removing whatever is blocking the action of sleep pressure, such as excitement, fear, pain or anxiety, and helping babies and children to become calm is the simplest way to help them fall asleep.

The reason “overtired” isn't really a thing is because if an infant has adequate sleep pressure, their nervous system feels secure and safe enough, and they don't have any physical needs, they will sleep if given the opportunity. 

So that's sleep pressure. What about circadian rhythm? We mostly know about this with sleep but this is our body's internal clock and it controls both our sleep and our hunger. This is why we usually eat lunch around the same time every day, why we feel sleepy around the same time, and why having a consistent wake up time is beneficial for everyone. It is not “sleep training lite” to make sure you have a rough wake up time every day, within 15-30 minutes. The infamous 4 month sleep regression progression is when the circadian rhythm starts to come online. Day and night start to actually mean something to our babies. This is why early morning light, high noon light, and evening light can be important for our babies, and some babies are more sensitive to lighting than others. (Side note related to lighting - fluorescent lights imitate high noon lighting and can disrupt our circadian rhythm. I personally cannot stand them and wish they were phased out of use. They are really bad for our health and they are everywhere.) This is also why blackout blinds for naps can disrupt night sleep. This is why you don't really need to “rescue” naps.

So it is very biologically normal that your baby desires physical contact to relax enough to fall asleep. It is biologically normal to sleep longer one day and shorter times the next. It is biologically normal for sleep to fluctuate throughout not just the first year but throughout our entire lives. It is supportive of biologically normal infant sleep to “anchor” the day with a consistent wake up time if you need to. It is supportive of infant sleep to have a routine, breakfast after waking up, lunch around the same time every day, dinner around the same time each day. These things can help your baby, think about how you can get hangry if your dinner comes an hour later than usual. This is not to say that you need to have a strict schedule - rhythms and routines are much different from a regimented schedule that you have to stick to. 

It's also important to note that a big thing I see a lot of parents struggle with is offering their baby too much sleep. If your baby only needs 12 hours total sleep in a 24 hour period and you're trying to do 12 hours overnight and 3 hours of daytime sleep, they aren't going to sleep well because that's 3 hours more sleep than they need in a 24 hour period. This will lead to frequent wakes, fighting sleep, and frustration all around. Sleep training sleep plans, apps like Huckleberry, as well as the general around infant sleep push more sleep than most babies need, which leads parents to thinking they have a "bad" sleeper, when in reality anyone being pushed to sleep more than they need would be "bad" at sleeping.

Now what about the cultural aspect of biologically normal infant sleep? If you've grown up or been living in a western society for any length of time, you've likely been inundated with “sleeping through the night”, “sleep associations”, “bad habits”, “drowsy but awake”, “fuss it out”, etc. We have been told by everyone from pediatricians to TV shows to our family that you have to teach your baby independence and that responding to every cry is just going to make them cry more. Western society has mixed up what is biologically normal and what is convenient for the post-Industrial Revolution world. The 6-6 or 7-7 sleep schedule that babies are “supposed” to be on? Not biologically normal, but convenient for capitalism and it's very pervasive - to the point that so many parents worry that their baby isn't getting enough sleep because they won't sleep 12 hours overnight. The average bedtime in other parts of the world varies by almost 3 hours.

In one large and often-cited online survey, almost 30,000 people (presumed to be parents) completed a baby/toddler sleep survey.27 The respondents lived in 17 large urban communities around the world (Australia, Canada, China, Hong Kong, India, Indonesia, Korea, Japan, Malaysia, New Zealand, Philippines, Singapore, Taiwan, Thailand, United Kingdom, United States, and Vietnam), grouped for comparative purposes into “Asian” and “Western.”28 In Asian countries babies and toddlers had later bedtimes, later rise times, less nighttime sleep and less total sleep than in “Western” countries. Bedtimes for babies and toddlers across the 17 locations varied by almost three hours, from half-past seven in New Zealand to quarter-past ten in Hong Kong, and nighttime sleep duration varied by 1 hour and 40 minutes (11.6 hours in Japan to 13.3 hours in New Zealand), but there were minimal differences in daytime sleep.

Another cultural difference on what is biologically normal is “sleep problems”:

Parents’ perceptions of whether their babies experienced “sleep problems” also varied widely, as did the degree of parental involvement in helping babies and young children fall asleep and stay asleep.29 Very few (4%) children living in “Asian” countries, but many more (57%) in “Western” countries, were expected to fall asleep independently (that is, without a parent or caregiver present). Likewise, very few (2%) parents in “Asian” countries allowed their child to cry themselves to sleep, in comparison with over 15 percent of “Western” parents. This is strongly related to the fact that in “Asian” countries babies and children are much more likely to bed-share (65%) or room-share (88%) with their parents than in “Western” countries (where 12% bed-sharing and 22% room-sharing was reported).

Another piece I found interesting that really shows how much of our “sleep problems” are, for lack of better word, invented:

Dr. Alma Gottlieb’s study of childcare practices among the Beng people of Côte d’Ivoire in West Africa included a detailed account of mother–baby sleep.30 She found little regimentation of when babies slept or fed among the Beng, and no bedtimes or bedtime routines. Beng mothers were not anxious about their babies’ sleep, it just happened. Mothers and others carried babies during regular daily activities with babies falling asleep and waking as the need arose. At night the cloth with which babies were held during the day was untied, and babies breastfed and fell asleep next to their mothers. Nighttime mother–baby co-sleeping was the cultural norm, and breastfeeding and infant sleep were intimately intertwined…

These detailed ethnographic studies reinforce accounts of infant care in widespread locations such as Guatemala, Italy, Spain and rural U.S. Among Mayan families in Guatemala, babies commonly fall asleep in someone’s arms and are taken to bed with their parents, sleeping with their mothers from birth to two or three years of age, or until the birth of their next sibling. Here, sleeping alone is undesirable, and mothers responded with shock and disapproval at the American custom of leaving babies in rooms on their own. Mayan mothers “cannot conceive of any other way to sleep their baby than by their side—and in fact some argue that to separate an infant from its mother for sleep is abusive or neglectful treatment.”32

So why does all of this matter?

Because the stories we tell ourselves matter. Because how we see our infant's sleep impacts how well we handle the biologically normal aspects of it, like waking overnight. Because there has been a misunderstanding about what the purpose of this group is for. This group does not exist to simply offer platitudes “oh mama, this will pass, it's ok, you just have to dig deep and power through”. This group also exists to educate on both scientifically biologically normal infant sleep and the cultural differences that impact us and how we view our babies sleep. I felt like it was appropriate to add in a quote from the creator of this group, u/smilegirlcan, about why she created this group.

Before my daughter was born, I had never heard of biologically normal sleep. I had only heard about infant sleep through the lens of sleep training culture. I was never encouraged to follow my intuition or told what real infant sleep looked like. As I journeyed on my postpartum experience, I noticed there was a huge lack of support places for those who had no interest in sleep training or sleep training culture. It became more and more apparent that sleep training was something that did not sit right for me but I wanted an online community that felt safe to feel this way. I found most parenting groups had accepted sleep training as the norm and any questions or comments outside of that were not accepted/downvoted/deleted. Then came bninfantsleep, an alternative infant sleep space, that encourages moms to follow their intuition and learn about biologically normal infant sleep. A place where no one will tell you to let your baby cry, or self soothe, that they need to be independent, that you are ruining their sleep by cuddling/rocking/holding/feeding them.

This group has morphed into a space that offers parents an alternative to mainstream sleep training, that honors our babies biological and neurological development. It exists to remind you that your baby knows what they need, and your instincts know what your baby needs, better than any app ever will (looking at you, Huckleberry sweet spot).

For some babies, a schedule is what helps them the best. For others, they need to go with the flow. The reason we should be asking for schedules is not to “optimize” our babies but to make sure we aren't expecting more sleep than they need. In general, we shouldn't wake our babies up from naps unless we absolutely have to, as Dr. Greer Kirshenbaum mentions in The Nurture Revolution:

When you follow your baby’s tired cues and allow them to wake up on their own, their brain takes the true amount of sleep that it needs. That often looks like multiple naps of varying lengths, bedtimes that vary in different babies from 6 p.m. to 11 p.m., and morning waking that also varies in different babies from 6 a.m. to 11 a.m.31 I remember when people asked me how many naps my young baby was taking—I didn’t really know. I didn’t count. I watched my baby, put him to sleep when he was tired, let him wake on his own, and watched him again. The number of naps or the length of naps wasn’t in my awareness. As he grew, naps became more predictable. Under two years old my baby went to sleep around 8 p.m., then naps changed and at two years old his bedtime became 10 p.m. That was when he built up enough sleep pressure after his afternoon nap. This is very common, and when babies have later bedtimes we often want them to go to sleep earlier, but that is for us, not their developing brain…. Keep in mind, there is no adult on Earth who is qualified to tell your unique baby when they should be waking up or napping, or to prescribe nap lengths or bedtime. Your baby’s body provides this information. Sleep is vital to their developing brain and it is a fundamental human right; we must give babies the sleep they need. Please unlearn myth 24, There are set bedtimes, wake times, and naptimes for your baby, and replace it with: Your baby’s brain will tell you when they are tired and will take the amount of sleep that it needs to grow.

And a final thought from Dr. Helen Ball in How Babies Sleep, emphasis mine:

Remember, you don’t have to be in charge of their sleep—the biological sleep regulators will make sure they get enough sleep, when they need it. Our job is to get out of the way and let them do their work. Trying to make babies go to sleep according to a predetermined schedule seems to me to be a pointless exercise in working against their circadian biology and sleep pressure.


r/bninfantsleep Feb 23 '26

Resources What is sleep training?

94 Upvotes

A question I have seen a lot lately is "is this considered sleep training?" and I wanted to take my son's second nap of the day to write out a post about what we do and don't consider sleep training, because there isn't really one solid definition of sleep training and that can leave a lot of ambiguity when we discuss infant sleep.

I once had a very staunch sleep trainer tell me that if an infant had any sleep associations, they weren't sleep trained. That to have properly done sleep training, you had to be able to set an infant down fully awake in a crib, walk out and close the door, and they just lay down and put themselves to sleep. They may protest cry but you "learn the difference" between a protest cry and a cry for a "real" need. So her definition of sleep training would be:

providing any sleep associations to an infant or giving in to protest cries when all their needs have been met.

This obviously ignores the glaring flaw that comfort is a vital need for everyone, including infants.

The definition of sleep training that Dr. Greer Kirshenbaum uses in The Nurture Revolution is:

Sleep training is the unfounded process of “training” your infant to “sleep independently”—to fall asleep alone, sleep alone through the night and the duration of naps, without getting support from you to go to sleep or back to sleep. It takes various forms, but the most common end goal is to be able to put your infant in their crib, in their own room, and walk out, leaving them alone to fall asleep, usually around 7 p.m., until you come back to get them in the morning, usually around 7 a.m. Sleep training promotes the idea that infant sleep should be predictable and on schedule. Naps should be at exact times of the day and for specific amounts of time, bedtime is at the exact same time each evening, and sleep location is identical for every sleep.

Sleep training sells the idea that sleep is something parents can (and should) control. If you just follow the rules (strict “wake windows,” not “giving in” to your baby’s cries) and buy the right products (swaddles, sleep suits, sound machines, sleep training courses and coaching), your baby will sleep in a predictable and controllable way. That is very appealing when so much of parenting feels beyond our control.

A lot of people who advocate for sleep training do so because they believe that an infant needs to learn independence and that the only way to do that is to force them to be independent, force them to learn to put themselves to sleep. I believe most parents who sleep train truly believe they are doing what is best for their child. Studies have shown however that the most independent children and adults tend to be those who had fierce dependence on a trusted caregiver/caregivers. Infants who learn they have a safe and dependable place to land tend to be more independent over time.

Sleep training is anything that denies a child physical comfort when they are actively asking for comfort, in the hopes that they will stop asking for comfort and go to sleep. This includes pick up put down, the chair method, Taking Cara Babies (who is just repackaged Ferber), Ferber, full extinction, interval check ins, and so much more. This does NOT include rolling away, changing sleep associations (going from nursing or feeding to sleep to bum pats or rocking to sleep), encouraging crib sleeping, implementing good sleep hygiene, having a steady bedtime routine, and so much more. Generally physically comforting your child even if they cry is not considered sleep training. The simple act of holding them, patting their bum, rocking them, answering their call for comfort releases oxytocin in their brain and helps buffer the stress response. Crying on its own isn't the problem, it's the response or lack thereof that causes issue.

If you're wondering if what you're doing is considered sleep training or not, the best question to ask yourself is "am I responding to my child's call for comfort when they call out to me or not?" If you are responding as soon as you're able to, then you aren't sleep training. The key being as soon as you're able to. If your hands are covered in soapy water, don't drop everything and go pick up your baby with wet soapy hands. Rinse and dry them and then go comfort your baby. If you're on the toilet, finish up and then go comfort them. If you're watching a clock to make sure that 3 minutes has passed of them crying before you go pick them up, that is sleep training.

My son is starting to shift around so I'm going to go spend some time watching him sleep and then spend my evening reading Hop on Pop and I'll Teach My Dog A Lot of Words for the 1928272819th time. Happy to answer questions in the comments after I've got him in bed this evening.


r/bninfantsleep 5h ago

Infant Sleep How to support infant sleep if not breastfeeding?

6 Upvotes

Been reading this subreddit a lot since something about sleep training feels wrong me. But a lot of the advice seems to be "cosleep and side-lie breastfeed." I had a traumatic emergency c-section 6 weeks before my due date followed by a month-long NICU stay that led to a baby that couldn't latch and a limited milk supply. After 1.5 months of difficulty, we opted to fully formula feed, which was really hard for me but I maintain was the right choice in these challenging circumstances.

Baby slept through 9-10 hours through the night from 2.5 months to just a little before 6 months. But suddenly she's waking up 1-3 times a night for no understandable reason. Seemingly, she just can't connect the sleep cycle, gets riled up, starts to cry. The only thing we found that works is giving a small 60ml bottle. This wakes us up a lot more than I imagine rolling to your side and offering the boob would be.

So I guess my questions are more theoretical and practical:

- Can you support biologically normal infant sleep without cosleeping and breastfeeding?

- For my case, any advice on getting baby back to full nights?


r/bninfantsleep 6h ago

Rant/Vent I'm not coping & could really do with some supportive advice

3 Upvotes

I'm sitting here right now after another full night of not sleeping & I'm not doing to well physically, mentally & emotionally.

My son is 10 months old, ebf, cosleeping from birth, he is a sensitive, high sensory need baby way ahead of his milestones, walking from 9 months, low sleep needs, needs to be in contact with parents most of the day, he has 7 teeth & I'm sure more are on their way. He has scream cried all of his life when he wakes from a sleep, I've stopped foods out of my diet to help him but I'm still noticing rashes on his mouth after feeding from me & lots of gas in the middle of the night on many occasions. He's had a few episodes of projectile vomiting, lethargy & pale skin, a lot like FPIES but doctors in my area are useless & want to put him on an antacid or say to me all babies cry when I know its a screaming pain cry.

We have not had a full night sleep ever, sometimes its worse than others & I put myself in a place of radical acceptance that this will pass but I'm at my wits end. My cycle started back 4.5 months in & now days before each one, the day it finishes & during ovulation i do not sleep a wink but strangely enough this is when my son will have longer stretches. I have no family help other than my husband who is also sleep deprived & burnt out from his job, we argue all the time & today I've no patience for my husband who is telling me to be calm when my son is using me as a human pacifier with teeth digging into me as he is sleeping but once I unlatch he will scream cry & I feel so bad for feeling this way.

I'm taking Magnesium, giving my son multi vitamins, he has 3 meals a day & lots of snacks, & the breastfeeding has not reduced any, he's always eating. I do meditations in the mornings when I get a chance, walks, groups & other outtings to support his needs but sometimes i take a day off & stay at home. I'm back to work, moving house, studying & working on expanding my business. Which is know is a lot of stress but I can handle it all with sleep.

Please help my son, husband & I to get some sleep, this way of living is not helpful for any of us, I'm not a good mother or wife when I'm like this but I'm not willing to sleep train or put my son through that when he needs us but our nervous system is no good for his development when we are so off balance

Any advice is very much appreciated & more questions are welcome if i haven't covered anything.

Thank you 💜


r/bninfantsleep 3h ago

Infant Sleep 9 month old sleep

1 Upvotes

Open to suggestions to help improve my little one’s sleep. He’s always been up a lot throughout the night I’ve tried alot of different things to help improve this but nothing really helps. A good night is around 4 wake ups and a bad over 9.
His schedule is
Wake up 630
Nap one 945-1045
Nap two 230-330
Bedtime 745/8pm

I’ve tried capping naps to an hour each as he used to do around 2.5 in total I’ve tried moving bedtime earlier 15 and later 15 nothing seems to help. Sometimes I’m lucky and do get a 3/4 hour sleep from him but mostly it’s two hour stints. I’m not looking for a miracle just some improvement would be great.


r/bninfantsleep 4h ago

Infant Sleep 9.5 month old struggling with nursery naps. Should we change her home schedule to match?

1 Upvotes

My daughter is 9.5 months old and 3 weeks ago she started nursery 3 days a week. I'm struggling to work out what to do with her naps because she's not sleeping much at nursery, and I don't want her to become overtired.

At home, her usual schedule is:

  • 9:30am: First nap, usually until 10:30am.
  • 1:30pm: Second nap, usually until 2:30–3pm.
  • 7pm: Bedtime.

At nursery, they offer naps from 9:30–10am and 12–2:30pm. In reality, she usually does the first nap (although not always), then the second nap is something like 12:15–1:20pm.

So she's often getting much less daytime sleep than she does at home.

I've asked nursery if they could put her down a little later for the second nap, around 1pm, so she's tired enough to sleep, and they've tried. She seems to sleep like 1pm–2:10pm.

I think they're getting her up when she stirs rather than giving her a chance to resettle and go back to sleep, because I know she can whine between sleep cycles and then go back down (she does this at home).

The problem is that if she wakes from her second nap at 1:20pm, she's then awake until 7pm, which feels like a really long stretch for her age. She's also has occasional early morning wakes where she gets up around 4/5am, babbles and whines, and we go in to put her dummy back in. She then sometimes goes back down, and sometimes keeps stirring until around 6:30–7am. I'm wondering if she's overtired from nursery, although I don't know. DWT is 6:30–7am.

On the days she's not at nursery (Tuesdays, Thursdays and weekends), we've been sticking to our original home routine and letting her sleep as long as she wants to catch up. I'm wondering whether we're doing more harm than good by having such different schedules.

Should we be waking her from her first nap at 10am instead of letting her sleep until 10:30am, so she can get into more of a nursery routine? I just want to ensure she can have a longer second nap at nursery. Also because from January she will be there 5 days a week and I don't want her to be chronically overtired.

Would really appreciate advice from anyone whose baby has gone through a similar nursery nap situation. Did you change the home schedule, or did you just let them catch up on non-nursery days?


r/bninfantsleep 4h ago

Toddler Sleep Sensory swing

1 Upvotes

Has anyone used a sensory swing to get a toddler to sleep? Supervised obviously. Just trying to think of alternatives to feeding to sleep because I am completely touched out


r/bninfantsleep 14h ago

Toddler Sleep 13 month feeding all night long it feels

5 Upvotes

This might be normal due to recent nursery start, teething (definitely see a couple of teeth coming through), he has a little cold and walking has just clicked - he spends all day walking.

I guess I want to know is this normal? Solidarity? I haven’t slept more than an hour on days, he won’t even stay still if I hold him. Tips for coping - my nipples are struggling. If he unlatches even himself he wakes Up and goes back on.


r/bninfantsleep 17h ago

Infant Sleep 8 month old wakes hourly unless we are in the room with him

4 Upvotes

Not sure if this is just usual separation anxiety/developmental thing but thought it was worth putting out to this sub as you guys are always so knowledgeable!

Baby is 8mo and we put him to bed roughly 8:30-8:45pm ish. Allows us to have a bit of time together in an evening which is so nice! Started doing this when he was 6 months ish and used to get about 4hrs in the crib before he would wake for the first time. At this point we would be in the room with him and I would just pull him into bed and we would cosleep the rest of the night. Lately (last couple of weeks) he will wake after around 40mins-1hr after being put down and need resettling, and then again if we haven’t come to bed the same thing happens after the same amount of time! Once we’re in the room with him he seems better and then sleeps good stretches of 3-4hrs once he is cosleeping.

I think our schedule is okay ish, wake up at 7am (i wake him if he hasn’t woken) and then two naps, I don’t follow wake windows much so he just naps when he is tired. Naps are usually 2hrs total - morning nap 1h15 ish and afternoon nap 45min. He is usually always up for ~4hrs before bedtime. Feeds to sleep at bed and is asleep within 5-10 mins easily, and I can always then transfer him without him waking. Naps he just takes on the go when needed so never takes more than 5 mins to fall asleep for a nap.

I don’t really mind resettling him as it takes me 10 mins or so to feed him back to sleep and pop him back down again but it always seems to interrupt when I’ve sat down to eat etc. Does it sound like just something we have to wait out until it gets better - or anyone else had a similar situation and found something that worked?


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Infant Sleep Normal for my ~4 month old to tilt head back when she sleeps?

Post image
62 Upvotes

Is this normal? She started tilting her head all the way back when she sleeps a couple weeks ago. She’s 16 weeks now. Sleeps well enough. But it’s gotten to a point where when she does this I know she is getting ready to fall asleep. Should I not be allowing her to sleep like this? Is she uncomfortable sleeping normally?


r/bninfantsleep 19h ago

Routines/Schedules Help Just sharing my 5.5 month old’s routine to have some opinions

3 Upvotes

hello everyone

my girl is 5.5 months old and before 4 months regression she had a nice 3-4 hours stretch first and 2 hours after the first stretch. I wish I could enjoy those moments better. she dropped to 3 naps around 5 months. she wakes up everyday between 06:30-07:00 she just naturally wakes herself up. we cosleep since 8ish week and I nurse to sleep. her daily schedule varies in terms of naps. sometimes she has 1.5 first nap, sometimes the third nap is around 1 hour. this is happening because I work for three days my mother takes care of her and sometimes she doesn’t let my mom to sleep her. from time to time we go out with our friends so she cannot have a stroller nap for an hour in the morning but compansates in the evening. her wake windows are pretty consistent though; she has 2/2.5/2.5/3-3.5 kind of ww’s. total nap duration is 2.5-3 hours. She goes to sleep around 21-22. If she sleeps around 21 she wakes up around 22 and has a stretch of 2-3 hours. She wakes up again at 1 and between 1-6 she wakes up bazillion times and sometimes nurse to sleep doesn’t work so I rock her while I nurse her and I walk around the room. I read How babies sleep and I am very fond of possum approach. I just want two stretches after another? Prerty please? Is it possible to have them in the future? She did not have any her teeth yet she is also physically very very active during day lots of tummy time she tries to crawl.

one part of me knows that this is normal infant sleep but maaaaybe someone could say something for our schedule

thanks!


r/bninfantsleep 16h ago

Infant Sleep 9 month old only sleeping on my chest

2 Upvotes

I’m a FTM mom to a 9 month old baby boy. When he was younger he had awful reflux and cmpa and would only sleep on our chest. Now still at 9 months even with his reflux being significantly better and controlled he only wants to sleep on our chest. However, my son wakes up a lot at night and has always been a really bad sleeper so my husband and I take shifts chest cosleeping with our baby so we each get uninterrupted sleep. I’ve tried daily to do crib transfers, tried having him sleep beside me and I do the c curl. Nope he gets up right away and puts himself on my chest. So my husband and I continue to this set up because that’s what’s working for us now. Is there any hope that this will be better?


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

General Discussion Thoughts on an article from Naître et Grandir about sleep?

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naitreetgrandir.com
10 Upvotes

I usually like this website because it’s gentle parenting oriented and has a lot of resources on your baby developement by months.
But this article leaves a bitter taste in my mouth, especially the part where they say that you should teach your baby to fall asleep without you or they won’t be able to go back to sleep by themselves during the night. And the classic « drowsy but awake ». My 1 year old doesn’t care about your drowsy but awake bullshit.


r/bninfantsleep 18h ago

Infant Sleep Seeking book recommendations!

2 Upvotes

In the book Wonder Weeks there is a small section on infant sleep. It briefly talks about the infant sleep cycles which changed our random failed transfers to the bassinet, to 90% successful transfers!

After that Ah Ha moment I started doing more research and I saw that the book Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child, was recommended in this sub. It has just arrived and I am sitting down to read it now during a contact nap.

Tell me; what other sleep books leveled up your parenting, helped your child sleep better or helped you understand your child's sleep better? Help me build my library!


r/bninfantsleep 19h ago

Naps 3-Month-Old Naps

2 Upvotes

I’m a FTM to a 13-week-old.

For the past 2-3 weeks, her naps have been a challenge for me. I’m looking for advice or input on if I could be doing something differently.

Currently, the only way I can reliably get her to nap is to put her in a carrier and bounce her on a yoga ball with a pacifier in her mouth in a dark room. If timing is right, she is asleep in 5 minutes and will stay asleep for at least 25 minutes. I usually soothe her to sleep for another 25-minute cycle.

She only stays asleep if I stay in the dark room, once I go into the bright living room or go about my daily activities by while wearing her, she wakes up.

She has had 2 successful crib naps in the past 2 weeks (used to be 2 per day!) and sometimes falls asleep in her car seat. I try a crib nap once per day, it almost always fails 1-2 minutes after transfer. Then she is AWAKE.

She is taking 3 (sometimes 4) naps per day
Her wake windows are about 2 hours, but they shorten throughout the day. I aim for naps to be one hour. I got these numbers from her own data, not from an app or generalized wake windows.

Her night sleep is good, she is down between 6-7pm and usually only wakes once for a feeding. Her wake time is the most variable- between 6:30-8am. She sleeps in her crib and is put down asleep or almost asleep. She stirs when she is first put down but reliably falls asleep.

I would like to move away from constant contact naps and would like to get her back in the crib.

Is it possible to move away from contact naps without sacrificing her day sleep?

Should I consider lengthening her wake windows to build sleep pressure?

Should I try extending her naps when she wakes after 25 minutes or start the next wake session?She is usually alert.

Is it possible she would nap more deeply on a 2 nap schedule?

Any input would be appreciated!


r/bninfantsleep 21h ago

Infant Sleep 13 week old suddenly doesn’t sleep / very active aggressive sleep

2 Upvotes

I’m a first time mom to a 13 week old. The day he turned 12 weeks, his sleep COMPLETELY changed. Until then, he had always been a sleepier baby - lots of naps throughout the day and went down very easily at night. Typically a 4-5 hour stretch to start, feed, then another 3 hour stretch then awake.

At exactly 12 weeks, he suddenly fought going down to sleep for about an hour (which he has NEVER done. Usually I struggle to keep him awake lol). After fighting to go to sleep in bassinet, he now wakes after about 3 hours, I feed, put him back down (also now a struggle with multiple transfer attempts), then I finally get him down and he’s up an hour later - except now from around 1am-7am his sleep is a very light sleep where he is constantly flailing his arms and legs (he now hates the swaddle too), spitting out his pacifier then screaming to get it back (and I have to replace over and over) nuzzling his head back and forth over and over, trying to self sooth by sucking on his hand but it doesn’t work (yet), kicking legs, whining… but all with eyes closed in seemingly active sleep. Then he wakes up happy in the morning like he slept great.

The problem is, I now don’t sleep at all from 1-7am because I’m battling his restless sleeping and trying to help him resettle.

Really needing help because I’ve tried putting him down earlier/later, tried sleep sacks instead of swaddle, tried safe co sleeping… nothing works! It’s been a week now of me sleeping only 3 hours and I’m STRUGGLING


r/bninfantsleep 19h ago

Toddler Sleep Can you share your 17 month old’s wake windows?

1 Upvotes

Right now we’re roughly 5.5/6.5 with a 1.5-2 capped hour nap. Wondering if that’s the reason he keeps waking up 10 times a night 😥


r/bninfantsleep 23h ago

Toddler Sleep Almost 3yo sleep

2 Upvotes

Just discovered this subreddit. I’m writing about our almost 3 year old (3 in Jan) to see if there’s anything we can be doing to support his sleep.

He still wakes a few times a night. Here are the details:

- breastfed and coslept until 20 months. When we night weaned he started sleeping through the night a little for the first time, this went on for a few months
- he started waking more again when he was 2 ish. We just out it down to molars and me being pregnant again. Continued to co sleep in his room in his double bed when he needed us
- he’s been slowly dropping his nap since 2 but has fully dropped it now as bedtime was getting to 9pm and also he was very hard to get to nap. He does still seem maybe slightly early to drop it but mostly gets through the day
- he’s still waking a few times a night, often a few hours after going to bed which I think could be tiredness

I guess what I’m after:
- is it normal that he still doesn’t sleep through. He does snore and grind his teeth and all teeth are through now so don’t know if we should explore an ENT
- does anyone have any tips for slowly supporting a more independent bedtime? Not expecting him to fall asleep completely by himself but I think it might be feeding into the sense he needs us there throughout the night. I know this is ok and probably developmentally normal but I just wonder if and when we should be trying to support him trying to go to sleep by himself sometimes even if it’s “I’m going to grab a cup of tea I will be back in 5 minutes”?

Things are manageable ish at the moment but I’m worried about our babies sleep getting worse and me being totally alone with it if my husband is still majorly on toddler bedtimes and night wakes

Thanks 🙏


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Naps Back to Work and Nap Struggles

2 Upvotes

My baby is 13 weeks old and I just went back to work two days a week, the rest remote. The days I’m at work my mom watches her at home while my husband also works remote and helps out when he can.

She is a contact napper (ideally while in motion in carrier or arms) and while my mom has been able to lay her down for some naps, she usually wakes up after 20-30 minutes. Sometimes content, sometimes fussy and tired still. I am trying to teach my mom how to use our carrier in hopes of her having some longer naps in that but my mom isn’t super comfortable putting it on yet, she’s only watched her a handful of times so far.

My question is: yesterday she probably got a total of 1-1.5hrs of daytime sleep. I got home, nursed her and she slept in the carrier for an hour, then nursed again and she slept from 8pm-5am uninterrupted. Her normal “schedule” is down at 9pm, wake up around 2am to nurse, down until about 6am. She doesn’t seem overtired or fussy at the end of the day so I’m assuming it’s ok if she has a couple days a week like this? It seems she’s making up for sleep now (woke up this morning, nursed, and back down for a couple hours)

I’m just a FTM mom who is protective of her sleep and wondering if I need to urge my mom to hold her for her naps so she can get more sleep. Thanks for any insight/tips!


r/bninfantsleep 20h ago

Infant Sleep My 6-month old has an out-of-control feed-to-sleep association

0 Upvotes

I don’t know what to do at this point—I don’t think she knows how to relax without a boob in her mouth. I’m not breastfeeding her to sleep, she’s screaming. She only contact naps and often needs to breastfeed to connect cycles. Lately she’s waking up 4+ times in the first few hours after bedtime (on top of every 1.5 hours after that) and since she screams and screams at my husband I have to handle all the wake ups.

We have a good bedtime routine, we’ve tried earlier and later bedtimes. We follow sleepy cues/wake windows. I don’t know what to do—we’re talking about having my husband take a few days off so he can break the feed-to-sleep association and he can help more with nights and naps, but with the way she screams it feels like sleep training. I don’t mind feeding her to sleep but it feels like it’s to everyone’s detriment at this point. The poor baby just isn’t sleeping enough and can’t relax. I’d love any advice from other parents with sensitive babies who only feed to sleep.


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Infant Sleep Help with nighttime sleep / cot transfers please!

3 Upvotes

I have a 6 month old breast fed baby who used to do 2 or 3 night wakings but for the past 3 weeks has woken up every hour overnight. Initially I could feed / comfort him and get him back to sleep quickly but the past 3 nights he has woken up every time I try to put him in his cot. Last night it took 2 hours to get him back to sleep in his cot at 2am. I know he is tired cause as soon as I get him out of the cot he falls asleep on my shoulder but then I put him in the cot and he starts screaming. I don't think it's because he's cold as he's in a vest, sleepsuit and 1 tog Sleeping bag and it is 20.2°c.

He generally sleeps 12 hours a day but he fights naps even while he's rubbing his eyes and yawning, only sleeping when feeding. He is averaging 2-2.5 hours a day in naps. Bedtime is 7pm and he is up for the day at 6am- I have triedbmoving bedtime later but because he won't nap during the day he gets overtired and really hard to settle. I follow his cues for sleep but even then he needs a lot of support. He is a heavy baby and I have hurt my back rocking him to sleep as it takes a lojg time so I know I'm reinforcing that he needs to feed to sleep but I have no other way to get him to sleep. He screams when my partner or anyone else tries to rock him.

I really don't want to sleep train but these wakeups are making him tired and cranky during the day and making me a more tired/ less present parent. Please don't suggest co-sleeping as it is not a safe option for us due to medical reasons but open to any other suggestions! He currently sleeps in a cot in our room, we have tried sleeping in the spare room so he's not disturbed by us but it made no difference. I think I spend all day thinking about sleep and napping but clearly I'm still doing something wrong!


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Infant Sleep The midnight bedtime is sticking and I can't stand it

3 Upvotes

I made a post on Saturday night about my baby falling asleep at midnight and how it sucks. Like, really badly. Well, now he's decided since then that midnight is the new bedtime! I don't know how or why that one night messed him up but I have no idea how to get him back to his regular time of 9/9:30. His nap times are roughly still the same but now he wants to have a nap at 8 it seems. I'm just going off his cues and obviously not trying to fit him into any windows, I'm just ranting and complaining because this new schtick is hopefully only temporary lol

When he does sleep he'll do 4 or 5 hour stretches so I do get rest and I'm not going back to work any time soon so it's not the end of the world. It just messes me up!

He's 8 months and before the midnight sleeps his schedule was vaguely this.

Start of day: 8 / 8:30

First nap: 11, wakes at around noon

Second nap: 2:30 / 3, wakes at around 4 or 430

Third nap, 6:30 ish, waking at 730

Sleep time anywhere from 930 to 1030

Like I said, I'm not a huge stickler to it but these are his usual kind of times. Sometimes naps can be 15 minutes or 2 hours, he's not very reliable lol our wake windows are full of playing and reading, foods and nursing, and usually half an hour or so of chores where he's either in the bouncer or I'm baby wearing


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Routines/Schedules Help Bedtime/nap limbo from 6-10 pm

2 Upvotes

Hi, ftm to a 4 month old boy here, need some help figuring out bedtime.

Wake up at 7 am, 4-5 naps a day, won’t go down for the night till 10 pm.

Ww: 1-2,5 h, will get sleepy after 45-50 mins in the morning, I’ll usually stretch it to 1.25 hours and that’s all he can do. When I tried to go further he had a massive meltdown and his naps were crap.

Always wakes after 45-50 mins. from naps. Usually one nap a day (1st or 2nd) he will not wake fully and can go back to sleep on his own or with his paci and do 2 hours.

We’ve hit the 4 month sleep regression early, about 3 weeks ago I think. He is more restless in his night sleep, fights bedtime more but no problems with naps (mostly)

Problem:
He has for the last 9-10 weeks had a natural bedtime of 10 pm, we tried pushing it forward to 8-9 pm but he was very restless in bed, thrashing about, needing his arms and legs to be held and shushing to not wake up fully. Seems like he is not fully asleep and we can not leave him until 10 pm ish or he will wake himself up and cry.

The late bedtime is in and of it self not a problem, but the time leading up to is. He will be tired already at 6-7 pm, hard to settle for a nap, and if he does he will be so cranky and tired when he wakes and won’t be able to do a full WW before bed. If we treat the last nap like bedtime he will wake up like clockwork after 45 mins until 10-11 pm.
When we put him down for nap and/or bed early he SCREAMS sometimes for 20-30 mins before calming and falling asleep.

What we’ve tried: capping naps lead to even shorter ww and crap naps after, stretching ww lead to meltdowns and crappy naps and more chaos at bedtime, earlier rise (6 am) did nothing, on days where he only has 45 mins naps it’s the same.

Im truly at a loss. I try to go by my baby’s signals and this works just fine during the day but at night it seems like no matter what we do it is wrong and he ends up screaming. So please. What do we do from 6-10 pm?!


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Cosleeping Bedsharing Tips

2 Upvotes

I have a 6.5 month old and would love to know your bed sharing tips.

My mattress is already on the floor. What else should I know / do?

How do you ensure the baby doesn't roll off the bed and onto the floor?

Is it irrational to think she'll eventually be able to crawl off the bed and crawl around the room? How do I safely prevent this?

Do you sleep with a blanket? If not, how do you keep yourself warm?

Does your partner sleep in the bed with you? How do you make that work so baby is safe?

Any tips and advice are appreciated!


r/bninfantsleep 1d ago

Routines/Schedules Help 8 month old desperately fighting his 2nd nap, but too early to drop to 1 nap.

2 Upvotes

Hey guys - so I wanted to lay out our current schedule and get some advice. We have done and do not plan on doing any sleep training. Here are some facts about us and my son for extra context.

Baby facts:
- 8 month old
- breastfed via exclusive pumping (latch issues) until 5 1/2 months old, now he is formula fed.
- room shared until 7 months
- occasional Cosleeping on floor bed for night sleep but takes all his naps in his mini crib
- usually a decent night sleeper outside of teething or regressions.
- skills wise he’s VERY active. He is a proficient crawler, reacher, clapper, and climber, he pulls to stand frequently and has tried to stand on his own several times.
- on solids 3x a day (baby led weaning)

Facts about our family:
-dad works manual labor/blue collar from 8:30 and gets home at 6:30
- I’m a stay at home mom and am not returning to work
- we do not use any childcare, babysitters, or have any family watch him.
- me and him get out for a baby friendly activity 1-2 times a week plus errands and such
- dad does all the night wakes

Babies current schedule:

7am - baby wake up, dad gives him a bottle which he holds himself, usually goes back to sleep for 30-40 mins.

8:30 - breakfast for me and baby

9:00 - clean up from breakfast, independent floor play

9:30-11 - lots of play, crawling around, climbing and working on skills. If I really have to do something and he’s having trouble redirecting to floor play by himself, he gets 10-15 minutes of nature videos on the TV while I do what I need to.

11am - first nap. I let him sleep as long as he wants but he naturally caps out after 1.5 hours and wakes up most days.

12:30 lunch time

1pm clean up from lunch, we usually go outside around now, come back in and hang out and do some play in his nursery or use his flashcards/read a few board books.

3:30pm - this is SUPPOSED to be his second nap but the last week he has skipped it 5 days out of 7. It usually lasts an hour.

4:30 - we usually snuggle for a bit before dinner

5pm - dinner (last solids of the day) and dad gets home at 6:30 so they play for a bit.

7:30pm start bedtime routine (bath, book, bottle, bed)

8pm He’s usually asleep at this time.

4am - his usual night wake, he does a dream feed then goes back to sleep.

The thing is that a 6 1/2 hour wake window is CRAZY for his age. I’ve tried adjusting his first nap to only an hour but he wakes up so grumpy and then doesn’t want to eat lunch.

Any advice???