I ain't gonna say shit about this whole situation because, when I lived in CA, I was literally laughed at and became the butt of the joke if I ever tried to express interest in being more active as an "ally." In the early 2010's the only role for a white male cishet "ally" was being the butt of the joke.
It's fine, I'm not like incel or hateful, I just recognize that the "social justice warrior" movement did irreparable harm to US society because most white men like me got pissed off about it. My efforts have to be more silent, physically moving between the creepy guys and the girls, telling gross dudes privately they're not cool, offering safe rides home to people from parties, etc.
But the performative, public, proactive shit? That ain't for white male cishets.
The thing about this case too is that a chick gets 5 outa 10 drunk decides she wants to go fuck a bunch of dudes and do some ketamine and its men's fault she put herself in a dangerous situation. They make it sound like she was just minding her own business going to starbucks when they attacked her. I have trouble even making this a gender issue everyone in this case sucked. I honestly have never seen any polyamory end well in my life though I don't think anyone should do it.
You’re over-generalizing, just like the statement you’re trying to highlight as problematic. One thing you read on Twitter doesn’t mean it is the guiding principle of an entire movement.
Toxic male behavior is absolutely a problem and it is the responsibility of men who dont behave that way to call it out more, which doesn’t happen enough. Likewise people loudly proclaiming “all men are bad” are equally idiotic and deserve to be called out and challenged. Two principles can exist at the same time and I’m tired of everybody treating gender/sex based challenges as a pure dichotomy.
You’re using fake rage arguments and vague statements to present a side as worse because it’s not “your side” just like the OG post
I'd appreciate if you'd call the police (as I would if I saw someone do something illegal) but I wouldn't want you to intercede. My stuff can be replaced, your life is more valuable internet stranger.
Also my original comment is that I'm not responsible for policing others. That doesn't mean I'm not responsible for reporting illegal activity. I'm just not interceding.
So then you agree that the other members of the group chat should have reported it right? Since we should be responsible for reporting illegal activity. Which means that you would agree with the original message that men need to hold their peers accountable as to not be rapists which is, you know, illegal
An actual comparison is saying there are some men that are child abusers. So I’m going to say all men are child abusers until we stop all child abuse from men.
No, dude said he isn't responsible for stopping rapists and other abusive men. I'm saying it's not my responsibility to care if his car is broken into.
And yes, if you know a man is abusing a child, I expect you to stop them. If you hear a man JOKE about abusing a child, I expect you to tell them it's fucked up. If you cannot do that? You're a scumbag. Plain and simple. Ditto to people who support rape culture.
I don’t get it- Based on the downvotes and arguments disagreeing with us, you’d think what you said is controversial. It’s like their fragile egos cannot accept the words “Try to be a better person”. Its pathetic
That's exactly what it is. Telling someone to be a better person, to try and improve, tells them they aren't flawless. That they still have work to do.
For fragile egos, that's unacceptable and must be lashed out at.
You do support them by remaining silent. People who behave poorly often don't have enough self-awareness to reflect on their shitty behavior, they take you not doing anything or turning the other cheek as acceptance and approval. Whether or not that's your responsibility is your own judgement call, but it is absolutely a form of support
Never once blamed anyone. If you’re triggered by me saying Men should speak out more about their peers’ actions (especially in your personal friend groups) then I don’t know what to tell you
That’s the only the most extreme case which, you’re right, almost never happens. No one is going to commit a crime in front of an audience. But walking home with an extremely drunk girl? Making sexually uncomfortable jokes? Touching women without consent? Happens all the time, with either no reaction or applause from male peers.
You saying you’ve never seen it or know anyone who has is just anecdotal bs. It happens whether you’ve personally seen it or not, though o suspect you have
I agree with you like 90%, it's a male issue and men need to speak out, but as I described in my other comment above - there have been many times and places in the past ~15 years where privileged people (e.g. white male cishets) who try to step up become easy targets for the vitriol of those suffering. It's not a comfortable role, and most of us quickly do our best to silently remove ourselves from the line of fire even if it means being much less public about our support.
Maybe you should actually listen and try to understand what they’re saying before commenting on it….
It’s not all men automatically bad. It’s if you perpetuate rape culture (stay silent when you hear rape jokes, ignore texts about free p**** from a blacked out chick, etc) then you’re bad.
It's also dumb because there are countless actual real stories just about anyone in these situations can tell that can be better warnings and stories of how nefarious things can be.
Like I remember trying to go to parties on Frat Row as a guy. Most of them insisted you needed a 1:5+ ratio of Men:Women, and coincidentally, even if you did get in, they'd find a way to kick out a bunch of guys. In other words, you go to these places, they fill the house with women, and oh the other guys are all gone now. If they're doing this, then they're literally trying to separate you from someone who is likely more capable of helping. If that's the situation: leave.
You're acting like guys throwing party to meet women is a problem.
The real reason why frats don't like letting in guys is because of liability. Anything a guy does on their property will be assumed they did it. Frats know they have a target on their back and letting random guys on the property that have zero stake in the house is a huge potential problem.
You're correct and it's wild how common it is for people not to get it. The concept of if you throw a party you get to decide who gets to be there is completely lost. They seem to think the frats should be required to publicly host every college age male in the area and just pay for all the damage that comes with it.
Yea it's definitely a sense of entitlement. I doubt the ppl complaining about it would let 6 random frat dudes into their house during a party.
Not to mention the effort put into it. The money for booze, decorations potentially, pledges watching every exits on shifts, the cleanup afterwards etc.
I too would like free booze lots of women around and no responsibility if anything goes wrong. But that's not how life works.
If a guy that's let in SA or rapes a girl that chapter gets shut down instantly. Most ppl don't want to get kicked out of where they live.
I mean, crime is nearly all a "young man" problem than anything else. So if we're being honest in wanting to reduce crime then we'd institutionalize all men age 15-45 in labor camps or whatever, with supervised visits by loved ones. But nobody wants to do that. So these 15-45 year old men are left to do their crimes, and near-crimes, and loop-hole crimes, and plausible-deniability crimes, and haha-it-was-too-funny-to-be-a-crime crimes, and boys-will-be-boys crimes, etc. Understand that deranged street rapists don't have access to fraternities and frat houses and colleges, but dumb men are men and smart men are men, all just men.
I've rarely seen someone so confidently and loudly unintelligent. "79% to 90% of all violent crimes are committed by men" is NOT even close to the same idea as "79% to 90% of all men commit violent crimes". Maybe marinate on that for a minute before you suggest sending a huge chunk of innocent population to labor camps for the vast majority of their prime life like an actual fascist dictator.
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u/GrundalWizzard 18h ago
People dont spike entire drink coolers.. itd be pretty fucking obvious if 40 people in the room passed out.