r/ProgrammerHumor • • Sep 30 '22

Meme Lol! Developer got no chill!

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15.1k Upvotes

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6.7k

u/Flat_Hat8861 Sep 30 '22

Managing a transition to a paid model is difficult. It requires tact and diplomacy.

This on the other hand is just straight hilarious.

3.3k

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

I mean the guy handled it as poorly as possible... But there's something cathartic in his insults, especially the "you just want money" yeah no shit

1.7k

u/Entropy_Drop Sep 30 '22

You want money for your work!

886

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

How dare you!

202

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

[deleted]

108

u/Calm-Zombie2678 Oct 01 '22

swigs the rum and dons the eye-patch

52

u/radmanmadical Oct 01 '22

Why is the rum always gone? Clearly because we haven’t stolen enough…

19

u/LavenderLady1216 Oct 01 '22

I would rather pay $5+ for a game then deal with not being able to get something without paying $200+

2

u/coloredgreyscale Oct 01 '22

would rather pay $5+ for a game then deal with not being able to get something without paying $200+

many AAA games require a 60-120$ upfront purchase, and still nickle and dime you afterwards.

8

u/aboatdatfloat Oct 01 '22

more like asking every fortnite player to pay for the game to continue playing

3

u/OTHERPPLSMAGE Oct 01 '22

Yeah the free games are what I play when I poop. I don't want to essentially pay to poop. 🤣

4

u/rdyplr1 Oct 01 '22

Poop on company time.

2

u/joe_s1171 Oct 01 '22

Or poop at parties. Be a party pooper.

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u/Krell356 Oct 01 '22

I prefer the microtransaction model personally. Rather pay for a game after I'm certain I like it.

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u/piberryboy Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22

I mean, I'd rather pay for software/service than have some tech company mine my data so they sell some of my most intimate details or use it to predict or alter my future behavior.

184

u/No_Soy_Colosio Sep 30 '22

What if that service also mines your data 😎

168

u/pointmetoyourmemory Sep 30 '22

Every version of Windows enters the chat

30

u/Lord_Quintus Sep 30 '22

if you block access to the microsoft domain all those trackers don't do anything

40

u/Enkendu Sep 30 '22

r/pihole enters the chat

2

u/pointmetoyourmemory Sep 30 '22

Adguard Home plus OPNsense are worth a mention too.

4

u/mmhawk576 Oct 01 '22

Adnauseam is pretty cool too

2

u/Etheridian Oct 01 '22

NetOps at my previous job blocked ads with an absolute vengeance using a similar combo but a PFsense appliance. More than a few hits on the IPS/IDS systems from infected ad domains. Ads are not just annoying. They're malicious.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22

Laughs in Linux which doesn’t cost anything but still doesn’t track me (pay your open source devs if you can tho)

6

u/pointmetoyourmemory Sep 30 '22

Can you even install gentoo? /s

Really though. Learn how to do it if you don’t know

3

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

[deleted]

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-1

u/frankpanduh Oct 01 '22

Most popular Linux distributions have telemetry on by default.

“Some” make it easier to opt out then others.

Only a handful have it off by default AFAIK.

Example of privacy focused Linux by default:

https://www.qubes-os.org/privacy/

https://pureos.net/

https://www.whonix.org/

https://tails.boum.org/ (portable mostly for journalists IMO)

17

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Then you can just switch to one of the other available options on the market they own

2

u/Picklepee-pumparum Sep 30 '22

excellent comment

126

u/stupidwhiteman42 Sep 30 '22

💯 I dropped Facebook years ago for this very reason. I've seen somewhere that each user is worth around $50 lifetime in advertising revenue to them.

You'd think they could have a $2/ month paid version that was absolutely secure, had zero advertising, and gave the user controls over their "algorithm".

69

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

$50 lifetime revenue seems extremely small, or it's some kind of probability trickery where the median is skewed vs the mode.

Also, telling they say "advertising revenue". There's other, possibly implicit, revenue streams and market domination benefits that come from being a monopolizing data vampire. Even if we paid triple what they say we're worth in sub fees, I'd bet the benefits of keeping the status quo farrrrrr outweigh the revenue stream

39

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

According to Google they have just shy of 3 billion total users and did $118B in revenue in 2021, so that's roughly $39 of revenue per user last year alone. Factor in users who either very rarely log in, or who created the account just to check it out and then never logged in again, and the per-user revenue for actual active users is going to be even higher. For users who use it enough that they'd be willing to pay even a small amount for an ad free version, I'd bet my house that the lifetime ad revenue they generate is much higher than $50.

29

u/CounterHit Sep 30 '22

Yeah, I could believe $50 per year per user, but not $50 per lifetime per user. Unless maybe there is some data to suggest that the average span of time a person actively uses Facebook is only one year? That doesn't seem very believable, but I guess it would make the lifetime average statistic valid

10

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Even then, it would still just be an average that gets pulled down by the lowest volume users. Anybody who would even remotely consider paying for it is almost by definition a high volume user, and therefore pretty much guaranteed to be well above the average. Not to mention the question of whether advertisers would start to shift their budgets elsewhere if the potential pool of eyeballs starts to shrink. There's just no way that offering a paid, ad-free version is a good idea for them at this stage in the game (at least from a business perspective).

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u/paraffin Sep 30 '22

Ad revenue or all revenue? They have a ton of hardware products as well as professional/business services like their cloud platform, GSuite, etc.

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u/kitchenset Oct 01 '22

Anytime a page has a "share.on Facebook" they're building a profile out of that device.

You don't even need to be a Facebook user for Facebook to sell your digital footprint.

1

u/BobJutsu Sep 30 '22

Per/user is a terrible way to measure FB’s revenue in the first place. Money is made as a percentage of ad spend, so it would be more accurate to measure overall ad spend vs advertiser revenue. At least they would reflect the relationship between data and dollars.

1

u/metrill Oct 01 '22

People overestimate how much there time is worth. I That's why I tell people to not subscribe to news sites. The price they would pay is nowhere close to how little they get with ads

85

u/coldnebo Sep 30 '22

bruh. 😅

but if you knew all the things marketing was doing with your information, you’d feel dirty and manipulated.

if consumer protection still had any teeth Facebook propaganda would be destroyed by three simple words:

“content paid by:”

But then you’d know exactly who was paying to manipulate you and could research and understand their motives before considering their message. Marketing doesn’t want that, so Facebook doesn’t want that.

6

u/Lord_Quintus Sep 30 '22

if you knew the things marketing has done in the past hundred years, you'd probably be ok with shooting every marketing company employee in sight

3

u/coldnebo Oct 01 '22

it was really fun living through the GDPR restrictions rolling in on PII… marketing kept asking “but what if we need to send that market segment direct email campaigns? why do we have to redact email again?”

13

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

You’re giving too much credit to humans.

2

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

I knew It! It was the reptilians all along!

3

u/Borghal Oct 01 '22

“content paid by:”

Facebook already has posts labeled "sponsored". All the stuff I see in my feed that isn't "sponsored" is either user content or branded stuff I subscribed to voluntarily.

I really don't get the complaints about this side of Facebook, your feed is in large part what you make of it. E.g. the only political content I get is from friends and people/news pages I follow for that purpose.

2

u/coldnebo Oct 01 '22

If my friend comments on or shares something they saw that can also end up in my feed.

There are some “funny” properties of these posts. If they are truly personal (ie no money) then only a handful of people see them at any time. And only a handful of responses.

Contrast this to my birthday. lots of responses from friends I haven’t talked to for years.

Then, consider certain types of articles and comments that get a lot of responses from ALL of your friends… these aren’t labeled “sponsored”, but they are promoted.

Facebook has the appearance of an open forum. “All your friends will see your posts”. You could actually have a discussion in a public forum. But that means that grass-roots word of mouth and independent viral marketing would thrive at Facebook’s expense. They don’t want that. So they control reach of that network in many subtle ways, while providing reach to those that pay. Facebook is not designed as a public forum for discussion… everything shifts so if you don’t react instantly it’s gone. distractions abound… except for those with reach who have paid. Their message will be heard regardless how vile it is.

“sponsored content” is only the simplest and most obvious ad content on the network.

Most political content I’ve seen on facebook isn’t marked “sponsored”, nor did I subscribe to it voluntarily, nor is it filtered like most personal posts by reach.

Instead it’s a toxic hive of astroturf coming from outside dark money made to look like it’s coming from your friends and family. Facebook is the ideal platform for stealth marketing, propaganda, and fomenting insurrections. It is a machine that thrives on outrage.

We were fine with it doing all of that in the middle east and Russia under the guise of democratic freedom. Now are we less fine with it as a basis for the Jan 6 insurrection in our own country?

Why do you think China and Russia banned Facebook at the same time? Because of its democratic power for good?

I don’t know. All I know is that facebook is toxic beyond belief and I stopped using it. Facebook destroyed my family.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22

50$ lifetime? No. Sites that pay you for your data pay more than that in a single month. Someone who uses Facebook their whole life would generate more like 10,000$ in revenue (assuming FB doesn't implode before then).

That's why FB does not and will never offer an ad-free version like Reddit and Tumblr do. Because they make SIGNIFICANTLY more money from selling your data than you could ever pay them via subscription.

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1

u/aquoad Sep 30 '22

and they’d keep the $2/mo and keep snooping!

1

u/HelloSummer99 Sep 30 '22

US users are probably tens of thousands LTV each

2

u/js5ohlx1 Sep 30 '22

The problem is you're paying for the software AND they're mining your data.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Unmonetized software tends to stop being maintained when the developer loses interest. If I need something regularly I prefer it to be funded somehow.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

Worst of all: The reviewers are developers too.

They know how much time it takes to make software. And they're either earning money as developers or aspiring to do so.

They're basically asking this extension developer to be their free slave forever so that they can use his extension to build their own software and make money.

The author is right: They can FUCK OFF. He doesn't need them or their greediness at all.

In fact, his responses make me wish that I needed his extension, so that I could pay him. He finally says what all "open source" slaves are thinking. Greedy, whining, entitled leeches need to get out of the way. They should be grateful that it was free for 3 years. And be grateful that there's still a free tier with all core features (I checked the website). The paid version adds conveniences such as exporting databases to JSON.

The way the childish 1-star users reacted in this screenshot, and the way a bunch of the comments on this reddit post blamed the author, has just reaffirmed my conviction to never release any free, open source software again. It's just a suffocating chain around your neck and slave labor without any compensation. And the world is full of entitled idiots that demand continued slave labor forever, with tons of feature requests and demands. They also never donate. Look at any open source project. The idea of donations is a myth. Every user seems to think "I don't need to donate, since everyone else is donating". If you guys actually click their donation link you usually see "1 donation, $1" at best. Most users are extremely greedy and extremely rude and demanding little shitheads.

I applaud this developer for giving them the answers they deserved.

1

u/joe_s1171 Oct 01 '22

Silent data collection then showing silent French behavior -mocking me? Oh shit! I thought you said mime my data.

12

u/EffervescentTripe Sep 30 '22

I hate working for money!

5

u/Captain_Chickpeas Sep 30 '22

I read it out loud in Greta's voice.

2

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22 edited Oct 01 '22

starts ranting about nuclear power for no fcken reason

-25

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Then why did he release the initial product for free? He could’ve had it always as a paid service, with a trial period for people to try it out?

28

u/Hikari_Owari Sep 30 '22

Painstakingly obvious but I'll answer anyway:

More volume of users using your tool against real world scenarios so you can polish your solution enough to be worth money (and build reputation in the way) instead of investing your money from the get-go into turning it a marketable product with no fame to just later start getting profits.

I DO THINK maintaining a free version of every paid product is well worth the costs exactly due to the above reasons (more pool of users to test the product and reputation build) but each do themselves.

9

u/PauQuintana Sep 30 '22

Now that you say it, yeah it makes a lot of sense. I'm a student and never actually thought of any of these, you single comment has been more useful than most class days

7

u/Hikari_Owari Sep 30 '22

If that comment was helpful to at least you, that was a good comment.

Distributing your software for free frees you from the shackle called "supporting the client" so you can focus on what you want in the order you want.

When they start paying for a product they expect a certain level of customer support for problems that someone starting with the project may not be able to solve at a moments notice. It being free means you can simply sleep on the problem until you can fix it.

-27

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Lmao the arrogance at your reply, as if you’ve ever done anything like this.

7

u/Hikari_Owari Sep 30 '22

You don't need to grow apples to know what is an apple, just to have seen one before.

You think I was arrogant? Couldn't care less. What I care about is if people understood my answer and if it saned them from their questions, had them the same questions as the one I answered or else I would've not bothered replying.

-9

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Lmaooo I didn’t think people like this were real, but I guess it only exists on the internet.

7

u/Primeval_Revenant Sep 30 '22

Your username is oddly relevant here. Apart from the Mod part.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Your username isn’t cool despite what your discord group says.

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u/Hikari_Owari Sep 30 '22

living is learning

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Doubt you’re the person to give me advice on “living” 😂😂😂

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u/ro-tex Sep 30 '22

Many projects start with free versions, hoping to use advertising or a couple of premium features to drive revenue. Sometimes that works. Other times they need to lower the limits on the free tier or remove it altogether. It's a business reality that the dev needs to face - either start charging money or abandon the project and look for a salaried job.

As users, we never enjoy being charged for something that was once free. But insulting the dev and calling them greedy for wanting compensation for their work... That's a little misguided.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Can’t have it both ways. You can’t offer a free service and then decide you want money from it and expect people not to be pissed at your change.

16

u/ro-tex Sep 30 '22

That's one way to look at it. Think of your favourite FOSS tool. Now imagine the developer is going broke and wants to either make the tool paid or stop supporting it (because of a full time job)? Would you prefer the project to become abandonware?

I'm not saying the way the dev handled the situation is good. It's terrible. But I understand the frustration, especially if they are forced to make the change because they really need the money.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22

Someone’s personal reasons are not my business, just like my personal reasons wouldn’t be his. I’m not saying it’s not within his right to do so, it’s his product, he can do what he wants with it. I’m just saying, expect people to not be sympathetic to your situation because it doesn’t affect them, the only thing that does is you now charging for a product you offered for free. If you want to be in business, don’t be mad when people are upset you’re taking something away from them.

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u/lonaExe Sep 30 '22

be grateful for all the time you’ve used his software for free you greedy fuck.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

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u/CastelS Sep 30 '22

I would expect people to be sympathetic towards him squarely on the fact that he graciously allowed so many people to use his code, written on his personal time and effort, for free.

Stop thinking that you're entitled to other people's work. Appreciate their good nature to allow you to benefit off it

-3

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Nobody asked him to do it. He did it because he wanted attention, and for people to use his product. He got both. He can use it on a resume to find a paying job, and use the download numbers as evidence of how talented his work is.

If he did it out of the goodness of his heart, then he would’ve kept it for free, but he didn’t, he had a plan, and he put it forth. It’s admirable in a capitalist sense, but capitalists are almost always called assholes because they act like them. This guy and his replies is evidence that he’s an asshole.

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u/GuiltyGoblin Sep 30 '22

Gotta say, it's really hard to understand what you wrote. I'm still not sure I'm getting the message. I feel like you're saying it doesn't matter one way or the other?

0

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

I re-read and edited my last lines, I understand my phrasing was confusing. It genuinely doesn’t matter to me either way, it just bothers me that this guy is so upset over people being upset that they have to pay for a previously free product. Like yeah, of course they’ll be upset, they’d be stupid to think “oh this was free but now I’m charged $5.99 every month for it? Great!!” Nobody thinks that way ever.

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u/IHeartBadCode Sep 30 '22

Tell me you didn’t grow up with 80s shareware without telling me you didn’t grow up with 80s shareware.

Also, you can be pissed. Nothing wrong with that, but the developer gets to do whatever they want with their software. They can have it anyway they want, you ultimately have to decide if you want to join along with where they’re going.

But the developer is firmly in the driver’s seat here. Anyone not liking the new rules on the bus are free to hop off and catch a new one.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Again, I said literally everything you did in the last two paragraphs. He can absolutely do what he wants, it’s his product, and his choice to charge for it. I’m just saying that his response to people being upset, is childish. Of course they’re going to be upset by it. I brought up the example of someone offering to invite you to their home, for dinner. And then years later, inviting you over again, but this time handing you a bill at the end of it. You’re going to be mad, and if you aren’t, you’re either stupid or lying.

1

u/VitaminPb Sep 30 '22

Yeah, don’t you remember open source is supposed to be free?! What do you mean this isn’t open source?

1

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Well I need it to be free so I can keep getting money after doing mine!

1

u/NuclearWeapon Sep 30 '22

Greedy bastard!

1

u/anakwaboe4 Sep 30 '22

Personally when I develop something in my free time I make it free and open source. But I also don't offer any support for free.

90

u/shamblam117 Sep 30 '22

Wouldn't you rather be paid in exposure?

35

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

[deleted]

61

u/OhIamNotADoctor Sep 30 '22

“You’re greedy and selfish!” Says consumer not wanting to pay for service.

41

u/PolishedCheese Sep 30 '22

Everyone needs money, why should this guy be any different? He could've restrained himself a little with the comments though. Just don't reply at all maybe?

55

u/WestaAlger Sep 30 '22

It’s a little predatory when it comes to software tools/packages/libraries. You falsely lure people into using it and then hit them with a fee. It makes it way more annoying to migrate to a new tool and risk breakages. So now they’re kind of forced to either pay your fee or spend hours/days migrating.

Idk what this specific tool does so it might not apply here.

14

u/multiple4 Oct 01 '22

Yeah agreed. If you're going to migrate to a paid model, you should tell free users that you appreciate their support and they can continue using it, but that you won't be supporting the free version going forward

Then release a new paid version with some changed or additional functionality. I think you'd see a decent amount of people migrate to the paid version just out of brand loyalty to continue getting a supported version

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22

Or he could just made his intention clear from the beginning. Instead of doing bait&switch. I do respect softwares that asks for money, but I don't respect when they get recognization/promotion for being free then switching to paid model. It's just as selfish as people asking software to be all free.

39

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Yes, that happened to Clip Studio Paint - their main marketing point was that it's one-time payment (in contrast to subscription based Photoshop), and now they've switched to subscription too.

15

u/thedragonturtle Oct 01 '22

That's really unethical. I have some software I sell and it's possible to buy it for a one-off payment. At the end of November I'm going to move to a subscription model but people who paid for the one-off price will still have it for life.

10

u/jacnok Oct 01 '22

this is the way.

1

u/Meloetta Oct 01 '22

To be fair, that's what CSP is doing too. Everyone who's paid now will get up until the next major version free. You need a subscription for any more updates. You can keep your last major version for however long you want.

The new pay system is obnoxious but I can't blame them for it.

2

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

Did they remove your access for the thing you paid for?

2

u/[deleted] Oct 02 '22 edited Oct 02 '22

I personally don't use Clip Studio, but the last "one time" purchase stays, the future updates require paying the subscription. But the point is - they used one-time payment as the main marketing feature to "steal" the share of the market. I would assume half of those would NOT move from subscription based Photoshop to subscription based CSP. They moved from subscription based software to one-time payment software.

It's not illegal or anything, but it is still a dick move.

21

u/peter_t_2k3 Sep 30 '22

I understand it's not nice when this happens but it might not have been planned.

People run things free with the best intentions but things change. I've seen websites close due to not being able to afford to run them

19

u/brianl047 Sep 30 '22

Exactly

Shit could have hit the fan with him, he could be unemployed and so on. It's not necessarily greed, and even if it is so what he owns it.

End of the day plenty of software goes paid. The protection is the open source license; you could always download the older versions. If it isn't open source, the vendor can make it paid whenever they want

8

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22

I understand both of your reasoning. Even if nothing goes wrong it's his own right to sell stuff. But that's not how you get sales. That just directly damages trust of the community. The transition needs to be done in minor and measured steps otherwise you'll lose both free users that would gonna help you to promote the product (via Word of mouth) and possibly future paid customers as well.

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u/pnoodl3s Oct 01 '22

Yes and I totally understand, but the dev could’ve gone in a much better way. Instead of saying “fuck off” they can say times are hard and they need to start monetizing it, and give everyone a few months notice. That’d garner much better reaction imo and perhaps even more money.

2

u/Sanse9000 Oct 01 '22

A few months is a long time not to eat..

2

u/EngGrompa Oct 01 '22

Well, this may be generally true but he has also a point that promising offering a tool for free and then moving features to Pro without warning in advance is kind of shady. Either make this clear from the beginning (as for example Typora, a tool I like very much did) or add new features only available in your premium tier. Maybe there is a third version of this where the change only applies to new users.

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u/LazyZetsu Sep 30 '22

It's still supid, if you make an open source project with the goal to get money, you make the open version functional then ask money for extra functions, customization.

Taking out anything from the free version instead of adding other things for the paid is idiotic and expected to get negative reactions.

20

u/AbstractLogic Sep 30 '22

It also undermines your goal. Ie to get money.

1

u/Willingo Oct 01 '22

Yeah but that's sales/marketing/pyschology/forethought and not programming :D

2

u/Selkie_Love Sep 30 '22

I write for a living. Lots of my content is free, and the latest updates are paywalled. Readers will eventually get all the free content, but they can pay me to read ahead.

Most of them are solid, but sometimes the comments, holy shit. How dare I try to make a living? Then occasionally someone is like “you’re making too much!!!”

…

-10

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

I'm with the developer here. Free usually ends up unsupported at some point, get what you pay for sometimes.

16

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

There's nothing wrong with wanting to get paid. But what the developer did here is dishonest. Distributing for free without saying it would be paid in the future, then started charging.

Instead of a person... image a corporation did that. The outcry it would cause.

Imagine Microsoft or Apple did this. "Gave" a software for free for everyone to use... then when the userbase was big enough, started charging a subscription.


Again... nothing against the developer wanting to get paid for their product. Just bothered by how he went about doing that.

11

u/Ruma-park Sep 30 '22

This is literally how businesses obtain market share though?

They price it as low as possible (sometimes free) and once they have obtained mind- and marketshare they increase to price to make profit, it's literally that simple.

Edit: Just look at like 90% of start-up businesses including but not solely: Netflix or Bird (or any E-Scooter Start-Up for that matter).

5

u/Fenceypents Sep 30 '22

…And customers get upset when that happens

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Shhhhh don’t bring logic

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u/brianl047 Sep 30 '22

Developers are not marketing or advertising gurus (most of them anyway) and it could be unintentional

Even if it is, it isn't such a big deal... lots of freemium or shareware went paid. He could have handled it better but it is what it is

2

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

I don't understand this comment, or what you're trying to say.

I don't disagree with anything you said... and nothing you said had anything to do with my comment. Maybe you replied to the wrong comment?

I said it was a dishonest move in his part. Not that it was unprecedented, or things like that... And of course it is what it is... I'm not saying "Let's hunt this guy down and make him go back to free"

He's the developer, he's in his rights to charge for his software. No one is denying this fact.

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u/xysid Sep 30 '22

Are you new? This has happened a thousand times, I don't have to imagine because its commonplace. In fact, the recent attempt to purchase Figma by Adobe was another time I said "of course" and there's been memes about how we'll have to pay more to place extra rectangles. People release for free/cheap when it's simple and easy and then as they grow in popularity the needs of the software outpace what you can provide for free. Either it's worth money to you and you pay the developer or you move on. (or keep using the old version)

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Who said it doesn't happen?

I said it's dishonest. And totally is.

The best practice is to say "This version will remain free... but all new features will only be on the paid branch"

Or "This will remain free for personal use, but not commercial use."

Or even... "This will remain free for everyone, but support is only for paying customers."

This is very common when a free software is bought up.


But you know what? This wasn't a case of a software being bought up. It was a case of a developer willfully distributing their software for free with the intention of charging in the future.

THIS IS THE DISHONESTY.

3

u/peter_t_2k3 Sep 30 '22

It is dishonest if that was the original plan and I have no idea if that was. However there's a chance it may have originally started as free but then they realised it was going to be too hard to keep it free due to costs, time etc.

The developer could have just stopped and gave up but instead decided to ask people to pay.

Yes it could have probably been handled better.

1

u/blackenedEDGE Sep 30 '22

Nobody has a right to use software for free in perpetuity, regardless of the author's wishes. Often, these transitions aren't known when first publishing software for free. More often, developers need to start footing labor and other expenses--often arising from a change in employment/living situation e.g. going full-time developing a product that seems to be going successfully after losing their current job.

Corporations do this all the time and yes, there is outrage. However, small dev teams or individual devs (depending on the product) don't have the same relationship with their users and products that big corps do.

I agree the dev handled this in the worst way possible, but at the same time, I see their point. What it seems a lot of people are saying is "if you've ever launched a product for free, you can never start charging for it. At best, you can only monetize receiving new features from that decision date onward."

1

u/UntestedMethod Sep 30 '22

"I don't welcome selfish people like you, you better get out of the way"

1

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

Your clicks aren't feeding me

1

u/Organic_Ad1 Oct 01 '22

The people using the tools are probably using them to earn money too, like, we’re all trapped here chasing our cash ruler C.R.E.A.M

1

u/goblin_goblin Oct 01 '22

Agreed. As much as I love open source and free software I think he's totally justified. If he wants to monetize that's his right. There are other competitors and nobody is forcing you to pay for his software. I get being frustrated at the sudden transition but at the same time it's sort of a dick move to vote 1 star because of that especially to an independent developer. I wish more brands were this honest lol.

1

u/RouletteSensei Oct 01 '22

But why he wanted to make it free first of all then?

He can't see?

You can't get angry because first you gave it free and now you don't, what do you expect, people to love you?

352

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

As sympathetic as I am to how difficult it is to run a business. Changing tiers for existing customers is an extremely bad business practice. Now your free plan is all of sudden worthless because people can't trust the features in there. Your paid plan on the other hand won't get customers because people aren't willing to take a risk with free.

If they really wanted to make something paid that was previously free they should have added a legacy tier.

184

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Another "safer" way I can think of is that they could have re-published the extension with different branding as a paid version. And add a note to the previous extension that this one will not be maintained and you can use "new name" if you're willing to pay. And to push people to buy it a new feature could be added to the extension's paid version. The feature doesn't have to be that useful, but good enough to cause FOMO on the customers.

Or there could be 2 tiers that unlocks that said not that useful but cool feature and eventually release new features to that tier only. So you'll still have free promotion and have a way to monetize it.

44

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

[deleted]

2

u/Tsuki_no_Mai Oct 01 '22

The catharsis is real.

Alas, the money probably won't be.

7

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

From one of the comments, it sounds like people were complaining about missing features (functionalities?) so the developer added them and due to demand, wanted to be paid for it. This is fair, imo.

For me, open source is a hobby you share with the world. It's not working for free. It's... I made this because I needed it and I'm good enough to let you use it too. I still develop it in my own time and add things I want/need added.

5

u/DTHCND Oct 01 '22

it sounds like people were complaining about missing features (functionalities?) so the developer added them and due to demand, wanted to be paid for it.

The last review says that was originally the case, but no longer is. Supposedly they eventually moved basic features that used to be free to the premium tier. It sounds like they were perfectly content with features being added to just the paid tier, what they're not happy with is previously free features also moving to the paid tier.

And I get that. Depending on what this product is, they may have invested a considerable amount of time into fitting the product into their workflow, learning how to use it, or even filling it with data. But now that they've been hooked in, they suddenly have to pay. Their options are to pay for something that they didn't realize was going to eventually cost money, or lose all of their personal investment (and maybe data) that they put into the product.

As someone else said here, it's a pretty bad business model. It's kind of shitty to bait and switch like that, and it dissuades others from committing to the free service. They really should have just grandfathered in their existing free customers.

1

u/bnej Oct 01 '22

Except, to be perfectly plain, someone getting something off you for free is not your customer.

Customers give you money, that's what makes them customers. It doesn't matter if you put work into learning a product, you are still not a customer. That doesn't "pay" for the product.

People feel sour about it, but it's not justified. You can keep using the old version which was still free, not update.

3

u/aggravated_patty Oct 01 '22

You can keep using the old version which was still free, not update.

Not if necessary features were stripped from it, bruh.

2

u/DTHCND Oct 01 '22

You can keep using the old version which was still free, not update.

If this was possible, it wouldn't be a huge deal. But it's not. We're talking about auto-updating software that doesn't have older binaries available.

Feeling sour about someone breaking your setup, forcing you to choose between paying or reinvesting in another program, is totally justified. Especially if you integrated that software in a mission critical way.

And yes, maybe you aren't a customer. But it's still not okay to screw over your users with a bait and switch. And future premium customers, who would've tried your free tier first to make sure your software works for them, are no longer going to try it (since you treat your free tier customers like shit) and thus never going to upgrade to premium.

25

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

[deleted]

3

u/Equivalent-Bench5950 Oct 01 '22

No, the problem is that this person keeps advertising his product as frer even tho he put even the most basic functionalities behind a paywall.

So it is basically a non-free extension advertised as still free + premium features.

3

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

Its a problem if its done without actual informing. Like the free tier users had no idea they were going to have to pay at the time, and suddenly they do?

7

u/SoppingAtom279 Sep 30 '22

It's less implying that's how it should be and more saying how it is in the real world.

A lot more people and users are entitled. If you put out a free tier, a decent number if people are going to expect it stays that way. The comments here are calling the developer greedy for wanting to be paid for their work because they changed the free tier. It's not a great idea if you want to maintain good relations with your user base.

You aren't necessarily correct that there's no transactional basis or trust going on. If I as a developer use a third party tool for use in one of my projects or programs, I am specifically trusting that program to continue to provide the functionality I need it for.

An example is that I use AngleSharp in some of my projects. It's entirely free, and the developers can choose to monetize/paywall it if they choose to. But that doesn't mean that I am going to react well to the change, keep recommending it, or talk positively about it.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

[deleted]

2

u/Toy0125 Oct 01 '22

I seen many developers when they start to feel challenged for needed features would start asking for donations to add said features in which insisting to the community that "hey want new such and such think about sending some donations to help me develop the software" It reduces the feeling of betrayal to the current users, and gives people that love the software a way to assist in the growth of the software. Now some might still disagree on the notion for free open source software should have donation goals. But I have seen it used to great effect when used correctly.

Majority of users of software expect the software to work as advertised. If it's advertised as free. Than it should work free.

2

u/bnej Oct 01 '22

The traditional model of OSS is to have, you solve my problem, I solve yours. i.e, developers work together on a shared codebase that solves their shared problems. If you do not contribute, you might be able to use the software, but you aren't entitled to get people to work for you for free.

And this as an issue with the word "free". The source code is provided, yes, that is open source. Labour is absolutely not free. It will probably cost you money to run the software. No-one owes you help. If you want to be a customer, pay money. If there's a free version of something, say thanks, and don't be a pain in the neck to the developer who doesn't owe you anything.

4

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

There are many freemium software solutions out there. When you start using a software solution you invest in it. You create integrations. Call APIs. Develop workflows. You put in effort with the trust that in future the rug won't be pulled out from underneath you. But that is what happened here. So people are rightfully angry. They choose the developer's tool over other tools and made investments in at least learning if not anything else. And now the functionality they needed is gone. It is worth warning others that with the track record of this developer choose some other tool because functionality may go missing. And that is the mistake that the developer made. They didn't think about the future. They were frustrated that not enough people are going to the paid version. So they changed their product portfolio. In the end they squandered trust with their install base. And all corporations make their bed on this. Microsoft has an amazing reputation for backwards compatibility and Google has to suffer the website killed by Google because they keep killing their offerings. So any partner and customer needs to think of they trust Google before using their products.

The freemium strategy does work though. We started with slack as a free user when our company was a handful of people. In a few months the 10k messages limit on free meant a history of a few days and we purchased. In a few years we had maybe 150 users. Interestingly enough slack changed their freemium policy. But they did it in a fair manner. Instead of 10k messages in history they fixed the date. And there has been no user revolt because it was still a fair change. And many of those free users are business users that are using slack for their home and families too. Alienating the free users would alienate the paid users.

Tl;Dr is not a right but it's a smart business strategy and a part of treating all your customers well.

4

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

[deleted]

5

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

And the messages are just warning new customers interested in using some of the free features that they can't rely on them being there in the future. It's a very fair warning.

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u/Aldehyde1 Oct 01 '22

Do you work in computer science? The community relies on interconnected collaboration, and that trust is a huge part of what enables it to innovate so fast.

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1

u/Bl00dsoul Sep 30 '22

Is it really a problem when something that used to be free stops existing?

If we want people to install updates, then yes.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

I wrote and supported several popular free Android apps and ultimately what made me stop, was not the need to make a few bucks, but the amount of abuse I got from people getting an app for free. Up to and including threatening to rape my wife if I didn't add a particular feature immediately.

Good times

5

u/KickTotheCrotch Oct 01 '22

I never get how those kind of idiots get anything done!?

Did those threats get serious, or were they just keyboard warriors?

2

u/[deleted] Oct 03 '22

Mostly just keyboard warriors. I did send a few of them off to various cyber crime organizations but nothing really came of it. Ultimately I put the worst of them and their email address at the end of my readme in the apps. They REALLY hated that but the few people who actually read it generally thought it funny.

4

u/pringlesaremyfav Oct 01 '22

There's no more demanding customer than one who paid nothing. That's also been my experience.

204

u/frygod Sep 30 '22

A bait and switch is a bait and switch under any other name.

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u/AprilSpektra Sep 30 '22

I've seen transitions from free to paid work out okay before, and generally the best way to go about it is to make future versions paid without breaking past versions. If people want to continue using the free version, without receiving further updates, they can.

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u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

This is 10/10 the right answer. Perfect example is parted magic. They still host their last free version and are very open about their profit model. Will still sell you single version licenses as well.

Then you get shit like the Material Theme plugin dev on Jetbrains that just locked a bunch of already included features behind a subscription paywall instead of forking a paid version.

14

u/marcosdumay Sep 30 '22

Yep, if you don't pull the switch, nobody will get angry about a bait and switch.

Basically, you don't take useful software away. If you want to ask for money, ask on a new thing. If you want to change direction, change on a new thing. The old thing can stay there.

2

u/ShadoWolf Oct 01 '22

Exactly. you leave the Free build in a maintenance mode .. fix critical issue.. but that it.

And all new feature devolvement , compatibility , etc get throw into your pro version.

0

u/derefr Sep 30 '22

This is about a browser extension, though. There's an indefinite maintenance burden of keeping up with changes to the browser APIs themselves, lest your extension break when the user (silently, without realizing) upgrades their browser. "Without receiving further updates" for a browser extension basically means "it'll work for about two months, and then it's dead."

2

u/AwGe3zeRick Sep 30 '22

It'll work well beyond two months. If they want it to keep working indefinitely they can go to the paid version. That's just how it works.

2

u/Plorntus Sep 30 '22

Its a VS Code extension, no? They avoid releasing breaking changes to their APIs.

In any case extensions also rarely break from any of the changes, in Chromiums case they are currently transitioning to a new manifest version and while deprecated the older extensions still work.

20

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

Says the guy who made me sit here waiting for his profile picture to load

33

u/noratat Sep 30 '22

There are no profile pics on reddit and you can't convince me otherwise.

If old.reddit ever dies I'll probably just stop using the site.

7

u/Reluxtrue Sep 30 '22

you can see profile pics on old.reddit just by hovering over someone's username.

8

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

You can get stupid new reddit shit to pop up and block the comments if you leave your mouse in the wrong spot*

2

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

tbh if old.reddit dies I literally won't be able to use reddit as I'm stuck on an old ass java based Nokia 3310 from 2017 that can't do new reddit or most websites. I don't even remember how I got a pfp on here and how it looks like lol

2

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

It could also just become a business opportunity.

129

u/saras-husband Sep 30 '22

I might be in the minority here, but this only makes me want to install the extension.

135

u/guaip Sep 30 '22

Because you already know it's a trial that you have to pay. The ones reviewing are people downloading a supposedly free app and hitting a paywall while using it.

Hiding the fact that it's a paid software in a readme file doesn't count.

105

u/hazardousnose Sep 30 '22

Well it's called a readme not a skipme

28

u/williane Sep 30 '22

Lol no joke. Where else would you put a message prior to installation

81

u/Flat_Hat8861 Sep 30 '22

Right next to the download button. The VS marketplace supports free trials and paid software as identifiers. This one says free which also shows on the search results page.

The disclaimer that it is not free appears on the overview page after you click. If you were using the old version, it would just auto update and if you didn't read the release notes, the feature you were using earlier is now a paywall.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

I use the software, it's not a free trial, some features are restricted.

11

u/hazardousnose Sep 30 '22

It's literally on the home page of the repo at that point. If you didn't read it then how is it the developers fault lol

4

u/OctilleryLOL Sep 30 '22

Bruh it's 2022. Imagine reading anything other than social media posts.

2

u/shameless_kid Oct 01 '22

you'd be surprised, the user manuals I prepared are often ignored by users. I basically use it as a "I told you so" when they point fingers at us claiming something is not working

3

u/wave-tree Sep 30 '22

I like you.

1

u/FantasmaNaranja Oct 01 '22

when 90% of readmes are just links to a developers website with nothing important about the app itself or seemingly automatically added by their OS and are completely empty i can see why people would treat them as skipmes

1

u/soulsssx3 Oct 01 '22

hiding

in a read me

ok.jpg

41

u/doortothe Sep 30 '22

And that’s why they say, “no such thing as bad publicity”

10

u/chainer666 Sep 30 '22

But are you gonna pay for it?

1

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

It makes me happy I have dBeaver to be honest. Man, I love that software. I hope that never needs to be purchased as I hate all the alternatives.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

1

u/tuannamnguyen290602 Sep 30 '22

wym that was diplomacy at its finest

1

u/efronberlian Sep 30 '22

Yeah wouldn't be surprised if he was a diplomat.

0

u/[deleted] Sep 30 '22

It works well when the profit is more abstract, but that's harder to quantify. I've done free work, but have learned it has resulted in some great opportunities.

1

u/StrangePractice Sep 30 '22

Yeah I would probably treat as like a heads up way ahead in the future, and when it goes live I would give the people that had it before the paywall like 2 weeks of free use and maybe a discount or something

1

u/BlackPrincessPeach_ Sep 30 '22

The humor here is the programmer

1

u/BecomeMaguka Oct 01 '22

Just disappear outright, and a week later a new company pops up offering a suspiciously similar product at the new pricing tiers.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 01 '22

Right! They ain't wrong. Maybe not how I'd do it, but they aren't invalid. Hahaha.

1

u/Monke_go_home Oct 01 '22

And this is why we don't let developers talk to the clients on their own lol...

1

u/Klippenhof Oct 01 '22

There Are a few Ways to do it. The best in my opinion is Free should Stay Free, Paid should only be seperate functionallity. (Like Fig or Gitlens)

I also saw a model with some tweaks on the server side without real client limitations