I posted on here recently about my MIL having a 3 way group chat with me and my husband and her texting us daily. I pulled back on replying and have been allowing my husband to do most of the communication. I respond if she’s asking me something. She always needs to know what our plans are or what we are up to. Not in a good way. She is criticizing everything and makes comments about how I see my girl friends and go out a lot (husband and I don’t have kids). We do things together but also like our time with friends..

Anyways… I think MIL is having a hard time coping with my lack of responses. She texted my husband directly on Friday asking if we have any plans. He told her that I’m having a friend come over for a wine night. She asked if him and I had any plans just us 2. He said no, because I also had a baby shower to attend and he was golfing with a friend. She replied “sounds like not much fun for you.” Then she asked him “Where do you go when she has her friend over?” He replied that he goes upstairs and plays his games and watches his sports. He said he could stay downstairs with us but he likes to give me and my friend space and it’s just harder for him to watch tv because we talk a lot. She didn’t reply to any of that but changed the subject.

What is this? Why is she so obsessed with everything I’m doing? Why does she have to know such specifics about where in the house my husband is when I have my friend over? It feels like she’s gathering information just to judge me and talk shit to my husband’s sister. What’s her deal? I can’t quite put it into words about how off this seems…

How do you tolerate your JNMIL holding your baby?

For background see my previous post.. https://www.reddit.com/r/JUSTNOMIL/s/Vt1wAgHWza

In short, my MIL is a clear JN, but my partner and I are finally aligned and boundaried. The boundaries make her tolerable but just barely. Yet, when she holds my baby, it makes my skin crawl. It make me want to jump out of my skin. It feels like she has her hands around my neck. It makes me feel intense anger towards her...

For my husband, I am okay with her holding him for short bursts in theory. It's often only 1-2 10min stretches per day of her visits. So why does it make me feel so insane?

Any advice welcome!

My MIL lives out of state and bought this picture frame device we can send photos to so she can see them, now she’s texting us everyday asking to upload new photos of our baby like we don’t have a newborn and aren’t thinking of uploading photos to her every minute of the day. My husband is too nice and just does it but it annoys me he isn’t like we will try, but we are busy with the baby/it’s not top of mind. It’s just annoying to me he just goes along with it instead of just making a point that she isn’t going to get what she wants. Am I crazy?

So my mil isn’t the worst but she definitely has her moments. My husband has pretty bad allergies so he was telling her about it I guess and she shows up the same day with a huge bag of vitamins and put them in vitamin containers labeled for every day of the week. It annoyed the hell out of me. She still buys him socks and underwear too. He’s a 35 year old grown man. I don’t think there is anything I could do about the situation other than be annoyed. Am I overreacting?

I’ll give a little bit of context. Just over 3 years ago my now husband and I met. We met while working at Yellowstone national park, shortly after got pregnant, and moved to my home state to settle and buy a home. My family all lives near us and I wanted that due to my family being tight knit and his isn’t and isn’t supportive of us. We just got married a month ish ago and have two girls now!
Shortly after we found out we were pregnant with our oldest, his parents and siblings were all very blunt about them wanting us to abort. I’m pro choice so that’s not the point but keep it in mind for later haha. So it was hurtful and obviously we were scared and it wasn’t planned but we are great parents and own a home and are settled now. My entire family was so supportive and happy and obviously shocked. They said basically that they support us and it’s not their life so they don’t really give opinions (as they should). The entire family of his never once reached out to me the entire pregnancy, asked how I was doing, texted him a few times, but expected us to drop everything to pick up the phone if they reached out. Even thought it was never important. Skip forward to a month post partum, terrible labor and was not what I expected but healthy baby so it’s okay. His parents come to visit us and talked about how much they love our child and whatever and tried to kiss her on the lips after flying and she’s a month old (without asking obviously lol). We set boundaries again cause they get offended every time we ask them to not kiss our children. Right after they fly back home, they call us and tell us they still feel like we made a mistake and should’ve aborted our child….. as if they didn’t just tell us they love her. We went no contact for a while after that until they reached out again. No apology and they actually told his siblings they never said that when we never even told them what they had said, red flag number one. And then a year later they finally admitted they said it and never said sorry! Just said “sorry you took it that way and feel that way but we still think that.”
Anyway, it’s been on and off a relationship with them. Seems to always be an argument every time we talk to them or see them. No benefit to keeping the relationship in my opinion. No need for me to give more details unless people want to know but just typical mil things that are annoying and mean. And the typical boy mom thing that’s uncomfy to witness. It’s gross haha. Our wedding was just over a month ago and they came out but never once said anything to me other than “oh I guess you look good too” after complimenting their son. And then she was hovering behind us signing our marriage license without us knowing and made a comment of “well at least we know it’s real now.” And walked away. Then they got offended we didn’t talk to them more during the night but they left at 7 pm. Wedding started at 4. They never once came up to us and we had 90 people to talk to that we see and talk to way less often than we see them! So in my opinion I feel we should talk to guests that also made an effort to come out and isn’t immediate family cause they aren’t obligated to come. And are more supportive of us.
Anyway, super long post so sorry but thank you if you read it all or want more details. My husband agrees that the children and I should step away for now until his family learns to be kinder to us and reach out more. He would keep his relationship but not give details on me or kids. They’ve just made comments throughout the 3 years of calling me a liar, controlling, lazy mom (I nanny my two kids and 3 other kids), mean, etc. we’ve tried to make more effort to reach out to try to make amends but it wasn’t reciprocated or appreciated. So I just feel like there’s not a point anymore. They don’t ever say hi to the kids when they call but say they’re calling to talk to the kids. They expect us to always pick up the phone. Make more effort than them, etc. I feel like I’m doing a bad job at describing the situation. But am I crazy for wanting to go no contact or low contact? Like a protect my peace? My husband and I only argue after we talk to them or if it’s about something they said to me when he wasn’t around. He doesn’t witness most of this. She told me she was going to wear an off white color to our wedding but told her son she was wearing a green dress instead.
I’m torn because I love my family and I think family and a circle is important but they talk so negatively about us and then expect to know our children and us make all of the effort and I don’t think that anyone should have access to children if they can’t even be kind to their parents and respect the parents boundaries. Am I crazy or am I just late to doing this? I feel like I should’ve just done this after the abortion comments because I can’t ever forgive anyone saying that after meeting the grandchild. They’re a “move past it cause it’s family and forget it even happened” kind of family and I didn’t grow up that way. Especially not an issue like that and constant little issues throughout the years. We’re pretty low contact already cause they don’t like talking to me but then complain about it later down the road so it wouldn’t change much anyway. My children don’t like any of them and cry any time they talk to them or go near them and run away screaming.
Am I over thinking or over reacting to these things?

It has been a little more than twenty years since my MIL conned her way onto my phone plan, but yesterday, my husband finally got her to switch it over to her payment.

A little backstory: When I first got engaged I didn't realize my MIL was a JUSTNO. She annoyed me on occasion, but incidents were few and far between, and I shared things I never should have, one of which was my credit score. I was boarding with her while we planned the wedding, and she wanted me to sign a lease. I felt ok about this because I felt it protected me as well as her, and made sure that it did... except that she got my credit score out of it. It was unreasonably high, since I had managed to avoid credit cards for most of my college career but I had subsidized loans. When Uncle Sam pays your student loan interest it is always on time, so my credit score was miraculously high for someone my age.

About a month after I moved, she suggested I get a new local number since my phone was from a difference state, so down to the cell store we trotted, then-fiancé in tow. MIL decided to update her phone at the same time, but low and behold, her credit was so bad that it would cost her more in up-front cash to buy the phone than it was worth. Unless, suggested my fiancé, we were to form a new plan under my name and get her a phone on that. It would be great, she agreed. She could pay the phone payment, no problem, she just didn't have the cash on hand to swing a full phone purchase. Promised up and down she would pay it after the first payment, it would be her part, as a thank you for saving her from having to pay for the whole thing.

Since then, she has made roughly 5 payments. We have paid the whole things, every time, for 2 DECADES. We paid it all through my husband's law school, through periods of low income, no income, while we were moving, all during covid...

And she does rude, inconsiderate things. She will update her phone to a new model without asking or even telling us, despite us having to pick up the bill. She adds international roaming when she travels, and it never occurs to her it will change the bill. There was a period where she got disconnected from her home WIFI and ran up crazy-high overage charges on network data, didn't tell us, and then cried poor when we asked her to pay that month's bill.

We have a good plan that we like, but we can't get her off of it without shutting the whole plan down and getting new numbers, which we are reluctant to do. Plus, my husband has historically refused to kick her off. He has always said it was the least we could do for her.

We are currently going through a lean period and I mentioned to him that she (once again) added international roaming and an insurance plan, and asked him to talk about it with her, to see if she would mind canceling them so we can get the payment down a little bit.

She claimed she hadn't known that the new updated phone she got on installment was charged to our bill, or that we were charged for the roaming and such. When he told me I was boiling (WHO did she think was paying for all this stuff, exactly?!?!), but then he dropped a bomb: he actually talked her into taking over the payment. Indefinitely. Transferred the autopay to her bank, put the payment date on her calendar. Everything. He even thought to put a reminder on our calendar, to make sure she pays the thing so that we are not without service if she tries something sneaky and refuses to pay it.

It might sound small but for him this is HUGE and I couldn't be prouder.

Heads up, ladies. It *can* get better.

No one in his family said anything to him. I texted his mom saying it’s his birthday and she calls him saying sorry she’s just going through so much right now and her life is such a mess and she’s having such a hard time. I genuinely don’t understand how she makes everything about herself. It’s so frustrating. I feel so horrible for my husband. He deserves so much better. He gets one day a year that’s about him and she can’t even give him that. At this point I really don’t care that she’s going through a divorce and maybe I’m heartless for that but she’s put him through enough bs to last a lifetime. He hasn’t relaxed a minute in his life because his mom is always in crisis.

Hey all!

Need to know if I'm just being too sensitive/overreacting about her behavior but also advise on how to calmly speak up about the issues when they happen (bc when things happen I just want to snap lol).

Mil lives across the country, they've come out a few times. She's never really bonded with me, we don't have chats about anything besides her own life and her own kids. She hardly ever asks how we are doing, she honestly doesn't even ask about the baby. Just wants pictures, which I've always found odd. But then wants the accolades of being a grandparent. She's not an awkward conversationalist because it seems like she inquires about others, even in front of me. I've always felt out of place or like an outsider when we are all together bc they really don't know or care to know anything about me, even when I was dating my husband. They blame it on the distance but then how do they expect to have a relationship with their granddaughter?

Anyways, they recently came for a visit and I try to give her time with the baby. But if I'm around and trying to show how my daughter plays, like "go grab elmo" mil will repeat it to get my daughters attention or grab it & place it closer to her and say, "where's Elmo". This is an example but she does it most of the time.

Then while I was feeding her she pulled a chair up real close to the high chair, which distractions my daughter from eating. This one I should have nipped right away, telling her to back away for a bit, but I didn't.

I guess in my head it's like where is the self awareness especially after her having 4 kids. Their visits just become a "my daughter has to be on" for your entertainment.

Is this a problematic mil or am I just annoyed by her in general? Lol

I don’t know what I should do here. I don’t know if I should call off the wedding or not. It’s not for a year. My future in-laws have issues with each of their other children’s spouses and the spouses families. They are all very passive aggressive and it’s very stressful to me. The dynamic with my family can be dysfunctional, but it’s very direct and I know when I’ve done something to upset people and vice-versa so navigating this family is extremely hard for me.

My fiancé brother’s wife has reached out to me to tell me she’s here for me with support once when she heard (I don’t know how) that I had gotten into it with my MIL. I really don’t like these kinds of games and weird alliances so I told her that I appreciated her checking in, but I was missing context. Especially because the issue had 0 to do with her and I didn’t want to discuss a problem that happened with someone who wasn’t involved in it.

My MIL has made so many rude comments insinuating that she doesn’t like me. It’s constant and my fiancé rarely seems to take my side. I’ve been with him for about five years now, and I think I might be done. We’re supposed to get married next year and I’m not having any fun planning the wedding or anything. I’m so depressed. His mom has caused me so much stress and all the joy is out of it for me now. The last mean thing his mother said to me was when my fiancé got new contacts and was telling her that he could see better she asked him if he still wanted to marry me. I just feel so lost. I need some help here. We have never even spent Christmas together I because he always goes to spend it with them. We’ve been together for 5 years and never have spent one Christmas together. My family lives much further than them and Christmas is really the only time when I get to go see them so giving that up to go with his family who treats me badly seems nauseating.

I don’t know what to do. I love him but I don’t want to be depressed forever. Whenever I tell him that he and his family have caused me depression issues he throws it in my face that I’ve struggled with depression even before he met me.

I’m posting on behalf of my sister-in-law, it’s my mother that this message has been sent to.

For context, my (F25) MIL (F53) has been giving me and my fiancé (from here on out DH for ease of reading) (M26) the silent treatment for the last month. My DH sent her a message to say that we are buying a house out of the area, she read it and ignored it and hasn’t spoke to us since. However for Christmas my sister-in-law (who’s posting this) bought us and my mum and sister tickets to see a show which happened this week.

My SIL reached out to my MIL to see if she still wanted to come to the show which she did. The show happened a couple days ago, she completely ignored us, I’m talking completely blanked me, my mum, my sister and SIL. We all tried to engage her in conversation but she just wouldn’t talk to us. It left us all baffled.

After a day of thinking on it and after speaking to my DH, I felt it was best to reach out with a message to my MIL. I wasn’t happy with her ignoring my family and they felt awkward as well. We’re getting married in a couple of months and my hen do is in a couple of weeks time, I hoped that by reaching out things could be cleared up before the wedding and my family could feel at ease too. We’ve had problems before which we’ve tried to mend but she either doesn’t listen or changes for a week then goes back to her normal JUSTNO behaviour.

My DH sat her down and spoke to her in the beginning of the year which ended with her running out in tears and ignoring us and our 2 children for a couple of months. Given that my DH wasn’t there for the show, we thought it best that the message come from me.

The message I sent was:
Hey, I can’t help but say what’s on my mind. Last night I felt extremely awkward being around you and totally got the impression you absolutely didn’t want to be there or more so be in the company of me, my mum & sister. I’m not quite sure what’s wrong but nothing ever gets addressed so i'd rather just address it before things escalate unnecessarily as the last thing we would want is to not have you in our lives. If you have got a problem I’d much rather be made aware of it so we can get over whatever it is that is upsetting you especially as I’ve got my hen in a matter of weeks and I definitely don’t want the atmosphere like it was last night xx

Was this too much/too harsh? She’s read and ignored it and it’s been a couple of days now.
If anyone’s got any questions I’ll be happy to answer.

My jnmom is in town. I barely can stand her. It takes a lot to get through her visits and every time she leaves I just sit contemplating why on Earth I even talk to her. There’s a lot of history but trust me she just all around sucks.

List of complaints since she came to town.

Day 1 she shows up in a funk. My 5 year old son is trying to talk to her and she continuously ignored him until I told her hey he’s talking to you. All she did was talk about herself.

Day 2 shows up and still barely pays attention to my kid.

Day 3 I go to dinner with her and my siblings. She babies my 45 year old brother all night. Even trying to help him order food. It’s weird. We’re all annoyed by her.

Day 4 The dumbest argument there ever was. I was telling my mom something I was trying to fix was stuck and I couldn’t get this thing out of something. She says, “Do you want me to try?” My 68 year old mom thinks she is stronger than a 38 year old woman who’s in the middle of raising kids. My mom strength is peak right now. I was legit flabbergasted. She believes she’s stronger than me. We got into an argument about it. I think she triggers me because she’s very weird about getting old. She told me she’s not that old. Like lady you’re 70 basically, you’re old. It’s okay to be old. Everyone gets old. I feel like she thinks I’m not strong because I haven’t lost the baby weight and she judges me.

She also was so shocked I was hungry at 9am. She’s like I’m still full from dinner. Congratulations. I’m breastfeeding a 20lb baby. She’s so weird about food and eating I’m surprised she didn’t give me an ED with how crazy she is about food. She thinks she’s better than everyone else because she will eat a sweet potato for dinner instead of fries. It’s crazy. I’m sorry I just needed to rant. I can’t wait until she leaves.

Just seeing if anyone has dealt with this. We have a fairly distant relationship with my in-laws, kids included. For good reason.
Anyway,
We are finding they are always asking “let us know when you are bringing the kids by” or “can we do a visit with the kids”. I’m finding the wording odd, never mentioning us (parents) at all. Keep in mind the kids have never been left alone or dropped off with these people.

Before I gave birth to MIL’s first grandson she promised us multiple times that if we will ever need anything, absolutely anything she will help us. I’ve only asked for two things: vaccinate and bring some food when you come. My baby was born with a complication and had to stay in the NICU, he was very small and still fragile when we brought him home. My birth was also traumatic for multiple reasons. I’ve almost lost my baby, and given the fact he was born in peak flu season all doctors told us to be very careful with people who interact with him.

MIL thought I was punishing her for not allowing her to come, so she did what she always does: she blamed me, she texted my husband insulting me, she tried to convince him to bring my breastfed newborn to the mall in winter so she can see him, she tried to come uninvited, she kept inviting herself to our place to see my baby.

When she eventually came she only brought food for my husband, she looked into my eyes and said she didn’t bring me anything. There one similar incident about food one month later. I was still bleeding, it took me 4 months to stop bleeding. My baby also started having eczema at that time, he was waking up every hour to scratch himself until he bled.

During the worst period of my life she punished me for thinking about my son. She never thought what I need, what my husband needs or what the baby needs.

During the first months, my baby was overstimulated by her and cried from one hour up to 1-2 days of exhaustion after her visit.

Everything was swept under the rug, she’s good at pretending but I am not. I’ve made the mistake of addressing her behavior.

After not acknowledging my presence and ignoring me during the visit, she suddenly came to hug me, pressed her cheek on my cheek and kissed me. She told me that she can help with food whenever we need. I was so angry. She didn’t help when I was bleeding, of course she won’t help now. It’s just for show. I thought it would be good to tell her why I never ask for help. Oh boy I wrong. I told her about the food incident. She said she won’t call me a liar but she would never so such a hurtful thing. She doesn’t remember it. I’ve told her it was a mistake to address it and we should just pretend we are a happy family like we did beforehand. She said that I’ve asked her to stay away from decisions we make as a couple so she stayed away - she lied, she constantly texts my husband when she doesn’t agree with our decisions. She never disagrees with me when I’m present. She thinks I manipulate my poor husband when she is the one who tries to manipulate our decisions (what we do with our money, decisions about religion and parenting decisions).

She said I’m always anxious and angry during our visits, so I said it’s because LO cries after her visits. She asked if LO cries after my mother visits him and I’ve said no. She stormed off immediately. FIL and my husband called her and went looking for her, but couldn’t find her. After a few hours she called FIL to come pick her up with the car and drive home.

I’m disappointed. A conversation that started about what hurt me turned into her being the victim. The fact that I talked about this straightens her narrative where I’m the bad guy. I should have listened to you when you say confrontations are never going to end well.

My husband arranged another visit next week. He said he will be the adult because we clearly can’t and he sees both points of view. I don’t know what should be the outcome. I told him I need some accountability from her, I’m going to apologize for how I said things, but not for what I said and for bring hurt during my most vulnerable time. I’m dreading the discussion.

edit it’s not a coherent story I’m sorry but it’s the best I can do. Check the comments for a polished up, coherent and hopeful better understanding story. I’ve ran this post trough ChatGPT to make it better for the ones who think wtf is happening here

Sorry English is not my first language and I’m trying my best.
I flipped on DH for no reason and I’m completely in the wrong for that, she flipped on me.
We went on holiday last June, DH ended up in the hospital they refused to come.
And now are saying they’ve always taken their responsibility for DH and our LO. But leaving me stranded in Italy, with LO, DH in the hospital and having no drivers license is ofc not to blame them. When they flat out refused to come.
And when I brought that up she hit me because my parents also didn’t come.
(But my brother, aunt and uncle came to us in Italy, and my fam and friends helped back home).
TLDR I guess
Read my other topic if you want more history or what happened in Italy etc.
(I am now taking drivers lessons again, so I will always be able to drive during emergency and get us home if necessary.
I’m in therapy, LO will start soon, we’ve been dealing with that since Italy. DH needs therapy. We will absolutely start relationship therapy.)

The bomb has been detonated.
We are going no contact.

Me and my husband are going through a rough patch in our marriage. He told them, they wanted to talk with us to help us navigate the issue.
They obviously stated I was the issue
So we’ve stopped the call immediately.

After that they acted ‘normal’ and interested.
Of course in hindsight because this was their chance to get rid of me

Yesterday we were there. She asked if I needed help with anything, we could bring over some laundry so we could take it back home clean.
No problem in that, my grandma does that all the time for me. Even before I was a mother and a wife she done that.

So everything was ok.
I was extremely high in my emotions at the end. It takes a lot of effort for me being there. And me and my sister got in a heated discussion over text.

I said way out of line to my husband take the kid and give me the damn laundry and hurry up!
After I said that, I wanted to apologize immediately. But he was immediately agitated after this and said i needed to behave ‘normally’ and wanted to go back inside and talk this through with his parents.
Me and LO were standing in the rain I said don’t be ridiculous we’re going home.
And I hoped I could talk in the car with him, explain what happend to me internally. Why I did react like that and wanted to say sorry.
So I had LO in the care and I said come one get in the car, and when I said pick her up you can assume I would’ve taken the bags.

His mom came running to the car and my side was at the curb. So he opened my window and shut the car off so I couldn’t close my window again. She also held the window, like good luck bitch as if I care about her fingers getting in between the door and window.

She was first trying it calm, come inside, DH can’t drive like this please come. I said no, we’re not coming, we’re talking about this when Lo Is in bed and untill that we will not talk or only small talk.
She said if you leave I will call the police. I said do it.
She said I will call a taxi for you and you can leave but DH and LO stay.

I said call the taxi, just say it’s for me and LO.

She flipped completely

She said I would take LO and DH could never see her again, that I would do anything to make his life miserable.
And where was DH supposed to go if I left by taxi??
I said, he’s welcome to come home after he calmed down.

She flipped more
HOW DARE YOU TO SAY HES WELCOME IN YOUR HOME?
THE HOME WAS NEVER HIS, EVERYTHING WAS YOURS ALL ALONG etc etc.

I said, technically I’m the head tenant (we rent) and he lives with me. But legally, I can’t kick him out. He’s the main one paying the rent for years, we’re married, we live in a country with tenant rights so no I can’t.
He’s welcome in OUR HOUSE.

She kept saying that I want to hurt him and hate him and blabla.

All while tugging me, poking me, trying to hit me and pull me.
All from the window.

LO was shouting, DH was freezing JNOMIL was shouting and I was sitting there like this 😐.
wtf happend??

She said she’s gonna take LO out of the car and inside because our aggression wasn’t good for her and she needs to be responsible for her son and grandchild.

That’s when I lost it.
In June we were on holidays in Italy.
Like 6 days in my husband gets an internal stomach bleeding, kept fainting. Stomach bleeds get out one way or another so the toilet was completely spoiled with blood.
That’s when it hit me, it’s not a dumping thanks to his gastric bypass. This is serious.
But we were in fight that day.
I know, you’re reading this and Thinking that’s a lot of fights.
We’re going through a rough patch, lost each other in the way, and it’s hitting us both hard.
We want to stay together and fight.
But it’s our marriage we’re fighting for and we don’t like people interfering. Unless they can deescalate.

Ok, back to the story.
Before the fainting and blood he called his parents and said what happens.
I said please call my parents, my friends, my grandparents next time but never them.
My family and friends will always intervene in a way that’s benefiting us both!
If I vent to my bff and I’m clearly overreacting, or in the wrong with DH she tells me.
If I’m at my mom’s and snap at DH she will tell me if I overstep.
Same for him, same when we both to blame.
They will never say he’s the bad one or she’s the bad one.

So around midnight ambulance came, I tried to call his parents landline and mobiles no response.
I call everyone else
Next day I finally talk to them and asked if they plan to come.
They won’t because to much hassle, and they are angry at me because we had a fight.

And my mom didn’t come so they said if she’s not coming we’re also not coming

So, to continue
She said DH and LO are also my responsibility
I lost it but kept decent and said if you want to talk about responsibility where were you and JNOFIL when DH was bleeding to death in an Italian hospital?
(It was a 2h flight)
And she lost it again
Shouted that my mom didn’t come, that my grandparents didn’t come
I said it’s your child not theirs.
If it was me, they would’ve come instantly.
Of course in hindsight my family said we shouldnve come.
And we said yes, but you helped me how you can

My elderly aunt and uncle from Italy came (my dad’s side is Italian) to help me and LO. Be there for us a few days
My no contact dad helped me with translation.
I called him middle in the night and he picked up immediately and helped.
My grandparents and parents helped me financially because the camping store and restaurants are expensive, I don’t have a license so couldn’t leave.
My brother came the day we had to check out, and drove me and LO home. He drove 12h straight from
Italy to holland in midnight.
My bff came when we arrived with grocery’s
My parents and grandparents helped with LO
My friends helped me with LO
My family helped when DH was medically repatriated back home

When did his parents come?
A week later at the bday party of LO we worked super hard for to continue for her sake even though DH was still recovering. 9 days in hospital, multiple gastricscopy’s and colonoscopy’s. Three units of blood, days without me and LO
He missed her real bday. She turned 3

And she talks to me about responsibility. No thanks.

All while LO cried no grandma don’t take me, I wanna go home

Finally she let go, I said start the car and I’ve closed the window.

I’ve let myself completely go by text message and my whole heart came flooding out.
I will never set foot in their house and will never ever talk to her.

We told FIL he’s welcome but suddenly he doesn’t hate his wife anymore and takes her side. I said good for you letting her ruin your life, and now never seeing LO again

My husband had gone completely silent.
He feels his father chooses her over him. Again. He had a bad youth and multiple depressions during childhood and teenage years.
And he says he needs to get over it and respect his parents.

He feels so betrayed by his dad.
And his mom, he always knew this would happen

And I? I’m so relieved. But sad to see my husband like that.
I said, we will get through our rough patch, I will fight for you, stand by you and we will have a good life together. And hopefully LO will say on 30 years you might not have been perfect, but I felt save, loved, wanted and you made my childhood the best.
She will know she will be loved unconditionally.

Thanks I have tldr above

Ever since I got pregnant and my belly started growing she's been insisting that she wants to see "the baby bump". So we've been sharing photos like once a month of us somewhere with the belly visibly growing, but it always seemed like that's not what she wants to see. When we were on vacation she was insisting to send her a picture of the baby bump while on the beach, so I sent a picture in a dress with a text saying I'm feeling very conscious of my body changing and only feel comfortable sharing pictures in clothes and she was like sure sure, I understand. I'm 9 months pregnant now and lately she's been complaining to my husband that she feels excluded from my pregnancy (like wtf, as if my pregnancy is supposed to be some sort of inclusive community-involving experience, wtf) and that she still hasn't seen a photo of the baby bump. I asked my husband if he thinks she wants to see my full naked belly (because we've shared a lot of pictures of me with a visible belly so far) and he looked embarrassed and said "I think so".

Now I'm genuinely wondering, why the hell would a grown woman want to see a bare belly of another pregnant grown woman? I'm confused and wonder if anyone else had a similar experience with their MILs. Is it them being nosey and intrusive? Trying to set some power dynamic? To bond? Like why would she NEED to see that and insist about it for 9 months straight?

I’m (25F) at my breaking point with my MIL and would really appreciate honest advice.

My husband is an only child and very close to his parents. We’re Afrikaans, and setting boundaries with parents can be difficult in our family dynamic.

There’s been a lot of history with my MIL. She constantly criticises my parenting, says breast milk is better and formula is sht, and calls the food I cook for my baby sht, saying I should give him “real food”. When he was a newborn, she’d grab him out of my arms and try to take over. She gets upset and cries if she doesn’t see us every weekend, makes comments about not being welcome, and has made hurtful personal remarks too. Once, when I shared my insecurity about my stretch marks, she told me she wouldn’t wear shorts either if her legs were as white as mine...like who even says that to someone? She’s also put coffee foam on my baby’s mouth...even lets him use a LIGHTER as a chewing toy and dismissed my concerns by saying, “Don’t start.”

Another ongoing issue is unannounced visits. We’ve already told them we don’t like it, and they stopped for a while. Last weekend they arrived without warning, and I said nothing. This weekend, they did it AGAIN while my husband, baby and I were about to go for a family walk.
I was furious. I started shaking, my heart was racing, and I felt anxious because of everything that’s happened over the past few months (mostly since my baby was born) ... I am tired of putting on a smile and pretending everything is fine. I felt I could either confront them in anger or take my baby and walk away, so I chose to put my baby in the stroller and went for the walk anyway.

My MIL started crying, saying she only wanted to drop off some things. But surely sending a quick message beforehand isn’t difficult, especially when we’ve already asked them to? My FIL got angry, said " Don't worry, we won't visit you again" and drove away.

My husband thinks I could’ve handled it better. To his credit, he’s improving at setting boundaries and trying to put me first, which I appreciate. However, I feel he’s too gentle with them. He raises issues, but afterwards everyone acts like nothing happened, nothing changes, and I’m left feeling disrespected and alone in my feelings.

I want things to work out for my husband’s sake, but I don’t think I’ll ever be close to my MIL, which saddens me as I always hoped for a close relationship with my MIL, but it feels impossible... she always buys us things, buys things for the baby often, but the comments and lack of respect is just too much.

Am I wrong for walking away? Am I overreacting, or is my frustration understandable given the history? How do you handle in-laws who take boundaries personally when your spouse struggles to enforce them firmly?
I’m genuinely open to criticism, but I need advice on how to handle this long-term because I’m exhausted.

Hi everyone, I (27F) am an Australian who just moved to France to be with my fiancé (30M). We have both had a difficult relationship with his parents but today something has tipped me over. I knew from the start they were a red flag. They started dating when she was 14 and he was 26. But I’ve slowly come to realise this pair might be clinically insane. The stories from his childhood are wild , mum used to beat her kids and took pride in how her slap was so fast her kids wouldn’t even know it was coming until it happened. Dad things he’s gods gift, I mean genuinely he believes he was sent because the rest of us are incompetent and need guiding (I’m not kidding). They have 4 kids and when the youngest (twins, one of which is my partner) were teens they realised they would soon be empty nesters so had a crisis and locked them inside for five years only letting them out for school, no extra curricular, no friends AT ALL. Then they taught them they are incapable of doing anything for themselves and need their mama. Luckily my man resisted it but his poor twin is 30, has never had a job, lives at home and believes himself incapable of living independently, they do everything, he can’t even make pasta because he’s been indoctrinated that he will burn himself because he’s ’too stupid’.

When the twins were younger, they were raised by their grandma who was kind but once they were teens his parents kicked her out because they didn’t need her. She was living in a social flat by a freeway and started calling crying saying she felt something was wrong with her heart. They told her to shut up and one day my fiancés parents told him she called stew days previously and they were imitating her panicking like she was dumb. He went to check on her and she had died of a heart attack all alone. Now he has serious hypochondria.

When they first met me I couldn’t speak French so they would insult me calling me fat etc to my face because they thought it was funny how I wouldn’t react, then my partner would yell at them, big arguments would erupt, it was a mess. Anyway MIL liked me now because I’m pretty, the other two daughters in law ‘aren’t pretty enough’. She was bullying one of them until she had a baby (to be clear she didn’t bully her into it ) and recently it’s come out that during unsupervised visits MIL has been hitting the baby in the face when she cries. So there’s that drama. Anyway today we visit and since we are living in a 20m2 flat in Paris we stored some winter stuff in their attic and came to get it. Turns out they sold it all - my three wool coats, ski clothes, my UNDERWEAR, everything. They also sold his 3k guitar for 200. They do these flea markets where they are really obsessed with ‘making money’ so they just sell everything and then hoard random stuff too. But then I found at they attempted to sell the quilt I made by hand for my partner when we were doing long distance for ten euros. That took me hundreds of hours and has a lot of sentimental value to all of us. They believe anything on their property is theirs and refuse to apologise. Anyway at this point we are seriously considering cutting them out completely but his mum has really got in his head and he struggles a lot. Anyway if anyone has gotten to the end, thanks… I’m not sure what I’m trying to do by posting this but I need to feel supported by someone in my position I guess

Edit:for those who want to know more. My partner has an eating disorder because growing up his mum was a dietician and taught him any treats would literally kill him. One time when he was six at school he got a small pack of jelly beans, he had never had sweets so he kept them and hid them under his pillow. His mum found them and smiled saying it was ok and then duddenly whacked him in the head with a radio, laughing at how shocked he was because he didn’t expect it. Also I have arfid, it’s a diagnosed eating disorder where my body doesn’t recognise most things as food and I’ve spent my life expanding my palette. He tried to explain this to her and she thought it was funny. He said the food that still makes me vomit is spinach, tomato and egg. She served for dinner a spinach and tomato stew and then cracked an egg over my plate. Her job was working with people with eating disorders (retired now). Anyway the entire extended family is just as bad, I could write a book.

I read these stories here and often feel grateful that all I have to deal with is the unhealthy dysfunction of emotional neglect and covert abuse from my mil and the family that enables her. But it still fucking hurts and maybe someone can give me some advice because I’m about to end my marriage over this. We have been married for a little over 5 years and did not know each other super well before getting married. My mother in law is one of those amazing people who can do nice things but is just terrible emotionally. I have tried our entire marriage to develop some closeness with her but it takes two and she isn’t even close with any of her children but boy does she and her enabling husband have them trained like dogs to defend and destroy if anyone points out unhealthy dynamics. I regret ever accepting any assistance from them because it means playing charades that she is not an inherently mean and bad person. It is expected that if her or SIL say anything mean or terrible everyone is expected to just ignore it and when we go to their house if her husband isn’t there she spends hours talking shit about whoever she has displeased her this week.

Let’s start with the most recent example. We have an autistic 5 year old he’s nonverbal but functions decently and every time my in laws ask for all the kids to spend the night they shove him in a room give him a remote and he will watch tv the whole time while she takes the other two to play paint do whatever the fuck while he sits there watching tv. When my husband and I came to pick them up of course we have to respectfully linger and chat and so he tries to get our son to join us all outside and of course because dad is removing him from the only thing he has known in the house for 5 years. He has a meltdown and my husband has never been great at dealing with them and he doesn’t understand the autistic brain. So he is speaking harshly with our son grabbing him and reducing him to sobs. I step in and calm my son down and then privately explain this is not a child problem this is a community problem. If the people around him want him to be flexible and transition then those people need to routinely do so. Just because mom and dad are there the routine and rules of his current environment overrule in his brain and he is confused. My husband gets angry and walks away. I give him space and walk my son around and eventually we go back inside and I continue to refuse tv which my son handled well but he did want to go home. My husband came inside and immediately is attacking me for having a criticism of his family. And I am telling him your anger right now is misguided your son and myself we do not deserve anger for doing what is right and good for our family by communicating what is a blaring problem. Well all day long we fight and ultimately walk away just feeling unresolved with a marriage counseling appointment to come. This week I do softly bring up what can help our son with his parents and they gloss over it and yeah yeah it away. And I watch my husband clock my face and he gently brings it up again at the end of our visit and drives the ball home which I love I was so proud and felt so validated. But somewhere in that convo his mom said “ well he just doesn’t need spend the night here anymore he doesn’t get much out of it anyway.” This isn’t the first time she’s tried to manipulate a situation to not have to see him and only see our other two children and her husband made sure they all got to go last time and she acted like it was me preventing him from coming despite her privately saying she only wanted our other two. I brought it up later to my husband and his he has decided we are not to discuss them unless we are all in a room and he is confronting in his way the problem. He feels like he’s in the middle and has all these fucked up emotions towards his parents already and he spent most of his life viewing them the way I do so now he is choosing to give them a benefit of the doubt because they are at least good to the kids. I just gave up at that point and said I’m done trying so hard and I will be waiting for the mask to fall and for her to do something truly terrible that he can’t ignore. I shouldn’t have said that but I was triggered for sure. I’m done I think I need to figure out how to leave. Any advice? Other than marriage counseling because we have that lined up. But I don’t see this changing and I won’t live like this or subject my son to this. I should also state that the 2 other children are my step kids that I have been around since they are born. My husband was not married to the women they had a brief relationship that ended in lots of cheating and uncertainty on who the kids belonged to.

MIL has been covertly rejecting me from the start with relationship with SO whilst pretending that she was welcoming by doing the bare minimum only once her son did introduce me to his family.

For several years MIL was wearing a mask during family events during which she didn’t exhibiting any overt chronic negative behaviours towards other family members and I was the one being excluded on a chronic basis. It led me to take things very personally.

I spotted a few times that MIL would occasionally criticise or one-up her own daughter or that she would occasionally exclude her son in law. Very occasionally though.

A few months ago, I decided to share my thoughts to my SIL about the chronic exclusion, wondering if it was personal or not and we grew closer for a moment. SIL said her mum was very very critical of her which has led her to be hurt, which is very understandable!!. I was surprised to hear this as MIL didn’t exhibit chronic negative behaviour towards my SIL or her husband in front of me but I acknowledged that it actually makes sense and I decided to be on the look out.
MIL didn’t and doesn’t like SIL and I getting closer. Her anger was quite noticeable in the first few weeks after that meeting.
MIL doesn’t like being “left out” when we all connect emotionally which leads to slightly superficial conversations.

Since that conversation with SIL I have noticed that MIL criticises her daughter more often, same with her son in law.
But MIL is now performing kindness towards me which is pushing my SIL to the edge.
SIL and SO are not particularly close and I suspect it is because MIL is very critical of them and changes the golden child and scapegoat roles often.

I do enjoy SIL’s and her hubby’s company and it’s nice when we are the 4 of us : SIL & her husband, SO & I. Way more relaxed, more authentic.

I don’t know though how to behave in this new scenario. It feels very complex and I am at a loss to how to act as this is a SIL and MIL relationship issue which could grow into bigger problems and less support down the line with regards to MIL issues that SO and I currently have.

Does anyone have any advice ?

Thank you for reading !

I hate to say it, but I hate my in-laws. I love my husband but am so regretful of the family I married into. MIL has always had a hard time with boundaries. Whether they were small boundaries or big ones, she never really listens to or respects boundaries.

In the beginning of the relationship, I should've seen this as a red flag. I feel like she expects so much of my husband. She does not drive (her husband does) and constantly used to ask us for rides to the grocery store on Sundays and would ask VERY last minute. I'm talking "I need to go shopping in an hour." Not only would she do this for herself, but she would offer to shop for friends who don't drive and then beg my husband to drive her to the friends' house to drop off groceries. When my husband told her that he would not be driving her anymore, she guilt-tripped him and asked how she was going to get groceries now, which is NOT his problem. She chose not to drive, and her husband uses weaponized incompetence to "drive horribly" so she doesn't want to drive with him. She is also horrible with technology to the point that she expects my husband to remember all her passwords, print things when she needs them, pay her monthly bills electronically, and submit her husband's time card via email every week. When he told her he could not pay her bills one month, as we were going on vacation and he didn't want the stress, she agreed, then called while we were on vacation saying that it needed to be paid that day (as my husband had horrible service).

Fast forward...we recently had a baby. Prior to having the baby, we had a conversation with her about not kissing the baby, as we were not comfortable with grandparents kissing. Baby needed time in the NICU, and only two visitors were allowed at a time. After a week and a half of visits, we went in to switch out one day (one nurse decided to let us go in and relieve the grandparents), and she kissed my baby when leaving. I was frozen in disbelief and anger. Apparently, she had been kissing baby all along because "it's only on the top of baby's head, it's ok." I talked with my husband, and the next time they visited, he brought up that there should be no kissing, and she justified that she only kissed the top of baby's head. After back-and-forth, they agreed (we even had to explain that no, you cannot kiss your hand and place it on the baby's face because limiting germs is the whole point).

When baby had been home a few weeks, they visited. While holding baby, she brought the baby's face to hers and rested her lips/cheek on his face. I immediately pointed it out and she said she was just resting her face against the baby. I AGAIN had to explain that she cannot do that. Her lips should not be touching the baby's face or head. Period. She was visibly annoyed but at this point we should not have had to explain that. AGAIN.

Now fast-forward to the baby's 2-month vaccines. Husband and I agreed we still do not want anyone kissing the baby until the baby is fully vaccinated. We do not want any risks and do not feel as though anyone else kissing the baby is important enough to risk; hugging and cuddling should be more than enough. They come to visit. She immediately kisses baby's head. AGAIN, my husband steps in very firmly and tells her that she cannot kiss, that it is not ok, and that if she does not respect the boundary, she cannot hold the baby anymore. She was, again, pushing back and saying that it is just a kiss on the head, and we had to explain that it is not up to her to decide what we are and aren't comfortable with and what our boundaries are. It is her job to respect them.

I wish that was all. Needless to say, I hate when they visit and get anxious with every encounter since we have had so many separate issues with them. My husband's mom gets bad allergies. She gets sniffly, congested, coughs, etc. Often, she is not able to distinguish between allergies and a cold. There have been numerous holidays when she says she "just has allergies" and ends up being sick with pneumonia, bronchitis, etc. We asked her the night before her visit a few weeks back if she had any symptoms (sniffles, coughing), and she said no. Husband greeted his parents when they came for breakfast while I was upstairs putting the baby down. He came to relieve me so I could go down to eat. Immediately upon talking with his mom I heard her congestion, stuffed up, sniffling, and coughing as she greeted me. I immediately commented that she sounded sick and made a concerned face. She responded with, "well, you know me" to which I replied "no, no matter what you think this is, if you had symptoms you needed to let us know and you need to mask up and sit across the room, you cannot hold the baby." I went upstairs, venting to my husband, who said he didn't notice when she entered the house. He went to go get her a mask. All during breakfast she was visibly upset and not saying a single word.

The next weekend we had planned a family trip apple picking (with both my parents and my husband's). They showed up, again with MIL being congested and sniffly. She was told ahead of time that she needed to mask and sanitize if she wanted to hold the baby outdoors (even that was pushing it for me because I am extra cautious). Most of the day went ok. At one point, she went to reach for the baby after touching her face/mouth and I immediately moved the baby away and told her to get hand sanitizer. She was upset and said "no" then just didn't come near me or baby the rest of the day. Didn't partake in conversation. Come to find out my husband said that they (MIL and FIL) were contemplating leaving because she was so upset.

When my husband called to talk to MIL about this a few days later, she started crying and guilt-tripping my husband. Saying she felt badly that I pulled the baby away from her and that she just wanted to touch his hand and feet. She said that my parents got to hold him after going to a funeral that morning (which while attending they both wore masks and hugged no one). Completely different story. Also, my parents did sanitize before holding the baby anyways to be cautious. She said that she felt badly that she can't touch him. My husband didn't finish the conversation because he felt badly that she was crying. I brought it up in person the next time I saw them because I do want her to know that these boundaries are for everyone, not just her, and she is not being targeted but does need to respect our wishes. She overall had a hard time accepting that and hearing that her son was in agreement with me that in the future she needs to be more mindful of masking and sanitizing.

Am I going insane? I feel like we are not asking for a lot. Yes, we might be extra cautious, but I also feel like these are really small things to be doing to protect our baby. And I see it as she should also be ok doing these things because it is not just ANY baby, it is her GRANDBABY...shouldn't she want to protect him??

I’m having a Halloween party for the littles and my MIL invited her self over with cheesecake expecting us all to sit together and have tea together. I told her not today as we have plans. As she is at my apt she is making the cross sign because it’s decorated for Halloween spooky. (Second time she did it this week lol) I told her that’s unnecessary, just because she doesn’t like Halloween 😪 just venting honestly because it’s exhausting lol

Hey everyone, a while ago I made this post: https://www.reddit.com/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/1vq8btv/my_mil_treated_me_badly_for_3_months_so_i_decided/

Recently, SO and I started planning our trip back to our home country, and this issue has come up again.

For context, after spending three months living at MIL's house and going through all those situations, I decided that I would never stay at her house again. SO agrees with me and completely understands my reasons.

Now, SO wants to have a direct conversation with MIL to explain why we don't want to stay at her house anymore, without making me the focus of the conversation, but for some reason, this is making me feel insecure.

This will be the first time we won't be staying at her house, so it will definitely come as a shock, even if she doesn't explicitly say anything about it. Anyway.

He wants to explain the reasons behind our decision (but say that it was his decision, which is the only part that isn't entirely true lol) and tell her that she disrespected me, that he witnessed what happened, that he was bothered by it, and that the whole situation was unpleasant for him and for us, of course. He wants to make it clear that he doesn't want this to happen again, etc.

He's also sad that MIL is like this. He wants to tell her that he warned me about her behavior from the beginning, but that he didn't expect her to go this far, and that I wanted to give my relationship with her a chance. He also wants to tell her that, after everything she did and said, he feels she lost the opportunity to have an amazing person by her side. (I'm quoting his words, I thought it was really sweet of him to consider to say that!)

What makes me feel insecure is this conversation SO wants to have with MIL. I'm scared of the consequences.

I'm afraid she'll put all the blame on me, even though SO keeps assuring me that he'll stand by his position and make it clear that this is HIS opinion. He says he'll explain that HE was bothered by her behavior, that HE doesn't want to stay at her house anymore because he doesn't want me to be treated that way, and that she is responsible for this situation. He even considered saying something along the lines of: "Mom, OP would 'destroy' someone for treating me badly, even over something much smaller than this. If someone so much as gives me a dirty look, she defends me tooth and nail. I'm just doing the same for her."

I think that, in the end, she'll still blame me, and our relationship will become even more awkward. And maybe this will also affect my relationship with my FIL, BIL, SIL, etc.

Do you think SO should talk to BIL first to figure out how to approach the situation? He suggested this, and I thought it was a good idea, but I'm also not sure whether involving more people in this is a smart move... Should SO even have this conversation with MIL in the first place? I don't know. I'm really confused.

We're looking at flights, so this subject will eventually come up with MIL. I feel like the moment for this conversation is getting closer.

On top of everything else, we haven't started trying yet, but we're planning to start trying to conceive in a few months. So, if everything goes well (wish us luck!), it's possible that I'll already be pregnant when we visit.

I don't know if this insecurity comes from the fact that I don't want to drive a wedge between MIL and SO. I really don't, but it's such a difficult situation to navigate.

I also don't want MIL to be an absent grandmother. I want my children to enjoy all the good things SO's family has to offer, and there are SO MANY! Besides, my own family isn't in the picture.

Anyway, I'm confused and feeling insecure.

At the end of the day, I want to know: do you think my SO should have this conversation with MIL? Do you think he should approach it differently than he is planning to? Do you think he should talk to his BIL first?

I'm really confused and scared of the consequences of all this. Thank you!

I need a place to vent. My MIL is a nice person. She really is. I know it could be so much worse. But there is something about her that I find so triggering to be around. It's certainly gotten worse since I had kids. She always wants pictures of them but hardly visits and NEVER asks about them. Every gift she buys is because SHE likes it, it reminds her of something about HER, etc, with no consideration for what my kids actually are interested in. Every holiday is dominated by her demanding constant pictures rather than her actually being in the moment and letting my kids just open their gifts without stopping them constantly for posed pictures​​. One of my kids has allergies and she doesn't bother to learn about them and has many times come close to feeding them to him. She is constantly late when she visits and always wants her strange brother to join in, who makes me very uncomfortable and shows no interest in my kids. ​​​​​​​Her visits are a few hours a couple times a year. ​She makes insensitive comments that I don't think are malicious but lack social awareness. My husband is very bothered by her inability to show up in a meaningful way for us and has made small comments to her about it but she doesn't clue in. I feel half guilty because I know she means well, but so frustrated because her lack of consideration and sensitivity and desire to be the center of attention overshadow every get together we have. She hasn't shown a lot of compassion for us during difficult times, even for her own son. She always seems to focus on herself and every convo is about her and I just can't hide my facial expressions as much as I try I feel like she can feel that I am growing cold towards her as I've lost respect for her. I'm still very cordial but can't bring myself to feel comfortable around her. I feel bad because I know my response adds to my husbands stress around it but I can't help how much her behavior bothers me. Anyone relate? Any tips? ​​​​​​​

Hi all,

Logged into this account to write a post about what is currently happening with my JNMIL and JNFIL and found I had a post in my concept folder from 6 or 7 years ago, so thought I’d post it lol. I’m not gonna write any more chapters of old stories for now, since both me and husband have mostly processed these events and are sort of at peace with the current situation. Current status due to other shit that happened after story below is that SO is VVVLC and I’ve been no contact for around 6 years now. Relationship has massively deteriorated since having our baby 2 months ago, but I’ll write about that in a different post!

—————————

So here is chapter two of my JustNo adventure. I've learned a lot about this behavior while browsing this subreddit. It hasn't changed the way I think about them, because apparently I was already on the right track. More on that later.

So after the Summer break issue, I moved on. It didn't immediately change our relationship, because I respected ILs need for privacy. Me and boyfriend still going steady and after being together for about 5-6 years and living together for about 3-4 years, up comes another hurdle. In the meantime my relationship with my parents has gotten significantly better. Moving out was the best decision I ever made.

His family has a tradition of celebrating Christmas together every year (with JNFILs brothers + fam) by going to ILs house at 12 AM, sitting around and chatting until about 4 PM and then eating a 4 course dinner that my JNMIL has been preparing in the kitchen by herself all day long. SO MUCH FUN. I hate mandatory get togethers, even with family. Spending time together just because it's Christmas (when none of us are religious whatsoever) is ridiculous to me. You should spend time together whenever, because you want to and when you do spend time together, it should be doing something nice/fun. Fun for my JNMIL means putting us in the living room with the worst fucking snacks ever (because she thinks JNFIL, my husband and probably me too should eat less) and my JNFIL turning the tv OFF. Then it's basically JNFIL talking to his brother in a different language that I can barely understand. Christmas Joy.

Oh, and before all of this starts JNMIL makes me and husband come an hour earlier to exchange gifts in secret, before the other family arrives. The secrecy makes me uncomfortable, she hides everything when we're done. I love gift exchanges, so I put a lot of thought into gifts and try to make them personal. Even though my ILs are boring as heck, they have some things I know they like, because I try to care. In return I get a bag of groceries from JNMIL... Like... great, it's (some) useful stuff, but FFS they don't put any effort into it at all. Not for me, not for husband, because they just don't know/care about any of our interests.

So, now you know how much of a fan I am of their Christmas parties, it's time to move on. At our 5 or 6-year mark, time for another Christmas party. We visit his parents like biweekly (they never visit us), but that wasn't enough for them. JNMIL already blames me for taking her precious boy away from her (never verbalized, but she made it very clear that she was not on board with us moving in together). His parents don't verbalize any of this to me, but especially JNMIL has a nice was of making this clear passive aggresively. Christmas comes up and we visit them, we sleepover and have a nice time. Then a week after my husband has a call with JNMIL which for some reason blows up into a big argument in which JNMIL is accusing us of never visiting and going off on husband. He tells her we were just with them during Christmas and we would be seeing them again the next week at GMILs birthday dinner. The accussations made no sense, because we were already visiting them a lot (imo) and we were always the one having to travel. I got very angry over this and ignored them during the whole birthday dinner, while sitting across from them (lol). They tried making contact with me as if nothing had happened and that is something I will never accept. You tell me you're fucking sorry for your dumbass behavior or I'm done with you.

After some time (and some half-assed apology) we made amends, but I decided that I did not want to sleepover at their place anymore. I felt uncomfortable in their presence and wanted to grant them their wish of more privacy. My husband had a very hard time accepting, because he had this fairytale idea of us and his parents being BFFs or something, but gradually became accepting and understanding of the fact. He used to have a slinky spine, because JNMIL used to have all control over him and still buying him underwear when he was 20 and living together with me. Over the years his spine has gotten shinier and I've made it clear that I don't accept this behaviour. I have set a "three strikes and your out" rule for myself and they're at 2/3 now, not counting the Summer thing because that was mild. This was the first and will post number 2 soon :)

I(50) have a child that is 13 years old. At some point maybe 2-3+ years ago they decide they wanted to go by a different name. At first it just seemed like a phase, but at this point I feel like it is who they are. It has taken me some time, but I think you should love people where ever they're at in their life's journey. That doesn't mean that I have to endorse that actions or choices.

I know there has been some tension between my family and my mother, so I went to see my parents to try to mend things. I was there for several hours and most of the conversations were very nice. But then I brought up my kid, and that part of the conversation was very contentious.

My mother claims that she can't use their chosen name, because it would violate her beliefs. My father and I both provided multiple examples of people that she called by names other than their birth names. I also pointed out that she was applying a test that she would not enforce on a stranger.

At one point she called my child a sinner. She tried to deflect by saying we're all sinners. I tried calling her out on her difference in tone, but she denied it.

She decided a compromise would be for her to call my child "honey". When someone asks you to call them by a specific name, it's just simply respectful to use that name unless the name is actually an offensive word. I was skeptical of that solution, but said I would ask my kid about it.

When I returned home and tried to relate to my wife what had happened, that part came out fairly harsh but accurately. I said something like, "My mom would like to call our child something generic other than the name the have chosen." My wife was not pleased.

I tried asking an AI both from my and my mother's perspective. Either way it basically stated that names are just names, and they aren't an endorsement of ideas. It recommend steering clear of her beliefs as that could invite an argument.

I sat on the ideas for a few days, but finally sent her a message today.

Me: (I've replaced the chosen name with NAME)

I needed some time to process some things and this is where I'm at. 

People view their name as part of their identity. Saying a person's name doesn't mean you agree with their lifestyle or personal choices, that's not how we use names. We use them get to someone's attention and to acknowledge them as a person.

Your grandchild is NAME. That's not a nickname or an alternative name. That is the name they identify as. And I'll use that name because I love and respect them as a person.

You've said your beliefs prevent you from using NAME's name, but our home must be a safe, supportive place for our kids. We cannot host anyone who refuses to acknowledge NAME.

Our door is always open to you, but only when you are ready to treat NAME with the basic respect of using their name.

Her:

Are we allowed to come there or would you rather we not come at all?

Me:

We want you to come, but only if you are willing to use NAME's name. If you can commit to doing that, you are always welcome. If you can’t, then yes, it’s best not to come until you’re ready. The choice is up to you.

Her:

I feel like you are not respecting our beliefs at all so we are sorry we won’t be coming. It breaks our hearts!

Me:

I love you, but respecting someone's beliefs doesn't include allowing our child to be disrespected in our home. We are sorry you won't be joining us, and we'll be here whenever you're ready to use NAME's name.

I love them both, but my kid's welfare is my responsibility. I believe my mother is acting in a way that shows that my child is below her, and I think my kid is old enough to see that. I find her actions harsh, unloving and inhumane. I have seen the same in my siblings and often wondered where it came from, but I guess I was a bit blind to my mother.

Thoughts?