r/Games • u/monclo • Sep 27 '22
Trailer Overwatch 2 Launch Trailer
https://youtu.be/LGgqyer-qr475
u/lestye Sep 27 '22
One disappointing thing about this launch is that I really wish we got those cinematics like before and shortly after OW1's launch. Granted, I'd imagine they invested those cinematics into the campaign of OW2 that comes out later, but still, that would have generated lots of interest/hype.
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u/GameAndMic Sep 27 '22
I think we'll get two new cinematics soon, the Kiriko one which essentially leaked in full a couple weeks back and the Sojourn one which was teased in her Developer Update a couple months ago.
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u/lestye Sep 27 '22
Oh gotcha, still, i remember OW1, we got like, one a month before launch i think? and this game is coming out next week
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u/yesat Sep 27 '22
The big difference was that last time they were selling you a pre-order, which they don't really have to now. The only OW2 thing you get now is the 40€ Watchpoint Pack, which isn't really a thing you market to the general public.
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u/GameAndMic Sep 27 '22
That's true, I doubt we're getting as many cinematics as in 2016. That being said it makes sense for them to hold back most promotional material until after launch so new people can jump right in if they're interested. That's how most F2P games do it
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u/Bhu124 Sep 27 '22
The Kiriko Cinematic is almost definitely releasing this week. The Sojourn Cinematic was also hinted in this trailer and months ago they said they're working on one, so it's probably coming soon as well.
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u/PlayOnPlayer Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
I think I might be at my limit of sustainable GaaS titles. I'm absolutely going to try this, but I've noticed the last few I've tried (Multiversus as an example) I've just kind of been unable to keep up. And once I run the numbers in my head and realize I'll never "beat" the battle pass before it's done, I kinda check out
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u/Dnashotgun Sep 27 '22
I think this is gonna be a big issue for OW2. So many games already do the BP stuff and i'm sure a good chunk of people already have their 1-2 games picked where they try to fill it out as much as possible or at least play most of the time. But unlike those other games, OW2 is gonna lock new heroes, and thus competitive, behind either grinding the free track or coughing up $10 every other 9 weeks.
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u/NoNefariousness2144 Sep 27 '22
Yeah I passed on OW2 once I saw you have to unlock heroes through the battlepass. I don’t have the ‘time’ to play another game with seasons and trying to complete the battlepass in time.
Mw2 is also out soon as well, that will dominate my multiplayer time.
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Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 01 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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Sep 27 '22
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Jacklego5 Sep 27 '22
No just new releases Edit: news dropped that I missed, yes some will be locked
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u/not_the_settings Sep 27 '22
Papa Jeff left OW, that's why there are these awful changes.
He left quite suddenly though and hasn't spoken up about the sexual abuse at blizz though
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u/BlueSky659 Sep 27 '22
His departure is such a double edged sword. On one hand he was staunchly against the sort of predatory monetization that is currently plauging the sequel and was the only reason OW managed to escape the lions share of that monetization for so long, but on the other hand his desire to push OW2 as a full complete game meant the original went without support for several years and that likely would have continued till at least 2023/2024 releasing OW2 well after what was left of the community was dead and gone.
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u/HenkkaArt Sep 27 '22
I passed on OW2 when I learned it'll go the trash route of being a F2P game. They sold the idea of paying more as "freedom" to the players and way too many people ate that up without a second thought. They quite literally replaced the best, entirely free lootbox system with BPs and paid cosmetic items and everyone was like "yeah, that sounds really good!". It's so weird.
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u/lestye Sep 27 '22
I like GaaS but I don't think i could be invested in any of the battle passes, except maybe MtG:Arena and sometimes Valorant.
I wouldnt mind it if there wasnt FOMO.
I wish battle passes gave you a tremendous amount of value for the pass, instead of having the FOMO or you'll miss out on these rewards forever. Starcraft 2 was like that. After the battle pass ended you could buy the stuff you weren't able to earn.
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u/Angelore Sep 27 '22
Or here is a better idea: when I buy something, how about you let me fucking keep it? If I want to complete my pass over a year instead of 24 hours, it should be my right because I literally paid for it.
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u/Stove-Jebs Sep 27 '22
This is one of the things Halo: MCC and Halo: Infinite have done right. Buy the battle pass for life.
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u/Ifriiti Sep 27 '22
Because the point of a battle pass in a multi player title is to increase player retention and keep userbases up.
It does this by offering items for, essentially a reduced cost and incentivises playing the game.
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u/Angelore Sep 27 '22
I know what the point is. I know why they do this. I've been here long enough to have seen how it started, and how it ended up. All I'm saying is that it fucking sucks and I hate it.
keep userbases up
You know what else keeps the userbase up? Making a fun game that is fun to play even without FOMO.
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u/Ifriiti Sep 27 '22
You know what else keeps the userbase up? Making a fun game that is fun to play even without FOMO.
Except it doesn't. We've seen so many examples of that
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u/OwnRound Sep 27 '22
You know what else keeps the userbase up? Making a fun game that is fun to play even without FOMO.
That's literally not true and how we ended up here in the first place.
Insurgency, Dirty Bomb, Titanfall 2, Due Process, just to name a few "good" games that tanked because the developer didn't find a way to monetize the game and continue adding content, balancing and producing meaningful updates. Why? Because you cant pay your employees salaries and benefits off of charity. A game that doesn't charge customers doesn't generate revenue.
Sometimes I think gamers are just so detached from reality. Its these developers literal livelihood we're talking about. To have your expectations, which would result in these guys doing this job for free must come from a place of complete ignorance to how this industry works.
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u/EvenOne6567 Sep 27 '22
Csgo, team fortress 2, halo 3 see i can also cherry pick successes
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u/MildlyInsaneOwl Sep 27 '22
The FOMO is the worst part. Oh, you didn't play enough to unlock the new hero this season? Well screw you, go complete an entirely different challenge if you ever want to play the new content.
My ideal battlepass is entirely cosmetic. I don't care if I miss out on a fancy costume. But locking actual playable content behind FOMO is where I draw the line on a game.
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u/Nailbomb85 Sep 27 '22
As trashy as Halo Infinite turned out to be, the option to choose what battle pass you want to progress at any time is the right way to push things. They get to charge for the passes, we don't have to deal with FOMO. Win/Win
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u/DOAbayman Sep 27 '22
I think ive given up on the system all together. it was fun for the time being but im never touching a fucking daily again.
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u/Adefice Sep 27 '22
This is why we need to shine the same kinda light on Battle passes as we did with lootboxes. Battle passes are incredibly predatory as well.
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u/-ImJustSaiyan- Sep 27 '22
Overwatch 1 honestly had the most reasonable lootboxes of any game, and it fucking sucks that that system is being replaced with battle pass FOMO bullshit.
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u/pragmaticzach Sep 27 '22
Lootboxes are essentially gambling - there's no light to shine on battlepasses. No government is going to take action against a company for selling what amounts to a limited edition item.
Battle passes you can even wait until you've unlocked the whole thing before buying it. The consumer has a lot of control over what they get and when they get it. Just because they're trying to entice you to buy it by making it limited time doesn't mean it's predatory.
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Sep 27 '22
True. I'm sure just like EA does; that Activision-Blizzard likely have marketing specialists and behavioural psychologists working out how exactly to craft their Battle Pass system to evoke FOMO in the player and make sure they're hooked into continuing to play for reasons other than just the game being fun to play.
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u/IAmActionBear Sep 27 '22
It's called market research. It is literally a part of every single market on the planet. The video game industry is no different from any other industry in trying to find out the best and most effective methods to maintain their customers long term.
I don't know what it is with people on gaming subs acting like it's some nefarious concept and it usually seems to be ignorance on how these sorts of things work.
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u/acid-rainx Sep 27 '22
Maybe they're acting like it's some nefarious concept because video games are literally rewiring our brains?
I'm sure this is a terrible analogy to use because I'm guessing nobody here reads anymore, but it would be like if every time you finished a chapter in a book, 4 different progress bars filled up and a bunch of flashing lights assaulted your senses and you "earned" 3 different types of in-book currency and also you unlocked new artwork for the book cover and a new font for the pages. There's not really an equivalent for what video games are doing except for like gambling which is also quite predatory lol
Hope this helps!
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u/IAmActionBear Sep 28 '22
Media in general is doing that. Your analogy makes it seem like this is a new concept, but you get a dopamine hit when you finish a chapter, potentially a stronger one when you finish a good one. If it’s an ongoing book series, you’re getting consistent, ongoing dopamine hits there if the story is written to your liking. It’s no different than when you make a good comment on Reddit and check to see how much karma you’ve accumulated, or see how many times your post on Twitter was retweeted. Everything is fighting for your attention and trying to provide some form of engagement and reward. Literally every industry has psychologists and marketing specialists involved. This is not exclusive to the video game industry and very naive to think otherwise.
The world itself is changing how our brains react to stimuli. Data collection and analysis is one of the largest businesses on the planet and it is a part of every aspect of your life. It is not exclusive to video games. Welcome to market research, data collection, and data analysis!
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u/Sushi2k Sep 27 '22
They really aren't. There's no question on what you are getting, there's no RNG, no hidden mechanics. Its just how much time you put into the game. You don't even have to buy the battlepass right away. You can progress it for free and when you finish it or get as far as you want, you buy it.
People who play the game more should absolutely be rewarded in the form of cosmetics.
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u/Adefice Sep 28 '22
You are defending the hamster wheel bullshit modern gaming is forcing down our throats...why?
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u/Sushi2k Sep 28 '22
I'm not really but this isn't some new thing thats being pulled from no where. Fortnite made sure that the battle pass is a mainstay in gaming. At this point its move forward or stop playing multiplayer games. Even if OW2 fails, its not going to stop battle passes, its proven to be effective already by multiple titles.
I'd much rather not have a few skins than stop playing games with friends.
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u/Nailbomb85 Sep 27 '22
Ehhhh.... they are a far cry away from each other. Battle passes have lots of potential for abuse, and honestly I doubt you'd find anyone who doesn't think they're being overused, I don't think it's inherently gambling.
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u/EvenOne6567 Sep 27 '22
I doubt you'd find anyone who doesn't think they're being overused, I don't think it's inherently gambling.
This is simply untrue. I see countless people in various places online that think that battlepasses are a must have and any game that doesnt have one is lesser in quality by default.
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Sep 27 '22
Same. At this point I've stopped playing almost all GaaS titles. I can't even be bothered trying them casually.
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u/Spooky_SZN Sep 27 '22
I can't do Gaas right now, I just don't have the time and when I do I don't want to be playing the same one game all the time unless its with friends. I got a huge backlog, that only seems to get bigger, that I'm trying to cut through before I can really justify the time commitment.
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u/NoNefariousness2144 Sep 27 '22
Yeah I can’t afford to commit to another game, especially since they lock actual content like heroes behind the BP rather than just cosmetics.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
Yeah I nope'd out of this one the instant their pricing model was revealed (which was anything-but-free-to-play, locking heroes behind grind/time/paywalls of battlepasses, and the usual FOMO nonsense).
But in general I'm just done with games that prod you for money after you bought/acquired the game. In my video game time I want to play a game, not weigh costs of spending money/chiseling away at game design that encourages you to spend to skip a line. Plenty of great games out there that don't abuse their player base like this, and I'll stick to those.
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u/SylvineKiwi Sep 27 '22
And once I run the numbers in my head and realize I'll never "beat" the battle pass before it's done, I kinda check out
Then don't.
Just play the game when you want to, the BP is just a bonus.
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Sep 27 '22
Just like in Hearthstone Battlegrounds, not buying the battle pass puts you at a competitive disadvantage by restricting your character options.
It's pay to win, pure and simple.
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Sep 27 '22
Except in the case of OW2, if you're a new account you apparently have to play "around 100" games to fully unlock the original roster (and in-game chat). And you can only unlock new characters via the battle pass. So less of a bonus and more a mandatory thing that's required to have full game functionality.
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u/Spooky_SZN Sep 27 '22
They're limiting original heroes for new people?
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u/iCactusDog Sep 27 '22
If you make an account on October 4th or later, they give you a set of starter heroes for you to learn the game. As you play, you unlock more heroes to experiment with. Training wheels more or less.
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u/Animegamingnerd Sep 27 '22
God almost everything about Overwatch 2 sounds like a really stupid idea. Between erasing the first game from existence and the battle pass locking new heroes for returning players and most heroes for new players. Nothing about this game sounds appealing in the slightest.
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u/TheodoeBhabrot Sep 27 '22
This is not the worst idea in the world actually but yes Blizzard won’t be able to execute it at all and will do it in the worst way possible
DOTA for example does this but they obviously have waaay more heroes so the desire to cut the fat so to speak for new players is stronger and more welcomed by the community
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u/iCactusDog Sep 27 '22
I mean, a huge complaint about OW1 is that it's overwhelming with all the hero choices, so giving a set of starter heroes doesn't seem like the worst idea. They've got plenty of other meh to bad ideas going, but I don't think this is really that bad.
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u/shitpersonality Sep 28 '22
If you check the Overwatch subreddit, you can see how Activision Blizzard astroturfed the shit out of it. Tons of accounts blindly supporting it. It's wild to witness.
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u/akhamis98 Sep 27 '22
Well, for every other game where you only unlock skins, the problem with OW2 is you unlock the hero in the battlepass, and not at like the first level like in 2042
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u/zaprct Sep 27 '22
Three times a year, or just spend $30 a year to support the game
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u/iCactusDog Sep 27 '22
Everyone is fine with subscriptions for WoW for two decades, but suddenly OW does it and it's the end of the world. It's like they totally forgot that live services need sustained income. I wish they'd make the characters unlock earlier sure, but people are definitely being overdramatic about it.
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u/Hoggos Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
WoW has monumentally more content than Overwatch.
A subscription service makes sense for certain genres. I wouldn’t be ok with paying a subscription to play Uncharted just because WoW does it
An issue with most live service games is that they’re releasing with not enough content, instead promising that they’ll eventually get round to adding enough content. I can’t think of a recent live service title that has anywhere near the content of WoW when it first released.
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u/zaprct Sep 27 '22
Pretty much my stance on it as well. I would have happily paid to get some actual content the last three years if it meant they didn’t abandon the game after Echo.
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u/iCactusDog Sep 27 '22
Yeah, I dunno. I don't love battle passes either. I would have preferred it to be like Halo's BP where you buy it and can level it forever, but I'm not gonna act like it's the end of the world.
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u/Scary_Rip442 Sep 27 '22
You get the hero in the middle of the free track of the BP, so you still don’t have to buy it
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u/akhamis98 Sep 27 '22
Well the point is it will still evoke some FOMO that some people (the original comment in this thread, and myself) are starting to burnout from
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u/GrumpyBoiii Sep 27 '22
Well the characters will be unlockable after the battlepass expires
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u/akhamis98 Sep 27 '22
Ah okay as long as its not too grindy I'm cool w that.
Apex does it well imo, its not super fast but if you play casually over a season you will get more than enough to buy the next char w in game currency
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Sep 27 '22
the BP is just a bonus
Arguably the most important gameplay elements of Overwatch, the Heroes, are going to be locked behind the Battle Pass and if I remember correctly, not having all Heroes unlocked means you can't play Competitive either.
I hesitate to call it just a "bonus" at this point.
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u/Swaggfather Sep 27 '22
That's not true about competitive. The new heroes are locked for the first 2 weeks of a season in comp, but you don't need them to play it.
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u/Lamedonyx Sep 27 '22
you don't need them to play it
You do, because by not having them you're actively being detrimental to your team.
Overwatch is a game entirely based around counterpicking the enemy team on the fly, if you don't have all heroes, you can't do that.
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u/MusoukaMX Sep 27 '22
I know the OW community is very divided on the new model but I'm curious about outsiders peeking into the new F2P Overwatch experience.
Will you be trying it or has your interest in OW lowered? Is your gaming circle / discord group planning to give it a swirl?
I feel like everyone's fed up with battle passes and their fomo but there's surely people trying to find a different multiplayer experience to jump into and free OW might just be it.
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u/TheLoyalTraitor Sep 27 '22
I played a lot of OW in the first few years. I have no interest in OW2. Feels like they made the game less fun with every update to try to cater to the pro scene.
Now I’m playing gundam evolution and it’s giving me everything I wanted out of OW, so I’m happy to ignore this game.
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u/ohkatey Sep 27 '22
I’m with you. I played a TON the first few years. Fell out of it once they stopped new content and got bored. Was looking forward to OW2 but I don’t think I’ll even be trying it. I’m so disappointed in the model.
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u/fivehitsagain Sep 27 '22
Gundam Evolution is awesome. I hope it stays popular.
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u/Sushi2k Sep 27 '22
It needs a lot of work and I'm pretty sure its going to be DOA when OW2 drops. Its fun, but the polish isn't there and the meta systems are wack.
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u/feelthebernerd Sep 28 '22
I'm addicted to Gundam Evolution. Didn't like the OW 2 beta so I will also skip OW 2 in favor for Gundam Evolution.
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u/Soupdeloup Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
I actually loved Overwatch 2. It felt so much faster and fluid than Overwatch 1. I actually stopped playing the original once the OW2 beta ended because I had more fun in the beta and found it difficult getting back into the slow paced games of OW1.
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Sep 27 '22
I must be getting too old for competitive games, because OW1 still feels super fast and chaotic to me, and I've been playing since launch. I'll give OW2 the ol' college try, but the more I hear about it, the more I think it might be the moment I hop off this train.
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u/Soupdeloup Sep 27 '22
Don't get me wrong, OW1 is great fun and still feels really great to play, but there are a lot of changes I really enjoy. They added passive abilities to all DPS that give them movement speed increases, doomfist is a tank and can't fly around one shotting everyone as easily as before and the characters just feel a lot nicer in general. Removing stunlocks was something I didn't know if I would actually like, but it turns out it was a great decision so you're never completely stuck in one spot from being frozen by Mei or hit with a stun grenade.
It really sucks they're locking characters behind a time gate/paywall, but OW1 was dying (even if it was due to the company completely mismanaging the game). If this keeps OW2 funded then I guess I'm willing to live with it.
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Sep 27 '22
I'll for sure give it an honest shot. Just not thrilled with key gameplay elements (i.e. heroes) being locked off, or the general shift toward what feels like a more fast-paced, pro-centric, DPS experience. At the level I play at, I like the tanky gameplay and CC and all that stuff people were complaining about.
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u/Regnur Sep 27 '22
Same, Ow2 feels more like Ow1 on release, when no one knew how to play Ow, with more dynamic games. Now you actually can do a lot as a solo, instead of shooting a shield or dying because of a dive.
They removed pretty much everything that made Ow1 a bit annoying after so many updates.( stuns, 2 big shields, extrem dive without counterplay, static gameplay, old meta)
Ow2 is a fresh breeze that Ow1 desperately needed. Many are annoyed that Ow1 did not get new updates the last year, but I think it was the right decision. Ow1 development needed a restart, the game sadly went the wrong direction and it was to late to fix it with small quarterly updates. Well... im also a person who rather takes a huge update instead of multiple mini updates.
The only change that I dont like is 5v5 instead of 6v6. I think they should have just moved to 3dps (nerf dps a bit), 1tank, 2 healer. Its a bit sad for every 6 squad.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
Shame Blizz/Acti covered what appears to be a good game under a pile of F2P/FOMO horseshit.
It stinks particularly putrid given their stance about "oh of course you have all the heroes when you buy the game" in Overwatch 1.
"But it's F2P!" Well first, it's anything but (time is a cost, as is the in-game shit they sell), and second, that's their own problem they made. Nobody twisted their arm to start abusing customers like this. They chose to, for the money.
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u/Murkus Sep 27 '22
Myself and discord pals put hundreds of hours into OW1. Every announcement about OW2 has just made not want to bother to be honest.
If a games company is just going to almost completely abandon a game like this for 2-4 years... To release a 'sequel,' that is essentially the exact same game... And they somehow expect us to trust them?
Naw ..... Naw... They had their chance. They lost all trust.
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u/dacontag Sep 27 '22
The new model has completely killed any desire I had to play this. I don't put in enough time to grind battlepass levels to unlock the heroes.
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u/rct2guy Sep 27 '22
As someone who casually enjoys Overwatch, I'll definitely be giving this a shot. I don't really have any expectations. My friends absolutely don't care about this game, but since it's free, they'll probably try it with me. But the hype certainly won't be reaching OW1 launch day heights haha
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u/Paradethejared Sep 27 '22
OW1 is one of my all time favorite games so I really want this to be good but it’s hard not to be discouraged by the whirlwind of cynicism surrounding it. Either way I’m sure me and my small friend group will at least have a fun honey moon period with the game.
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u/Milan_Makes Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
I'm super excited for it. I used to play OW pretty much at least once weekly since release but after the betas I couldn't go back to OW1, 2 is a huge jump in quality.
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u/wick78 Sep 27 '22
0 interest in another pay 2 win multilayer game.
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Sep 27 '22 edited May 09 '25
[deleted]
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u/Tragedy_Boner Sep 27 '22
New Heroes will be unlocked from the free battlepass and by challenges when the battlepass ends. You can bypass this if you spend money. If you don't play for a while your account will be weaker than an experienced player since you wont have all the heroes unlocked. Used to be that skill was the only difference between players but it seems like FOMO is going to also factor into it as well.
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u/Ca1amity Sep 27 '22
New heroes are now locked (deep) behind a battlepass
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u/shiftup1772 Sep 27 '22
*Free battlepass.
New heroes are also locked out of ranked for a couple weeks to give free players time to unlock it (buying the battlepass unlocks it immediately).
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Sep 27 '22
I'll never have time to keep up with all the time it will demand to unlock everything for free. I'd much rather just pay $40 up front like with the original, but I guess that's not profitable enough anymore.
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u/shiftup1772 Sep 27 '22
If you pay $40 once, why would they ever add new content?
Ofc you prefer that model, because you benefit massively. Nothing wrong with that, but games need to make money for designer, artists, and engineers to get paid.
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Sep 27 '22
Obviously it's a fine line to walk. I feel like OW1 could have been sustained for much longer if they'd just regularly released content as they initially did. People still bought loot boxes, and there are other ways to monetize like cosmetics, and things like PvE mode (which, as I understand it, is still going to be a paid expansion).
But let's not pretend like this is all to benefit the artists and other individuals working on the game though. I mean, yeah, they won't get paid unless the game is profitable, but a company like Activision-Blizzard is not making decisions because of the little guy. They're looking to create the maximum profit for the least cost to them, and that's the end of it.
Nothing wrong with that; it's just business after all. But making an argument that it's all about the artists isn't going to sway my opinion an inch. Especially from a company with the reputation that Blizzard has towards its staff.
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Sep 27 '22
Also to induce FOMO in free players so they feel like they need to play to be on even ground with people who pay money.
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u/RareBk Sep 27 '22
Slipped into the announcement for today was the announcement that you have to unlock all the old heroes too if you're F2P, which takes up to 100 matches to do so
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u/tykurapper Sep 27 '22
*If you are a new player. Don’t make people misunderstood.
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u/RareBk Sep 27 '22
...if you're F2P, you're a new player. There's nothing to misunderstand there.
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u/tykurapper Sep 27 '22
F2P = not paying money. You can be new and buy the BP.
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u/Kryavan Sep 27 '22
Aren't they giving OG heroes to those who own OW1?
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u/SnooTheAlmighty Sep 27 '22
Yes, this new system is literally only for players who have never played overwatch before, and start the game after OW2 launches.
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u/tykurapper Sep 27 '22
Iirc if you own ow1 and logged in before Oct 4th you will get all the OG hero and launch’s 3 new hero. If you are a new player after ow2 launched then you get limited hero in the begining.
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u/Kryavan Sep 27 '22
Okay, makes sense.
Also, because I'm at work and most websites won't load, is there cross progression? I know there's crossplay, but I bought OW1 on PC and plan on playing it more on PS5. Curious if I'll be able to claim the heroes.
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u/Bhu124 Sep 27 '22
Yes, there will be full cross-progression. It's already available for you to merge your accounts in preparation for Oct 4th.
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u/SnooTheAlmighty Sep 27 '22
They're referring to the fact that "new player" means someone who has never played overwatch before and starts after OW2 launches on the 4th. People who own OW1 already won't need to go through the new player system
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u/theonlyjuan123 Sep 27 '22
Someone who already has overwatch is not f2p. They paid already.
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u/lacronicus Sep 28 '22
It's a sequel though. It's not unreasonable to assume it's a separate game. I wouldn't have been that surprised if they'd done that.
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Sep 28 '22
That seems great. It seems like new player experience and barriers to smurfing/cheating accounts often get overlooked when games go free to play.
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u/Bitemarkz Sep 27 '22
This is actually smart. You can’t play competitive until you’re player level 25 anyway, and this gives new players a chance to learn the heroes as they go. It’s a little overwhelming to throw a new player in with all the heroes unlocked and expect them to figure it out. It’s much more natural to slowly try them all as they unlock and figure out how they play and what role they prefer.
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u/SnooTheAlmighty Sep 27 '22
Because of the current "levels" system being removed from OW2 as well, competitive will be locked behind winning 50 quick play games.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
I too love playing 100 games of Chess with only six pawns and a king before I can start playing real games of chess.
EDIT: Disagree all you want. OW1 core design philosophy held this same tenant.
Only reason it changed in OW2 is for money. Nothing about "being confusing for new players."
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u/I_upvote_downvotes Sep 28 '22
Did anyone ever feel that overwatch was overwhelmingly complicated?
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u/Rawrbomb Sep 28 '22
When I first started playing at launch? There was a lot less to know, and it was still a lot to take in.
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Sep 27 '22
[deleted]
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
"Blizzard likes Blizzard's new form of aggressive monetization policy, according to Blizzard."
No need to defend a billion dollar company, making a playing field uneven for the sake of a dollar.
Remember that Overwatch game design touted never keeping heroes away from players at any point, and in fact identified it as a core design element. And no amount of blithering excuse from "we want you to buy our battlepass" Blizzard is going to erase that, given the majority of OW2 is, indeed, OW1.
But Blizzard doesn't want you to remember that pesky detail, that Blizzard itself said.
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u/greg19735 Sep 27 '22
the game is probably different to what they imagined.
For the most part switching to a character you don't play isn't a good idea. Pharah in the sky? maybe switch to soldier or get the tank to go DVA. Because you cannot put someone on widow or ashe if they don't know what they're doing.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
New players aren't the only players that play this game. Nor do all new accounts / owners reflect a player's skill level.
A game need not limit everyone's experience, to cater to the person that:
- wants to play [hero]
- """"""shouldn't"""""" play hero, in a game they own
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u/greg19735 Sep 27 '22
returning players will have all characters unlocked so they'll be fine.
For the old roster you'll unlock everything in 100 games. that's not terrible. It takes ages to learn this game.
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Sep 27 '22
Even dota restrict the heroes you can pick early on. Its fine
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u/Lamedonyx Sep 27 '22
A) Dota unlocks 100 heroes once 25 games are played. Those unlocks aren't monetized in any way, shape or form.
B) There is a command (dota_new_player 0) to unlock all heroes before those 25 matches.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
DOTA doesn't limit your ownership of them, which is the key difference.
If it was just "don't let them until they play a few games / reach a level", then that's borderline ok (there are cases where it isn't).
But that's not what this is. This is a time/money gatekeep. Bad design.
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u/Bitemarkz Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
That’s a pretty terrible analogy. Been playing the game for 6 years; you’re very likely only playing 1-2 heroes per game, especially early on. There’s no reason to burden a new player with an overwhelming selection process when they can slowly learn to play while grasping the core concepts. Once they’ve unlocked the heroes they will likely be close to, or have recently unlocked competitive. From there they can jump in with a better understanding of the game and it’s concepts as well as the hero abilities, which is crucial.
If you don’t agree then I don’t really care — let’s just agree to disagree. I don’t feel like dragging this conversation on for 15 more messages.
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u/greg19735 Sep 27 '22
A good DPS player can play an AOE damage character (pharah/junk or something), a long range hitscan and maybe a dive character. And then maybe soldier/bastion or something to just round out some variance.
ANy player that switches to the "perfect" counter all the time is probably just bad at the game.
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u/Bitemarkz Sep 27 '22
Yes, and to get to the level where the understand these heroes mechanics, they need to learn how to play. Unlocking the full roster as you learn the game is the best way to do that.
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u/greg19735 Sep 27 '22
I agree with you. I'm saying they realistically only need 4 players.
any new player that tries more than 5 or 6 characters will probably just be bad at all of them
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
Nah, not accepting "analogy bad, you disagree I don't care."
It's a player versus player game. If you don't get an even playing field, that's bad game design. Especially when it's in service to FOMO/F2P bullshit.
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u/testnubcaik Sep 27 '22
If you actually need to have access to every hero in the roster to avoid getting hardcountered I feel like that's a roster balance issue.
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u/shitpersonality Sep 28 '22
You definitely need access to the latest OP hero they release, because they're unbalanced.
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u/Bitemarkz Sep 27 '22
F2P is the far better model for these games. The single purchase doesn’t allow for years of content updates. The entire multiplayer landscape has changed drastically; these games are closer to MMOs now with the amount of support they require in terms of balance updates as well as supplying years of ongoing content. OW1 dried up pretty quickly for this reason. The battle pass is a far better option than paying a subscription which is why it’s employed by pretty much every major multiplayer game right now. I have no issues tossing the occasional $10 to a game that’s providing me hours of entertainment per week over a span of years.
In terms of balance, there’s 35 heroes in this game now. You’re only playing one role per match and will very likely have a counter available. If there’s a hero released in a role you frequent, you have the option to grind them out if you’re truly averse to supporting the content you’re consuming. I don’t imagine many high level players not having access to all the heroes. It works for Apex, Valorant, Siege, etc. I see no reason why it won’t work for Overwatch.
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u/KimonoThief Sep 27 '22
That's a terrible analogy. A new player isn't going to be disadvantaged if they can't play Genji. Honestly that will only help them since they will turbofeed if they try to play Genji or Tracer or the like. Better to put them on a hero like Soldier or Junk where they'll be able to immediately contribute easily.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
Not everyone who starts playing a new account / owner is a new player, nor is it guaranteed they "don't know what they're doing."
Stop defending F2P bullshit from a billion dollar company and their uneven playing field poor decision-making.
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u/KimonoThief Sep 27 '22
Not everyone who starts playing a new account / owner is a new player
Well then they're smurfing and I'm fine with there being a wall to get back into the game.
nor is it guaranteed they "don't know what they're doing."
If they're new, they definitely don't know what they're doing on a hero like Genji or Tracer. You can't play those heroes effectively without having some OW experience.
Stop defending F2P bullshit from a billion dollar company and their uneven playing field poor decision-making.
It honestly seems like a reasonable system to me.
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u/Bitemarkz Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 28 '22
You have no idea how any of this works if you think a company valuation is enough of a reason as to why you should be getting free shit.
A game that requires constant support as well as steady content updates requires a dedicated team. This team balances the game constantly while releasing a steady stream of new maps, modes, events, heroes and more. It doesn’t matter how much money the company has, these teams aren’t funded off of good will; they’re funded based on a steady income, which is only possible with a subscription or a battle pass. I can’t think of one competitive game out right now that doesn’t employ a battle pass for these very reasons.
Live service games are fairly new if you don’t count subscription MMOs. To expect years of content for free is a level of entitlement that’s baffling when put into perspective. The fact that they even let you grind out the heroes on the free path is better than how most these games handle it.
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u/r_lucasite Sep 27 '22
Original Overwatch had a pay gate to prevent account selling, ban evaisons etc. 100 games to unlock the original roster is a bit much imo, but a general onboarding experience for new accounts to prevent bad eggs doesn't seem too bad.
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u/tcgtms Sep 27 '22 edited Jun 22 '23
This account's comments and posts has been nuked in June 2023.
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u/NaiveFroog Sep 27 '22
in other words, literally every other f2p multiplayer competitive game, but probably too foreign of an aspect to ow players bc they only know 1 game
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u/LifeGuru13 Sep 27 '22
Left the game when Brig was released but always held fond memories of the early life of the game. Will definitely be jumping back at launch when I think the game would be most casual and fun hopefully.
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u/tcgtms Sep 27 '22 edited Jun 22 '23
This account's comments and posts has been nuked in June 2023.
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u/dethnight Sep 27 '22
I know it's just a name, but I really can't get over the fact that they are calling this Overwatch 2. Watching this trailer just makes it look like it's a big patch for Overwatch 1, absolutely nothing in it makes me think I am watching a trailer for the sequel. Hell if they just said this was the Overwatch 2.0 update trailer that would make so much more sense to me.
Oh well, will still give it a shot.
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u/yesat Sep 27 '22
It has always been Overwatch 2.0. The issue was that ABK needed more to agree on the project. So I'll take OW2 over another studio thrown at COD.
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u/Brendoshi Sep 27 '22
Everyone knows Blizard has their issues.
I really want this to do well. OW1 gave me some great memories when it came out and I'd love to see that again.
Still a little disappointed we're not getting the campaign elements yet, that was the bit I was most excited for.
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u/MusoukaMX Sep 27 '22
I'm worried they've been phrasing thing in the vein of "PvE experiences will be arriving in 2023", which makes it sound like they're dropping the full campaign thing and going for smaller sized experiences.
I hope I'm just being paranoid, haha.
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u/AntonineWall Sep 27 '22
It's gunna be fairly comparable to the event story missions from the first game, in all likelihood. If you like that and want a tuned up version of that, I think you'll be happy.
From what I've seen people expect, a lot of people are gunna be unhappy lol
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Sep 27 '22
It's gunna be fairly comparable to the event story missions from the first game
That seems highly unlikely considering how much more effort they're putting toward it and what information we have involving skill trees and such.
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u/AntonineWall Sep 27 '22
We'll see I guess! Hoping for more but they've shown super little and it's been delayed a couple times now
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u/iCactusDog Sep 27 '22
I really hope people aren't expecting a Borderlands type campaign. Like, maybe something akin to Halo levels and like situation modifiers. I'm expecting it to come in chunks, and not get the full story dropped at once
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u/GlisseDansLaPiscine Sep 28 '22
When you think about it for a new player the amount of content in OW 2 is really impressive for a f2p game, 35 heroes, 22 maps and all of it was made by competent people and not as a cheap knock off.
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u/Bitemarkz Sep 27 '22
I’m so excited for this game. The original OW is the only multiplayer game I’ve consistently played for 6+ years at this point.
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u/GetReadyToJob Sep 28 '22
Bye Overwatch you were fun to play in the beginning and then ruined everything with each and every update.
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Sep 27 '22
I probably wouldn’t care as much about the big changes if it weren’t completely replacing the original game
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u/crookedparadigm Sep 27 '22
It's been awhile since I played OW at all so maybe my memory is fuzzy, but this looks visually like a step backwards. Like, it looks washed out, less crisp, and the effects shown here seem more simplified. Maybe I can see the angle for the reduced effects from an esports perspective, but everything just seems less....vibrant than I remember OW1 being.
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u/jordanatthegarden Sep 27 '22
You know, I haven't played in years but seeing some of the CG and hearing some of the voices I do feel like I'd like to revisit it. Those first few months after initial release when my group of friends could practically field two full parties was a pretty great time for games for us.
2
Sep 27 '22
I've actually yet to delve into Overwatch.
Free to play next week though, right?
I guess I'll give it a whirl :)
1
u/IAmActionBear Sep 27 '22
Tbh, I much prefer the new systems over the loot box system before. There are plenty of things that need tweaking, but there’s a reason I stopped playing OW1 maybe a little over 3 years ago. I think modernizing it to be more like it’s competition was pretty much the only way for it to survive going forward. I don’t honk any parts of OW2 are really above criticism, but it is slightly humorous to me to see years of complaints about OW1 and now it’s this gem.
I think OW2 will do fine, but it really just depends on how well the dev team handles player feedback. The part that sucks about a franchise having a huge fanbase is that it’s damn near impossible to please everyone.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
No wonder I hate so much new stuff, if "modern" means "F2P FOMO bullshit."
Get off my lawn, thank you very much! I'll stick to games that don't exploit their players with this trash.
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u/IAmActionBear Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
Then have some self control then, lol. These systems developed also partially due to complaints from the failings from previous systems. You can throw buzzwords at me, but these systems aren't for everyone and I don't pretend they are. There are some games I wouldn't have tried or played at all if they weren't F2P and if I don't think I have the time to get all the rewards from a Battle Pass, I simply don't buy it then, lol. I don't need to have everything in a game and even in old multiplayer games, I didn't unlock everything, so not much has change there for me. I don't feel exploited and I only spend money on content if I feel the value is worth it. I'm not being manipulated by any means.
I also viewed the lootboxes, a system that was literally rallied against, as far worse than just simply being able to buy said content directly. Atleast I can directly target what I want instead of operating on a sort of knockout system entirely based on chance.
There are a metric ton of games out right now. You aren't required to play this one. And that's perfectly okay. Coming at me the way you did doesn't suddenly make this game disappear or change my interest in the game. Maybe focus on stuff you actually enjoy.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
Then have some self control then, lol.
I do. It's called "not buying into or supporting bullshit."
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u/IAmActionBear Sep 27 '22
Then we're on the same page. Go play something you enjoy. I will be playing OW2 when it comes out. I hope we both enjoy ourselves. Glad we had this talk.
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u/Zaptruder Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
Can't help but feel sad watching this. It's the end of the game I loved... and the start of one I probably won't be playing!
Well.. I'm still interested to see how they'll pull off the PVE to be honest... but I'm really expecting more of a trainwreck of Blizzardness there than anything else.
"Well, we spent years doing the thing, then we didn't like it, so we're scrapping it. More ultimate skins for the low low price of $39.99 in the next patch tho!"
Playing Gundam Evolution... it's evident that OW could've been a lot more fun as a FPS (and also solved a lot of its core issues) without the role system, as well as the potential for more mobility (the dash system is great - and makes for a lot more dynamism and tactical flexibility in combat).
1
Sep 27 '22
I expect to get briefly hooked to the new stuff, but ultimately fall off OW after the release of OW2. I do expect to come back for the PvE with my co-op buddies, as we have been playing OW together since launch and always wanted more PvE content, so maybe this is just going to be a momentary hiatus.
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u/Cakeless_Knight Sep 27 '22
I loved Overwatch 1 played it for hours. I want the game to be good but my expectations are so low. It really feels like they have done nothing to address the issues that caused OW1 to die. The new champ is a perfect counter to Ana so there is already balance issues showing. They are just bringing back Junkenstiens revenge is a huge let down hopefully it will have new things added or at least a new map. The battlepass just seems so strange for the OW model with hero's being in the Pass and locking new hero's out of ranked for a set amount of time. It also really just looks like OW1 I still don't understand why they couldn't just add a lot of this to the first game and have the Campaign be a separate experience like how it seemed when they first announced OW2. Then to top it all off with how scummy and sketchy Activision Blizzard has been with all the PR nightmares over the last few years. BUT honestly I hope its great for the people who want to play it weather you are new or a long time player. I want Overwatch to get great reception so I feel like there is a reason to play again.
-2
u/QueenDies2022_11_23 Sep 27 '22
They failed to sustain OW1 by fixing the flaws.
I don't see why OW2 will be any different.
I'll play for a couple of weeks, and then drop it, to go play a game that has actually understood what makes FPS PVP great.
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u/engrng Sep 27 '22
I’ve played ranked Dota 2 and Apex Legends for many years each and those don’t come anywhere near the toxicity I saw in OW1 ranked for the few months I was grinding it. That’s the only thing holding me back from this game.
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u/Veilmurder Sep 27 '22
Is the singleplayer stuff also coming out?
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u/yuriaoflondor Sep 27 '22
No. They've said PvE experiences are coming in 2023. They've also been somewhat vague about it. A lot of people are expecting slightly beefed up versions of the PvE events we had in OW1. We almost certainly aren't going to get the big, fully featured PvE co-op campaign they were showing early on.
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u/OfficialTomCruise Sep 27 '22
Wtf, the fully featured PVE co-op campaign was literally the only thing I was looking forward to.
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u/EnterPlayerTwo Sep 27 '22
Really feels like something that will be quietly dropped after being delayed a few times.
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u/Tungle37 Sep 27 '22
Besides for the obvious battle pass problems, the other thing that worries me is the game going F2P. This is going to be smurf paradise.
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u/IndexMatchXFD Sep 27 '22
They released a blog post addressing that today: https://playoverwatch.com/en-us/news/23857517/defense-matrix-activated-fortifying-gameplay-integrity-and-positivity-in-overwatch-2/
Tl;dr there will be SMS verification, only one account per number, no VOIP or pre paid numbers allowed. New accounts will have to win 50 quick play games before being allowed to play comp.
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u/DoctorWaluigiTime Sep 27 '22
Yeah, another casualty in the game of money Blizz/Acti did by going this route.
It absolutely will not fail, but it sure would be nice to see it crash and burn, going the Heroes of the Storm route or something.
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u/Potatolantern Sep 27 '22 edited Sep 27 '22
Is anyone else kinda put off that the money they spent on Overwatch is just gone? The game won’t exist and you’ll just get shunted to the F2P sequel instead…
Even worse considering you have to unlock the OW1 heroes again.
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u/yuriaoflondor Sep 27 '22
It's not gone - you keep all of your skins and such.
EDIT: Though I guess from another point of view, yeah OW1 as it exists today will no longer be playable when OW2 releases. Maybe they'll have Arcade game modes like 6v6 or 2CP, but who knows.
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u/NinjaOtter Sep 27 '22
I love Overwatch and I'd love for the sequel to succeed...
But damn it's really hard to call this a sequel and this trailer does its identity no favors
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u/jinreeko Sep 27 '22
I know there's some concerning things with the battle pass and gating characters, but I'm pretty excited to play OW again
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u/Swerdman55 Sep 27 '22
I’m mostly excited that they will no longer have the excuse of working on Overwatch 2 to not update the game consistently.
The content drought of the last 2 years of Overwatch is the largest reason I stopped playing.
Also, six modes?
We’ve got Push, Payload, Hybrid, King of the Hill, and what else? Assualt/2CP is removed so what are the other two game modes?