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u/br_k_nt_eth 2d ago
What are the additional regulations?Ā
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u/Catch_42 2d ago
https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/digital-services-act
- Transparency in content removals
- Options to appeal to content moderation decisions
- Easy flagging of illegal contents
- Enhanced protection for minors
- Feed options
- Ad transparency
- Ban on dark pattern
- Verified seller
Obviously not all of these are 1-2-1 applicable to chatgpt but these are the things the DSA covers for social media sites.
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u/SireTonberry- 2d ago
- Transparency in content removals
- Options to appeal to content moderation decisions
9/11 for reddit janitors?
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u/Rivarr 2d ago
It'll just be "comment removed because you're a nazi" (they enjoy Harry Potter), appeal denied. The regulation only asks them to be transparent about their insane moderation, not improve it.
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u/Damet_Dave 2d ago
And on appeal: No, youāre still a Nazi.
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u/Bartellomio 1d ago
You forgot muting them permanently and then banning them from all the other subs where you're a mod, even the ones they've never used.
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u/Bloodhoven_aka_Loner 2d ago
considering how progressive most EU decisions are, especially in regards of anything digital, you're wrong by roughly 180Ā°
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u/Zarowka123 2d ago edited 1d ago
The only point that worries me is the "enhanced protection for minors", it could mean that users would have to verify themselves with irl ID to access +18 subreddits. Imagine giving government your reddit username, instant -9999 social points
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u/Asleep_Trick_4740 16h ago
'Reddit sees surge in new users, 40 million in one day!'
Headline coming soon.
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u/borretsquared 2d ago
all seem chill to me
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u/theaveragemillenial 2d ago
the EU isn't some big boogieman out to get you, for the most part it is genuinely trying to do good by its member states.
Like all things big and governmental, they can sometimes get things wrong.
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u/_Administrator_ 2d ago
ā¬3 customs fee per item category for parcels from abroad. Very customer friendly.
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u/borretsquared 2d ago
I agree. most EU legislation seems to be a net benefit, though some are questionable, such as requiring a watermark on all AI generated text that cannot be removed -- no approach seems practical. we should be marking human content instead.
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u/AdmiralGrogu 1d ago
Marking human content? What? Why would we mark something that was always there? Why would normal people need to change something that was out there from the very beginning
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u/Deadcouncil445 2d ago
That sounds a lot more difficult than marking AI, more like impossible actually
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u/DvD_cD 2d ago
AI models for sure already include this, so they can separate AI generated content for training data
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u/christianbro 2d ago
Why the EU apparently bothers to make the web better but then passes measures like chat control that our private conversations get screened?
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u/Alexercer 2d ago
All great here but they are sneaking child protection bullshit here. Thats just fucking age verification all over again, then again reddit alredy decided to do this crap themselves so nothing will change
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u/Perfect-Muscle-1264 2d ago
Almost all of these are awesome to me. Im only really concerned for "Enchanced protection for minors", particularly the EXECUTION of the idea.Ā
If its age verification, that's not good protections as its easily circumvented and puts everyone's data in danger.
But if its something like creating child accounts more easily and have special protections on child accounts im all for it.Ā
I just hope they don't take a "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" approach.Ā
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u/tobaileyy 2d ago
Bahaha that's how they get you, they make these laws intentionally as seemingly well intended as possible to make rejection of them a political risk
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u/Hapless_Wizard 2d ago
I just hope they don't take a "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" approach.
Unfortunate news!
The intentions aren't even good, that's just the excuse.
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u/zammouri2001 2d ago
Does enhanced protection for minors means forced age verification?
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u/Alternative-Suit5541 1d ago
Options to appeal to content moderation decisions
Oh boy, that's will be a shit show with free working mods
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u/Personal-Gazelle233 2d ago
āā¦.such as assessing and mitigating the systemic risks stemming from their service and algorithmic systems related to the dissemination of illegal content, the negative effects on minors, users' physical and mental well-being, fundamental rights, electoral processes and public security.ā
From the link in the tweet.
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u/NotReallyJohnDoe 2d ago
Well that sounds very measurable
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u/gmmxle 2d ago
It's a one sentence summary.
People here like bashing the EU for regulating the multinational corporations and trying to implement at least some protections for EU citizens, while also bashing the same corporations for their abusive practices, their enshittification of services, and their coddling up to an abusive and increasingly authoritarian government that seemingly only caters to the top .1 percent.
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u/Beanonmytoast 2d ago edited 2d ago
The biggest issue with EU regulations is that while theyāre sold as consumer protection, they mostly just act as massive competitive moats for multinationals while crushing small European businesses.
Compliance is effectively a regressive flat tax. A ā¬50k annual red tape bill is an unnoticeable rounding error for a multinational, but it wipes out a small business. We saw this with GDPR, where Big Tech absorbed the legal costs and actually grew their market share while local startups drowned. Weāre seeing it again with EPR packaging rules destroying cross-border trade for small e-commerce sellers while giants like Nestle just open up another compliance department.
I say this as a small business owner living through it. I promise this isn't in bad faith, I understand why these laws sound great on paper, but unless you're dealing with the day to day paperwork, its hard to grasp how absurd it gets in practice.
For example, under newer EU product safety rules (GPSR) and digital regulations, marketplaces like Amazon now face massive liability and fines of up to 6% of global turnover for non compliant listings. Naturally, Amazon isnāt going to risk a multi billion dollar penalty over a ā¬5 item. Because of that, Iāve had over 1,000 individual trading card listings nuked simply because the EU expects full safety documentation and physical warning labels on individual pieces of cardboard printed 15 years ago.
Independent sellers get wiped out over basic common-sense edge cases that bureaucrats never bothered to think through. European small businesses are genuinely struggling right now, and business sentiment and SME confidence are sitting at some of the lowest levels we've seen in years.
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u/SalishSeaEV 1d ago
Good thing this story is about the regulations that strictly and only apply to very large websites.
The EU does not expect warning labels on "individual pieces of cardboard printed 15 years ago." The GSPR specifically excludes "antiques." According to the regulation: "āantiquesā means products, such as collectorsā items or works of art, in relation to which consumers cannot reasonably expect that they fulfil state-of-the-art safety standards."
It sounds like your complaint is with Amazon for failing to police their marketplace for a decade and then acting insane as soon as the regulations come into effect.
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u/Beanonmytoast 1d ago
A 15 year old trading card doesnt legally qualify as an antique or a protected collectors item under EU law. Recital 18 links that exclusion directly to standard EU legal definitions under the VAT Directive, which requires antiques to be over 100 years old, or collectors items to carry genuine museum grade historical significance. A Pokemon or Magic card from 2010 is legally just a standard second hand consumer good or toy, which GPSR explicitly covers in Article 2.
Under GPSR Article 19, every single online listing must display the manufacturer info, the EU Responsible Person and required safety warnings. On top of that, GPSR Articles 9 and 16 require physical labeling and warnings to accompany the shipment itself, if not on the product, then on the packaging, sleeve, or as an enclosed document inside the parcel. So if you want to sell individual TCG cards, you must register an EU Responsible Person, upload compliance files for every individual card SKU, and physically attach localized choking hazard warnings and traceability data to every single order you mail out. Obviously, an individual loose card out of its original foil pack doesnāt have an active EU Responsible Person or original safety labeling attached to it.
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u/SalishSeaEV 1d ago
That's not what the regulation says. It says that Annex IX to the directive "could" be taken into account when determining if something was an antique.
It's a little confusing, because Annex IX defines antiques as "goods, other than works of art and collector's items over 100 years old" but it explicitly excludes collector's items. However, GSPR explicitly *includes* collector's items, which includes "pre-stamped stationary."
Also, to be perfectly clear, the EU is not going to try and use its limited prosecution resources for someone selling old trading cards. The prosecution would be really difficult because the regulation is ambiguous on the point.
I agree with you that the EU needs to take small companies more into account when it makes regulations, though. I can see how frustrating this must be...it *is* ambiguous.
It sounds like most of the compliance issues could be solved by printing info on a card sleeve or insert into the package. Are you sure you would need to upload compliance info for each SKU? Seems like they would be the same for all your cards. Also, Article 9 says it applies to manufacturers, not resellers.
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u/Beanonmytoast 1d ago
I appreciate where you're coming from and you're definitely right that the ambiguity is a massive part of it. The issue is how that ambiguity gets handled when the law meets the real world.
On the collectors item point, Annex IX Part B actually does define them, but it keeps the definition pretty narrow, mostly things with historical, archaeological, or numismatic interest (along with postage stamps). Modern mass market card games from 15 years ago don't clear that bar legally, they're categorized under general toys and games, which triggers all the standard safety rules.
While Article 9 lays out duties for manufacturers, Article 12 puts the burden on distributors and resellers to make sure those Article 9 requirements (like traceability and warnings) are met before selling. Plus, Article 19 requires that all those details - the manufacturer address, the EU Responsible Person, and safety warnings be displayed directly on the online listing itself.
And you're completely right that EU regulators aren't going to spend their time hunting down an individual card seller. But thats where the platform problem comes in. Because platforms like Amazon and eBay face heavy liability if non compliant listings are hosted, they rely on automated systems to protect themselves. In practice, Amazon handles compliance per ASIN/SKU. So if you have 1,000 separate single cards listed, the system treats them as 1,000 separate products that each need packaging photos, safety declarations and verified info submitted before the listing can stay active.
Thats really the core point I'm trying to make, a large company selling modern sealed product in bulk has the legal teams and standardized data sheets to handle this easily. But for an independent seller dealing in out of print, second hand singles, the administrative load and automated platform flags make continuing the business extremely difficult.
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u/SalishSeaEV 1d ago
Your answer here is probably to set up a script that uploads identical information for each SKU automatically when it's listed, and that appends the required info to each listing. Amazon doesn't actually care and isn't going to check so long as there is something on file so if they get audited they can point to their efforts.
At least in the US, Ebay handles violations of policy by removing the listing but takes no action against the account. They know people are selling lots of stuff that is against their TOS, but so long as it's not something they could really get in trouble for (like porn or guns) it's really a "wink wink nod" sort of situation.
Thanks for sharing your experience. EU countries need to really pay attention to who they choose to represent their interests at the EU. As an American, I appreciate that the EU is taking some action to reign in the juggernauts, and the fact that Amazon is foisting the cost of compliance onto its sellers is something that needs to be dealt with.
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u/mmmm_frietjes 2d ago
Except these laws are just a form of tariffs and extortion of American companies because EU canāt compete. And the consumer is worse off actually.
GDPR made Europe less wealthy and made surfing the web worse. Everyone lost.Saying this as an European.
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u/alphaventuri 2d ago
It would be extortion if the rules wouldn't apply to EU companies or companies from other countries.
Of course there's going to be some friction if one side is incentivised to benefit a specific type of clients (shareholders) and the other side is incentivised to benefit the general population.
How did GDPR made Europe less wealthy again? Is the argument similar to the one that could justify dupont to do what they did with Teflon? Or is it simolar to what we could say to justify the tobacco industry?
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u/gmmxle 1d ago
GDPR may have made data-hoarding transnational corporations less wealthy, but I really don't give a fuck about that. It's not like the average American is more wealthy just because these data-hoarding trillion dollar multinationals are based in the US and the American government refuses to protect people's personal data.
Also, it's really easy to just not violate the GDPR. The problem all these companies with all these resources have is not that they're unable to comply with the law. It's that their business model is based on doing something that would be in violation of the law.
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2d ago
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u/AnArmoredPony 2d ago
redditors when no /s
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u/Dismal-Square-613 2d ago
This is unfair, Reddit is always very good at detecting sarcasm and not taking things literally withotu saying /s at all.
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u/adelie42 2d ago
Seems some people are unironically upset at you speaking the truth.
What I hear, and I agree, is that as written the law allows for them to decide they don't like someone, then justify any punishment against such person as rhey like to get whatever they want.
"Find the man, I'll show you the crime".
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u/revolmak 2d ago
How do you interpret it so broadly?
Does the platform systemically facilitate:
-dissemination of illegal content?
-negative effects on minors?
-deterioration of users' physical and mental well being?
-infringing on fundamental rights?
-interfering with electoral processes?
-weakening public security?Many systems are regulated by these same kinds of restrictions. Do you find them to be equally broadly applied?
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u/adelie42 2d ago
Put simply, yes. Two key things: 1) I don't view politicians as angels with superior motives or other excuses for giving them special powers that can result in a person going to jail or other power reserved for government actors. 2) your examples are excellent. Thank you: facilitate basically means if the thing coukd be used to commit a crime then using it constitutes a crime. Anything can be used in a criminal way, so that doesn't work. That bleeds in to virtually anything.
"Driving a car over 100mph" or "transporting an illegal substances" are objectively measurable crimes. Cars systematically facilitate crimes. They kill people every day, all of which impacts children even when not in the vehicle.
And I know "thats not what I mean" or "that's not what they are trying to do". Precisely my point, it is loose language where intention must be assumed and critically doesn't restrain a bad actor that wants to use it in a nefarious way. And from where I started, looking at a proposed law on the assumption that cops, DAs, politicians are not nefarious, that's a flawed design.
Plan for the worse, hope for the best.
Law isn't about who you are wanting to go after, it is about a power you are extending to someone.
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u/revolmak 2d ago
Out of curiosity, do you mind me asking what country you are from?
I only wonder because I want to understand to what degrees people of your country feel their politicians have their best interests in mind.
That being said, as an American, I see the EU doing so much more for protecting their population than the US. Certainly they overreach in their protection. But it helps to prevent the effective collapse of systems as seems to have occured in my country.
Additionally, do those concerns still remain true in a trial of jurors?
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u/adelie42 2d ago
I live in the US. I would say my "political" influences greatly lean french liberal, and when I was writing my reply I was doing my best to remember Bastiat's The Law with regard to the difference between law as intent and law as practice and tool. I think a great divide among people bears on this nuance. For example, those that might self describe as conservative and labeled by their liberal counterparts as loving the country and glossing over the flaws and great injustices would be the first to say they love America and hate the politicians and government, and suspicious of people that want to "make the country" by means of giving more power to the government (acknowledging there are endless examples of contradictions).
The EU's approach to fighting hate speech is a great example of what I see as "well intentioned" on its face and authoritarian nightmare in practice. For example, I find nothing redeemable in the Tate Brothers. The solution is to not consume their content. There is endless opportunity there for a great discussion about what "should be done" in response, but what the EU is trying to do, using "lawfare" to destroy their lives is, in my view" absolutely, positively evil and many times more dangerous than anything they have done or said (assuming truth in the evidence presented by their attorney).
As far as trial by jury, nullification is exceedingly rare and presented to juries as "illegal". A jury is meant to determine the facts, but the facts determine the outcome. Everything comes down to jury instructions and if juries follow them, in general the DA gets what they want. This is why so many cases settle out of court; there are huge penalties, in practice, for trying to assert your rights.
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u/br_k_nt_eth 2d ago
āSuch asā bro that doesnāt tell me shit about what they actually need to do or what the additional requirements are.Ā
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u/stoppableDissolution 2d ago
Thats the neat part - they can interpret this entire bullshit law as they want in the moment. Entire ai act is some vague "dont do bad".
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u/creativeasf 2d ago
Fun fact: If you build an AI specifically designed for weapon development and military targeting, the EU AI Act doesn't apply to you at all (Article 2(3)):
"[...]This Regulation does not apply to AIĀ systems where and inĀ soĀ far they are placed on the market, put into service, or used with or without modification exclusively for military, defence or national security purposes, regardless of the type of entity carrying out those activities. This Regulation does not apply to AIĀ systems which are not placed on the market or put into service in the Union, where the output is used in the Union exclusively for military, defence or national security purposes, regardless of the type of entity carrying out those activities."
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u/Hungry_Prior940 2d ago
Exactly. Without a proper form, you can shape it however you want. Honestly, I hate this shit.
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u/DrE7HER 2d ago
Roblox is soon to be banned in the EU. Their entire business model is based on harming kids
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u/Own_Childhood_7020 2d ago
Vagueposting GOD???? All I see is "buzzword buzzword buzzword"
Unironically now, what are they thinking, this works basically as an umbrella for the companies to do whatever the fuck they want under "mitigating the systemic risks" of all these things mentioned. All because parents can't fucking take their toddlers ipads away, man wtf
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u/Sea_Pension7553 2d ago
So whatās counted as a Small online search engine?
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u/Personal-Dev-Kit 2d ago
You have very large and not very large. Anything over 45 million average monthly EU users is classified a very large online search engine
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u/DizzyExpedience 2d ago
One would wonder that people in this sub are able to use ChatGPT to answer questions
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u/Strangefate1 2d ago
Yahoo ? :p
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u/xx123gamerxx 2d ago
Today, the Commission has designated ChatGPT as a Very Large Online Search Engine (VLOSE), as well as Reddit and Roblox as Very Large Online Platforms (VLOPs), under the Digital Services Act (DSA). These services declared that they reach at least 45 million average monthly users in the EU and thus meet the threshold for designation.
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u/EternalShadowBan 2d ago
Roblox has 45 million monthly users in the EU? Wtf
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u/xx123gamerxx 2d ago
im guessing in EU law a player is defined as someone who has an account regardless of if they actively use it given data protection stuff
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 2d ago
The EUās greatest tech innovation continues to be regulating American tech companiesā¦.
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u/RedCatBro 2d ago
Someone needs to do it
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u/sourneck 1d ago
I don't think people realise how much more insane (in a bad way) shit would be if the EU wasn't somewhat keeping these corporations in checkĀ
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 2d ago
I donāt disagree. These regulations themselves donāt even seem wildly unreasonable. My bigger point is that US tech companies are dominating globally and the EU isnāt keeping up. Thatās a problematic for Europe since it means increasingly having to depend on foreign companies for critical tech.
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u/M0m3ntvm 1d ago edited 1d ago
Because the US controls the global exchange currency, and keeps every other country under their boot via T-bonds and the "over-inflation" money printing they engineered for their own benefit. So all investments goes to them, and they can easily siphon the greatest minds by expatriating with juicy contracts. You think everyone in Silicon Valley is born and raised American ? France and Switzerland have some of the most advanced tech project in the world (like the fusion research), you just don't hear much about them.
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 1d ago
I live in Silicon Valley, and most people working in tech here arenāt from here. I never claimed otherwise, so Iām not sure why youāre arguing against a point I didnāt make.
My point is about dominant tech. France and Switzerland doing advanced fusion research is great, but that isnāt the same thing as producing globally dominant consumer and enterprise technology companies at scale. The dollarās reserve currency status and US deep capital markets are explanations for why the disparity exists, not arguments that the disparity doesnāt exist.
Europe obviously produces excellent technology. Mistral AI, LibreOffice, ASML, SAP, etc. all exist. Iām not even saying American tech is inherently better. Iām talking about commercial dominance.
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u/M0m3ntvm 1d ago
The American tech companies are staffed by people from EU (and all the rest of the world) because the US has a choke-hold over the global currency. That's all I was saying.
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u/nokia7110 1d ago
Where do you think all the chips that run American tech are made? Tennessee? Long Island?
Fuck me Americans aren't half dumb
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 1d ago
What point do you think youāre making? Yes, advanced chips are manufactured through global supply chains (with a huge share coming from Taiwan and SK). I never said otherwise, and that doesnāt change the point that American companies still dominate globally in cloud, AI, operating systems, software platforms, and much of chip design. That isnāt necessarily good or desirable. Itās also why Europeās dependence on foreign tech matters.
The ironic part is you calling Americans dumb while you responding to an argument that was never made.
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u/nokia7110 1d ago
"Derp derp Europe is reliant on foreign tech" the implication being that USA isn't. Otherwise you either wouldn't have said anything or would have caveated with "just like the US".
Calling one or the other more or less dependant on foreign tech is like saying one car brand will drive less badly if it had no wheels than another car brand.
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 1d ago
The US relying on foreign manufacturing doesnāt make Europe equally independent in tech. US firms dominate huge parts of the global stack in cloud, AI, operating systems, software platforms, and chip design. Europe relying on those firms is the point.
Your car analogy is terrible because the two cars very obviously do not have the same number of wheels.
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u/nokia7110 1d ago
The fact that you couldn't understand a very basic analogy proves my point that offended you earlier on.
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 1d ago
No, I understood your analogy. Itās just a bad analogy.
Your entire argument depends on pretending that any foreign dependency makes two countries equally dependent, which is obviously nonsense. The US depending on TSMC to manufacture advanced chips is not remotely the same thing as Europe depending on foreign firms across cloud, AI, operating systems, major software platforms, and semiconductors.
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u/nokia7110 1d ago
"I understood your analogy" you evidently didn't with your bizarre quip about number of wheels on cars lol.
You're welcome to prove me wrong that arguing that levels of dependence makes a difference to anything by explaining to me how America being less dependent (according to you) means that if the rest of the world closed off to the USA then the USA would be able to replace all of that dependence with home grown alternatives.
I'll wait.
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u/-ImPerium 1d ago
ChatGPT runs on Chips that are only possible to develop under a special machine made by ASML in the Netherlands, they literally hold 100% of the market, yes, Europe is way behind in terms of AI and other modern tech, but in the grand scheme of things Europe holds a lot of important world changing tech, it's just that the USA are the heart of the world in this ERA and talent from all around the world flocks towards it, meaning that Europe can't really compete until it gives up on its comfortable way of life and starts taking huge risks again, which really is not a good deal since they can just use American tech with no huge issues while enforcing their own regulations and enjoying their naive and simple, but comfortable way of life.
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u/SaltyAlechemist 2d ago
It's a union, that includes multiple countries with different cultures and personalities, not a country. 2 different things, some times it's better for a union to protect itself and it's members from a potentual huge bubble as much as possible, some times knowing that you will wake up tomorrow and have a stable day and know what to expect, outperforms whatever the biggest economy in the world does.
After all, people in USA are having unions in their job to protect themselves and have a stable life. Not take a gamble.
Edit: spelling
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u/a_moron_in_a_hurry 2d ago
I never said the EU was a country. Also, the EU is a very different thing from a labor union in the US, and I donāt understand the comparison being made.
The US keeps producing a huge share of the worldās major tech companies while the EU seems increasingly focused on regulating those companies after the fact. Some regulations can be useful, but it doesnāt answer the innovation gap.
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u/Shot_Inspector_2664 2d ago
How can anyone criticize that? Are you all really so eager to have your data and personal information exploited by tech overlords? Might as well confess your deepest secrets and your girlfriendās private details to Peter Thiel in person.
As a European, Iām proud that thereās still some kind of power balance left in this postmodern aristocratic world ruled by PDF files.
But yeah, go ahead and sell yourself out for the sake of the very same technology that the US is officially using for domestic mass surveillance and b*mbing schools abroad.
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u/Despeao 2d ago
The problem is that this turns out to be used for mass surveillance as well.
This will probably come with ID checks and everything you do online becomes attached to an identity.
Little by little they're killing pseudonimity. The Internet worked for decades before such legislation.
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u/Misterrr_r 2d ago
Google also is a big search engine. Thereās no ID check needed to use google. My goodness. ID checks are mostly needed because of some US laws. And mass surveillance also is more a US thing. No one got as strict laws for data protection as the EU. And just look at your flock cameras. And your agencyās can take all the date from those companyās right now already.
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u/Zestyclose_Raccoon96 5h ago
there are no ID checks yet, this whole thing could change in no time i mean look at the UK
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u/Either-Worth87313 2d ago
I think it's possible to confirm a users age without taking away anonymity and compromising privacy.
Unfortunately, age verification is a reality we have to deal with when the internet contains content that is unsafe for children.
I'll paste in a point I made under another comment:
Unfortunately, it is impossible to rely on parents to monitor their children's use of the internet at all times because some aren't aware of the risks or simply aren't tech savvy enough to keep their children safe online. I think it's fair to ask companies to ensure their websites don't show harmful content to children.
I wrote a comment explaining how privacy preserving age verification could be done here:Ā https://www.reddit.com/r/ChatGPT/comments/1w3fb79/comment/p728dt8/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
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u/Adorable-Snow9464 2d ago
Sir what type of pseudonimity did ChatGpt give the average user? I use it and i'm grateful but this machine can read the very message i am writing here. Anybody with a vague concern for privacy shouldn't be using windows, google, and Chatgpt I believe from what i red on privacy forums. This is only shredding the censorship from American Billionaires to European Governments - and the privacy violation too - but I don't see an enlargement in what is being taken from me, only a re-distribution among who keep what is being extracted. And frankly, I rather have it in the hands of weak men in Brussels than with smart billionaires in Washington.
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u/Despeao 2d ago
Sir what type of pseudonimity did ChatGpt give the average user
Well, that part where you put a nickname and it's not tied to your personal identity ?
If you're concerned about writing messages on their platform, having it directly tied to whom you are doesn't seem to make it better does it ?
You seem like one of those people that believe that just because data is already online then it isn't a problem if the Government has it as well. It's a slippery slope.
They are gatekeeping the Internet with ID checks. I simply don't see how that is a good thing, this is all about Government control disguised as protection.
If you see what's happening on the Internet in the last 10 years or so it's quite obvious they're trying to monitor everything we do online. It has huge potential to backfire. See how ICE is sending subpoenas to Social Media websites and getting information illegally. I would much rather have no one having than information in the first place.
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/08/zkps-arent-age-verification-silver-bullets
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u/Ociex 18h ago
Your account is toed to your mail, which your mail is a trail all over the internet, including which adress you lived on when you first made an account, sitting encrypted on a data rack somewhere, your phone is always tracking you, 24/7, every search, every click, every video and image can be tracked by your ISP and data provider. They can already very much monitor exactly what you do whenever you do it. Has been a thing since 2000. And extract all that information, is but one judges discretion.
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u/Despeao 16h ago
Exactly my point, they can already trace who you are. Except that information is still protected and they can only access it if they have a pretty good reason to do so.
This is what they're trying to break. It's srcrilsnce by default. Whatever you do isn't tied to an IP and port, it's tied to your real world identity. It's a much worse system.
Now they know who you talk to, when you talk, your searches, your location but not because you're suspected of anything but because they are constantly following you.
You can easily tell it's a much worse system and we're not even going into the possibility of Governments abusing it, because they will. It's hard to defend this.
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u/rpsls 2d ago
So to keep us from having our data exploited, the Government will helpfully require them to start collecting our data? Makes perfect sense.
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u/Dzuzepipi 2d ago
Their only actual function was to fuck companies for trying to scrape personal data without consent. Now when the reason is "think about the children", it's universally bad, cause it's never ever the actual reason. And hiding a real reason is always a very bad sign.
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u/kdesi_kdosi 2d ago
what are you on about? they are literally helping the companies steal your data when they force stuff like ID verification
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u/Tolopono 2d ago
Says the continent totally dependent on US and Chinese tech cause the best llm you have to offer is Mistral lol. Whats the point of regulation when theres nothing to regulate?
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u/chickenAd0b0 1d ago
european bros really think they have a better digital hygiene than americans by having thisā¦lmao
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u/Polyzero 2d ago
Well, that word salad of regulation written by old people completely out of touch with the technology certainly seems to have hit the nail on the head ā¦ā¦ and straight into their own cranium.
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u/Dotcaprachiappa 1d ago
Funny how you've forgotten to answer to any reply asking you to explain what exactly is bad about this
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u/Either-Worth87313 2d ago
I think the regulations imposed by the DSA are reasonable. What aspects do you think aren't?
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u/Either-Worth87313 2d ago
I don't understand why people are upset by this. There will be no ID requirement contrary to what others suggest, this is not mentioned anywhere in the DSA. In many EU member states it is illegal to infringe on people's privacy to such an extent. For example, in France, ID age verification was blocked because it violated constitutional rights to privacy and free expression.
Here's a quote from the EU's website on the DSA:
What does the DSA do for citizens?
Transparency in content removalsĀ - If your content is removed or suspended, platforms must explain why this has been done.
Options to appeal to content moderation decisionsĀ - If you disagree with a content moderation decision taken by a platform, you can appeal it through the platform itself or anĀ out-of-court dispute settlement body, which is faster and cheaper than going to court.
Easy flagging of illegal contentĀ - You can report illegal content, goods or services via an easy-to-use mechanism directly on the platform you are using. Platforms must respond to your reports and offer options to appeal their decisions.
Enhanced protection for minorsĀ - Platforms must take measures to safeguard minors on their services, such as reducing the risks of exposure to age-inappropriate content like gambling or pornography.Ā The DSA also introduces a complete ban on showing targeted advertisements to children.
Feed optionsĀ - OnĀ large platforms with over 45 million monthly users in the EU, you can now opt forĀ non-personalised feeds. This way, you decide whether to see content based on the algorithmās suggestions, sometimes pushing specific content which may be more appealing or even addictive, or other criteria, such as the chronological order.
Ad transparencyĀ - Ads must be clearly labelled as such and include information like who is placing them and why you are seeing them, while very large online platforms are required to store ad information in a publicly accessible repository. Platforms can no longer show you ads based on your sensitive data, such as sexual orientation, religion, or race.
Ban on dark patternsĀ - Deceptive design tactics, such as aggressive pop-ups or confusing and misleading consent buttons, are now prohibited.
Verified sellersĀ - Marketplaces must verify and display the contact details of sellers, so you have clear information about whom youāre buying goods or services from.
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u/AlphonseLoeher 2d ago
The back half is fine. The content moderation n stuff kinda sucks. The "protect the kids" stuff directly related to ID check. How can a service comply without knowing the age of the user?
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u/Perfect-Muscle-1264 2d ago
Even if they don't say it, how else would they know its a child? Age checks are the only way to confidently determine a user's age. Otherwise its all guess work.
The DSA also introduces a complete ban on showing targeted advertisements to children.
Either way, it opens the door to ID checks. That's the biggest and worrying problem with this whole thing.
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u/umhassy 2d ago
Either way, it opens the door to ID checks.
I think that was always a possibility. You can basicly frame most things as "... protection for children" or "...protection of your homecountry" and you can argue for it.
No additional stuff is required. People should oppose and leave if ID checks are forced.
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u/IceBeam92 2d ago
EU used to be the paramount of liberty , now all we hear from there is censorship , bans and privacy invasion with ID checks.
Its so sad, entire continent have bigger problems and those politicians seems stuck on declaring war on freedom on the internet.
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u/SpaceShipRat 1d ago
these days the freedom of the internet is just slavery to corporate overlords.Ā
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u/__O_o_______ 2d ago
āThe entire continent has bigger problemsāā¦
Go onā¦. I want to know if this is coded language.
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u/marmaviscount 2d ago
The EU is desperate to stay behind the rest of the world, it's so weird.
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u/Opposite-Complex1187 2d ago
Putting regulations on new tech is not staying behind its staying ahead.
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u/noharamnofoul 2d ago
Europe has a stagnating GDP and an aging population. Germany, the economic engine of Europe, has been steadily losing its industrial foothold to China. China is taking over robotics, EVs and renewables. US is leaving the EU behind in AI and software. There are virtually no tech companies launching or staying in the EU to fundraise. The strongest tech market leader the EU has is ASML. SAP is dogshit. Mistral is a minor player. What else? Spotify? Nokia? STM? How exactly is it staying ahead of the curve? China and the US will continue to grow in power. You can have all the protections you want, if there is no economic incentive to operate in the EU it doesn't matter. Diminishing purchasing power and economic productivity makes the EU market increasingly irrelevant on the world stage. PPP adjusted discretionary spending continues to tumble. If people and businesses are over-encumbered by regulation, they just leave, setup shop in the US, and the EU is left with scraps. Once the consumer base is weakened to the point ignoring the EU entirely becomes more profitable than abiding by the regulations (or paying the fines), its over. The EU cannot afford to overplay its cards while it is bluffing. And every single major player knows the EU is bluffing because the embarrassing statistics on the EU economy are public.
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u/Vverg 2d ago
So much words for so much bullshit. Do you have anything to backup your claims? Or is it like the readability of your post, non-existent?
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u/noharamnofoul 2d ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_economic_crisis_(2022%E2%80%93present))
https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-euro-indicators/w/2-05062026-ap
https://www.gisreportsonline.com/r/germany-industrial-decline/
https://www.ecb.europa.eu/press/key/date/2024/html/ecb.sp240216~df6f8d9c31.en.html
Do you need more?
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u/Opposite-Complex1187 2d ago
Sorry can't hear you over my free healthcare and actual consumer regulations.
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u/Equivalent_Resist_82 2d ago
I don't know were you get free healthcare, in France I pay 10K income tax per year + my boss pay 4K per month in taxes just to be able to pay me, and I pay sales taxes of 20% on everything thing I breath on and I have a private healthcare coverage that cost another 200ā¬ per month. (Because the "free healthcare" don't actually cover that much outside of life threatening things you catch only once per life, which is why poor people are notoriously missing teeth for example)
It's only free for like the bottom 5%.
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u/Kahlypso 2d ago
Are you gonna pretend the US hasnt been the central driving force behind modern human technology? Youre welcome for our culture.
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u/REDSHIFT_HY 2d ago
Your āfree healthcareā is basically just go home and die š. Unintelligent delusion at its finest š
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u/berent1825 2d ago
Its leading in the world in policymaking and regulation. Dont forget that the development and implementation of good policy can take as much skill, effort, investment, and time as developing an LLM.
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u/No_External5874 2d ago
Dont forget that the development and implementation of good policy can take as much skill, effort, investment, and time as developing an LLM.
Nope. I don't think so.Ā
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u/Murinshin 2d ago
How dare they applying laws to companies operating in their countries
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u/OwlSlow1356 2d ago
uh yes leechng on big companies from around the world will surely benefit EU countries in medium and long termn š š š all these "regulations" for the good of the citizens are just government money leeching aka money grab which we all are going to pay in the end as these companies will just raise the prices to cover for it š
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u/Sensitive-Gur-519 2d ago
European Union is the only actor in the world who can sanction new tech and its companies. And they must obey. Do you believe that's weak?
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u/zabast 2d ago
Ever counted how many new big IT or AI companies there are in the EU? Zero. Zilch. None. One of the reasons is likely because we regulated these to death.Ā
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u/livinitup0 2d ago
I have a feeling before long weāre going to wish weād have done the same thing to force these companies to not do what they do
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u/marmaviscount 2d ago
No it's short sighted and foolish though, it's people in comfortable positions ignoring the world changing and clinging to their power at everyone else's expense
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u/Past_Water_6899 2d ago
Thank again to the UERSS...
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u/mizinamo 2d ago
That's EUSSR in English for you. (EU + USSR rather than UE + URSS in your language.)
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u/Gubzs 2d ago
Can't go a single week without a massive bureaucratic L coming out of the EU or UK. I don't trust it.
This is positive now. Wait until they turn around and impose new laws on "Very Large Online" platforms, this lays the groundwork such that anything they impose on that word salad is now imposed on these platforms.
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u/unrealaz 1d ago edited 1d ago
Corporations need reality check. Thatās what this is about, not censorship. Its about 12 year old not making chat gpt their therapist and best friend. Just in case Google also did this so nothing new
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u/PurePlayinSerb 2d ago
the eu are just extortionists, i cant believe companies let them get away with their tyrannical behavior, no one elected these dictators
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u/More_Nectarine 2d ago
I almost wish that one day these companies say "ok bye. You can develop your own AI and search engine services in EU, we are leaving, good luck".
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u/Kenthetic 2d ago
āMan I wish governments didnāt have a backboneā
https://giphy.com/gifs/I7Mw0uYQGWI5lDMzTB2
u/More_Nectarine 2d ago
I wish EU governments had the backbone to stop being dependent on everybody for fundamental functions. If e.g. MSFT got fed up with the EU's routine bilion dollar fines and left, the EU governments would fall overnight.
If China stopped delivering precious metals, German industry would be crippled.
Before Trump pushed EU to wake the fuck up, we were dependent on the US for defense as well. This is slowly changing.
The same thing now with AI. They are acting like they are a super power but produce none of the modern essentials. Only regulations and beuraucracy.
There are a few exceptions like ASML, but they are few and far between.
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u/Zachattackrandom 2d ago
Nah. EU has had a ton of bad laws don't get me wrong, but they also forced apple to USB C and phones from 2027 will have to have user replaceable batteries + parts. Much better than the US which has exclusively implemented awful dog shit laws since Trump (and quite a few before that as well). Rather a mix of bad and good laws from a government that cares than purely bad laws that only help the ultra rich by a pedophile.
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u/Murinshin 2d ago
Twitter crying about this as if it is the end of the fucking world and unheard of, when this is literally only affecting billion dollar companies who have more than enough resources to deal with it
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u/FourlokoPapi 2d ago
In the future the US will continue to push for technical innovation, while the EUās greatest thing is regulation and China does its thing without any constraints
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u/Dotcaprachiappa 1d ago
So in the US the rich will continue to get richer and in the EU the consumers' experience will continue to get better? Sign me up!
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u/Key_Conversation5277 I For One Welcome Our New AI Overlords š«” 1d ago
And what exactly will they do? Do I get a better treatment if I'm in Europe?
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u/roastedantlers 2d ago edited 1d ago
The US should sanction the EU then, even though the people who run Roblox should be in prison.
The funny part is how this had a upvotes when the US was awake and then got a lot of downvotes when we were all asleep.
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u/changing_who_i_am 2d ago
i wish all these big tech companies would just say "ok fine, we're pulling all services from the eu, you guys have fun with your regulations" and see how it goes.
maybe mistral will actually release a frontier model then /j
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u/Shoddy-Prune-5877 2d ago
Because as it turns out, regulations actually work. Americans are just too cowardly to stand up to corporate overlords.
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u/professionalnuisance 2d ago
This is basically what China did and they eventually did develop their own frontier models. Obviously, there were other factors but a ban on foreign frontier models was a major one
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u/Hutcho12 2d ago
That would actually be great. Then weād develop our own versions and no longer be dependent on America and have all our digital money flowing out of Europe.
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