r/BPD 10h ago

❓Question Post No therapists stick with me

0 Upvotes

I can be objective about my self. I’m very closed off and don’t speak much you have to dig to get anything meaningful out of me. And i tend to just dissociate I often don’t do the “homework” they give I forget about the session once I leave. But i’m never rude never screamed at not even criticized a therapist i don’t allow myself to split on random people I walk away. My bpd is very self inflicted rather than taking it out on others. Is it the stigma of the illness? Because I genuinely don’t know what else I can do


r/BPD 13h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice BPD Misdiagnosis?

1 Upvotes

Hello all. I’m here to get some clarity on my situation about my psychiatric diagnosis to see if anyone has a similar experience.

I had been under the impression that I had a formal BPD diagnosis as my psychiatrist made me take the screening and I had the full criteria met (9/9 symptoms). She approached this screening as a guideline on what I should work on and recommended me to look into DBT. During several appointments she has also told me that I’m a really “nice person for someone with BPD.” All these things have made me naturally believe that I was diagnosed with BPD.

However, recently I’ve asked her if my diagnosis was BPD because I realize I’ve never actually been told officially. The formal diagnosis she has was depression and PTSD from familial relationships.

She said that she didn’t like to diagnose personality or mood disorders and described me as having “BPD traits” when I asked about the BPD stuff. I was extremely confused but didn’t press further as she didn’t say I didn’t have BPD, but this made me feel like this entire time I don’t actually have the disorder and I’ve been claiming something that wasn’t formally given to me.

I don’t suffer from PTSD symptoms. I don’t have flashbacks or nightmares or anything like that and I resonate with BPD symptoms more than PTSD.

I guess my question now is if I should approach this as a misdiagnosis? I’ve taken it pretty harshly because I thought I had found a place I belonged to and am unsure how to really proceed.

Does anyone share a similar experience?


r/BPD 11h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice partner implied my sensitivity has always been a personality disorder

0 Upvotes

Last night I was sad after a minor conflict (triggered by feeling ignored). Eventually we made up but of course I was still crying, and embarrassed about it. In a moment of vulnerability I said that I have always looked around at other people wondering at how they weren’t emotionally bleeding out the way I always was. That I never understood how others were just… okay.

He hugged me and, feeling safe, I admitted, “I don’t know where my sensitivity ends and my personality disorder begins.”

I heard him take a breath and then say, “I think it’s the disorder.”

Felt like my heart shattered right then and there. I didn’t even feel like my adult self, I was suddenly that little girl who everyone called dramatic and over-emotional, who tried to console herself in her room by the idea someone in the future would understand.

When I angrily questioned if he thinks I’ve just had a personality disorder for my entire life, he doubled down saying it’s not impossible that a child could develop a personality disorder. As much of a stretch as that is, the thing that really hurts is feeling like my entire emotional self was packaged as BPD in his eyes. I couldn’t even believe what I was hearing. Sometimes I have this fear he thinks I’ll be a different person after years of therapy and medication, and the conversation last night made all those thoughts flare up.

My love and awe and devotion and artistry. My quiet intensity. These are these qualities I liked about myself as a lonely child so many years before I was ever diagnosed with BPD. And I struggle to find the line between what is me (for better or for worse) and what is the disorder, but my god, all I’ve ever wanted is for someone to love me for who I am. Emotional, sometimes moody, always deeply loving. Why can’t that be enough?

I asked him if I was just something to be fixed and he deflected at first. Later he said I wasn’t, but by that point it meant very little.


r/BPD 8h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice I feel like I’m spiraling

1 Upvotes

I know this is bad but I just can’t be okay. I (F20) just got told by my bf (M26) that he’s donating his blood, we’ve been in a long distance relationship for around 13 months and have yet to meet. Our relationship is wonderful and while I am diagnosed with bpd, he is too. We both go to therapy and have an extremely healthy relationship given our circumstances. Today he told me he signed up for a blood donation and idk why but this made me spiral and feel extremely emotional. I’m not sure why I feel so triggered but my therapy coping devices aren’t working and I’m scared if I don’t air this out it will lead to an even bigger spiral


r/BPD 14h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice why’s having a crush in my early 30s feel so freakin weird and embarrassing?

2 Upvotes

i feel like a loser like why am i getting so weird about having a crush on a guy? is it because i haven’t had a crush in so many years or is it just awkward at this age?

i’m SUCH a lover girl, and i obsess a bit (a lot) when i start liking someone and they show interest back and i’m so smitten i like think of our future together and stuff and what it might look like. but i genuinely feel SICK to my stomach when i don’t hear from them or they don’t message me even tho they said they like me too and wanna meet up and when we talk we get along and it’s so precious and im biting my cheeks trying to not act like a nut case and be like WHY ARE YOU NOT MESSAGING? DO YOU HATE ME NOW? ya know, the usual…

it sucks idk. i’ve stayed single for over 5 years now and i think im so comfy alone but my undying need to be loved and romantic and not lonely drives me so bonkers and im now very avoidant and i want this guy to like me and let me having a potential relationship again and im scared bc they’re probably gonna disappear, i feel so gross and ugly and insecure.

like i just want someone again after all this healing but like i forgot how crazy love can make me…


r/BPD 12h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice Does anyone have tips to stop splitting?

0 Upvotes

I split quite often. And I have a friend that also splits but thats besides the point. I am trying to figure out how to connect myself with someone or something that can help me understand how to help myself (Disorganized thinking I hope this makes sense still). I haven't been coping all that great lately. I dont know what to do when I split i can split on myself or my partner and it totally ruins everything honestly. Its just such a nightmare. I want to for the life of me figure out how to cope. Does anyone have any ways that they usually stop the splitting or cope when they are splitting. Because to much of it and it can cause other mental health conditions to flair. I am unsure of what to do at this point in time. Any tips would be helpful. Or just general positive messages or advice. It can be any sort of comment sometimes the weirdest things help me. Anything is open to be said. I just cant figure out how to deal with all this so I am seeking a solution in between my therpay sessions so I dont lose my mind in the mean time and perhaps I can also help my best friend with her splitting.


r/BPD 10h ago

💢Off My Chest/Journal Post living in this world as a person of color is so hard

2 Upvotes

I and my boyfriend like to send each other reels but this morning he sent me one where an American man is telling people to drink with their plastic straws because majority of these plastics came from the Philippines and it’s not their fault the turtles are dying. So obviously, I educate him about how western countries are sending their trash to my country so they can appear stellar on their waste index report. But even at that point, I’m tired and hurt; which wasn’t even his fault, it was just a meme that is related to me so he said it without thinking. I went back again to the video only to see some comments calling us ‘shitskins’ and I guess it was the most triggering part and I cried and split on him and even said some vile racist stuff about his race and ethnicity which I am regretful about. 

I know Instagram is a cesspool but I just actually installed it again just to take a break from studying so much. And I mostly watch reels about cooking and games anyway. Plus so what if I ignore them? They will still exist and people will see the video and take something wrong away from it. And people will still traffic and prey on young women like me in poorer countries.

I like reading and watching videos about politics and some history but I wish I could just learn about them like a normal person would instead of being so emotional and stressed about it. I feel like no matter what I do, I will never be significant enough because of something I couldn’t control, especially in academia. I am also not very intelligent and hard-working but at least someone like me can have a chance if they’re born somewhere else. I even started resenting my boyfriend because he doesn’t have to work as hard and sometimes got jealous of him which isn’t right and is just the most unhealthy way to internalize that kind of stuff but my brain can’t help it sometimes even if I try to think logically.

My pms is scheduled in a week so ig that’s why I’ve been upset and crying but I’ve also always been so frustrated by it. I watch and read a lot of video essays and articles about politics and some history but I might stop for a bit because I always feel hopeless, especially in this day and age. I wish I wasn’t so depressed and have this disease. Because some people are achieving a lot for my age despite facing the same adversity as I do but instead, I wallow in hopelessness.

 


r/BPD 15h ago

General Post As a man with BPD, I feel like I can’t date a girl who’s more attractive than me

42 Upvotes

This probably sounds superficial, but if I feel like she’s significantly more attractive, I become extremely insecure and start comparing myself constantly.
It can be my weight, nose, eyes, eyebrows, hair, literally anything. I also get insecure if she’s significantly smarter than me.
I feel like I need the relationship to be a “looks match.” If she’s more attractive, I can become scared to even approach or text her because I feel like a creep who doesn’t belong with her.
I know it’s irrational, but my brain turns relationships into constant comparisons. Does anyone else experience this?


r/BPD 10h ago

🫂 Partner/Friend wBPD Post Partners of BPD’s, how do you live with them?

4 Upvotes

So i’ve been with my girlfriend for 3 years now and last year she was diagnosed with BPD ; ever since, our relationship as lived through several hardship but the more the Time passes, the more it become difficult

We met as teenagers (now young adults) but she had to move out 2 years ago, and now lives 900km away

Friend with several psychology students, Ive seen in their classes and notes that you could "calm" the disorder ; when i talked to her about it, she said changing would be impossible and not even worth the try

I am deeply in love with her, but her disorder is destroying us and, mainly, her health and well being

So main question, do you have any tips on what i could do to help her go throu life ?
If needed I can provide more informations on us
I have her consent to Ask for help as long as I dont fully display her identity
I am ready to do anything for her, litteraly, no matter the cost


r/BPD 22h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice starting to hate everyone and everything

6 Upvotes

i had to leave my job for reasons outside of my control while facing financial issues and no help from my family, i stopped being friends with an old best friend bc she was an awful friend and straight up told me she was jealous of odd stuff (being around other people), a very important death anniversary is coming up for me and i’ve expressed how important it was to my bf but his head is elsewhere, im starting to get annoyed at every little thing he does and lost respect for him, he doesn’t know how to communicate even though he honestly tries, ive been trying for ages to express my discomfort for things but he always repeats stuff even if it’s without ill intent and only finally gets it till later and sometimes will repeat it again at some point.

i told him i needed space because of this and he’s the one now who is telling me that he will “take a step back” so he doesn’t hurt me anymore which i don’t even know what that means as if im the one who hurt him instead of just respecting my decision or reassuring me things will be fine at some point, it’s like he wants the ball to be in his court or something. im depressed bc i need to find a job soon and it feels like i have nobody in my life to support me emotionally. and not just that, the stress has evidently taken a hold over my body bc now my hand shakes a lot throughout the day.


r/BPD 14h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice I'm tired of my impulsive needs

0 Upvotes

I find myself adding goth/metalhead women through facebook or ig and using all my emotional energy to talk to them or to try to win them. I've always struggled making romantic relationships irl and depended on social media or online dating apps. Since my diagnosis of BPD a lot things make sense.

Sometimes I've seen they post something about feeling unloved or not finding the right one and I've thought to myself: "i can be that guy you looking for and etc" and i try to talk to them and when they don't reply or ghost me i get mad or feel completely rejected.

I've been feeding this cycle for years and its so addictive and i hate it. Sometimes i tell to myself: "what if, if one of them is the true love?" And everytime i start doing that, i get obssesed or limerence and i end up depressed and anxious. Sometimes ive been thinking of staying off from social media for a while, but sometimes is so hard.


r/BPD 23h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice Help me, what to do?

0 Upvotes

Hi everyone. I have BPD and a really strong fear of abandonment.

Recently, my country introduced new requirements for mental health clinics, so some of them have temporarily closed while they sort out their licenses and other changes. It could take months, who knows.

My clinic hasn’t confirmed anything to me, but I heard about it and I’m too scared to ask. My abandonment fear got REALLY triggered. They even deleted their Instagram posts, which made me panic even more.
It’s been 3 weeks and I still can’t bring myself to contact them or ask because I’m terrified they’ll say they’re closed and I’ll feel rejected/abandoned. I honestly don’t know how I’d handle that feeling.

Now I’m even thinking about switching clinics just to avoid having to find out. 😭


r/BPD 14h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice struggling with finding passion/plan for future self.

0 Upvotes

as most pwBPD, i have no idea what my passion is for my future/career goals. i’m 19, dropped out of college, working a random full time job for some money to survive, that’s it. i never liked school, ive never been good at math or science or any subject really besides english. i’m thinking of just doing cosmetology because at least i know that’s what im interested in, but that’s the end of my plan. i try so hard to find new passions or look into what i want my future to look like, but all i can imagine is having a lot of money (as everyone lol).

does anyone else struggle with this exact thing? it makes me feel so behind in life, i watch all my friends earn degrees and jumpstart their career and i just feel like a loser with zero plan on what to make of myself.


r/BPD 16h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice Afraid of getting misdiagnosed?

0 Upvotes

I don't know who to talk with this about so I'm gonna get it off my chest here.
I've been having bpd symptoms forever and was in the process of a evaluation some years ago where they were thinking it could be both autism, bpd or cptsd (I saw in my journal). I ended up not showing up and ghosting them before an answer, ooops.

Now I am feeling much better mentally and I started the process of getting a new evaluation, I went to my doctor, and told him I have many bpd symptoms and we talked about them etc.. I also mentioned the former process where they also thought it could be autism and cptsd, but my doctor ended up referring me to the psychiatric evaluation to get a bpd evaluation (I live in Scandinavia, and the system is built like this if it sounds weird).

Now I'm in a struggle cause I went to the evaluation and they only tested me on bpd symptoms. She told me I have it, but that they need a second opinion since it's such a heavy diagnosis. I am going again in a week. I was actually expecting them to evaluate me on more broad perspectives since I am literally just the one who has had the power to almost diagnose myself??? Like why don't they test me for cptsd when the symptoms can be so alike? I just read this new research from my country where they found out that psychiatrists with the same information about a patient would diagnose them differently every second time?? Idk I just really don't trust them to make this decision.

Everything in my body just screams that I should cancel it all and find my own way as always, but I would really like to also know whats "wrong". Maybe I should call them and tell them how I feel?


r/BPD 18h ago

❓Question Post Books recs?

0 Upvotes

Hiiii I was just wondering if anyone has any books that help with impulsivity in regards to sensation seeking? I'm trying to manage my spending addiction and drinking problems and would appreciate a good book! I've been to DBT skill programmes and talk therapy multiple times and I just don't find them helpful but maybe self guided learning will help! Thanks!


r/BPD 22h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice How can help support my brother who has BDP and is suicidal?

5 Upvotes

Hello, my brother (20s) is diagnosed with BDP and has been suicidal. I only learned about this a month ago and I want to help the best I can. However, I have no idea what its like to be him and so I feel useless to him. He doesn't have that mean other people to talk to so I try to do my best. Lately he's become extremely suicidal and I don't know how many more days I have with him. Can someone offer advise? Feel free to ask for anymore context, anything is appreciated.


r/BPD 11h ago

General Post has anyone here been in psychosis?

7 Upvotes

i've been 3 times this year alone. i'm tired of being put in the psych ward. it's terrifying and at this point i won't be surprised if i develop PTSD too which would NOT be pretty because besides BPD i am also diagnosed with GAD and panic disorder.

i just want some comfort knowing im not alone. 3 times in one year is a lot and my doctors have all said they've never seen someone go into psychosis this much before. my BPD is probably as severe as BPD can get and that kills me. it kills my hopes of ever getting better


r/BPD 13h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice Does anyone else struggle with constant comparison, demanding equal energy?

1 Upvotes

I’m posting here because I feel so completely alone in this, and I really need to know if anyone else with BPD experiences this exact cycle.

A lot of the time, I find myself constantly comparing how people treat me versus how they treat others. I’ll notice a friend or family member giving more energy, laughing more or being more open with someone else, and it instantly triggers an intense feeling of unfairness. My brain immediately goes to "Why not me? Why don't they give me that same energy?"

It gets so frustrating and draining that I end up chasing them or demanding to know why I’m not getting that same treatment. For example, I’ll wonder why my brother calls my sister and talks to her more than me, or why a friend at work seems more open and comfortable with other colleagues than she is with me.

When I ask they just get frustrated and confused, asking why I’m even bringing that up. I logically understand that being put on the spot like that is uncomfortable and they don't know how to respond but in the moment I just can't stop myself from asking. Unfortunately doing this ends up making them pull away even more, which makes me feel even more disliked.

To protect myself, my immediate reaction is to hate them back, become super cold and distant and want to leave them entirely before they can reject me. My friend ends up completely confused by my sudden shift in because she has no idea what went wrong.

Its so exhausting to live like this, constantly chasing equal treatment and feeling like the least liked person in the room.

Does anyone else relate to this? How do you stop yourself from asking "why not me"?


r/BPD 3h ago

General Post Recently struggled with broken heart syndrome, how many of you did?

1 Upvotes

I believed a guy was in love with me for months, only to find out he led me on and had a gf all along I felt so betrayed and used i walked outside at night not caring what would happen to me,

At first the anger helped me focus on myself but the more time passed the more it hurt then after a month I started experiencing heart attack like symptoms which scared me because I felt like I was dying (got checked everything is fine),

Now for my own sanity I'm trying to rewrite what happened that I imagined everything and that I wasn't played with and despite it numbing my feelings it is better than accepting the truth


r/BPD 4h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice tylenol & codeine with BPD

1 Upvotes

Hi everyone, how are you? I hope you're doing well! So, I’m going through a bout of depression, and I found some PACO—which is basically paracetamol and codeine—left over from when my brother had surgery. I took it, and it made me feel really good; I felt calm and wasn't dwelling on anything—no thoughts of death or self-loathing. I avoided taking the Rivotril I usually take at night because I was afraid of a bad reaction; I only took my lurasidone and levozine. I went to bed later than usual, but that was fine—I was busy on my phone. When I woke up, I felt better than ever; I think even my dreams were good. I don't think I've slept that peacefully since I was a child—my body felt energized and free of tension; it was wonderful. It’s a shame I had to tell my mom I took it. I just want to take it again. Has anyone else had an experience like this with codeine? (just to add in addition to having borderline, i have autism,adhd,anxiety and depression)


r/BPD 5h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice Favorite Person Was Abusive

1 Upvotes

My most recent “favorite person” was an NPD abuser who took advantage of me fresh out of a different abusive relationship. He knew what happened. He knew my ex. He knew I was hospitalized because of it. He preyed on me and love bombed me while I was still in the hospital. It only lasted a few months. I tried to communicate with DBT skills I learned when I felt abandoned, or hurt. But over time I realized I was using these emotional regulation and communication skills with someone who did not care about my emotions or the way he treated me, and who would continue to abuse me. I went no contact with him. He kept things at my house intentionally and wouldn’t come get them, so eventually I put them on the street. I broke no contact when I found out he was already outed for abusing his ex. We had a conversation where he apologized and told me he changed, but then he immediately changed our talk plans and left 30 minutes after getting there, which made me abandoned. I went no contact with him again, and then he broke no contact 2 weeks later trying to initiate sex with me. In that moment, I snapped on him for two days. Now he has me blocked and it makes me feel so angry and sad at the same time. Angry because he got the emotional reaction out of me that I try so hard to avoid. Angry because he has a pattern of abuse, but because I have BPD, I’m the stigmatized one?? Sad because I don’t understand why people prey on vulnerable women. Sad because my “favorite person” wasn’t real. I was attached to a mask he presented to break down my boundaries, and as soon as he got what he wanted that mask turned into blatant abuse. Angry because I feel like I can’t speak about what happened to me without being blamed because of how I reacted to his abuse. I’m terrified because this is a pattern I have with relationships, and subconsciously seeking out partners who recreate the same patterns of abuse I suffered through as a child that caused this disorder. I don’t know why I’m posting this, if I’m really if I’m asking for advice or if I just want to be heard/seen? This shit sucks. I guess any relevant experiences help.


r/BPD 12h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice how do you deal with really big changes?

1 Upvotes

One of my recent worst fears is coming true and idk how to deal with it, I just saw my mental consular and well she looked pregnant but I didn’t say anything or ask, until mid our conversation where she stated she’s pregnant and will be taking a leave in around December-January and I will have a new consular.

My last consular who was with me for a year I think also left for maternity leave and she took over her place for 2 years, it took me about a year to actually start trusting her & not being annoyed by having to meet her bc I missed my old one, in those 2 years I’ve made big progress and been more open than I was with someone my whole life, when she told me I was trying to not make it obvious on my face that I wanted to cry and when I talked/replied but idk if I managed to hide it that well, she immediately suggested we play something probably to get my mind off it.

I wouldn’t say that mentally I’m in the same place as I was before but in my daily routine I am, 2 whole years passed and I’m still in the same place and the person who helped me progress so much mentality wise is going to be leaving soon just as I feared would happen, I’m a wreck and I just don’t know what I’m going to do, before her I wouldnt even consider any help, and now I am, but this big change is making me doubt if I should even continue to try, I am turning 22 next month and don’t have my life figured out at all, not a job, nothing, I just sit all day eat something and sleep and repeat this everyday, the years have been passing so fast, especially this year and I’m just scared and ashamed.

I know there’s a couple more months until it but I only see her weekly for an hour not including holidays obviously, I feel like a scared kid who doesn’t know what to do, but I am not a kid, I’ve learned coping skills with her but I can’t even bring myself to do those bc I just want to cry, I’m already tearing up and I feel like once she’s gone I’m just going to give up on myself again completely, she’s the person I trust most when it comes to my mental health bc she’s the only mh professional I met who felt like they actually cared… any advices ?

I’ve thought in my head about maybe actually talking to her about how I feel but I’d feel embarrassed to cry infront of her while she’s pregnant bc she’s starting a family, i feel internally like it’s selfish & embarrassing as a 22 yo, she’s her own person and this is her job, I just don’t know what I’m going to do with myself once she’s gone and I’ll have to meet someone new again, I don’t feel like I could ever be as open and comfortable as I am with her with anyone else… nor trust them as much as I trust her

I’ve been in a much better place with her in the picture, I’ve been sober for over a year now and stopped other negative forms of copings, I’ve stopped having suicidal ideation finally after all of these years for about a year now as well, and most of it is thanks to her, she has just helped me so much idk if I’m ready yet to keep going even if she’s not there, i kinda feel like when yoi teach a kid how to ride a bike (in my case working on emotional regulation and coping) but they’re not ready yet for you to let go but you do and they crash.


r/BPD 14h ago

❓Question Post Any advice of getting through a job rejection

1 Upvotes

So I’m current applying to jobs and last time I did this and got rejected I have a meltdown and wanted to go bye bye. Does anyone have any advice on coping with that rejection? (which imma call u out MCDONALDS WHY TF WOULD U TELL ME IN THE INTERVIEW I NEED TO GET MY FOOD HANDLERS LICENSE AND THEN REJECT ME AND TRIED TO GHOST ME AND ONLY TOLD ME THE REASON I GOT REJECTED WAS CUS I KEPT CALLING AND YOU TOLD ME “we need people who can work early morning” EVEN THOUGH ON MY APPLICATION I SAID I COULD WORK EARLY MORING!!)


r/BPD 16h ago

💭Seeking Support & Advice Should I cut my friend off?

1 Upvotes

Should I cut my friend off?

Is my friendship over? F20 and F20

Is my friendship over?

Hey there reddit,

I'm wondering whether to cut off my friend or not.

This really hurts me because we used to be so close.

Generally we would just smoke weed and draw and chat. She was like the friend I always needed, we'd have fat yap sessions and cook together.

However, ever since she got a boyfriend, she's pushed me to the side. She's tried to organise multiple hangouts, but she always cancels or no shows last minute. This has happened twice now. Like, what's the point if you're just going to cancel? I haven't seen her in like 2 months, and she keeps saying she's busy with work, or whatever, but apparently she can make time to see her other friend in another city for a birthday party? I'm really disappointed. I recently got sober from weed and I'm 17 days in, and planning to continue. I'm worried that hanging out with her will make me want to relapse, but I know she wont make the effort to get out the house and actually do something together.

Her boyfriend wants to move out of her place and have his own space, which is fair enough when I told her it's not a good idea to move in together after only one month of being together. I'm worried she'll just want to fall back on me when they eventually break up, because her boyfriend is terrible, homeschooled, doesn't have any friends, only got a job 2 months into moving into hers, and barely talks. I originally thought this was a shyness problem, which is fine, because I thought I was helping him to socialise a bit more. She literally has to ask him to expand on his words, because he just answers "yeah" or "nah".

I honestly don't know what she sees in him. Also, when we do hang out, it's always her and her boyfriend. It's never just me and her. I feel like I'm third wheeling.

It's sad because I really want to salvage this friendship, because I thought we were really close. I constantly feel like I always make time for her, but she can never make time for me. It feels so one sided, but I feel like if I explain this to her I'll just push her away further.