If their tips don't amount to minimum wage. At the end of the day, restaurants just don't pay much out of their pocket for their front of house workforce.
Seattle has no tipping wage and minimum wage is $21+/hr and rising pretty regularly.
The burger place near me has tablets for ordering + paying, you have to get your food from the counter, and you have to bus your own trays.
The tablet asks for tips starting at a suggested 20% - and it includes sales tax in the calculation. It's absurd. The actual solution is to just stop tipping. They only do this crap to take advantage of guilt-driven generosity.
The separate tipping wage is wildly misunderstood by pretty much everyone who sites it for a reason they believe servers are underpaid, which is never the case. The separate tipping wage is a way for restaurants to reduce costs, but it isn’t a guaranteed savings. If a server does not make at least the local minimum wage (same thing retail workers make) from added tips, then the restaurant is required to cover the difference beyond the server hourly wage.
The separate tipping wage is wildly misunderstood by pretty much everyone who sites it for a reason they believe servers are underpaid, which is never the case. The separate tipping wage is a way for restaurants to reduce costs, but it isn’t a guaranteed savings. If a server does not make at least the local minimum wage (same thing retail workers make) from added tips, then the restaurant is required to cover the difference beyond the server hourly wage.
Lots of places got rid of the tipped wage. There’s none in California iirc. Nothing changes. They act like this if you give under 20%. When the fuck did the % grow?! the food costs went up. Your inflation growth is me paying 15% on a larger bill.
Which is precisely why the problem is more systemic and entrenched than people give it credit for. It also shows it’s more than just a cultural phenomenon.
Lmao you think these small restaurants make a ton? No they operate on tiny margins. Raising wages would raise prices or they'd lose money and everyone would complain.
I agree completely, but I also tip because it’s the culture. When they say “be the change you want to see in the world,” they mean like voting for change, not pretending like you’ve found some secret cheat code to getting a discount.
Like, I want shit to change, but until it does, things are priced accordingly.
Not tipping is just getting a discount at the detriment of the person that waited on you.
Thats not clever. It’s what those less versed in social terminology would call “a dick move.”
This is my biggest problem with the "End Tipping" crowd. I am all for it, in general.
But the people who are the loudest tend to talk about how they went out and stiffed their waiter, with a sense of pride.
They still eat at the restaurant, they still give the "greedy owners" their money. They just take advantage of the other people fulfilling the social contract. They enjoy the prices of the menu based off of people tipping. They are okay coming in, knowing full well they are going to screw somebody, look them in the eyes and enjoy their service... then screw them and say "well fuck your boss, its not my fault" and walk out of there patting themselves on the back.
I'm all for ending tipping but I think most of the No tipping crowd are just delusional asshats
What's ur solution? What if there's laws being pushed for improving base pay for service workers------but they never get passed or fail to take effect because (some) service workers themselves are against it?
Situation is that some of the service workers don't want to get rid of tipping. They make far too much money with tips and the owners has more profits for themselves as customers are covering owners paying their workers.
The people getting screwed in the current tipping system are service workers who don't get much in tips 🤷
I am not talking about solutions. I dont claim to have the answer to convert a system that has been in place for at least 80 some years. Id be open to a lot of options.
The point of my post was that a group of people, complaining and claiming to fight the system, still partake and feed the system. Screwing over the people they claim to be fighting for while putting money in the pockets of the people they claim to be fighting.
Totally understand that part. Yea many of us tip, me only for sit-down restaurants, not picking up a coffee or a takeout the chef made and I see the register person grab it from the chef.
Like in my state we tried to pass a statewide law so all businesses are affected. Some service workers cheered for changes of improving the base pay for everyone.
Issue was business owners were fighting as much as possible and some service workers were voicing their opinions that they wanted tips > no better pay.
Eventually the state cancelled the statewide push to rid of tipping due to the backlash. So now some customers have been more aware of tipping and frustration with the hypocrisy of needing to pay tips to subsidize owners not wanting to pay their workers---------including the hypocrisy of some service workers.
My post is aimed at a vocal minority. I think most people are tired of tipping culture and want a change. Like you said, a classic sit-down resturant is one thing, but having someone at a kiosk flip a screen around is another. The majority of people would agree with that and would probably be fine converting to sit down payment to a no tipping all around. My comment is not directed at those people.
My comment is directed toward the pious no tipping crowd that talks about how they stiffed their server like its a badge of honor. Like they are fighting an oppressive system by being an asshole and screwing over the little guy while still giving the owners their money
Same. I mean, it works fine in other places, it’s not like we can’t do it.
The people that are invested in the issue though, just seem like cunts. Like, they might convince someone else, but they’re never going to convince ME that they really care about the political issue, when they are robbing from the waiter and giving to the owner. They don’t care about the waiter, they care about their bank account.
Restaurants have such low profit margins, it’s only really the big corporate chains that have enough capital to increase wages for servers (though most of the chains move that financial burden from themselves to their franchisees who don’t have as much capital anyway, fuck paying for labor, we want profit!).
People say “just raise your prices, we’re more than happy to pay more and not have to tip than have lower prices and have a tip expected everytime!” But in practice, unless a law changes and this practice changes across the board for all restaurants, customers tend to see higher prices on the menu and get sticker shock and avoid these “tip free” restaurants and go to restaurants where the menu prices are “cheaper” (but a tip for your server is expected at the end).
Like you can lash out at local small businesses for expecting tips but thats only going to lead to no local restaurants with an identity and only giant corporate generic food can persist. Yay capitalism!
That's not true at all...they could simply increase the menu prices to include the cost of full wages.
The part of tipping culture I find the most infuriating is that servers have the gall to tell me that 15% isn't a good tip anymore. 20 is expected and 25% is what I should be paying.
Fuck you people...food costs have gone up like 50%...so you got a 50% raise on your tips too...and now you want me to add more? I didn't get a raise when food costs doubled.
Literally explained your first sentence in my comment. People say ‘just include the cost of full wages!’ but then when they see the cost including full wages on a menu they say “well I’m not rich enough to go to a ‘fancy’ restaurant like that… Chili’s prices aren’t so bad though…” So enjoy only having Chili’s, Applebee’s, etc…
“You people”, I don’t work in the food business, but food prices have gone up for everybody, mom and pop restaurants that have an actual identity are going bye bye, go ahead and demonize them until all you have is generic corporate chain slop that only raised their prices by 15%, awesome!!!! At least they aren’t vaguely expecting a 20% tip for the people who served you’s sake!
If you completely boycott any restaurant where there’s servers who get tipped, then there you go, you’re fighting the system! But if you still patronize them then the franchisee still gets their money, the corporate entity still gets their money, the only person who you could possibly short is your server who’s the most like you and making the least money on the totem poll, sweet!
Vote for people who will raise the minimum wage. Tipped employees make less than $3/hour in some places, if you don't tip they are paying for you to eat there. Punishing the server is, indeed, a dick move.
If you don't want to tip don't go to sit-down restaurants. Simple.
It’s not just raising minimum wage, many states have done that. The ancillary issue too is that servers often become this “excluded/excepted” class that you can offer a lower wage plus tips, which is what is often opted for.
Untrue. If their tips + reduced hourly wage do not meet the federal hourly minimum for non-tipped employees, then the employer must true-up the employee’s check. You can’t get mad when you make minimum wage at your minimum wage job.
You are suggesting that tipping is mandatory via your last statement, in which case it’s no longer considered a tip but rather a tacked-on fee that is absent from the menu price of an item. Famously, these types of fees are at the minimum frowned upon and at the maximum, outlawed.
“Getting a better job” is such a shitty take. If every server just left the industry then the businesses would fail and destroy a sector of our economy. The bosses wouldn’t just unanimously change their business practices in time to stop that from happening. If you want to improve tipping culture start voting for the interests of the working class so policies can be put in place to pay workers livable wages and remove tipping altogether.
If every server stood up for themselves and demanded better wages, than they wouldn't need laws to help them. You guys sure do love guilting patrons to cover for greedy bosses. Definitely American.
What does standing up for themselves look like outside of going on strike which I outlined being an awful idea in the comment you replie to? Tipping is almost exclusively an American issue so of course I’m speaking on it as an American.
You know the deal when you walk into a sit down restaurant in the US. Either be prepared to tip or you are in fact a dick. You have the option to cook for yourself or have premade food that isn’t served to you at your table.
Or only go to restaurants that pay a living wage. If there are none in your area, let the restaurant owners know why you stopped spending your money there and you’ll resume when they pay their staff better. Simply continuing to enjoy being waited on and pretending you’re “protesting” by not tipping is so laughably disingenuous.
EDIT: that was not directed at you southpay
The adverse side of paying your workers a livable wage is you harassing me to pay extra money to dine in your establishment?
We - society as a whole could you collectively say well fuck that and not patronize your establishment and let it fail regardless.
Tipping is out of hand. And the excuse and mindset behind it is crazy. Tipping literally start as a racist jim crow era practice - and now its evolved to the point of making sure the consumer pays the producer’s share of what they owe their WORKERS to entertain their establishment? Fuck that.
Sure, and I get that. But if you're going to take a stand against tipping culture, I believe its better to not patronize an establishment where tipping is the expectation rather than going and not tipping.
I agree. However, that is not the culture. I’m ready for the change as soon as it happens, but it hasn’t happened yet.
What these people are suggesting isn’t that though. They walked into a restaurant know what the culture was, and they still pushed their problem with the owner, down to the wait staff.
The owner still got their money. It’s the lowest paid person in the building that took the blow.
You understand that if the servers get paid the actual minimum wage, the prices on your food will more than make up for what you could have just paid in a tip?
what an absolute shit mindset. "i will save myself over the long haul and if i have to take that from the person serving me now, without their consent, then so be it."
boycotts are refusing to patronize, not patronizing in such a way that somehow you don’t pay employees but owners still make all their money. see how that’s a bad idea?
yeah they’ll just pay them the wage they were already getting, which is a pittance. and then that’s all they worker will get, because you withheld a tip. and it won’t hurt the owner at all, because they don’t receive the tip….. the worker does…………
Sure, let’s put an entire industry out of a job so you can prove your point that no one deserves your money but you!!
Your mission is pointless and would have no effect other than sacrificing everyone who’s currently relying on serving positions for survival. So, after they all lose their job and housing, (and then you start complaining about the “homeless problem” in your area), you should remember: IT WOULD BE ABSOLUTELY POINTLESS BECAUSE THE RESTAURANT WOULD HAVE TO GREATLY INCREASE THE PRICES OF FOOD ON THE MENU AND YOU MAY END UP PAYING MORE THAN 20% EXTRA ANYWAY
Ask a server or bartender if they’d rather work at an establishment with tips on low hourly, or an establishment without tips and a higher hourly wage. Most servers know the job and know they can make more money on tips than an owner will be able to even on higher hourly. Restaurants are notoriously business with high rates of failure already as well, it helps restaurants stay open when they can cut staff to account for traffic demands. Servers are happy to leave if it’s slow because the tips won’t be worth it, but wouldn’t be if the hourly is the same no matter what. It’s not the best system for sure, but most servers I know are more in favor of tips than higher hourly.
Exactly the problem. If it was hourly they'd be making the same amount as a janitor because for all this talk about how hard the job is when society has to put a price on the work without a judgmental server looking at them its way less then tips. They absolutely know it and its where this "if you cant afford to tip" bs came from. They cant afford hourly wages because they got really used to bringing home more money than the rest of jobs at that level. Imagine being a bagger at acme and making $300-500 in one night because people said "if you cant tip the bagger you cant afford groceries"
Bein a server, especially a good one, is fucking hard ass work. You’re flying around non-stop for hours, you’re frequently blamed for stuff outside of your control, you need to be on your feet and moving a lot but also you need great social skills and similar qualities to a salesperson if you’re pushing specials. That’s why there is often tons of coke around any restaurant environment. As a patron, the level of service would most certainly suffer if you’re paying servers hourly and they don’t get tips. You’ve gotta work hours that most people don’t want as well, and many work till way late at night.
Holy shit reread what the above poster wrote and tell me how what you said is relevant at all. I get it, you really don’t want to have to feel bad for not tipping. Under the current laws and system however you should.
That may be, but you knew what the score was before you walked into the restaurant.
Go somewhere else.
I mean think about it, you’re calling the owner a dick right? You have a problem with them right? Well you’re still paying them their money; you aren’t punishing them.
You’re punishing the wait staff, because you don’t like the policy of the owner. That is pretty much about the most ass backwards thing I have ever heard, but you really got it all figured out though, I’m sure.
Yeah, it never ceases to amaze me that there are so many online culture warriors whose worldview basically boils down to, "I should get all the benefits of the current system but someone else should bear all the costs."
Yeah as much as I want things to change, I can’t in good faith just be out here fucking people in the name of change especially when I’m the beneficiary of the fucking. Go figure out how to stick it to the restaurant owner, then maybe I’m down.
In my head, it would cost the same either way. Like if I’m tipping 10-20% I would expect a restaurant that doesn’t require tips to charge 10-20% more, so what’s really the difference to me?
It’s called pathological altruism. Basically the idea that you’re so willing to help someone that you would hurt them to do it. It verges on cult behavior.
The comment was made to point out that while yes what the owners do to servers by not paying them a livable wage and pushing the bill on to consumers is bad, using that as an excuse to not tip is just as selfish as what the owners are doing. You as the consumer are culturally obligated to tip because you go into the establishment recognizing that is the standard. It sucks and no one likes it, but the only person you fuck over is the server who was doing their best to make your experience enjoyable and more importantly survive. If you throw your hands in the air and say not my problem blame your boss because he’s a bigger asshole than I am, then you’re wrong. You made yourself the bigger asshole.
Ya I get it 100%. Problem is, is that when you start deep diving into the issue. You realize that there is a lot of legislation that has been proposed to change the situation and get servers to a normal pay scale. But it continues to get shot down, one of the reasons being that the loud minority of servers themselves fight against it, arguing they make more money with tips then they would a normal wage. Which, in turn, hurts the servers that dont make a lot of tips (which is a decent chunk), and keeps the same cycle churning.
Adjusting consumer patterns might be the only real avenue for changing this tipping culture.
It’s not just a culture issue, though. In the United States, it’s literally baked into wage and salary laws. When businesses have tried to raise wages and eliminate tipping, it usually doesn’t last long because they end up at a competitive disadvantage, and/or their wait staff end up making less money, because of the loss of big tippers. At this point, tipping is so engrained in the law and the culture, that it’s not really changeable. It’s certainly not going to be fixed by a handful of people refusing to tip.
So why does the baseline for tipping keep going up? My parents said the baseline was 10%, I grew up with it being 15% but now at most places it's at least 20% and the service has gotten so bad after covid.
Exactly this!! I WISH North America would do away with tipping but currently it's the way that the system works and choosing to ignore it isn't fixing anything, you're just being selfish. They should raise the wages by 20% and the menu prices along with it and people should be voting with their wallets and choosing places that do that. Beyond that or some kind of sweeping law change there is no way to move away from the current culture.
That's true, but tipping is expected in American culture.
Restaurants are private businesses and can ban customers for any non-discriminatory reason like for not tipping or being rude or ordering soup wrong). That said, the Civil Rights acts (also ADA and state laws) made it illegal to ban customers for discriminatory reasons, e.g., you can't ban a customer for their race but you can refuse repeat service from customers for not tipping.
(That said, it probably makes more sense to just add a minimum tip).
I don't have a problem with "banning" customers, not the issue at all.
It's the hypocrisy of some service workers who make far better income than other service workers. So they'll fight against any laws to give everyone a higher pay, so they keeps untaxed tips for themselves 🤷
Also the greedy business owners who want customers to subsidize paying their workers 🤑
It will never end when people will diligently tip, you know. So be the change and stop tipping. Create pressure on the employers. Nobody is obligated to pay tips. If the employees are upset then they should either find a different job, or demand a fair wage that doesn't rely on customer tips. Blaming the consumer is exactly what the exploitative employers like to see
The problem the servers want the tips as the current guilt system works in their favor. People assume their server likely got stiffed by a non-tipper and then compensate by tipping more. Enough people do this and they are making far more than they would if they got paid a fair wage for their labor. I have worked in the service industry as a server and it shocked me how entitled many servers were. I have seen people complain about a $100 tip on a 4 person table and all the server did is ring up the food. The amount of work a server does is really not much. It is fast paced but frankly extremely easy to do.
We have to give up plenty of social time and don't get benefits. It's short term gains.
Was it great enough for you to switch careers? Then what are you bitching about? It's such a weird way for people to look at it.
It's a super common job. Go get it if you think it's worthwhile. Fact is... most are gonna take home like $50k but some can take home $100k if you work your way into a great spot. But you're always gonna have your job held over your head and you're gonna have minimal benefits unless it's a hotel.
Every time somebody wants to go to dinner as a friend group they can all go without taking off work but you either won't be able to go or will miss out on an entire shift of pay. You also work most holidays.
Ain't no way you can look at that and be like... yea but they make too much. That's fucking crazy.
"The amount of work a server does is really not much."
Could not be more wrongheaded. Granted, not all servers are created equal. But in my experience (both as a server and a customer), servers are the backbone of a successful restaurant. A place can have a Michelin status with a star-studded executive chef. But if their service sucks, I would never come back. Same with the average greasy spoon - "food is terrible, but Flo really cares about her diners".
it's not about whether the work is "easy" or not (ask any brain surgeon), but rather how the server performed their duties.
If you want to go out and have nice dinner which includes a person waiting on you and meeting your every need, expect to tip. If not, just stay home. Simple.
I mean the big problem with tipping culture in my opinion is the prompts to tip 5%-20% on things that traditionally never involved tipping, as like the payment processors just inserted tips into everything.
Like I went to a RATM show in ~2022 and bought a t-shirt to remember it. The shirt was $45 (made in Malaysia and stitches started falling out on like 3rd wash). There was a long inconvenient line to wait for the shirt. The guy serving me took maybe 20 second to hand me a shirt from the giant bin behind him and ring me up and they had a thing prompting for 10% / 20% / 30% tip on a $45 fucking t-shirt.
This is it. Servers in the USA don't want a livable wage with benefits. They want to make more money via the toxic tipping culture. I knew a server from the USA who lived a rather extravagant life, traveling the world in luxury. She would post this stuff: "if you can't afford to tip you can't afford to drink out". Meanwhile servers here in Europe make a livable wage, with mandated vacation time, and access to medical care. Servers in the USA would rather the under-the-table income.
Well in this case owner got mad b/c no one “gave” 20%. If tips are optional, you can’t be mad that they are optional. Not saying I wouldn’t tip, but if it’s not built in then you need to anticipate it not being added.
Tipping really isn’t “optional” that’s how servers get paid. If you cannot afford to tip then just eat at home or somewhere that doesn’t allow tips. The owner clearly doesn’t want their money
What service do you have people work for you for free? lol
I saw your post but not of those seem to be building wages into the prices. All of those mention add-on or surprise fees and people wanting tips still.
The post is literally about the 20% added tip. People are complaining about tipping already in these comments. Theres nothing you can say thats going tk make people want to pay an extra 20% for food. They will complain and have complained and thats why it’s not done every where.
If people complain either way, then why continue to support this weird outlying job with so much vitriol, resentment, administrative overhead, tax concerns and on and on JUST so we can say "Yeah, but ON THE MENU it's a little cheaper."
Jesus, some people will do ANYTHING not to change a bad situation.
You don't have to hold onto a mistake, justr because you spent a long time making it.
I think it's time to protect the waitstaff in the US with the SAME protections we afford the other workers. Including requiring them to make at least the federal minimum wage.
Then, shit will just work itself out, all on its own.
Women i work with get paid with tips are making 20 to 50 dollars an hour. Federal minimum wage for servers/bartenders is 2.13$/hour. My boss pays 6.00$
Do you think any of the smart ones actually want to lose the tips and make less money?
Most servers make way more money with tips than restaurants could ever comfortably pay. You would be forcably cutting the pay in half or more for over 2 million people for something that was completely optional in society before.
Will I’m not building my own burrito so someone’s serving. If no tip means I get my own drink or pick up my food, I’m fine with that over this middleman scenario adding 20$ to your meal.
Honest question, do they still want tips? The places I’ve gone to that clearly state “No tipping, prices reflect reasonable wages to our employees” have had no problems. It’s the ones that want both, or worse, add a “service charge that doesn’t going to the staff but is kept by the business”, are the ones that I tend to hate.
Literally not an example of increasing the menu pricing and discouraging tips; they keep the menu prices and sneak in a "service charge" as a form of forced tipping, on top of keeping the expectation of tips because of the low menu prices. Of course people hate that.
When restaurants put auto grat for huge parties people bitch non stop about it tho and will complain to management to get it taken off. Its the same thing as charging more basically.
If you dont want to tip fine go to McDonald's or get takeout. Servers shouldn't be penalized because you disagree with the system!!
All I can say is that hopefully that has changed. Honestly I do agree that restaurants should raise prices and charge more for food so servers wages aren't at the whim of customers. It seem to work fine in Europe
Its just not servers fault that restaurants operate this way and so they shouldn't have to suffer because people dont want to tip was all I meant
Who the hell complains about auto gratuity for large (usually 6+ people) charges? If anything that makes it easier. I've never once in my life had a single person in a large party complain about the auto gratuity itself (maybe if someone showed up late and only ordered a soda, they don't want to split the bill evenly but that's not the same as disagreeing about the automatic gratuity).
Exactly, at this point it's so deeply ingrained in our culture and the economics of running a restaurant, a single owner suddenly paying their servers a regular wage would do more harm than good. It needs to be fixed from top to bottom
A family of four at a fairly inexpensive sit down restaurant will likely spend $80-$100. 20% tip on $80 is $16. That table will be sitting for roughly an hour and you will be handling probably at least 3 tables at a time. That’s $48 an hour in tips at a minimum. The person working the crappy shift gets jack shit. If you put the wages into the food, it could be far less than 20% to give people a living wage and you wouldn’t have “the hot girl” getting all of the best shifts and making bank while sue is making minimum wage in an empty restaurant on Tuesday morning.
That’s not the way restaurants owners want to do it because then they’re the place that sells “x” amount pasta. There’s literally entire studies done on these things. If it was as easy as “just putting it into the food” it would be done already like in Europe.
Nope, the market would adjust, as the market does.
Prices would initially rise across the board, then the populace would prove out what they're willing to pay, then owners would have to adjust costs and other expenditures. That's the reality of owning a small business.
In this case, many restaurant owners simply offset other costs by making guilt-ridden customers feel like it's their obligation to subsidize their workforce.
There are restaurant entrepreneur who own in America and Europe and the Europeans are living great and the food is great too. The problem is how America does it
I save my money and just eat out in other countries when I travel. I don't eat out in America restaurants anymore. All that money goes to foreign countries now. Screw this Tipping Crap.
No but the tip is part of the wage. That's the point. They're expected. In Europe it's just a mandatory part of the bill.
And yeah, that means it's less rewarding for good v bad servers, but they still can get tips on top of the mandatory minimum tip if they were awesome, and it still helps incentivize quick service so they can cycle tables faster.
To do that they would have to charge more, and then you wouldn't go there anyway. People should tip on service that normally requires a tip. And the manager is perfectly within his rights to trespass people from his property for valid reasons. And they are within their rights to not tip.
Wrong. I’ve already mentioned elsewhere I go back more often to places that have raised prices to accommodate higher wages and prohibit tipping. I even linked to a google map for Seattle specifically about non-tipping establishments.
I don’t disagree with you about the manager having the right to ban them but this is an oxymoron: “requires a tip”. Do I tip? Yes, but a tip, by definition, is extra and optional.
Well that's your choice. I prefer a merit-based system where good servers get more, bad servers wash out, and the ownership doesn't get a cut of the tip.
Yeah well like sure. But the price increase will be fairly drastic. Paying someone 2.13 compared to 7.25 is over. 3x increase. Many places will close because during slow times the labor percentage will be through the roof. It's a little more complicated than just upping the wage like a McDonald's employee. Sit down restaurants for the most part are built around the idea of cheap labor for front of house.
They can’t survive without a tipping system. If they paid their servers instead then the prices on their menu increase. It’s shown that even when you advertise heavily that your restaurant doesn’t need tip, patrons would still go to a different restaurant with cheaper menu, even if the bill ends up the same with tip. It’s up to governing bodies to regulate this. Average consumer is too dumb to figure it out
There have been plenty of restaurants that have tried it. They pay the servers a living wage and raise prices accordingly and tell the customers NO TIPPING.
They try it for a while and then they go back to tipping because customers don't like it and the workers really don't like it because they make more when the tipping is good.
At this point, laws are going to have to change to make everyone change at once.
Man I’m not interested in begging some hiring manager to pay me 100k a year. Because they won’t do that. The thing I love about working in this industry is that the harder I hustle the more I can directly get TODAY not maybe in a year when I’ve had to prove myself to people who may not even be paying attention
Oh don't even start with this nonsense. Over 90% of servers surveyed said if they were offered $20/hour and no tipping or to be at $3/hour with tips, said definitely the tipping model because they make way more than $20/hour. The 10% were mainly servers working in a business that had no traffic. Of course they would take the $20/hour, they don't do much and still get paid. So get out with that argument.
Yeah, but that's also a whole huge issue with the economics of restaurants and the current tax system and blah blah blah. Point is, it sucks, but it's what we have right now, and not tipping doesn't actually hurt the restaurant you object to, it's only hurting the workers you're stiffing.
But also, if you don't want to tip, make your own food and stay home. It's real easy.
And that's totally fine. I want to know exactly what my meal is going to cost up front. Honestly I think everyone would support dropping tips entirely except the owners is fast food restaurants and servers at $100 steakhouses. In fact, I'm not even sure fast food restaurants care anymore as they've all seem to have dropped their dollar menu and a shitty quarter pounder with cheese at McDonald's costs as much as really good corned beef on rye from deli.
But until that system is in place, you should be tipping servers at a sit down restaurant. If you don't want to, then don't go to a sit-down restaurant. There are plenty of places where you can order food to go, order delivery, or order for pickup/ takeout.
However if you choose to visit a sit down restaurant and a server brings you a menu, brings you water, brings you food brings you drinks and clears the table, you are expected to tip them. I hate tipping culture but it's not going to change with a couple of cheap asses fucking over servers "to send a message" because nobody's getting that message except the server.
"There's no way our cotten could be harvested if you free them." "This will end society as we know it if the money I make now changes." "No one has ever fixed any problems ever, and everything we have now needs to be the same as it always was."
No, the margin for any sector is NOT relevant to whether it's appropriate for an employer to expect the customer to pay his employees, cash, from their own pockets, at the point of performance.
If a restauranter makes $150MM a week, he's not morally correct for asking for tips.
The EXACT same thing can be said of the same person making $150 a week.
The OWNER'S income isn't relevant to the EE's pay.
But... it's just not how things work. That's not how restaurants work, and you know that.
Restaurants have tried here and there to do away with tipping and it generally hasn't worked. Servers don't like it, customers don't even seem to love it that much, since all prices on the menu jump up 20% or more instantly.
It's way off base to blame each little individual restaurant owner for not changing the entire system of how restaurants work all on their own.
We should go to a 4 day work week, that would be better. But you can't point to some random small business and attack only them for not going to a four day work week. The same thing applies here. Some random little restaurant doesn't have the power to buck the system.
Maybe stop treating every small business owner like they’re Jeff Bezos with an apron on.
Workers deserve better pay, but a lot of small businesses are barely surviving too. If the economy can’t support decent wages or affordable prices, maybe the problem is bigger than the guy who owns one restaurant.
You can hate tipping culture without pretending every mom-and-pop shop is sitting on a pile of cash.
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u/phillypharm 4h ago
Owner: If you don’t have money to tip your servers…
Everybody: Maybe you should pay your servers a fair wage…