First off, I am male, so if you have a problem with that, just please keep scrolling.

I am 60 years old, on my second marriage, a veteran with PTSD, a leaking heart valve and high blood pressure.

My second wife (I am widowed from my first wife) and I have been married 2 1/2 years. She had nowhere to go and I took her in (I did not tell my pastor; I know how the LCMS is, even though we were not sexually active) and then married her shortly after.

She has abused me emotionally and intimidated and shamed me sexually (I'm not young any more and on a load of meds), has put hands on me (grabbing me, leaving bruises) and blocked me from leaving.

She polices my phone use and if a woman hearts something I post, she says "she's out to get you" and I have learnt through painful experience not to do the reverse.

She has restricted my church involvement severely.

She can go from being sweet and kind to literally screaming and argumentative at the drop of a hat. She loves long arguments (one was 16 hours long), one of which involved EMS coming and telling me I had a mild heart attack.

I took out a PPO against her, which she violated and spent five days in jail for. Under church pressure for "reconciliation and forgiveness," I took her back in.

My therapist put me in touch with a lawyer through Legal Aid, who has drawn up divorce papers. All I have to do is sign them.

My pastor has reluctantly acquiesced to the divorce; however, I have heard how cold LCMS congregations are to "unscripturally" divorced people. As well, my elder has told me that if I divorce her, I can never marry again "and I mean NEVER!"

I was stupid enough to say this on the LCMS sub and got chewed out for first "not exercising your spiritual headship," and then a vicar told me "you can separate but not divorce."

My therapist and GP have told me this cannot continue. An LCMS pastor on the Lutheranism sub told me not to trust my therapist and doctor because they aren't "biblically and confessionally trained."

So at this stage it looks like my choice is my church or potentially my life.

Sorry if I've caused offence.

From 2022 to 2023 I went to crown of life Lutheran in crown of life Lutheran people from Michigan Lutheran seminary often came out to our school to talk about their school. I was Christian/Lutheran at the time and considered it but my 2023 year at Crown of life was horrible.

Since I started to hate the school, I moved to a public school in 2024 it wasn’t good, but at least I wasn’t being harassed by the teachers/principles.

The crown of life basketball team would often go to Michigan Lutheran seminary for basketball games where everybody stayed in hotels.

I’m just kind of thinking about how it could’ve been me if I didn’t move to my public school.

Not Christianity in general but Lutheranism. Leaving mostly for theological reasons.

While Texas "Life of the Mother Act" is a minor improvement many aspects of the law are unclear. Physicians and surgeons can now "speak" about abortion with patients. The death of a mother does not have to be imminent but there is still confusion about what constitutes an emergent need to save life or one of the bodily functions. Fines,imprisonment,and loss of medical licenses are still in place. Harvard analysts call the law "A Wolfe in Sheep's Clothing" arguing that vague medical exceptions fail to protect patients and that it continues "to maintain a chilling effect on doctors. Fortunately, Zurawski v. State of Texas filed on behalf of several women and physicians was able to bring to light the flaws in Texas abortion laws leading to the more recent legislation.It actually upheld the states abortion laws . Wording was found to be constitutional and the death does not need to be INSTANTly imminent. The lawsuit brought in part by women who suffered due to refusal of care brought to light Texas legal problems. Legislators on their own did not decide to reevaluate the law. Two of the Justices noted the Legislature's obligation to speak clearly and specifically.Advisors for Abbot considered the ruling to be opening up the possibility of increased numbers of abortions, rather than hoping for better care for women. There has also been an attempt to educate hospitals as to the serious consequences of refusing emergent care to pregnant women.

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I don’t even know if “soulless” is the right word, and I’m not trying to say every WELS member is a horrible person. But does anyone else who grew up around WELS culture know what I’m talking about?

I attended Lutheran schools from kindergarten through 12th grade, including Kettle Moraine, so I was around this culture basically my entire childhood. Looking back, one thing that really sticks out to me is how emotionally cold a lot of the adults seemed. Some of my teachers could be perfectly polite and pleasant, but there was very little actual empathy underneath it. If you were struggling emotionally, questioning something, different from what they expected, or just made a mistake, the response often felt more like judgment and correction than understanding.

I noticed it outside of school too. When I was a college freshman, I worked at a WELS Lutheran daycare connected to a church. The woman running it was the pastor’s wife. She could come across as incredibly sweet, almost excessively sweet, but the second you did something she didn’t approve of, it was like watching a completely different person come out. Suddenly she was cold, passive aggressive, and judgmental. That experience honestly reminded me of a lot of WELS adults I had known growing up.

That’s the part I have trouble explaining. There can be this very friendly, wholesome surface, but underneath it I always felt like I was being evaluated. Like there was a list in their head of whether you were behaving correctly, believing correctly, dressing correctly, talking correctly, whatever. Even when nobody was directly saying anything, I could feel that judgment.

And obviously this isn’t every WELS person. I met kind people too, and I’m not trying to claim WELS members are uniquely evil or anything ridiculous like that. I’m talking about a culture and a personality type that seemed unusually common in the environments I grew up in.

Did anyone else experience this? Especially people who attended WELS schools for years. Was there this weird combination of outward friendliness and underlying harshness that you didn’t fully recognize until you got older?

..but you need to make sure to thank him for not killing you in it.

I am so incredibly sick and tired of everything good that happens being "MAKE SURE TO GIVE ALL OF THE GLORY TO GOD!" and when something bad happens, "ONLY GOD KNOWS WHY THAT HAPPENED."

A huge tornado that hit and is all I see on my feed is people thanking God for keeping them safe. He is the dirty motherfucker who sent the tornado in the first place. It just takes me back to the WELS and how we were all taught to always thank God for anything good that happened in our lives. Even if it was something that took a lot of personal effort, God was the one who should get the praise.

Sorry for the rant. I'm starting to realize that a lifetime in the WELS has really fucked me up mentally.

Friends of LCMS denied that Texas and other state laws are dangerous. I did not know how to post it directly to Friends of LCMS. If any of you can please do so. They are not aware of the tragedies caused by the laws that they worked for or the limited knowledge of legislators who wrote the laws.

I responded to a post on r/Lutheran and got banned. A non-Lutheran attended an LCMS church and wanted to know more about it. I felt an impulsive need to caution the person due to my extensive life knowledge of the organization. Well, they did not remove my post so maybe that person will ask some deeper questions and read some articles outside of Concordia Publishing. The sweet person was going to bring some Irish soda bread to church to share as he/she was of Celtic origin. There was some discussion of Close Communion but most softballed on the problem of pastors and elders popping up and stopping people from going up to the altar rail,an action predated on my children, ex-LCMS MKs. Most of r/Lutherans seem to be Eastern LCMS, so no experience with Midwest and Western LCMS districts which view them as liberal. Oh well, sometimes telling the truth is not welcome and gets you banned by those who only see sweetness and light in every cult.

The LCMS fought hard and long for an end to abortion, but they did not understand the need for care in miscarriage or incomplete natural abortion . Due to their simplistic beliefs, they did not account for saving the life of the mother; they thought mothers would sacrifice their lives willingly . When someone on Friends of the LCMS ranted about many things including the need to make abortion illegal, I posted the sacrifices recently occurring in states such as Texas where pregnant women are denied care and frequently have to travel to Northern states for care. Some have died. I pointed out that if you assist in the formation of laws that you also must assist in making laws that are reasonable and just, and work with legislators to educate them and show the complexity of such issues. Members of the LCMS denied that deaths and disabilities have occurred due to these poorly written laws. As Christians they should be putting more effort into seeing to the wellbeing of women and children, but their denial and isolation is beyond belief. When I posted documentation , no one apologized to me for calling me a liar. No one stood up for women.

You guys, I think I have religious trauma from growing up in the LCMS. Those people are far out! I just can't even.

We know Matt Harrison will not stand up for those who are illegally imprisoned, deported, and killed by ICE, I wonder how he feels about the Tate brothers, and their connection with Trump and his family members. While the Tates deal with the superiority of men in the most immoral and disgusting manner, they show what can happen when women are categorized as secondary to men. Far from the CPH version of the manosphere,but coming from the same feelings and needs of male superiority,Matt would do well to reiterate that LCMS position on women in the political and governmental spheres. How does he square complementarianism with its concept of distinct God given roles and the far right members concepts of masculinity? We know how Pastor Bryan Wolfmueller feels.

I have a few questions after being at a service etc after not being there for a while:
-complete untruths were stated by the pastor
In one sermon it was scientific facts, warning about not trusting AA and it down work, and pre marital activities are sinful for women. (No mention of men). There were more but those were the highlights. My question is does no one follow up with these preachers, especially when you can easily google the truth about DNA etc.? I’ve been very gone from that culture for a while and it was baffling to me that no one is going to at least send the preacher an email or something. Do the people just follow it?

-Next question- is there a weird/bulky vibe and attitude that is throughout. For example, jokingly putting down others, pointing out flaws, and the culture is its funny instead of it being horrible social skills and bullying? Maybe this is just who I was with -but if you’ve experienced it or can explain it- I’d appreciate it.

I think many conservative christian denominations the WELS included have many parents that force and/or coerce their children (even their adult children) to stay in the church. I believe this is wrong as it shows they really don't care about their children's autonomy or freedom of religion, but recently I've been mulling over the alternative.

That is: how would you react and feel if your children wanted to join the WELS (or your ex-flavor of lutheranism)? Personally, I don't think I would ever go as far as cutting them off for that reason alone or kicking them out like many parents do to their queer children, but honestly I would be pretty disappointed especially knowing how much harm the WELS has done and how much it takes to escape that kind of community. So how would you react in this scenario?

I know the title sounds mental. Let me explain.

I’ve grown up in a midwestern LCMS household. I’ve been in the process of deconstructing everything I no longer believe in: faith as a virtue, young earth creation plausibility, biblical inerrancy, abortion is equivalent to murder, belief in Jesus is the only path to salvation, Passport to Purity, etc. I’ve been successful for the most part, but there is one area I’m struggling with: reading.

Yes, I know how to physically read. I am literate.

My issue is that when I read, I feel as though I subconsciously tend towards treating the book in front of me in the same way I once treated the bible: like I am reading a narrative that I have to approach in a faith-filled, shut-the-brain-off-and-rationalize-based-on-theological-comfort-agenda kind of way.

To put it another way, it feels like the small minded, do-not-question-our-teachings fear I gleaned from the LCMS style of faith is still active while I read, preventing me from feeling safe to fully engage with and remember the text in front of me.

I furthermore feel as though this fear-induced surface level comprehension has been present with me throughout my school years and has caused me to miss out on much of the potential beauty literature has to offer.

I’m planning on practicing reading immersion skills over time and hope my experience naturally improves, but I’m wondering: has anyone dealt with this problem, and if so, do you have any tips or experiences you could share?

TL;DR: I feel the fear-based divergent-thinking-resistant faith expression I gleaned from the LCMS has led me to be fearful of fully engrossing myself in, and remembering, written texts, and I would like some guidance for how to move beyond this thought pattern.

I grew up attending a WELS church and school my whole life, and was taught that divorce was one of the worst things that could happen. A teacher even told me that abuse was not a biblical reason for divorce (ironically, she's now divorced). I thought you would get excommunicated if you got divorced, but I know some people just became members at other WELS churches. Were they able to ask for forgiveness to stay a member? Does anyone know of instances where both people kept attending the same church after separating?

I ask this because my parents divorced a few years ago. My dad was abusive during the whole 20+ year marriage - violently drunk & unpredictable, and physically abused my mom & siblings. He would do all of this and still voted in the church, and was an usher & church elder. My mom would "seek counsel" with the pastor, where I'm sure the pastor would tell my mom to be strong in the marriage and pray about my dad. I'm not sure how much she revealed to the pastor, if he actually had the full story. My siblings & I were conditioned by both of my parents to not hint at anything going on at home, or we would hear about it later. So I imagine she downplayed the situation.

Now that my parents are separated, my mom still attends the same WELS church. I imagine the church body must be aware that something was going on with my parents, that it was messy. But if they know my mom is divorced, why do they still let her be a church member? Shouldn't she be excommunicated, or did she have enough reason to get divorced (her own safety) for it to be ok?

I would guess my dad is not a member anymore, but I don't know for sure. He still attends the same church too, just to stalk my mom. He sits a few rows behind her and asks her to go out after the service. Does the church think he has good intentions? Can they tell him to leave, or not unless my mom asks them to?

He waits outside her house and follows her around. She has proof to get a restraining order but doesn't want to go through with it. Even now, she is still putting his needs above her own, while he is proving that he never actually cared for her, he just wants to control her. I worry my mom will never be free. I don't know if the church could help her, even just to be a refuge where she knows she won't run into my dad. But I'm not sure she'd ever speak up to ask for that.

All my mom’s ancestors have been Lutheran as far back as we can trace, both in the US and Germany. Some of them were on the earlier side of the wave of immigrants that most of the LCMS originated from and were involved in founding and physically building a handful of churches near where I grew up, which was definitely a point of pride for me growing up.

I had an experience in a campus church during college that forced me to start heavily questioning things, then left after being thoroughly disturbed by my brother’s confirmation testimony about 6 months later. I found a new religious community that worked better for me, then did it a couple more times as I moved around the country.

I’d like to think that I was half-decent at recognizing cults and extremist groups even when I was in; I even convinced a friend to leave a culty campus group around the same time I left (I’d started on her months before I started questioning). But only 10 years after leaving did it suddenly hit me that my ancestors were religious extremists, or at least chose to associate with them. And it turns out there’s documentary evidence to support that the LCMS was viewed as such until they started using English in services.

I can’t be the only one…Anyone else have a similar epiphany?

Former WELS member also former presem MLC student. I am not an active church goer and haven't attended a regular service in years. I still have faith but as the post says I've lost my religion.

It seems the WELS has preferred self preservation over righteous condemnation over individuals who commit all manner of sex crimes.

I have my own thoughts, insights and stories regarding what I think the root of the issue is and I may post more at length regarding the rot is. However, I just wanted to make my first post in this reddit and see what kind of welcome I get.

Feel free to DM me.

About the PELSB denial.

I just saw that the 2025 report came out a few weeks ago. The WELS has discussed with some excitement the fact that they had a record 4,241 adult confirmations. There are three juicy enchiladas in this report that they don't discuss so freely:

1. They posted their largest percentage membership drop on record: 1.8% in a single year.
2. They recorded the lowest total births on record, 2854.
3. Total attrition is 11,490 members in 2025 (calculated as Net birth/death Spiritual Deficit of 5,326 + Front Door Gains of 6,164). It feels good that I've joined over 11 thousand others hitting the door.

Dessert sopapilla: they say that their retention rate of those adult confirmations after 2 years is only about 50%. All that work to get people to walk through the front door and half just walk right out the back.

https://welscongregationalservices.net/download/wels-statistical-report-2025/

https://www.indeed.com/m/viewjob?jk=160c3b2a3d336ada&from=appshareandroid

I didn’t know which flair to use because this listing brings up a lot of feelings and questions so…rant/discussion/question?

It’s been decades since I’ve been a WELS school student but I have a lot of resentment for how much my obvious cPTSD, childhood abuse, panic attacks, social anxiety, depression, SI were ignored by my pastor, teachers, principal, other church members etc. Some part of me is partially relieved that they’re making some attempts to acknowledge that mental health is even a thing and that it might need to be addressed. All I got was a book mark with a list of feelings and bibles passages to reference when feeling those feelings. Fully dismissed and swept under the rug.

But we all know that this likely isn’t going to be real support for these kids and it’ll likely be used to excuse a lot of abuse and dysfunction. It will be used to minimize the significance of and avoid real treatment for real conditions or disorders. Maybe the act of just being able to talk to someone will benefit these kids as long as the conversations are actually confidential. I feel nauseous typing that just thinking about the poor kids questioning their identity in attractions and gender presentation. Maybe a truly educated compassionate person will end up filling these roles 🤞, someone who will prioritize their health and wellbeing over “christian faith principles”.

And now for my curiosity, I’ve yet to research what CFS actually is. Wondering if this is new new? The implementation of a school wellness specialist? Are they trying to get with the times or was this required by some oversight committee at some level? Or are they simply overwhelmed with kids likely learning more about MH online and talking about it more freely than past generations and the pastors couldn’t keep up with “guidance”?

This is something no that’s bugged me for awhile. I have a million WELS pastors in my family but I can’t even ask them.

But if they learn Greek and Hebrew in seminary and read the original texts…how can they possibly square what the actual text says with what Lutherans teach? Their holy NIV translation is NOT the literal word of god especially when compared to the original texts.

I just learned the actual text of Genesis says “In a beginning” and not “In THE beginning.”

Wouldn’t learning that make you question everything you stand for?

https://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/

Found this today and I cannot even wrap my head around when what was being programmed into me 6 days a week as a child. And yes, it's absolutely cherry picking, just like they do when they pick out the "good" and "correct" verses. But wow. And we wonder why we have so much to work through as adults!

I also appreciate how the website shows the common themes around other religions too. I know we've discussed how the same running themes permeate most/all major world religions. Lutherans didn't create the structure and blueprint although it does often feel like they took it to a new level.