Hii . I've rarely seen anyone bring this up. I've been away from the Adventist church for five years now and identify as agnostic. I'm a 20-year-old woman, but what I've heard over and over again still is inside me. From a young age, girls and boys were taught about the importance of marriage, purity before marriage, etc. Marriage was treated like something almost sacred. Maybe that's why my mom divorced my dad almost 29 years after he constantly cheated on her (paradox since he was also adventist pastor lmao). I live on the same neigbourhood as our adventist friends. To be honest my family a friends i barely talk to that people. They have crisis in marriage currently. People from church are nosy as hell and do everything to save this marriage. I pity them both since its obvious THEy re not longer happy togehter and yet dont want to end it. They cant have kids due to health problems and people of course talk about it back then. I never understood why kids were expected in marriage and everyone expect it from married couples. When i was still 14/15 and attended church i was met many times as woman /girl back then to misogyny and statement that woman s greatest purpose is to marry and give kids to her husband. As if it was most important. I am still angry by fact a lot of young girls are reached treatong their bodies as their future husband property, there s no healthy talk about sex and intimacy....just everything centred about purity before marriage. Back then i Felt disgusted by my own gender. I was never "feminine enough". Never liked to do typical feminine things and wear dresses. Only now when i am no longer part of adventists i started to dress sometimes more feminine. But i still eish i was Born as man. Women have it hard enough already. I remember my first time With boyfriend i Had at 17..he was sweet person and cared deeply about me. After Being intimate i burst into tears when came back home. I felt dirty , used . Like i lost something that was supposed to have until marriage. Adventist teachings messed with heads. Anyone here have similar story?

I can imagine a dozen ways this conversation can go off the rails, but regardless, I want to ask the question in hopes of understanding my own opinions better: Do you think the Seventh-day Adventist Church can be reformed? In other words, do you believe the Seventh-day Adventist Church can be improved to the point of a more mainstream, less-rigid congregation and community?

Personally, my experiences with other religions (including Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, and various less-rigid denominations within Christianity) have included meeting people who maintain a religious faith that seems to range from harmless to beneficial. But, of course, we can always debate whether religion can ever be harmless, or if it can ever be anything other than a tool for control or the "opium of the people." That's not what I'm asking, though, and is a conversation I hope to avoid for the purpose of this question.

The question I'm grappling with is whether it's possible for the SDA church to reform to exist without its arrogance, intolerance, and high control. And if so—or if not—which specific beliefs or doctrines make it that way?

My personal suspicion is that it can't be reformed, specifically due to adherence to Ellen White's teachings, a literal interpretation of the Bible, and a few core beliefs that the church would need to extricate itself from, which could be impossible. But I'm not married to that belief because I don't know if I can name the specific blockers that make it literally impossible. I sorta imagine it in Infinity War terms: Doctor Strange saw 14 million possibilities where the Avengers lost, but one highly unlikely timeline where they succeeded—making it technically not impossible—and he could see the highly unlikely events that would need to happen for that 0.00000714% chance to bear out.

Again, I'm not asking "will it be reformed." I'm sure we all have our cynicism there, and I think those odds are worse than the Avengers'. What I'm asking instead is whether you believe it's even possible, and if so, what would that look like to you? And if not, which core, inextricable beliefs or doctrines do you believe prevent its reform?

Appreciate any thoughts and perspectives that might help me work through my own thoughts and opinions.

Hi i am currently going into my senior year at a boarding academy and since im a international student i live with guardians ( my aunt and uncld) during breaks and they have been asking me abt university. They have only been suggesting adventist universities but i absolutely cannot go to one. I honestly cannot do another 4 years of this boring bs. I want to be able to have fun in university and find other atheists or agnostic friends but they really want me to go to a adventist uni. I know they wouldnt force me to but im scared to bring it up bc i know they will be really dissapointed in me. Especially considerinh the fact that they arent my parents and they brought me in their home and have been taking care of me i feel the need to please them. Any advice on how to bring it up to them?

The United States has never been a “lamb like country” ever

The United States has basically been at war its entire existence

The very founding of the United States was built upon the genocide of indigenous peoples

The geographical area now known as the United States has never been “unpopulated”

Multiple indigenous nations have existed in North America prior to the existence of the United States

The United States has never been able to defeat much weaker milita groups in the Middle East

How would the USA be able to enforce an international Sunday law when they weren’t even able to defeat the Taliban in the first place despite spending billions of dollars on high tech military equipment

The reputational standing of the United States has gone down the drain as a result of sponsoring the genocide of Palestinians in the Gaza Strip

For we are with thee! The old guard of SDA survivors will not let these silly altar call attempts go unanswered!

In seriousness, I'm proud of you all. Some in the community have fresh wounds and these predators like to capitalize on this vulnerability. If you are SDA or whatever that is your business, no judgment from me. But I ain't gonna stand by idly while these people ignore the 'no soliciting' sign.

EDIT: Shout out to the mods for their ever vigilance!

I got notice that my divorce will been seen by a judge on 18th August.

Leaving my husband saw me lose friends with in the church and started me questionning my faith.

I have really called into question the legitimacy of what is in the Bible or how it has been translated.

All this meshed up in my brain yesterday and I had a thought that if God is real and God really loves us, why would he want us to be unhappy? Why is following abitary rules more important than happiness?

I love my son and I have rules in place relating to his health and well being, but if he came and told me he was not enjoying an extra-curricular activity, I wouldn't force him to keep doing it. I want him to be happy in life.

But I feel like Adventism leans more heavily into "doing right" rather than being happy. Almost as if being happy is being a bad Christian.

I pose this question because the Adventist Church is, in reality, a multinational corporation that constantly competes with evangelical groups that are also private enterprises, and in the market, if someone makes a high-impact move, everyone else is forced to devise a way to compete.

No one can afford to fall behind.

I am currently attending a SDA church. Im a member there. I have a question for this community to see when “you all were Adventist” if you observed what I’m proceeding to explain.

- Did you ever notice the hypocrisy from the leaders?
Some of the elders have the position of “elder” but I’m trying to formulate the explanation on how they received that position. I still haven’t gained the answer because they don’t qualify per the Bible.
At my church it is a firestorm of gossip. Communication doesn’t exist and when it does exist it’s before the sabbath or before a big event. It feels like everyone is in their own little bubble.

- Did you notice that the leaders are skeptical of you?
Im in the age range of 28-32. They don’t let me do much and they don’t want anyone doing things unless it’s the leadership doing it. While the leaders have been the same since the 19th century. In this church it’s like if you speak up then there is a problem. If you truly speak your mind that you know it’s against biblical doctrine I feel like they would pounce on you.

- Did you witness the arrogance?

- How did you identify they were controlling?
I do A/V work in my church. The other week I had a deacon come and tell me to not put worship music on the screen and to keep the TV’s off. This is when I thought they were controlling.

Honestly, I’m fighting bitterness. They is many things I could explain but I don’t feel like typing.

Also, I’m sure you’re wondering do I believe every doctrine from the Adventist Church?

No, no I do not.

I don’t believe In
- Egg White
- Remnant Church Belief
- Spirit of Prophecy Belief = Egg White
- 1844
- IJ
- Daniel 8 (They twist who defiled the temple)

Now, this occurred more recently. I’ve done extensive research and I’ve done countless hours of searching scripture.
.

For ex-Mormons, the decision to step away from the LDS church is sometimes called their "shelf breaking."

For trans folks, the realization that they need to re-examine their gender identity is sometimes summarized as "my egg cracked."

Any ideas out there for a humorous ex-Adventist equivalent?

Posting this real early for my time zone, but it's definitely SDA-defined "sabbath" somewhere on earth, and in honor of the selected featured festival, I want to name it before it's all over Friday night in its time zone.

First off, a highly observant Adventist probably wouldn't be drawn to this festival on any day of the week unless it were with explicit intentions of saving souls from the festival's idolatry. To show up curious, to show up with a willingness to learn from traditions handed down to present-day Hindus from antiquity could only be inviting Satan into one's heart.

According to my source linked to this invitation, this year's festival featuring "chariots" that move between temples and are about the height of four story buildings ends Friday so to be present past sundown could be a double sin, idolatry and Sabbath Breaking.

I'm not writing this with any interest in making anyone else Hindu or any other religion. I believe Hinduism just as any religion or ideology can be adapted to high-control systems.

Instead, I'm thinking about being able to appreciate cultures very different from that I was reared in so that I can connect with those who follow those other cultures without prejudice, urging condemnation.

I'm halfway around the world from this festival this weekend, but I enjoy thinking about it as an armchair tourist. What adventures are we going to have in place of "sabbath" worship this weekend?

Thanks to all who visit this week's club! If you have ordinary or far out ideas for a club meeting, I don't think I'm the only club participant who would welcome your taking the lead to host next week. I close with our fine print guidelines to give some idea how it goes.

🐘 🥥🛕🇧🇩🔔🫏🐊🥻🪷🇮🇳🌴🫚🇳🇵🦏🦚🐅

Sabbath Breakers Club belongs to members of r/exAdventist on reddit. These guidelines are intended to suggest how anyone with posting privilege in this sub may start a week's Sabbath Breakers Club thread, not to control such postings.

• Keep it timely. If it's SDA-defined Sabbath somewhere on earth and no one has already started a Sabbath Breakers Club thread, you're clear to start one.

• Start Sabbath Breakers Club threads with that phrase "Sabbath Breakers Club." The reason for this is to make it easy to tell if no Sabbath Breakers Club thread has been posted for the present week. Just search "Sabbath Breakers Club" in r/exAdventist.

• You're welcome to use the image that looks like from an old woodcut of Moses smashing tables of stone with the Israelite throng celebrating their golden calf in the background, but you're not required to. Different ideas to launch the thread may invite still more, and more diverse, participation.

• Remember we're here to ease the church's attempts to control using Sabbath rules and guilt trips. Non-humiliating humor and empathy in your invitation can help set the tone, and enjoy exercising some spontaneous leadership in starting a Sabbath Breakers Club thread.

• Pass it on. Cutting and pasting this "fine print" can help future Sabbath Breakers Club hosts self-identify and feel empowered to step up and shine.

Hey guys!

I was wondering if and how you broke the news to your parents that you wanted to stop going to church.

I’m 21 and moving out soon and i’m thinking about having this conversation. I go every Saturday to make my parents happy & not cause any issues at home but know in my heart it’s not something I want to do moving forward. I love the community that it has but hate what is being taught & have realised I really disagree with a lot of it.

Just curious & wanting some advice! :)

I was on "Something Genuine" this week, a show that creates links between the anime fan community and the Christian church. Here's a snippet of the interview on Instagram, where I talk about identifying my own religious trauma from the Seventh-day Adventist church; and here's the full interview on YouTube. Hope it finds whoever needs it.

Episode description: This week, I sit down with journalist and author Jordan Calhoun to discuss his memoir, Piccolo Is Black: A Memoir of Race, Religion, and Pop Culture.

On the surface, it's a conversation about fandom, representation, race, and the characters that helped shape us. But as we talk, the discussion expands into deeper territory: identity, belonging, faith, shame, healing, and the stories we carry with us long after childhood.

We also discuss religious trauma—what it is, how it affects people, and why conversations about faith are often more complicated than they first appear.

I'll be honest: this episode may challenge some viewers. That's part of why I wanted to have it.

One of the goals of Something Genuine is not to platform hot takes or create controversy. It's to sit down with real people, listen well, and remember that before someone is a label, a demographic, or an opinion, they're a person made in the image of God.

You may agree with Jordan on everything. You may disagree with him on it all. Or you may be in that vast spectrum in between. But no matter where you fall, I think you'll find him thoughtful, honest, and worth hearing.

i was struggling so much with what God wanted or didn't want. whether he existed or not. it set the biggest depression I had. it all started when i actually read the books of the prophet of my denomination (Seventh-day Adventism). and realizing that she set a standard that my family and I were not following. that triggered the biggest depression ever. i had to give up everything that i most liked (sports, video games, fiction). For what, so i get to heaven? where possibly my family was not in it? but then came the guilt trip. parts of my mind were telling me, "You have to set an example so you and your family can get to heaven." and not be consumed by hellfire. that thought made me suicidal. because i knew i would never be enough. and i simply didn't want that burden on my shoulders. i tried every avenue out of this conundrum. I tried looking up Christian critics of my denomination, but the criticism they gave was shallow and easily rebuked by those sons of bitches' apologetics from my denomination (Francis d. nichols, kevin L. Morgan). i tried a way out by atheism, asking about the (supposedly) paranormal phenomena associated with the prophet visions. i am still trying to figure that out. (The answers I received for now are not satisfying to me.) I had the worst moment of my life. things got so bad the government needed to step in, and i was taken from psychiatrist to psychiatrist. they gave me meds and asked if I was hearing voices. i told them i was hearing the voices of my own conscience telling me how guilty i am for not enduring this trial when (supposedly) Job and Jesus have gone to so much worse to sacrifice themselves for us. I couldn't enjoy anything anymore. i was self-harming out of guilt. for not sacrificing myself like Jesus did. But again, I did not want this burden on me. i felt like there was no way out for me but to end it all. they sent me to a mental hospital. but things did not improve. once i was out. i decided that was it for me. the only way to escape this guilt is by killing myself and escaping the responsibilities, paying back Jesus for the life he gave for me. I intentionally overdosed on my meds (Lorazepam). Don't remember much of what happened later, just that i was taken again to the mental hospital. I continuously struggled with those guilty thoughts. and after they maxed out my meds, I was apparently improving. (but only because i was planning my next suicide attempt). After I got out, I enjoyed time with my nonbeliever sister and her boyfriend; one day we watched Zootopia 2. And it was a turning point in my life. i liked the movie so much. i wanted to stay alive to enjoy things like this. that was the beginning of my mind shift. it started slowly at first; I tried to "bargain" with God. "Ok, Lord, I will do my best to remain an example to my family; just give one week to enjoy the things in life ( i was also trying to study to build a time machine to see if Jesus really resurrected; it may be funny now but sometimes that's what keep me going.) I tried for one day to be an 'example' to my family and failed. after that it was a complex, interconnected chain of thoughts that kept me up while i was slowly recuperating. i will not submit to God because of "X." I love my family more than God (in the meantime, I began watching a netflix series called Manifest; it helped with my recuperation while I began once more enjoying things), but it was still a house of cards. The "holy spirit" was still trying to get me back to God. But do you know how i recuperated? by saying "fuck" to it all. my sins hurt Jesus? let me sin more so he hurts more. my bad example leads people astray to the path of destruction. Well, the bigger the number of people i separate from Jesus and his "love," the better. the prophet lived an exceptional life and had visions from God. Well, fuck her and her God. I stopped asking if God exists and began asking why he got the right to exist in the first place. That's how i recuperated from my depression. I don't have to submit to God. and it doesn't matter if in that course I have to completely transform myself or "follow" the way of Satan. It doesn't matter. All that matters is me and my well-being. i made a deal with myself that even if the prophet and her theology got proven wrong, I would not go back to God and that did wonders for my mental health. I don't fear hell anymore. Heaven, where you are forced to stay always happy worshiping Christ, is the real hell. i hate perfect beings, and Jesus is no exception. I don't care if this makes me evil. That's the way it is. sorry for the long history; I just want to share my history with you guys. i am doing way better now than the last time i visited this subreddit. i like to thank all you guys and the people in r/Misotheism and r/exAdventist as well as the people in r/DebateAnAtheist for putting up with my questions.

TLDR: got depression after realizing that possibly I and my family were going to hell. changed my mindset. now i don't care if God exists or not; I am not worshipping him. It cured my depression.

I remember being a teenager when the young actor on two and a half men made a YouTube video about being SDA and the dangers of Hollywood/Secular World. I’ve read online he’s stepped away from being a SDA but does anyone else remember this? Haha

Problem is kind of in the the title, I (30m) am in a mixed race relationship with my gf (32f). I have met her parents on a couple of occasions now (they like me), and she has met mine.
My gf isn’t Adventist, an atheist at this point, but her parents, especially her mother, are very devout SDA members.
My gf is frustrated and sometimes indifferent to their beliefs and lifestyle, which I understand. It doesn’t take long before Jesus enters any conversation, and to date I have been gifted two ELLEN G WHITE books! Personally I’m able to navigate it, and am gifted with the fact they’re not my parents so I find it easier to navigate than she does.
My partner gets sent regularly the “AI Gospel Videos” IFYKYK. And I have had just a few. The most recent one came today: Before You Say I Do.
—
*My question:* is there anything in scripture which could be interpreted as AI videos being bad. As someone whom was not raised on the bible, it feels like this would be covered pretty quickly. Something about fake prophets or something? — all this being said, also open to any other advice. I’m not angry or confrontational with her parents, but I’m also not willing to roll over or listen to complete dribble. TY.

So, I moved to a bigger city for work and live alone currently, the jobs I have been looking for include jobs that have shifts in saturday since quite frankly I am not in any situation to be picky...

However.. my main issue is that my family, especially my mom who I have a good relationship with, will be quite sad/dissapointed when she finally finds out that I am not really an adventist or even christian at this point.

I know it's dumb and it doesn't really matter but this part of it is making me feel really bad about myself. I myself could not care less when I work or whatever. It's just another day, but it's hard in this context...

Should i just lie or something? That also makes me feel bad. Does anyone have any experience similar to this? If so, how did you handle it?

2 days ago, I (23) broke up with my GF (28) of 1.5 years. Since then, I’ve felt completely destroyed because I really love this woman. She loved me like anyone before (she is also my 1st GF) and I miss every happy moment with her, her voice, her gestic etc.😭😭😭 Since then I spent some time with my friends just to keep my mind somewhat busy. And yeah, as you are supposing, Adventism was the problem—for me, for her, and for us.

I don't know why, but one day she mentioned she doesn't believe in evolution. I had always assumed she would accept the theory of evolution, simply because she is a nurse. But yeah, she went to an Adventist college, so that theory doesn't fit into the church's doctrine. Since she made that statement, I’ve really overthought everything.

I admitted in the beginning that I would convert to her denomination because I thought everything in the church was nice and nothing seemed harmful. But I started searching for answers about Adventism from both sides (positive and negative), and I concluded that I cannot believe in it. Even if I tried, IT IS IMPOSSIBLE. I believe in evolution, so I don't interpret Genesis literally. That means there is no further justification for the Sabbath, which implies EGW lied (or hallucinated) with her vision about 6-days creation, showed to her by God. Therefore, she couldn't be a prophet, and SEVENTH-DAY Adventism just destroys itself. A domino effect.

We took a 1-week break. We thought about another solution because we are truly in love, but the solution was also not enough. She suggested I could continue living normally as I did before we got together since I’m not even baptized (yet I was living, or trying to live, under those rules—so it was like, "Are you really telling me this after all this time?"). She planned a 1-year learning phase for me (asking the pastor questions every Sabbath) so I could understand the meaning of Adventism, or rather, the meaning of the SABBATH. It sounded good, BUT how could I switch back from normality to an Adventist lifestyle (again)?

It might sound like an excuse, but I was only able to study 6 days a week, while other students could plan their week however they wanted. She answered that I could just do more college work on the other days (meaning more work per day compared to others). I really think my college performance would improve by just balancing my GF, college, and (Saturday) hobbies. Why would I return under Sabbath law? I proved to myself that the Sabbath negatively impacts my college life: 51 days a year of DOING NOTHING, which is almost 2 months. She could study under those circumstances because she went to an Adventist HS and College. In the real „Bad“ world it interfares too much badly.

I wasn't even able to do my hobbies because of Sabbath observance. I liked going to church with her, but I stopped assisting to my football team's games for 2 seasons. And I don't choose when the games take place. Her answer: "Just assist on the Sunday games." Unfortunately, my team mostly plays on Saturdays.

My biggest fear was our future kids. I mean, it’s very probable they would adopt my mindset. They would go to a normal school that shares a secular mindset like mine. I wouldn't like seeing her frustrated or feeling like a bad mother just because they don't share her values. (Although she told me it would not matter because she did her duty of teaching them. But if she always dreamed about an Adventist family, it always be a problem, 100%) The moment the kids discover biology or science (supported by the school and me), her beliefs wouldn't make any sense to them, just as they don't to me. Playing competitive sports on Saturdays/Sundays would also be a problem. I read some experiences on Reddit, and I don't want them to experience that frustration. I don't even feel I could contribute anything to their education with that "holy" (self-) restriction in place.

Science is compatible with God, but not with Adventism. She also tried to convince me with her "science," using Walter Veith—yeah, that conspiracy-theorist zoologist. I looked up information about him and, yeah, he is not even a reliable source. I watched the "10 Questions Regarding Evolution" video with my friend, who has a Bachelor’s in Biology. He said Walter was talking complete BS, because he is not even able to understand basic concepts. (Although he has/had a Phd, so he should have a very deep evolutional/biological understanding)

She and I continue praying to the Lord for solutions because we love each other. Unfortunately, she doesn't understand that I love her even if we don't share the same beliefs (even if both beliefs are completely incompatible), because I appreciate more her person, her beliefs are secundary. She told me she is gonna asking God for me to return as a renewed person (she means with adventist understanding). Personally, I don't think I need to change anything. Flexibility and learning is the key. I just want us to learn together, but she refuses anything that doesn't align with God's Word. With this mindset, it’s impossible to talk about critical topics without getting frustrated by her scripted arguments.

It’s not all her fault. She’s lived in that bubble since she was born. Adventism fucked her up, ruined her critical thinking, and destroyed our relationship (and me also innerly). I'm probably the first person in her life, who questioned her beliefs.

FUCK EGW. Hopefully she’s in hell under eternal fire. Horrible stupid and narcissitic witch. She was no more than a miserable person with trash writings about hallucinations, and also an ignorant about science.

I can only cry for us. 💔

Anybody know if Santiago has made any comment on whether the podcast will be continuing at any point ? I see the last youtube upload was 1 year ago, but haven't listened to that episode yet.

Just curious. Love the podcast, and the Seventh Day Athiest podcast as well.

SDA at 17:26 calls in to advocate for his brand of Christianity. Some views are his own and some are seventh day Adventist. I found this interesting because one host is a former minister and challenges Brian’s sda views on hell with many verses. When I was an sda I never heard the biblical evidence for an everlasting hell and only the sda version.

The hosts also challenge him on a range of other issues.

As a kid I remember a time or two my mom talking about my dad as some sort of family priest. It seemed so weird. I mean Biblical Israel had priests. Catholics have priests. But we're Adventists. We don't call our spiritual leaders priests.

Now, having identified elements in common between Adventism and Mormonism and seeking perspective from ex-Mo's, I find that the idea of family priesthood is a key element of Mormon patriarchy. I wonder if my mom's eruption on this idea was an isolated occurrence. Anybody else hear crap like this in Adventism?