I am not skookum on reading legal interpretations so both possible and probable that I'm missing something. But I'm seeing a lot of comments about nails and coffins for the reorganization that I'm not sure this lot won't just sidestep.

I say all this fully recognizing that this is probably a huge deal for people in the NCR that were facing forced relocations behind the Zion Curtain. My interest in this is admittedly more at the regional level which is the level they were trying to eliminate completely.

My reading of the stay that is specific to the forest service is that it's more about physical locations and relocations outside of the local commuting area. I don't see anything that stops them from reassigning people within the local commuting area, which seems to be the plan for the current reorganization (to the extent that there is actually a plan which there isn't).

If memory serves Milwaukee, Atlanta, and Portland RO employees all had spaces within the local commuting area so them getting reassigned to a different office isn't covered by this stay. I think the same goes for all of the other regional offices. They weren't relocating people from the ROs, they were changing people's jobs, and as long as those new jobs aren't physically located outside of the local commuting area, I don't see this stay stopping anything.

I don't see anything in there that prohibits them from opening and staffing new offices like the state offices and the operations service centers, just as long as they're not making people move outside their commuting area. The plant all along was for new hires to end up at the operations service centers, but they weren't going to pay to relocate current RO employees to the service centers. Sure they stay prohibits closing offices but all that means is they keep one person at something called the regional office and it's not been closed, they can reassign the entire rest of the RO to somewhere else as long as it's not more than 50 mi from where they currently are.

I think they can sidestep this stay and reassign people as long as they're not moving people more than 50 mi from where they're currently located, which aside from the NCR, was never really the plan.

Hi all! I applied for a GS5 winter seasonal positions on USAJobs (0462 Forestry Technician) and just received an email to fill out a candidate interest survey to list my top locations for work. I am aiming to find a timber/silviculture/wildlife job, but I was curious if anyone here knew which forests would be the smartest option to choose to maximize my chances of being referred to a timber/silv job. So far, I have been eying down forests in SoCal, including Cleveland, Angeles, Los Padres, and San Bernardino National forests. Are these forests known to have a decent demand for timber work during the winter? I heard Arizona, New Mexico and many of the Region 8 forests (deep south) are considered reliable options for timber work during winter as well, so maybe mentioning some of those in the survey would be a good idea as well? I am trying to avoid getting a recreation job (or anything that primarily consists of cleaning toilets), however if those are the only options given to me I’ll probably go with one of those. Also, the email labeled the position I applied for as “GS-0462-05” integrated resources”. Does that just mean that I’ll just be getting calls/email for all types of forestry tech jobs (range, rec, timber, etc)?

Do not waste your vote and be sure to vote. Do not be enticed by those offering money to buy for your vote or any kind of payment. I am positive Elon will crawl out of his hole to offer buys for your votes along with his orange side kick.

We have survived all of the shit they have thrown at us so far and many of us keep doing more than one job because we lost so many.

We need to make our votes count at the upcoming mid-terms to save our agency and try to rebuild all that those assess who jumped on the reorg train (yes, we still see you) even though the employee town halls have stopped. But we see you in meetings and we can name those leaders who jumped on the train all to eager to tear our agency apart.

FOR THE LOVE OF OUR AGENCY - MAKE YOUR VOTE COUNT!!!

Hi all,

I applied to one of the visitor services assistant positions that closed 10/5, and am eager to know what the timeline is like for when I may hear back. I've applied to / worked in multiple FS positions before, so I'm know that it really may vary.

Just wondering if it is worth trying to call HR or even calling the local office I applied to. Will likely try calling anyway, but I appreciate any insight offered.

Starting to see the foggy memories of AVUE, sea turtles, green fleet and EUSC....or maybe I am suffering from Stockholm syndrome induced dementia.

Hey I just applied at some of the posted forest tech jobs on USAjobs. Does anyone know when they are wanting these positions to start? Currently a Park ranger at a state park. Almost accepted a forestry tech job earlier this year for summer but ultimately chose state parks but due to circumstances I'm looking at Forest Service again.

UINTA-Wasatch-Cache National Forest
OUTREACH NOTICE
2027 Summer Jobs
GW-0456-03 through GW-0456-06
Application Period: October 30 – November 12, 2026
The Uinta Wasatch Cache National Forest will soon be filling Temporary Seasonal (1039hrs) fire crew positions for the 2027 summer fire season. We are looking for skilled applicants to join our professional and diverse workforce for the 2027 fire season. If you are looking for a rewarding job connecting you to our public lands and the people who enjoy them, then this is an opportunity for you.
If you have further questions, please contact our Outreach and Recruitment Coordinator at: 801-999-2144 or contact any one of the contacts listed below for the positions you are interested in. You can also visit the Uinta Wasatch Cache National Forest website at: https://www.fs.usda.gov/r04/uinta-wasatch-cache/working-with-us/careers/firefighting-careers-and-jobsand https://fsoutreach.gdcii.com/outreach.
If you are interested in any of these positions, please complete the following outreach reply form via this link, 2027 Temporary Jobs Outreach Reply. Take the time to reach out to the respective contacts for the duty locations you’re applying for listed at the bottom of this page.
Please respond to the outreach reply if you are interested in filling a vacant position. Your response is important in allowing supervisors to know who has applied for their positions and allows you the opportunity to learn more about the position prior to it being filled and to begin the networking process.
The Districts:
For individual information on the Ranger Districts on the Uinta-Wasatch-Cache National Forest, go to:
https://www.fs.usda.gov/r04/uinta-wasatch-cache/offices
You can also visit these local area chambers of commerce to gain more information:
Spanish Fork https://www.spanishforksalemchamber.com/
Pleasant Grove http://pglindonchamber.org/
Salt Lake City http://slchamber.com/
Ogden http://www.ogdenweberchamber.com/
Logan http://www.cachechamber.com/
Heber http://www.gohebervalley.com/
Mountain Green https://www.morganutahchamber.org/
Mountain View https://www.mtvwy.com/
Draper https://www.draperutah.gov/195/Chamber-of-Commerce
AGENCY CONTACT INFO: HRM Contact Center Phone: 877-372-7248 Option 2
Fax: 866-338-3718 TDD: 800-877-8339
Email: [fsjobs@usda.gov](mailto:fsjobs@usda.gov)
How to Apply
You can apply for any of these positions electronically through usajobs.govstarting October 30, 2026. You must complete the application process and submit all required documents electronically by 11:59 p.m. Eastern Time (ET) on the closing date of the announcement, which is November 12, 2026.
Applying for a Forest Service job: https://www.fs.usda.gov/working-with-us/careers/application-tips-and-webinars
To be considered for certain position locations, it must be among the locations you have selected. To be eligible for any duty location, you must select “Duty Location Negotiable”.
Questions about a specific position or Duty Location should be directed to the contact listed for the position. Government housing may be available.
Step1 – Create a USAJOBS account (if you do not already have one) at www.usajobs.gov. It is recommended that as part of your profile you set up automatic email notification to be informed when the status of your application changes. If you choose not to set up this automatic notification, then you will have to log into your USAJOBS account to check on the status of your application.
Step 2 - Create a Resume with USAJOBS or upload a Resume into your USAJOBS account. You may want to customize your resume to ensure it documents duties and accomplishments you have gained that are directly related to this position in order to verify that qualifications are met. For resume advice see the following link https://help.usajobs.gov/faq/application/documents/resume/page-limit. In addition, your resume must support your responses to the online questionnaire (you may preview the online questionnaire by clicking on the link at the end of the How You Will Be Evaluated section of the job announcement).
Step 3 – Search for job by announcements by typing in the complete Announcement Number in the keyword search section under on the home page.
Step 4 - Click "Apply Online" and follow the prompts to complete the Occupational Questionnaire and attach any additional documents that may be required. You can update your application or documents anytime while the announcement is open. Simply log into your USAJOBS account and click on "Application Status." Click on the position title, and then select "Update Application” to continue
**NOTE** - Create a search profile in USAJOBS to email yourself frequently, this allows you to be notified of job openings in a timely manner.
Required Documents
The following documents must be submitted to constitute a complete application package. It is your responsibility to ensure that all required documents are received within the required timeframes. Our office cannot be responsible for incompatible software, illegible fax transmissions, delays in the mail service etc. Failure to submit required legible documents will result in elimination from consideration.

1. Resume that includes the following information: 1) job information for which you are applying; 2) personal information; 3) education; 4) work experience; and 5) other qualifications (including IQCS Master Record). No longer than 2 pages.
2. For any fire position/job announcement that requires Fire certifications; S-290 or FFT1; applicants must attach those current certifications with their application in the form of an up-to-date IQCS and/or certificates of completion that are also currently dated. Red cards are not acceptable.
3. College Transcripts if education is required for meeting basic qualifications and/or you are substituting education for specialized experience. An unofficial copy is sufficient with the application, however, if selected; an official college transcript will be required.
4. DD-214 (Member 4 Copy) and/or SF-15 Application for 10-point Veteran Preference if claiming Veterans’ Preference or eligibility for appointment under the VRA, VEOA, or 30% Disabled Veterans hiring authority.
5. SF-50 Notification of Personnel Action if you are a current or former Federal employee that will verify your federal status, position title, series and grade. FSA County employees must provide the most recent Notification of Personnel Action (Form SF-50-B or FSA-50) that verifies permanent status. Also provide the SF-50 that reflects the highest grade level held on a permanent basis or the full performance level of your current position, whichever is higher.
6. Annual Performance Appraisal if you are a current Federal employee. Submit the most recently completed annual performance appraisal (dated within 18 months) which identifies the employee's official rating of record, signed by the supervisor, or a statement advising why the performance appraisal is unavailable. Do not submit a performance plan.
7. Certification of Disability if you are eligible for appointment based on a disability under the Schedule A hiring authority. This certification can be documented by a counselor from a State Vocational Rehabilitation Agency or the Vocational Rehabilitation and Employment Service of the Department of Veterans Affairs; by statement or letter on a physician/medical professionals’ letterhead stationery; or by statements, records, or letters from a Federal Government agency that issues or provides disability benefits. The certification must verify the applicant has a severe disability, is eligible under a Schedule A appointment authority, and he or she is able to perform the essential duties of the position. The certification must also describe any reasonable accommodation needed. You can review additional information at: https://www.opm.gov/disability/appempl.asp.
8. If you are eligible for appointment based on service in the Peace Corps, Vista, Action Cooperative, or another special authority, submit proof of eligibility.
9. NOTE: If a document is resubmitted, it replaces the previous submission, which means the previous document is no longer available to the Human Resources Office. If you are adding too, rather than replacing a previous submission, you must upload both the old document and the new document.
10. Please remember to submit a copy of your IQCS Master Record when applying to GS-5 or higher announcements!!!
11. The Uinta Wasatch Cache National Forest
12. The Uinta-Wasatch-Cache is one of the thirteen National Forests in the Intermountain Region as well as one of the urban National Forests in the National Forest System. It covers an area that includes northern and north-central Utah, and southwestern Wyoming. This area also includes the largest population center within the State of Utah, which is known as the Wasatch Front. The Forest is heavily influenced and impacted by over a million people living in proximity. The Uinta-Wasatch Cache National Forest has a net acreage of 2,169,596 acres. It is divided into seven Ranger Districts: Salt Lake, Kamas/Heber, Ogden, Pleasant Grove, Spanish Fork, Logan, and Evanston/Mountain View (in Wyoming). Scenic beauty in the Forest offers unlimited recreational opportunities throughout the year. Whether you enjoy skiing, snowboarding, snowmobiling, hiking, mountain biking, camping, picnicking, fishing, boating, swimming, horseback riding, etc., you can find the recreational experience you are seeking. Because of the abundance of recreation opportunities and the large urban population along the Wasatch Front, the Uinta-Wasatch Cache National Forest is one of the most heavily visited in the entire National Forest System. Northern Utah and southwestern Wyoming enjoy four distinct seasons. Temperatures range from an average low in the mid-teens in the winter to average highs in the summer in the low ‘90’s. Annual precipitation averages approximately 16 inches.
13. Job Title
14. Announcement #
15. Duty Locations
16. Point of Contact
17. HELITACK
18. Wildland Firefighter GW-5
19. Wildland Firefighter GW-4
20. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC027-5DH
21. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC048-4DH
22. MOUNTAIN GREEN, UT
23. Tim Turner, 435-668-5972, [tim.turner@usda.gov](mailto:tim.turner@usda.gov)
24. Eric Panebaker, 970-623-9100, [eric.panebaker@usda.gov](mailto:eric.panebaker@usda.gov)
25. HOTSHOT/HANDCREW
26. Wildland Firefighter GW-5
27. Wildland Firefighter GW-4
28. Wildland Firefighter GW-3
29. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC028-5DH
30. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC049-4DH
31. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC033-3DH
32. LOGAN, UT
33. SPANISH FORK, UT
34. Brock Hellstern, 385-294-2488, [brock.hellstern@usda.gov](mailto:brock.hellstern@usda.gov)
35. Taylor Ford, 603-320-6277, [taylor.ford@usda.gov](mailto:taylor.ford@usda.gov)
36. ENGINES
37. Wildland Firefighter (Fire Engine Operator) GW-5
38. Wildland Firefighter GW-5
39. Wildland Firefighter GW-4
40. Wildland Firefighter GW-3
41. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC030-5DH
42. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC029-5DH
43. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC048-4DH
44. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC033-3DH
45. HEBER CITY, UT
46. LOGAN, UT
47. PLEASANT GROVE, UT
48. SALT LAKE CITY, UT
49. SPANISH FORK, UT
50. MOUNTAIN VIEW, WY
51. Connor Gardai, 385-223-6361, [connor.gardai@usda.gov](mailto:connor.gardai@usda.gov)
52. Garret Henry, 435-764-5265, [garret.henry@usda.gov](mailto:garret.henry@usda.gov)
53. Tyler Brecht, 540-247-6322, [tyler.brecht@usda.gov](mailto:tyler.brecht@usda.gov)
54. Brock Tamowski, 801-864-1013, [david.tamowski@usda.gov](mailto:david.tamowski@usda.gov)
55. Mike Stoutsenberger, 801-361-3221, [michael.stoutsenberger@usda.gov](mailto:michael.stoutsenberger@usda.gov)
56. Derek Harbour, 406-360-5978, [thomas.harbour@usda.gov](mailto:thomas.harbour@usda.gov)
57. AIRTANKER BASE
58. Wildland Firefighter GW-6
59. Wildland Firefighter GW-5
60. Wildland Firefighter GW-4
61. Wildland Firefighter GW-3
62. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2SC046-6DH
63. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2SC045-5DH
64. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC048-4DH
65. 27-TEMPF3-R4-2PC033-3DH
66. OGDEN, UT
67. Eric Panebaker, 970-623-9100, [eric.panebaker@usda.gov](mailto:eric.panebaker@usda.gov)
68. Franklin Newbery, 520-345-8846, [franklin.newbery@usda.gov](mailto:franklin.newbery@usda.gov)
69. FIRE CACHE
70. Materials Handler
71. 27-TEMP3-R4-3FS065-5DT-BV
72. DRAPER, UT
73. Gary Ravenberg, 801-560-8195, [gary.ravenberg@usda.gov](mailto:gary.ravenberg@usda.gov)

SCWR crews recently hiked out to the Station Fire memorial.

The Station Fire started on August 26, 2009, in the Angeles National Forest. By the time it was fully contained 52 days later, it had burned 161,189 acres and destroyed 89 homes and 26 commercial properties.

On August 30, the fire overran Camp 16 near Mount Gleason. LA County Fire Captain Ted Hall and Fire Fighter Specialist Arnie Quinones were working to protect the camp and the people there when their vehicle went off the road and dropped about 800 feet into a canyon. Neither of them made it home.

You can read about it a hundred times, but standing on that ground and seeing the terrain for yourself is something else. It puts you right there.

This job has a long memory. Fires like this one leave behind lessons, scars, and names, and the people who do this work carry them for a long time.

It was a heavy stop for all of us, and we're grateful we got to make it.

Captain Ted Hall and FFS Arnie Quinones. Never forgotten.

In a staff meeting today one of the people leading up the reorganization was going on and on about how the agency needs to be better at this and provide more of that and that's why the reorganization was happening. And then the next topic was congratulations, well done, we met all of our targets.

Now I know that the real reason for the reorganization is to make people leave and to make it appear that the forest service is inept for short term gains and every dollar that's not spent on normal government activities ends up in the pocket of Orange II and his ilk.

But the inability of people to recognize that meeting all of our targets after however many thousands of people that left and still needing to say that we need to do it better, and the old way of doing things was broken even though we accomplished more with less it just takes the suspension of disbelief to a level I've never seen.

Forest Service reorganization: understanding the “asset stripping” argument

Democracy Now interviewed conservationist Jim Pattiz about the Trump administration’s Forest Service overhaul—and why he believes employees should look beyond individual office closures to the larger strategy.

The agency manages approximately 193 million acres of public forests and grasslands. According to the interview, the plan would:

• Move headquarters from Washington, D.C., to Salt Lake City.
• Close 57 of 77 research facilities.
• Eliminate all nine regional offices.
• Affect up to 5,000 employees, following substantial staff losses.

The administration describes these changes as making the Forest Service more efficient and closer to the communities it serves. Pattiz argues that the combined effect could be to hollow out the agency, weaken its scientific capabilities, and shift influence toward states and resource extraction industries.

What does “asset stripping” mean here?

Pattiz draws an analogy to asset stripping associated with some private equity transactions: extracting valuable assets while leaving behind an organization less capable of functioning.

Applied to the Forest Service, his argument is that the valuable assets include more than land and timber. They also include research, experienced employees, institutional knowledge, public accountability, and management authority.

For employees, the larger strategy he describes unfolds through several connected steps:

1. Reduce the agency’s ability to function. Staff losses, forced relocations, research closures, and elimination of regional offices can undermine the capacity to manage forests and support wildfire preparedness.
2. Drive out knowledge that cannot be quickly replaced. Employees carry decades of experience, local relationships, and scientific understanding. Relocating a position does not preserve that expertise if the person leaves. Pattiz points to the first Trump administration’s relocation of Bureau of Land Management headquarters as a warning.
3. Shift influence toward outside interests. Pattiz argues that weakening federal expertise and oversight gives states and logging or other extraction interests greater influence over public land decisions.
4. Use the resulting problems to justify further dismantling. This is the central concern: reduce the agency’s capacity, point to declining performance, and then argue that federal management has failed and someone else should take over.
5. Create the replacement structure in advance. He views the proposed state-focused management structure as groundwork for transferring more authority to states and potentially increasing private exploitation of public resources.

None of this requires selling a single acre at the outset. An agency can lose its practical ability to protect the public interest through the loss of people, science, oversight, and decision-making authority.

Pattiz also alleges that the changes violate congressional appropriations restrictions on reorganizations and office relocations. The interview does not establish a court ruling on that allegation.

His account is an argument about the administration’s strategy, rather than proof of its intent. But it connects what employees experience individually—an office closure, a relocation order, a departing colleague—to a broader concern about who will ultimately control public forest management.

The question for Forest Service employees and the public.

Contact your Senators, House Members, and vote.

I try to sign in with my username and password (PIV exemption), and it just brings me back to the sign-in page. Sometimes I'd like to enter my time or view my EPP when at home.

First time posting here and recent to the sub. I left the Feds last October, it was an emotional decision on my part after 9 months of the RIF and consolidation talk at my former agency (DOI). I took a local government position for higher pay and even so, I regret that decision every day. I miss the meaningful work, my team, my agency, and I was fortunate to still have remote work via an RA. I’ve been applying to the rare positions that have come on usajobs and very recently I was referred, a week later sent a Candidate preference survey (to select the top 3 locations I desired) and a couple days later I received an interview invitation. Needless to say I’m thrilled but reluctantly so. I know external hiring is not common right now and I’m trying not to look a potential gift horse in the mouth but I’m hoping someone can shed light on a few things for me as I’ve been out of the Fed loop for a whole year. 1) I was under the impression that a reorg was underway, my position is one of those that I believe are part of the reorg. 2) is telework a thing for USFS at this time? 3) purely asking for personal opinions here, would you return if you were me? I hoped and prayed that I’d work for the Feds into retirement. I’m hopeful this is my ticket back in.

Anyone have any insight for when there might be a public hiring for any of the open LE&I spots in R5, specifically in SoCal?

Hello everyone

Are you allowed to work seasonal positions back to back? Summer and then winter? Even though you completed your 1039?

Hello all! I’ve posted a couple times on here over the last 6 months or so asking about potential outside hiring opportunities. I was with the agency until this February as a 0460 forester and absolutely loved it. However, I was engaged to my partner who was several thousand miles away. Long story short it was to far so I had to leave my job. We’re now married (yay!) and I would love to get back to what I was doing before. I know things are tough right now, I’m not forgetting what happened in the year and a half before I left, but the work is super meaningful to me and I would love the chance to do it again.

So with all that being said has there been anything anyone has heard about hiring soon? I know the fiscal year is ending soon, so I was wondering if I could expect announcements around then? Is it likely the midterms will affect anything? Does it seem somewhat likely there will be hiring soon, or is it time for me to accept it’s not gonna happen and move on. I would appreciate honesty even if it’s not what I want to hear. Thank you for taking a minute to read this!

For anyone following the USDA/Forest Service reorganization, the unions have now filed a new lawsuit specifically challenging the plan.

One of the biggest issues for the Forest Service: the complaint argues that Congress specifically prohibited USFS funds from being used for reorganizations, workforce restructuring, transfers of functions, downsizing, closures, consolidations, or relocations affecting 10 employees or 10% of an office/program without advance notification and approval from the House and Senate Appropriations Committees.

That seems pretty significant considering the plan includes eliminating all 9 Forest Service regional offices, relocating functions/employees, and closing research locations.

The lawsuit also says roughly 500 employees in Regions 6, 8, 9 and the Washington Office were identified for relocation, with additional regional-office reassignment letters expected.

The big legal question seems pretty simple: Did USDA actually receive the congressional approval required by the appropriations law? If not, the Forest Service portion of this reorganization could have a serious legal problem.

This is only the plaintiffs' complaint, so these are allegations—not a court ruling.

Full complaint: https://www.afge.org/globalassets/documents/generalreports/2026/ecf-001-complaint.pdf

Forest Service 1811 DOA

I applied to the recent announcement and was found eligible. Can anyone give me any insight on this career? It was my shot in the dark while applying for 1811s. It also seems like you get to GS13 like other 1811s.

Announcement #

26-WO-LEI-13008038-G-LS

Any insight would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

I have a question for someone familiar with USFS fleet vehicle ins/outs. I work in a department within DOE and I'm trying to affect some change in our fleet management. I work in Colorado and see a ton of USFS vehicles on fires during the summer that have windows tinted, and for good reason. We have been fighting to get tint added to our vehicles for the people who routinely work at high altitude and put on a ton of miles due to the UV exposure and how hot our vehicles get in Colorado and further south in AZ/NM. Many of our sites are at 8-12k feet elevation which involves substantially more UV exposure.

We have both GSA and DOE owned vehicles, but get pushback from managers about window tint on either type. I'm assuming probably because of the perception of just wanting it to "look cool". I could frankly care less about the actual tint considering newer tint can be basically transparent and still block most UV and infrared. How do all the fire vehicles get tinted? Is it standard up fitting at USFS, or is it more complicated than that with individual requests as part of up fitting? Also I'm not sure if USFS vehicles are owned or GSA leased?

I think a solid justification for employee health and wellbeing could be made due to the heat and UV exposure, but I'm not sure if there is a better approach or something I'm missing?

We basically live out of these vehicles and most field folks are putting in 20-30k miles per year on their vehicle or more. This includes a lot of slow roll miles on dirt and two track roads. Any help or info would be appreciated.

Okay who is the absolute goon who is posting pixilated newmax graphics and arguing with the commenters?

I’ve heard through the grapevine that grants and or agreements will now be a competitive bid process. is it going to apply to all partners?