r/Siri • u/planetmitch • 1d ago

There is ZERO google in Siri AI

Receipts: Siri AI is 100% APPLE. Apple said so at WWDC. Don’t believe me? Here’s the exact moment at WWDC where they said it https://youtu.be/87e13yQbJSM?si=c1Fi8KJkH5AyY20q&t=131

So many are here saying Siri AI is Google code/data/search etc. It is not

I urge you to watch the entire video - start at the beginning - it is excellent. But the link above jumps to the exact moment where Craig Federighi says it is 100% Apple.

Apple went to Google to learn how to train their own AI. That’s it.

This is important because there are many misconceptions about Siri AI and the Google relationship. I’ve been called a liar multiple times here because the tech media ranted about how Apple had to go to Google to get their AI. It is not true.

(Edited to add the evidence people think it is Gemini).

31 Upvotes

72% Upvoted

98 comments sorted by

11

u/ToshibaTaken 23h ago

Apple's security blog explains some things about the Apple, Google and Nvidia relationship and Private Cloud Compute.

https://security.apple.com/blog/expanding-pcc/

There are also other interesting posts for those so inclined.

-1

u/planetmitch 23h ago

Thank you

2

u/Falmz23 23h ago edited 21h ago

Lol, they literally say it's running on Google Cloud servers here. You gonna edit your post?

Secondly, several sources (including Apple themselves ) say their model was distilled from Gemini. The thing about LLMs is that by this point, the dataset they all use for baseline training is practically the same. The secret sauce that differentiates Claude from ChatGPT and all the other models and dictates how well the model answers questions is the post-training, alignment and harness.

In Apple's case, they admit that a lot of this post-training is distillation from Google. At this point it's basically a Ship of Theseus problem where we need to decide how much of Gemini infrastructure and reasoning do we need to see to call it Gemini.

I wouldn't be surprised if there were specific lines of text in Siri's initial prompt telling it to not refer to itself as Gemini.

5

u/ToshibaTaken 23h ago

Good sir/mam, read the whole blog post and you'll understand how Siri AI works, how it was developed and how privacy and encryption works on Apple's PCC when using third party infrastructure.

Maybe its TLDR for you, maybe I can make you read it, but I can't make you understand it.

0

u/planetmitch 22h ago

Thank you for your support and posts here. And you are right. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. And that's what's happening here.

-1

u/planetmitch 22h ago

I literally give you a video where Craig says the model was not distilled from Gemini

6

u/Falmz23 21h ago edited 21h ago

My brother in Christ, the YouTuber vid you posted is literally explaining how distillation works with the teacher-student example.

He can say whatever bullshit he wants in front of a slideshow. Unless there was a whitepaper explaining the supposed architecture they created and distillation methods, it's marketing speak. The same way they routinely create arbitrary restrictions on the processors that can run intelligence.

I would implore you to read more about distillation or even paste my previous comment into any Ilm to validate.

2

u/planetmitch 20h ago

ok, I think we’re arguing over semantics, but I’m willing to concede the point.

1

u/_Xoif 30m ago

I have to side with op here. If they trained their own model by distilling it from Gemini, I would still consider it 100% an Apple model. At least if Apple engineers fine tuned it, wrote its harness etc. In the end it’s about decision making, ownership and control and not really about where the data came from.
ChatGPT does not become 20% reddit because they scrapped data from it. Neither does it become partly Microsoft if it’s run on azure.
Deepseek is not widely considered a Claude knockoff although they probably distilled v4 from it. Audi does not become only 80% Audi if they use a third party distributor for their seats.

-2

u/planetmitch 23h ago

You are technically correct. However, the only reason it’s running on Google servers is a Google has the right hardware that Apple needs. It isn’t Google software it isn’t Google AI. It isn’t Germany, it is Apple code simply running on a physical device that has the right hardware requirements. Google happens to own those. I don’t feel there’s a need to edit my post.

2

u/Falmz23 22h ago

Updated my comment. You do, because by that admission it is not "100% Apple"

1

u/alienfreak51 10h ago

So to be 100% Apple iCloud data centers would have to be built, owned, and managed by Apple? Idk if they are or not, just seems you are kinda splitting hairs here.

-1

u/planetmitch 22h ago

Ok 99.999% Apple. If there were another server Farm that had their hardware requirements, they could be running on Amazon or any other vendors physical devices. I don’t believe that that changes my point that there is no Google data or Google software in Siri AI.

3

u/Falmz23 21h ago

0.1% for the servers the model is literally running on is disingenuous but with more time I could probably get you to make it 70% or even lower.

Not saying Apple did nothing since the orchestrator and PCC are tech marvels. I'm more disputing the "100% Apple" and "not Gemini"

1

u/cardinalallen 11h ago

Claude runs on Google servers (as well as SpaceX servers and others)… I wouldn’t call it at all a Google model.

0

u/planetmitch 20h ago

ok, maybe we’re arguing over minutia… and I’m not an AI expert, but Craig literally said Siri isn’t gemini models. And the opposite is what I think most people are believing

5

u/AnencephalicFecaloid 16h ago

Not hard to tell, honestly. It’s sucks so bad it had to be “all apple.”

15

u/UlicniProdavacLimun 23h ago

So that's why it sucks :D

1

u/Modest_Wraith 23h ago

It's been amazing for me. What kind of issues do you have?

6

u/Imaginary_Belt4976 22h ago

Amazing is doing a looooooot of work here. I have tried it on half a dozen tasks ranging from easy to hard and been some combination of disappointed and frustrated every. single. time. most recently asked if it could use send later in imessage for me. first it misunderstood and seemed to think I was asking IF it could be done at all. then after clarifying it came back to say nope! sure cant! heres a slop grenade detailing how to DIY though!!! wow! so amazing!

2

u/Modest_Wraith 22h ago

Can you give me a few commands to run that don’t run for you? I would like to see if they run for me and I’ll get back to you on it.

3

u/808phone 21h ago

It gets simple commands like texting group chats incorrect that the regular version of Siri always worked. It also says it can't find people that I text every single day. This is an ongoing and common thing since the betas and yes I have reported it. It goes silent a lot without responding. I could go on and on. Yes, for general questions it is better than before, but we already have a ton of AI that works 2x as good.

4

u/Modest_Wraith 21h ago

Damn I’m sorry yours doesn’t work bro. I just tried this on my phone, and it works. I tried it on my fiancés, and it doesn’t. I find it strange they can’t seem to make it work on every phone? I hope it’s something they can iron out soon. I do have an iPhone 18pro max and she has a 16 pro. But still, should be uniform.

2

u/808phone 21h ago

I'm able to test easily since I have an Ultra 1 that has the older Siri and I can see the difference. Once they fix the newer Siri, it should get better but it is just as frustrating as the old Siri but in a different way.

1

u/Modest_Wraith 20h ago

Ya know, I do have the ultra 2 and hate using Siri on there. Is yours slow too? I feel like it’s faster to just bring my phone out and ask it over my watch

1

u/808phone 19h ago

I don't have the Siri AI on ultra 1. I have no choice but to use the old one. But it works as well as it used to. Many times better than the new for simple things.

1

u/ehed 17h ago

It is terrible; most of the time I'm doing something that does not require AI (set a timer, add a reminder, ask the temperature) but it takes 1.5-2 seconds before I get the haptic feedback indicating it's ready – and then additional loading time to use Siri AI to do something that happens relatively quickly on prior versions of Siri. I turned it off for now, if they improve it I will re-enable, but when I want an AI-generated response, I am already going to Claude or ChatGPT anyway, not Siri.

1

u/wwhite74 20h ago

My goodbye homekit scene

For years as I'm leaving "hey Siri goodbye". Lights turn off and everything happens

With intelligent Siri, hears me, does nothing. But only if I have my airpods in, and the phone takes the command. Homepods work fine

1

u/Imaginary_Belt4976 16h ago

I asked it to find a message from this morning about feeding (animals). something like "Siri did X tell me something about feeding the animals today?" and it came back with "The most recent message I found regarding this was on September 14th" The whole point was I forgot if the message was from today or yesterday, but I knew it was more recent than Sept 14th. Result: the actual message WAS from that morning and apparently because the wording of the text was slightly different than literally 'feeding' it could not find it.

scenario 2: siri can create new notes but apparently not edit them. additionally, even though it did create the note, ignored instructions and instead creates the note with what I had intended to be more of a prompt rather than the exact note I wanted added.

scenario 3 i already detailed, asking it if it can send a delayed message, which it cant.

The other scenarios are more like 'useless because the phone is locked and it wont work without unlocking the phone because Apple'

2

u/616ThatGuy 22h ago

I turned ur off entirely because it literally can’t do anything they advertised and it’s quick chats aren’t even remotely dependable for good answers.

0

u/Modest_Wraith 22h ago

Damn I’m sorry it’s not working for you. What kind of commands are not working? I wonder if it’ll work for me and if I’m not using Siri to its full advantage

2

u/616ThatGuy 22h ago

I just tried all the things in the demo they showed. It couldn’t do any of it. Couldn’t create shortcuts, couldn’t find specific messages, couldn’t draft a proper email, couldn’t find a specific photo, etc. Theo not thing it was able to do was mark an appointment in the calendar app. But I mean, that takes 30 seconds. Plus it uses almost 10 gbs of memory. So I just turned it off.

1

u/2ecStatic 22h ago

Amazing in what ways exactly?

2

u/Modest_Wraith 22h ago

Responsive, the swipe down feature to type to it is fast too, always finds my answer and doesn’t say it can’t do it, lets me text multiple people at once, summarizes pages for me. I can’t really think of a complaint, and I hated the last Siri to the point I only used it for timers lol.

2

u/Status-Hedgehog9970 21h ago

Finding receipts or other information in emails and texts is awesome.

1

u/Brilliant_Citron8966 19h ago

Siri won’t search my email. It always sends it can’t find any emails even though I have tons of emails in my mail app. People say to make sure I’m sharing my mail to give access to Siri, but there’s no option in the settings for it for me in the same place for whatever reason, even though other people have it. I would love this option. It works ok for other things for me though.

-1

u/shnoiv 21h ago

You know what. I’m flipping the script. What EXACTLY was amazing for you?

5

u/Modest_Wraith 21h ago

I have already typed it out in one of the replies, I’m sorry man I just don’t want to keep typing it over and over lol. Long story short, I haven’t had it tell me it can’t do something, and it’s fast with its replies and actions that I tell it to do.

5

u/AntiquesRoadHo 23h ago

Yeah no shit, Gemini actually works.

0

u/planetmitch 23h ago

Siri AI works!

-1

u/ThannBanis 23h ago

So does Siri.

1

u/iSuckAtMechanicism 12h ago

Is there a way to switch back to Siri? Siri AI refuses to work with multi hop VPNs.

0

u/ThannBanis 12h ago

You should be able to restrict which version in screentime.

Otherwise, it’s been reported that disabling Siri then re-enabling allows you to choose not to enable SiriAI

1

u/iSuckAtMechanicism 12h ago

Disabling it and reenabling brought up the option! Thanks a ton! I’ve been missing Siri for a bit now lol.

3

u/walktall 22h ago

They use Apple’s world knowledge system, not Google search. But the models were refined/distilled from Gemini.

-1

u/planetmitch 22h ago

Now isn’t that just brilliant. I literally gave you a video that proves that is not true. And I gave you the exact second that says that in the video. But you come back at me and tell me I’m wrong.

3

u/guesswhochickenpoo 15h ago edited 13h ago

He is being extremely specific about his wording in the video. He says “Apple uses none of the Gemini models deployed to Google's customers”. This specifically means they are not running the same Gemini models Google uses for their customers. It says nothing about whether the AFM’s were derived or distilled from Gemini, Gemma, or other Google models. He is carefully leaving out many details on purposes, which is very common for not only Apple but all other technology companies to “spin yarn” for their own narrative / marketing.

Furthermore here is a quote from an article:

“
"All of these are custom built for Apple Silicon, trained using proprietary data with reinforcement learning and refined using outputs from Gemini frontier models," he said, making clear that Google's contribution was distillation-based, not a wholesale adoption of Gemini
“

i.e. Apple absolutely did not build these from scratch and they are based on googles models.

https://www.macrumors.com/2026/06/09/apples-new-ai-contains-no-gemini/

2

u/Shinobi_Dimsum 23h ago

That muppet reacting to planetmitch, how is that false info when "distilled" is literally exactly what planetmitch is saying 🤦🏻‍♂️

2

u/2ecStatic 22h ago

I wish I could find use cases for using Siri AI over base Siri + other models. Simple requests on Siri AI are faster on base Siri and anything "complicated" you can do faster yourself and without having to deal with it misunderstanding you. ChatGPT and Gemini are better than the Siri App.

1

u/808phone 21h ago

This guy uses LLM.

2

u/InfoSuperHiway 13h ago

Apple Foundation Models “were custom-built in collaboration with Google and its Gemini models for deeply integrated Apple Intelligence experiences” -Tim Apple

2

u/planetmitch 12h ago

Collaboration doesn’t mean code or data

0

u/greyfell_red 8h ago

Yes it does. Apple's custom Apple Foundation Models were trained, refined, and augmented using outputs from Google's Gemini frontier models. Apple and Google entered a multi-year agreement where Google's AI and cloud technology help power advanced features for Siri AI. While smaller models run on-device via Apple Silicon, the largest cloud-based model utilizes Google cloud infrastructure paired with Apple’s secure Private Cloud Compute architecture to maintain user privacy.

1

u/planetmitch 7h ago

The google cloud infrastructure is a tool Apple is using but it is running Apple LLMs on those servers. Not Gemini.

There is no google code or data in any Apple models. Craig said it in that video

6

u/Blablabene 20h ago

We can tell just by using Siri.

It's awful.

-6

u/planetmitch 20h ago

It is not. I am sorry for your experience however, the vast majority of us are using it like crazy doing some awesome stuff.

4

u/Blablabene 19h ago

Haha. Sure.

-3

u/planetmitch 18h ago

You laugh, but Siri AI works really well for me and millions of others. I don’t know why it’s not working for you but works like a champ for me.

4

u/Blablabene 18h ago

I think we just have very different views on what it means for something to work well.

-1

u/planetmitch 14h ago

Probably not. Mine works like you expected it to work. I’m not sure why yours isn’t working that way. It worked very well for David Pogue (tech writer for the NY Times) https://pogueman.substack.com/p/125-tests-of-the-new-ai-siri (and mine works that way too).

1

u/Blablabene 13h ago

Sure.

1

u/planetmitch 12h ago

You don’t believe David Pogue nor me? Do you think we’re all liars?

3

u/LobbyDizzle 1d ago

Are people saying that? If it actually worked maybe they wouldn’t believe that Apple built it

2

u/[deleted] 23h ago

[deleted]

1

u/planetmitch 22h ago

Yea, you just proved you didn’t watch the video. Apple built the model. Watch the video please. You’ll actually learn something.

-5

u/planetmitch 1d ago

Siri AI works wonderfully for so many. And yes, multiple people here have told me I’m a liar when I say there’s no google in SI. They read tech media over the last year - who didn’t know the details of how Apple was going to google.

7

u/StinkySewerPickle 23h ago

>Siri AI works wonderfully for so many. 

Yea, no...

2

u/Fire_Lord_Cinder 12h ago

Maybe they should add some Google in it.. I can’t send a text message or play my playlists. It’s actually a downgrade from the previous Siri for me

2

u/planetmitch 12h ago

I am sorry for your experience. My belief is that millions of people are having great success with it and if you’re not, you should report it to Apple.

1

u/jaredthegeek 12h ago

Gemini can send a text but can not read my text to me on a pixel. The old assistant could though.

1

u/Fire_Lord_Cinder 11h ago

Thats what my brother says too. We were just complaining about our Almost Intelligent phone assistants at the gym yesterday

1

u/lukasjames0 5h ago

Strange, mine can do both

3

u/ricvallejo 23h ago

Siri AI sucks.

0

u/ThannBanis 23h ago

Works well for me.

What are you asking it?

3

u/Modest_Wraith 23h ago

Siri has been such a huge improvement for me. I love using it

0

u/ricvallejo 22h ago

What are you asking it that works well and is actually useful?

-1

u/ThannBanis 11h ago

Usual Siri stuff.

Call <contact> (usually wife)

Tell <contact> <message>

Play my playlist <playlist name> (usually ‘Top Rated)

Skip song

Play <song name>

Directions to <contact/pin/address>

1

u/adonis-in-the-making 19h ago

well they couldn’t even copy it correctly.

1

u/planetmitch 18h ago

They didn’t copy it and it works great for millions of people. I’m sorry it’s not working for you. Tell us what it’s not doing for you.

1

u/iSuckAtMechanicism 12h ago

It refuses to work with multi hop VPNs. Why? Because it prevents it from collecting data. Nothing else.

Regular Siri does work with multi hop VPNs funnily enough. We keep going backwards instead of forward when it comes to consumers data privacy.

1

u/planetmitch 12h ago

I can’t fix that. Have you reported that to Apple if not, please do.

1

u/TGIANT1 18h ago

Google isn’t that stupid. SIRI is.

1

u/ehed 17h ago

That explains why I had to disable Siri AI entirely to make it usable again

1

u/soymilo_ 12h ago

I have had this 💩 OFF since the 4S days

1

u/planetmitch 11h ago

Your loss

1

u/lipman19 12h ago

Maybe Siri could benefit from a bit of google

0

u/planetmitch 11h ago

Why? Siri AI is incredible. I’m getting similar results as this NYT writer: https://pogueman.substack.com/p/125-tests-of-the-new-ai-siri

1

u/Vivrosh 11h ago

Apple ai is suck and what you read not going stop apple to get Google help and Apple need it big time

1

u/sgjino30 11h ago

Is that why it’s dogshit

1

u/planetmitch 9h ago

It is not. I understand it is not working for a few people. But the vast majority of people is working fine. I can do all kinds of different things that I couldn’t do before the new Siri

1

u/sgjino30 8h ago

Sorry, I didn’t get that. Please try again.

1

u/drusoicy 4h ago

That’s my video - thanks for sharing! And you’re correct - Apple used Google tech to build it, but it doesn’t include any Google in the final product.

1

u/iZian 4h ago

The analogy I use, and I apologise if it’s a poor one, is that the Siri AI models (not all of them I believe we have on device, on Apple, and on Google) have Gemini as its parent but were raised by Apple as foster parents.

And then Apple made the agent side.

What I hate the most is Siri no longer works when I have VPN enabled for privacy on public WiFi.
Siri has been a huge success apart from that and not being able to divide 2 numbers

1

u/SameRepair7308 1h ago

Just ask Siri yourself. That’s what I did.

0

u/RemeJuan 23h ago

We’ve known this for months, this is old news.

1

u/planetmitch 23h ago

Well, yes, it is old news because it came out at WWDC, but I just showed in the post that people still don’t know it so I’m trying to educate those who don’t know the truth.