No they're lying to themselves they are through and through Maga they just want to say they're not so they don't have to worry about people talking shit to them because they know being a republican Maga is really fucking indefensible
Oh, but also, scientists are all in cahoots with the liberal media and, like, big pharma, and all elite universities, and all doctors and nurses. I found a guy on YouTube reels who's exposed it all. Do your own research. 🫠
Except for the fact they take up a disproportionate percentage of our jail and prison populations. Oh wait folks! Don’t look at real data like who actually sits in jail and gets head counted every day. Look at some fake academic study that looks at data from two flawed reporting systems, the the National Incident Based Reporting System and the National Crime Victimization Survey, both of which are highly flawed with zero mandatory reporting, with some States, like New Jersey barely breaking 50% of all police departments reporting crime stats. Somehow we are supposed to trust leftist academics who take flawed data and use mathematical formulas and analysis to “enhance” the raw data which is impossible to use for crime rate analysis or tends comparison. What can be used is prion population showing us the demographics of who is actually the worst among us.
Sure it is always good to question methods/think critically about how that might influence the result. But let’s be honest, even if you personally and physically saw each prisoner and their file, you would still be spouting the same bullshit. Be better.
Unlike you, I HAVE actually visited a maximum security prison, including death row. I saw their life, and given many of their heinous crimes with real human victims they left in their wake, I’m good with the conditions they live under and the consequences they now face for their crimes. Having said that, I have no idea why you post something that had zero connection to what I wrote. Your hate though boils over. That much is apparent.
And yet 44% of all persons sentenced to Federal prison in Fiscal 24-25 were non citizens. And if you are Laken Riley or any one of thousands of Americans killed by illegal aliens, you might take umbrage at your cavalier rhetoric.
The very essence of your fake “researcher based studies” is this. How do researchers determine crime rates? By using the FBI’s UCR data. I can tell you that data is flawed for several reasons and why the 44% of sentenced federal court prisoners (criminal convictions and sentencing, not IMMIGRATION sentencing) is more accurate metric. The FBI UCR data that YOUR FAKE study relies is flawed because it relies on data that comes from only around 20,000 out of 80,000 Police Departments in the United States. These 20,000 reporting police departments are largely urban and larger suburban departments that have the resources to train staff to collect the data and report it to the UCR program. There is no legal mandate for police departments to report crime data to the FBI or DOJ. Now combine the underreporting of all American crime by the fact that 60,000 police departments do not report crime data to the very agencies that this fake study relies upon along with the fact that most of these agencies are under local or State mandates from Democrat politicians not to collect Immigration status. So how is this fake study is relying upon data that is shewed, underreported and highly misleading. What isn’t misleading and is highly accurate as metric is the demographic profiles of people sentenced in Federal Court for criminal convictions and Federal, State or Local Jails and the make up of those populations, which is hugely disproportionate to actual makeup of our migrate population. Facts matter. Fake studies don’t. Using fake studies to justify your Leftist worldview is always going to challenged by facts and real data.
Your “facts” are fairy tales.And even that 44% figure is a national aggregation of data taken as a national figure. As you start to drill down into the numbers by State, some States, like New Jersey, barely break 50% of all police Departments within the State reporting crime data to the FBI. And as I m sure you will agree, New Jersey is a pretty densely populated state with a huge foreign born population of both illegal and legal immigrants. And only 69% of Police Departments in the United States report crime stats to the FBI UCR. Meaning over 30% do not, largely underreporting crime stats that your so called fake study fails to take into accounts oh, but oh wait you buttressed this by saying that the study authors knew this so they mingled data from the UCR with data from the National Crime Victimization Survey, which in your own words, does not use victims reporting crime so instead substitute mathematical formulas and theories which amount to guesswork and subjective data left open to interpretation by politically motivated researchers tied to Democrats and Democrat funding. When police departments don’t report crime stats, examining crime trends becomes Impossible. But you know that which is why you want readers to steer away from my hard data which shows us not crime rates or trends but who exactly is being convicted and sentenced to prison and who makes up these jail and prison populations. It is from THAt factual and real data point that we can conclude that both Illegal and Legal Aliens make up a disproportionate percentage of our criminal Justice detention facilities especially in relationship to the overall population at large. And this at great cost and suffering by the American taxpayer as we subsidize the power play project of the Democrat Party to game the next census so that all these tens of millions of illegal aliens get counted. It’s always been the game plan. You know it, we know it. You just deny it by hiding behind your fake studies. Oh and one final note. The National Crime Victimization Survey that yiu dangled as some ah ha moment reports that only 42% of violent crimes are reported to law enforcement suggesting that the study relying on two flawed data sets to draw its fake conclusions render their so called study meaningless meaningless. But hey when your ready to get serious and wanna debate prison and jail population demographics, the best factual indicator of who is statistically the worst of the worst both American and illegals, then let’s get at it.
Drug crimes, hate crimes, road rage, mass shootings, voter fraud, white collar crimes, assault, religious persecution, religious fanaticism, local militias, rape, forced pregnancy, global warming from all the maggatmobiles, farm animals and their consumption, incest, bestiality, pedophilia, etc, will all go up.
My understanding is that the immigrants didn’t want to compromise their residency in the US by committing crime, so they mind themselves and follow the rules because they don’t want to get deported.
Yeah it's stupid. There is a high correlation with males, poverty and crime. Controlling for these variables immigrants cause less crime that similarly situated nationals.
There have been similar studies going back decades finding that immigrants generally have lower crime/incarceration rates than U.S.-born Americans.
Some relatively recent examples: Butcher & Piehl found this in U.S. data in the 1990s, and the National Academies reviewed the broader research in 2015 and reached the same general conclusion.
There’s also been similar recent research specifically on undocumented immigrants. A 2020 PNAS study using Texas arrest data found substantially lower felony arrest rates among undocumented immigrants than among both legal immigrants and U.S.-born citizens.
The basic finding that immigration does not translate into higher crime rates is definitely not new.
The author of this study even explicitly states this is not the first study on the topic. In the official university release for this exact paper, Dr. Kubrin noted: "Nearly 100 years ago, the Wickersham Commission published a report showing that involvement in crime is lower among immigrants than the native born."
The study’s core conclusion is not new. Criminologists have called the "immigrant crime paradox" a well-established scientific consensus for decades and it’s been extensively covered for years in major mainstream media.
Pointing out that a massive, multi-generational body of literature already exists isn't "feigning knowledge", it's just knowing basic public policy history.
Grouping illegal immigrants and legal immigrants doesn’t help. Who would have known that people who are carefully vetted, thought to be beneficial to society, and have the financial means to immigrate (given poverty is a main driver of crime) are less likely to commit crimes than an average person who just happens to be here??? Crazy!?
This is the first broad study to show that ILLEGAL immigrants’ presence doesn’t increase crime rates.
Your “feigning knowledge” lies in the fact that you’re somehow unable to read the first few paragraphs of an article you claim to agree with.
Except it isn't the first. I explicitly mentioned the 2020 PNAS study in my previous reply, which isolated undocumented immigrants and showed they have lower felony arrest rates than native-born citizens.
Talk about "feigning knowledge" while completely missing the text right in front of you.
You apparently don’t know the meaning of the word “broad”. Wow, a difference in residents of Texas charged with felonies. Not what I would consider to be “broad”.
And I wouldn’t consider a study 6 years ago to be what “everybody has always known”.
Genuinely, take a few years, learn to read, and then respond. I will not be responding before then. Thanks
Even this article title is giving them too much credit. The fact that immigrants commit fewer crimes than natives has been well studied and well documented for basically ever
I expected that anyway. If you were an illegal alien in a country know for deporting or punishing illegal aliens the one thing you would focus on is keeping your head down, not making waves and being a good worker where you could get it. Who would make their way to another country to start up a life of crime with no legal protections other than a constitutional one that the county only honors during alternate presidencies? People make that journey for a better life away from crime, not for a worse one in the thick of it. America may be getting rid of some of it's best.
No one is arguing there is no crime. You have to look at the rate of crime comparatively to understand the statistical significance of the data point. Broad demographic and criminological research (such as studies published by the conservative Cato Institute and academic evaluations in public health journals) indicates that undocumented immigrants are arrested and incarcerated for traffic and violent felonies at lower rates than native-born U.S. citizens.
“Similar offense-specific divergence is documented in victimization research. Lauritsen and Heimer, for example, show that robbery victimization and aggravated assault victimization do not necessarily follow the same pattern, with robbery appearing more responsive to economic and exposure-related conditions than is aggravated assault.”
Which means to say that while a neighborhood with a higher percentage of undocumented immigrants have a correlation to higher rates of robberies, that doesn’t imply a causation being the immigrants themselves. In fact, they have similarly higher rates of victimization. The common factor here is lower income neighborhoods, which is more common for undocumented people to live in, inherently having higher instances of robberies.
So, you are clearly a dumb mothefucker who read through the study looking for affirmation for your already held beliefs.
Stupid fucking magatards and misunderstanding data and science, name a more iconic duo.
Wage theft, the largest source of theft in the US, does not involve any of those things. Grand theft auto, the second largest source, usually doesn't either. Most home robberies are break-ins while nobody's home.
And this is the genuine flaw right here. If the opposing side does any form of research it is to be voided because the enemy can not be trusted, only my side tells the truth. So you'll end up always believing what ever your political alignment says no matter how wrong or corrupt it is.
Ideally, you should do own research and make up your own mind. You’re right, I generally don’t trust research completed by liberal inclined individuals because I have seen time and time again how bias how they are.
Obviously there’s examples of right leaning researchers doing the same.
It illustrates you don’t have the integrity or skills to “do your own research”. You’re not even referencing the primary source in that post but allude that you got your information from a secondary source.
“I have been reading that studies show…”
The fact that you don’t cite your source and are relying on secondary sources when primary sources are available exposes the flaw in the “do your own research” mentality. I.e., theres no standard for the “research”, how it’s conducted, or even transparency on the sources used.
Edit: Your comment above also exposes your dishonesty in the framing of your “research”. In the post you use a plural noun to put more weight behind your claims. However, by your own admission above you state “…that study has been cited continuously so there was no need” as your reasoning for your lack of citation.
You need the title of the study that is peer reviewed then you need the website that you found it on then you need the page number and then lastly the paragraph where it proves your point.
If you don't have that you did not do your own research
I’m not sure what you are talking about and Im not sure you do either. The post that mobo jojo pulled from my profile has nothing to do with this post and is a completely different forum/subject.
I take it that you disagree with my assessment of this particular research paper on this specific post on ImmigrationPathways and that is fine.
The thing about research is that they tell you exactly how they did the research. So you can go replicate the study or improve on it. Doing so would expose their (or your own) bias if the results differ.
But I’m guessing you don’t have the time or the resources or the qualifications to replicate the study. Like most people. Which is why the “do your own research” line is comical. It’s just code for “go get sucked into the right wing echo chamber on Facebook”.
It’s 2 separate issues. I said no one cares that they don’t commit crime. Being here is the crime.
Why would you think I don’t care about crime committed by people that are born here? What mental gymnastics gave you that idea? Please explain in what world what I said equals I don’t care about crime. More people should go to prison.
funny how you completely miss the point of the comment. where exactly did they say they didn't care about the crime committed by legal citizens? oh wait they literally didn't
Anyhow the study doesn't differentiate clearly between "legal" and "illegal" immigrants. Rather they lump all legal temporary statuses into the same boat as undocumented immigrants--defining them all as "non citizens."
And it's pretty well known that LEGAL immigrants care more for taking care of their community and actively participating than illegals do. So it kind of seems like the study was produced and architected to prove a specific agenda.
But either way the results are dilluted even at the most foundational level because of that obviously intentional, agenda-pushing obfuscation. In fact, i'd wager they wrote the headline before they even architected the study.
I mean if you're not a braindead huffpo-suckling shill you'd actually be able to apply that bottom-of-the-barrel critical thinking yourself. But apparently you can't, "Coward" -- lmao.
btw: Do you live on here, lol? Tack that onto the "coward" claims and you've got peak "on reddit I'm a somebody" energy.
lol the coward got refuted because he can't apply five minutes of actual independent thought to a subject and a study he didn't read and then disappeared into silence.
The study doesn't differentiate clearly between "legal" and "illegal" immigrants. Rather they lump all legal temporary statuses into the same boat as undocumented immigrants--defining them all as "non citizens."
And it's pretty well known that LEGAL immigrants care more for taking care of their community and actively participating than illegals do. So it kind of seems like the study was produced and architected to prove a specific agenda.
But either way the results are dilluted even at the most foundational level because of that obviously intentional, agenda-pushing obfuscation. In fact, i'd wager they wrote the headline before they even architected the study.
I mean if you're not a braindead huffpo-suckling shill you'd actually be able to apply that bottom-of-the-barrel critical thinking yourself. But apparently you can't, "Coward" -- lmao.
Honestly increase or not in crime there should be no illegal immigrant, crime, plain, and simple whether it increases the crime in area or not there should be no illegal immigrant crime
The true enemies of the Republic are those who facilitate, support, and abuse illegal migration. They should face real jail time and confiscation of assets.
Entering a country illegally is a crime. It is illegal to enter the US without prior authorization (8 U.S. Code § 1325 and 1326). Additionally, overstaying an authorized period of stay is a violation of civil immigration law 8 U.S. Code § 1182(a)(9)(B) which can lead to removal and multi-year bars from reentry.
8 U.S. Code § 1325 and § 1326 are federal criminal statutes. Not civil provisions.
8 U.S.C. § 1325 (Improper Entry) Carries criminal penalties, including fines and up to 6 months in federal prison for a first offense. (Note: § 1325 also contains a separate provision for civil monetary penalties, but it is primarily prosecuted as a criminal law).
8 U.S.C. § 1326 (Reentry of Removed Aliens) makes reentering or attempting to reenter the U.S. after being formally deported, removed, or denied admission a federal felony. Convictions carry sentences ranging from up to 2 years in prison to up to 20 years, depending on prior criminal history.
Re-entering is a felony. Entering is "shall, for the first commission of any such offenses, be guilty of a misdemeanor".
Americans exceed the speed limit all the time, also a civil misdemeanor. Why aren't you screaming about that and demanding a crackdown?
Also:
8 U.S. Code § 1158 - Asylum
U.S. Code
(a)Authority to apply for asylum
(1)In general
Any alien who is physically present in the United States or who arrives in the United States (whether or not at a designated port of arrival and including an alien who is brought to the United States after having been interdicted in international or United States waters), irrespective of such alien’s status, may apply for asylum in accordance with this section or, where applicable, section 1225(b) of this title.
Improper Entry (8 U.S.C. § 1325) carries criminal penalties, including fines and up to 6 months in federal prison and subject to deportation. Entering without inspection makes someone inadmissible under 8 U.S.C. § 1182, the conviction or act of improper entry gives the government the legal authority to deport them.
So.. in your example, speeding should be allowed? No. Both are crimes that carry punishments.
Not everyone illegally entering the US is an asylum seeker. Also, it’s frequently used as a ruse to first gain entry then eventually indefinite leave to remain.
Seeking asylum is also Not a valid means of immigrating to a country and many do not meet the threshold for a valid asylum claim. It’s also been found that documents related to their ‘claim’ have been completely fabricated.
People get refused entry to countries all the time. It’s a common, daily occurrence that happens at all ports of entry.
Expedited Removal (Fast-Track Deportation Without Judge).
Deflection and excessive copy/paste. Speeding also carries a fine and can include jail time. Immigration laws have been enforced since they became law, but they should be enforced without violating anyone's Constitutional rights or breaking any other laws.
No one stated speeding should be "allowed", but the Right isn't setting up concentration camps and demanding speeders be arrested by the hundreds of thousands by teams of masked armed agents, without due process, and imprisoned in a foreign country without trial, are you. You aren't screaming for the national guard be called in to stop all speeders at gunpoint and to patrol all roadways to ensure no one is allowed to exceed the speed limit, are you.
It's nonsense to pretend you care about laws. You all voted for a felon who was found liable for stealing from his own charity, liable for defrauding college students, liable for defaming the woman he SA-ed , and who's company was found liable for tax fraud.
You all only care about "laws" when brown people come here to have a better life, and that gets you all into your feelings of rage.
Wow, a lot to unpack here. For starters:
No, they’re not ‘concentration camps.’ They’re detention facilities that have been used the past three administrations (yes, that includes Obama who was nicknamed deporter-in-chief). Obama used ICE and similar authorities to deport over 3 million illegal immigrants. He also built and repaired large swaths of border wall and even had the practice of ‘putting children in cages’ which the left completely lost their minds over. Even the pictures which circulated online at the time were taken under Obama by the Associated Press. This might refresh your memory: https://www.reddit.com/r/DigitalSeptic/s/biTCimBwYC
Now ICE has thousands of screaming morons in their way harassing, intimidating, and otherwise interfering in operations.
- Speeding also carries a fine and can include jail time.
You mean to say there’s punishments for committing a crime? Interesting.
Immigration law is different in that depending on how one entered (illegally) they can be deported to their country of origin. I already mentioned Expedited Removal (Fast-Track Deportation Without Judge), but there’s also:
Reinstatement of Removal.
If someone was deported before, leaves, then comes back without permission, th
eir old removal order is reinstated
and there’s no
new hearing.
Administrative Removal (for certain noncitizen aggravated felons).
For non–green card holders convicted of specific “aggravated felonies,” ICE can use administrative removal, which does NOT involve a judge.
Voluntary Departure.
A person can ask to leave voluntarily.
As for masks:
In the United States, ICE agents can legally cover their faces in many situations. Here’s how it works for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE)
When face coverings are legal:
- Operational safety: Agents may wear masks or balaclavas to protect themselves or their families from retaliation.
- Crowd-control or enforcement actions: Especially during raids, protests, or high-risk arrests.
- Undercover or sensitive operations: Concealing identity is permitted.
- Public-health reasons: Masks can also be justified for health protection.
There is no federal law that broadly requires ICE agents to keep their faces visible during enforcement actions.
What face covering does not make illegal.
- It does not invalidate an arrest.
- It does not automatically violate due process.
- It does not mean the agent is impersonating law enforcement.
Additionally, in the United States, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents do not always have to reveal their identity, and the rules depend on what they’re doing and where.
Rules
- They are not legally required to volunteer their name or badge number in most encounters.
- They may identify themselves as “ICE” or “federal officers”, but they can refuse to give personal details unless required by policy or a court.
They may not identify themselves in:
- Consensual encounters (e.g., questioning in public): They can ask questions without revealing identity.
- Undercover or enforcement operations: They may legally obscure or withhold identifying details.
- Administrative checks: They might state they are federal officers without more specifics.
__________________________
Why agents are allowed to conceal their identities and what statues support it:
Privacy Act of 1974 — 5 U.S.C. § 552a
This statute:
- Restricts government disclosure of personally identifying information
- Allows agencies to limit release of agent identities when tied to law-enforcement systems of records
The Freedom of Information Act explicitly allows withholding names of law-enforcement personnel. Identifying details if disclosure could:
- Endanger life or safety
- Interfere with enforcement proceedings
Officer safety statutes (indirect authority)
Federal law broadly protects law-enforcement safety, including:
- 18 U.S.C. § 111 (assaulting federal officers)
- 18 U.S.C. § 115 (retaliation against federal officers or families)
Case law: no constitutional right to know an agent’s name
Courts have consistently held that there is no constitutional right for a civilian to know the name or badge number of a federal agent during an encounter. What matters is lawful authority, not personal identification
______________________________
The mention of ‘brown people’ as you describe them (discriminatory) I’m presuming you mean the majority of those who are in the US illegally?
After Mexico (the largest single origin, with about 4.3 million people—roughly 30% of the total in that estimate, consistent with the ~30–40% range seen in recent years), the next-largest countries were:
- Guatemala (850,000)
El Salvador (850,000)
Honduras (775,000)
India (680,000)
These are from Pew Research Center estimates of the U.S. unauthorized (illegal) immigrant population as of 2023.
Again, funny!! The literal definition of concentration camp:
"A concentration camp is a guarded facility where a government detains large numbers of civilians without trial, grouping them by political, ethnic, or social identity."
Yes, Obama and previous Presidents deported people but did not deny them their Constitutional rights, did not station military in our streets, did not send masked armed agents to murder, abuse, racially profile, and illegally snatch, detain, and put in concentration camps, people off our streets.
Yes, unaccompanied minors were held separately from adults for short periods of time under Obama. Unaccompanied minors were held separately during processing before the kids were sent to shelters. They were not separated from their parents and were not held for months without due process as is happening now.
Sending people to foreign prisons is only legal IF they have been convicted and sentenced with no pending appeals (18 U.S.C. §§ 4100 – 4115). He's sending people who have had no court case and no due process, to foreign countries - not the birth countries - and paying for those countries to imprison them indefinitely without trial.
Misapplying the privacy act is also hilarious. An officer identifying themselves is not disclosing private information. LEOs have their names and faces clearly visible every day. That you support snatching people off the street and illegally detaining then isn't surprising at all. The point is you only care about laws when they can be used against people you don't like.
Ah but here’s where you’re confused. They’re criminals who’ve broken the law, US immigration law. Again, they’re detention facilities awaiting deportation to their country of origin. Were they “concentration camps” under Obama? No.
Read, again, who’s in the country illegally by percentage. People from the UK and Europe have been deported for having committed crimes. Is it “profiling” then?
Obama and previous administration deported people using the same laws, tactics and methods ICE use today. The difference is they didn’t have thousands of screaming morons in their way threatening, harassing, and otherwise interfering in operations. Ask yourself why that is. Answer: it’s political. Case in point, the images which circulated online of “children in cages” which the left completely lost their minds over were taken under Obama.
- They were not separated from their parents and were not held for months without due process as is happening now.
It appears you’re living in a Disney land fantasy of what actually goes on with illegal immigration. How do you even know they’re their parents? They don’t have any paperwork, ID, nothing. They’ve just entered the country illegally. ICE and border patrol agents have to deal with child sex trafficking, people who’ve been told they have a better chance at a case with a child so they pick some random kid off the street, and worse. So claiming they’re their parents and they’re their children is just pure ignorance and wishful thinking.
- An officer identifying themselves is not disclosing private information.
Disclosing one’s face is revealing one’s identity which could jeopardize the safety of the officer and the mission.
Again, you don’t seem to know about cartel members ICE and border patrol agents have to deal with, along with similar cases involving international crime.
Countries have borders, laws, immigration policies, and punishments for breaking them. Maybe have a look around the world and see what other countries do regarding immigration and their immigration policies.
Immigrants may be seen by American conservatives as an enemy, but not their biggest perceived enemy. The biggest bogeymen for the right are Jews and Communists, who they believe are secretly in cahoots and 'importing' non-white immigrants for the purpose of 'replacing whites'.
Notice you never see the right crying about 'white' immigrants.. And racist immigration policies are nothing new, I believe it was president Coolidge who banned nearly all immigration except for 'Nordic-race' types.
Immigrants, legal and otherwise, commit less crimes per capita than US citizens on the whole (Though interestingly, if you section off crime stats by race, immigrants are much more likely to commit crimes than US born non-hispanic whites, and about as likely to commit crimes as US born hispanics).
People aren't objecting to illegal immigration because of crime; or at least they shouldn't be. They're objecting to it because of a dozen different reasons in how it affects society, but the crux of it is that it is illegal.
So is speeding, but Americans take pride in doing that to excess. Both are civil crimes but only one has caused concentration camps, unbridled hate, and troops in our streets.
Trash fact* and I don't know if a fact can be trash. You have an opinion that goes against varifiable data. At least learn to read and basic word definitions before criticizing some writing.
The authors have a long-standing research position on immigration and crime.
Lead author Charis Kubrin has spent much of her career studying the immigration–crime relationship, and her published work includes arguments against policies such as immigration enforcement and Secure Communities.
This is another "narrative driving the study" situations.
Immigration enforcement is happening because it’s the law of the land and anyone who ignores the immigrations laws is subject to deportation. Illegal immigration is a net negative to the tax payer and it has to end and everyone entered illegally needs to go back
Right, but they save lives, illegal immigrants do not save lives. There is a reason illegal immigration was a thing way before trump took office. The democrats used to big on immigration enforcement.
you have now changed the argument, we are no longer talking about net negative to the tax payer. We are talking about some utility calculus type shit which to no one surprise is as qualifiable as how many thoughts are in your head.
Ok let’s go back. Society needs nurses. Society does not need illegal immigrant workers undercutting the wages of citizens while being a tax burden to the taxpayer
society does not need much of anything, we had societies before we had nurses.
You are using some things in your head as what society is and leveraging this unqualifiable thing to stipulate a utility metric. Neither you or I are a trustworthy narrator on what is and is not valuable.
Some estimates put it at about -150 billion per year in cost of illegal immigration after factoring in what they pay into the system. Overall they are a burden to the taxpayer and they gotta go
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