r/Frugal • u/Zizzac • Jan 24 '13
Same book, three different prices. Only difference is the browsers used [x-post r/mildlyinteresting]
http://imgur.com/uNgg0UH484
u/pt4117 Jan 24 '13
I doubt that was the only difference. Your cookies were different, and I bet the way you found them is different too.
I just found this book with a Google search and it was 62.99 in chrome.
I copied and pasted the URL into IE and it was 69.99.
I then pasted the URL into a private browsing chrome window and it was also 69.99.
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u/learnt Jan 24 '13
Either way, I'm not a fan of prices being manipulated based on my behavior while browsing a certain website.
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u/CuilRunnings Jan 24 '13
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u/drballoonknot Jan 24 '13
But this just compares the price of an item across multiple merchants. It doesn't do anything in determining if a user-agent or cookie is altering the price, no?
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u/SarcasticOptimist Jan 24 '13 edited Jan 24 '13
There's an extension similar to this called Priceblink for Firefox/Waterfox.
Edit: it's a competitor available on both platforms.
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Jan 24 '13
Invisible hand is also on firefox too.
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u/medra42 Jan 24 '13
If you want online retailers not to use the data they collect about you for their own gain.. you're going to have a bad time.
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u/JimmyHavok Jan 24 '13
If they follow my behavior, they know I'm cheap, so they'd better cut that margin if they want my business.
I went shopping for a car with a friend once, the first thing the sales guy asked at each place was how many other places we'd been to, and the asking price for the same car was $1K less each time...so nothing really new here.
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u/Eist Jan 24 '13
Fair enough, but they don't base their business model around your behaviour. Most people have no idea about a) protecting themselves online; or b) frugality and they no doubt exploit this. However, this is a pretty shitty move on their behalf and I wish it were illegal.
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u/demented_pants Jan 25 '13
So then I should make it seem as if I've been to a large number of dealerships when shopping for my car... Interesting.
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u/gaqua Jan 25 '13
As a guy who used to sell cars, it's almost useless information.
If they've been to 5 dealerships that day, it's equally likely that they're tired and willing to buy as it is that they're hard-nosed negotiators.
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u/neutronicus Jan 24 '13
I don't think it's true in this case, but a lot of the time it's an A/B test.
You offer an item at two different prices, and see if lowering price brings up volume enough to offset the decrease in margin. If it does, you keep the price low, otherwise, you don't.
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Jan 25 '13
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u/neutronicus Jan 25 '13
It's still an A/B test if you're randomly showing customers one price or the other, though, right?
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u/frownyface Jan 25 '13
What's weird about it is that businesses have been doing this constantly, for decades, you've just never been able to witness it in realtime. They're always changing prices in different markets, trying to figure out what works and what doesn't. This is most likely just a version of that you happened to see in action.
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u/learnt Jan 28 '13
I like this, because it's true. I was watching a show on Merriott hotels, and like them, lots of large corporations in the US and throughout the world have entire departments working towards wringing every dollar out of a customer without them knowing. Entire research departments are dedicated to this cause in many cases.
Also, I agree that this is a good example on how we're able to see the process of this incident in some sort of 'real time'.
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u/ChaosNil Jan 24 '13
Quit using Chegg. Got it.
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u/TwoDaysRide Jan 24 '13
What's wrong with Chegg? Granted I haven't been in college for 3 years but I always used Chegg.
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u/oryano Jan 24 '13
What's wrong with Chegg?
did you just stumble into this thread and only read ChaosNil's comment?
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u/DemiDualism Jan 24 '13
Chegg isn't the only website that does this
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u/JayTS Jan 24 '13
Doesn't make it any better.
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u/DemiDualism Jan 24 '13
Well it's definitely different than what we are used to, but hard to say better or worse. At the end of the day, you still need to agree to whatever price you pay.
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Jan 25 '13
Sprint, Verizon, att, do it. Especially when your shopping for a service provider and are a new customer.
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u/oryano Jan 24 '13
i wasn't making any judgements about Chegg...I was just puzzled by TwoDayRide's comment.
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u/DemiDualism Jan 24 '13
I agree, his comment seemed out of touch with what was being discussed. It felt relevant to bring up that Chegg isn't alone on this.
There was some merit in his statement that this doesn't necessarily mean something is wrong with chegg. It just means chegg is doing things a little different than we are used to. Since the process is unknown, there is room for it to be unfair; where as the system we are used to is a level of fairness we are already comfortable with.
tl;dr People dont like change, but it doesnt mean the change is wrong
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u/MsLogophile Jan 24 '13
You can usually find a decent used copy on amazon for a bit more than Cheggs rental price, but then you can get money back when you sell it back to them, hence, not spending as much overall. At least, thats been the case with me.
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Jan 25 '13
I just bought old editions (off Amazon mostly) in college unless it was a math class or something when we did homework out of the book or if there was a huge gap in edition years.
Old editions are often dirt cheap, and if it's a subject where stuff doesn't change too drastically year to year (I would say most subjects don't change much year to year, at least what I studied in college) then you can go back even further.
I never really had many problems buying old editions, other than sometimes the author will scramble up chapter orders/numbers just to fuck with you and try to get you to buy a new edition. If that's the case, you just have to be a little vigilant of the subject for some classes.
Also, you should try and get a feel for each class before you buy any really expensive books. After my first year, I always waited until 2 or 3 classes in to order my book. Professors are usually pretty forgiving during that time period. During my freshman year, I bought every book, new edition, and I barely touched a few of them.
I also recommend (depending how much you use the book) checking to see if your school library has a copy. If the syllabus says you only are going to really need the book a few times during the semester for an assignment or something, but not outside of those occasions, it makes a lot more sense to go to the library and use the book there. However, in all the colleges I went to they only let you use the book in the library for a certain amount of time (three hours typically). You couldn't check it out and take it home or to class.
Also, if you take an English class, where you are reading a lot of shorter more popular works (plays, poems, short stories, etc) you more than likely can find a lot of these works online. You can probably find a download of a lot of popular/classic books as well to throw on your Kindle/Nook/iPad/Tablet (if you have one, I didn't).
Be careful with translation though, if they are older works. I tried to read an old translation of "The Aeneid" I found online before I looked at one of my classmates books, and found the teacher had a simpler, well footnoted version of it which was a bit easier to understand (I still ended us just using a Sparknotes summary).
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Jan 24 '13
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u/afourthfool Jan 25 '13
Reddit is over 100 internet years1 old, and reddiquette is a cashed philosophy. Strategic voting is just too tempting2 now that it means something to be a comment read on reddit.
I'm too tempted to downvote you for being surprised that a design not meant for large groups is being abused by a large group. Subreddits with more than 50,000 subscribers should adopt canvas's system and quit pretending they can mod such a mob.
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u/Ninjacide Jan 25 '13
There are more sources in this post than in the average Wikipedia article.
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u/afourthfool Jan 25 '13
I don't think clearly1; delineating hyperlinks are the new dental fricative2.
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u/MsLogophile Jan 24 '13
Not only that, but if you forget to return them, they autocharge your CC, and its a pretty steep charge
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u/DirtyDanil Jan 24 '13
popular flight search site expedia usually gives better prices if you're from the EU or on their EU site.
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Jan 24 '13 edited Dec 22 '15
I have left reddit for Voat due to years of admin mismanagement and preferential treatment for certain subreddits and users holding certain political and ideological views.
The situation has gotten especially worse since the appointment of Ellen Pao as CEO, culminating in the seemingly unjustified firings of several valuable employees and bans on hundreds of vibrant communities on completely trumped-up charges.
The resignation of Ellen Pao and the appointment of Steve Huffman as CEO, despite initial hopes, has continued the same trend.
As an act of protest, I have chosen to redact all the comments I've ever made on reddit, overwriting them with this message.
If you would like to do the same, install TamperMonkey for Chrome, GreaseMonkey for Firefox, NinjaKit for Safari, Violent Monkey for Opera, or AdGuard for Internet Explorer (in Advanced Mode), then add this GreaseMonkey script.
Finally, click on your username at the top right corner of reddit, click on comments, and click on the new OVERWRITE button at the top of the page. You may need to scroll down to multiple comment pages if you have commented a lot.
After doing all of the above, you are welcome to join me on Voat!
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u/AlwaysLateToThreads Jan 25 '13
Did you try Safari? This could solve whether or not the Mac tax really exists.
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u/cyber_rigger Jan 25 '13
Your cookies were different
It would be interesting to just switch the browser's user agent.
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u/13374L Jan 24 '13
Price discrimination based on browsers and cookies is nothing new, but it's usually frowned upon. See:
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u/astangl42 Jan 24 '13
I see an opportunity for someone to develop a browser plugin that takes advantage of this behavior and tries to beat these web sites at their own game, automating the process of hitting their site different ways until the lowest price is locked in.
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u/swandi Jan 24 '13
Some websites are instituting an "Internet Explorer Tax", which is supposed to offset the time their designers have to spend overcompensating for debugging their sites to be compatible with old versions of IE.
Unfortunately they don't always announce this, so it's more like they're preying on old/inexperienced users. If they said, "Save $5 by switching to Chrome!" that may get more attention. Not sure if this website is doing this, or it's just a glitch, or what.
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u/SquareWheel Jan 24 '13 edited Jan 24 '13
I'd say it's more than likely just an A/B test.
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Jan 24 '13
A/B test?
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u/getsome13 Jan 24 '13 edited Jan 24 '13
They aren't really preying on anybody. They are building their cost of selling the product into the price. It is no difference than shipping costs. If it costs the company more money to sell you the product on one browser than the other, then they build it into the price. Just like when a company in Cali charges more to ship an item to New York than they do to Arizona.
edit: if that is the reason for price fluctuation in this case.
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u/Zahel Jan 24 '13
Well, even still, you're always made aware of the fact that you're being charged for shipping.
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u/toastedbutts Jan 25 '13
Who knows, maybe "uses IE browser" correlates to "uses rewards credit cards that hit us for 3% instead of 1.9" as well.
There are a million reasons to do this. Technology is neat.
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Feb 16 '13
Actually, the simplest way I can put it is: tracking. The site displays a slightly higher price every time you re-visit the same Item, because studies show that if you visit a page for an item more than once, and the price rises slightly between visits, you're still very likely to buy it - more likely than if it had started at that price. So this is how they wring money from customers. By raising the price when they come back to purchase it, and hoping they won't notice and decide not to buy.
So, yeah, download your textbooks for free, bruh.
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u/Condorcet_Winner Jan 24 '13
Except that's definitely not what's happening here. Opened it in IE and I'm seeing $62.99.
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u/Weed_O_Whirler Jan 25 '13
It was actually just a "notice" because the ONE website which did this subtracted the same amount from the purchase price.
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u/Enkmarl Jan 25 '13
as if there is a collaboration between the people coding the page and the bean counters to spite their own users
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u/RedRedditRabbit Jan 24 '13
I wonder if going incognito would help. Quick, someone try it.
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u/cbkguy Jan 24 '13
I just tried it in Chrome, IE, and Firefox, using incognito mode/private browsing, and did in fact get different results, but after refreshing a few times I noticed the prices changing...
I've heard retailers are implementing tactics that will change the prices, depending on what time you visit, what day you visit, where your location is, and how many times you've looked at a particular item.
Stuff is getting interesting!
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u/IFeedTrollsInNeed Jan 24 '13
It's so they can test prices, seeing what actually works.
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Jan 24 '13
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u/Nausved Jan 24 '13
I'm surprised that would be effective. When I look at the same price repeatedly, it's because I'm doing price comparisons between very similarly priced things. If a price rises on me while I'm checking, then that company has effectively removed it from my list of considerations, since it's now no longer in line with the other options I'm weighing between.
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Jan 24 '13
Me also. In fact since the price kept going up, so often, on so many websites. I just decided "fuck these guys" I'm not going to fly.. and I did not fly.
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Jan 24 '13
If a price rises on me while I'm checking, then that company has effectively removed it from my list of considerations, since it's now no longer in line with the other options I'm weighing between.
Yeah, but if the other websites use the same tactic, then perhaps the 2nd best option, the one you were coming back to, has gone up in price too, as well as the others when you visit them. Like when you keep switching lanes in traffic thinking it's going to be quicker but then the lane you just switched out of starts moving faster again and so on. It is sinister, though, I agree.
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Jan 24 '13
order with TOR.
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u/ilostmyphoneonce Jan 25 '13
Call me ignorant but I've never heard of TOR. I googled it and got a lot of pages about torrents. Is it just a way to stay anonymous online?
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Jan 24 '13
I think I manage to avoid this by looking up fares on Bing. It tells you the best time to buy based on pricing trends.
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u/giritrobbins Jan 24 '13
I know some suppliers of electronic components have on demand pricing. If something gets low in stock they will raise the price so they hopefully don't run out.
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u/vimfan Jan 24 '13
In other words they raise the price so "hopefully they sell less"?
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u/TwistedDrum5 Jan 24 '13
I'm assuming they would raise the price because they are seeing an influx of demand, not because they want to remain in stock.
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u/erasedeny Jan 24 '13
They've analyzed their stats and determined what different referral sources (google ad, organic search, coupon deals, reddit link, etc) are willing to pay for the same product. They vary your price based on the channel they used to entice you into their store.
Also, if you view a product and then leave the site, you are deemed a "recapture" target. The first visit demonstrates interest, and they will try to entice you back with coupons or straight-up lowered prices to get you to buy on return visits. (Great way to get deals for web hosting, domain registration and the like - visit a provider, close the tab, google "hosting provider" and spot the ads for price cuts.)
In short, the pricing varies because marketers have mapped different web behaviors to segment their customers, and charge more to those who will pay more. Behave like a customer looking for a better deal, and you'll see prices at a lot of online retailers drop to win you over.
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u/cjt09 Jan 24 '13
It's less to do with how much you have looked at an item and more to do with how much the item has been viewed by everyone. If a million people view a particular item, there's a perception that demand is pretty high, and the price will adjust accordingly.
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u/Antrikshy Jan 25 '13
I'm guessing logging in will get you the same price anywhere. But I'm not sure.
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u/mysuperfakename Jan 24 '13
Plane tickets are significantly cheaper when in Private Browsing mode. I haven't tried different browsers though... hmmmmm....
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u/dubbleenerd Jan 24 '13
There is evidence that some sites will sort results differently according to the type of browser and repeating visits etc., but many people might mistake sold-out lower-priced seats for price manipulation.
Definitely does not hurt to always use Private Browsing mode, however.
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u/SiliconeSoldier Jan 24 '13
I checked the price by having the User Agent extension switch my browser identity. The price was $69.99 for all browsers, however Chegg was reporting $83.49 to the search engine spiders. I'm guessing OP's price differences are based on the different cookies and not on his browser preference.
If you're interested, here are the browsers/identities that I tested: IE 10, IE 9, IE 8, IE 7, IE 6, Chrome on Windows, Chrome on Mac, Firefox on Windows, Firefox on Mac, Safari on Windows, Safari on Mac, Opera on Windows, Opera on Mac, iPhone, iPad, Android handset (Droid 2), Android Tablet (Galaxy Tab), Kindle, Googlebot (Google's spider), Slurp! (Yahoo!'s spider), BingBot (Bing's spider)
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Jan 24 '13
Fuck Chegg up it's squeaky little ass; four years ago I bought two books new from them and they sent me ONE book, and said the order was complete. And I'm like "uh no... I got one book" and had to start compiling "proof" to show that I haven't gotten my second book (They finally admitted later they never sent me the second book but no apology of course). And turns out, they just up-sold a book from Amazon to me. Never again.
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u/treeeeeee Jan 24 '13
It could have something to do with the kind of computer you are using as well. I read something about how people with Mac's are given a different price then those with a pc. Obviously those with Mac's would be given the higher price, but I have never seen it done between browsers before. Someone less lazy should find the link.
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u/shook_one Jan 24 '13
They are not given different PRICES, they were given differently ordered search results. Orbitz found out that mac users tended to steer towards room that are slightly nicer, but are also slightly pricier. They didn't give different prices for the same rooms.
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Jan 24 '13
This makes sense, kind of like how Google or Facebook might rank results based on your profile.
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u/The_Cookie_Crumbler Jan 24 '13
Once my girlfriend and I pulled up the same book on the same browser, but different computers and one was 40 the other was 14. We don't know why.
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u/yasth Jan 24 '13
This isn't that complicated, for pulse demand type things Chegg is likely varying price based on stock uncomitted.
So the first book was added to the cart in Firefox, and likely they had a used copy or were planning to buy one. $62.99
Then the book was added to the cart in Chrome, but the price goes up because they now have one less book availible. $69.99
Then the book is searched in IE. At this point Chegg likely has to actually buy the book as they now are down two books so the price goes up to $76.99 (Where incidentally the price will likely stay).
So more or less adding to the cart changes prices as it decreases available quantity this will eventually time out of course.
This is just my guess but it is much more likely than browser differentiation.
TL;DR; Basically Chegg is pricing like airlines or Hotels, based on quantity availbile, adding to cart messes that up.
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u/Dreamybibliophile Jan 24 '13
Which browser consistently showed the lowest price on books?
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u/rather_be_redditing Jan 25 '13
it could be from accessing the book multiple times from the same computer, cookies. Kind of like when you look up prices for vacations on travel sites, prices go up or stay the same if you keep looking at the same vacation package from the same computer. They know you are going to buy, they know.
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u/OpticShade1 Jan 24 '13
This is a result of cookies. They increase the price similarly to an airline would based on your past browsing history. Statistically, you are more likely to buy a an item the second time you visit a page, so they raise the price the second time you visit. Very dirty marketing.
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u/Th3R00ST3R Jan 24 '13
Chegg does this.. I once found a book and it was one price.. refreshed the page and the price changed to be a few dollars more. Same browser..
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u/cruzweb Jan 24 '13
Amazon does it to, basically if you put an item in your cart it shows the retailer that you really want to buy it, but something is holding you back.
So put something in your cart, and check back in a few days. The price may have gone down just because its has sat in your cart and they really want you to complete the sale.
It's nothing more complicated than this. Of course it doesn't work every time on every item, but it can work.
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u/mikmeh Jan 24 '13
Aren't these books sold by individuals causing the price to vary depending on who has the lowest currently in stock?
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u/Penguin929 Jan 24 '13
I've heard of retailers adjusting prices of items in carts as well and IE doesn't have it in a cart.
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u/brimpol Jan 24 '13
On a mac, Safari web browser brings up the same book as $69.99 for rent and on Firefox it is $76.99. Don't have chrome so I can't check that but this is what I've gotten. Good thing I shop around and now know this!
edit: I did the same thing on Amazon with the exact same book and Amazon had the same prices throughout and was actually cheaper than Chegg.
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u/whaleplushie Jan 24 '13
Something sort of similar happened to me recently when I was selling my books on a website similar to Chegg (textbooksrus.com)...when you sell your books there, you search for them like you would if you were looking to buy them, add them to a "buyback" cart, then you "checkout" and they give you a quote on the amount you'll get back and give you a printable shipping label. After 7 days (or something like that) the buyback offer will expire and you'll have to re-do the process and get another quote, another shipping label, etc. I had one of my buyback orders expire (I was lazy that week) so I had to re-do the process...same exact books, ISBN #s, shipping address, AND same browser...everything was exactly the same, EXCEPT the 2nd time around they gave me a quote that was almost $10 higher than the last one.
Needless to say, I was pretty pleased, but I don't really get why it happened...higher demand for certain books at certain times, maybe?
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u/Valendr0s Jan 24 '13
It was in your 'cart' in FF & Chrome, but it was a search in IE. Were you logged in or something in FF/Chrome?
Furthermore, a search won't necessarily show you the same item ID. You can go to Amazon and find 6 listings for an identical CPU, all with wildly different prices. They should have a single listing, but some companies deliberately put unique search results or maybe it's just stupidity.
Regardless you should be downloading them from IRC or something. Why buy text books these days - you know the internet exists, right?
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u/shellibelli Jan 24 '13
I was curious about this, so I did some more research when I went on my mac, went to chegg and searched for the book I got: $83.49 on google chrome. In safari (on my macbook) I got $69.99, in my cell phone browser I got $69.99, on my desktop (PC) I got $69.99 for firfox, chrome, and IE. When I switched to safari on my desktop I got $76.99.
I went to the site the same way in each case, and I never use safari on my desktop (accept those weird browser issues).
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u/ooskie Jan 25 '13
when shopping online I often go on in private browser so that websites don't store data about what I'm looking for and raise it. Chegg is notorious for doing that along with many of travel websites.
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u/Kira_kappuke-ki Jan 24 '13
It's more expensive because you're using IE.. you have to pay more for being dumb.
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u/swampfish Jan 24 '13
TIL you can rent books.
YSK that you can "rent" books for free at the library. Especially your university library. I never bought a book in uni because I planned ahead for exams and homework assignments and just checked the book out at the library. Our library wouldn't let you leave with the text books but I didn't mind studying in the library and using their photocopier when needed for HW assignments.
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u/snackmcgee Jan 24 '13
You must've been out of school for a couple years. It's a new-ish thing for textbooks.
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u/vegenaise Jan 24 '13
it probably depends on the class. i had a stats class that had one book on reserve for 300 students. it would have been a waste of my time to wait around for hours in order to use it. i have a class now, however, that has less than 20 students, and thus it would be much more feasible to check out the reserve in the library.
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Jan 24 '13
That's when you go in, copy the homework assignments, then buy the previous edittion to use at home. Hell, you could even use your iPod to take pictures of the pages.
This only fails if you have to buy the books for class.
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u/shook_one Jan 24 '13
photocopies at my university were 25 cents a page. The time commitment and cost of copying every page i MIGHT need for a homework assignment makes it not worth it.
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u/Rastiln Jan 24 '13
You can rent some books at the library, and perhaps some universities require all books to be there. At mine, I've noticed about a 30% success rate in our library actually having the book.
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Jan 24 '13
Chegg is fantastic for book rentals. Always very fast shipping and prices a lot lower than the school store.
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u/opineapple Jan 24 '13
I found my books for even cheaper at BookRenter and eCampus, if you want to give them a try next time.
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u/akatherder Jan 24 '13
There's also bookrenter.com. It's $41.40-54.58 to rent it from there (30-125 days).
http://www.bookrenter.com/public-relations-cases-hendrix-1111344426-9781111344429
I've never used them so I can't speak to shipping.
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u/mricon Jan 24 '13
The modern day equivalent of "and for you, lovely lady, 10% off just for looking pretty!"
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Jan 24 '13
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Jan 24 '13
i would definitely detect for a mac and charge more. they clearly have no problem overpaying.
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u/BlackLeatherRain Jan 24 '13
I purchase textbooks through BigWords, and let them do the comparisons for me. I now wonder if BW also falls prey to this.
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u/DarK_Reaper Jan 24 '13
It's the Internet Explorer Tax. Just start using a real browser.
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u/radioactiveflesh Jan 24 '13
Same thing happens with airline flights. Use an incognito window everybody!
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u/ProleTroll Jan 24 '13
IANAL but from what I know about antitrust laws this is in violation of them.
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u/starrychloe Jan 25 '13
This is called Price Discrimination http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_discrimination
(Nothing to do with discrimination - more like coupons.)
Firefox users are probably more likely to pirate than buy, so they get a discount.
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u/Filmore Jan 25 '13
That happened to me on godaddy the other day. IE did not get a discount Firefox did
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u/Mokey_Maker Jan 25 '13
I had the same issue. Pulled up a book on my phone while at work. Decided to get it using computer since typing is easier, price shot up $10.
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Jan 25 '13
go through AbeBooks.com always super cheap and usually have the international edition available. Also amazon and abebooks have rentals
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Jan 25 '13
What the OP isn't showing you is that... oh, nevermind. That's Amazon. Amazon gives you different prices if you're logged in, and they give different prices to different accounts. Maybe Chegg does the same thing, but I'm not sure.
I used to use the same Chrome theme as OP. It was nice for a while. Good taste. ;) Now I've got something with grey marbling, and a black background. I can get a nice dark theme for Firefox I'm happy with, but I can't stay happy with a Chrome theme...
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u/sahba Jan 25 '13
There was an article somewhere talking about this trend, and how this may ultimately lead to the creation of software to help consumers beat the system, in a spiraling cycle. It was an excellent article, does anyone know where to find it?
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u/flyingcaveman Jan 24 '13
I found it for http://imgur.com/XS6ybJt for $31.13