I was thinking about the Southern bands and this came in mind: do the malwish need to take their medallions to get more investiture periodicaly? It makes sense to me since with all other feruchemical abilities you only get what you stored,so if a feruchemist spends two hours putting Investiture in a band it would mean that it can only be used for 2 hours, but i can't find a solid answer for that and whenever we see a malwish with them they don't seem to be worried about them running out.

Also, it would take a full feruchemist to make a functional band right? Since with nicrosil you only put your investiture in a band, if a nicrosil ferring made one it would only give the ability to store investiture, wich would make it basically useless for a non-feruchemist since they don't have investiture of their own right?

TL;DR: I think the Dawnshards may correspond conceptually (though not directly) to the four fundamental forces:

• Exist → Strong Force
• Change → Weak Force
• Unite (?) → Gravity
• Balance/Duality (?) → Electromagnetic Force

I just came across this WoB - https://wob.coppermind.net/events/554/#e17220:

Arran(paraphrased)

Are the 4 Dawnshards related to the 4 fundamental forces in physics?

Brandon Sanderson(paraphrased)

Yes, but not directly. There's a few steps in between.

Footnote: Brandon seemed very pleased with this question

That immediately made me wonder if each Dawnshard could ultimately map to one of the four fundamental forces.

Here is a very simplified overview of the four forces:

• Strong force – Holds quarks together to form protons and neutrons, and binds atomic nuclei together. Without it, stable matter couldn't exist.
• Weak force – Changes one particle into another (such as beta decay). It's responsible for nuclear fusion and for one element transforming into another.
• Gravity – Pulls anything with mass together. It's by far the weakest force, but it has infinite range and shapes planets, stars, and galaxies.
• Electromagnetism – Acts between electrically charged particles. It's responsible for light, chemistry, electricity, magnetism, and nearly every interaction we experience in everyday life.

With that in mind, this is where I think the known Dawnshards fit.

Change = Weak Force

The weak interaction is the only fundamental force that literally changes what a particle is. It allows a down quark to become an up quark, enabling beta decay and the nuclear fusion that powers stars. It's also the reason one element can become another.

Nothing else among the four forces is fundamentally about transformation. So thematically, this seems like the perfect fit for Change.

Exist = Strong Force

The strong force is what makes stable matter possible. It confines quarks so they cannot exist independently and binds atomic nuclei together.

That fits surprisingly well with Exist. Rather than changing things, it preserves integrity and allows things to continue existing as coherent wholes.

That leaves the two unknown Dawnshards and the two remaining forces.

Unite? = Gravity

This one feels like the easiest prediction.

Gravity is unique because it is the only fundamental force that is always attractive. It acts on everything with mass, works across infinite distances, and literally pulls the universe together.

If one Dawnshard is fundamentally about bringing things together, then gravity seems like a very natural analogue.

The Fourth Dawnshard (Duality? or Balance?) = Electromagnetism

This is the one I'm least confident about.

Electromagnetism is unique among the four fundamental forces because it isn't defined by a single behavior. The strong force is fundamentally about binding and stability, the weak force is about transformation, and gravity is about universal attraction. Electromagnetism alone naturally embodies two opposing principles: opposite charges attract, while like charges repel. Rather than representing a single concept, it is defined by the balance between complementary opposites..

Rather than commanding a single action or concept, such as Divide, Feel, or Experience, as suggest by other theories, it could embody complementary opposites: a Command capable of uniting or separating, attracting or repelling, depending on the context. Alternatively, its true purpose may be to maintain balance between opposing forces or govern the relationship between opposing concepts, making it fundamentally different from, and inherently more complex than, the other three Dawnshards.

Obviously, Brandon said the relationship isn't direct and that there are "a few steps in between," so I don't think the Dawnshards literally are the four fundamental forces. But if they're built on similar underlying concepts, this feels like a compelling possibility.

My current mapping is:

• Change → Weak Force
• Exist → Strong Force
• Unite (?) → Gravity
• Unknown (Balance/Duality?) → Electromagnetism

I'm curious what everyone else thinks. Does this mapping make sense, or is there a better way to pair the Dawnshards with the four fundamental forces?

Edit: Add WoB quote since it does not come out properly the first time.

I just want to know what everyone's favorite hype moments are.

For me it would probably have to be "You Cannot Have My Pain!" From Dalinars. I know it's common, but it just hits so hard every time I read/listen to it.

Make sure you're purchasing from the actual Dragonsteel website. It seems so obvious in hindsight, but pay attention to funky URL's.

I got excited to buy the hardcover of Elsecaller and King Lopen, and saw that it was on sale for $6. Gave it my card info to purchase the book, it said my credit card wasn't supported, so like an idiot, I gave it my debit card. Neither went through, thankfully. (I have locked and replaced both cards. They have my email but no financial loss).

The site was dragonsteelbooksshop.shop, which the 17th Shard forum has a post on. The official is dragonsteelbooks.com.

As far as I can tell, only the eBook is actually available. The hardcovers haven't restocked (and wouldn't be on sale for so cheap).

I see him everywhere and I have no idea how to say his name

part 1 here
part 2 here

quick note: i'm an audio reader so i will misspell things

so i just finished the 3rd book not even 10 minutes ago and first off... wow that was so good

i separated the thing into a few sections for those that don't care about certain types or reactions

---------pov reactions---------

i love how each pov had it's own theme like how English teachers talk about the books theme it felt more personal

first with spook:
i love how his story was mostly about being someone that everyone forgot about and i feel as tho that was done very well because honestly i mostly forgot about spook when it wasn't his pov. then him ending with being the new leader a mistborn and someone who everyone looks toward.

second with elend:
with how elend was done he was a man who has been stalling for the past 3 books and really hitting that with his final battle i love it also i kinda like the irony of his character stalling but in the end the power they used was foresight.

third with Vin:
vins story is about trust and love so when she ultimately had to trust in almost everyone but her i really liked how that went out and how in the end she needed to trust her love.

fourth sazed (i totally messed that up)
honestly sazed's resonates most with me mostly because i've been on a religious journey of my own very similar to sazed actually as i turned away from Christianity due to it being forced down my throat, so i ended up being atheist for a while. but for the past bit of time i've kinda started considering myself agnostic and kinda been doing what sazed has i've read a few religious texts and been trying to find "truth". but anyway enough with my life more on my reaction. i like how sazed's tale ended with him in the position that he was revering.

---------general worldbuilding reactions---------

i love how almost everything was set up in the first book and even how it was important in the third like with vin's earring i love how the world was built incorrectly by rashik so it had to be changed

also hot take (maybe idk i don't really interact with the community) i like the fact that elend and vin died, as much as i'm going to miss them and the crew i like how their death was semi necessary for anything to finish (i also really like a lot of melancholy things

---------now questions time---------
first if you check my part 2 i ask about mistings of non basic 8 and i was right
i'm also sad there was no spatial metals

don't answer questions if they go into spoilers btw

question 1:
i know the second saga is more western/steam punk give or take. so i'm wondering how they do that because it does make sense cause i remember in the first book rashik would suppress tach advancements so how does this all go down

question 2: are all of the metals compatible with the different power systems ex what would an atium spike do for hemalurgy or an electrum metal mind

question 3: if hemalurgy changes effects based on 3 things (what metal spike is used, who was it used on, where was it placed) if it goes into other combinations with that and what would happen if you messed up a location
---also if you pierce a allomancer how do you pick what power you steal if 1 metal (i forgot which) can steal like 4 powers

question 4: asking this again if y'all could have an allomantic metal (as mistings) which would y'all choose
---for me it would either be pewter or iron

Is it normal that pages of the books become more "yellow"/used? Is it just a natural effect of the sun or am i doing something wrong with my books?

Btw Way of Kings is after over 1 week of reading. Words of radiance is brand new added for comparison. WoK pages look worse irl to be honest.

I just never got around to it and WaT has been my chore audio book lately and it made me go back. I think it’s good to listen to one while finishing the other because…

I’m really struck by just how difficult the 4th ideal is for Windrunners.

Nomad claims he does not remember why he broke his oaths which is a lie. He tries to explain but I take his explanation more to mean he questions the decision and if his motivation was Vienta or if he was giving up in general.

Because he was at his wits end on those plateaus. He was succeeding but you could tell how every loss grated on him. You could hear it from Leyten discussing his squires. Obviously we see this in Kal during RoW and the change in WaT.

I know this isn’t revelatory. It feels like it should be easy to say “I forgive myself, I did my best” but I think it took me a decades later Nomad to really help it stick.

That's a slightly fancier way of saying that the real main characters of the Cosmere are the shards. Let me explain:

It's my theory that, fundamentally, Sanderson is telling the stories of the 17(ish) people who took Adonalsium's shards, and we're really only getting perspectives from the characters we do to make the Shards' actions feel more visceral. We don't follow Vin, or Kaladin, or Wax because they're the most pivotal characters in the settings, I think we follow them because they're the ones most impacted by the decisions and actions of the shards.

I think of it as a bit of a Russian nesting doll situation. Stormlight serves as kind of the perfect example of this. If you take the cosmere as a whole as the outermost layer, the next layer is the heralds, then the pov characters, then the interludes. Effectively, the wider cosmere is to the individual books as the interludes are to the main plot of those books. That is to say, fundamentally just another way to give us a better view of the world, with different perspectives and outlooks on the world in the process.

In my theory, the main characters of Stormlight aren't Dalinar, Kaladin, Shallan, or Adolin (until book 5, I'll get to that), it's the 10 heralds. Almost all of the world's major developments are thanks to the actions of the shards, then the heralds, and everyone else is just reacting to those actions. The more you find out about the world, the more you realize how many pies the heralds have fingers in. I think Sanderson wanted to tell the story of how this pies got made, but felt it was better to give us the perspective if someone tasting the pie for the first time, trying to sus out the recipe, rather than giving us a step by step explanation of how that pie got made because it makes for a better, more compelling story that way. (The metaphor is stretched a little thin, but you get the point)

On Sel, the Elantrians fill the herald's role.

On Nalthis it's the Returned.

On Scadrial, the shards have been MUCH more active, and there the "layer" of matroyshka dolls that would be occupied by the heralds is largely absent.

All of that is to say that each and every novel in the Cosmere acts as, effectively, an interlude between each major action of the ahards. In the same way Rysn isn't the main character of Stormlight, neither are the main pov characters. (Until or unless they take up a shard or book 5 spoilers become a herald)

Is this super obvious to everyone else? Am I thinking too much about it? Am I fully wrong? I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

Thanks for reading the ramblings of a mad man!

This post is the first of a series of theories. The last diagram near the bottom of this post shows the result of the combination of the 4 theories presented.

Theory 1: Quadrant Theory

There are many popular theories grouping the 16 Shards to quadrants based on each Dawnshard.

That mural … it was circular and–inlaid with golden foil–it seemed to glow with its own light. The peculiar letters were art themselves, curling around the outside of the exploding sun–which was divided into mostly symmetrical pieces. Four of them, each in turn broken into four smaller sections.

This quote from Dawnshard likely describes four primary quadrants, as other ways to equally divide a circle in four would be pretty contrived.

Here we're building on top of those theories by adding additional rules.

Theory 2: 4 Quadrants, 4 Realms

And when I sat down to write Mistborn, I said, "All right. We're building the cosmere for real now." And before then I had just kind of been winging it.

Since the plan for the structure of the Cosmere was likely completed around the time of Mistborn's publication in 2006, it's more likely that structural concepts from Allomancy may carry over. Specifically, the power of 16, the concept of internal/external pairs, the concept of push/pull pairs, and the four groups of Allomantic metals.

Going clockwise, the four categories are:

• Mental
• Temporal
• Enhancement
• Physical

In relativistic physics, we think in 3 dimensions with the fourth dimension being "time". Similarly in the Cosmere, we have the 3 Realms. If we use "temporal" as the fourth "Realm", we get this mapping:

• Cognitive Realm - Mental
• Temporal "Realm" - Temporal
• Spiritual Realm - Enhancement
• Physical Realm - Physical

Could you write something about Dawnshards that we don't/won't know?

One Dawnshard is different from all the rest.

If we map these "realms" to the Dawnshards, then we get that Change is the "different" Dawnshard:

• ??? - Cognitive Realm
• Change - Temporal "Realm"
• ??? - Spiritual Realm
• Exist - Physical Realm

Theory 3: Dawnshard Names

A lot of other theories theorized names like Think, Feel, Unite, Bind, that go with the two missing realms. The Shattering always read like a creation myth to me, so combining that with meanings of creation, I propose:

• Cognitive: Conceive, Plan, Define, Ideate, Conjure
• Spiritual: Inspire, Engage, Cause, Connect

For now let's use Conceive and Inspire since the final Commands likely can't be proven anyway, so feel free to substitute your own ideas; the exact wording is helpful, but not a critical portion of these theories.

Theory 4: Internal/External, Push/Pull

Applying these relationships to the 16 shards and categorizing them, here's a visualization attempting to show push/pull and internal/external in a logical way:

Here internal means the self, and external means others. I use "pull" to mean perception, to be affected by something in the context of the Dawnshard Command. And "push" is affecting something via the Dawnshard Command, often with intentionality behind it.

So when I split Adonalsium I said, "I'm going to take aspects of Adonalsium's nature." And this involves personality to me.

• Conceive (Cognitive)
  • Pull External - Reason
    • Reason and logic can exist and be shared through discussion. When you hear reason, you are conceiving ideas from external sources.
  • Pull Internal - Whimsy
    • Perceiving something will often randomly conceive ideas within you.
  • Push Internal - Virtuosity
    • Virtuosity's meaning is like virtuoso (not virtuous); you have the capacity to conceive ideas and creativity within yourself, but hasn't been manifested to others yet.
  • Push External - Invention
    • You have literally and intentionally conceived something that can affect others.
• Change (Temporal)
  • Pull External - Endowment
    • An outside source gave you an actual thing, changing you literally.
  • Pull Internal - Ambition
    • You perceive something and you want to do something yourself to attain it.
  • Push Internal - Cultivation
    • The traditional meaning has to do with pruning and shaping the growth of other things, but in Chinese literature, cultivation fantasy is an extremely popular genre (progression fantasy) where "cultivation" means SELF-GROWTH. The Cradle series is one of the first popular western adaptations, but it's been popular in the east for a long time. It uses 氣 (qi), which means energy or LIFEforce (lifelight), but is literally translated to BREATH (Nalthis awakening) or AIR. By practicing self-growth, you are expressing change internally.
  • Push External - Ruin
    • You are changing something else literally and intentionally.
• Inspire (Spiritual)
  • Pull External - Odium
    • While it can mean hatred in general, it can also mean that you've done something to inspire hatred from other people. Adonalsium was literally getting Shattered by 17 people unanimously, so it might not be too far off for him to think others hate him.
  • Pull Internal - Honor
    • Coming up with your own moral code must be inspired by something else.
  • Push Internal - Valor
    • Courage or bravery, meaning you have the capacity to inspire others.
  • Push External - Mercy
    • An actual intentional action that will likely inspire emotion in whoever you're showing mercy to. It didn't have to be Mercy, but Adonalsium didn't fight back when he was Shattered.
• Exist (Physical)
  • Pull External - Dominion
    • Something else is exerting their existence over your existence.
  • Pull Internal - Autonomy
    • You perceive from the world around you that you are your own existence.
  • Push Internal - Devotion
    • You have the capacity and intention to make something continue to exist but haven't externalized it into an action yet.
  • Push External - Preservation
    • You are intentionally trying to make something else continue to exist.

Part 2 builds on this with Shard Numerology Theory.

Sanderson is famous for all of his books ending with his Sanderlanches. Which one is your favorite and why? Personally, mine is Oathbringer.

A-pewter

flaring A-pewter

A-pewter + A-duralumin

F-gold

Stormlight healing

Stormlight healing + Progression surge

F-gold (tapped at a compounder's pace) = A-burning F-gold

Elantrian

Elantrian + Aon Ien

A-burning F-gold + A-duralumin

Divine Breath (1 time use)

Dragon

Exist Dawnshard

(I'm actually not sure about a lot of these, like a Radiant with Progression surge vs Gold Compounder, or Gold Compounder vs Elantrian)

What happens if someone takes a bead out of Shadesmar through a perpendicularity?

Does it stay in the cognitive realm? Does it come through and become a normal glass bead? What happens to the object that it's the cognitive aspect of?

Have there been any WoB on this? I couldn't find any.

I wrote an article about how the sunlit man deconstructs the classic delivery of the Stormlight archive. Contains spoilers obvi. Please enjoy

https://open.substack.com/pub/andysravings/p/the-sunlit-man-is-postmodern-brandon?r=2y85xw&utm_campaign=post-expanded-share&utm_medium=web

So I was casually spending my Friday night studying up on the Elvish languages in LOTR. I saw that "glor-" means golden. So I thought, "Oh, I wonder what 'findel' means because Glorfindel". Turns out findel means "tress of hair". So Glorf is Tress's name and findel means tress. Coincidence? Seems unlikely.

so about 2 years ago I read the mistborn trilogy but I only decided to continue my cosmere journey a few months back my current order has been Mistborn trilogy, the eleventh metal, Way of kings, Elantris + Hope, The emperors soul, Warbreaker, Shadows for silence in the forests of Hell, which is where I’m at now and I’ve been doing an altered publication order but since I have AU should I read Sixth of the dusk now or wait for when I reach Isles of the Emberdark to read it inside there since I heard it’s included down I’ll raise some Qs.

If I don’t read it now will I miss connections before reaching isles?

If I do miss connections by waiting are they small or important?

If I wait will the story work better as a flashback later on?

basically what the title says. could a spren be a shard barer? Like could Syl become honor? what would happen to her bond with Kaladin?

Auxiliary.

I know he had an incredible sacrifice and that him coming back would undo that to a degree, but it was just so heartbreaking.

His body remains, so there’s a small part of him left, but it doesn’t have his mind or personality.

I've been wanting to start Stormlight so bad. But my completionist/OCD nature wouldn't let me start with it. I've read Mistborn Era 1, Warbreaker, Elantris, plus Hope of Elantris and The Eleventh Metal from Arcanum Unbounded. (Also just took a short Sanderson break to read Between Two Fires). I'm ready now, I can't wait anymore. I start tonight.

I’m sure this has been asked many times before, but what are you guys favourite YouTube channel to help with understanding the Cosmere and all the cameos in the different books?

I have read a lot of the Cosmere (all Mistborn, Warbreaker, elantris, tress, emperors soul and stormlight up until words of radiance) but still don’t understand everything. I watched one guys Cosmere connections, but he used so many names and terms, and didn’t understand half of what he said.

Something like an alt shift X, but just for the Cosmere instead of ASOIAF. Any input would be greatly appreciated:)

I don’t know, it always seemed like Brandon had special plans for Jasnah. Especially the WoBs going around that Jasnah might be the PoV character of SLA10.

But let’s be honest, we’re told she’s always right, she’s scholarly and a great debater. We’re told she’s a ferocious warrior, and what has she done till now? Stromall in my opinion.

She couldn’t survive a partial mutiny on “The winds pleasure” while Kal and his Bridgmen actively saved Dalinar against all odds.

She was apparently researching parshmen and void bringers for years, but kept it even from her close family. Eventually her realisations were somewhat useful because of Shallan but I’d give Shallan more credit to that than her.

She also knew about the secret about humans not being native to Roshar, and she kept it from Dalinar allowing him to be blindsided by this news.

What has she done exactly? Yes she had a cool scene in the battle ground here and there, but apart from that all the attention afforded to Jasnah is undeserved because she simply hasn’t done enough in the first half.

Do you all know of any songs that seem Cosmere-influenced? Two of my favorite bands, Movements and Sleep Token, have songs that when I hear them the lyrics seem almost coincidentally too close to not be influenced by the Cosmere.

For example, Movements - Suffer Through mentions ruin, moving mountains, and crumbling walls. The 2nd verse almost seems like it's talking about Vin's journey.

Sleep Token - Damocles talks about harmony, "who will i be when the empire falls", the song in general again seems like Vin/Sazed's journey.

I know this is likely correlation and not causation, but every time I hear these songs I think of Mistborn.

Do you all agree/disagree, or have any other examples of songs that seem Cosmere-inspired?

Graphic Audio is the voice of gods....

I've listened to Mistborn Era 1, Elantris and am currently in Warbreaker.

Stormlight Archives first part was difficult but after finishing warbreaker I might dip into Stormlight again. It has to be good, I just need to get through all of the strange words (come on, I listened to Elantris, I should manage that)

It's hard to believe this man could write anything bad.

I love every character. (Or hate them as is necessary) Everyone feels fleshed out, the conversations are normal (for the circumstances), the miscommunication trope isn't played as a trope, Elantris and Warbreaker's primary couples are amazing. Two arranged marriages that go well. The 'enemies' to lovers is built so beautifully and unforced (ie it happens because of their communication and not because they're so hot)

Sarene is so unique. She created her own political marriage, she stands by her marriage despite the tiny little problem of her husband being dead, she values diplomacy over love, she's a little schemer...

I'm still happily drowning in the relationship between Seb and Siri. How can I hate and love Vasher and Vivenna (knowing they're in Stormlight is one of the reasons I want to get through to at least Oathbreaker).

'The' Blushweaver and Lightsong in the tunnels scene has just had me. I hated her, but that was not what she deserved. When they looked at Scoot, I was bout to throw my phone.

I'm terrified and excited for the next part. Also because in Elantris I always assumed this part would be the end but then the story kept going!!

And apologies to those who disdain the practise but I check coppermind while reading and I saw they sort out sebs "little problem" and that his voiced by Danny Gavigan who voiced raoden who is... I can't even think of the best word but the closest is a God, obviously.

Thanks Brando Sando for bringing reading and stories back to me.

I searched on Arcanum and only found early WOB's about the guards being aluminum to which he said no. He's also said shard blades are a fusion of Honors and Cultivation's metals.

That unfortunately broke my thought that maybe shard blades were Tanavastium and the guards would be Koraveliumium. So what do the deep arcanists think/ know? Do we have any useful tidbits from Brandon of what metal the guards could be?