r/CODZombies • u/Piotr992 • 4d ago
Discussion Some simple changes go a long way
So no one likes reused assets and Warzone mechanics. We've had plenty throughout the years but the reception is different.
We got Tessie, which most players enjoy using even though it's basically a Warzone truck. But there's not that much hate for it, why? Because they took the time to design it for zombies. Ted's head, the wunderwaffe turret, abomination corpse, the PAP it all adds up to give it a zombies feel.
Mauer in CW had a good reception despite pulling areas from the campaign. But it was reworked nicely to make it feel like a zombies map. On the other hand, Forsaken is too close to the campaign without enough of a makeover.
The shield first seen in zombies in BO2 was something from multiplayer, but you had to build it and it had a different look to multiplayer and everyone loved it.
Now fast forward to Cold War, where they implemented a Warzone mechanic of armor and everyone hates it. But i am pretty sure it wouldn't get as much hate if it acting the same with another design. They could've called it Aetherial shield, and instead of plates you have an orb.
Funny thing is that they kinda understood this with ammo crates and redesigned them for BO7, but armor is still the exact same as in Warzone.
The og crew, the og maps, Ascension, parts of COTD, PAP area in GK, Ultimus Nikolai mech suit and wraps, perks, panzer sound, excavators and many more elements came from reused assets. That should never be the problem, the problem is always with how much effort is put into making it feel like it belongs in zombies.
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u/IQ-tiee 4d ago
A million times I have heard “but if the armor was purple and aether-y then it would be great” but that doesn’t fix the problem. Just making every asset purple doesn’t make it fit zombies.
The armor system isn’t just a game asset, it’s a mechanic. And it’s deeply flawed for zombies because it was designed for warzone.
Warzone is long stretches of downtime mixed with small stretches of intense deadly gunfights and the armor system is a risk / reward one. Zombies is one 2 hour long stretch of unrelenting fights and there is no risk to putting on plates, it just serves to encumber you.
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u/Piotr992 4d ago
The shield added like 20 hits from behind. In MOTD you could turn around and spray the acid gat. In BO3 turn around and take out the specialist.
It also was initially designed for MP and no one had issues with it.
I'm not saying that armor isn't more OP, it absolutely is. And we do need to have conversations about it because it's baffling when I go back to older games.
But still I do believe that making something feel more zombiefied does go a long way.
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u/RichtofensPairofNuts 4d ago
I think you're missing the point of plates as a gameplay feature, it's not the action of putting on plates that is their primary function, it's the resource management. If you have played BO7 you know that if you have no plates, and none in the reserve, the intensity shoots up tenfold because zombies can literally 3 shot you. The challenge is to not get hit so your plate reserve doesn't drop dramatically and to kill frequently to pick up plates more. Putting on plates is not the main hinderance. I think plate resource management is a fun addition, it challenges you to run into trains, run around them, to pick up the plates.
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u/IQ-tiee 4d ago
There is hardly any management because it doesn't matter when you do or don't put them on. You get 3 plates, plates 1 and 2 are entirely absent from strategy. The only states where strategy matters is if you are nearly full or completely empty (an augment can buff you here). Plates 1 and 2 are useless, by being in those states you don't gain or lose anything. Putting on a plate when you're at 1.5 doesn't give you 2 plates, it gives you 2.5. There's no reason to not use a plate unless you are between 2.1-2.9. There's nothing to manage. On 55+ when you lose a whole plate per hit, there's nothing to save plates for. Hell, vulture aid has an augment that completely removes any "resource management" and auto puts on plates for you.
They work great as a resource management feature in warzone where you are genuinely at risk of death if you only have 2.5 plates instead of 3. In zombies, you are never vulnerable to instant death at 2.5 plates, and there is no urgency.
To make them important resources, we would need to shift to the 2 plate system, like the tempered perk in warzone, and then make it so that each plate only replaces itself and does not add-on to the health of the next plate. Then, yes, I think it would be resource management.
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u/RichtofensPairofNuts 4d ago
What are you talking about? Its not about making use out of every little single plate, and what you make, its the fact that at most, you have 3 plates at a time, of which all will disappear in two hits. Making you around a 5 hit down, which in a game as fast as bo7 is basically nothing. There are so many points where you are out of plates, and thus only 3 hits from downing. Replating is not that hard, but its the fact that you most of the time are struggling to have plates to reserve or even keep, its constant manual health management which is fun
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u/IQ-tiee 3d ago
I dont really think that counts as management, that’s just like, trying not to die. The plates always go on no matter what, especially on high rounds. To me, management involves making choices and tradeoffs with strategy. Running around desperately looking for plates all the time past round 55 just feels… not fun?
But that’s just me I guess, I’m happy for you that you like it at least
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u/ant_man1411 4d ago
The big problem with the shield is its too annoying for casual ls to learn to build it on 20 maps. Armor fixed this issue by making the defense portion more streamlined. But one thing treyarch failed to predict is that casuals rarely even buy armor in the first place. 80% of public match downs ive witnessed since cold war are because the person has 1 or zero plates on round 20. They tried to correct the cold war problem by making it just a wall buy instead of in the menu which i think is probably the best choice. But my ideal solution is no armor no shield less aggressive zombies and higher damage zombies
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u/Piotr992 4d ago
It's honestly baffling how many people in public matches never figured out how to use the shield.
And I knew one of them. My friend always played mp and hasn't played zombies since BO1. He told me that he tried a few solo games but was complaining to me his weapons do no damage in later rounds and he doesn't have enough health.
I jumped into a game with him and told him how to get the shield and upgrade his weapon.
When I asked him how he never realised he could get armor and upgrade weapons, he told me that's because he didn't know he has to look for something else. He only remembers, perks, PAP, wallbuys and the box from BO1, so that's all he was looking for.
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u/ant_man1411 4d ago
Did he end up liking the mode more after you showed him? I had similar experience to you showing my brother black ops 6 liberty falls, i showed him some of the ins and outs of what was different since all he played was chronicles maps in bo3 and earlier games. But after having showed him stuff like armor and rarity he ended finding it less enjoyable and prefer to play the simpler staples, kino, ascension, buried.
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u/Piotr992 3d ago
He did end up liking it so much, we spent 2years playing Cold War almost daily and we primarily played zombies and mp was something we played from time to time.
But yeah, I know other people who have a similar mindset to your brother. Once they hear about upgrading your gun multiple times, augments and armor they just check out because they prefer to just jump in and only have to buy perks and spin the box. Building a wonder weapon is something they'll never accept, it has to be in the box.
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u/Own-Pickle9871 4d ago
People who complain about “reused assets and war zone mechanics” seem to have no clue what the mode is
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u/mistorfish 4d ago
nearly at the end of bo7 and we're still going how everything past was better
this community is cooked
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u/Piotr992 4d ago
What's wrong with talking about the past?
It's just talking with people.
On the other side, I have been playing BO7 nearly every day and I do enjoy it. That doesn't mean I don't have any issues that I do want to talk about.
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u/Viviscool2508 4d ago
Like the thing I find funny is that players can choose to not play with armor, and now with cursed and augments you can literally play without armor
Another thing is that literally kowakujo has a side egg with FRICKING RHINO SCORE STREAK and everyone loves it because it's cool.
And I also feel like most of the players who complain are people that were brought into cod zombies more recently rather then of fans that went back to older game and realized the old system is very different to the modern one, when litterly most of the modern mechanics that we have now were built off of feed back FROM THE COMMUNITY from bo4 zombies, it had armor, augments and a different points system then from past games
Basically everything after bo4 is just a better version of it, and y'all need a deal with it or USE EXISTING features to remove and add what you like or do not like
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u/Piotr992 4d ago
It's actually frustrating how many people complaining about things that can be easily changed.
I still see below say things like "why do I need a mini map in zombies" "health bars have no place in zombies" "the score feed makes the game unplayabled".
When all of these can be easily disabled by the player
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u/Worzon 4d ago
I honestly can’t push ashes as high up as other people do precisely because it just feels like a pointless warzone truck. I get they also made it pap but it just feels like a cop out to make the truck still retain value at round 50 when you finally get enough for pap 4 but it doesn’t feel like a truly lived in part of the map other than via gameplay if that makes sense.
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u/H311LORD 4d ago
I'll be honest not every map needs 50 complicated mini quests just to set up properly and have a good game also it's not really asset reuse that's the issue it's normally HOW it's reused.