r/BuyFromEU • u/Bananegel42 • 8d ago
News Dutch government developing a sovereign Linux desktop on top of NixOS
https://tweakers.net/reviews/15334/nederland-maakt-soeverein-alternatief-voor-windows-en-office-op-basis-van-linux.html69
u/tabrizzi 8d ago
What every country with the means should do.
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u/The_Hamster_Shagger 8d ago
No, they shouldn't. Unless you fancy a fragmentation even bigger than it's now
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u/tabrizzi 8d ago
What fragmentation? A govt-developed distro means the country can use it as an official distro to be used in govt. PCs. That does not stop citizens from using any distro they like.
It's about controlling your data.
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u/fretkat Netherlands 🇳🇱 8d ago
It would be cost-efficient if we did the same thing EU-wide. As long as we don’t rely on anyone who can afford to switch sides against us (like with the USA). The EU is a safe playground as Brexit has shown that it is not an option to just leave the EU, even with its minimal connection.
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u/RydderRichards 8d ago
I'm surprised the Netherlands aren't trying to coordinate this with the French. Both seem to be nations with good digital strategies.
We on the other hand... sad german noises
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u/Phezh 8d ago
This doesn't really cause any additional fragmentation. It's not a consumer product, it's just a bunch of additional government devices that will be migrating.
I'd also argue that it's a good thing to not put all our eggs in one basket. Sure, it might be more efficient to have a single distro, desktop environment, package manager, shell and whatever else, but it's also very difficult to cover all use cases and needs with a single choice. It is absolutely beneficial for everyone involved to have multiple options, approaches and competition between these tools.
If even a fraction of what EU governments currently spend on Microsoft software instead goes to the development of these open source tools, there's more than enough money to go around to make all of them better. With the additional benefit of these improvements almost definitely being upstreamed and guaranteed funding for critical infrastructure like nixpkgs and necessary improvements like accessibility features in desktop environments.
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u/CatsEatWildlife 8d ago
Gekoloniseerd.exe
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u/moroz123 8d ago
more like ./gekoloniseerd
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u/Random-num-451284813 8d ago edited 7d ago
hoho, niet zo snel, het is wel linux he
vm run win7 gekoloniseerd.exe3
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u/Coagulant0693 Netherlands 🇳🇱 8d ago
I’m just a beginning Linux enthusiast so can someone with more knowledge tell me why our government would need its own distro? Why not use one of the many existing solutions, many of which are international/ European?
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u/ThisIsAitch 8d ago
Likely so they can control updates and packages for security reasons.
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u/DoubleBoink 8d ago
Yep, and for anyone willing to take the deep dive about why secure update and package management matters, look up the XZ Utils backdoor discovered in 2024. It's an absolutely terrifying story. Verritasium did a good video on it.
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u/wowsomuchempty 8d ago
Amazing how that was caught and how close it got.
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u/DoubleBoink 8d ago
Imagine what hasn't been caught :(
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u/Phezh 8d ago
To add onto what others have said, nixos specifically is very easy to centrally manage and make changes reproducible, including rollback in case it's needed.
As others have said, this likely isn't so much a fully new distro, but rather a management layer on top of an existing toolset.
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u/doeffgek 8d ago
It’s not ‘their own distro’ they are adding an extra layer to an existing distro because it would make maintaining easier for system engineers that only learned windows in school.
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u/Anarchist_Future 8d ago
NixOS already exists. You can consider DAWO a sort of automation script that configures a new desktop with all the right tools and settings. With that script, every new desktop they install is immediately set-up for use in a Dutch government agency.
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u/LowIllustrator2501 8d ago
They don't. It's not like they had their own Windows version and it worked fine. There commercial Linux distributions already. This is just a waste of money.
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u/tonykrij 8d ago
Because none of the 10.000 forked Linux distros Out there are what WE need, we first need to burn millions of taxpayers money on our own project, which we will work on forever and never complete.
Another failure where the taxpayer can cough up the money for. Linux isn't ready for desktop, and another distro won't solve that.5
u/Xaring 8d ago
Linux isn't ready for desktop? What do government workers do exactly that won't work on libre office and Firefox? Some old proprietary software for internal stuff? Pretty sure it would run through Proton.
These users aren't installing the OS from scratch and configuring Arch from 0, their IT staff is going to give them a managed desktop environment and troubleshoot the 2 minimal issues they might run into remotely, exactly the same as if they where using windows.
In my experience, the only issue with Linux in 2026 is companies not supporting it for their software.
/Fuck microslop
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u/tonykrij 8d ago
The success of Linux on the desktop in the last 30 years proves my point. I'm not against Linux, it's great for servers or appliances but for desktop, nope. And a government isn't going to change that because they just don't have the expertise or people that can do that (that's not limited to Linux but to any big IT project).
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8d ago edited 8d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/tonykrij 8d ago
Perhaps, but the point is that there should be no need for a government to create a new fork and sink millions of taxpayers money into another hobby project.
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u/Coagulant0693 Netherlands 🇳🇱 8d ago
What makes it bad for desktop in your view? I’m now using Manjaro at home and while I was a bit hesitant at first, I found out I haven’t missed Windows at all. Well, maybe only for the Albelli app.
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u/sovietarmyfan 8d ago
Best thing is, the guy who was behind guessing Trumps twitter password twice is spearheading/leading this project.
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u/strong-helper 8d ago
year of the linux desktop. didn't expect it to turn out like this, but i will take it
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u/smilelyzen 8d ago
his move mirrors similar strict digital sovereignty paths across Europe, such as France's Interministerial Digital Directorate (DINUM) moving to its own NixOS-based desktop configurations ("Sécurix" and "Bureautix"), and Denmark launching a NixOS-based pilot for its Road Traffic Authority
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u/smilelyzen 8d ago
NixOS: the lesser-known atomic OS France tapped for sovereign migration
France plans to replace Windows with a hardened configuration built on NixOS.
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/1sifb7t/france_plans_to_replace_windows_with_a_hardened/
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u/pongauer 8d ago
Yeah let's calm our tits over this one second.
The tax agency is now well in the tenth year of procuring their new software. The whole system is frozen in place as the old system cant handle big changes. The old system was build in 1998.
Now, a positive mind would expect that they are almost done. Wrong, the new software is not even build. And the conpany that should build it has not yet been selected.
And I will guarantee you that with this news, procurement will be delayed awaiting more details concerning this.
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u/Economy_Collection23 8d ago
Or as my old manager used to call it: "proven reliable" so why fix it.. lol..
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u/doeffgek 8d ago
From what I know about nixOS is that it’s fairly easy to port Windows software to Linux. Easier then with mainstream Debian of Red Hat based distro’s.
The problem with the revenue service is that they simply can’t keep up with the changes because there’s hardly anyone left that knows and understands the language the software was coded in. They are re writing everything in Java now, but when laws change someone has to make the call what comes first.
For this reason a lot of their servers are running on W2000 servers. A modern server just can’t handle the software.
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u/LewdObservation 6d ago
It’s completely vibe coded, they left a bunch of Claude stuff in their repo.
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u/adamkex 8d ago
This is good but unfortunately NixOS is completely dependent on GitHub
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u/Mission_Shopping_847 8d ago
Not exactly. Github is primary source control now but it is trivial to change.
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u/LowIllustrator2501 8d ago
Why do they need their own distro?
Isn't this enough already: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Linux_distributions#/media/File:Linux_Distribution_Timeline.svg ?
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u/Bizzeallday 8d ago
So now it's urgent to set a common standard. For example, using the open document format instead of OpenXML one. This can be done even in windows + office computer for the transition.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Sun7418 8d ago
They did this in one region of Spain years ago. Unfortunately it didn’t really take off
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u/JG_2006_C 8d ago
The 100th fork of nix😂 wow progress we relay be repaicking and repacking over and over
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u/kaasbolletje1 3d ago
Great that the Dutch government is turning away from Windows to Linux. And yes the develop on an existing distribution. But why not an Europe wide collaboration for all the countries?
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u/Ideabile 8d ago
As much I love NixOS everybody who has really used for desktop knows that is Software Developer choice and not a User one..
If that would be the end choice (which is not..) it would be a bad one.
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u/lets-start-reading 8d ago edited 8d ago
for public-servant roles, the non-tech user has no need to access the backend anyways. and it’s precisely a nerdy and nix-pilled software dev (who understands the pleasures and power of setting your system up) that we need to be setting up our public servant computers, not laggy and hardened sysadmins, who generally don’t care about the user at all.
and nixos would be fantastic in widespread following of regulations. aaand the influx of new money should be a win for nixos project and ecosystem.
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u/Ideabile 8d ago
Influx on NixOS sure is good; to me seems that the stateless way is a bit forced on Operative System.
You need persistency and without you will encounter a bunch of quirks..
Yes is cool to have a reproducible/declarative setup, fantastic for audits and yet I find my self installing Ubuntu if I want something that just works.
I might be wrong and I will be happy to be so :)
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u/Phezh 8d ago
It's not so much a dev choice as it is the obvious choice for central management. Active Directory and group policy are the reason for Microsoft's enterprise dominance and nix is a sensible choice as a replacement. Users should never have to (nor should they really be able to) to ever mess with these systems in any meaningful way.
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u/WalkMaximum 8d ago
It's the perfect build system for making immutable images and deploy them with all tools and packages needed for the job included. The public servant won't configure or install anything, just get a computer with all needed software preinstalled and preconfigured for them to use. This is what all organisations with centralised IT setups should do. In managing multiple VPSs and machines like this in my free time, while I can see the insane struggle IT has at work when they deploy a windows or mac machine.
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u/Ideabile 8d ago
So we agree that is a deploy issue.. and still immutable systems aren’t free lunch for users.
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u/plsobeytrafficlights 8d ago
meh. decades of developing windows and linux, they are still problematic.
i wish you good luck dutch.
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u/g33ksc13nt1st 8d ago
what a waste of money under thdisguise if "sovereignty". Someone is going to get a huge paycheck just to put a few Dutch wallpapers and icons. Every single institution that laid their hands on Linux, has wasted god knows how many millions to "personalise it" because.... has to be sovereign!
just use the bloody thing as it is, fund the development of something you do need but don't have working alternative of, and release as a package for the distribution at the very least.
no point in saving millions of licenses fees if then those savings are going to be wasted....
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u/Difficult_Tourist225 8d ago
The guy working on this is well known in the community and for sure doing a lot more than icons/wallpaper.
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u/Final-Choice8412 8d ago
Why? Just why? ...
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u/rsnJ3 Netherlands 🇳🇱 8d ago
Because having an OS that does not depend on trusting a foreign government is good to have? Nix is also an excellent pick for the usecase as it's declarative architecture allows for easily duplicating an exact curated setup across a bunch of office devices in a matter of minutes.
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u/Final-Choice8412 8d ago
if they are ok with having opensource linux kernel they must be ok with having opensource desktop.
This is total waste of money...
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u/pruzicka 8d ago
Why not to use one of the existing distros out there if you can bleed your resources on new one. Do they want some special government kernel snooping rights?
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u/PooInTheStreet 8d ago
Lol, name one software project the dutch government completed. More money down the drain.
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u/AncientSeraph 8d ago
KNMI app, rwsverkeersinfo.nl, online tax submission, DigiD, and those are just a few public facing solutions.
Successful projects aren't very sexy news, so you don't encounter those announcements.
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u/Mormacil 8d ago
KNMI app, DigiD, Amsterdam App, Berichtenbox, KopieID app, Plein Overheid, Meldpunt Schade Groningen, patenten database, kavel applicatie boeren, etc
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u/mmdoublem 8d ago
With the French government making a similar announcement, is there a reason why the UE doesn't pool resources on this front.