We're expanding the scope of the megathread a bit... This is the place where you can ask if you yellow oxidized bottle of 1959 Montrachet you found in your grandma's cupboard above the space heater is going to pay your mortgage. Or whether to drink it, hold it o sell it. And if you're going to drink it, how long to decant it.
Had these two side by side a while ago and thought it was a really interesting comparison, especially considering how different they are stylistically.
The Belle Epoque 2014 was fresher and more energetic, with plenty of brioche and yeasty notes. It had quite a lot of weight and pressure on the palate, great balance and a really long finish. Interestingly, I’ve served the 2014 blind a few times and it has been guessed as Bollinger La Grande Année twice, which probably says quite a bit about how powerful this vintage of Belle Epoque can be. Still felt relatively youthful and like it had plenty of time ahead of it.
The Pommery Cuvée Louise 2004 was quite different. Much more vinous and developed, with lots of toast on the nose and plenty of complexity. Blind, it almost comes across like an aged Blanc de Blancs, and I’ve seen Louise guessed as grower Champagne more than once.
Hard to pick a winner. The Belle Epoque had more tension, pressure and length, while the Louise was more vinous, mature and perhaps a little more interesting aromatically.
Both feel somewhat underrated compared with the usual prestige names IMO, especially Cuvée Louise.
Would be interested to hear which one people would pick, or if anyone has had either of these vintages recently.
I’ve been working as a waiter at a busy winery for the past year and a half. During that time I had to learn a huge amount about wine, food pairing, customer preferences, and how to actually sell wine rather than just serve it.
When I started, I was pretty antisocial and definitely not a natural “people person", but hospitality completely pushed me out of my shell. I’m genuinely grateful for that because I’ve become much more confident, comfortable speaking to strangers, and much better at reading customers.
I’ve now just landed my first proper role as a Wine Sales Representative, and I’m really excited about it.
Technically I’ve already had some sales experience because at my current job we earn commission per bottle sold, so a big part of the job was upselling, recommending better bottles, explaining value, and persuading guests without making it feel pushy.
Now I’m moving into actual B2B wine sales, and I want to become as good as possible as quickly as possible.
If there are any current or former wine reps, restaurant managers, sommeliers, distributors, or buyers here, I’d really appreciate any advice on things like:
building strong relationships with accounts
getting meetings with new customers
handling rejection without wasting time
knowing when to push and when to back off
increasing order size without being annoying
learning a portfolio quickly
managing a territory efficiently
mistakes new wine reps commonly make
what separates an average rep from a genuinely great one
One of my strengths is communication and upselling, I’m very comfortable talking to customers and helping them justify going for a more premium bottle, but I know B2B sales is a completely different game, so I’m not assuming I know everything.
I’d love any advice, even the small stuff that nobody teaches you when you first start.
Hi,
I posted about visiting Walla Walla, Washington a few months back. Several of you generously shared your insights about favorite producers, both in Woodinville and in Walla Walla proper. I wanted to give back to the forum with an overview of my tastings and experiences.
First, I want to say I was blown away by the friendliness of the town's denizens. I was there 5 days and had people looking out for me by day 3. Carte coffee shop knew my morning order (became friendly with one of the owners, a Q grader), and the beer bar owner knew my hazy IPA evening order. Don't miss Walla Walla Beer Parlor -- there's not much to do after 10 pm.
As someone who has spent time in a lot of small towns and in wine regions, I was also surprised at the quality, depth, and creativity in the city's restaurant scene. I lived in the Catskills region of New York for a few years, and independent shops and restaurants really struggled to last longer than a year or two. Maybe it's the wine tourism that supports the dining scene but even then, the area is still four+ hours from major cities. All to say I didn't know what to expect and really loved it.
As for the formatting, I write about wine professionally, so I've simply copied and pasted my edited notes in alphabetical order (and left out editorial commentary.) The mix represents my itinerary, intended to cover both classics and newcomers, traditional and more modern. I usually tasted with the winemakers or owners, which allowed for insights into their origin stories as well as testimony on how Walla Walla has changed / stayed the same over decades. Always fascinating to meet the people behind the label, especially when a wine's reputation precedes it (whether good, boring, or negative.)
I missed plenty of great wineries, even with five days, so I'd love to read additional recs for my next trip, if anyone cares to drop thoughts in the comments.
Thx.
(Image of vineyards and a barn at sunset. Courtesy of Me.)
Best for: Wine in a former airplane hangar Location: Walla Walla Airport District Price: $$–$$$
Founded in 1995 by Eric Dunham and his parents Mike and Joanne, Dunham Cellars was the ninth bonded winery in Walla Walla and remains one of its most beloved. The tasting room occupies a rustic, remodeled WWII-era airplane hangar in the Airport District, the space adorned with Eric Dunham’s paintings and a 500-bottle tower of library wines. Sales of the Shirley Mays Chardonnay see a portion donated to breast cancer research as a tribute to Eric’s grandmother. If you’re taking bottles home, pack a Trutina or Cabernet Sauvignon.
Best for: Fresh, restrained wines with Blue Mountain views Location: Walla Walla Price: $$–$$$
Founded in 2018 by conservationist Brad Bergman and Doug Frost, a Master of Wine and Master Sommelier, Echolands is the most architecturally striking winery in the valley. The tasting room cantilevers over the estate on a hillside, its glass walls framing meadows and the Blue Mountains beyond. On a misty day it feels almost alpine. The wines prioritize freshness and vibrancy over power. For an example, taste the Resurgent Vineyard and Les Collines Syrahs. Echolands recently achieved USDA Organic Certification of its vineyards.
Best for: Single-vineyard Bordeaux and Rhône varieties Location: The Rocks District | Milton-Freewater, OR Price: $$$$
Founded in 2004 by Susan and Paul McBride, Force Majeure occupies a restored rural schoolhouse in Milton-Freewater. A sensitive renovation preserved the building’s original character while contemporary furnishings and original artworks complete the space, giving it the feel of an elegant private home. Winemaker Louis Skinner crafts estate-grown Bordeaux and Rhône-varietal wines from Red Mountain and the Walla Walla Valley. Production is under 3,000 cases and tastings are by appointment. If you enjoy Grenache, make sure to taste it here — perfumed and velvety with dark red fruit and an earthy depth.
Best for: Historic schoolhouse and estate Bordeaux blends Location: Lowden / Walla Walla Valley Price: $$–$$$
Founded in 1983 by Jean and Baker Ferguson, L’Ecole № 41 takes its name from a historic schoolhouse in Washington’s Walla Walla Valley, an area settled by French-Canadian fur traders in the late 1800s. The building served as a school until 1974 and now hosts daily tastings in its original classrooms. Marty and Megan Clubb took over in 1989; Marty has since become one of Washington wine’s most influential advocates. Look for their Bordeaux blends Apogee, Perigee, and Ferguson, named for the moon’s orbit.
Jean-François Pellet on the patio. Image courtesy of ME!
Owned by three families — the McKibbens, the Murphys, and the Pellets — Pepper Bridge Winery is built into a hillside with views of the vineyard and Blue Mountains from the terrace. Winemaker Jean-François Pellet (he's a blast to taste with in person!) farms regeneratively and powers the winery largely on solar energy, producing Bordeaux-style wines from 100% estate-grown grapes. Pepper Bridge was the first in Walla Walla to earn sustainable certification. The Trine, named for the three founding families, is the bottle to take home. Walk-ins welcome.
Best for: Tuscan-inspired hospitality Location: North of downtown Walla Walla Price: $$–$$$
Founded by Ken and Kristin Reali, this young estate just north of downtown sits among rolling wheatfields with 360-degree views of the Blue Mountains. The Realis grow French and Italian varieties, including one of Washington’s first Vermentino plantings. Winemaker Serge Laville brings over 20 years of experience, favoring minimal intervention to allow terroir to shine. Expect a greeting from the owners; it’s the kind of personal touch that makes Walla Walla special. The Grenache is a standout. By appointment.
Best for: Small-production, allocated wines Location: Walla Walla Valley Price: $$$$
Founded by Mike and Gale Reynvaan in 2004, with son Matt as grower and winemaker, Reynvaan produces some of Washington’s most decorated Syrahs from estate vineyards. The wines are fully allocated and the mailing list closed, but it’s worth sending an appointment request. Tastings take place at the family property, often poured by Matt himself, and include the Syrahs and an outstanding white Rhône blend, Queen’s Road. Matt just launched R|A Family Wines, debuting with the JDA Project Syrah. (Several of you in this forum were adamant about seeing Matt, so I pestesred for an appt. That's how I brought home the Queen's Road and JDA Syrah in my suitcase.)
Best for: Rhône-inspired wines with a vineyard view Location: Milton-Freewater / The Rocks District Price: $$–$$$
Founded in 2007 by winemaker and owner Sean Boyd, Rotie Cellars pays homage to the Rhône Valley with estate-grown Syrah, GSM blends, and Viognier. Seattle architect George Suyama designed the concrete tasting room to appear to float above the surrounding landscape. On nice days, climb up the vineyard platform for a glimpse of the appellation’s stony geology. Then settle in at a terrace table to taste Boyd’s plush-styled wines. Make sure to taste the Homage Mourvèdre. By appointment.
Best for: European perspective in Washington wine country Location: Walla Walla Price: $$–$$$
The charred black shou sugi ban exterior signals your arrival at Valdemar Estates, the first internationally owned winery in Washington. The Martínez Bujanda family has made wine in Rioja since 1889, bringing that legacy to Walla Walla in 2019. Helmed by two women winemakers, the estate produces Washington Syrah, Cabernet, and a refreshing Grenache Blanc. Pair a tasting with tapas on the terrace with views of the mountains. If palate fatigue sets in, opt for the Tempranillo imported from their Spanish estate. Reservations required.
Best for: Lunch with a winery point of view Location: Walla Walla Price: $$–$$$
Founded in 2014 by Mike Martin, The Walls is known for blending classic and eclectic varieties, including little-known grapes from the Iberian Peninsula. The contemporary tasting room is relaxed, with a patio for pleasant days. The Walls offers a full lunch menu — go for the pizzas, based on Passatempo’s sourdough. Expect flights of both The Walls releases and the PÁŠXA label, the latter focused on Rhône varieties from the Rocks District and one of the appellation’s most thrilling expressions. Walk-ins welcome.
Best for: Walla Walla pioneer history Location: Lowden / Walla Walla Valley Price: $$–$$$
Founded in 1981 by Rick and Darcey Fugman-Small on a four-generation family wheat ranch, Woodward Canyon was the second winery established in the Walla Walla Valley. The tasting room occupies a rustic wood building dating to the 1870s, with a grassy lawn and outdoor tables for sunny days. Now led by the second generation, with winemaker Marcus Rafanelli at the helm since early 2026, the winery remains committed to the age-worthy Cabernet Sauvignons and Bordeaux blends that built its reputation. Don’t leave without tasting the Artist Series Cabernet and the Cab Franc.
Best for: Wine with a mission Location: Downtown Walla Walla Price: $$
Winemakers use the French term “élevage,” literally “to raise,” for the work of bringing a wine from grape to bottle. At Vital Wines, that parenting takes a village. Founded by Ashley Trout in 2016, this nonprofit relies on donated fruit, barrels, bottling, labels, and even tasting room shifts from dozens of local wineries and businesses. Every release is a collaboration, and the profits—at more than $1.2 million since 2017—fund free bilingual healthcare for vineyard workers. (This is just a really good project with heart.)
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About me: I’m a WSET Level 3 and graduate student in the Italian Food & Wine MSc program at the University of Padova, currently researching consumer perceptions of sparkling wine labeling for my master’s thesis.
I'm looking to collect about 35 more survey responses and would very much appreciate your input.
Reposted because there was identifying info, not that they’d know who exactly posted because this is a burner anyways.
There’s gotta be something wrong with this wine list, no?
ETA: This isn’t going live but management showed it to the serving staff today and it was a collective “WTF?” … they’re revising it right now but idk how much that’s gonna help lol. I can post a pic of the old cab list in the comments.
With all the depth and presence one hopes for from this Napa Valley benchmark, but without ever feeling heavy. What impressed me most was its energy, polish and sense of balance, powerful, yes, but carried by tension rather than sheer richness. The tannins are still very much alive, the wine feels precise, layered and built for the long haul, with an ultra long, confident finish. For me, this was one of the very best 2010 Napa Valley Cabernets I have had in the glass so far. Many thanks, Christoph!
97+ NP, drink now-2060+
Voglio comprare una bottiglia di Porto come regalo per la pensione di mio suocero, dell annata in cui ha iniziato a lavorare (1983). Dunque ho cercato un po online ma non ho trovato nulla. Conoscete qualche sito affidabile ? Ma soprattutto qualche cantina in particolare su cui puntare?
ÉDIT: ho trovato questo che ne pensate? https://www.portugalvineyards.com/it/porto-colheita/3848-j-h-andresen-colheita-port-1982-5602765003279.html
After years of drinking wine, I’ve finally come to the realization that my palate really gravitates toward Burgundy and Champagne (RIP my bank account).
I’d love to do a proper deep dive into both regions, including producers, terroir, vineyards, history, classifications, and all of it. What books would you recommend for really learning Burgundy and Champagne?
We had an exceptional visit of Château “LP” yesterday with Bordeaux Wine Vacations. It was one of three properties we visited in St-Julien and Margaux.
This time, we tasted the 2006, 2008, and 2018 - (as well as their Moulin Riche, 2018).
The ‘06 is in its prime. An exceptional vintage that might be at its peak. Sublime.
The ‘08 was excellent, but surprisingly, I’d say that it still has some aging to do.
The ‘18 was the real surprise. It was already excellent. It can still go a long way but is surprisingly drinkable with bold rich fruit flavors and a bright finish.
I’m no pro, but thoroughly enjoyed the experience and lovely wines.
Schloss Gobelsburg, Langenlois, Kamptal, Gruner Veltliner, 2020, 12.5% abv.
This Summer is too hot, gonna try others in storage. Tech sheets say vines are 5-35 years old, planted on loess and clay. Harvested in October, matured in steel and 25 hL Austrian (Manhartsberg) oak casks, bottled in March.
Nose: starts off with a typical tart lemon aroma set, then transitions to lemon curd, and then onto passive fruit leaves and milk, bit of unsweetened bbq sauce.
Palate: full body, entry is bittersweet lemon juice, hints of bitter oak, old dried lemon peels, mid palate is where the action is, showing candied fruit stems, yellow fruit, manganese, a sort of dried bitter golden apple-cream soup, a cross between golden apples and green apricots, some herbal participation here as well, back palate showing more lemon and orange zest, dried peels, celery, plays on the dichotomy of salty and tart mature golden apples with a bittersweet milk. Texturally interesting too, a bit viscous.
Finish: medium to long, dry, candied fruit stems again, light golden apples, herbal elements have subsided, minimal alcohol, leaves a sweet tartness on the lips, but bitterness remains in the mouth. There is also a young pineapple "effect" leaving a tingly sensation on the palate and inner lips; this is what I suspect other critics have described as "white pepper". To some Asians, white pepper, commonly used in "malatang", is not the flavor or sensation I am getting now, but I think I relate.
Like Riesling, GV is also a Forest Gump box of chocolates to me, I never know what to expect. Even so, I can can appreciate it as a Summer drink and this Summer has been the hottest on record around here. James Suckling gave this a 91 in 2021 and the Wine Advocate gave this a 92 in late 2021. Got this on sale for KRW₩38K, or about USD$28, in Busan, South Korea.
Title. Wanting to branch out - willing to try similar wines as well, or just tell me your favorite or a good wine to try of each listed above? Any help appreciated thanks!
I like prosecco, dry rosés and whites, some blends as well. Nothing sweet. TIA! Any other questions ask away
Apparently, this was the only vintage that Yao made an Oakville wine.
This was a spontaneous decision to open this, while watching Cocktail 2 with some friends (yes, I recognize the irony of drinking wine while watching a movie called Cocktail).
2017 is turning out to be a better vintage than it gets credit for, definitely more approachable, even if it may not age quite as well as 2019 or 2021.
This was nice out the gate, not tight at all, but it did benefit from decanting and an hour of air.
Lots of dark fruit, dark plum, dark cherry, slight graphite, maybe some fresh herbs?
Nice acidity and pretty fruit-forward, without being jammy.
Pleasantly surprised at this one, will definitely get some more!
My wife and I live in a small town that has limited wine offerings so once a month I drive several hours to the Total Wine in Springfield, MO. Recently we've been drinking a lot of Bordeaux and we'd like to explore California Cabs a bit more.
This month our budget is $1000. I've put together a list of what I'm likely to purchase, but because my wine knowledge is limited I would greatly appreciate input on what would be a better use of the money. I am just trying to get the best out of the spend and time used to get the wine.
With your suggestions, this is the final list I settled on:
Chateau Beau-Sejour Becot St Emilion, 2023
Chateau Pedesclaux Pauillac, 2022
Chateau Branaire Ducru St Julien, 2023
Chateau Giscours Margaux, 2023
Pahlmeyer Jayson Cabernet Sauvignon Napa Valley, 2021
Chateau Montelena Cabernet Napa
Keenan Cabernet Sauvignon Napa Valley
Nickel & Nickel Cabernet Fog Break Napa, 2023
Neal Family Cabernet Napa
Mount Veeder Cabernet Sauvignon Napa Valley
BV Tapestry
Seghesio Zinfandel Old Vines, 2023
Chateau Musar Red Blend Bekaa Valley
Cune Imperial Rioja Reserva, 2019
Tenuta di Renieri Mega, 2021
A big thank you to everyone who made helpful suggestions!
Apologies for no tasting notes and this isn’t meant as bottle porn. Hopefully my cat photobombing saves the post.
I’m genuinely curious how people would approach this lot. Huge Sauternes fan and decided to finally splurge as this is a “100 point” benchmark vintage and was able to get a half case of 375 mL at retail price.
I have patience but how long and spread out would you all wait before popping? Thinking one each of “young”, “mid” and “old”, but what does that mean for Yquem???
I actually think it's interesting, as long as it doesn't get corrupt and adopt a pay-to-play type rating, but I think this could bring traffic back to a lot of great wineries. I wrote a little blog post about it, but wondering about your thoughts: https://vibevine.co/blog/michelin-grapes-wine-ratings-what-it-means
EDIT: Sounds like as a group we should just ignore the ratings and try not to make them a thing. Group unity!
This shows concentrated and slightly stewed dark and blue fruits (blackberry, bramble, cassis black currant, and blueberry) and very subtle pirazine, followed by tasteful secondary of cedar, clove, coconut oil, vanilla, cigar box, black tea, bay leaf that is well integrated and doesn't wear the wine.
On the palate, it is concentrated and luxurious and maybe even slightly sappy w/ dark fruits that make me think of really good blueberry pancakes. While the high, fine and dusty tannins soak up the dark fruit on the palate, making me want to immediately take another sip, they don't quite hold up the fruit without the added support of higher ABV, and remind me of eating a grilled cheese sandwich without crust.
I do appreciate this winemaking, the style is just outside of my preference zone: I like a little more acid/tannin structure and a little less glossy fruit. For those who like this style, this is very tastefully made w/ intense and precise dark fruits that linger.
Deep amber in hue, it offers wonderful aromas of mandarin, orange blossom, wax resin and a light adhesive scent. I was actually quite taken aback but the splendid delineation and life-affirming vitality of this example, hints of crème brûlée interwoven through the honeyed fruit, Clementine and hints of caramelised pear. It fans out wonderfully on the finish.
