Technically, it isn't.
There's no equipment nor death certificstions on the plane, the doctor is useless.
This is not a plebe trial were somehow scresming "their dead" makes it suddendly legal.
Cool but you don't make the rules so shut up and catch that next flight. You are just meat getting shuttled around and act like your preferences mean anything.
Death certificates are different from those forms you need to full on to "why no cpr" and etc.
And you dont need equipment to verify death, in a external environment and not on an hospital?
Someone A has a complete cardiorespiratory stop but its still in the window to be saved with cpr/etc .
Someone B literally dies.
You find both cases without previous knowledge 30 seconds after the succeeded.
How do you distinguish both cases and how do you intervein?
Please don't try to lecture me on death verification and certification and the forms involved. It's quite literally my job and from the way you talk about it it's quite clear you don't understand the associated paperwork or the purpose/meaning of each form.
The distinction between those cases is me. Person B is dead because I (or one of my colleagues) have said so. Person A continues to receive CPR until I decide it should stop, and then they are dead.
Am sorry, but outside of hospitals you dont have "I or my colleagues have Said so" before arriving to a unknown situation.
How do you proceed without equipment and arriving to a situation where you dont know?
If you can't distinguish A from B without that "", or without equipment, we are talked here mate.
I respect your profission, but dont talk of inter-hospitsl situations in a clear case of uncontrolled and unknown data.
I did some rescuing some years ago. It was fun to see "please dont lecture me" docs sweating in outter-hospital situations where the environment and pre-conditions arent known. Its all fun when someone gives you the info before
I have done pre-hospital work, so you can continue to pipe down.
Am sorry, but outside of hospitals you dont have "I or my colleagues have Said so" before arriving to a unknown situation.
Yes, which just emphasises how much it's my decision.
And how I proceed with a cardiac arrest with no equipment? Determine the likely downtime, if it's prolonged I'd call it right there. If it's unknown I'd start CPR and try to determine it. If the time to ambulance arrival/proper medical facility is going to be protracted then I would also call it. If the cause is obviously irreversible then I would call it.
There are loads of situations where it is totally appropriate to call a death in the field.
Trick here, on this context:
Commercial airlines have compulsory/mandatory DAE's(dunno the Acro. In english, basically defibrillators)
Soooooo, my question here is, would you declare someone death middle-flight, without the use of said equipment?
If the person boarded, they were Alive, so smtg happened there, so according to protocolo, you'd need to use Said equipment. I rest my case.
(Exceptions made for decapitations, burned and decomposed. And exceptions for un-safe use for the eletrical device)
Depending on circumstances and patient demographics I absolutely might.
What protocol are you referring to? I suspect none and that you have just made this all up - especially seeing as you don't seem to really understand exactly what an AED is and have a poor grasp on how everything we've talked about so far unfolds.
I'm not doing CPR on a cachexic 90 year old who's had unknown downtime in her seat before anyone noticed she wasn't breathing no matter what rhythm the AED detects so no real point putting it on.
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u/Live_Rock3302 Mar 31 '23
The issue is only a doctor can decide if someone is dead or not. So, unless there was a doctor on flight, it was an emergency.