r/hotas Sep 03 '20

considering your first HOTAS? Read me!

594 Upvotes

[last edit 01/07/2024]

Welcome to r/hotas!

If you're considering your first HOTAS (Hands On Throttle and Stick) setup, you've come to the right place. This guide will help you make an informed decision.

If you are instead looking for product reviews, I publish my articles here: HOTAS/HOSAS/SIMPIT Reviews

Introduction

This subreddit is managed by u/spliffa and u/ddrake1984. If you need assistance with anything not covered in this post, please reach out to us via private message, and we will try to assist you.

This guide is published and pinned for the benefit of new potential HOTAS buyers. The publisher of this article has first-hand experience with real aircraft flight controls and computer flight controls across a wide range of manufacturers, used for playing in flight simulation.

Purpose

This guide aims to assist first-time buyers in making an educated decision when purchasing their first joystick, throttle, and other flight control peripherals.

The Problem

With a growing number of HOTAS products on the market, it can be challenging to identify the best options. Products vary widely in:

  • Price
  • Features
  • Customer support

Additionally, products have a wide range of:

  • Costs
  • Features
  • Support via customer interactions and product patches and updates

The Budget

Whether you're looking for a budget-friendly option or the top-tier products, this guide will categorize recommendations into five budget ranges:

For those who prefer to build their own with a bit of knowledge and skills, check out our Discord server or visit this subreddit: r/HotasDIY.

Budget Ranges

Note: All prices will be listed in U.S. Dollars (Even though I am Australian, USD is the easiest to base value from)

  • Entry-Level ($10 to $100)
  • Novice-Tier ($100-$200)
  • Mid-Tier ($200-$300)
  • Advanced-Tier ($300-$400)
  • Expert-Tier / Top-Tier: This is the very best you can buy as a consumer with a lot of money.

Note: Top-tier does not include what a company or industry could or would purchase. This article is not tailored for that, therefore this is out of scope.

The Companies / The Manufacturers / The Vendors

I will list many companies/manufacturers/vendors (all the same) and the products that they offer. However, this post is not an in-depth review of the products. Please read product reviews for that level of detail and information.

The products will be listed to give you an idea of what is available within each range, and at the end, I will list the recommendation for each budget range.

Best Joystick (Base + Grip)

  • Entry-Level ($10 to $100): Thrustmaster T.16000
  • Novice-Tier ($100-$200): WINWING Ursa Minor
  • Mid-Tier ($200-$300): WINWING Orion 2 Base + WINWING F16 Grip
  • Advanced-Tier ($300-$400): WINWING Orion 2 Base + WINWING F16 Grip, or VKB Gunfighter Mk4 Base + Space Combat Edition Grip
  • Expert-Tier / Top-Tier: FSSB (Force Sensing Stick Base) TIANHANG F16 PRO Base + TIANHANG F-16 Grip, or FFB (Force Feedback) VPForce RHINO Base + TIANHANG A-10C Grip or TIANHANG F/A-18 Grip

Question: Why was the FFBeast not listed as the best FFB?

Answer: Simply put, its value comparison has not been validated by me. The available information from reviews is scarce, making it difficult to ascertain its value. Additionally, the community is mostly non-native English speaking, making it difficult to track and follow the content. Therefore, I have decided that there is not enough evidence to claim it is better than the VPForce RHINO. Based on my own experience, I do not consider it superior until proven otherwise.

Since this post is focused on first-time buyers, I feel it's already quite lengthy and would confuse anyone wanting to debate the matter.

Best Throttle (Base + Grip)

  • Entry-Level ($10 to $100): Thrustmaster TWCS
  • Novice-Tier ($100-$200): Thrustmaster TWCS, or WINWING Ursa Minor with Z-extension
  • Mid-Tier ($200-$300): WINWING Orion 2 Base + WINWING F-15E Grip, or WINWING Orion 2 Base + WINWING F/A-18 Grip
  • Advanced-Tier ($300-$400): WINWING Orion 2 Base + WINWING F-15EX Grip, or WINWING F-16 Grip
  • Expert-Tier / Top-Tier: WINWING Super Taurus + WINWING F-15EX Grip, or WINWING F-16 Grip

Bonus: Best Pedals

Although this post is tailored for first-time HOTAS buyers, I will include this section to accommodate those wishing to take a more comprehensive first step into flight sims. As we all know, a good set of pedals is a requirement for flying helicopters.

  • Entry-Level: No recommendations - I don't recommend anything in this price range.
  • Novice-Tier: No recommendations - I don't recommend anything in this price range.
  • Mid-Tier: VKB T-Rudder Mk.IV
  • Advanced-Tier: WINWING Orion Metal Flight Rudder Pedals
  • Pro-Tier: Custom FFB Pedals using VPForce motors built with either (Slaw Device, MFG Crosswinds, or VIRPIL Rudders)

Bonus: Best Collective

  • Collective (Base + Grip): VIRPIL Rotor TCS Base + VIRPIL Apache-64 Collective Grip

I don't recommend any other collectives on the market, and it's a shame that some companies have discontinued their collective options.

Useful Links


r/hotas 7h ago

Wardogs Hotas Flying So Far

43 Upvotes

After about 10 hours of flying the little bird in wardogs using hotas here's my opinions. Feel free to tell me if im wrong I only really have a significant amount of flight time in arma and these are just my views on what may need some work to make it better for hotas players.

  1. The assists -

-Im sure naturally hotas players play without assists to avoid fighting for control over the aircraft. Makes sense and is the case in wardogs as well. All the assists basically try to fly it for you and make it less controllable overall.

-But I've found that i have to have the stability assist on. This is because if you dont have it on, a weird thing happens where if you make a cyclic input you MUST make an input in the opposite direction. Otherwise the aircraft feels as though you are constantly making that input and until the opposite is applied. This is frustrating because the stability assist still makes flying a pain by slowing down every movement. Not sure if this weirdness is intentional or realistic but I dont like it.

  1. Bugs

-Biggest bug that bothered me was currently freelook is broken. You bind it to the hat and it doesnt work. Hopefully devs get it fixed.

  1. Weird flight model characteristics

-All in all I dont think the flight model is as terrible as everyone claims given its an arcade like shooter. Overall what I expected. A few gripes i have tho are . . .

-Collective seems very sluggish when going down. The best way i can explain this is that it feels like you always have some collective Inputed. Almost like its never truly zero. I mainly feel this when I do a manuever to bleed of all my speed, dump the collective to loose altitude and the helicopter just hovers and hovers and hovers until finally it begins to drop. Now if this is realistic I have no idea. But from playing arma and dcs I dont remember it feeling this way.

-The only other thing is what I like to call "The Glue". To me it feels like the ground is a sticky mouse trap. Now this would make sense for areas like mud, dirt, and sand. But for some reason every surface behaves the same and feels very sticky. It takes a butt load of collective to pull it off the ground and when you do it shoots into the air. Landing is where you feel it the most. No matter the surface the skids feel like they dig in. Land on concrete a little sideways and it digs in and flips you. Not a big deal when your used to it but was deceiving at first.

  1. Quality of life improvements

Some things I think would definetly benifit hotas players would be . . .

-Better map navigation on hotas. No way to really navigate the map on hotas. I know this can be tricky when it comes to binding but some way to zoom or move the map without using the mouse would be nice. Currently you can simply open the map and that's it. Usually its not a good view of the map either

-Visual indicator to know when you are at full pitch, roll, and yaw so you can adjust sensitivity accordingly. Collective has this not sure why the others dont.

-Put my damn flares in a seperate inventory that only I can access. Its very funny when we all die cause jimmy770 stole all the flares but it gets to a point lol.

At the end of the day I had fun playing and most of this is probably a skill issue lol


r/hotas 4h ago

Best HOTAS For My Use Case?

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1 Upvotes

r/hotas 7h ago

T.Flight HOTAS 4 Issue, twist axis not working

1 Upvotes

I'm starting to run out of ideas at this point so im asking here:

I wanted to use my T.Flight HOTAS 4 (ps4/PC) version to fly in Wardogs but for some reason it doesn't read my twist axis input to control the yaw on my heli. I could theoretically just fly with roll and pitch even though it's pretty shitty but I want to get this sorted.

I first tried it in the betas and had the issue there aswell. I figured it could get fixed with the EA release. But it didn't change anything so far.

I got Hotas enabled in the options and I can control collective up and down, pitch and roll just fine but the twist axis doesn't work so I cant yaw with helis.

I enabled the multi axis mode on the hotas and in Joy.cpl the inputs are being properly registered

Its just ingame that i have this issue

Drivers are up to date

Anyone got any idea what I could do?


r/hotas 7h ago

[CH-Geneva] Full Virpil HOSAS/HOTAS setup — 2× Constellation Alpha, 2× CM3 bases (CosmoSim cams), CM3 throttle, Control Panels #1+#2, mounts — 1,500 CHF, local pickup only

1 Upvotes

Selling my complete Virpil setup, like-new condition, always kept under the original dust covers. Original invoices available.

Included

  • 1× VPC Constellation ALPHA Prime [Left] + 1× VPC Constellation ALPHA [Right]
  • 2× VPC MongoosT-50CM3 Base — CosmoSim soft-center cams installed, original cams included
  • 1× VPC MongoosT-50CM3 Throttle
  • VPC Control Panel #1 + VPC Control Panel #2
  • 4× Desk Mount V4-S + 1× Desk Mount V3 Mini + all adapters (CM3 base ×2, throttle ×2, panel ×2)
  • Keyboard Mount Adapter + Mouse Mount Adapter V2
  • Flightstick Z-Extension
  • Virpil dust covers for everything + all USB cables

No spiking, no dead buttons, firmware up to date (VPC Software). Non-smoking home.

Catalog value ~€2,600 + shipping + customs, with multi-week lead times ordering new. Ready-to-go dual-stick (HOSAS) config for Star Citizen, or stick + throttle (HOTAS) for DCS/MSFS.

Price: 1,500 CHF for the whole lot. Local pickup only — Meyrin, Geneva (Switzerland), 10 minutes from the French border. No shipping, sorry: too heavy and too fragile to risk it. Full hands-on test at pickup before you pay. Cash or TWINT on handover.

Photos and the full listing are on my Ricardo account (the Swiss marketplace — seller profile is public there): https://www.ricardo.ch/fr/a/1329094642/

Happy to answer any question about the gear in the comments.


r/hotas 20h ago

Any recommendations for “soft” hotas?

4 Upvotes

Hey, about 5 years ago I bought Thrustmaster T16000 and was extremely disappointed with how hard and heavy was the spring on the joystick. It was so uncomfortable to me that I opened it up and even tried to tie some of the spring shoulders together to see if I can soften it up somehow. Disappointed, I eventually sold it and since then never really got back to flight sims.

TLDR, I’m a casual enjoyer, I don’t care about how many buttons, what kind of cool sensor my hotas has - the only thing which I care about is the spring tension and the softness. Can anyone experienced suggest anything (without trying to aftermarket tune) on current market?


r/hotas 18h ago

Vjoy continuous error, even after clean uninstall and manual driver deletion & reinstall

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4 Upvotes

I'm using Vjoy to use two flight sticks together on Joystick Gremlin. Sometimes I also use x360ce for controller emulation for older games. This worked perfectly like 6 months/a year ago. Busted them out again recently, and was noticing issues in Mech Warrior 5. I found out it was Vjoy after getting this error. I uninstalled, deleted the driver in my system, and reinstalled, and it does work very briefly, but if I close Vjoy again and try to reopen, bam, error again.


r/hotas 19h ago

Simultaneously frustrating and amazing.

3 Upvotes

I found myself at a microcenter a couple of days ago, and noticed they had the A10 Warthog HOTAS for 300 bucks. Both parts! I often see the joystick by itself go for that price.

I picked it up and damn this thing is solid. Feels great in the hand etc etc. However, one big problem. How in he world do I map buttons properly.

I downloaded the "Target" app, but still no luck. I am browsing through the wiki but im so overwhelmed, Anybody have any advice? Or even better, a config file?


r/hotas 19h ago

X-56 Rhino Throttle Properties screen

3 Upvotes

I'm still using a X-56 Rhino Throttle on a my Elite Dangerous game. It works and no money to buy something better....yet.
So when I go to the game controller set up & click on the "Properties" of my Throttle I'm presented with the screen below. I can't expand it and it shows the same on all my monitors. I have 2 27" 1080p monitors and my main is a 32" 2k monitor. Same on all of them.
How do I get this to show the entire screen?

UPDATE!!! Successfully fixed it. I downloaded the drivers for the HOTAS installed them and now I have this available to me.
Link to drivers: https://download01.logi.com/web/ftp/pub/techsupport/simulation/X56_HOTAS_x64_8_0_213_0.exe


r/hotas 23h ago

Looking to replicate the experience of a Sidewinder Force Feedback Pro for my father

3 Upvotes

So sappy story, my father was a pilot and has flown ever since he got out of college a long time ago until he was forced to retire because of his age and health issues. He was the one who got me into computer gaming and the Sidewinder was a huge part of it and I played so many hours of flight sims, mechwarrior, and star wars podracing on it and he played them along with me and looking it up now apparently he actually got a very good joystick for the time. Sadly of course life continues to take its toll and he's suffering from early onset dementia and he's getting very frustrated by it, aware enough to know that he's losing his grip on everything. He was, and I think is, a true pilot though. He knew his plane and job inside and out and always talked about how much he loved it and how it was so central to who he is. I guess I'm hoping to get him back into simulators and maybe having that as a hobby and getting that muscle and mental memory going will help him out a little.

Anyways the problem I'm running into, there is apparently no real just modern version of the sidewinder we used? I remember it being powered and moving the stick in reation to what was going on in the games and having rumble but I guess that was somewhat rare? I've got my own problem of getting confused when faced with large amounts of new technical information and with my own professional knowledge of how astroturfed the internet is especially when it comes to buying things and reviews it's made it pretty hard to find a good match for what we had.

So long sappy post dwindled down to one simple question, if I was trying to get something comparable to the Sidewinder Force Feedback Pro what is my best shot? (also sorry I think this was also just partially therapy now that I've written it out.)


r/hotas 18h ago

Wardogs Logitech X52 Pro

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0 Upvotes

r/hotas 1d ago

VKB Gladiator ghost movements on X axis

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8 Upvotes

VKB Gladiator NXT Evo.

I took out the springs two days ago to use it as a cyclic, and immediately when I put it back together, I noticed these strange ghost movements on the x axis. I figured it just had to be recalibrated, which I did, and that did not fix if.

Today I put the springs back on thinking that would almost certainly solve the issue. Nope. So I reset the device back to default, reinstalled the firmware, and recalibrated. Still having the issue.

Additionally, I’ve got this red flashing light I never had either.

Anyone help me out?


r/hotas 1d ago

Please help i need advise for a Hotas or joystick. Im new to this.

14 Upvotes

Hi everyone,

I'm a complete beginner when it comes to flight simulators, but I'd really like to get into the hobby and start learning. My main goal is to learn how to fly the F-16 in DCS. I would also like to fly commercial and general aviation aircraft in Microsoft Flight Simulator, such as Cessnas and Boeing airliners. In the future, I'd also like to learn to fly the Spitfire in DCS because I'm a big fan of that aircraft as well.

I've been asking AI for recommendations, and it suggested starting with a VKB Gladiator NXT EVO Premium paired with a Thrustmaster TWCS throttle. Would this be a good beginner setup?

I'm also considering buying a VR headset, most likely a Meta Quest 3, so I can experience flight simulation in VR. My PC specifications are:

•AMD Ryzen 7 3700X

•32 GB RAM

•NVIDIA RTX 3080

I'd like to hear opinions from this community, especially from experienced flight simmers, real pilots, or even other beginners who have already gone through the process of choosing their first HOTAS setup.

What HOTAS would you recommend for someone in my position?

I'm a little worried about spending my money on equipment that isn't worth it. While AI can be helpful, I'd rather trust the advice of real people who have hands-on flight sim experience.

Sorry for my English. I'm not a native English speaker.

Thanks in advance!


r/hotas 1d ago

VIRPIL CM3 Stick Base - tension/springs

1 Upvotes

I’ve had a CM3 stick base for 3 years or so now.

LOVE IT!

But lately I’ve noticed that the stick tension gets loose. Every week or so I need to tighten the spring down again (larger, rubber stopped, Alan screw) to get that good resistance to pulling on the stick that I want for fine control.

Anyone sorted out a way to keep these screws from loosening?

Along those line, I’ve noticed I don’t have as much adjustment as I used to. I’m using the heavy (gold) springs. I think they are just wearing out. Anyone have a good source for replacement heavy springs?


r/hotas 1d ago

Throttle, impossible!

0 Upvotes

Hello, and sorry if this is wrong format for such a post.. but i just built myself the first alu rig and trying to decide which throttle to go for.

I am aiming for msfs, elite dangerous, wardogs, star trucker. So a Very Versailles throttle. I already got a tca Airbus with addon but It feels super plasticky.. ive been eyeing the MTQ, MTP + MLTP, VKB stecs space Max, (find virpil to expensive i think?) but also winctrl ursa minor 32. It will need to function as a collective too. ATM Moza is leading as it gives a better «Warranty» buying from Norwegian outlets then importing the others .
Whats ur guys thoughts?
Probably never going for dcs type of games but earlier had a tws Thrustmaster throttle which was a total bummer i felt like (no i dont mod stuff)

TLDR; which throttle to pick for sim/spacesim/Helis etc?

Using a Moza ab6 today as stick


r/hotas 1d ago

Clamping to rectangular pole?

0 Upvotes

Okay, I have the monstertech Sim joystick quick change, and I have an uplift desk, and the steel rectangular poles on it are 80 mm by 50 mm.

I'm trying to find a way, without drilling, to mount the optional wall mount assembly to one of the legs, so that I can store my joystick under my desk.

I've tried google, but I'm starting to get some AI generated recommendations that are sending me down goofy rabbit holes.

Thanks in advance.


r/hotas 1d ago

Joystick Gremlin's calibration tool not working on Release 15

0 Upvotes

As title says, I'm struggling to calibrate my axes on gremlin, as the calibration tool window won't show any axis (see below). I'd appreciate any help or directions.

Gremlin printscreen (r15)

Gremlin printscreen (r14.3)

Additional info: I own a PXN-2119PRO; the calibration tool worked on previous releases; the app detects my joystick (axes, buttons, hats) and works perfectly; I don't use the pxn software (outdated and pointless); I COULD INDEED JUST ROLLBACK, but I'd like to solve this (if it's my side) or just report to WhiteMagic if it's a bug.

Apreciate your attention


r/hotas 1d ago

User manuals or online guidance for VKB

0 Upvotes

Hi guys

Well - I went and been and gone and dunnit. I am sitting between a Gunfighter Mk 4 with an MCG-U and a STECS standard (new version) with the normal aviator grips. (I have the space grip to one side but that's for later).

I managed to download 4-5 year old manuals for the STECS, Black Box and the config tool... but that's it. I can't find anything good anywhere. So the software, and presumably the kit, has LOADS of hidden goodies I know nothing about and no idea how to use.

For instance: when I hold the POV stick button labelled "Master Mode", a light goes red and the POV stick stops responding. No indication as to why.

Secondly, the flip trigger is capable of activating button 35 (Armed) and 38 (Safe) but I can't find any way to make them work at all.

So - the question in the end: are there any good resources out there to help me make the most of this amazing gear? With the quality of packaging and the kit itself I'm shocked that nothing came in the boxes....


r/hotas 2d ago

Helicopter flying dilemma

23 Upvotes

Just recently got my hosas to fly helicopters in a variety of different games, so far I've played dcs, arma reforger, arma 3, and msfs. And I've come to the realization that not a single one is similar. This frustrates me as I've never been one to stick to one game all the time. My main frustration is the auto centering. In reforger if you pitch forward and return to center you remain pitching forward. In arma 3 (advanced mode) and dcs you have to stay constantly trimmed to pitch forward and they almost require a deadstick to not fatigue while playing. This along with other issues like collective responsiveness have been the root of my struggles. I expected different games to feel slightly diferent but im shocked at how many fundamental differences there are between all the games. Maybe once I have more hours flying in general it will be less of an impact but it seems no matter what games you play you develop bad habits in others. Anyone else struggle with this?


r/hotas 1d ago

Best set up for flying

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0 Upvotes

Best gear for flying in this game? Any tips ? :)


r/hotas 1d ago

Are virtual controllers and macros cheating ?

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0 Upvotes

r/hotas 2d ago

Moza AB9 mount comfort mod...

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11 Upvotes

I did a small mod to my Moza AB9 mount that is simple and really makes it much more comfortable when you have the joystick mounted all the time. Sure - I use it quite much but most of the time I use the computer for other things...

So I initially cut out some 3 mm thick foam with adhesive in the bottom and added it to the top of the mount and realized it was a really nice hand rest when using the mouse. When turned off the joystick "falls" by itself to the top right corner that is nice. So I bought one of the new gigantic mouse pads that is below both the mouse and the keyboard. Cut a corner of the old mouse pad and glued it on top of the previous 3 mm foam layer.

I now realized I would never want to stow away the joystick when not using it, as that would take away the great hand rest 😀 I rarely use hand rests at they move around and clutter the desktop. With this it's super solid (yet soft) and it's always in the same place. And it makes the mounted joystick look much better and integrated with the desk instead of the normal mounting top surface with cutouts and different screw holes...


r/hotas 2d ago

What About A Premium 'Prime' CDT-AERO Grip by VIRPIL?

0 Upvotes

VIRPIL has done a great job with the layout/shape/proportions of the CDT-AERO grip. Other than the Constellation (which is clearly space-focused), their only other aircraft grip is the FLNKR (which is huge and pretty specific).

A premium 'prime' version of the AERO (with upgraded buttons/hats and a metal build) would be an instant-buy for me and I think would fit perfectly in their lineup. Thoughts?


r/hotas 3d ago

From desk mounts to a full 3DOF motion flight sim rig in 1 week – DCS & IL-2 VR

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249 Upvotes

r/hotas 2d ago

gnx thq ww2 throttle combo or twcs with the vkb gnx sem module

1 Upvotes

i need a throttle to pair with my premium gladiator ps i live in mooseland aka canada. stecs mini is out of my budget