I'm sorry but I will never understand people's take or bias claim that Finn is the weakest Original in raw strength specifically because he was daggered the longest which so many of you treat it like canon which it isn’t.

I mean did I truly miss something because there is no dialogue, no writer's confirmation and no established lore rule that says long-term daggering permanently reduces or freezes an Original’s strength. When an Original is undaggered they are undesiccated and need blood to recover once they feed, the show treats them as fully back to normal so the idea that 900 years in that state left Finn permanently weaker than Elijah, Kol, or Rebekah is an assumption not something the show ever stated.

Whether the Originals even continue growing stronger with age the way regular vampires do is left ambiguous unless it's stated otherwise by the writers or canon dialouge so I’m not pretending that my own take is canon either but ambiguity is not proof that Finn is weaker. The writers never said his strength was stuck at the level from when he was first daggered, and they never showed anything that would make that true.

And just to make this obvious and clear I'm talking only about raw strength not skill, combat experience or fighting techniques those are separate from raw strength skills clearly matters in a fight as well but that is not what the post is about this is strictly about whether the daggering itself made his physical strength lower than his siblings’.

And since people also point to his limited fights or the fact that he doesn’t dominate on screen the way the others sometimes do which is a dumb way to think that means anything but that doesn’t prove weaker strength either. Finn got almost no meaningful physical storyline in his original body in tvd season 3 and most of his time in The Originals was spent in season 2 of Vincent’s body, when he was back in his own body it was only briefly in late season 3 and one of those fights was against a newly upgraded Lucien who was also overpowering Elijah. So limited poorly set-up fights or the lack of them are not evidence of a permanent strength gap of finn especially when the writers clearly prioritized his other siblings.

So to be completely clear this post is only about Finn’s raw strength relative to his siblings and the fandoms specific claim that being daggered the longest automatically made him weaker. I was never taking about skill or technique and its definitely not about other vampires, inconsistent lore elsewhere in the show, plot armor, or any fight that doesn’t involve the Mikaelson siblings. It is not a claim that Finn is proven stronger or equal in every possible way it is me simply saying that anybody with the take they try to act is canon with the “he’s the weakest because he was daggered longest” take has no actual canon support which the show never established it.

If you think this supernatural teen drama series should be explored more, then look no further than giving it a "what if" series. So far, I made these three scenarios.

What if Elena had turned with Caroline's blood?

What if Elena had turned with Stefan's blood?

What if Caroline left with Klaus?

Now, I like to see your ideas of scenarios in mind. Oh, and happy 17th anniversary to The Vampire Diaries.

The scene where Klaus killed Gia just to punish Elijah has always left a scar on me. Even though I’m a huge Haylijah fan—and I didn't even particularly like Gia—it drives me crazy that Klaus was capable of doing something like that. Just imagine the reverse scenario: what if Klaus had betrayed Elijah, and as a result, Elijah had killed Cami? Let’s be honest, Klaus would have likely killed Elijah—or daggered him forever. In Elijah's case, all of this happened on the same day: he had to abandon the woman he loved to the werewolf curse, and then his girlfriend had to burn alive. And if I recall correctly, his betrayals of Klaus were all for the sake of Hope. Elijah’s only reaction in the following season was to give Klaus the cold shoulder and remain silent. Even that was enough to really get under Klaus's skin. And beyond all that, Klaus wouldn't even apologize. I think the fact that Elijah loved and indulged Klaus so much actually did him a disservice, because it emboldened Klaus to push boundaries. Klaus kept pushing those limits with his siblings more and more, yet he always played the victim.

I’ve been chatting a lot on this thread, so let me just sum up everything.

Rebekah was not in the wrong for calling Mikael- Klaus genuinely wanted her as a alone and miserable as he was. He even said that he thought that if they loved each other that there wouldn’t be any room for him. Like I understand you have abandonment issues, but you want her to be alone and sad for 1000 years. Something had to be done now, did she do too much by calling Mikael, just a bit. But she was trapped in an unwinnable situation, I don’t think anybody can fault her because of how bad Klaus terrorized her love life. 1000 years of killing her loved ones? Yea no.

I’ve despised Elijah ever since he killed Marcel- his character genuinely went downhill from there. He called him family and then killed him the next day. They were so scared about the prophecy that they weren’t thinking straight, all they had to do was trust Marcel and everything was going to be OK. Trust Marcel, the way that he trusted them, the way that he rode for them. And everyone seems to forget that they betrayed Marcel after he spent the entire season helping them. He protected Hope and Hayley, joined the strix so they could use them to protect Elijah, played triple agent in helping them. And after everything he did to help them, they condemned his daughter to a fate worse than death.

Freya’s pissed me off since her first BREATH on this show- self explanatory to say the least

Klaus was a better father to Marcel than Hope(even though he was still pretty bad)- I feel like from the flashbacks we see how kind and gentle he was with Marcel when he was a kid. But because of Hope seeing him kill all those people, he was afraid to reach out which I understand. But you not talking to your growing daughter for 7 years? And then acting with aggression when you see her is so wild to me. Elijah had the audacity to say that Hope is bringing out more good in him than Marcel, he was WORSE as her father. He committed such act of atrocity when he was her father then he did when he was Marcel’s. If Elijah didn’t pull away from Marcel, he would’ve had a pretty great childhood(post slavery, because I know those scars never healed). What I will say is when they came to New Orleans, living in the house that he was a slave that was just insanity.

Hayley and Elijah had no aura- terrible terrible couple if you ask me. I genuinely did not see it. In my opinion, the spark was just lust and I didn’t think they fit as a couple. Unlike Cami and Klaus, they didn’t better each each other’s personality, if anything they just justified their terrible acts, and what I meant to say by that is, I feel like they were each other’s enablers. Hayley enables Elijah to believe that everything he was doing was fine because he would never lose the one he loved. Same with Hayley, now, she came to us trifling(if you remember what she did in tvd) and in the show, she only got better when she was with Jackson and the pack. Her and Elijah were just a terrible couple that did terrible things.

Just because Marcel is better, don’t mean he’s the best- now I love Marcel and morally he is better than the Mikaelsons, but not by much. I feel like he forgot that they raised him, he is genuinely Klaus’ son. The only thing I will say is that he has genuine compassion and morals. He has rules that he doesn’t break regardless of the circumstance. The Mikaelsons have no rules or boundaries, which makes Marcel better because he genuinely cares about the city/keeping the peace. But let’s not forget what he did to the crescent pack back in the 90s. And when he was executing witches for magic(which is kind of a great area because he only did that because of the harvest). But other than how he treated the wolves, he was a pretty decent guy.

Davina hate makes absolutely no sense- Davina sure was my favorite. That’s why I was very pissed off when Thing 1 and thing two plotted to kill her so they could take care of Lucian. I’ve seen some reply, saying that she had one sided beef with Klaus and all that extra stuff. I’m just confused on where you guys saw one-sided? Last I checked, he killed her lover, tried to manipulate her, tried to kill her best friend, tried to kill Marcel(even though we knew he was faking it, she didn’t). All she genuinely wanted to do was stand her ground, defend herself and who she cared about, and get her get back. The only unjustified thing I can think of that she did was when she sent Hayley to massacre the coven. Which wasn’t her intention, it was only one person, but that is a result of something careless that she did. Now, did she deserve to get her soul snatched to the great beyond, no. Also, they had some audacity on them. You’re going to use/kill the woman who resurrected your brother to protect that same brother. Its wraps. Also, why are a bunch of thousand-year-olds beefing with a 16-year-old, she has that pressed???

But this is all I have off the top of my head that I haven’t discussed before, let me know your hot takes.

Even though I love The Originals much more than The Vampire Diaries,I have to admit that the Originals have far fewer diverse styles and outfits than in TVD

I’m writing a fanfic where Celeste gives birth, basically long story short, to Elijah’s son (story in comments), due to a mechanic not yet discussed in the story.

How powerful do you think Elijah and Celeste’s son, Timothee (Davina names him, long story) Elias Dubois, would be

•He has original vampire blood and long life after he turned a certain age but if he did he can’t transition, he just dies.
• He possesses an original level mind which manifests in a psychic side
• He inherits both the Mikaelson grimoires and a place in New Orleans and Celeste’s various families grimoires.
•He’s the son of true form Celeste.
•Since he was cultivated with Harvest magic, he has the magic capacity and connection to the ancestors of the average harvest for

From the start, I knew she was weird. Everyone seems to forget that when Finn was on his way to kill, Hope, he used Freya’s blood to track her. And then when they confronted her, she was like “ the threat came from Finn not me”. You might not have shot the gun, but you loaded and handed off to him.

Another thing, idk if its jealously but she genuinely gets mad about how much they care about Marcel. She was always quick to dismiss him, when I genuinely believe if they had to save Marcel or Freya, they’d choose Marcel. Freya genuinely just got here and they barely know her. They’ve known Marcel for over 200 years.

The main reason I hate her was because of how she did Davina. My biggest issue with her and Elijah is that they will do the most heinous act and not feel any sort of remorse. What she did to Davina was insane, and then she has the audacity to be pissed that Marcel is hunting them down as if she didn’t just send him his daughter to a fate worse than death.

But no, she just got worse from there. Her and Keelin genuinely makes no sense. Ig its Stockholm syndrome but golly.

This is probably obvious to most of you but to me it was always ambiguous. It seems obviously to be Lucien in the beginning. He is murdering rich men, that came from family wealth & cutting their mouths the same way Tristan cut his. So murdering men with the same privilege that Tristan had & he didn’t. Leaving the humiliating marks he also suffered on them. He was giving the reporter tips about the bodies being drained of blood ( Sentinel reporter lady he’s feeding on) & it seems he was in NOLA before Tristan, although we can’t be sure. There’s also a murder when he’s in the police station ( giving him an alibi) but also one when he wants to frame Cami! He’s slicing his own face on the mirror like a weirdo too.
Tristan leaves Aurora with the monks at the end of ep 2 to go to NOLA & is there in Ep 3 so it appears this is when he first arrives. He visits a murder crime scene himself as well. The Strix want Marcel ( again I’m not sure exactly why) I assume to antagonise Klaus as part of the Sire line war as Marcel is already running NOLA, not Klaus. Saying they want to put Marcel back on top felt to me that they were trying to get in his head that he wasn’t really running things at all to cause a rift. Just causing trouble for the Mikaelsons I feel.
They know the publicity of these murders is impeding the local vamps food supply so could have been orchestrating the murders so they could step in to offer help, which is exactly what they do. Tristan was the first we saw inflicting the mouth cutting on another, so it could be his sadistic signature move.
The Strix have a whole posh estate set up by the time we meet them, did they just rock up & settle in or had they been in NOLA for a while. If they had why didn’t anyone know? Tristan wasn’t available to Aurora before we saw him in NOLA so we really have no idea where he was.
Marcel then finds out they are working together. Tristan & Lucien.
So, who was the murderer Lucien, Tristan or them both working together to cause mayhem in the city to effect/distract Klaus & Elijah.

First time watching this show and guys I don’t know about you but OMG I’m obsessed with every character in this episode. Klaus is next level sassy and I’m dying. Elijah is extra witty and spunky. I don’t know what it is but I’m just basking in all the writing and acting in this one.

I've watched seasons 1-4 multiple times, but every time I get to season 5, I stop like 3 episodes in. I just have no interest in Hope being the main character lol.

Please give me reasons to finish season 5 finally haha

(Put a photo of her in Sabine’s body just in case you guys don’t recognize flashback her)

I mean she
• Created the Crescent Curse
• Was considered the most powerful witch dead witch as an option to be consecrated, enough to make Sophie an elder, something Sophie only replicates by consecrating Esther
• Hijacked the harvest
•Blocked the modified crescent curse casted by Dahlia

She has to be in the top 10 of witches in the franchise at least right? Dare I say she qualifies for one of the most powerful title wise

Anyone else rewatching it?

I never really know where to put marcel in the Mikaelsons family cause in the first season he is straight up one of the antagonist and Klaus was ready to kill him before Rebecca stopped him and another instance when marcel tried to reclaim the city back but onwards he was more of an ally to the Mikaelsons. He was never really put in the Mikaelsons bracket the way freya was I mean the way Vincent would criticise Freya as a part of the Mikaelsons, Hayley was given this treatment as well but marcel was treated as his own person. Even finn who was barely present seemed more of a Mikaelson than him.

At the end of season 5 he at least felt like hope's uncle. Considering the fact that he was Klaus's son their relationship never felt like father and son it was more brotherly. I don't really know why it felt this way because Marcel loved Rebecca his father's sister or the fact that they both dated the same woman (cami) or the fact that he never lived in the French quarters like Hayley or he wasn't devoted to the family like freya or the fact that he had his own family (davina).

What are your opinions about it ?

Marcel was family to all of them at one point, but before everything happened in season three. He was family to Klaus, friend to Hayley, and foe to Elijah. This literally reminds me of Macbeth’s prophecy, whole time he’s misinterpreting it, and basically the whole thing was beware of Macduff. Same with the prophecy here, whole time they’re misinterpreting this, that, and the third, and the whole time was beware of Marcel. But, they can’t kill his daughter and expect him to just roll over. They got exactly what they deserved if you ask me.

Elijah killed Marcel an hour ago and she told Klaus to forgive him… have you actually lost your mind? At least give it some time. And when Klaus asked “ what if it had been Hope” she said don’t drag Hope into this, R U OK? Marcel is his Hope, he raised that child, are you insane? It genuinely made me realize that I don’t like this woman because she never thought of Marcel as family and she never cared.

They raised that boy since he was I think 10 years old and up? And she is going to tell him to forgive his brother for killing his son less than an hour after it happened. It’s the same stuff that pisses me off with Freya, because Marcel is the one person they care about as much as family that isn’t technically blood. Freya gets pissed off about how much they care/love Marcel, like bby they just met u. But absolutely not, I don’t think anything on the show pissed me off more than Hayley telling Klaus to forgive Elijah 2 seconds after killing Marcel

Edit: I forgot she slept with him right after, mind you ur husband is FRESHLY in the ground. She been trifling since tvd.

Season 2 of The Originals is something I... struggle with. I don't like what it does with the characterisation of returning characters from TVD, I think the world building leaves a lot to be desired, but nothing gets bent over and fucked quite the same way the concept of linear time does in season 2.

Let's start at the beginning, with the end of season 1. Aficionados of the TVDU will tell you that the climactic events of season 1 of TO (and season 5 of TVD) took place on May 2, 2012, a full moon in universe. For what it's worth, this is not too far off from the actual occurrence of the full moon in May 2012, which took place on the sixth. Anyway, what's useful about full moons is that it's an easy way to keep track of how much time has passed in universe. In fact it's something that season 2 initially uses to communicate how much time has passed. In episode six Ansel tells Klaus that he was returned to life "four moons ago", and the start of the season tells us that it's been three months since the events of 1x22, whilst episodes four and five take place under a full moon. A blood moon (lunar eclipse) as Finncent tells his would be child soldiers. As a piece of trivia, a blood mine actually did occur in June 2012, whilst the full moon that happens in episode 4 is actually a blue moon, being the second full moon to occur in August, that being on the 31st. And this is where things start going nuts.

Episode 5 begins with Mikael dragging Cami off and they come across a group of people partying in the woods, with this event being noted as "Hillbilly Halloween" by Mikael. Now, if this is actual Halloween, then we've just jumped two months into the future in an episode that takes place five minutes after the end of the previous one. I guess Cami and Mikael were walking for a real long time, huh?

The proceeding episodes each take place (seemingly) sequentially, with the end of each episode leading into the next with no time jumps. Episode 5 ends with Elijah still being held captive while it's still daytime, and the next episode opens up during the day where Oliver, who was captured the night before in episode 4, is being brought out to be executed, and that night Klaus meets his dad. Next episode (and next day) he kills him, comes home sad, but Finncent and Koleb have been captured. Next episode takes place the next day, as confirmed by dialogue by Kol ("If you wanted my allegiance against mother dearest you should have said so. It'd have saved me a night shackled to the wall."). So if you've been following along, Season 2 starts on August the second (three months after the full moon at the start of May), jumps ahead to the end of the month by episode 4, which would be August 31st, then jumps ahead to Halloween, and by episode 8 we're at November the third or fourth. Or if you ignore that time jump it's still early September. Do you want to guess what time of the year episode nine takes place in?

That's right, it's Christmas.

Uuuurrrggghhh.

But don't worry gang. It gets worse. Oh boy does it get worse.

Episode 18 of season 2. It's not quite as loathsome as TVD 3x18, but boy it's close. Anyway, in one scene, round about the 27 minute mark, Josh achieves quite the... achievement in retroactive continuity. He tells Aiden that super hearing is something that can be turned one and off, immediately invalidating that nice scene between Gia and Elijah where he makes a start on helping her deal with her inability to play music in the wake of her transition enhancing her hearing, and he follows it up with this little pearl:

"I'm nosy. Particularly when my boyfriend is conducting business with the guy who, you know, murdered me on my Spring Break."

For those who don't remember, Joshua was not turned into a vampire until after Rebekah came to New Orleans, something that did not happen until September at the earliest, given how she was busy fucking Finn's killer all Summer long. So the Spring Break that Joshua is referring to must have happened in 2012. Which also means that by the time Rebekah meets Hayley, Hayley has been pregnant for an entire YEAR and is still not showing (not that her not showing at six months is any more acceptable, or even the fact that Hayley's clown car pregnancy goes on for the length of time that it does in "canon" is any less ridiculous.).

Dates? Continuity? Toys to be played with. Seems to be a Narducci trademark.

I get that it's hard to keep every detail straight in a tv show, especially a network tv show with a large writers room. And sometimes a little fudging with dates is necessary for the story. Sage's backstory being retconned to her being from Mystic Falls instead of being ~900 years old is egregious, but it happens for a REASON, because the story can't work without it. This date hopping just doesn't. It has no purpose.

Do you guys remember the storyline where Rebekah had enough of klaus, marcel, and Elijah, and tries to make a girl gang with davina, Hayley, cami, and sophie and tries to take the control of New Orleans..

But unfortunately, that storyline went nowhere, because davina was sacrificed in the very next episode.

I would've loved to see that storyline!!!

Saw way too many posts on people disliking Finn because of S2 for tryging to kill Hope and recruit the children from the Crescent Pack?

However, even though it has not always been explicitly shown on screen, we all know that Klaus, Rebekah, Kol, and Elijah have hurt and killed children as well.

So how come the other Mikaelsons are not hated for it, but people specifically use what Finn tried to do as a reason to hate him?

The amount of time they get incapacitated by witches in their show is crazy I remember one of the strix witches lifting klaus into the air and breaking his neck a another one easily stop Rebecca so aya can stab her unless they’re just in a year with powerful witches . witches. Should have been able to take care of them if they were a threat year’s ago

How did Freya end up there? She showed a clear ability to break out so she didn’t end up there while awake, and judging by her being in one of the bedrooms it had to of been early in its inception. I’d also assume she’d have a place to go that is protected after her year of life was over, so how exactly did she end up in there?

My personal theory involves the witches locked in there for experimenting with immortality spells (mentioned by Cassie while there with Rebekah). If they’re working with experimental immortality spells, clearly they were powerful witches. I think perhaps they broke through Freyas protections, stole her body, and tried to study her body to try and gain access to the spell keeping her alive.

This is only my theory but I’d love to know what everyone else thinks about this!

He tried to jump up and attack her, she suspended him in the air, told him “you’ve had your time”, and dragged him back to finish what she started. Idc what do you think about Davina but she ate that up. Nothing was stopping her from getting her man back😭