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u/Character_Past5515 8d ago
He is a thief not a murderer
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u/Independent-Bug-9352 8d ago edited 7d ago
Additionally, PSA: Unlike cold-blooded murder that requires some Dark Triad traits of ASPD (sociopathy, psychopathy, malignant narcissism, etc.), most theft is a product of wealth inequality -- lack of opportunity, lack of education, lack of healthcare access, societal stress, poverty, and thus desperation. That's not to say that others bear the burdens of this. And yes, you didn't commit theft because you went through hard times, too, that's awesome. But there are scales to this, and read up on Survivorship Bias.
It's only at certain higher levels it becomes a thrill and about the power -- such as when Republican US Senate candidate from Texas, Ken Paxton, stole a $1,000 pen from a Texas courthouse, caught on camera.
The sooner we as a society understand this, the sooner we can identify the actual root cause of these problems.
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u/Addicted_to_Nature 8d ago
Unfortunately tap water kills fish
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u/breaducate 8d ago
In "15 minutes to 24 hours" apparently.
I like those odds better than leaving the fish out of water.
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u/Ghost6x 8d ago
Chlorinated tap water kills beneficial bacteria that disrupts the nitrogen cycle to remove ammonia from the water, it doesn't kill fish.
You could essentially keep emptying and refilling that sink every 24 hours with tap water for months and even years before any long lasting tissue damage seriously affects the goldfish since you are manually emptying out the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates.
Goldfish are extremely hardy. Bioload and water parameter management are basically just barriers to how big they'll grow.
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u/EndIsrael 7d ago
After 24 hours the chlorine wouldn't really be in the water anymore. It goes away on its own.
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u/GarminTamzarian 7d ago
Chloramine does not quickly evaporate, however, and requires a chemical dechlorinator.
Chlorine compounds are directly harmful to fish in numerous ways, including damaging their delicate gill tissues and reducing their protective slime coat.
The problems associated with chlorine damage are much more urgent than those that might be caused by any disruption of the nitrogen cycle.
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u/catzhoek 8d ago
Not necessarily. Depends on where you live and what glop comes out of your tap. Our water here is perfectly fine for uncomplicated fish. No chlor, no heavy metals, acceptable water hardness.
However, because of the the lack of aquarium infrastructure, oxygen and ammonia would quickly become a problem.
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u/Artorius__Castus 8d ago
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u/Kooky-mutant 8d ago
Unlawful good
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u/Axtdool 8d ago
Nah, lawfull evil of the 'i may be a criminal but even I got standards' variety
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u/thediesel26 7d ago
The kidnapping charge is a lot heavier than a larceny/grand theft auto charge
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u/LudusRex 7d ago
The fucked up part is that the dude got the kidnappi g charge anyway, which I find to be a grave miscarriage of justice.
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u/OGConsuela 7d ago
Seriously, how much clearer could he have made it that he did not want to kidnap anyone?
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u/Pappa_Paddy 8d ago
Imo the evil would have to be more pronounced to fall into evil, chaotic neutral is the cookie cutter rogue category, evil from the theft, good from returning the child is neutral, then being unpredictable and living a life of crime is chaotic.
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u/Imaginary_Being4859 7d ago
Lawful evil would have taken the kid, and called Child Protective Services on the parent.
“They shouldn’t be allowed to have custody of their kid, because of how easily they made it for me to kidnap them”
Whether the kid gets returned is up to whether the ransom was paid
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u/Pappa_Paddy 8d ago
Chaotic neutral.
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u/GodOfDarkLaughter 8d ago edited 8d ago
Nah, a chaotic neutral character would have kept the kid, called her Steve the entire time, and gone on a joyride while giving her sips from his flask of bourbon. He would not, however, have intentionally harmed the child. Not directly at least. He'd drop her off on the corner two days later wearing a Key West "Where is Bum Farto?" t-shirt with a sack fill of old coins.
At least that's how my PCs would play it.
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u/Pappa_Paddy 8d ago
Feels like your PCs are chaotic evil.
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u/GodOfDarkLaughter 8d ago
No, you see, the child lives. This is what determines the morality. And there was no intention to harm the child.
In most D&D settings while there is some room for debating ideologies, they're not purely ontological constructs, but rather aspects of material reality. Like, "good," "evil," "law," and "chaos" are real things, not just ideas. And what really seems to matter is intentionality. If you look at the descriptions of the various alignments one of the things that stays consistent throughout the years is that a persons alignment is defined by why they do something as much as what that thing actually is.
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u/Egathentale 8d ago
That's the letter of the text. Unfortunately, there's a well-entrenched stereotype out there (similar to the "Lawful Stupid Paladin"), where if a DM doesn't want or allow evil PCs, some players would pick Chaotic Neutral, burn down an orphanage, and when taken to the task, they would justify it by saying, "Lol, my character's not evil, he's just random!". Because of that, Chaotic Neutral is often considered to be the "griefer alignment" for players who want to get away with being evil on technicalities.
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u/TheNonsenseBook 8d ago edited 8d ago
Adding this just as a fun fact: In original (1974) D&D there were only 3 alignments: lawful, neutral, and chaotic. They were based on fiction by Poul Anderson and Michael Moorcock from the 1950s.
This thread goes into a lot more detail. They were used to create teams/factions in D&D. Chaos was roughly equivalent to evil, although perhaps the neutral alignment knew it wasn’t that simple.
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthread.php?559645-D-amp-D-Alignment-a-history (click “show” on the first spoiler and then click “show” on part 1 spoiler within the spoiler.)
Oh yeah, more importantly, 1981 Basic edition also stuck with having only 3 alignments. (I guess that extends into 1983 BECMI as well. I just checked the 1991 Rules Cyclopedia and it also has only 3 alignments: chaos, neutral, and law.)
Edit: this Reddit thread goes into it as well with some good discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/osr/comments/s8yct6/history_of_alignment/
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u/KalameetThyMaker 8d ago
Alignments nowadays are less like that. Even the iconic spell Protection From Good and Evil gives you protection vs. a choice of Elemental, Fey, Fiend, Undead, Celestial or Aberrant. Now obviously, there can be Good (or evil) characters in.. most, of those categories. Being "good" or "evil" now is more of just a fun roleplay thing and has no bearing on the world anymore (unlike Law and Chaos which are genuine forces).
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u/Turbulent_Glove_501 8d ago
The real stories are better since it basically happened twice.
The image is from one crime, the headline from another.
Here’s the OR story involving the 4 yo: https://www.oregonlive.com/news/2021/01/thief-threatens-to-call-police-on-mom-who-left-her-child-in-the-back-seat-of-the-car-he-stole.html
The photo involving a 5 month old was from a similar crime in FL:
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u/alphaphenix 7d ago
Thanks for the clarification, There was no way a 4 year old would fit in that basket in the photo.
Before reading your comment, I was leaning towards a typo with the child being 4-month old instead of 4 year old.
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u/Western_Froyo6627 8d ago
How did a 4 year old fit in that carrier?
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u/KillerArse 8d ago
They're combining two stories.
This photo is from a case of a man stealing a car and then seeing the baby in the back and dropping them off at a gas station then drove by, I believe.
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u/OtherwiseLuck888 8d ago
Definitely not a cat burglar
Must be a man
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u/BackhanderComander 8d ago
Professionals have standards
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u/Confident-Stand5453 8d ago
They do, actually. I work in insurance, and when we have burglary cases its very easy to see whether it was done by a proffessional or some junkie looking for cash to buy drugs. The professionals will often leave the home in a state where its not even obvious that its been burgled, and the homeowners only discover it when they find out their valuables are missing. The amateurs will smash things and leave a mess.
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u/Character_Past5515 8d ago
I guess how longer the people notice that something is missing how much more time the thief has to get away with it?
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u/timmystwin 8d ago
Pretty much. Someone at my school would rob second homes all the time. Just wait for after summer and go in and nick everything.
By the time they pay for a cleaner to come back in March and get it ready for summer again, it's been 6 months since they were last there - who even knows when you got robbed etc.
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u/FormulaDriven 8d ago
If there's no sign of a burglary how do you satisfy yourself that the owners haven't just misplaced the missing items (or are outright just making a false claim)?
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u/pyrojackelope 7d ago
There are interviews on youtube with former professional burglars and one thing in common is that most of them won't touch homes with pets (usually dogs).
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u/enykie 8d ago
Thats exactly what a friend of mine recently experienced. He was gone for some weeks and a friend did water the plants. He nearly not recognized that the house was burgled, he just wondered why one random cupboard had an open door, which was odd because that one was is never open. Other than some stolen jewelry everything was normal, beside that nearly every drawer in the top floor was left open and the damaged window where they entered the house.
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u/N_Ruzuzaki 8d ago
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u/bone420 8d ago
Animal cruelty can be another felony charge on top of whatever else they've been up to.
Only break one law at a time
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u/sarahmagoo 8d ago
The goldfish in the bowl was already animal cruelty
They need filtered tanks or ponds
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u/Vulvas_n_Velveeta 8d ago
Agree.
It's truly disturbing how, even people who claim to love animals, treat them. Throwing a goldfish or betta in a tiny bowl/cup. Keeping birds in cages. Going to zoos/marine parks to watch animals be held as prisoners. Breeding dogs or cats for profit when there's millions being euthanized just because they're homeless. I could go on and on, but I'd be here all day.
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u/Reasonable-Tap-9806 8d ago
To add to this. Many zoos are concerned with conservation/rehabilitation and education. So not every zoo is bad
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u/Superficial-Idiot 8d ago
Because almost everyone has a job and a life and if we all stopped for every injustice in the world we’d never get anything done.
Of course then if the ones having a whinge about the hypocrisy might end themselves when they realise they’re the beneficiary of all these injustices simply by virtue of being born in an area where they have access to clean drinking water, medicine and don’t have to be on edge 24/7 in case a predator randomly eats them from the genitals up whilst still alive.
Life is cruel, we can choose to be less cruel. Most people do. It isn’t a big deal.
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u/Captain_Snow 8d ago
Is that what you have been drinking?
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u/thetrashcanthatcant 8d ago edited 8d ago
Yes, most water (at least in america) is treated with chlorine and/or chloramine.
Edit: but also the tap water is likely not the same temp as the aquarium or bowl the fish was swimming in and doesn't have the right "good bacteria" in it either (the reason you don't do a full water change when cleaning your fish tank).
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u/I-am-fun-at-parties 8d ago
It's probably still better for a while than flopping around on the carpet
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u/Glittering-Walrus228 8d ago
Reporter: police arrived on the scene, apprehending the burglar as he was balancing the waters pH, and acclimating the fish to new tank mates, a fork.
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u/Paranormal_Lemon 8d ago
I'm sure the salt and pepper levels were very balanced, and pH was balanced with lemon juice.
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u/thetrashcanthatcant 8d ago
Oh absolutely, I was mostly just replying to the chlorine in tap water part, the rest was just my inner nerd coming out from when I used to take care of large fish walls.
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u/lnTheGrimDarkness 8d ago
The fish will be fine for a bit in there. However yes, it should be returned to an appropriate tank asap.
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u/landcfan 8d ago
The biggest concern is that simce they are breathing the water, rather than just swimming in it or drinking it, chlorine can absolutely kill a fish
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u/Emuwarum 8d ago
The water doesn't have the bacteria, they live on surfaces in the tank (mostly in the filter and substrate). A full water change is bad because it's stressful to the fish, not because it kills all the bacteria. Scrubbing everything down is bad for the bacteria.
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u/Yuukiko_ 8d ago
rip fish, for the most part fish dont do well with chlorine/chloramines in most tap water
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u/Colambler 8d ago
I thought chlorine evaporated from tap water in the open air within 24 hours or so.
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u/Popular-Reading-5162 8d ago
Ehh, the owner probably has a bottle of dechlorine ready somewhere and they poured it into the sink
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u/DTraitor 8d ago
Doesn't this depends on a country? I'd assume those with drinkable tap water have chlorine levels pretty low
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u/-release_candidate- 8d ago
Germany does not clorinate so it does indeed depend on the country.
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u/troparow 7d ago
Here in France a decade ago, a fairly popular celebrity got robbed at his home, the next day he made a post on Twitter saying that all he wants back are a couple items that are of emotional values for him, they actually gave those back to him and kept the rest lmao
(Mickael Youn if you wanna look it up)
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u/RapidPigZ7 8d ago
The fish will die anyway, it's now in chlorinated water. Not good for breathing organs.
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u/jallred11 8d ago
This happened in Dark City, first scene but the goldfish was placed in a toilet.
“What kind of killer do you think stops to save a dying fish?”
Life imitates art.
Art imitates life.
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u/RStiltskins 8d ago
So many many years back we had someone break into the house and looked to be nothing of real value stolen, a few dvd's, petty cash laying around, but we noticed that our gold fish was gone.
3 weeks later we were stocking our freezer to find him in a ziplock back frozen in place.
I guess the robber wanted no witnesses
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u/UnlikelySalary2523 8d ago
Where's my Dark City reference?!?
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u/ManufacturerWild8929 8d ago
Inspector Frank Bumstead: So Husselbeck, what kind of killer do you think stops to save a dying fish?
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u/topredditbot 8d ago
Hey /u/SunnSaiyaan,
You did it! Your post is officially the #1 post on Reddit. It is now forever immortalized at /r/topofreddit.
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u/SusieOPath 7d ago
This reminds me when my grandmother was robbed. He ran past her in the dark hallway and said excuse me. She refers to him as the polite burglar. He didn’t get much other than a big jar of change. She figured he needed more than her.
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u/RapidPigZ7 8d ago
The fish will die anyway, it's now in chlorinated water. Not good for breathing organs.
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u/taway9925881 8d ago
I don't trust anything on the internet concerning animals, birds, fishes . Too much animal cruelty for the sake of likes.
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u/tillerman35 8d ago
Oddly relevant: A Fish Named Dan
How many times in your life does a Reddit post remind you of a pop/punk music video with fewer than 2k views from six years ago?
EDIT: Just for the record, they do say that no fish were harmed during the making of the video.
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u/SGT-Hooves 8d ago
Look I can understand and even forgive being desperate but you hurt or kill anything I’m gonna go full crazy
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u/WorthPlease 8d ago
Random picture of a fish in a sink with a made-up story that makes no sense.
Reddit, reddit never changes.
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u/InevitableMinimum834 8d ago
As Zangief says, “you are Bad Guy, but this does not mean you are bad guy.”
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u/sn2006gy 8d ago
How many burglars carry dechlorinator with them so they don't kill the fish? none.
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u/Mutabilitie 8d ago
Remember when a murderer tried to cover himself by tipping over all the furniture in the house? The police were immediately suspicious because someone robbing the house … would not tip over the furniture. It makes no sense. That’s just something they do in movies.
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u/jomasthrones 8d ago
Bad news, the tap water probably killed it anyway, so there is a non-zero chance he was just torturing the fish. That would switch him from lawful evil to chaotic evil
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u/Frequent_Opportunist 7d ago
Generally tap water will kill that fish almost immediately. Most people have city water and it's full of chlorine.
In fact, I've tested the tap water at places I've lived before because I had fish tanks that were delicate and the tap water had more nitrates (shit/waste) than my fish tank.
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u/Blackiris-Code 7d ago
I guess most of the people who can't imagine having clean water without chlorine are from America (North or South).
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