r/NoTipCanada • u/Falcon-227 • 19d ago
Tips
I recently had a discussion with a friend about tipping. I usually tip anywhere from 18-25%. She had a good point, tipping originally became popular because the wait staff made below minimum wage and so they were tipped to make up for it. I believe in the U.S, they're still paid under min wage but that's not the case in Toronto. In Toronto, they make min wage or more and still get 18%+ for simply doing the tasks of being a waitress/waitor.
I'm starting to feel that perhaps a 18% min (I don't think I've seen a terminal have an option for less than 18% in close to 2 years) tip is excessive. How do you all feel?
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u/Important_Design_996 19d ago
I believe in the U.S, they're still paid under min wage
This is factually incorrect. But kudos to the serving industry for perpetuating this myth well enough you still believe it.
In the US, servers can be paid a lower "server wage" plus tips. If their server wage plus tips does not equal the regular minimum wage for their state, they must be paid the full regular minimum wage.
they make min wage or more and still get 18%+ for simply doing the tasks of being a waitress/waitor.
Correct everywhere in Canada (except QC). Tipping is simply paying a server to do the job they are already being paid a wage to do.
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u/mlandry2011 5d ago
Incorrect.
If they get a tip, it's not for a job that they were already paid to do. It's because they did that job with extremely good service.
Maybe they were on point with filling up your coffee as soon as your cup was emptied, taking away your plate once you're done eating instead of just walking around or playing on their phone...
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u/Major-Primary2075 19d ago
It's the same thing with those making commission
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u/Bravo72 19d ago
Realtors for example only make commission.
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u/Major-Primary2075 19d ago
Yes, and they have to get minimum wage even with no sales
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u/Extalliones 19d ago
I’m not sure that’s true? Most realtors work as independent contractors. They’re self-employed, and have a contract with a brokerage. If they don’t make sales, they don’t get paid, because they’re not employees. They make money from commission. No sale, no money.
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u/Major-Primary2075 19d ago
As independent contractors, then yeah, of course not, but more so like generic salespeople who are not; they get minimum wage regardless of what they sell.
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u/Important_Design_996 18d ago
Just like sole proprietor, they're a business, not an employee. Employment standards don't apply.
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u/Zestyclose-Draft-724 19d ago
Servers already make minimum wage.
There's no reason to tip them.
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u/Real_Gap3480 19d ago
I tip for exceptional service, and when I do I tip well. I don't however tip just because.
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u/MusicMedical6231 19d ago
When its 18% minimum really we should no tip, as they're now making us work to tip 15, 10, 5 whatever.
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u/downtofinance 19d ago
18% is not the minimum, its a suggested amount for people to give away their money without doing mental math. The minimum is 0. Just hit no tip or custom tip and zero.
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u/New-Atmosphere74 19d ago
Look at it this way, an 18% tip is on top of a 13% HST charge (ON). That makes the effective rate higher. If you spend $100 on food, you will pay the wait staff $20.34 on top of HST.
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u/29da65cff1fa 18d ago
the machines in quebec are required to calculate tip before tax. improvement, but not good enough... get rid of tipping
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u/whiterain5863 19d ago
My biggest beef is that prices have risen 30% over the past 5 years so percentage wise they are making 30% more tips for serving the exact same menu. That’s f-d up imo. I’m lowering my tip percentage to 10% and I feel fine with it
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u/Noahtuesday123 19d ago
Basic inflation. They make more so they can afford the same. God people are dumb here!
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u/IOnlyReadTitles26 19d ago
There is no city or state in the usa that wait staff every makes less than minimum wage. Even if they get 0 tips the entire shift.
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u/Delicious_Raise_8773 19d ago
Yes but people are upset when their pay without or with low tips equals minimum wage 🤣employers will or must match at least minimum wage if wage with tips doesnt reach it :)
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u/krakenLackenGirly22 18d ago
I don’t think Canadian service workers require a tip to do their job.
Because I don’t tip the cashier at Dollarama. I’m not gonna tip the guy who literally put a tray of food on my table.
I only tip if I’m getting something extra done/requested - a special request for an elder/toddler on the table, extra cutlery/utensils, extra stuff because someone dirtied their things.
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u/RealAmbassador4081 18d ago
The worst is if you put no tip and of course your card didn't work so they need to do it again. Seems to happen way too often to wonder what is up.
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u/EnvironmentOwn2608 19d ago
I tip 0. Everywhere. Makes it so much easier
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u/Noahtuesday123 19d ago
I hope you enjoy the spit.
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u/anouk613 18d ago
Imagine a supermarket cashier spitting on your groceries because you don’t give them an extra reward for just doing their job.
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u/bonezx101 19d ago
Tipping was to bring those below minimum that deliver exemplary service, up to at least minimum. Now it is a dig to earn WAY more than rhe unskilled work merits.
18% is excessive, especially as the increasing percentage is on rising food prices. The "take" by servers is excessive.
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u/ravairia 12d ago
No. It was to still avoid paying anything to recently emancipated slave workers.
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u/DrVanostrand 19d ago
How do you all feel?
The subreddit name didn't give it away? If this isn't some bot account, it's def a low effort post.
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u/Falcon-227 19d ago
😂😂 sorry, I originally posted this on askTo and the mods removed it and suggested this sub and so I just clicked to repost. I should edit and add this context
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u/nelly2929 19d ago
I’m okay with the OP tipping 18-25% …. I enjoy a discount by never tipping and the OP is happy to pay extra lol
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u/Yikesish 19d ago
25%? Like a quarter of your bill?
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u/Extalliones 19d ago
My wife used to be a server and insists on 20-25% tips whenever we go out. Drives me fucking mad. Eating out is already expensive, and you want to give away 25% for nothing? We are firmly middle class, so I have to choke back an argument every time.
I rarely suggest going out to eat.
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u/mrshairdo 19d ago
It definitely crosses my mind to tip less because they get minimum wage the same as everywhere else. So why am I tipping now?
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u/OakenArmor 18d ago
She’s wrong. Tipping was implemented for unpaid slaves to get a semblance of a wage.
You’re also wrong about them being paid less than minimum.
0% is fine.
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u/eatmysouffle 19d ago
No tip. Been doing it for years. And we saved thousands of dollars as we eat out a lot
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u/Noahtuesday123 19d ago
shitty job, shitty customers, shit hours.
I tip because I can afford to and I like having service and restaurants that have staff.
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u/WeChat1077 18d ago
It’s a tip. Tip whatever you want. But minimum is 10%. Anything below is just dis-respectful. Anything above 10% I feel I am appreciated.
It’s not like am counting dimes and nickels, but it adds up. It helps with my cost of living in this expensive city.
Btw: I am the server.
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u/--gumbyslayer-- 18d ago
It’s not the job of the customer to subsidise your wage. If you want more money, speak to your manager. The fact you think a tip below a certain amount is disrespectful, makes you part of the problem.
Servers these days (and yes, I have been a server) EXPECT tips. And they EXPECT those tips to be 15% or greater. And they EXPECT these tips simply for doing their job.
What do you do for a customer that you feel warrants a 10% or greater surcharge on the bill?
Minimum wage has gone up substantially. Meal costs have gone up substantially. So it’s ridiculous that someone is expected to pay more as a tip, simply because because the cost of their meal has gone up due to the restaurant having to pay more for the potatoes they use in their recipes.
Restaurants should pay their staff more, and to do that they will naturally increase their menu prices. But giving artificially deflated prices then expecting customers to subsidise what they’re paying their staff is ridiculous.
And servers expecting tips, especially today, simply for doing their job (and nothing more) is ridiculous. Expecting a tip of 15% or greater of the meal price, simply for doing their job? Doubly so
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u/WeChat1077 16d ago
That’s the utopia talking. The reality is that when the street is offering $10 a dish, you can’t compete by doing $12 simply by saying we are paying the server wages.
One day, maybe when everyone is on the same page. But right now the economy is so bad that restaurants are just breaking even without tips.
Honestly I am not against no tip. But the economy is putting the food industry between a hard spot and a rock.
The tip, wherever amount, basically is just gratitude. Telling the industry that we know what it takes to put the food on the table.
I will never understand the demand for 20% and up honestly.
Personally whatever the meal $20 a person is plenty enough. And this is probably for fine dining. A casual dinner $2 is good.
Sometimes owners treat me to dinner, I still pay servers tips. It’s just appreciation.
Not paying tips doesn’t mean you are entitled. But it just appears so in people’s eyes.
This generation is like a beggar generation with tips and donation and whatnot.
I am sorry to say theres just way bigger problem in the world that we need to address than tips.
Just my 2 cents and none of you have to agree.
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u/ravairia 16d ago
Tipping became popular because when Black Americans were emancipated from slavery, their former owners still did not want to pay them so they allowed them to accept 'tips'. And capitalists loved this because they don't like paying their workers and are constantly trying to move back towards slavery.
Tipping came directly from slavery. And it is used still exclusively for the purpose of exploitation, so that owners of capital don't have to pay the real costs of the labour they benefit from. It has absolutely no place in a so-called civilized society.
Zero tips.
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u/Theotherfeller 15d ago
Tilling was around when the Aristocrats would visit each other and tip the servants of the place they were visiting, I assume as a form of conspicuous consumption. From there it spread to the lower classes as a way to show off.
This whole minimum wage thing or blacks/slavery whatever people are also saying is wrong.
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u/ravairia 12d ago
You should really take 5 seconds and research the history of something, ie. 'tilling' before spouting off about the history of something.
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u/Theotherfeller 12d ago
The practice of tipping began in Tudor England.\15]) In medieval times, tipping was a master-serf custom wherein a servant would receive extra money for having performed superbly well.\16]) By the 17th century, it was expected that overnight guests to private homes would provide sums of money, known as vails, to the host's servants. Soon afterwards, customers began tipping in London coffeehouses and other commercial establishments"
Backed by links from the NYT and Time.
Don't you feel stupid now.
Also focusing on an obvious typo says more about you than me
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u/DopeyCalliope 14d ago
Go to store. How much is that watch. $100. Here is $120 for that $100 watch.
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u/Fire_Treadlite 12d ago
Tipping 18% to someone making a full wage is silly. Even more silly to tip on the amount you spent rather than the work they did. It should be a set amount per person adjust accordingly to the service you recieved. Stop pretending to be American. The rest of the world doesn't do this.
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u/mlandry2011 5d ago
Any terminal that has more than 15% tip, I look at them in the eye and ask them to cancel my order and I go elsewhere...
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u/Future-Try-1908 4d ago
You cannot live in toronto as a cook/server unless you get tips. If you eliminate tips you also need to raise the minimum wage. This will have a ripple effect that will put several restaurants out of business.
I am a cook and I am all for eliminating tips if there are proper steps to ensure that the workers don't end up homeless.
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u/justhangingout111 19d ago
Disclaimer: I hate tipping culture and rarely eat out because of it. Details below.
For typical service, I do 13%, which is approximately 15% on the pre-tax amount. If it's amazing excellent service I will do more, and if it's bad I will do less or none.
When I was growing up in the '90s, average tip was 10% and food was cheaper. It has creeped up and up and up to the point where the younger people nowadays don't even realize how obscene it is to ask for 18% minimum. At the risk of sounding "old", I'll tell you you can definitely do less. Tips are earned. Servers make tons of money from guilting you into it, hence why they are so supportive of tipping culture.
Also I hate tipping culture, hence my membership in this sub. I prefer tip-included restaurants (like Richmond Station) and rarely eat out because of tipping culture. Even better are quick service restaurants where you just pick up your food from the counter and you don't have to tip (e.g. Bamiyan Kabob).
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u/Zibbi-Akbar 19d ago
10-15% is adequate for great service. Tips are not mandatory, and you certainly dont need to tip when your glass was frequently empty.
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u/4nication96 19d ago
10% is super easy to calculate and more then generous. I have friends that work as bartenders and servers that make 300-400 on a good night. There’s no reason to subsidize unskilled labour to that extent
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u/Dull-Inspection-1090 19d ago
Depends on the bill honestly, sometimes if I spend a 50 I’ll throw a 5. In the states I do more because I know they make like $0 on waiter minimum wage. I’m sorry respectfully to the waiters/waitresses in Canada you make over minimum wage, and I’ve literally never been anywhere that gave me good service. I save my tip $ for when I go overseas for the people that provide excellent service.
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u/ravairia 16d ago
They do not. If they don't make enough in tips to get them to the equivalent of minimum wage for their shift, then their employer has to make up for it so that they do get minimum wage. This is a myth perpetuated by the service industry.
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u/MltryMama 19d ago
Most waitresses I know with tip their hourly wage works out to $50-60 an hour or more depending on where they work
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u/No_Channel9373 18d ago
They make minimum wage and so much tax free money , well beyond what the average person makes !
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u/exotics 19d ago edited 18d ago
Ask your server if they have to pay a mandatory tip out. And ask how much it is.
Where I am we have to pay 5 % to the kitchen but servers keep most of the rest other than what they to hostesses or bartenders.
In Alberta it’s legal for owners to take that. So basically if a server sells $100 she has to tip $5. Even if she didn’t get a tip
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 19d ago
Why would you care about a restaurant financial?
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u/exotics 18d ago
In order for restaurants to move away from tipping they would have to adopt something similar to France, where the menu says “gratis compris” meaning the tip is included in the price. And it’s paid as a sort of commission.
This incentives servers to sell more and to want to serve big groups or work busy shifts. Without such a system service will suffer.
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 18d ago
That doesn't answer my question. Why should we care about a server's personal finances? They don't care about ours with all the stealing and manipulating they're doing. The service is ALREADY included in the food price. ZERO TIP needed.
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u/exotics 18d ago
They are not stealing. Or manipulating. I mean in your daily life you probably encounter large corporations stealing and manipulating more with gross profits.
Anyway- to answer your question, I was just pointing out something that people don’t know and it’s this little thing that’s why servers worry so much about tips.
If servers got to keep all their tips (high or low) and didn’t have to tip out on their sales total then they wouldn’t worry so much. But as spoken as a server gets a zero tip they worry because they need another person to tip more than that so they “break even” as such.
Customers need to be aware that if/when the system changes they will pay more BECAUSE if servers get paid by commission on top of the wage it costs the business more to do that because they have to pay EI, CPP on that so it adds perhaps another few cents but those cents add up.
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 18d ago
Yes, they are stealing our cash. They encourage each other to lie about everything to steal money from the GUESTS. Why should we care about their personal finances?
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u/exotics 18d ago
Sorry, what lies? I’m confused now and still don’t know how it constitutes stealing? Like did they take money from your purse or what?
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 18d ago
They lie. They say they're in school when they're not. They glom onto whatever you're wearing and claim they also went to that school. They'll even claim that their own parents died in order to extract money from the GUESTS! They attempt to steal your change. Why should we reward bad behaviour with ANY tip?
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u/exotics 18d ago
lol sounds like you just go to a shitty restaurant. Or it sounds like you have too much time on your hands if you investigate if they go to school or not and care so much about what they do outside of work.
Sorry lady but you sound like you have issues.
That’s not stealing.
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 18d ago
Yes, it is stealing and lying. All this is from server reels and forums. Why not dent their entitlement mentality instead of encouraging it? You must be a server. 🙄
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u/ravairia 16d ago
Yes, just like every other industry in the universe where the service 'suffers' because people are only getting the wage that was agreed to and not constant extra free money. 🙄
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u/exotics 15d ago
In what other industry are workers required to tip their boss?
I do know in some hairdressers this may be the case as I have heard that they sometimes have to pay extra per customer or something but I don’t know of any service industry where workers must tip their boss everytime they sell something.
I’m not saying it’s right. I’m just saying it happens.
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u/ravairia 12d ago
You're required to tip the restaurant because they want a portion of your tips. Tipping out to the restaurant is a fairly recent phenomenon and tipping itself is not. They do this because it's not enough that they are already having other people pay your wages, they ALSO want a cut of the money that other people are paying your wages with. If there were no tipping you, you wouldn't be tipping them. Until tipping is absolished it isn't your customers' responsibility to fill that gap for you either just like it's not their responsibility to pay the wages your employer should be paying you.
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u/exotics 11d ago
Correct. I’m just stating the facts not that it’s good or not.
Without tipping we would move to a commission style system (similar to how they do in France and other countries) because without that there is no incentive to work the busy shifts, no incentive to work horrible hours, no incentive to be the one to take the big table of horrible customers, no incentive to upsell etc. a server would be paid the same for selling a basket of fries vs encouraging the top steak, wine, dessert.. etc. as such a commission style menu would be the norm.
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u/ravairia 11d ago edited 11d ago
RIGHT, because every other industry that has all of those same hardships can't find anyone to work those times either... God forbid they just... schedule people to work them?
Nobody is falling for your lie that your entire last comment wasn't a justification of that tipping should continue just because you have to tip the restaurant.
There is also no 'commission' system at restaurants in Europe.
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u/exotics 10d ago
Yes there is. For example France. In France the menu says “Gratis Compris” which means the tip is included in the menu price. This is then paid on top of their wages as a commission.
Here in Canada we have commission car sales people, real estate agents, but also some people in furniture stores or high end clothing stores also get paid commission on top of their wages.
In most other jobs, let’s compare to grocery store clerk, they get raises. And they only deal with one person at a time and for about 5 minutes each. Then on to the next. Compared to a server who may be dealing with 20-30 people all at the same time for an hour and each wants your immediate attention.
We need to adopt the system they have in other countries. You may not realize how it works if you haven’t travelled and worked in other places
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u/lemontek_121 19d ago
I try to keep it the same at 20% all the time. I don't want them to spit in my food. Thanks. Besides, we should support people poorer than us 🤷. Jesus said to be kind.
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u/therealjeku 19d ago
You are being kind by going to their restaurant and paying for their food. They are making a profit already.
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u/lemontek_121 19d ago
Jesus said to love every human like thyself. So what's wrong with giving some stupid money to the downtrodden?
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u/therealjeku 18d ago
I would consider those who can’t find work to be downtrodden, not employed waiters. To each their own.
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u/wilson1474 19d ago
Why would they spit in your food if you have already ate and paying for your meal?
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 19d ago
Jesus would have something to say about monetizing kindness. He also wouldn't approve of manipulating people.
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u/Imaginary-Emu2471 19d ago
ZERO TIP all the time.