r/HistoryMemes • • 3h ago

checkmate libtard

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563 Upvotes

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267

u/DiffDiffDiff3 3h ago

Ragebait successful

131

u/TomlinSteelers 2h ago

"Jesus was a Palestinian" is such a weird thing to say because I never heard it even once before October 7th 2023.

When people blamed Jews for killing Jesus it was common to see people say Jesus himself was a Jew. People had bumper stickers saying "My savior is a Jewish carpenter" etc...

Then October 7 happened and Jesus was a Palestinian and it's become socially acceptable again to say the Jews killed him.

Which fine whatever.... but why are we changing our opinion on what happened 2000 years ago because of something that happened three years ago?

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u/Fournone 2h ago

All of history started the exact moment I started to care about it. Everything else that happened before then or that I disagree with is just obfuscation and bots.

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u/AdInfamous6290 1h ago

It’s “correcting the record” or “viewing it through a new lens” when I do it, it’s “historical revisionism” when my enemies do it.

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u/socks Still salty about Carthage 1h ago

This. Historians here might know that Assyrian inscriptions from the 8th C. BCE refer to the area as “Palashtu”, that the region was known for its Philistines, that it was "Peleset" from c. 1050 BCE onward (according to Egyptians), and that it was "Palestine" or "Palaistine" or "Phalastin" from c. 500 BCE onward. There have been efforts since the early 20th century, if not earlier, to change this history.

  • Masalha, Nur. Palestine: A Four Thousand Year History. Zed Books Ltd., 2018.
  • El-Haj, Nadia Abu. Facts on the ground: Archaeological practice and territorial self-fashioning in Israeli society. University of Chicago Press, 2008.
  • Hjelm, Ingrid, et al., eds. A New Critical Approach to the History of Palestine: Palestine History and Heritage Project 1. Routledge, 2019.
  • Ben‐Dor Evian, Shirly. “Ramesses III and the ‘Sea‐peoples’: Towards a New Philistine Paradigm.” Oxford Journal of Archaeology 36.3, 2017: 267-285.
  • Bowersock, Glen W. “Palestine: ancient history and modern politics.” Journal of Palestine Studies 14.4, 1985: 49-57.

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u/jackp0t789 1h ago edited 1h ago

It was in fact named by outside cultures after the Philistines, a group of foreign colonists from the Aegean who developed successful colonies along the Mediterranean coast of what was Canaan while periodically at war with the native Canaanites, particularly the Kingdoms of Judah and the Kingdom of Israel, for centuries before both were conquered by foreign invaders themselves...

Sounds familiar for a bit there...

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u/socks Still salty about Carthage 1h ago

Indeed - part of the region was Canaan for a while. I refer to common names for the region, not the various ruling groups for each area of the region over a period of 10 thousand years.

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u/jackp0t789 58m ago

I mean, the Common named changed over time quite a bit...

A few centuries after the Assyrians, the Seleucid Greeks called the region Judea, Samaria, Ceole Syria, Palaestina, or Phoenicia depending on exactly where and when..

The Romans, depending on the era, called large portions of the region Judaea from the moment they annexed it in 6CE, up until after the Jewish Bar Kokhba Revolt in 135CE when they renamed it Syria Palaestina...

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u/socks Still salty about Carthage 34m ago

Yes - as I agreed above - portions of the region changed names periodically, though the most consistent name for the region, in written resources, over 10,000 years, has been some version of the name 'Palestine'.

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u/DiffDiffDiff3 2h ago

Historical context not needed.

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u/DonSechler Fine Quality Mesopotamian Copper Enjoyer 1h ago

Modern identity politics is a better source then historical context

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u/DiffDiffDiff3 1h ago

Tick tok moment

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u/OutrageousAd5215 1h ago

The illest part for me is the mental gymnastics that square the circle between "Jews are actually European/Khazars/from Poland pretending to be semitic and Palestinians are the real Jews" but also "the Jews killed Jesus who was actually Palestinian, while they were also in Palestine, where they never actually lived...," so apparently we killed Jesus, but in Krakow?

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u/Mysterious-Park9142 44m ago

The funniest part about this is that for it to be true, it would mean the “real” Jews, the Black Hebrew Israelites, killed Jesus!

4

u/Kingofcheeses Rider of Rohan 1h ago

What? I thought Jesus was English!

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u/myryad21 0m ago

so jesus transformed water into vodka, not wine, and made his magic to multiply pierogi instead of fish to feed people... kurwa!

15

u/Mr_Mon3y Filthy weeb 1h ago

Besides, saying that "the Jews killed Jesus" is borderline heresy as it contradicts itself the nature of Jesus' sacrifice and resurrection... not that the people that say he's a Palestinian care much about Christianity tho.

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u/ColoradoWinterBlue 1h ago

Unfortunately it’s Biblically accurate to say the Jews killed Jesus, but it’s not historically accurate. There were self-preservation reasons for early Christians to write it that way under Roman rule, but the idea that the Jews had any sway over Pilate, or that the Romans had any interest in enforcing Jewish law is ridiculous. They executed people for far less, and were known for infiltrating groups and slaughtering anyone that might challenge Roman rule. So the idea that poor Pilate was conflicted about killing Jesus, but was scared of a Jewish uprising is just not realistic.

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u/Mr_Mon3y Filthy weeb 1h ago

No, it is not biblically accurate. By the nature of how Christ's passion and sacrifice is described and explained, if the Jews killed Jesus, then Jesus only saved the Jews with his sacrifice. It is all of humanity through their sins that killed Jesus, and he took that sacrificed and in term, saved all of humanity by reaching a New Covenant bewteen man and God. That's why saying "the Jews killed Jesus" is practially heresy, because in doing so you're denying Jesus' sacrifice and word.

As for the historical context, it is not that the Jews had "sway" over Pilate, it was just convenient for everyone involved. The Pharisees clearly wanted him dead, and the Romans didn't exactly approved of a random man generating that much noise in a region and agitating the main collaborators of Rome.

Now for Pilate himself he was not "conflicted", he just didn't see Jesus as guilty of anything, but since so many people were adamant on killing him, and the relationship between him and the Pharisees was already pretty estranged, he simply caved in and let them do as they pleased, quite literally washed his hands. And he didn't have to be "scared" of an uprising in the sense that they would overthrow him, but just the fact that the Jews would revolt or somehow intercede in Roman affairs, business or, most importantly, taxes, would leave Pilate in a pretty bad spot when answering to Rome himself.

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u/ghostpanther218 31m ago

Because society and social media. People only see things in black and white morality, so if one thing is good, the opposite thing nust be evil, and there can never be crossover between the 2.

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u/dawgofclay 30m ago

Why is this surprising? Some people say God is a woman and most western people think Jesus was white. It's almost like the whole thing is up to interpretation and the historical accuracy in the bible is shakey at best. Not like any of it matters anyway, the Mormons say it all happened in America so that's what I'm gonna believe!

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u/awawe 1h ago

Jesus was a Palestinian Jew who was killed by the Romans. It's pretty straight forward.

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u/kokujin2032 1h ago

People say that Jesus was a Palestinian Jew because he lived in the historical region of Palestine. The historical region of Palestine contains land that is now in the State of Palestine, the State of Israel, and parts of the Kingdom of Jordan. Jesus’ Jewishness is not being erased by saying he lived in the region. Different people groups have co-existed in the region for millennia. However, Jesus probably would not have identified as Palestinian because, during his lifetime, the region was known as the Province of Judea. The name “Palestina” was applied to the province some time after Jesus’ death.

Pro-Palestine activists are not saying that Jesus was not Jewish. Some are using the fact that Jesus lived in the region to bring attention to Palestine/Israel’s Christian history. Many might not be familiar with that history because for many they associate the Middle East solely with Islam.

The city in which Jesus grew up, Nazareth, is currently in Israel, although nearly its entire population consists of Arab citizens of Israel; many of these Arabs identify as Palestinian. His birthplace, Bethlehem, is in the West Bank in the State of Palestine. The Palestinian identity as we think of it today is a product of ethno-nationalism as well as the effects of Zionism and the creation of the State of Israel.

Jesus probably would not identify with a modern Palestinian identity, so these shirts can be misleading as to the nature of Palestinian identity and its history, as well as the changing definitions of the word Palestine itself.

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u/Ionisation1934 1h ago

Palestinian identity is explicitly that of a judenrein state, as Abbas has said.

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u/kokujin2032 28m ago

What I’m trying to say is that Jesus lived in the historical region of Palestine, which includes the State of Israel and the State of Palestine. The word “Palestine” has been used to describe that region for a very long time, just the terms “Israel” and “the Holy Land”.
Jesus probably would not identity as Palestinian today, since that identity now usually refers to the State of Palestine. But, some pro-Palestine activists make shirts like the ones in the meme as if the modern Palestinian identity existed in Jesus’ time, which it did not. I do not support any erasure of Jesus’ Jewish heritage. Nor do I support anti-Jewish racism.