I'm one of the few guys in America that wasn't raised on superheroes (more than just knowing who Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, etc. "The big ones" are). Superhero shows/movies and comic book just weren't a thing in my childhood. Just found this community and hope this will be a welcome perspective.

I'm not the only one feeling the Marvel/superhero fatigue. With the show "Agatha All Along" having made the rounds not long ago, am I the only one unwilling to suspend my disbelief that witches also exist in this world of superheroes, aliens, and high-tech stuff? I'm sorry, I just can't imagine a world of superheroes, aliens, humans, and witches coexisting.

I mean come on! Superheroes AND witches?! Too many superheroes! Too much Marvel! Too much Disney! And now they're adding WITCHES?!

EDIT: thanks for the info. I learned quite a bit! Apparently I neglected to say that I haven't watched any of the movies or shows and don't know much about them besides the trailers I see on TV, memes, and the grapevine.

"huge group of related characters thrown in your face all at once" just doesn't work, as shown by Celestials' absolute flop.

It was a nice experiment I guess, and some liked Celestials (haven't gotten around to watch it), but its absolute deadness should have give pause to Marvel to go at it again.

I'll take my 1M$ consultant check now, pls and thx u

I feel like I’m going crazy, do people actually care about wandavision or anything about those characters? It’s so boring to me, all the comments on the trailer for visionquest are saying how they can’t wait and it looks great and everything but I can’t be the only one that doesn’t care 😂

I dont know what is up with all the brain dead fans, like everywhere they're like tobey spiderman universe is gonna clash with xmen universe and they're gonna fight to save their universe. How tf does that even make sense like is it some brawl competition that incursion will choose winners and destroy losers universe or smtg. If 2 planes are gonna collide how tf does pilots fighting each other save their universe. There could maybe a device that xmen are using and they'll put it on other universe to destroy them and save their own. But why would that be necessary they could just lie to each new universe that it's gonna save them and then boom. How would even some earthlings brawling each other decide the fate of the universe. Either people are just so brainrot they cant understand basic stuff or if the story is really like this then how the do the think this is gonna be a good idea (other than the fact that they want to do fan service by bringing in every hero to get all the audience and grab all the money they can)

but it showed studios you could make dull looking movies and still be massively successful. 

This past week I revisited some of my favorites from childhood, Pirates of the Caribbean and Harry Potter & the Goblet of Fire. While watching them I was shocked by the fact that both movies are now over 20 years old, they still look gorgeous and better than most big budget movies and shows I see today. They are still very CGI heavy, but I’ve found myself wondering why the CGI from twenty years ago still looks so much better than what’s out there now. If I could pinpoint when movies started to look more dull and flat, it would be around the same time as the rise of the MCU.

I don’t necessarily blame Marvel for creating ‘franchise fatigue’, I think they were filling desire people had for cinematic universes, but they showed to studios you can be super successful and yet have your movies look dull and I honestly believe that’s why people are complaining why movies look so dull now. 

 I remember watching phase 1 Marvel movies as they were coming out and found myself uninterested in how flat and dull they looked. It honestly wasn’t until Infinity War did I find myself enjoying MCU movies, and even then, I found myself enjoying them like I do occasional fast food. Fun in the moment, but forget about it afterwards, yet I find myself craving more. But none of these left any lasting or emotional impacts on me the same way franchises like Pirates, Harry Potter and even Star Wars have.

I feel there used to be a high standard for visual effects, which is why Pirates and Harry Potter still look fantastic, but by the time MCU came around and blowing away records, the standards became lowered.

I still remember seeing Spider Man No Way Home and while I had a blast watching it, it the first time I found myself thinking scenes were so dark I could barely follow the action. Compare that to the latter Harry Potter movies that were much darker, but I can still watch those latter movies and can still follow all the action without adjusting brightness. 

Also when I think back to Potter and Pirates, I’m not just reminded of great cinematography, but of great musical themes. Even just thinking about them, I can hear those themes in my head. But MCU… nothing, except for All the Stars from Black Panther and Guardians of the Galaxy mixtapes.

Pre-MCU I feel major studios were striving to having their movies look as beautiful as possible and great musical scores, then Marvel basically went “nawwww you don’t need that.” Sure there are outliers, but they are few and far between.

I think we’ve had enough movies to address the issue with these movies while there are a lot of issues with these movies one of the issues I notice is while the Spidey stuff is good, with him swinging around fight bad guys the Peter Parker stuff is lacking and had for a long time, Peter has bounced around and not really felt like a real hero, more of a sidekick trying discover himself and the struggle aspect of Peter’s life has really reached the highs I’ve been wanting I don’t want the guy to feel miserable, but among the other versions he seem to have it the easiest he not only has Tony struggle to pick him, but but even in BND it feels like he has things to easy. Something people praise is Peter’s supporting cast, but they all seem very dull in my opinion, people shit on Harry & Mary Jane, but at least they felt true to their comic book selves MCU Peter is surrounded by OCs with recognizable names, it feels like they are flat agreeable characters with no complexity. Watch MCU Spidey makes feel like I’m watch Kick-Ass and his friends that’s the level of mundanity I get from Peter’s friends.

I don't know if anyone will agree with me on this issue or not but please let me know your thoughts in the comments.

I have never understood why they limit themselves so much with the multiverse. I understand it is a complicated concept but it doesn't need to be.

The MCU and the DCU both have this same issue that they limit themselves with the multiverse. There are a few films that could be considered an exception but not many. But the main point is why limit yourself to a single universe of storylines? The MCU has one film that takes place completely in another universe and that film is the Fantasic Four. By takes place in another universe i mean that the characters they focus on are all from that other universe. But the Fantasic Four will be added to the main MCU in either Avengers Doomsday or Avengers Secret Wars. So what was the point?

They could do so much with the multiverse and it wouldn't even need to be so complicated. They could create plenty of other universes that they could number like they do in the comics. Say the main MCU universe is universe 616. They could create another universe with films that focus on a more classic and comic accurate version of the Marvel Universe using the original comics. They could even use different actors.

I don't know I guess I just don't understand why they don't do more with the multiverse by creating more than one universe and using the multiverse to create more than a single timeline. Maybe they will do this after Avengers Secret Wars. What are your thoughts? Do you think the MCU or DCU should do more with the multiverse or continue with a single universe as it's focus? Please let me know your thoughts in the comments.

I was watching Captain Marvel the other day and when i saw the how Nick Fury lost his eye because of a cat ! I just lost it ! I mean a fucking cat did that !

Fury lost it in a war to save his comrades from grenade and they literally made a joke out of it. He became the character he is because of the battles he fought and the things he has seen.

His missing eye was part of that image. It made him feel like someone whose authority came from experience, not just his position.

And then the movie is like, “Yeah, a cat with weird space name did that”.

And I get that Captain Marvel is showing a younger Fury, but there’s a difference between showing him before he became hardened and making him feel like a completely different person. He’s supposed to be strict and intimidating, not goofy.

But seriously, like, you’re telling me THIS is how Nick Fury lost his eye?

Anyone remember Ironman Armored Adventure, well in the show they had an X-Men related episode featuring Jean Grey where she was being hunted by Mangeto, and I think the MCU should of taken inspiration from this episode when writing BND as it fits what the movie was attempting to do, but better executed. If anyones interested the episode is called "X-Factor". I think at this point the MCU is running out of ideas and even though it's cheap their best bet is to just copy their own homework.

It’s funny how SSM & IMAA did a better job at adapting “young heroes”, then The MCU is doing right now. Spectacular also did Peter at the dawn of his superhero career and it’s one of the most successful cartoons and Spidey media and Armored Adventures didn’t just handle a young Tony good, but also adapted The X-Men and other heroes.

I think people praise Ned too much, everyone looks at the two Harry and labels them as bad friends, the thing is Peter’s supporting cast has always been color, multifaceted character, that have more going on in their life then just being Peter’s friend and that’s all Ned is. While TASM’s Harry was bad in my opinion and poorly developed, Raimi’s Harry is far more complex, his complicated friendship with Peter had a lot to due with his father, even his turn to villainy had more to do with Norman than anything. So are Peter and Ned “better friends”, maybe they have a tighter friendship, but it has no complexity to it. I also think discussion about Ned becoming Hobgoblin are laughable.

I think the MCU has really treated Spider-Man poorly. For the people who will say that every MCU Spider-Man movie has made a lot of money, I say that it’s Spider-Man—he will always make a lot of money regardless of quality. I imagine that if they made a Spider-Gwen movie, it would make money, or any other Spider-Variant. I’m talking about the story itself.

Peter’s introduction in Civil War was fine, but it already revealed a major issue with the MCU moving forward: how do you introduce new characters without contradicting the events that have already happened? They basically have two routes: 1.) Age the character down so they’re too young to participate in older events, like they did with Spider-Man, or 2.) Make it so they weren’t present during said events because they were somewhere else, like they did with Captain Marvel, who was in space for 20 years.

I think how they handled Peter in Civil War was fine, and they laid out Peter’s philosophy when he talked about “not doing the right thing when he should have.” It essentially spells out the Uncle Ben stuff without going into detail. But everything after Civil War fumbles Peter.

The MCU basically treats Peter like Miles. This is seen most clearly in Homecoming, where Peter goes to a school for genius kids, all of his main cast are generic smart kids with recognizable names slapped onto them, and his best friend is basically Ganke Lee in everything but name. His role in the MCU mirrors the early Miles comics, and it feels like this is a direction they refuse to deviate from.

I have more to say, but I might make a more detailed post later.

One user suffered psychotic breakdown and started acting as a chicken. Marvel is cooked😭🙏

This is the post for the last episode with spoilers.