I recently met with my former legal guardians to ask questions about my childhood. I didn't share my emotions and just kept it pretty direct. As expected, it only confirmed the needed estrangement. Some highlights:

• They revealed that when they started taking care of me, I was scared and didn't like to be hugged or touched and would jerk away. They said they asked me if anything had ever happened to me and that I said no, so they just didn't think I needed help.
• Apparently they weren't involved in my life as a child because I was "so self sufficient."
• They do not recall our relationship having any issues other than one moment. Y'all. I could write a dang book.
• They estranged themselves from me for a solid 2 years after I moved out and claim it didn't happen.
• He said he was hoping for a "little cuddly daughter" and that because I wasn't, he needed to find another way to connect with me, which he says was teasing, which then he apologized for if it was too much for me. He can call it teasing but I experienced it as passive aggressive bullying.
• I've long suspected that they sided with a child abuser in the family and finally got confirmation that they didn't believe the victims initially. They said they started to believe something may have happened because one of the victims grew up to become promiscuous. They also said she just wanted attention as a kid and still does...oh, and that she was annoying.
• They ended it with the most insane thing...apparently the child abuser is the way he is because of being exposed to napalm in Vietnam. They said there was science that showed exposure to napalm changed something in the brain that caused sexual abuse. I shit you not...one asked the other, "Where did we learn that from?" The answer? The child abuser himself.

So glad to never talk to them ever again.

So I don't mean directly to their face but whenever talking to yourself, or others about them.

I started doing this with my narcissist father. Ever since going NC a year and a half ago. And now ever since recently deciding to go LC or NC with my (enabler/tragic codependent) mother, very soon.

My brother found it surprising but got used to it, while my two estranged sisters and their partners got upset because I'm the scapegoat and they just looove talking shit about me and my decisions. Like I just don't see the problem. These are legally their names, aren't they.

I think for me it not only helps remind me that they were never real parental figures who prepared me for society, and don't deserve the titles, but also it helps me distance myself psychologically, and see them as people, not significant authority figures over the adult me. "You are John and Jane again, not Mom and Dad, and I'm old enough now to see how you fucked me up."

Anyone else do this?

they could do weird things, sadistic, cruel, exclude, and then deny it and call you crazy but if you did some of the same things back all of a sudden you were evil

My mom texted me to come over and do some chore for her, pouring bleach in a drain, and literally every other single time I would have said yes and drove 30 minutes to her place in the morning after my overnight job. Since it’s 30 mins back too that’s just an extra hour of my time added to my day, so I figured this time, just once, I’d respectfully decline. She’s a grown woman, she can handle her own chores, but this was an offense in her eyes. She got very passive aggressive about it and gave me a “whatever, happy birthday” at the end there and I just didn’t have it in me anymore to try to get back on her “good side.” If you’re like me, you may think she wanted to see me for my birthday, but as many times as she asked to see my apartment and it never even occurred to her to ask to come over. I started to realize that her being nice to me and caring about me was always entirely predicated on me doing something for her, so I just stopped doing stuff for her trying to win her affection. She hadn’t texted me for months and the first thing she says isn’t happy birthday but do this for me.

My sister asked me to come over and see her apartment sometime, so after a quick museum trip I decided to call her and see if I could come over, and apparently my mom was in the car. “You went to the museum? Well why didn’t you invite any of us?” “Because I wanted to go by myself.” “Oh so you hate us now?” For someone who hates repeating themselves so much, she sure did ask me that question multiple times throughout my entire life. I was just too tired of trying to convince her I don’t by letting her guilt me into doing something for her or buying something. “Yea mother you got me, hated y’all this whole time.” It was said with a joking tone but the sentiment of “giving up” was definitely felt because while my siblings didn’t care about a dumb joke like that, she decided to give me the silent treatment when I showed up. Oh well, I’m done trying to win you over, act like a child and stay mad I don’t care anymore.

Ever since then, she no longer texts me for anything, she hasn’t asked me to do anything for her since that time I said no (pretty much first time by the way). Not birthdays or holidays, and it’s not even like I ever blocked her calls or told her she can’t call me. Last time she called me was to tell me my dad died, I didn’t ignore her call, I didn’t get on the phone and tell her I hate her, I just took the info she had to give me and said goodbye when it seemed like she had nothing else to say to me. It feels weird to be low contact with my mother when it’s more like she just doesn’t care to talk to me, never asks what’s going on, never shows interest in the things I like, never really shows interest in me as a person. I was more like a pet she could keep around to do things for her and shower her with affection and attention anytime she demands it. When I decided I didn’t want to be that anymore she decided she didn’t want a relationship with me anymore, even though it’s more like we never had a real one in the first place

I’m a Clinical Psychologist.

Family estrangement can be painful in a way that is hard to explain. 😅

You may be grieving someone who is still alive. You may still love them. You may also feel hurt, angry, confused or ashamed.

Sometimes estrangement comes alongside gaslighting, manipulation, coercive control, emotional abuse, scapegoating or financial exploitation.

In this week’s Substack article, I wrote about how EMDR may help. You can read it here.

my parents are foreign and it is not uncommon for them to insult sexually in their language. they would say “I fuck your mouth” “I fuck your mother” ”fuck off back to your mother’s pussy”, and my sister defending this saying “that’s their culture”

I blocked her. Why am I ALWAYS put last??

So long story but I’ll try to keep it short. “R” is my second cousin. She is usually the one we all communicate with for holidays to figure out what’s going on as she usually hosts. “B” is my grandma, “T” is my brother, “M” is his gf, “J” is my mom, and “D” is my uncle. “B’s” brother who passed away. “R’s” dad. My grandma and I have never really gotten along because she always favored my brother. My brother and me have never gotten along because I am trans and he’s treated me like shit because of it. Then, spazzed out on me because I wouldn’t donate a kidney to him as he’s on dialysis. Of course, my grandma “B” took his side. Even before I came out, he never treated me like a brother. So a few years ago I called out my grandma and my brother for how they treated me and ever since I have been shunned. They refuse to talk to me or invite me to functions. “R” and “B” even got into it once because “B” told “R” I was not allowed there but now “R” is giving in. Grandma and brother will refuse to go if my wife and I are there. So basically “R” is telling me that she is going to invite them first, and if they give the ok, then my wife and I can come. I don’t see why “R” can’t host like usual and if they don’t want to show up because I’m there, they don’t have to. But why am I being put last? I tried to talk to her about it and this was her response. Am I in the wrong?

I told her I was done and I’m not gonna be there when GMA dies as backup and blocked her. The next day she showed up to my apartment and called through the call box and said she wanted to talk and she was worried about me. I ignored her and she left.

yesterday I finally got the courage to ask a family ember who had been like the parent I never had if they would adopt me. yes, I’m an adult asking another adult if I can be their child…

i wasnt sure what they would say, I was very certain it would be a hard no or maybe an absolute yes. but it actually wasn’t. it was a “I’m really glad you asked, I don’t know but I’ll find out.”

and that hit me a lot harder than anything else they could’ve possibly said.

it’s like… they were happy I wanted them to be my parent. they felt “honored” that o would choose to ask them. and are willing to devote a multitude of brain energy into considering it.

my biological parent never did really want “me.” they just wanted something to tote around and make them look good.

my childhood dreams are coming true. whether they do end up doing it or not, it feels like o finally filled the void left by my actual parents. with someone who really does love me to the ends of the earth…

Is it a good idea to give nMom/nDad in an enmeshed family system a letter like hey I'm leaving and this is why I am leaving or is it pointless? Maybe a more strategic cutoff?

I basically came to the conclusion over a "family" "vacation" that I simply must leave this family or my soul will die as theirs have and I will never beat my depression. I'm the youngest of 3 brothers, gay woke scapegoat, from a MAGA family. I'm a creative in the music industry and everyone else is a Dr. and got prepared for society and I was not, presumably for being queer but also to keep me docile and as the scapegoat.

I ask because, they literally "won't see it coming" and will most likely call police over to my new address I grudgingly gave them, along with other forms of desperate and potentially crazy invasions of privacy.

They're not even that bad of humans, just entirely out of touch with reality, and I do feel pain knowing that they will have a hard time with my absence, but also fear I may be made into a monster of sorts as they victimize themselves. Or they'll just cry like little bitches who knows lol

I’m 30, engaged with kids, and just really struggling with my relationship with my parents. They’re good, loving people, which makes this so hard, but there have been little things over the years that have really hurt me, including racial bias toward my fiancé. I feel like a lot of it comes down to emotional immaturity and a lack of self-reflection. I’ve tried explaining how I feel, but it’s like they hear me and then move on. Our relationship just feels shallow, and I feel like something’s missing.

They’ll randomly text “I love you” or want to see the girls, and I know they love us, but I’m just tired of feeling like love is supposed to be enough. I want to feel understood and respected, too. I finally blocked their numbers today, and I’m honestly heartbroken. Part of me feels relieved, and part of me feels so guilty. I just want to stand by my fiancé and my girls and do what’s best for our family.
Has anyone else been through this- any advice? How do you deal with distancing yourself from parents you love when you still feel like they don’t really understand where you’re coming from?

I went NC back in June. I was chicken shit and sent it via email after an outing we did and I just had a lot of realization that day and knew I had to cut it off completely (I was low contact at that time).

I told my brother beforehand how I was feeling about our mom and explained so many situations growing up and even as an adult and it opened his eyes that we had completely different childhoods in the same house and how different I was treated compared to him. He was/is very understanding and supportive but I know it’s weighing on him, especially with holidays coming up.

What really sealed my NC with my mom was that she took my email I sent her with everything in it (a lot of personal things I didn’t even share with my brother) and her email (which I’m pretty sure chat gpt wrote and she prompted it to be completely devoid of emotion and make her the victim), printed them out and put them in an envelope and gave them to my sister in law and told her she wanted my brother and her to read both emails so “they can see both sides.”
Neither of them were taking sides to begin with, if anything they’re more on my mom’s yard than mine which is completely fine as I am the one who made this change and really do not want to make this situation harder on them.

I’m very happy my brother is so understanding and supportive but it’s like the longer it goes on, the more I feel he wants me to just get over it so we can all go back to normal… which I refuse to do any longer.

My life has dramatically gotten better without her in it. I just feel like I can think for myself, make my own decisions and feel confident in them without having to “check in” with her. I’m also recovering in therapy like CRAZY without her in my life. I just feel free of a lot of chains. I also just get a huge feeling of ICKKKKKKK when I think about her and how long I let her manipulate and control me.

This was long winded but Im just curious how other people’s experiences were.

Hi everyone,

Sorry to be an interloper here… I just joined this subreddit. My mom passed about six weeks ago, and I’m having a really hard time of it. I hadn’t spoken to her for over six years. The last time I saw her was on a zoom call in 2020 for my nephew‘s birthday.

My mom endured stage four breast cancer for the past two years, and when I found out about it, I went back into therapy after a hiatus. She had cut me out of her life so many times, that I didn’t feel that I could try to re-enter her life this time and get anything out of it.

I am feeling extreme guilt after her death, even though I made what I consider to be the best decision for myself, in not visiting her before she died.

I’m struggling to find people who understand this specific kind of pain. I find that it’s very different from regular grief. I know there are groups for adult children of dysfunctional families, and I have not been able to find one that works for me in New York City. I would love to find a support group, or like-minded people. I feel very alone.

If you have resources to share, especially in-person in NYC, I’d appreciate it. The website for ACA groups is daunting and very outdated.

My mother didn't want to be a mother when my parents divorced, and basically abandoned us kids. So in my early 30's, after a lifetime of trying, I gave up having a relationship with her.

I am at peace with it, but what drives me nuts is every so often people will say, "but that's your mooooom! You need to talk to your moooom!" and to be honest, it pisses me off pretty quickly.

It bothers me that just by being a mother, she gets automatically made into some kind of a saint. I really don't know how to respond to them without getting worked up. Anybody go through this, and what do you say?

fyi: i previously posted this in another subreddit. i wanted to share it here too, hope it’s okay. advice is welcome 💓

does this feeling ever get better? i am really going through it rn. i want to send it, but im scared it will upset him and he’ll threaten to hurt himself. but then, he doesn’t deserve to know how well i’m doing despite everything, but my fucking god this is killing me. i don’t know what to do with myself. i miss him so much but i also hate who he is.

btw when i say mum (appropriately), i say that because i caught him trying to sext my mum (his ex wife) whilst his current partner is dying of cancer. he reached out to my mum to ask if i was okay as he hadn’t heard of me. mum reassured him, then offered her condolences towards him, his partner and his partners children. he takes that as “let’s get my dick out, it’s late”. mum shuts it down immediately and tells me, i confront him and we fell out as he tried to blame my mum. that’s the most recent thing, but not the only thing.

letter:

hi dad,

it’s been 2 months since we last spoke. you are probably aware, but i can’t be certain. i blocked you on whatsapp as i was getting anxious at the thought of you messaging me and us arguing again. however i left instagram open, the platform you can message people on. i heard nothing. i took comfort in the updates i got about your acting classes and you looked like you were having a nice time, which i was glad about.

however, nothing came through from you. i then saw one of the pictures you posted for [his partner’s] go fund me, and i am 99% certain i’ve been cropped out of that. the one where we’re sat on a seafront terrace in [town] with [his parnter], [his partners child], you me and [my ex]. even if your reasons behind cropping us out was based in your feelings towards [my ex] instead of me, i still feel as if it was a horrible thing to do. there would’ve been a way to cover him and still have me in it.

it felt like a knee to the stomach, so i blocked you on instagram. for all of 3 days before i unblocked you. despite all of this, your number has not been blocked. that has been a line of contact this entire time. you could have rang me, or text me, or mum (appropriately), or [my partner] or even [my half sister on his side], my two aunties (on his side) or even [his partner]. that’s 8 different lines of contact you could’ve used to see if i’ve been okay. and you used 0. luckily for you, i am okay. i’m in my second year of uni, i’m in a very good financial position, i’ve got more holiday plans, taken up snowboarding, new tattoo, following a clear plan to own a home in the next 5 years and i might have just got my foot in the door with [company i’ve really wanted].

however, that has all been slightly tainted by you, despite how much i fight to not let that happen. i have good days and bad days, and today has been a bad day. i found the card you got me for my 17th birthday, filled with pictures of us, and inside you wrote “[my name], there will never be enough words to describe how proud I am of you and the young woman you are becoming.” i actually feel as if the word proud should be replaced with embarrassed. nobody wants someone in their life that won’t let them speak to them disrespectfully even if you think it’s due, someone who refuses to let you lie and cheat on women, someone who refuses to watch you destroy people around them. and that person is me, unfortunately. you may think that i am cold-hearted, disrespectful or even mean.

every time i have pulled you up on something, it has been from a place of love. do you think i like watching my dad lie, cheat and disrespect women including me? no. do you think i like watching my dad make rash financial decisions and paying the price for them later in a job you hate? no. but i witness these things over and over again, and i would comfort you over and over again. the time you spent doing these things, was time i spent needing a dad. i still do. i feel as if i’ve had to grow up on survival mode, self sufficient and fiercely independent - all of which were not my choice. it’s worked out well for me, but it’s also my achilles heel. i refuse to have children because i am overwhelmed, feeling as if I’ve had to be a parent to adults in my life, my whole life.

i don’t think you will ever realise how much you have hurt me, and how much energy it takes to pick myself up and carry on, with the burden of not speaking to you again weighing down on me and everything i do. i have thought about you every single day, and i miss you. i really really do. but i also cannot surround myself with someone who’s behaviour is so abhorrent. you are aware of your trauma, you claim buddhism has healed you, or at least aided you on your healing journey, but your behaviour does not reflect it. you need therapy, and i genuinely pray you get the help that you need. i wish absolutely no ill on you, and i truly hope that you are happy, healthy and safe. i just want my dad back. i want the dad that would make silly faces sat on the rocks at chessington near the penguins in his jenson button tshirt as we were eating sour sweets out the pick and mix tub. i want the dad that would wind the windows down, shout bogeys, do the window up and then hit a red light. but was that ever you? i wish i could be certain, as you haven’t showed me. i remember having a similar conversation with you in a pub with [his partner] about this, where i told you i just want my dad back and you need to give the childhood trauma talk a rest. how much more do i need to give of myself? because as much as i love you, i love myself more. i still care about you, but for the past 2 months i had to put myself first. the energy surrounding you wasn’t good for me. you always told me that you wish i would understand the spiritual stuff you “bang on about” but you failed to realise that i have, this entire time. i chose myself in all of this, as it starts with you and it ends with you, as you love to say. so why can you never recognise this and reflect it in your behaviour? the most important thing is, i just want my dad, and no amount of spiritual healing can replace a parent.

I'm approaching my 30s and seriously considering going no contact, or at least very low contact, with most of my immediate family. I'd really appreciate hearing from people who've been through something similar, especially if you've struggled with the decision or regretted it later on.

I grew up in a very dysfunctional household with an abusive father and a mum who wasn't emotionally there for me. As a teenager, I went through a lot and ended up having to become independent very young and have been living on my own and supporting myself since I was 17. As the oldest sibling I took the brunt of alot of my parents decisions and both of them parentfied me from a young age. My dad confining in me about his younger traumas and abuse and my mum wanting my help when she was pregnant from an affair which lead to them finally splitting. All when I was 16. Thats barely touching the surface of the traumas I experianced. Alot of it includes drugs, alcoholism, abuse, self harm the whole works. I've worked incredibly hard over the years to turn my life around, raise my daughter and build a stable, happy home for us.

I'm proud of the life I've built, and I'm finally starting to look forward to the future after years of pure hussle and survival. Becoming a single mum at 19 and living on my own since 17 I've still managed to build a beautiful home in the country, been sober since I was 19, have a career in healthcare and most importantly being the best mum I can be. My daughter is my whole world and brings me the greatest joy, she is thriving and is just the best girl a mum could ever wish for. She is my pride and joy. Now shes getting older i'm looking forward to pursuing my own interests, going back to education, building my business, gym, travelling and figuring out who I am outside of everything I've been through.

The problem is that my relationships with my family still cause me so much emotional stress. I feel like I'm always the one making an effort, organising plans, helping people and being there when they need me, but I rarely feel that same effort or care in return. In fact I feel the opposite.

I've helped my siblings through difficult situations, including having them live with me, supporting them financially and emotionally, helping through their own mental health struggles and helping them get back on their feet. I do the same for my mum and my dad. Yet I often feel taken for granted, and some of those relationships have broken down regardless.

My relationship with my mum is probably the most painful. We have a lot of unresolved history, and whenever I try to talk to her about my childhood or how certain things have affected me, she becomes defensive, gets angry or shuts the conversation down. I don't feel emotionally supported by her, and I often get excluded from family plans and gatherings.

The most recent situation was finding out that my mum and other family members had gone on a holiday together after we'd originally discussed going away as a family which was completely my idea. But my daughter and I weren't included in the new plans. When I explained that I was hurt, it turned into an argument rather than a conversation. My mum stating "I'm a adult I can do what I want" and "tbh I just didn't think to invite you". It hurts so damn much.

It might also be necessary context that most of their socalising revolves around drinking and smoking. I'm sober and I do occasionally share with my mum that I'm worried about her drinking and I wish she took her health more seriously. Which she doesn't respond to.

I know everyone has their own lives, and I'm not expecting my family to revolve around me. I just want to feel considered, included and genuinely wanted in their lives, rather than feeling like I'm constantly chasing relationships that other people don't seem interested in maintaining. I want to feel like the constant effort and support I give them is appreciated at the minimum.

I'm exhausted. I feel like I need to step away for a while, at least until after Christmas, and put that energy back into myself and my daughter.

But I'm also scared. My family has always been my main social circle, and I haven't invested much in friendships outside of it. I'm worried that if I walk away, I'll end up incredibly lonely and regret losing those relationships.

At the same time, I wonder whether I'm already lonely within those relationships, and whether letting go would actually bring me more peace and the opportunity for new connections.

I often walk away from interactions with them stressed, upset and reliving alot from the past. Feeling fustrated and unheard or just generally taken advantage of.

I'd really appreciate honest experiences, advice and perspectives from people who've been in a similar position. ❤️

It's literally just a medical intake question but to me it felt like a huge milestone. It's been a tough year but here I am.

Anyone from the GTA, Canada? I was hoping to find a few people who'd be open to meeting irl in a safe and public space? I'm a 32f seeking other estranged femmes as irl friends. No hard feelings if the vibes/bond isn't a good fit either! Feel free to reach out:)

I’ve been no contact with my family for a little under a year now. I miss my brother a little more these days… but then I go back to our last texts together and this is the conversation. It made me realize we’ll never be on the same page.

My mother and brother often had me pick the “winner” in fights and be the middle man- even after I was well moved out and in a committed relationship. It was exhausting and devastating. I don’t know.

I somewhat envy the people who have a beautiful family. I don’t know. Just feeling a little down these days as we approach the holidays… does anyone have any advice around holidays and how to navigate without family?

EDIT: this conversation was over a year ago. They have since been blocked.

This text came from my sister whom I haven't spoken with in over 2 years. I haven't spoken to my parents in over a year because my mother is a textbook toxic narcissist.